WTF Happened With Secret Invasion
Category
📺
TVTranscript
00:00 Welcome back to New Rock Stars, I'm Eric Vos,
00:02 and Marvel's Secret Invasion reached its finale
00:04 with the lowest score from critics
00:06 in Marvel Studios history,
00:08 with episode six receiving only 13% on Rotten Tomatoes.
00:11 Now yes, I am no fan of the way
00:13 Rotten Tomatoes calculates these scores,
00:15 but from a qualitative temperature check
00:17 in the days since the finale,
00:18 Secret Invasion just seems to have left
00:20 a universally sour taste in the mouths of viewers,
00:22 which seems to come from a disappointment
00:23 over characters like Maria Hill, Talos, and Soren
00:26 killed off with really no sense of resolution
00:28 to those deaths in the finale,
00:30 questions left unanswered with how long exactly
00:32 Rhodey has been a Skrull,
00:33 some inconsistency with the characters of Gravik
00:35 and Gaia's decision making,
00:37 and Gaia's new insane power set at the end of the series,
00:40 and really just what we're supposed to take away
00:42 from the focus on Nick Fury's marriage,
00:44 and in general, all these missed opportunities
00:46 to do a live action Secret Invasion
00:48 and a Skrull storyline over four years of MCU history
00:51 that just ends like this.
00:53 Look, I'm not here to do a hate video.
00:54 Overall, I enjoyed watching this series
00:57 and I had a pretty good time with it.
00:58 For a more specific review,
00:59 you can check out me and Mod Garrett's criticisms
01:02 in our finale review on "The Break Room,"
01:03 and I did a deeper analysis of each scene
01:05 in my Easter egg breakdown,
01:06 but here in this video,
01:07 I want to look back on the whole series
01:09 and analyze what went wrong with Secret Invasion,
01:12 the challenges it faced,
01:13 the real reason I think we feel disappointed,
01:15 and I really wanna try to clear up
01:16 some of the bad takes going around
01:17 about how the sausage is really made.
01:19 Like, for example, the strike said nothing to do with this,
01:21 and yes, there is a strike from SAG-AFTRA
01:24 in the WGA right now,
01:25 and SAG has informed us that entertainment journalists
01:27 like new rock stars are allowed to cover movies and TV shows.
01:29 We just wanna appreciate how hard it is
01:31 for writers and actors to work under these conditions
01:34 and how they deserve fair pay.
01:35 There were some great moments of artistry
01:36 in Secret Invasion.
01:37 Let's not overlook those,
01:39 specifically the acting of Olivia Colman,
01:41 Don Cheadle, Samuel L. Jackson, Charlaine Woodard,
01:43 and everyone else in the cast,
01:44 and ultimately, I do think some amazing bits of dialogue
01:47 were written.
01:47 It was just the context around that dialogue
01:49 that didn't hit with us.
01:50 And let's start by saying that Secret Invasion
01:52 has not disappointed fans
01:53 out of a sense of Marvel fatigue, in my opinion.
01:55 I'm not even sold that there is a Marvel fatigue
01:58 or a superhero fatigue
01:58 after two of the biggest movies this summer
02:00 were Guardians of the Galaxy Volume 3
02:02 and Spider-Man Across the Spider-Verse,
02:03 and Marvel fans, from what I can tell,
02:05 still seem pretty excited about the upcoming titles.
02:07 I'm also hesitant to blame the writing.
02:09 Now, I know, a lot of you are like, "Come on, dude."
02:11 And I will admit that, yeah,
02:12 there were some major issues
02:14 with Secret Invasion's episode structure,
02:16 its internal logic, and the character arcs.
02:18 It's probably a weird sign
02:20 how the episode runtimes vary so much in length.
02:22 Some people say that they wish that they had more episodes.
02:24 I honestly think they could have done with less.
02:26 Like, in the six episodes of the series,
02:28 you could have made one killer two-hour film.
02:30 But talking about some of the specific choices
02:31 in the scripts this season,
02:33 yeah, it does not feel great
02:34 that Maria Hill was killed off
02:35 and didn't at all motivate the final conflict of the series,
02:38 or that Soren was killed off offscreen,
02:40 or that the real Nick Fury, the hero of the series,
02:42 had less of a relationship with the villain
02:44 than did Gaia, who's a two-tier protagonist,
02:46 who spent the season waffling with her stances
02:49 and suddenly took over in the final battle.
02:51 And it doesn't feel great
02:51 that the big twist of the series,
02:53 that Rhodey was a Skrull, was learned by Nick Fury
02:55 at some point offscreen between episodes.
02:58 It doesn't feel great
02:59 that the best moments of dialogue of the season
03:00 occurred between two known characters
03:02 we thought Fury and Rhodey, Fury and Gravik,
03:05 but then we learned just really occurred
03:06 between Skrulls bullshitting about their histories.
03:09 But here's the deal.
03:10 I wasn't in the writers' room of the series.
03:11 I wouldn't be surprised if a lot of the people
03:12 who wrote on the show would feel the same way.
03:14 I think TV writers often have to make sacrifices
03:16 and surrender battles to a bigger studio vision and notes.
03:20 So instead, I just wanna focus
03:21 on some more external evidence-based reasons
03:23 that the studio struggled
03:24 with "Secret Invasion" in particular.
03:26 At the very least, think about it.
03:27 "Secret Invasion" could have been Marvel's Andor
03:29 or Marvel's Peacemaker, both of them lesser viewed,
03:32 but well-liked and extremely well-executed
03:34 seasons of television,
03:35 espionage stories set in heavily IP-driven worlds.
03:38 Peacemaker was a better "Secret Invasion" storyline
03:40 than "Secret Invasion" was.
03:41 So to this end, I think Marvel Studios struggled
03:43 to overcome three challenges in particular
03:45 when it came to "Secret Invasion."
03:46 Number one, we've talked about before
03:48 what I call the scale dilemma.
03:50 In an invastigation I did on the Deep Dive channel,
03:52 I broke down how in 2019,
03:54 when Marvel only made two to three movies a year,
03:56 there was only seven hours and 14 minutes total
03:58 of MCU content to account for.
04:00 In 2021, that expanded to 34 hours and 42 minutes
04:04 across four films and five Disney+ streaming series.
04:07 And then in 2022, 22 hours and 42 minutes
04:10 across three films, three Disney+ series,
04:12 and two special presentations.
04:14 Now to be clear, I don't think any of us are complaining
04:16 about having too much content,
04:17 but since Marvel in particular depends
04:19 on all of these storylines interconnecting
04:22 in the same universe, it's just harder and harder to do that
04:26 when you want all of these titles
04:27 to also have distinct tonal variety and unique stakes.
04:30 "Secret Invasion" has to take place in a world
04:32 where Tiamat is poking out of the ozone layer
04:34 and Captain Marvel's power set is supposed
04:36 to be uniquely tied to an upcoming plot,
04:38 making it pretty hard for a fourth character
04:40 to suddenly get her powers.
04:41 Furthermore, Marvel's approach to rely on reshoots,
04:44 there were apparently extensive reshoots
04:46 for "Secret Invasion," and Marvel's tendency
04:48 to reconfigure plot lines during post-production,
04:50 sometimes you can pull that off,
04:51 like the Russo brothers did that for "Infinity War"
04:52 in "Endgame" and pulled it off,
04:54 but I think it's especially damaging to the espionage genre
04:57 in which audiences expect characters
04:59 to be a step ahead of us and outsmart each other
05:01 and keep us guessing about their plans
05:03 and to be brilliant master tacticians.
05:05 "Secret Invasion" really just played out
05:06 as a battle of idiots.
05:08 Who could fumble the least?
05:09 Like Fury and Gaia's Avenger DNA plan,
05:12 that was so dangerously stupid.
05:14 And Nick Fury's supposed to be one
05:15 of the cleverest people in the MCU.
05:17 If you're the kind of person who likes working on cars
05:19 but doesn't have the room in your apartment
05:20 for a full garage,
05:21 then the "Fast and Furious" miniature collection
05:23 from Fanhome might be just what you need.
05:25 Fanhome is a brand dedicated
05:26 to developing unique collections
05:28 and build up models from your favorite fandoms,
05:30 whether that's "Star Wars," "Marvel," or "The Fast Saga."
05:32 A Fanhome subscription gets you magazines loaded
05:35 with trivia and stories about your favorite fandom,
05:37 but also everything you need
05:38 to build your very own family
05:40 of awesome physics-defying cars.
05:42 The cars at Fanhome's "Fast and Furious" collection
05:44 are 1-43 scale models made of die-cast metal
05:48 and injected ABS plastic.
05:50 They're hand-painted,
05:51 so every detail is film-accurate, including the interiors.
05:54 They've got rubber tires that you can steer
05:56 and roll wherever you want,
05:57 Rio, outer space, Rome, or just your next family barbecue.
06:01 With a Fanhome subscription,
06:02 you'll get a new kit every month
06:04 with easy-to-follow instructions
06:05 on how to put everything together.
06:06 You'll also get a Dodge Charger off-road model,
06:09 an exclusive T-shirt, a mug, and three posters.
06:12 But just like the movies, it's all about the cars.
06:15 And family, but like a car-centric family.
06:17 And look at these things, they're incredible.
06:19 To get started with Fanhome,
06:20 just click the link in the description below.
06:22 The second issue that I think Marvel struggled with
06:24 is "Sacred Invasion" needs "Avengers."
06:26 The reason Brian Michael Bendis' comic crossover storyline
06:29 is so beloved is that it seemed like
06:31 every Marvel hero could tie in with it.
06:33 And indeed, everyone pretty much does.
06:35 But in the MCU, in phase five on Disney+,
06:38 it's just really, really hard to pull that off
06:40 so that it retroactively fits in perfectly
06:42 with 15 years of an interconnected cinematic universe
06:46 and still stay on budget.
06:47 Like, at the end of the day,
06:48 they couldn't afford to bring in Chris Hemsworth
06:50 or Robert Downey Jr., Chris Evans,
06:52 or even Mark Ruffalo to show up.
06:53 Thought they could pay Julie Louis-Dreyfus to do this,
06:55 but I guess not.
06:56 The series instead provided two solutions.
06:58 Reveal one, longtime Avenger is a Skrull,
07:01 in this case, James Rhoades' war machine,
07:03 but gave no answers on when that swap occurred
07:06 and even had the gall to ask the question
07:07 but not answer it.
07:09 So we're just kind of left guessing
07:10 how much of a beloved character's storyline
07:12 was made up of lies.
07:13 There's no catharsis.
07:15 The second solution they offered
07:16 was this final Super Skrull battle between Gaia and Gravik,
07:19 which did feature nods to over 20 MCU characters,
07:22 and I'll admit, it was fun to watch.
07:23 But ultimately, it was two characters we cared less about
07:26 cosplaying with literal arm sleeves
07:29 of more interesting characters.
07:31 It's not the powers of those characters that we love,
07:33 it's the faces and the personalities of Drax and Groot
07:36 and Mantis and Bruce Banner and Thanos and the rest
07:39 that really matter to the fans.
07:40 That, plus the goofy VFX of Drax's arm
07:42 being way too small for Gaia's body,
07:44 it just kind of left us feeling hollow.
07:46 But the third thing that Marvel's really struggling with
07:48 is a central vision and really an identity crisis.
07:51 Ultimately, what "Secret Invasion" was missing the most,
07:53 and I think what the MCU desperately needs right now,
07:55 is a strong central vision for all of these titles
07:58 and what identity an espionage-filled "Secret Invasion" series
08:01 would occupy in the overall MCU slate.
08:04 Like, when you look at "Star Wars,"
08:05 Tony Gilroy was able to outline his vision for Andor
08:08 in its "Rogue One" prequel timeline
08:09 with dark, grounded, spycraft themes
08:11 because he was able to pitch that as a contrast
08:14 to the Dave Filoni side of "Star Wars,"
08:16 because Filoni has done such an effective job
08:18 defining that side of the brand.
08:20 The fact that Lucasfilm saw that in Gilroy's pitch document
08:22 and believed in him led to Andor being a quality,
08:25 if underwatched, title.
08:27 And yes, there was just some amazing goddamn writing
08:29 on that show, because when characters were killed off,
08:32 it mattered.
08:33 Before "Marvel Phase 4," Kevin Feige described it
08:35 as a response to "Endgame" and kind of a reset.
08:38 Okay, but for "Phase 5," with "Quantumania,"
08:41 "Guardians Vol. 3," and "Secret Invasion,"
08:43 and the Marvel's coming,
08:44 we do not know what the central vision of Marvel is
08:48 and what identity each of these titles is striving to hit,
08:51 other than, I suppose, what She-Hulk made fun of Marvel for,
08:54 CGI-filled, unfulfilling final acts.
08:57 But Marvel has an identity crisis right now,
09:00 which means some titles are gonna be great
09:02 if the director has a strong central vision for it
09:04 and the studio didn't interfere with that,
09:06 like as was the case with "Guardians Vol. 3,"
09:08 but other titles are just gonna feel weird and confusing,
09:11 as is the case with "Quantumania."
09:12 "Secret Invasion" just did not have its own strong vision
09:15 for what the show was going to be about.
09:17 It started as a show about political conspiracies
09:19 and xenophobia, but really ended as a show
09:21 about American overreactionism and married life.
09:25 Like, imagine what "Secret Invasion" would have looked like
09:27 if it opened with President Ritson's address
09:30 and then a montage of news anchors
09:31 and world leaders getting assassinated,
09:33 some Skrull, some human.
09:35 What would happen next?
09:36 That is what "Secret Invasion" should feel like.
09:38 That should have been the tone for the entire series.
09:41 But instead, Marvel left us once again thinking,
09:43 well, maybe the next one will be better.
09:45 I wanna know your thoughts on "Secret Invasion" as a whole
09:47 in the comments below.
09:48 If you like what we're doing at New Rock Stars,
09:50 please subscribe to all three of our channels
09:52 so you can follow me on all social platforms @eavoss.
09:55 Thank you for watching, and I'll see you next time, bye.
09:57 (upbeat music)
10:00 (upbeat music)
10:02 (upbeat music)
10:05 (upbeat music)
10:07 (upbeat music)
10:10 (upbeat music)
10:12 (upbeat music)
10:15 (upbeat music)