Shimano Global Recall | Cycling Weekly
Shimano has announced what could be, the biggest product recall in cycling history. Over 2.8 million cranks have been subject to the recall with over 4,500 recorded failures which sees the delamination and in some cases complete separation of the cranks, sometimes with catastrophic results.
Joe Baker and Sam Gupta dive into the details of the product recall from Shimano, they also discuss Joe's experience with the brand new range topping endurance bike from Pinarello, named the Dogma X, and they also discuss the state of the endurance bike market and pick which bikes they would choose to ride themselves. The Raleigh Chopper is the choice for Bike Of The Month.
Joe Baker and Sam Gupta dive into the details of the product recall from Shimano, they also discuss Joe's experience with the brand new range topping endurance bike from Pinarello, named the Dogma X, and they also discuss the state of the endurance bike market and pick which bikes they would choose to ride themselves. The Raleigh Chopper is the choice for Bike Of The Month.
Transcript
00:00 Welcome to October's Tech of the Month, where we discuss all the latest news and reviews.
00:09 After a brief hiatus, we're back with new bikes and new launches.
00:13 And there is a lot to discuss, because there have been a vast amount of brand new endurance
00:18 bikes hitting the market in recent months, but also what could possibly be one of the
00:23 most significant product recalls in cycling history.
00:28 To be honest, I want to get straight into this Shimano recall, because the implications
00:33 are huge and there is actually quite a lot to unpack here.
00:37 So, Joe, you've become a bit of an expert over the past few days because you have been
00:41 knee deep in all of the context that has been coming out of Shimano.
00:45 So I think a good place to start is what's actually happened.
00:50 So on the 21st of September, 2023, last week at the time of filming, Shimano issued a recall
00:55 in the United States of America and Canada of over 760,000 cranks.
01:02 This came after concerns were raised by the Consumer Product Safety Commission of cranks
01:07 failing and leading to injury and potentially crashes.
01:09 Yeah, OK.
01:11 And what is that number?
01:12 I mean, how many recorded cases is that of, you know, the total that are out there?
01:16 So the current number of recorded failures is 4,519.
01:21 And of the 2.8 million cranks sold between June 2012 and June 2019, that works out around
01:27 a 0.7% failure rate.
01:29 OK, so it's a really small number, but at the same time, 4,500 recorded failures is
01:35 quite a lot.
01:36 Exactly.
01:37 And recorded failures is the key there.
01:38 There could well be more that have gone unrecorded.
01:41 I think it's very safe to say that there probably are.
01:43 Yeah, absolutely.
01:44 So what does that actually mean for the customer and the consumers of these cranks?
01:48 So here's where the waters are slightly muddied.
01:51 In the United States, a no ride has been issued.
01:55 So if you're in the United States, stop riding your cranks until they've been looked at by
02:00 someone in a bike shop, by a mechanic.
02:02 Whereas in Europe, as far as we can tell, there has been no stop ride issued.
02:07 So although the same cranks went to Europe and the United States, the goalposts, if you
02:12 like, are different between the two regions.
02:14 Correct me if I'm wrong, but the advice within Europe is very much still to have your cranks
02:20 checked out by your local Shimano dealer.
02:23 Absolutely right.
02:24 So from the 1st of October, Shimano will be rolling out an inspection programme.
02:28 This is purely cosmetic, which to me sounds slightly worrying, bearing in mind all the
02:33 failures that have been happening are generally catastrophic with little or no warning.
02:38 But as you said, Sam, Shimano is recommending that everybody gets their cranks checked out
02:42 under this programme.
02:43 Yeah.
02:44 And I mean, it's quite helpful because Shimano have essentially listed all of the cranks
02:48 that are affected and will pop on screen now all of the codes for the cranks that are affected.
02:53 So you can check just on the inside of your crank arm whether you have an affected crank.
02:58 But I think if there's any obvious signs of any cracking or if the chain rings are kind
03:02 of coming away from the arms, if there's any weird gaps, if anything doesn't look completely
03:06 flush and smooth, I think it's probably worth getting it checked out by your local dealer.
03:10 And then they can kind of take a more rigorous look at the crank set to see if it's something
03:14 that needs to be replaced.
03:16 But Shimano have been quite good, haven't they?
03:17 Because they've come out and said that if you have a faulty crank set, they will replace
03:22 it.
03:23 So that's good, right?
03:24 That's exactly right.
03:25 So Shimano has said that they will essentially give you a free upgrade to the most recent
03:29 crank.
03:30 So if you had an old Dura-Ace crank, you'll get a new Dura-Ace crank.
03:32 If you have an old Ultegra crank, you'll be upgraded to a new one that is certified to
03:36 be safe.
03:37 They've now changed the manufacturing processes.
03:39 The issue lies though that you'll only receive that upgrade if your cranks prove to fail
03:44 that inspection.
03:45 And once again, as that's purely aesthetic, it's...
03:47 Yeah, because sometimes you can't always see when things are failing.
03:51 So if there's something that you haven't quite noticed yet, and that's why this kind of stop
03:54 ride notice in the US versus the non-stop ride notice in the Europe is kind of just
03:59 slightly worrying.
04:01 Because you could inspect your cranks today, but then in a year's time, basically, you're
04:05 going to have to...
04:06 If you have one of these affected cranks, you're going to have to keep an eye on it
04:09 to see if any problems develop later down the line.
04:11 Because the cranks that did fail, it's not like they happened on the first ride.
04:16 It happened over time.
04:17 So cranks that look fine today could be broken in a year's time.
04:20 So I think it's one of those things if you do really have to keep an eye on it.
04:24 And that to me from Shimano is arguably almost negligent because a very complex issue is
04:28 sort of being made black and white.
04:30 And I think that's where the issue lies.
04:31 Yeah.
04:32 So what do you think then it means for Shimano?
04:35 Because I think what's really interesting here is that they are recalling products from
04:40 a seven-year cycle.
04:42 And the other really important fact here is that not all of the Dura-Ace 9100 cranks were
04:48 part of the recall.
04:50 So that means that they changed their manufacturing process midway through that product cycle,
04:54 meaning they knew about the problem for quite a while and what was causing it.
04:58 Exactly.
04:59 And that's where for me the negligence comes in.
05:01 At the very least, it's a massive kick in the teeth.
05:03 I think the very fact that it's 2.8 million cranks affected over that period of time globally,
05:08 which is such a huge amount.
05:09 I think that, yeah, whichever way you look at it, it's going to be very expensive for
05:13 Shimano but also pretty damaging to their reputation.
05:16 Absolutely.
05:17 I think this has been something with, I mean, there's a very pretty popular Instagram account
05:21 called Thanks Shimano where essentially all of the failures have been logged.
05:25 So big shout out to those guys.
05:26 But they've been on it for a really long time.
05:29 And it's mad that the product cycle, obviously it was made up until 2019, the 30th of June
05:35 2019.
05:36 We're now September 2023, four years later.
05:41 In some ways, it has taken too long.
05:43 Absolutely.
05:44 So what are the implications worldwide?
05:47 So this is where, once again, things get even more complicated.
05:50 We actually spoke with Thomas Jervis, who is a solicitor at Lead Day, a very renowned
05:54 company in the UK.
05:56 And he sort of explained that due to the fact there's no global regulator for product recalls,
06:02 basically there's different rules that can be applied all over the world.
06:05 In the UK in particular, because of the way our regulatory system works, it's quite outdated.
06:10 It's actually going to be really quite tricky to legally hold Shimano to account.
06:14 Obviously, arguably it's not in their best interest to try and wriggle out of it because,
06:19 as I mentioned before, their reputation is on the line.
06:22 But just in terms of how much bureaucracy there's going to be, how much strain this
06:26 will put on bike shops, distributors, bike brands, everybody is going to be affected
06:30 just because of the sheer scale of Shimano.
06:32 Now other than just visually checking the cranks, you can also listen to your cranks.
06:37 Now funnily enough, Shimano posted a video two weeks ago, but it was an unlisted video
06:42 on YouTube.
06:43 And it's a demonstration of the noise that these cranks can make if they are defective.
06:49 And it sounds a little like this.
06:58 Interestingly as well, it's exactly what you said.
07:00 That video was posted two weeks ago, which to me begs the question, how long have Shimano
07:05 known about this?
07:06 How long has the pressure been mounting potentially from the CPSC?
07:09 Well, yeah, I mean, I reckon they've known about the problem for a really long time.
07:12 Like in some ways, it's something that's been out in the wild for quite a long time.
07:16 Again, thanks Shimano.
07:18 So I think they've probably been preparing for this for a really long time.
07:22 And again, because, you know, replacement units will hopefully be available from the
07:26 1st of October going onwards, they've probably had to build up an inventory of stock so that
07:31 when all of these broken cranks start coming back to them, they have units they can send
07:35 out to distributors.
07:37 So that essentially, yeah, customers can have kind of a straight swap.
07:40 So they must have been planning this for a really long time.
07:46 Now Joe, you are fresh back from Italy just last week from Pinarello because they launched
07:50 a new bike, the Pinarello Dogma X.
07:54 So what do you actually think of the new Dogma X?
07:57 Yeah, so to put things into perspective first, the Dogma X is essentially a slightly softened
08:04 up Dogma F. So slightly slacker geometry, longer chainstays, higher stack, all of the
08:10 main sort of candidates.
08:11 And I think they did a pretty good job.
08:13 I think the ethos of the bike is brilliant.
08:15 The geometry is also really good.
08:17 It handles really well.
08:19 The X-Stays technology, which they've brought in for a comfier rear end to the bike, did
08:24 a good job of soaking up the larger bumps and the 35mm tyre clearance too made things
08:29 really comfortable.
08:30 I did though notice a really distinct lack of stiffness from both the bottom bracket
08:34 and head tube when compared to a race bike.
08:37 I guess it was created not to be a race bike, but to be an endurance bike.
08:41 So surely those attributes actually do make sense or not?
08:43 They do make sense, absolutely.
08:45 I think Pinarello really marketed this as like the performance endurance bike, if that
08:50 makes sense.
08:51 So for the person that wants to go fast, but also be comfortable.
08:54 And while it does the comfort pretty well, I think arguably there's just a bit of a lack
08:58 of stiffness and maybe a tiny bit of the sort of true Dogma F character that could have
09:04 been carried over.
09:05 Oh, okay.
09:06 Interesting.
09:07 Now, one thing that I'm wondering is the geometry that's found on the Dogma X, is that the same
09:10 geometry that's found on the X-Series bikes?
09:13 Very good question.
09:14 So no, it's not.
09:15 Pinarello now essentially have two different endurance bikes.
09:18 The Dogma X sits a little bit closer to the Dogma F and the X-Series is slacker still.
09:25 So the chain stays the same length, but there's a higher stack and a shorter reach again.
09:31 So that really is aimed more at comfort.
09:33 Okay.
09:34 So the Dogma X then makes more sense to be slightly more performance orientated than
09:38 the X-Series themselves.
09:40 That's exactly right.
09:41 And arguably it's the Dogma most people should probably own.
09:44 I think a lot of us get sucked into this wanting the latest and greatest race bike because
09:48 Tom Pidcock rides it, because Filippo Ganna rides it.
09:51 But actually the Dogma X, a little bit more slack, a little bit more tire clearance, but
09:56 for the majority of us, probably a much more usable bike.
09:59 For sure.
10:00 But I mean, we don't have the flexibility of professional athletes or the power output.
10:03 So it makes sense that we don't actually use the same tools for the job.
10:07 One thing that does interest me though, is what implications does this have for the Dogma
10:12 F?
10:13 I mean, we're predicting that a Dogma F could come either next year or 2025.
10:17 So what does this then mean for that bike?
10:20 Does that mean that the new Dogma F is going to be even more racy and it's going to be
10:25 even more dialed in because it is essentially being made to be just for the pros?
10:29 That's exactly right.
10:30 So chief of operations at Pinarello, Maurizio Bellin, actually sort of told us over dinner,
10:35 quite informally, but sort of said this really lets the engineers off the hook now to do
10:40 whatever they want with the Dogma F.
10:42 The Dogma F really is a bike designed for the Ineos Grenadiers and it's designed to
10:47 be raced at the highest level.
10:49 And having the Dogma X sort of allows the engineers to go all in on a true race bike.
10:54 Interesting.
10:55 Okay.
10:56 So I mean, it's probably fair to say that the jump, she's probably going to get a bit
10:59 more aggressive, probably going to be lighter, probably going to be stiffer.
11:02 All of the usual cues.
11:04 The full compliment of top trumps.
11:06 Perfect.
11:07 So overall then it kind of sounds like you were kind of impressed by some features, but
11:12 also let down by others in other areas.
11:14 I just wonder if they could have explored other avenues to get the same level of compliance
11:18 whilst keeping a higher level of stiffness in the bike.
11:21 Interesting.
11:22 Okay.
11:23 I mean, what makes this even more interesting is the fact that this bike is landing in a
11:26 year where there seems to have been a million new endurance bikes.
11:30 I mean, I've got a small list here.
11:32 This year so far, we have had obviously the new Dogma X and the X series range of bikes
11:37 from Pinarello.
11:38 We've had a Specialized Roubaix.
11:40 We had a new Trek Dumané less than 12 months ago.
11:43 We've had the new Canyon Endurace.
11:45 We've had the new Specialized Valet, which was made to be more of an endurance platform.
11:49 We've also had the Vitus Venon and finally, most recently, the Giant Defy.
11:54 So that bike is landing in a world of brand new endurance tech.
11:59 But what this also then challenges is what's even happened to the endurance category?
12:04 Because it feels like the whole thing's just been obliterated.
12:06 And actually, it just doesn't exist anymore because I feel like you've either got endurance
12:11 all-road bikes or performance endurance bikes.
12:14 And I'm not really too sure what's actually the right thing to buy.
12:19 Exactly right.
12:20 And it's very telling, isn't it, that the Giant Defy actually shares almost the exact
12:24 same geometry after getting a little bit more aggressive as the Pinarello Dogma X.
12:29 They compare for a given frame size within two millimeters on stack reach and chainstay
12:33 length.
12:34 And that leads into what you were saying about there being two different types of endurance
12:38 bike you've got, performance-oriented endurance bikes and all-road endurance bikes.
12:42 And I think, to be honest, that's a really good thing for the industry.
12:46 As we were saying, not all of us can ride a race bike and I don't think we should be
12:49 riding a race bike.
12:51 So the fact that we now have more choice in bikes that suit the majority of consumers,
12:55 for me, is a really good thing.
12:56 Okay, that's really interesting.
12:58 Because I guess if you look at, say, the new Specialized Roubaix or the Canyon Endurace,
13:02 they are really clearly tapered more to that all-road category, which isn't necessarily
13:07 a bad thing.
13:08 And if anything, given the state of the UK roads, actually is probably pretty ideal.
13:13 But I think with the Giant Defy and the Dogma X, I think it's going to be really interesting
13:16 for us to spend more time on those bikes because it would kind of make me wonder whether or
13:20 not I'd actually want to go back towards a pure race bike or whether or not it would
13:25 actually give me all of the performance I'd actually need.
13:27 Yep, I totally agree.
13:28 I think it leaves the consumer with a real choice as to whether they want to go down
13:32 that hardcore race avenue, which for some consumers is absolutely still going to be
13:37 the right thing to do.
13:38 The out-and-out race bikes do feel stiffer, they are often lighter.
13:42 And for some people, that's exactly the right choice.
13:44 But for a lot of customers, I think there's going to be an interesting choice to be made.
13:48 Yeah, 100%.
13:49 So, I mean, given all of the new bikes that have come out over the past 12 months, which
13:54 one would you choose?
13:56 Of the cohort of endurance bikes, it has to be said, I think I'd be most interested in
14:01 trying the Giant Defy.
14:02 The slightly more aggressive geometry and 785-gram frame weight both really interest
14:07 me.
14:08 And I think as well, the way Giant has opted for gaining compliance in the seat post, which
14:12 is away from the frame, away from the bottom bracket, away from the head tube, could make
14:17 for quite a stiff frame that's also compliant as well.
14:19 Again, coupled with 38-millimeter tire clearance as well.
14:22 Yeah, that's very true, actually.
14:24 How about you, Sam?
14:25 What would you opt for?
14:26 So, given the list that I just reeled off earlier, I think I would actually go for the
14:30 Vitus Venon because it's very much got two personalities because you can buy that bike
14:35 in a full road endurance build, or you can buy it in a gravel build.
14:39 And I do quite like that versatility.
14:42 Maybe a couple of years ago, I probably would have gone for the Defy.
14:44 But having got back from riding a whole bunch of gravel in Europe, actually, the gravel
14:49 bike is quite good.
14:50 So I think having that versatility, I think, would be good fun.
14:54 So yeah, Vitus Venon for me.
14:56 Yeah, that makes sense.
14:58 So in 2022, we saw plenty of race bikes released.
15:01 We did.
15:02 In the last 12 months, we've seen plenty of endurance bikes released.
15:05 What's coming next?
15:06 My prediction, given a couple of releases that we've had this year already, like the
15:10 new Orbea and the new Factor, I think next year is very much going to be the year of
15:15 the lightweight climbing bike.
15:17 And I've got a few models penned that I think will be coming out.
15:20 So I think a new Scott Addict is on the cards.
15:23 I think a new Cervelo R5 is on the cards.
15:25 I think a new TCR is on the cards.
15:28 And I think all of those are going to go exactly down the same route, which is basically strip
15:32 all of the weight out and go really aggressive.
15:35 So yeah, next year, you heard it here first, year of the climbing bike.
15:38 Bold claims.
15:39 For October's bike of the month, you may have noticed this beautiful bike behind us, this
15:49 recreation of a Raleigh chopper, but very much made by Raleigh.
15:53 Joe, tell us more about it.
15:55 You're absolutely right.
15:56 So this is a remake.
15:57 It's the closest they've ever got to the original Mark II Raleigh chopper that was released in
16:02 1972.
16:03 Raleigh says that they've had to make a couple of very minor changes just to bring the bike
16:07 up to date.
16:08 But from an aesthetic point of view, this bike is the closest recreation of that Mark
16:12 II Raleigh chopper.
16:13 So why do you think they actually went to the effort of making this thing?
16:15 They've actually done a number of remakes over the last few years due to the fact that
16:19 it's got a huge cult following.
16:21 So as I said, released in 1972.
16:23 To an older generation, there's a lot of nostalgia there.
16:26 Things like ET, Goonies, but also to a younger generation as well with the bike being featured
16:30 in Stranger Things.
16:32 So there's a real rich history there.
16:34 Nice.
16:35 And actually that cult following has led to some bikes being worth quite a lot of money,
16:39 right?
16:40 Absolutely.
16:41 Yes.
16:42 So on the secondhand market, a mint condition one from the sort of late 70s seems to be
16:45 the best era for these bikes.
16:48 Bikes can fetch as much as or even more than £3,000.
16:50 £3,000.
16:51 That is quite a lot of money.
16:52 Happily though, this does not cost as much as that.
16:54 I think this is in somewhere in the hundreds.
16:57 So if you wanted to get one, then I think they did a limited run of production on this
17:01 bike.
17:02 They did do a limited run.
17:03 I did have a look on Riley's website earlier though, and I think they're all sold out.
17:06 Oh, brutal.
17:07 Now despite all of these being sold out, you will actually be able to see this bike in action
17:11 pretty soon, courtesy of Joe.
17:13 That's exactly right.
17:14 Regrettably, I must say, I'm not looking forward to this, but I will be racing this bike in
17:20 a very traditional type of British bike race.
17:22 Interesting.
17:23 So keep your eyes peeled for that one.
17:25 Do let us know down below though, what you think the state of the endurance bike market
17:29 is.
17:30 If you enjoyed the video, then please do drop it a like, subscribe to the channel for more
17:33 content and we will see you again very soon.
17:35 Thanks for watching.
17:38 [BLANK_AUDIO]