"Jo cheezayn istemal hoti hai politicians ke khilaf...," Mustafa Nawaz Khokhar
"Jo cheezayn istemal hoti hai politicians ke khilaf...," Mustafa Nawaz Khokhar
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00:00 Politicians have admitted that the power that is at the forefront of this country is not the people.
00:13 And if we want to come to power, we have to keep those powers happy.
00:18 And if we don't keep them happy, they will throw us out using these laws.
00:24 And I was surprised to see that yesterday I was in a TV program and a friend of Tehreek-e-Insaf was very strongly opposing this.
00:32 That this should be kept in its place.
00:35 Although you see what conditions you are going through right now.
00:39 This will be used against you in the future and in today's time as well.
00:43 It is being used.
00:44 So maturity requires that we take all these things,
00:47 the violence committed against the constitution, the things used to throw out the politicians from the field,
00:54 we should all come together and have a consensus on it and say that this should end.
01:00 What you were saying that we should learn from history, I don't think so.
01:05 Mr. Chaudhary, the issue is that the current parliament that is not there,
01:12 when the parliament comes, it feels that it will have so much power, so much power or consensus.
01:19 Or the court's explanation that will come, we are waiting for that.
01:23 Under that, the 62-63 will be present for some more time.
01:29 Look Maria, this is basically about the one quality of 62-63 and the other is about the inability.
01:38 Now the framers of the constitution of the time, they had put both these things.
01:46 You cannot take out 62-63 completely.
01:49 They had kept some basic things by thinking that this will be the scale.
01:53 Now that scale, I don't know if you remember, when Zia-ul-Haq got the referendum,
01:59 Zia-ul-Haq said that if you want Islam, I will be elected for 5 years, I will be the president of this country.
02:05 So they had put such very basic things.
02:09 As a result of that, we are standing here today.
02:12 And I have a conviction that we are still fighting with Zia-ul-Haq.
02:19 If you look at the class and culture in this country, if you look at the sectarianism in this country,
02:28 if you look at what happened with Afghanistan in this country, as a result of that what happened in Pakistan,
02:34 if you look at religious violence, if you look at the constitution,
02:39 then even today this debate is taking place that whether Zia-ul-Haq had put it in, whether it should be removed or not.
02:43 So as Mr. Khokhar said, there was a complete mindset.
02:48 They reversed the whole society.
02:51 For example, the society that was based on politics, that this is politics, this is anti-politics,
02:57 this is right, this is left, this is right-wing, this is left-wing, this is religious community.
03:01 So there were such debates.
03:04 Then what happened after the 85th election?
03:06 This is a community, its community is big, this will win, this has more money, this will win,
03:11 this can do more mischief, this will win.
03:14 These things came then.
03:16 So all those things that were completely contrary to politics,
03:21 things that were destroying this society,
03:23 all those things were put consciously because Zia-ul-Haq was against politics,
03:28 was against that whole process.
03:30 So before that, there was abdo, before that all these things were happening.
03:33 So this is the society's fabric that has been targeted.
03:36 I think we are standing there.
03:39 The fabric of society has been targeted very carefully.
03:42 Yes, it has been broken.
03:44 The entire social fabric of society has been broken.
03:49 And it is not being able to be made in a new way.
03:52 These are the problems of our society at the moment.
03:55 And instead of things getting better day by day, they are getting worse.
03:59 We have to accept this.
04:01 It is getting more destructive.
04:03 But what is the way forward from here?
04:05 Because again, we are waiting for the Supreme Court's decision.
04:09 But now we saw that more or less the same issues have been raised with Imran Khan.
04:13 Now we see the article that if Nawaz Sharif gets relief,
04:16 then in his defense, will Khan, Tareen, who are pleading their case,
04:21 will also get relief or not?
04:23 But then this matter will go back to the courts.
04:26 Until and unless the political parties themselves decide.
04:31 Then the courts will give the decision that will suit the political party.
04:35 They will be happy if they do not do it.
04:37 Then obviously, campaigns will run.
04:39 And then history will judge those decisions.
04:42 I think, Maria, that in politics, the maturity will have to come.
04:50 But what we have seen in the last 10 years,
04:53 we have seen the face of politics getting smudged,
04:56 we have seen politics deteriorating.
04:58 If we see now, where we see the world in a state of breakdown,
05:03 there the Pakistani society is also in a state of breakdown.
05:06 Your institutions have lost their sanctity.
05:09 Your courts have not been able to do anything.
05:11 Legitimacy also has problems.
05:13 Legitimacy problems have arisen.
05:15 Political parties have not been able to do anything.
05:17 Now, from this point of view, I am often surprised that
05:21 the data that came out a week or a week and a half ago from the World Bank,
05:25 where 9 crore people are living below the Pakistani poverty line,
05:29 the issues of the people there are also disconnected from them.
05:33 And our goal of the politicians at the moment is to get power at all costs.
05:37 Power politics.
05:38 People will not have issues.
05:39 So, a disconnect has arisen in politics and in people.
05:42 That people are forced to ask this question,
05:44 that they take our name, but for whom is this politics?
05:48 So, in this environment, we need a major radical surgery
05:54 that not only fixes all these things, but also restores their credibility.
05:58 Now, the phase through which justice is passing,
06:01 I don't think that the controversies that have been generated,
06:05 that justice will be able to restore its credibility.
06:08 I don't think that political parties will be able to restore their credibility.
06:12 And if we want to move forward in that regard,
06:15 then politicians will have to sit on the same table.
06:18 They will have to sit on the same table and set some boundaries.
06:21 The establishment will also have to sit together.
06:23 And this is not because someone is doing anti-establishment politics,
06:29 someone is doing this, for the sake of Pakistan.
06:32 It's been 76 years, enough is enough.
06:34 But the election we are going into now, Mr. Chaudhary Manzoor,
06:37 obviously, if all these things are going to happen,
06:39 then they will happen after the election.
06:41 We hope that the elections will happen.
06:45 Chief Justice of Pakistan has said that they will do it.
06:48 Is there any space left after that to sit and talk?
06:53 Or is this a turmoil phase,
06:57 where no constructive work can be done, even if we want to?
07:03 Maria, the same people who go to someone to ask for votes,
07:09 they say that they give good advice, they see it.
07:13 The first question they ask is, are the elections happening?
07:16 There is still confusion.
07:18 And I believe that whenever a result has been tried to affect,
07:22 in any election, there is always confusion before that,
07:26 so that people are confused whether the elections will happen or not.
07:29 Yesterday's incident in the Senate, you see, it increased the confusion.
07:34 So, the reaction of the political parties and the way things came,
07:39 it gave clarity, but all of a sudden, everything was reversed.
07:45 Secondly, we will have to see what you can do.