Former Gonzaga All-American Adam Morrison breaks down why the Bulldogs must play at their pace against the Gaels
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01:20 [Music]
01:29 Welcome to The Perimeter, Season 3, Episode 15, sponsored by McGillivray Environmental.
01:34 Good week. We're going to recap multiple games.
01:38 Talk about... we talked a little bit about Ben Gray going in the starting lineup, but I want to touch on that a little bit.
01:45 He's had a good run as a starter. I think it's really helped us schematically.
01:49 And then talk about probably the biggest game of the year in conference, obviously, with St. Mary's coming to town 7-0.
01:54 We're obviously one game behind. It'll be a huge swing for us if we can get that win,
02:01 and then it'll help us in the net ranking, hopefully.
02:04 We're going to talk about the bracketology. Lonardi still has us out. Fox has us first four out.
02:09 I'll get my opinion on that, my take on that.
02:14 Then talk about the AP coaches poll that we're not in yet, and then the net,
02:19 which is always something that we have to monitor, especially in the position we are.
02:24 31 right now, which is not a bad place to be.
02:28 I think traditionally, if you're in the top 40, you usually get in that large bit,
02:32 but then, like I just mentioned, Fox and Lonardi have us as one of the first four teams out.
02:38 But I trust those websites. They're pretty good, and they're historically pretty good.
02:45 And then we got some listener questions. Did you go to the game last night?
02:49 I did, and my son had a basketball practice, and I was like, "Eight o'clock to start is late."
02:55 But I wish I would have been there. I was like, "I should have just gone and just made it,"
02:59 because it looked like a blast.
03:01 Yeah, it was great energy. Students are obviously back, but the energy was fantastic,
03:07 and we played as good as we played all season.
03:11 We flew around that first half. They hung with us for a little bit,
03:18 but it was just one of those games that you kind of felt like they didn't have a prayer
03:23 after about the first 10 minutes, up 16 and a half.
03:29 I'm going to talk about a defensive subject that we don't usually do a lot.
03:33 We're decent defensively, but I've mentioned it in the past,
03:37 and I talk about it a lot on the broadcast.
03:41 If you watched the game last night, we switched all their ball screen and screen-away action
03:46 except on Dom Harris. We just fought and got through it.
03:51 Normally this year with Braden, and especially Graham, we've had a show package,
03:55 either a drop, hard show, and then a traditional tag from the weak side.
04:01 If you're listening and you're kind of wondering what I'm talking about,
04:04 normally when you play ball screen coverages, in the past it used to be a traditional big guy,
04:09 and you always had to show hard or drop, and your guard had to do everything,
04:13 and it really made it hard because the guys on the weak side had to chug the roller
04:20 if your guy was showing, and then you leave the corner, and then that gave up.
04:24 Ghost cuts. Remember Joel was really good at ghost cutting,
04:27 and so that's what a ghost cut is, right, from the corner side.
04:31 In the last five, six years, we've switched everything,
04:34 and just think how good defensively we've been in the last five, six, seven years.
04:37 With Shett's group, with obviously BC and Rui's group was one of the most elite.
04:42 Corey's group, where we just switched everything and played through that.
04:48 Well, we did that first all year last night with Graham, and I thought he was fantastic,
04:52 and look how much it messed up all of their actions.
04:58 And so, why I bring it up is like, I think we're going to do that the rest of the year,
05:02 and it showed that we can. Now, is it going to be as elite as those groups I just mentioned?
05:07 No, but I think it solves some of our issues defensively that we might have.
05:12 Like some of the mistakes get minimized, especially for the young players,
05:16 like a Dusty or even a Braden.
05:20 So I was really impressed and happy that they went to that.
05:24 You could tell LMU was completely flummoxed on what to do,
05:28 and what it does is it takes away the small disorganization
05:34 or the little gaps or advantages that you get in the ball screen coverages.
05:40 So instead of having to tag or Graham being away from the basket,
05:44 he just switches, you know, gets in a stance and guards a guy for three, four dribbles,
05:50 and then that's it, right? And the easy thing on that situation is
05:59 every big guy that we've had that has been successful here,
06:04 all the guys that can do that were pro—that turned into pro prospects.
06:09 Okay, so you got Domus could do it, right?
06:13 BC, obviously. Rui, obviously. Zach Collins could do it.
06:20 Chet was like a lead at it, and people would try to switch,
06:22 and they'd be like, "Oh, I'm just going to go by this guy."
06:24 He's like, "Nope." You know, he uses length, and he would—you know, but like, you have to do it.
06:28 My point is like, so you go to Graham, and you say,
06:31 "Hey, if you want to play at the next level, potentially,
06:33 you have to be able to guard a guy for three, four dribbles, five seconds."
06:37 And it's an easy like, "All right, I better figure this out."
06:40 So I was really impressed with that schematic change.
06:44 Now, will we do it all season? No, but it's nice to show that we can do it.
06:49 You know, like, think of the guys who've struggled in that, you know, situation.
06:56 It's hard for them to find a place in the league.
06:58 Kelly could do it, right? Yeah, Schimmick—
07:01 Schimmick couldn't do it. Drew was okay at it, but it was hard for him.
07:05 But you see what I'm saying? Yeah, totally.
07:07 And so it really, really helps you, and you know, that's going to last throughout the season,
07:13 just that—to have that in your back pocket, but it really messed up LMU.
07:16 I didn't think they were prepared for that, because we haven't shown it all year.
07:19 And then their defense scheme against the pick-and-roll was interesting.
07:26 They were switching and trying to dive, like downhill switch and smash.
07:30 And I think of the first five pick-and-roll actions we ran, we got a dunk,
07:35 we got two layups, we got a foul, and I think we got a corner three out of it.
07:39 And like, it was just—they didn't have any answer.
07:41 So I was really impressed with the game last night.
07:44 The best part about that game was, obviously, sharing the basketball,
07:50 we have 19 assists, only five turnovers, 12 steals. We forced 20 of theirs.
07:56 But to say, how we started and how we came out the second half,
07:59 that's been kind of an issue in the previous games.
08:03 I'll talk about Pacific here shortly, and I'll give some numbers for people
08:06 that were freaking out watching that game.
08:08 People have short memories, man. Like, it's nuts.
08:13 But yeah, it was fun in there. Not that it hasn't been, but it was super fun.
08:19 We were making those type of zag plays, getting out and running, layups, dunks,
08:24 guys sharing the basketball.
08:27 Nolan was fantastic, had a career-high 24, 10 of 15 from the field, 4 of 7 from downtown.
08:33 Graham, only in 22 minutes, 8 of 9, 20 points.
08:36 Anton, in 28 minutes, 4 of 4, 10 points, 5 rebounds, 4 assists,
08:41 no turnovers, 3 steals, fantastic.
08:44 Ben Gregg, again, 11 and 5, 4 of 5 from the field in only 20 minutes.
08:50 Nembhard didn't have his best game, but was under control.
08:53 Sometimes he just doesn't—he didn't play bad, but it was other people's night.
08:58 Braden was good off the bench, 4 of 8, 10 points, 5 rebounds.
09:02 So it was a game that everybody kind of got to play, and we got off the floor preparing for—
09:07 I know it was going to be a long week, but we got a good prep time for St. Mary's coming into town.
09:14 Did a good job on their best players.
09:16 Dom Harris played here for two years, averaging 15, shooting 43% from 3.
09:25 We did a really good job on him.
09:26 He was 4 of 13, only had 11 points, 0 assists, 4 turnovers.
09:30 So he had 0 in the first half, so kind of felt bad for him, too,
09:34 because the transfer was the right thing to do.
09:39 He probably wasn't going to play much this year if Steele didn't get hurt.
09:42 People were like, "Well, Steele was in."
09:44 It probably would have been the same situation.
09:47 Not that he's not a good player, it's just one of those you just don't fit, maybe.
09:52 And he's having a great season at LMU, but I felt bad because on the first half he didn't play good.
09:57 So I was like, "I want the kid to have some success."
10:00 You know what I'm saying?
10:01 There have to be some nerves there.
10:03 100%.
10:04 And he's a nice kid, his family was nice, and they're nice people.
10:08 There's no ill will, but it's just like, "Ah," you feel bad when a kid's not like—
10:12 you don't want him to go bonkers, but you're also like,
10:14 "Man, he had 4 turnovers, 0 points first half."
10:17 You're like, "Ah."
10:18 So when he made his first shot on the air, I was like, "Yes."
10:20 You know what I mean?
10:21 For real.
10:22 Not a pity thing, it was just like, "You don't want a kid to—"
10:26 because there is a lot of nerves and all that stuff.
10:29 I'm sure some of the students probably were saying things that were not very nice.
10:32 You know what I mean?
10:34 I was glad that he scored and got 11 in the second half and played better.
10:39 But it was fantastic.
10:40 I mean, we lost on the glass, but it doesn't matter.
10:43 We ended up winning by—what was that, 34?
10:47 Yeah, it was a great game.
10:48 So I was really impressed, pleased.
10:50 That's a tricky team to play against.
10:52 Oh, 715 from 3, so 46%.
10:56 Fantastic.
10:59 So I thought it was our best game energy-wise all season,
11:04 especially first half, second half starts, like I mentioned.
11:07 So yeah, really good, you know, kind of a potential to be,
11:12 quote-unquote, a trap game, or whatever he talks about.
11:15 I think because LMU had played St. Mary's really close on Saturday,
11:20 and I mean, everyone's looking at St. Mary's as being the team to beat right now,
11:25 and WCC, and I think, yeah, that trap—
11:27 I think we were thinking, like, people were thinking, like,
11:30 this could be another close game, especially after the last two games.
11:33 Yeah.
11:34 And, you know, getting a slow start against this team might have hurt us.
11:39 But I mean, having—I think at one time they had 11 turnovers in the first, like, 10 minutes.
11:45 Yeah, like I said, the switching, they weren't prepared for it.
11:48 What it does, too, it makes you get through your third or fourth action
11:51 if you're not prepared for it.
11:53 And then usually your third or fourth option or action is not your best ones,
11:58 usually your first two.
11:59 So sometimes you're throwing it to guys that you don't want to throw the ball,
12:03 and they'll be like, "Oh, there's a mismatch."
12:04 Like, yeah, but you're throwing it to your fourth-best scorer against maybe,
12:09 like, if he's a post, he's going against a guard, but he's not very good.
12:14 Yeah.
12:15 You know what I'm saying?
12:15 So, like, that's where it tricks people into thinking that they're getting advantages
12:20 and when they're really not.
12:21 Like, even at the, like, AU level, like, for high school, I switched almost everything.
12:26 It just messes teams up.
12:27 They're not used to it.
12:28 It's like, "What?
12:29 It's unfair.
12:30 You're supposed to show, and then we get—you know, my girl can turn the corner."
12:34 You know what I mean?
12:34 It's like, "No, you just switch and tell everybody to body up
12:37 and make them take a tough contested, too, and off we go."
12:41 Yeah.
12:42 So I was really impressed with the defense overall, and it was a great atmosphere.
12:45 It felt good in there.
12:47 Let's go to the Pacific game real quick.
12:50 Now, we ended up being down 1-1/2, and, you know, if you get online—
12:56 and I'm not a big message board guy, really not, but, like, you know,
12:59 like, at the bottom of the Zag website—or the Zag Instagram account,
13:04 you'll see some of the comments, and you're just like, "Jeez, man,"
13:06 or, like, you know, all the stuff on Facebook.
13:09 And the '17 team was down by 7, I think, down there.
13:14 That went to the National Championship game.
13:16 '21 team was down at halftime there.
13:19 How do you set a stat last night?
13:21 I think in the sixth of the last seven years, we either were tied or down at halftime there.
13:27 And we end up winning by 9.
13:30 Great second half.
13:31 Nolan Hickman was fantastic, again, at 19 points.
13:34 Graham E. Kaye, as well, at 20.
13:36 Ben Gregg, 13-8.
13:38 Fantastic.
13:40 We just don't match up, or we just play bad down there.
13:43 We won by 9 last year there, too.
13:46 Yeah.
13:46 So, like, everybody was like—and it's funny when people are like,
13:52 "St. Mary's just beating by 48," which they just did, okay?
13:56 We just beat LMU by—what did I just say? 34?
14:00 37, yeah.
14:01 37, okay? Right?
14:04 Yeah.
14:05 Hold on, but LMU beat—or St. Mary's beat LMU by a combined 9 points.
14:11 So, it's always just like, "Well, why aren't we killing this team?"
14:14 "Well, why didn't St. Mary's blow out LMU? We just blew out LMU."
14:19 You know what I'm saying?
14:19 So, like, my point is, like, sometimes I get the fan stuff,
14:23 but sometimes it's so dumb that you're like,
14:26 "Man, you shouldn't be allowed to comment on anything."
14:29 Seriously, you're a moron.
14:30 I agree. Yeah, no, it's—
14:31 It's like, you're an idiot.
14:32 I think it's just that we've—fans have become so complacent in that
14:37 Gonzaga should always be in a tournament.
14:39 We should always be blowing out teams.
14:41 They look at, like, net rankings and they see that Pacific is, you know, 354
14:47 and, like, probably one of the worst teams.
14:48 But then—but then, I mean, every—all these kids playing, they're all—
14:53 I mean, they're going to college to play basketball.
14:55 Like, it's—they're all talented players.
14:57 I've said this a million times, and this is not a hot take,
15:00 but, like, our games, they're Super Bowl.
15:02 Yeah.
15:02 I know that's so cliche, but it's true.
15:04 Yeah.
15:05 And it's also, like, sometimes matchups and styles matter.
15:10 And for some reason, we just don't play good down there, but we win.
15:15 So, yeah, like, all those teams I just mentioned were fantastic.
15:20 I mean, Elite Eight last year, then two national championship runner-ups,
15:24 and they struggled, but Pacific.
15:26 And they're—those teams, you know, are probably more talented than these.
15:31 So, again, sometimes I just had to mention that.
15:33 It's like, dude, for some reason, we don't play good down there,
15:36 but we still get wins.
15:37 Who cares?
15:37 Move on.
15:39 And so, you know, and again, sometimes those games are good
15:44 because you have to play through anxiety.
15:45 You have to make plays.
15:47 And you play a style—just play weird down there.
15:49 Just four out, five out, and then they zoned us.
15:53 And then they just—you know what I'm saying?
15:54 And, like, guys kind of play out of their minds.
15:56 And so, you know, that's pretty much the recap of that game.
16:01 I thought we were fantastic on the glass, plus 14,
16:04 but I just had to throw that out.
16:06 And it's like, dude, for some reason, we don't play good there,
16:09 but it's a W, and we get the hell out of there.
16:11 Who cares?
16:12 You know what I mean?
16:13 And so, I think, like I said, people have short memories.
16:16 I understand it's good that we have fans.
16:19 It really is.
16:21 But also sometimes it's like, dude, you have to look at the totality.
16:25 And also, you can't just go, "Well, St. Mary's beat them by 48.
16:28 What the heck is wrong with us?"
16:29 And it's like, well, like I said, St. Mary's only beat both games
16:34 by a combined nine points.
16:36 LMU, we just blew LMU out, and we put in our backups,
16:40 like backup backups at the 7-10 mark.
16:42 So, if we really kept everybody in, we could have been 40 or 50.
16:45 Easy.
16:46 So, yeah, it was, it's always funny reading those stuff.
16:51 And it's just like, people are dumb.
16:54 You know, I mean that in the nicest way.
16:57 - Keyboard warriors.
16:59 - And again, you can have a critical opinion all day long.
17:05 This is what this show tries to be about sometimes too,
17:09 is having me tell it like it is.
17:12 But like some of it's just so dumb and so like juvenile of the logic.
17:18 It's like, "Well, we should be killing them.
17:20 They suck."
17:20 It's like, yeah, sometimes people play out of their mind.
17:22 Like you mentioned, they're Division I basketball players.
17:25 This is the only time they're going to have like fans in there at the game.
17:29 So, they're a little bit hyped.
17:30 And they know it's Gonzaga and blah, blah, blah.
17:34 And for some reason, we always, you know, we always, that road trip,
17:38 we have to fly in the night before and we just, you know, play.
17:41 It's just a weird trip.
17:43 You can't go out anywhere.
17:44 It's a weird part of town, blah, blah, blah.
17:46 So, I don't know.
17:47 But anyway, it's an overall good week.
17:50 Obviously, the San Francisco…
17:52 - The Perimeter will be right back after a word from our sponsor.
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18:25 - It's an overall good week.
18:27 Obviously, the San Francisco game, we didn't cover.
18:30 I know that was probably, what, now 10 days ago.
18:32 - Yeah.
18:34 - Really good game.
18:35 San Francisco was in the 50s in the net.
18:38 So, it ended up being, you know, it could be potentially a really good win for us.
18:42 We ended up winning 77-72.
18:45 Had to make plays down the stretch.
18:48 My memory serves, probably midway through the second half,
18:51 we went on a nice run to get up, like, 10 or 11.
18:55 And then they came back in that last four minutes.
18:59 No, actually, it was the two-and-a-half-minute mark they started fouling.
19:02 And they're a big analytic team.
19:04 They have been since Kyle Smith was there, then he left, and then, obviously,
19:07 Todd Golden, who left.
19:08 But they really believe in analytics.
19:10 I like their program.
19:12 They're 15-6, 4-2 now this year.
19:16 But they started fouling at two-and-a-half.
19:18 A lot of teams, like, if you're down 12 in that spot, just kind of give up.
19:22 And they say, "All right."
19:23 And they got back into when, you know, where the game was in, like, three,
19:26 and we had to make free throws down the stretch.
19:29 And it got anxiety and a lot of groans and stuff in the building after that,
19:35 you know, during that time.
19:36 So, I like those games, though, because I think it puts equity in the bank for us as
19:40 far as, "Hey, you made free throws and anxiety."
19:43 And we had to run a press break, and you had to, you know, meet the pass and all
19:46 that stuff.
19:47 And, you know, our guys did good.
19:50 And Ben Gregg was fantastic.
19:52 Again, Graham E.K. was fantastic.
19:54 I think he's…it's 7 out of the last 8 he's either scored, 19 or more in his games.
20:00 So, he's playing like he should.
20:02 And he put two halves together last game.
20:06 Didn't do it against Pacific.
20:07 Got a great second half.
20:08 But he's finally, you know, being, like, more consistent.
20:12 He's been good all season, but he's being, like, really consistent inside.
20:16 Anton was great, 15 and 7.
20:19 Nemhard was good, 13 and 6 assists.
20:23 And then Nolan was all right that game, but I mentioned the previous…the last two,
20:27 he's been great.
20:28 So, our guys are playing good.
20:30 I think, again, having Ben Gregg in the starting lineup, he started five games.
20:35 He's averaging double figures, which is great.
20:38 So, the move, obviously, was the right one.
20:41 And you always like when a kid is…makes the most of their opportunity.
20:46 Get what I'm saying?
20:48 - Yeah.
20:48 - So, I think it's the perfect deal for us to have him in the starting lineup.
20:55 Dusty's played okay.
20:57 Actually, Dusty played good the last two games previous to last night.
21:01 Banged in some threes.
21:03 You know what I mean?
21:03 So, I think it's the right thing to do.
21:09 Yeah, he just gives us those energy plays and figures out a way to score without having
21:15 to run plays for him and that type of situation.
21:18 So, I was really impressed with him these last five games going into that starting lineup,
21:25 starting at Pepperdine on the road.
21:28 And, yeah, I think we're headed in the right direction.
21:31 St. Mary's is going to be really tough.
21:33 Obviously, our conference rival had a really good turnaround of the season.
21:41 16-6 at one time, I think I saw they were like 3-5.
21:45 - Yeah, at the start of the year.
21:46 - Yeah, they were really struggling.
21:50 You know, they got…they lost to Weber State by 4, lost to San Diego State,
21:55 who we lost to, but they lost by 25.
21:58 That game got blown out.
22:00 Xavier, they got blown out by 17.
22:02 Then lost to Utah by 7.
22:04 Boise State got them.
22:06 Shout out to Leon Rice.
22:07 But they were just really struggling to put things together, and then they figured it out.
22:14 Coming into conference, they've won 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8 games in a row.
22:20 Going back to Kent State, which is always a good win.
22:26 So, yeah, it's going to be an interesting one in the Kennel.
22:32 We should have good energy.
22:33 Obviously, Mahaney's probably their best player.
22:37 The little point guards average in 14.5.
22:40 Digging through his numbers right now.
22:42 Not great, though, if you really look at it.
22:43 39% from the field on 284 attempts and how many games is that?
22:50 22.
22:52 35 from 381 from the free throw line, but…it's not great.
23:00 I'm looking at all the stats.
23:02 They just must play really good team ball because nothing's really sticking out to me.
23:07 That's how they are.
23:08 Yeah, and that's just how they've always been.
23:10 That's how they are.
23:11 Yeah, there's never a guy that really, at least as long as I've been doing this deal,
23:17 is obviously Della Delva and Patty Mills are great players.
23:21 Landell's probably the one that I've called.
23:25 If you look at the team stats, they're 45 from the field.
23:29 It's not great.
23:30 32 from threes, obviously not great.
23:34 It's kind of in our territory.
23:35 We're at probably 33, 34 now.
23:37 They shoot under 70 from free throw line.
23:40 That's not great.
23:42 Rebounds is really good, plus 12 on average.
23:45 They're scoring 72.5.
23:46 Then look at their defensive numbers.
23:49 57.5 points per.
23:52 Holding teams to 38 and then 30 from three.
23:54 That's where they make their pay.
23:57 They're always like that, but usually their numbers are a little bit better than this.
24:02 Some of these could be skewed at the start of the year.
24:04 They just didn't make shots at the start of the year, too.
24:06 I was actually listening to a little snippet on one of their deals and Randy Bennett was
24:11 talking about it.
24:12 He was like, "We didn't hate where we were.
24:14 We just weren't shooting it good, and now we're making shots and voila."
24:18 I've talked about that a lot.
24:20 It's the old expression.
24:21 It's a make or miss league.
24:23 It's an NBA expression.
24:24 It's so true.
24:25 Sometimes you just don't make shots and everybody's like, "What are you doing?"
24:28 It's like we've been running the same plays that we ran five years ago and they all work.
24:32 The ball's not going in the cup and that matters.
24:35 So it'll be tough.
24:36 They're going to play really slow as they always do.
24:39 Obviously they're 7-0 in conference, so if we get this win we'll be tied in the loss
24:44 column with them.
24:45 Then I don't know about the tiebreakers, but the biggest key is to get that first two seeds.
24:50 Let's look real quick.
24:53 Yeah, 21.
24:54 So we're at 31.
24:56 If we get this win, this can turn into a quad one win.
25:00 Not looking ahead, but if you can get two obviously and then another one against San
25:04 Francisco.
25:05 Those are two in the top 55, let's just say, and one top 25.
25:12 That could really help you for a tournament resume if it comes down to bubble type of
25:16 a situation that could help you be like, "Hey, actually we're better.
25:20 We just struggled in November and December, blah, blah, blah."
25:25 I think the thing with St. Mary's is you've got to be really good in your ball screen
25:31 coverages.
25:32 I remember last year we tried to long show, it's called, where you go with Mahaney for
25:41 two or three dribbles and let your guy get over the top and then rotate back.
25:44 Remember that last eight minutes of that game down there, he just killed us.
25:47 He had like 15 in that last eight minutes.
25:51 So I'm curious if we're going to go to a switch.
25:54 I don't know.
25:55 I just talked about how great it was, but he's a little bit different.
25:58 I wouldn't be surprised if we just, I think last year, yeah, we went the second game and
26:03 the third game, we played him in Vegas, we just trapped him and just got out of his hands
26:08 and lived with playing three on four on the backside defensively because some of their
26:13 guys are not programmed to shoot out of those or they're just not as good to catch and shoot
26:19 out of a trap with an advantage.
26:23 So I wouldn't be surprised if that's what we do, is trap and get it out of his hands.
26:30 He's only had one good game against us.
26:32 He's a fantastic player, but I think sometimes he can shoot them out of games too.
26:36 He takes a lot of tough.
26:38 If you get a body on him, he's a thin kid, get a body on him and make him take tough
26:42 shoes.
26:43 He can struggle where he has some four for 17s and stuff like that, five for 15s.
26:52 But you have to dominate the inside and then you also have to play at your pace.
26:59 Marcellonis has been much better this year, averaging almost 12.
27:02 And then Mitchell Sachs and the kid inside, he's usually viewed as kind of just an oaf,
27:10 I guess is a way to put it, but he's actually having a good season, 11 points per game.
27:13 But they always have one big, big, and they play 35 minutes, 28 to 35 minutes.
27:21 And he's that guy this year.
27:24 But it's so weird.
27:25 They always, every player, they have the same players at the same positions every year,
27:32 if that makes sense.
27:33 There's no nuance ever.
27:35 Always one huge big.
27:37 There's always a really good guard.
27:39 There's a decent two guard, always a decent two guard that's going to give you 8 to 12.
27:44 And then everybody else is just strictly roll.
27:46 And I know, but they play their role exactly how they want to play it.
27:50 And you know exactly what they're going to run.
27:52 They run the same like four actions and that's it.
27:55 - Do they have an Australian?
27:57 - I think Mitchell, yeah, you're right.
28:02 I think Dukas is.
28:03 - Dukas, yeah.
28:04 Because they always fit those roles.
28:07 They always have at least a couple of Australians on their team.
28:11 - Yeah, they have some Australians.
28:13 But a really good basketball team.
28:15 They really are.
28:16 And it's going to be paramount that we come out with a lot of energy and play hard, obviously.
28:20 And hopefully our crowd is good as it was last night.
28:24 But I've been really impressed with how we've been playing lately, honestly.
28:27 And it's not just because we're getting wins.
28:30 We're having better second halves.
28:31 I mentioned the energy last night.
28:34 We're shooting it much better.
28:35 Nembhard's, his stat was 13 and 25 in conference play from three.
28:41 - Wow, that's awesome.
28:42 - So you're going to have to tip your cap because we harped on it during the year.
28:47 So then when he's playing good, I got to mention it and be fair.
28:50 So he's really shooting the ball good at the right time.
28:52 Nolan was fantastic last night over the last stretch.
28:57 Let's see.
28:58 So three of eight to get specific.
29:00 What was he last night?
29:01 It was a four for seven or something.
29:04 So was that seven to 15?
29:06 It's a pretty good stretch, right?
29:08 - That's a pretty good stretch.
29:09 - 46%.
29:10 So guys are making shots in volume and I'm really excited where this team can go.
29:17 And I've talked about it before.
29:20 Obviously you want to win in November and December, but nobody cares if you go on the
29:23 totality of it.
29:24 And perfect example is that Pacific game is, "Why aren't they blowing this team out?"
29:30 And then you just go, "Oh yeah, the 17 team and the 21 team."
29:33 And then like Phewy talked about it on one of the interviews I was listening to real
29:37 quick and I was like, "Oh, okay."
29:40 You know what I mean?
29:41 He's just like, "We don't play good down there.
29:42 I don't know what it is, but we win and we get to get out of there."
29:47 - When I watch it on TV, that gym, it looks like a high school gym.
29:51 - It looks like, and this is no disrespect, it looks like a Juco gym.
29:55 My dad coached Juco and it looks like all the gyms, like concrete, wood bleachers, and
30:00 then just like no life to it.
30:01 It's terrible.
30:02 - Yeah, I couldn't, going from playing at the Kennel, playing in big arenas, and then
30:08 going and playing in the place, that has to change your mentality a little bit.
30:15 Because you never played at, Pacific wasn't in the MCC.
30:20 But there are teams that, yeah, it's just a different vibe.
30:25 It's just like, it has to be part of it.
30:28 - You know, one stat that really stuck out to me about St. Mary's is that they held Pacific
30:34 to 28 points.
30:35 - Yeah, it is crazy.
30:37 - That's a crazy number.
30:39 That's like a high school number, like 28 points.
30:45 - That is a wild number, exactly right.
30:47 - So their defense is going to be, I mean, the games are always different versus being
30:53 at the Kennel versus being down there in Moraga.
30:56 Because I know we never really played that well down there, but getting this first one
31:01 and beating them would, I think, would give Gonzaga so much more momentum going into the
31:06 rest of the season.
31:07 - Yeah, 100%.
31:08 And then you're obviously tied for first, and then puts the pressure back on them not
31:12 to slip out of that first or second spot.
31:15 Because that spot's going to really, really matter this year.
31:21 Having to win two games instead of three at the West Coast Conference Tournament.
31:25 So I was really, like I said, really impressed, looking forward to this one.
31:29 I think the biggest key is pace and then what you do against Mahaney.
31:34 And like I said, I would be surprised if we would go to that trap scenario that we did
31:37 to him last year, really bothered him.
31:41 I think we're headed in the right direction.
31:43 Still a lot of basketball that you have to be played, but we're peaking at the right
31:46 time in my opinion.
31:49 And Phuey said it a million times, not just me, he's like, "You got to celebrate wins
31:55 any way you get them with this year's crew."
31:57 And that's not a knock, but he literally said that on one of the radio shows, the Mark Phuey
32:03 radio show.
32:04 He's just like, "Let's calm down here, everybody."
32:07 He's like, "We won by nine, I know everybody's freaking out, but we won and we're in second
32:12 place.
32:13 Let's keep on going."
32:14 - I mean, like this short-term memory loss, like just forget about it and move on to the
32:18 next.
32:19 I think that's the key in all sports is like, well, you can't especially dwell on wins when
32:26 you win.
32:27 - I know, exactly.
32:28 - You just gotta-- - So true.
32:30 - Who does that?
32:31 Even as a fan, when we escape games like we have this year, I'm happy that we got through
32:38 it and that we can move on to our next game.
32:42 But it's just having, dwelling on the team playing close, it's such a weird mentality.
32:49 - It is a weird mentality.
32:50 - It's a loser's mentality, in my opinion.
32:51 - I agree, 100%.
32:53 It's a loser's mentality and it's also like an uninformed mentality too.
33:00 You're saying that you think you know what you're talking about, but you really don't.
33:05 Because it's like, so you have to win by 25 to feel satisfied?
33:09 This is not an over-under gambling deal here, you know what I mean?
33:13 Anyway, I'm happy for the guys.
33:15 They've played well in stretches and starting to play with a lot of energy and making threes
33:20 and hopefully continues, like I said, big game on Saturday.
33:25 So we'll talk about that, obviously, next week.
33:27 Do you have a listener question?
33:30 - Real quick about bracketology, there's not really much to say.
33:34 Leonardi continues to have us as the first four out.
33:38 The question I had about that, though, is win this weekend, how much does that change?
33:46 I know we're not bracketology experts, but I imagine it will help us at least get into
33:50 the either next four in or maybe even into the tournament.
33:55 - That's a good question.
33:56 - I mean, obviously, it doesn't matter because we've got to just keep on winning and we've
33:59 got to win the tournament at the end of the season.
34:02 But like we've said, we're on the right track.
34:07 - I think so, too.
34:10 And I think San Francisco is another opportunity, like I mentioned earlier, and then these two
34:16 St. Mary's games.
34:17 I think if you get those and you win out, I think it puts you into the first last four
34:22 in or whatever.
34:25 I don't really have never had to dive into that stuff.
34:27 We've never had to.
34:28 And I'm not trying to be funny, but we just never had.
34:31 It was always, were we a one seed, or were we a two seed, or were we a three seed?
34:34 You know what I mean?
34:35 So hopefully we just keep playing good hoops and then get to the tournament and just go
34:42 win two games at Vegas, guys.
34:43 You know what I'm saying?
34:44 Just go win two games at Vegas and then everybody will, nobody will have that fear.
34:51 And then you can just play free in the NCAA tournament with no expectations.
34:55 That's a pretty good feeling to have as well.
34:58 And it's not saying people think you can get balanced, but you can just go with a lot of
35:01 rip.
35:02 But we got to get there and we can't assume.
35:06 That's very true.
35:08 And at the same time, we're 16 and five.
35:13 You know what I'm saying?
35:15 And two of our losses are against two top five teams that probably have a chance to
35:20 be in the final four.
35:21 I mean, seriously.
35:22 So let's remember that part.
35:25 And then San Diego State's really good.
35:28 The loss that stings, the two are obviously Washington and Santa Clara.
35:33 You know what I'm saying?
35:34 Like the Washington game, if you go back and watch that, you're like, man, we should've,
35:38 literally should've won that.
35:39 And then Santa Clara, we have a front end and a one-on-one up one.
35:42 You know what I'm saying?
35:43 So like if you win those two, then we're 18 and four.
35:46 18 and four, yeah.
35:48 And then the whole tenor of the, you know, this podcast changes, right?
35:55 So sometimes I got to be the voice that pushes back a little bit.
36:00 And I love that we have great fans and people that care.
36:04 And I try to pride myself on honesty.
36:06 We talk about it off camera or whatever about the shows.
36:11 We don't want to just be a layup line for go-zay.
36:14 You know what I mean?
36:15 We want to tell it like how we see it.
36:16 But also sometimes it's like, hey, guys, we're not dog shit.
36:21 So let's stop acting like we are.
36:23 That part gets, that's when I get to be like, hold on here, right?
36:28 Let's calm down.
36:29 And so we always have to kind of push back a little bit and give guys credit when they're
36:35 playing better.
36:36 Like I think Nembhard's playing better in conference play.
36:38 Nolan obviously is.
36:40 Graham EK's really stepped, hey, they're playing at the right time.
36:44 Do you want to play them their best ball in November or February, March?
36:48 I mean, so that's where we're at.
36:53 Oh, we got a quick mention, Luka Kranovic played last night.
36:58 I think that's just going to help have it in the back pocket for minutes for a guard
37:03 situation, especially if a guy gets in a weird spot.
37:05 I think it takes pressure off if you get in a weird spot where if Dusty's not playing
37:10 good or if you want to trust a matchup, you have Luka now that you can put in off the
37:14 bench instead of just Dusty.
37:16 So that part's nice as well.
37:19 So he came back from a hand injury, had that freak accident at UConn in Seattle.
37:23 It was so weird.
37:24 He literally hurt himself in like a passing drill or something.
37:29 But it's nice to see him and it's nice to see him score a couple, get four points.
37:32 You know what I mean?
37:33 Just to see the anxiety.
37:34 All right, you know, it's just like, good job.
37:37 He's a nice kid.
37:39 Talked to his dad.
37:40 His dad came to the, who he played in the arena?
37:44 Pepperdine.
37:45 Yeah.
37:46 Pepperdine was pretty cool.
37:47 You know, because I'm, I played over in either Croatia, but I played over in Belgrade.
37:52 So like, it's kind of fun talking to those people just for a little bit.
37:55 Did his dad play?
37:56 I didn't ask them that, but they're just nice people.
38:01 Yeah, nice dude.
38:02 You know what I mean?
38:03 So what's the listener question?
38:05 I got this question.
38:07 The Perimeter will be right back after a word from our sponsor.
38:10 Hey, it's Olive.
38:11 I just got my first ICCU debit card.
38:12 Now I just need to get my first ICCU debit card.
38:13 Now I just need some money in my account.
38:18 If only there was someone who could transfer in some allowance.
38:21 Wow.
38:22 What's the listener question?
38:27 I got this question.
38:28 We never talk about the guys that come in at the end of the game because it's just,
38:33 I mean, it's just, they always come in.
38:34 We always had, there's always been guys for Gonzaga that just come in the last like two
38:38 minutes of the game.
38:40 Fans get into it when they can play and get a shot.
38:45 And someone asked, why does Joe Fugue get more run than June?
38:54 And I was just going to say, I feel like it's a difference between trying to have a guy
38:59 on the, like a practice player and trying to develop a player.
39:02 Yeah, that's a good question.
39:04 Yeah.
39:05 What is your opinion on it?
39:07 Or not?
39:08 Well, let's just be fair.
39:09 I think June has a lot of potential.
39:13 He's got a great motor.
39:18 He's a great athlete.
39:19 Had a great FIBA tournament, whatever that was.
39:23 And those things matter, but that's kind of where his stock rose.
39:27 But I think he's just in a doghouse.
39:32 And I don't know that for sure, but I'm pretty sure I'm right.
39:35 It's pretty obvious because they don't even look to him in any game.
39:39 And then, obviously, Joe's Coach Fugue's son, too.
39:44 And he's a junior.
39:45 So it's not like he's just putting him in as a freshman.
39:48 He's begun two years.
39:50 And that's kind of how Fugue does with the walk-ons.
39:52 Once they get to be juniors and seniors, then they put him in.
39:55 You kind of have to earn your deal.
39:57 And so there's not nepotism going on.
40:00 But I think June is deep in the doghouse, whatever that is.
40:05 Any time June gets on the floor, he goes way too fast.
40:09 He turns the ball over.
40:10 I know.
40:11 He's trying to do too much.
40:12 He's trying to do too much.
40:13 He's like, he is like--
40:14 It's just too much.
40:15 And it's like, dude, you just need to sometimes catch the ball and throw it to the next guy
40:17 and cut.
40:18 And then, you know what I'm saying?
40:20 I've been in that spot many times.
40:22 It's not fun.
40:23 And trying to come in at the end of the game and look good.
40:26 So I'm going to throw that out to people.
40:28 It's not very fun when you've sat cold for 38 minutes.
40:33 And game time, real time, it's probably an hour and a half or whatever.
40:36 And then you have to come in.
40:37 And if you miss your one shot, you suck.
40:39 And everybody thinks you suck.
40:41 You know what I'm saying?
40:42 So I've got to be fair to them on that.
40:45 But something's going on during practice or whatever.
40:48 He's not even getting sniffed at.
40:50 It's kind of like, feels like-- remember, Efton had that first deal last year where
40:56 he was playing.
40:57 And then it was the Purdue game where he didn't-- and then after that, it was like, we're done.
41:01 Yeah.
41:02 Then he transferred.
41:03 And he's actually playing good at Wake Forest.
41:04 But it was like, he just got in the doghouse, couldn't get out of it.
41:10 Nobody's told me that, but I know how this thing works.
41:12 And when you're not even getting looked at in certain situations-- not just at the end
41:16 of the game, but at spots where, like, all right, foul trouble.
41:22 Anton's got three.
41:23 Ben Gregg's got three.
41:24 Brayden can't move against this matchup.
41:27 Dusty hasn't played good.
41:29 Dusty go it.
41:30 You know what I mean?
41:31 So I'm like, oh, this might be a June moment.
41:33 Nope.
41:34 Nope.
41:35 You know what I'm saying?
41:36 So that's a great listener question.
41:40 But I think he's just so far in the doghouse.
41:42 And then again, like I said, this is being real.
41:44 If you look at our walk-ons in the past, nobody has.
41:47 But obviously, I've been around it.
41:50 Juniors and senior guys get in.
41:53 And obviously, the last name on your jersey when it's your dad coaching helps a little
41:56 bit too.
41:57 And I would do the same thing.
41:59 Like, why not?
42:00 - He's been in the program since he was a baby.
42:03 - 100%.
42:04 And this is his third year.
42:05 So he's earned it to check in.
42:08 And that's not even a, because I don't mean few of your friends, that's not even me just
42:13 saying that.
42:14 It's how he's always done it.
42:16 Every single walk-on.
42:17 Like, what's the Rasmore kid that's the walk-on now?
42:22 I guarantee he will not play in a game this year because he's a freshman.
42:26 He will not play in, we could be up 65.
42:29 He will not play.
42:30 But he might play maybe next year.
42:33 But I doubt it.
42:34 But his junior and senior year, they'll put him in the game.
42:37 So it's just kind of how it works.
42:38 But yeah, good show, man.
42:42 Good recap.
42:43 Great week for our guys.
42:44 St. Mary's is going to be a fun one.
42:46 We'll have that recap and then preview for next week.
42:50 What do we got next week?
42:52 I haven't even looked.
42:53 - We have, well, we have Portland on Wednesday at home.
42:57 And then we head to Lexington, Kentucky to face Kentucky.
43:03 - I looked at my flight schedules, started pouting already.
43:06 It's crazy.
43:07 I think we get to Lexington at like one o'clock.
43:10 Oh my God.
43:12 - On Friday?
43:13 - Something like that.
43:14 - Oh, wow.
43:15 - Sucks.
43:16 But there's obviously no direct.
43:18 And then even if, you know what I'm saying?
43:19 But it's just also like, I know that's the SEC country, but it's like, this is what it
43:23 would be like in Big 12.
43:24 I'm like, I'd be hanging her up if that's the case.
43:29 You know, that's a lot of travel.
43:31 That gets old after a while.
43:33 But anyway, that's going to be a great opportunity.
43:35 Obviously, hopefully we get two straight wins and then go into that game feeling good about
43:38 ourselves.
43:39 We can go to that game, you know, with nothing to lose, quote unquote.
43:44 So that's a good feeling.
43:45 But we boat raced them last year.
43:48 I just have a feeling.
43:49 We'll talk about it.
43:50 I'll talk about it at length.
43:52 Calipari and stuff like that next week.
43:54 But that has the makings of getting homered before you even walk in.
44:00 You know what I mean?
44:01 Their officials, Cal, they're riled up.
44:04 I mean, we boat raced them last year.
44:06 That has a feeling of, Graeme Meekay's got three fouls in three minutes, and so does
44:11 Ben Gregg.
44:12 And then, you know what I mean?
44:14 Four travels were called, and it's 6-2 in the fouls in the first 13 minutes.
44:20 Or first seven minutes, 13 minutes.
44:22 Oh, you're in the bonus.
44:24 I was going to ask you about this.
44:26 This happened, like you said, 10 days ago.
44:28 San Francisco, what was going on with the refereeing in that game?
44:32 It was awful.
44:33 It was just bad.
44:34 There were so many missed and weird calls.
44:38 Yeah, they just had, sometimes refs have bad nights and bad crews, and they get graded.
44:47 But it was one of those that just had so many weird, you know, like usually obvious ones,
44:53 and you're like, "What?"
44:54 You know, and then they called the three, the foul three was terrible, because he jumped
44:59 into, I think it was Anton, and Anton literally was like, "Dude, I jumped out of the way you
45:03 could read his lips."
45:05 And so, yeah, they had a bad one.
45:07 That's kind of why they stuck in the game a little bit.
45:12 And normally, I think it's a loser's mentality to complain about officiating a lot, or blame
45:18 it.
45:19 I mean, I was on my kids' teams in high school and in college.
45:23 I always had coaches I would be really upset if you constantly complained, because it's
45:28 just a loser's mentality, where you get, "Oh, the ref screwed us tonight."
45:32 It's like, "Well, at this level, maybe a little bit."
45:36 You can argue that, but they're graded, and they usually call it pretty, you know what
45:39 I mean?
45:40 If you go back and watch the tape, blah, blah, blah.
45:42 It's not the 1970s, where they can just like homer you, and nobody will see the game, you
45:47 know what I'm saying, or whatever.
45:51 You know what I mean?
45:52 - I feel like there was a ton going on, but looking at the stats now, it was just like,
45:57 even if the calls weren't going against us sometimes, they had 25 fouls to our 14.
46:01 - Well, there's an old NBA thing, though, that guys used to talk about, and I bet you
46:07 they still do it.
46:08 Like, if you get into a game, and let's say you're getting blown out, or you're down 15
46:15 or 20, and 20 was different 15, 20 years ago than it is now in the NBA, and if the fouls
46:23 were like 12 to 6, they would go beep, beep, beep at the end of the game, and they'd be
46:28 like, "It was 12 to 10 in the second half."
46:31 You know what I mean?
46:32 They'd give them all to you late in the game, and then they could always go to the box score,
46:35 like, "What are you talking about?
46:36 It wasn't even..."
46:37 And it happened all the time, and it was crafty by the officials, because they would just
46:41 go, "Sure."
46:42 And then they always have it out, like, "This guy's crazy.
46:45 What are you talking about?
46:46 It was 12 to 10."
46:48 And four of those came in the last three minutes when the game was out of hand.
46:51 - Interesting, yeah.
46:52 - You know what I mean?
46:53 So sometimes the fouls called is interesting, and officials think about that.
46:58 I know that it's maybe not as...
47:01 They think of it at the top of their mind, but it's a subconscious thing.
47:04 Like I said, it's an easy way to see why...
47:08 - I've talked to a ref about this, about like...
47:11 Because he's a good friend, and I was just like, "Hey, when you're reffing basketball,
47:16 do you make up calls?"
47:17 He's like, "Oh, 100%."
47:18 - Oh, yeah.
47:19 I think actually that's the right way to ref, too.
47:22 I think there's times when you have to do it, where if you make a bad call, you just
47:30 wait a couple, or you give a ticky-tack one to put them back on the free...
47:34 You know what I mean?
47:35 I think that's good officiating.
47:36 I call that out all the time on the broadcast if I see it.
47:39 I'm like, "Oh, that was a makeup call.
47:41 That's good officiating."
47:42 I don't mind.
47:43 People go crazy when...
47:45 If you go up and get bumped, and it wasn't crazy contact, but it was enough to make you
47:49 miss, I like when refs wait to see if you miss it, and then whistle.
47:54 People are like, "It's so late."
47:55 It's like he's trying to let the game flow.
47:58 Now if you make it, he doesn't call anything in the game, I think it's great officiating.
48:01 So you just wait, "Oh, he missed it.
48:04 Beep.
48:05 I'm going to call it."
48:06 I think that's how it should be called sometimes, because he's trying to let it go.
48:10 You know what I'm saying?
48:11 So there's a lot of nuance in officiating.
48:14 It's hard, man, too.
48:16 I wouldn't want to be official unless somebody tried to be funny.
48:20 It's really tough to move up, and then you're always scrutinized and blah, blah, blah.
48:24 - There's so many eyes on you now.
48:26 - Oh, yeah.
48:27 It's crazy.
48:28 But yeah, thanks to our sponsors, McGillivray Environmental, Idaho Central Credit Unit,
48:35 DG Architecture.
48:36 Like I said, we'll be back next week talking about St. Mary's recap, and then the preview
48:41 for Portland, and then Kentucky.
48:44 That'll be fun.
48:45 And I got a couple of Cal stories that are pretty good, and things of that nature.
48:50 I played with a lot of guys.
48:51 Not a lot, but I played with some Kentucky guys, too.
48:54 I played at Nevada.
48:55 Why did I say Nevada?
48:56 Memphis.
48:57 You know what I mean?
48:58 So he's a funny cat.
48:59 Good dude.
49:00 But yeah, thanks for listening.
49:01 - Thank you.
49:02 - Thanks for listening.
49:03 - Bye.
49:04 - Bye.
49:04 - Bye.
49:05 - Bye.
49:05 - Bye.
49:06 - Bye.
49:06 - Bye.
49:07 - Bye.
49:07 - Bye.
49:14 - Bye.
49:21 - Bye.