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SportsTranscript
00:00Back to our double box coverage and continue on the conversation of what happened in Saudi
00:04Arabia just moments ago from the Kingdom Arena, where for the first time in the four belt
00:10era of boxing, we have an undisputed heavyweight champion, Alexander Usyk, the 6'3", 223-pounder,
00:21who used to be a cruiserweight and was the best of all, who stepped up to heavyweight
00:25and has now gone through a stretch where he's toppled them all.
00:29Through Anthony Joshua and now, earlier today, defeating by split decision Tyson Fury, scoring
00:35a knockdown with a series of left hands in the ninth round, hurting Fury with a shot
00:41to the nose in the eighth round, and then pressing the action and backing up the much
00:45bigger man in the twelfth round to pull out a split decision.
00:49Joe Tessitore and the crew here as we continue on with our reaction.
00:54I want to get back into the conversation of what happened stylistically.
00:58You always go into the film room, you talk about the lap.
01:01There was a clear, distinct turning point in this fight where you said to me, he's countering
01:06the counter.
01:07Watch the second left hand, not the first left hand by Usyk.
01:10It was amazing to see.
01:11First of all, Fury fought exactly like I thought he was going to fight.
01:16Exactly.
01:17The only thing he didn't do was make the adjustment and take it to Usyk.
01:20I thought he would incorporate that, but he didn't.
01:23He found out in there, and he tries, that Usyk was strong physically on the inside.
01:30Usyk would push him up off of him.
01:32Usyk wouldn't allow him to grab him.
01:34He kept his hands tucked inside like this.
01:38What I really saw on the back end of this fight was, I saw a fighter that had been disciplined
01:43his whole entire life, that lived the sport the right way, that took this sport seriously,
01:50didn't abuse his body, and he's the older fighter here.
01:54He's 37 years old, Tyson Fury is 35.
01:57I saw Tyson Fury fade out, showed his age on the back end of the fight.
02:02I was waiting on his second win.
02:04He never got there.
02:05Usyk stepped on the gas, because of the discipline, because of his will to win, and then the technique
02:12came through, through straighter punches.
02:15He was to the target.
02:16Not just missing, just swelling shots, no.
02:19Every shot had a direction, and he was trying to land the shot cleanly, so that was the
02:23major difference here, man, towards the back end of this fight, because if Fury would have
02:27stepped on the gas a little bit, if he had a little bit left inside, a little reserve,
02:31he could have pulled off this victory, but the fact that he got dropped along those ropes,
02:36and the fact that Usyk was able to finish strong, he wins the fight on the back end.
02:43When you get tired, the thinking fighter won, the guy was able to think with a better mind.
02:48And when you get tired, and when you get hit, it's more difficult to think, this to me was
02:54a victory for Usyk's will.
03:00That's at the essence of stamina.
03:01Can I really think?
03:02Can I make an adjustment when I'm tired, when I'm getting hit, when I'm getting leaned on
03:08by a bigger guy?
03:09Really, I didn't think there was any way.
03:10I'm looking at the calculus of this.
03:12There's no way to change the tide.
03:14He's fighting the biggest guy we've ever seen, and he's a good boxer.
03:20Nothing against Tyson Fury.
03:22The mental fortitude that this guy showed, that's why he's holding his breath for five
03:28minutes and doing whatever, I don't know how many kilometers swims, and all that stuff.
03:33All of those are metaphors for what this kind of endurance really, really is.
03:37And something we haven't even mentioned yet, the fact that Tyson Fury trimmed down to 262
03:41pounds, and that's the lightest he's been since he beat Otto Wallin, who you mentioned,
03:47and he got hurt in that fight.
03:48Which was a dangerous fight for him.
03:49Exactly.
03:50He got hurt in that fight as well, and the fact that Usyk came in one pound heavier than
03:55in the rematch against Anthony Joshua, which he also had Joshua in trouble in that 12th
04:01round.
04:02But ultimately it came down to this, Alexander Usyk had resolve, he had the physical strength,
04:08he took the best shots that Fury had to the body early and was able to make those adjustments
04:13and those uppercuts, Tim, that you kept harping on when we were watching the fight.
04:17So you can look at this fight and say, look, both guys were faithful to their strategy,
04:24it's just that Alexander Usyk had that much more left in the tank to pursue what he wanted
04:29to do.
04:30By the way, I tell people, don't base Fury on the Fury who came out against Nganou.
04:39And by the way...
04:40What?
04:41No, no.
04:42This was no different.
04:43Look, man.
04:44He was better than he was against Nganou.
04:45He was fast.
04:46But he wasn't.
04:47You're right.
04:48Go ahead.
04:49I'm sorry.
04:50I'm sorry.
04:51Go ahead.
04:52It's a better version than the guy who was against Nganou because he came in in better
04:57shape.
04:58But what I'm saying is that this is how seriously Tyson Fury took it.
05:04We've seen guys lose titles.
05:06For me, it was most apparent with Ali late in his career because they took stuff light
05:12or they thought they could get away with it.
05:14This wasn't that.
05:15He didn't beat a Fury who thinks, I'm just going to beat up on a smaller guy.
05:21He beat the best Fury there was.
05:23I think that they were tactical.
05:24I think he gave away a little bit too much in the beginning, but Fury beats anybody else
05:31tonight.
05:32And the other thing, real quick, Tim, what about the recuperative powers that we've seen
05:35time and time again from Tyson Fury?
05:38Now, many people are saying, hey, that was a long 20 second count.
05:42Number one, it could have either been two knockdowns or a TKO if he wants to stop the
05:48fight at this point.
05:49I'm glad he didn't stop the fight.
05:50But I mean, that whole ninth round was four unanswered shots from Oleksandr Usyk all on
05:56the button.
05:57And it was a great round for the Ukrainian.
06:00I thought Fury in the middle rounds, I was like, wow, yeah, I haven't seen this Fury
06:05in a very long time.
06:06I mean, he went back to the Klitschko days where he was moving, you know, defensively
06:10moving, popping shots, catching, you know, catching, shooting, shooting that uppercut,
06:15setting up that uppercut.
06:16But to go back to what you was talking about, as far as the adjustment, the minor adjustment,
06:21Usyk is smart enough to realize what Fury was doing.
06:25He got hit with that uppercut several times over and over and over again.
06:29And then he realized, hey, well, I'm not going to jump back out of range.
06:33I'm going to be just at the proper range.
06:35I know he's going to shoot that jab, but when he shoots that jab, I can give him a little
06:39feint or level change, and then he'll shoot the right hand or the uppercut, then now it's
06:44my turn to go.
06:46So he was catching them at the end.
06:49So he was being first sometimes and then being last at the same damn time right afterwards.
06:53And that's the reason why he was able to pull off that victory and knock down Fury.
06:59Let me hold your hand a little bit here and just remind you of what we're doing.
07:03Right now you're watching Alfredo Flores and Alan Garcia right over here in this box.
07:09Right here, we're going to just continue on with this epic, historical result we're getting
07:14from Saudi Arabia, where Alexander Usyk is the new undisputed heavyweight champion of
07:18the world with a split decision win against Tyson Fury.
07:22We're going to do that until it feels like we've exhausted it and we've given you all
07:25the coverage we can.
07:26By the way, Mike Coppinger from ESPN.com is in Saudi Arabia.
07:30We hope to hear from him in a moment.
07:32And at the conclusion of this round that you're seeing here on our undercard between Flores
07:36and Garcia, I want to get into some of the CompuBox numbers, specifically the power punch
07:41numbers.
07:42So let's put that up there and show you the round by round.
07:45And Tim, you will see the numbers here where you talk about the strategy change and where
07:50the shift takes place.
07:52Look at round number eight for Usyk compared to those middle rounds for Fury.
07:57These are power punches thrown and you can see the effort and the results that were had
08:03by Usyk down the stretch of this fight with power punches thrown.
08:08That's the effort.
08:09That's the volume.
08:10That's what was put forth.
08:11He also had a 122 to 95 connect advantage.
08:15So that's according to CompuBox what you see there between Usyk and Fury.
08:19He let him in power punches and the new undisputed champion, Alexander Usyk, led in total connects
08:24170 to 157.
08:26Can I just give you a quick breakdown of how those numbers go?
08:29There's a 50 punch difference in punches thrown, but Usyk landed 27 of those 50 punches.
08:36That's the biggest difference is the fact that not only did he throw 50 more, he landed
08:4027 more power punches than Tyson Fury.
08:43He's always been very accurate.
08:44Now keep in mind with Fury, you know you always have the great footwork and especially Mark,
08:50the great upper body head movement, which perhaps he was getting a little too cute with
08:54early on in this fight.
08:55But coming into this fight, Tyson Fury, opponents were only landing 6.6 punches per round, seventh
09:04fewest among all fighters.
09:07Defensively, Fury has been an absolute elite defensive heavyweight.
09:12But Alexander Usyk on the back end of this undisputed championship fight was able to
09:18find the target.
09:19Mark, I want to get back to the conversation in terms of the best of Tyson Fury.
09:23I could make an argument, and Karl Moretti, the vice president of top ranks, said something
09:28to this effect to me while we were watching the fight together, and that is as much as
09:33Tyson Fury, perhaps forever ruined Deontay Wilder.
09:37I also don't know that something wasn't taken out of Tyson Fury with that trilogy.
09:43He had soft touches after that fight, Ngannou was an issue with training, but there are
09:47definitely some doubts in the head.
09:49I did not see, and I marked it down round by round.
09:52I'm scoring the fight.
09:53I'm taking notes.
09:54The bullying version of Tyson Fury, to me, did not arrive until we got to the end of
09:59round six and fully into seven, and then it was extinguished at round eight.
10:03Joe, I disagree.
10:05No, no, no, no, wait, wait, wait, but what I'm mystified by, no, I don't think he took
10:12anything from him.
10:14I'm mystified by, once again, how Fury was able to survive.
10:19He was out on his feet.
10:20He was done.
10:21He's been smacked all over the ring.
10:22Hold on.
10:23He's done that his whole career.
10:24But the other thing, you touched on it before, about what a superlative defensive fighter
10:29he was.
10:30Yes.
10:31I thought that, forgetting about the knockdown, I thought that he seeded the first three rounds
10:37by showboating, not offensively, but defensively, holding onto both robes, showing that he
10:44could treat Usyk like it was Tom Schwarz, and slip, and duck, and move, and showing
10:50how cute, and nimble, and graceful he was, which he was.
10:54Usyk didn't hurt him, but I thought that he gave away those three rounds, showboating
10:59on defense.
11:01And if I could just add to what you were saying, because we were both watching the same fight,
11:05my notes were, round six, started using his physical advantages, he started to, you hold
11:10him down.
11:11Same exact note I have here, showing his physicality, leaning, showing he's the bigger man, and
11:16then that goes into round seven, leaning forward, acting bigger, I wrote down.
11:20Acting bigger, then it goes away.
11:22Round eight, I put slowing down, and then I put the broken nose, and then the knockdown
11:27in round nine.
11:28I think it's ebbs and flows.
11:29You want to know why he slowed down?
11:31I'm going to tell you right now.
11:33First of all, Usyk was going down to the body, and he started early.
11:36That's when he was landing those jabs, down, stab, jabs, left hands down to the body.
11:41But I remember fighting Manny Pacquiao, and I remember having to be tense every second,
11:47because you don't know when he's going to attack.
11:49Usyk has that type of style, where he keeps you busy, up front, he keeps you always thinking.
11:54You've always got to be on point, because one mistake, he can slip past you, but that's
11:58what Fury was doing.
11:59Fury was trying to match him there, and at the same time, he was burning so much energy
12:06in play, and that's the reason why he got tired, because not only was he getting attacked,
12:11he was also getting attacked mentally as well, because Usyk is making him think more.
12:16Then there's another fact here, Joe, you brought up Wilder, Wilder takes something
12:21out of you after he hits you, but we didn't see any difference in Fury from the first
12:27to the second to the third Wilder fight.
12:31One of the things that you have to factor into here, is that Usyk is bigger than Wilder.
12:39He's physically bigger, he's physically stronger.
12:43Real quick, can I ask?
12:44He's bigger, he's not 219 pounds.
12:45No, he is.
12:46He's a thicker, more sturdy guy.
12:48He's the size of George Foreman the first time around.
12:51How about this?
12:52You ready for this?
12:53Let's just have that conversation, because we think, you know, cruiserweights, we're
12:56in an era of super heavyweights, so things have to be put in perspective here, but consider
13:00this for history with Alexander Usyk.
13:02He came in at 6'3", 223 pounds.
13:06Obviously Rocky Marciano was barely 5'11", with a 68-inch reach.
13:09Joe Frazier was 5'11 1⁄2", with a 73-inch wingspan.
13:14Mike Tyson was 5'10", with a 71-inch reach.
13:17Jack Johnson, 6'0", with a 74-inch reach.
13:20Vander Holyfield, 6'2", with just a 78-inch reach.
13:24Vander Holyfield, the last undisputed cruiserweight champion to become undisputed heavyweight
13:29champion.
13:30And he was 223.
13:31Remember, it was an error in the calculation.
13:36One thing, to go back to Tim's point, because on my notes I had how hard Usyk was working
13:42to get inside, and how he started to tire in round 6.
13:45Tim, how he turned it around, because the whole flow was going, I mean, it was from
13:51round 3 through about 7, it was all fury.
13:55How was he able to withstand that and turn the fight around?
13:58Good technique, training, training, caught his second win.
14:03And it's mentally, mentally he stayed controlled.
14:07You know, it don't even matter, look, you gotta fight past that.
14:10You have one thing on your mind, and that's victory.
14:12And he kept that on his mind.
14:14He was like, I'm gonna get to him, I'm gonna get to him, I'm gonna get to him.
14:17And then he had a breakthrough.
14:18You call it almost like a runner's high.
14:21You know, when you're running, you ever been running, and you feel like you can run forever
14:24after you get to a certain point?
14:25You break through the wall.
14:26You break through the wall.
14:27That's exactly what happened.
14:28He broke through the wall, and he had some success, and then he took that adrenaline,
14:31and he just ran off with it.
14:33And real quick, the opposite happened with Fury.
14:35He was getting to his best moment, and then he gets dropped, and the nose injury.
14:40We had, I think we agree on this, we had Fury winning four, five, six, seven.
14:47And to your point, and to my point, Usyk's training enabled him to remain undiscouraged.
14:54Like, you're watching this, you're thinking there's inevitability to this.
14:58He's bigger, he has technique, he can touch you from across the room, and he was, you
15:03know, he's good enough to clown with Usyk.
15:06But Usyk was able to remain undiscouraged and think through it.
15:12Calm.
15:13Calm.
15:14And he's always been calm.
15:16There is something about the eyes of Alexander Usyk that everybody has the same reaction
15:21to, and it is this man is absolutely fearless.
15:26This man has seen things, this man may have even done things, and he doesn't care.
15:31Earlier this week, somebody asked him about the face-offs with Tyson Fury.
15:36Tyson Fury did not engage in a stare-down when they had the final press conference.
15:41Tyson Fury then, after the weigh-in, instead of having a long face-off and stare-down,
15:46did a quick push and engaged physically, knowing it would create a semi-brawl and everything
15:50would be broken up.
15:52When asked about it, Usyk said, when asked, why are you so calm as you're about to have
15:57the biggest moment of your professional life, he says, because of my plan.
16:03I will not be nervous because of my plan.
16:07He's always got that smile.
16:12But he's always got that smile.
16:14It's like the eyes are looking right through you.
16:18By the way, John Fury, the headbutt, Tyson with the shot, not so calm.
16:25I don't want to make too much of that.
16:27I think there's something to be made of it, Mark.
16:28I had a guy tell me once, I'm like, why when you spar, are you smiling?
16:35Because it's a school of thought in Eastern European martial arts.
16:41If you smile, you relax yourself, but you also unnerve your opponent.
16:46And I kept thinking of Usyk, you know, and like a real warrior smile, not a goofy smile,
16:54but it's like a grin.
16:55Yes.
16:57What's this guy really thinking?
16:58And then you look at the eyes.
17:01Listen, you'll hear people that have been in the business long enough talk about the
17:05all-time great champions, just the great champions.
17:08And they'll say they're all a little crazy.
17:10They all got a little crazy.
17:11We do.
17:12They're all just a little crazy.
17:14Listen, you against Provodnikov, you're a little crazy.
17:17There's a lot of crazy there.
17:18You're a lot of crazy with the way you approached the last few rounds there.
17:21There's a lot of you had a will.
17:22You've said it to me.
17:23We've had that conversation.
17:25You were willing to cross that line that only if you got a little bit of crazy in you,
17:30you would do.
17:31Maybe more than a little.
17:32There's more than a little bit of crazy in Alexander Ude.
17:35There's a fearlessness, but there's sublime skills.
17:38But you want to know something?
17:42He pressed from round one to round 12 being the smaller man by 40-some pounds.
17:49But that's one of the things I'm talking about.
17:53Compared to Wilder, Fury figured something out from fight one to fight two.
17:58I'm just going to lean on him.
17:59I'm going to grab him.
18:00I'm going to hold him.
18:01I'm going to weigh him down because I'm the bigger man.
18:04He couldn't do that with Usyk.
18:07And you know why?
18:08He was too strong.
18:09Remember our Friday meetings, Igor Golov, the trainer for Dennis Berinchik tonight,
18:14how he said, Alexander Usyk is going to beat Tyson Fury.
18:19He's going to knock him out.
18:20Didn't he say like the ninth round, I think?
18:23The thing was, we were all like, okay, but why?
18:25Footwork, footwork, footwork.
18:28And look, you guys can poo-poo whatever you want as much, but Alexander Usyk, Vasily Lomachenko,
18:36Bozdik, that entire generation who grew up under the tutelage of Anatoly Lomachenko,
18:42they can all fight.
18:43And we got one tonight in our world title fight.
18:45We got Dennis Berinchik against Emmanuel Navarrete.
18:49This could be.
18:50I mean, it's not even close.
18:52The greatest night in Ukrainian boxing history.
18:54The greatest night in Ukrainian sports history.
18:57You have the undisputed heavyweight champion of the world, and in a few hours, you're going
19:00to have your undefeated former Olympic silver medalist, who was part of that team.
19:05Dennis Berinchik was part of that team with Lomachenko, with Bozdik, who became a light
19:09heavyweight champion, with Alexander Usyk, the current undisputed heavyweight champion.
19:12And now Berinchik tonight on ESPN, undefeated, is going to fight for the WBO lightweight
19:19championship.
19:20Can you imagine a country that is going through the struggle that Ukraine's going through
19:24day in and day out, having a day like this to galvanize and to give themselves something
19:30to wrap their arms around?
19:32Of these two happenings, it could happen in just a few hours as we continue with our coverage
19:36here coming to the end of round of our Flores versus Garcia.
19:41But let's remind you, you brought it up.
19:43You go back to the London Olympics in 2012, and you look at the amateur team.
19:48Timmy, you want to talk about talent on Team Ukraine?
19:53And it totally has done a great job with them, man.
19:55You know, in that fighter meeting, the trainer of Berinchik, we asked him, we said, what's
20:04the, I asked, actually asked the fighter, I said, what's the most important element
20:08of a fighter?
20:09And, you know, I was thinking he might say footwork or something.
20:13He said, yes, the mind.
20:16He said the mind is the most important aspect of a fighter.
20:20And I said, he's absolutely right.
20:22That's why I always say boxing is 90% mental.
20:25But the way they train is decision-making type of training.
20:29They don't do the normal, like lifting weights.
20:31Like they do that.
20:32However, that's not important to them.
20:34They're most of like, they'll play like chess games, you know, board games.
20:38You see, you know, you see Lomachenko reaction games, reaction, but it's reaction under,
20:44under direct.
20:45Yes.
20:46Yes.
20:47And, and, and look, it's easy to like box in front of a mirror, like look good.
20:51Oh man.
20:52Yeah.
20:53Do it when you got smacked, do it when you're tired.
20:56One of the first things to go, you know, and it's just footwork's a little bit, man.
21:03Footwork is part of it because footwork definitely is a part of it.
21:05I would say it's second for sure.
21:07It's, it can change in my new ways that can cost you a fight.
21:11You know what, Navarrete, who's going to be in our main event tonight for the Bacon
21:15WBO lightweight world title against a fellow Ukrainian of Oleksandr Usyk and Denis Barenchik.
21:21He said Vasily Lomachenko, I admired him growing up and that's the most opposite thinking thing
21:29you would think.
21:30Yes.
21:31Emmanuel Navarrete.
21:32Absolutely.
21:33But he said he's as close to a complete fighter as you can get.
21:36And tonight Oleksandr Usyk put on about as complete a performance as you can under the
21:42circumstances of facing a huge heavyweight who can crack, who can move, who is skilled
21:49and who can take a shot until that punch in that ninth round where he landed flush four
21:55times consecutively.
21:57But Oleksandr Usyk put on a masterful performance tonight and it wasn't against a bad version
22:03of Tyson Fury.
22:04No, it wasn't.
22:05No.
22:06I picked Fury to win the fight, by the way, because I thought you picked Usyk.
22:10You were right.
22:11You were right on the money.
22:12See, and I picked him just based upon the skill set of both guys.
22:15I thought that Fury, of course, could do a little bit more.
22:18He didn't switch softball.
22:19He switched softball for just a minute.
22:22I felt that he could box off the back foot.
22:23I thought he can be able to bully and come forward and pressure.
22:27But the technique of Usyk, the positioning, the will to win, you know, that came forth
22:34and won him the fight at the end of the day.
22:37What did you think?
22:38I want to get back to the ninth round, the ninth round where Usyk lands the big overhand
22:42left hand, then has the series, goes on the attack, has the series of left hands.
22:48Eventually, Tyson Fury goes up against the ropes, held up by the ropes, has ruled a knockdown,
22:53and then the remaining seconds of that round ticked down.
22:58But that sequence happens 30 seconds earlier, 45 seconds earlier.
23:04You tell me how things play out in that round.
23:07I think Fury probably gets stopped, absolutely, because Usyk at that time, you know, he smelled
23:13blood, one.
23:14Two, he had his man hurt, and he probably had in his mind that, hey, I'm going to stop
23:18him.
23:19But he ran out of time.
23:20I mean, if that knockdown would have happened sooner when he bounced off the rope the first
23:24time, he probably would have had enough time to finish him, without a doubt.
23:27And can you imagine Usyk, cruiserweight, corner, facing, beating Joshua, then he comes
23:33in and he knocks out Tyson Fury, who is highly respected, that's been on the pound-for-pound
23:38list for many years?
23:40My gosh, dude, I mean, you can't deny him, without question, you can't deny him number
23:45one pound-for-pound.
23:46Listen, you just brought it up again, and we will tell you this, obviously, I mean,
23:49the email has gone out, everybody who is a voter on boxing's pound-for-pound list will
23:54be submitting a new top ten that will be tallied, that will be released this week on
24:00ESPN.com.
24:01But undoubtedly, there are going to be major disruptions to the pound-for-pound list.
24:08Possibly at number one, you've heard our opinions.
24:10Many at this desk right now feel that Alexander Usyk has usurped the great Naoya Inouye, the
24:16great Bud Crawford, because of the division he has done it in as an undersized heavyweight.
24:22However, Tyson Fury, who gets voted into many top tens, will obviously be exiting that list,
24:29and there are others who you want to see and make a judgment on, but this is probably going
24:33to be the most disruption that we've seen in the pound-for-pound list, going back to
24:39the results of Bud Crawford annihilating Errol Spence.
24:43You're talking about, look, all those guys, Lomachenko, what he did last week.
24:47You're talking about Navarrete, what he can do tonight, because I know for a lot of us,
24:51he's around the 11th, 12th on the list, just knocking on the doorstep of that pound-for-pound
24:57top ten conversation.
24:59So look, I love it.
25:00I love the fact that we can look at that pound-for-pound list and say, this week, these guys are in.
25:05And you know what?
25:06In a month, we're going to get Tank Davis in action.
25:09In a month, we're going to get a lot of the other guys in action.
25:11In a few months, Terence Crawford's going to be back in the ring, taking on another
25:15challenge that could potentially put him number one again.
25:18I love this turnover.
25:20That's what boxing should be about.
25:21Not just like, these are the sacred cows of boxing and they can't be moved off the list.
25:26No.
25:27What have you done for me lately?
25:28Because boxing is dynamic right now.
25:30Boxing is getting great fights.
25:32And I'm all for that.
25:33Well said.
25:34What do you think about the rematch?
25:36Rematch is scheduled to happen in October.
25:38Remember, when the negotiations for this fight happened, Mark, it was already put forth as
25:43a two-fight deal.
25:44Well, it's the only fight that ever broke down, or deal that ever broke down over percentages
25:49on the second, back end of the second fight.
25:51Look, I'm glad they get to do it again.
25:55I look forward to it.
26:01Now I'm interested in where Tyson Fury's headed.
26:05Can I just say one thing?
26:07We've talked about how good boxing is right now.
26:10How stupid is the IBF to strip the winner of this fight and not allow the rematch to
26:15be for all the belts again?
26:17I understand.
26:18Look, at the end of the day, you can't take away from Oleksandr Usyk that he is the number
26:22one, undisputed, pound-for-pound, heavyweight champion of the world.
26:26I get that.
26:27But you know what?
26:28We waited a long time for this to happen.
26:29And these guys have been waiting for it to happen for a long time, being the number one
26:33contender, Flip Herkovich.
26:34I get it.
26:35But what about WBC holding the belts for Charlo?
26:39I mean, we've got Canelo, who's got the belts hostage at 168.
26:45We just got a horrible name for the new mandatory for Canelo Alvarez as well.
26:50So how about we stop playing games and let these guys fight inside the ring?
26:54Or how about you just don't even acknowledge it?
26:56Is there any doubt in your mind?
26:58Who cares what the IBF says?
27:00Is there any doubt in your mind who the undisputed heavyweight champion is?
27:02But that's how we got into this position in the first place.
27:04It takes a confluence of politics and timing to get it undisputed champion.
27:09The WBA stripped Lennox Lewis.
27:11Genius.
27:12Exactly.
27:13But you've had Herkovich, I believe.
27:14I think he's the number one guy.
27:15He's been in that position for some time now.
27:16And the sanctioned body doesn't want to get sued because he's been waiting more time to
27:17get it.
27:18Man, you know what we've got?
27:19Interim emeritus.
27:20We've got like 75 titles per division.
27:21I agree.
27:22They're going to make something up for him.
27:23I'm just letting you.
27:24I'm just, you know.
27:25There's one champion in heavyweight right now.
27:26No more titles.
27:27No more making up titles.
27:28There's one champion right now in heavyweight.
27:29His name is Oleksandr Usyk.
27:30Absolutely.
27:31Period.
27:32No matter what.
27:33And he does it by split decision as we're coming to the end of another round two.
27:34Thank you.
27:36And that is between Flores and Garcia.
27:37One round to go.
27:38We are going to stay with you for this final round of this fight with our coverage and
27:39reaction to what happened with Usyk and Fury.
27:40Usyk by split decision.
27:41New undisputed champion.
27:42Then we will go ringside.
27:43Bernardo and Tim, you're going to have the call of one of the hottest prospects in the
27:44world.
27:45One of the hottest prospects in the world.
27:46One of the hottest prospects in the world.
27:47One of the hottest prospects in the world.
27:48One of the hottest prospects in the world.
27:49One of the hottest prospects in the world.
27:50One of the hottest prospects in the world.
27:51One of the hottest prospects in the world.
27:52One of the hottest prospects in the world.
27:53One of the hottest prospects in the world.
27:54One of the hottest prospects in the world.
27:55That will come up at the conclusion of this fight and this conversation.
27:56You'll also see the undefeated heavyweight prospect, Richard Kiki Torres.
27:57And there is Emiliano Vargas.
27:58And there is Emiliano Vargas.
27:59And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:00And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:01And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:02And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:03And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:04And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:05And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:06And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:07And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:08And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:09And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:10And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:11And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:12And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:13And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:14And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:15And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:16And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:17And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:18And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:19And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:20And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:21And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:22And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:23And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:24And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:25And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:26And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:27And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:28And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:29And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:30And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:31And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:32And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:33And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:34And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:35And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:36And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:37And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:38And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:39And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:40And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:41And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:42And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:43And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:44And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:45And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:46And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:47And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:48And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:49And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:50And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:51And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:52And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:53And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:54And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:55And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:56And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:57And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:58And there is Emiliano Vargas.
28:59All right.
29:00Let's finish up this conversation on Fury and Usyk as you get the final round here of
29:04Flores and Garcia.
29:05And then we will bring you Emiliano Vargas.
29:08Split decision win for Usyk.
29:10New undisputed champion in the world.
29:12The first time the sport has had a four-belt lineal undisputed heavyweight champion.
29:17He stays undefeated.
29:19He does it by scores of 114-113, 115-112.
29:24The same exact scorecards that the two of you scored.
29:26I had it 114-113, Usyk.
29:29And then the WBC judge, Greg Metcalf from Canada, had it 114-113, Fury, thus the split
29:38decision.
29:39You said moments ago, Mark, we mentioned the rematch, that you're curious to understand
29:43where Tyson Fury's head will be following this.
29:47Well, Tyson's Fury head has long been a rollercoaster ride.
29:50Obviously, he's been an advocate for mental health.
29:53He bounced back from obesity and substance abuse and suicidal attempts to become the
29:59undisputed, to become the WBC and lineal heavyweight champion to get to this point.
30:06Your reaction to where this all goes for Tyson Fury coming off of this?
30:11To my experience with Tyson, he's more vulnerable after he wins than after he loses.
30:18Interesting.
30:19That's what bothers, what eats at Fury is when he doesn't have a mountain to climb.
30:25Yes.
30:26I mean, look, he was vulnerable against Ngannou, he wanted to go and make a score, and he did,
30:31but he hurt his reputation.
30:32So off of the first Wilder fight, off of the Ngannou fight, you get a better version of
30:36him.
30:37Look, if he wants to come back and win the next fight, he can do it.
30:44He's still bigger.
30:46He's still longer.
30:47He can still box his you-know-what off.
30:49It was a close fight, except for one round.
30:53And to my mind, he gave away too much early on.
30:58So if he wants to be one of these guys who came back and became the undisputed, it's
31:04certainly within his power.
31:05And I think that, I don't want to, I'm not speaking for him, but what we're really talking
31:11about here is motivation.
31:12And if he wants to have the motivation to come back, he has it.
31:16If Fury gets everything he wants, that's when it's dangerous.
31:20And it was that ninth round, that one single round that determined this Undisputed Heavyweight
31:25Championship.
31:27That 10-8 round is what swings it in the favor of Alexander Uso.
31:31And look, at the end of the day, how about we just applaud the judges?
31:35Because that's not an outrageous scorecard.
31:37I mean, it's not that we got, you know, 115-112, and then the next one's like 117-111 the other
31:44way.
31:45That's a plausible scorecard if you give Tyson Fury every swing round.
31:50So let's just give the judges credit, because we're easy to pan them when they don't get
31:54it right.
31:55And ultimately, when we look at the future for Tyson Fury, Mark is right.
32:00He was in this fight, he didn't get washed in this fight.
32:04If he makes those adjustments that Tim was talking about, pressing the action when he
32:08has an opportunity, maybe when he's fresher and goes and is the bigger man early on, maybe
32:14it's Alexander Uso who tires out.
32:16So there's adjustments to be made for the rematch.
32:18I think sometimes what ends up happening is, like, you look at Errol Spence against Crawford
32:22and you're like, there's nothing Errol Spence can do to beat Terrence Crawford in the rematch.
32:26Here you could see a way, there's a path for Fury to beat Alexander Uso in a rematch.
32:32In a rematch, this is just my quick reaction.
32:36I would prefer, if I'm Team Fury, to see a slightly bigger Tyson Fury utilizing his
32:43physical presence and being more the bully rather than the leaner, sleeker, defensive-minded
32:52with body movement version of Tyson Fury.
32:55I think a bigger, more physically dominating Tyson Fury takes advantages of his advantages,
33:02to keep it simple.
33:03I think he gets beat up more.
33:04Do you really?
33:05I really do.
33:06I think he gets beat up more.
33:07I think he becomes a stationary target.
33:08I think he...
33:09You don't think he does more damage on the inside?
33:12I don't think he will.
33:13I think he realized how strong Usyk was.
33:15Usyk is physically strong, man.
33:17He was able to take AJ's punch, he was able to take Fury's punch.
33:21Fury had the right game plan.
33:23If he would have stepped inside the pocket, he even digged down to the body, hit him with
33:27uppercuts to the body, both sides.
33:29He did everything he needed to do to win this fight.
33:32He just ran out of juice.
33:34I honestly think that Usyk is just too much for Fury at this point in his career.
33:39I think he wins the next fight and he might even knock him out.
33:42We're going to wrap up our coverage here of the undisputed heavyweight title fight.
33:45We will talk more about this at 10.30 p.m. Eastern time on ESPN Plus and ESPN when we
33:52get to our title fight.
33:54For now, let's get the official decision of Flores and Garcia from Mark Cheneau.
33:58Ladies and gentlemen, after eight rounds here inside Pechanga Arena, San Diego, we go to
34:03the judges' scorecards for the official decision.
34:07Patrick Morley, Alejandro Rochin, and Fernando Villareal all have it 80-72.
34:14For your winner by unanimous decision, Alan Kid Kansas Garcia!
34:23Alan Garcia is 13-0.
34:25Don't go anywhere.
34:26Coming up next, it will be the undisputed heavyweight title fight.
34:27Don't go anywhere.
34:28Coming up next, it will be the undisputed heavyweight title fight.
34:29Don't go anywhere.
34:30Coming up next, it will be the undisputed heavyweight title fight.
34:31Coming up next, it will be the undisputed heavyweight title fight.
34:32Coming up next, it will be the undisputed heavyweight title fight.
34:33Coming up next, it will be the undisputed heavyweight title fight.
34:34Coming up next, it will be the undisputed heavyweight title fight.
34:35Coming up next, it will be the undisputed heavyweight title fight.