Kent Politics Show Special: Election 2024 (01:00-01:42)
Watch back KMTV's live coverage of the UK's 2024 General Election results.
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00:00Welcome back to Medway Park, the pop-up studio where we are here
00:10all night focusing on the battle in Medway. I'm joined now by Kat
00:14Jamieson, a candidate for the Greens, and Stuart Bourne from the
00:18Liberal Democrats. Stuart, we are talking about the exit poll and
00:21obviously we are still very far away from things really taking
00:24shape. There are only a few seats coming in nationally, nothing in
00:27the Lib Dems yet. What sense have you got about how the Liberal
00:30Democrats have performed today here in Medway but also across the
00:33county? The exit poll is very exciting. It is a poll, we have to
00:36wait for the actual results to come in and not every seat should be
00:39taken for granted until then. It looks like a really good night for
00:42the Lib Dems. We are back to being the third party in Parliament.
00:46That means people have recognised us and our policies and they are
00:50willing to listen again. Hopefully we have turned a corner and we are
00:53back to being a really strong party again in Parliament. The big
00:56hope for the Liberal Democrats in Kent was Tunbridge Wells, wasn't
00:59it? At the moment we are being told too close to call but on the
01:03balance of probabilities it will probably stay blue. What do you
01:07think? I think it is very close to call and it is such a shame if it
01:11doesn't because Mike is such a fantastic candidate, really good
01:15local knowledge and they have got a very strong team. I think Tunbridge
01:18Wells desperately needs a new MP and a new change in there. I really
01:22hope we can get those votes over the line and get a first Lib Dem in
01:26Kent. Kat, obviously the Greens, we know there has been some momentum
01:30behind them. We heard from Kate Belmonte, one of your colleagues
01:33earlier on. Do you think that two seats is a reasonable return if
01:37that exit poll comes back or is that going to be disappointing for
01:40you? I would like to see more green seats. I think we have to have a
01:45strong green voice. We know we are going to have a big Labour
01:49majority. The stronger that green voice can be standing up for
01:53climate and inequality and things, the better as far as I am
01:57concerned. Greens are really targeting, I don't think it is any
02:01secret, four seats. I would love by the end of the night to see that
02:05two turn to a four would be the dream. Where would they be, do you
02:10think? Brighton, Bristol Central, Waverley Valley and Herefordshire.
02:14Do you think there is any chance ever of us seeing, we know that
02:18Folsom and Hyde now has a really strong green base in it. Maidstone
02:22is a coalition council run by the Greens. Any chance of that ever
02:26turning into a green vote at a national election? I hope so. The
02:30first-past-the-post system makes it really difficult for the Greens.
02:34But we are building momentum all the time. We are getting
02:38unprecedented numbers of councillors. We have only ever had
02:41one MP. If we go to two, that is doubling our MPs, albeit in small
02:45numbers. But we have got a lot to build on. Talking to people in
02:49the streets and on the doorsteps and things. We have had lots and
02:53lots of people joining the party, getting involved. We are definitely
02:57a party that is growing and getting stronger day by day. I would hope
03:01to see some green MPs in Kent soon. One of the things I want to talk to
03:05you about is energising young voters, which is always a challenge
03:09at general elections. We generally hear an awful lot about how young
03:13people are disaffected, how they are unhappy, but then it doesn't
03:17necessarily translate to action. This year, I am going to posit that
03:21this was the first TikTok election this year. That may be the defining
03:25media of this election. I think nothing encapsulates that more than
03:29Ed Davey having the time of his life on the campaign trail. Was that a
03:33deliberate attempt, do you think, to create one-minute shareable
03:37videos on TikTok for young voters? I think Ed's philosophy on this
03:41campaign was to bring some emotion and humanity to it. It is very easy
03:45to have these sort of grey politicians stand there and talk about
03:49policy, but that doesn't get people engaged. What people need to know
03:53is, who are you, what do you stand for, are you having a bit of fun as
03:57well? I have to say, what he brought to is an amazing bit of, it is a
04:01bit of a stunt, but here is the serious message behind it. I think
04:05that is what he brought to his campaign. He made a bit of fun to wake
04:09up, energise people and pay attention. Looking at the exit polls, it is
04:13absolutely a fantastic work. Even if you saw the recent poll they did
04:17about leadership popularity, Ed's daily dramatically increased his
04:21polling numbers more than any other political leader. That was because
04:25he was both honest and fun with people, and people respect that. The
04:29story over the last 15 years, I think, is that people have been
04:33mistrusting the Lib Dems. The story over the last 15 years with the
04:37Liberal Democrats has been about tuition fees, a broken relationship
04:41with young people. Does that exit poll suggest you have healed that
04:45rift? I think it has taken a lot of time for us to earn people's trust
04:49again. I am not going to deny it, it was a hard-fought battle to regain
04:53that, but we have put forward policies and promises that people
04:57respect and know we hold. We have had ten good years of running
05:01the party. If we want to trust the Lib Dems, we can deliver on the
05:05promises we make. Today, we have definitely turned that corner and
05:09hopefully, fingers crossed, we have earned that trust back, that we can
05:13build on this and put our platform of all our policies out to the
05:17electorate in the next election. You work with young people, don't you?
05:21That is part of your day job. Are they engaged enough? Is politics
05:25inspirational to young people? It is something that I am really
05:29passionate about. I think the threshold for turnout for young
05:33people is really low. I think we have got to think about how we are
05:37messaging, and you say the TikTok election, how we are messaging and
05:41talking to young people and getting them out to vote. I did quite warm
05:45to Ed Davies during this campaign. I thought he did really well.
05:49Yes, I was working for the British Youth Council and huge numbers of
05:53young people are really politically engaged. They have got really
05:57passionate and want to go out and make a difference. I am just not
06:01sure that for all young people, they see politics as the way to do
06:05that at the moment. There is a lot of work that we need to do. I am
06:09really passionate about getting out and talking to young people and
06:13seeing how we can do it. The TikTok format really encourages people to
06:17send a reply, send an emoji. That is your way of engaging rather than
06:21going to the ballot box. In effect, the whole system is designed for a
06:25lot of action, potentially, do you think? Yes, and I think also people
06:29maybe are a bit more issue-based and will get involved in a campaign
06:33or something that they really care about and see that they can make
06:37change by campaigning on a specific issue rather than maybe getting
06:41involved with the whole broad spectrum of politics when they don't really
06:45trust in it and trust in the process. I think the key message here is
06:49what we need to do is make sure we talk about policies that affect young
06:53people. I think the Greens and the parties have almost pandered to the
06:57OEP, to the old folk, because that is who votes. They have often ignored
07:01them. I am proud of both our party and to an extent the Greens have put
07:05forward policies that really young people care about. Climate change,
07:09number one issue for most young people out there. Housing, number two
07:13issue for most young people out there. I don't see many of the big parties
07:17talking about it, but we were proud to put those policies forward. If you
07:21don't put those policies forward, that is an issue that affects them now.
07:25The interesting thing this year, if that turns out, we won't get these
07:29figures tonight, we will be a little down the line before we get some
07:33demographics back on the voting, but if it turns out young people have
07:37stayed at home as they normally do, in an election where one of the main
07:41parties was saying we will conscript you into national service, we will
07:45force you to do community service or military service, if that doesn't get
07:49back on the ballot, that is a big issue. I think there is a lot of
07:53positiveness about it all. I have been outdoor knocking and speaking to
07:57young people. Today I have seen lots of very young people voting for the
08:01first time, which is very good. I saw a recent stat online where
08:05TikTok did the vote registration announcement across all their
08:09platform, and there was a massive surge of online registration by
08:13young people. I think we get those platforms out, get the message out,
08:17deliver on the promises we give them, and actually do policies and do
08:21initiatives that actually help them, rather than a certain subset of the
08:25older population who the previous parties have focused on.
08:29I was going to say, that is about engaging with young people and
08:33listening to them and seeing what matters to them. You have raised some
08:37important points that do matter to young people, but we need to make sure
08:41they are part of those conversations and helping to form those solutions as
08:45well. They have had a really, really bad time.
08:49Youth services have been cut. Short starts have gone. All the
08:53services that really would have helped them have the best start in life have
08:57been taken away from them. It has been damaged over the last 14 years.
09:01There are commentators out there looking at all kinds of different ways
09:05that our political system might need to be shaken up. One of the things that
09:09gets talked about is citizens assemblies, a way of giving people a
09:13voice, a way of actually being part of a decision-making process.
09:17Yes, 100%. I think that all too often the people who are affected by issues
09:21are the ones that will understand the issues and be able to find the
09:25solutions and have the knowledge, the skills, the ideas. If we don't
09:29involve people in democracy, in decision-making, then it is not a true
09:33democracy. Green is very much about decisions being made at the most
09:37practical level to the people that they affect.
09:41We are going to have a Labour government. We have spoken to you quite a
09:45few times, Stuart, on CAM TV. You are a regular face on here. One of the
09:49things we have spoken to you about before is issues that affect parents.
09:53You are very vocal about that often. The two-child cap limit is going to
09:57be one of the big issues for an incoming Labour government. It affects
10:01a lot of people. One of the big financial pressures on families and
10:05young families. Do you think the government is going to be able to
10:09deal with that? It is going to be tough for a government coming in with
10:13public finances as bad as they are. I am not going to deny it. The Tories
10:17have left Labour in a really tough position. However, there are certain
10:21principles that I think people need to stand by. The two-child limit is
10:25one of those principles that goes beyond that. Fundamentally, we should
10:29be a country where children are not poor. They should not be hungry.
10:33They should deserve everything they get. I would like to see the Labour
10:37stick... There are a few U-turns that I would appreciate. This is number
10:41one. I suspect, if this ever came to a Parliament vote, there would be a
10:45lot of new Labour MPs who would not be voting with the government on this.
10:49You might see one of the first governments switch around on this.
10:53I think there are a lot of Labour people out there who are not happy with
10:57this. They want their government, they want Keir Starmer, to realise
11:01fundamentally we should have that limited and we should have a
11:05country where children are not in poverty. Do you think he can afford to
11:09make those kind of changes? I think you can afford what you want to
11:13afford. It is about political will and choice and how you spend money. I
11:17have not heard from him, from Labour, that they want, for example, the
11:21Greens had the wealth tax, so we were going to find some money in that way
11:25or we would scrap Trident or find some money there. I am not quite sure
11:29where Labour's money is going to come from. It is choice at the end of the
11:33day. We will put a pin in the conversation for a moment. We are
11:37ready to go over to Sean in Sevenoaks, who has some news about
11:41turnout and the number of registered ballots.
11:46Sorry, the verification has now just been announced. It is a bit
11:50calmer here at the minute. There was 50,000 of 50 votes in total.
11:55Around 67.9% turnout. That was a fall from the previous election,
11:59where it was a bit quieter. It is a bit quieter now. It is a bit quieter
12:03now. It is a bit quieter now. It is a bit quieter now. It is a bit quieter
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13:07now. Sean, thank you.
13:13We were talking about turnout then. 67% in Severn thats down from where
13:17it was before but thats still in the bounds on what we would expect in a
13:21general election. We were just looking at results coming around the rest
13:25of the country with turnout around 50%-55% is that a concern? It would
13:31be a concern if I was a Tory right now. In this sort of situation, I would
13:36a lot of that low turnout is disenfranchised Tories who've looked at
13:38a government embarrassed by their government and though they don't want to
13:42vote for another option they don't want to vote at all. So yeah I'd be worried if
13:47I was a Tory candidate right now. Is it only the Conservatives that
13:51need to fear a low turnout? I think it's a bit of a statement about the
13:56lack of trust in politicians generally and you hear that a lot on the doorstep
13:59well you're all the same don't you know don't have any trust, you're
14:03never going to do anything for, no one's going to do anything for me so I'm not
14:05voting. So I think it's an issue that everybody needs, all politicians need to
14:09address. There's one seat in Kent which was Labour before the night started that
14:15was Canterbury, widely expected to be held by Rosie Duffield. I think we can go
14:19there now for an update on how the count is going.
14:24So obviously it's still quite busy here for a sense of the amount of bodies in
14:30the room they've had to fling open the doors just off camera to let some air in.
14:35It is getting quite stuffy in here because things are in motion now.
14:38Many counts are being conducted by various teams, we're slightly past the
14:45usual voter verification stage in some parts of this count so things are in
14:52motion but and we'd be speaking to councillors on the ground, what are they
14:57thinking tonight? Well we spoke to KCC councillor Neil Baker who's actually
15:01acting as the agent for Louise Harvey-Clarke, the Conservative
15:06candidate for Canterbury. He says it's going to be a slightly better night for
15:15the Conservatives than expected.
15:18Well I don't think it's a secret that we were expecting a bad night of results
15:20for the Conservatives. To be honest if we do get around 131 seats it's probably
15:26on the higher end of my expectations. I was personally prepared for a sub 100
15:30seat total so I'm not going to pretend it's a good result but it could have
15:33been even worse.
15:37One thing he did say though is despite acting as the agent for Louise Harvey-
15:42Clarke, he doesn't expect her to win. He expects Rosie Duffield, the Labour
15:48candidate, to get a 20,000 seat majority but says that her and they could be a
15:54surprise. Alan Bulldog, the leader of Labour Council, is a sceptical about the
15:59results. He wants to see the actual results on the ground first but we'll
16:03have to wait and see. There's a bit of commotion behind me. I'm not sure what
16:07that quite is but we'll be bringing you all the latest from this count when we
16:11find out.
16:16Thank you Ollie. Looking very, very hot and sweaty there. I won't gloat about
16:20the fact that we're in an air-conditioned pop-up studio here. News
16:24coming in that Craig McKinley, who was the MP in South Thanet, has been made a
16:30Lord and that breaking news tonight. Obviously his position, his health
16:37position, absolutely kind of awful and his bravery coming back to Parliament
16:42was incredible. Do you think that that's a good kind of credit for his service to
16:48the county? I think so, I think so. I'm always a bit worried about the
16:53unelected Lords, who gets in there and whether it's that, but I think on some
16:57of those rare occasions you get these examples where it is fully deserved. He's
17:02got a life experience more than most would have and they can bring that to
17:05Lords and make sure of it. So absolutely, he probably 100% deserves this and
17:10good luck with him and I'm sure he's still going to be an excellent
17:13parliamentarian in the Lords and then continue doing his work. It's a
17:17good moment to reflect on the loss of some political experience from
17:21around the county tonight, isn't it? I mean, because obviously election is all
17:25about change, but we've got some people who have served the county for quite a
17:29long time, who stepped down, who made the decision not to stand or who will be
17:32losing. Tracy Crouch, a good example of that. Greg Clark would be a good example of
17:36that. Obviously they're not from your party, but do you think that that is, I
17:41mean, are they losses that will be felt here in Kent, do you think? Are you glad to see them
17:46gone? You can say how you feel. Yeah, I know Tracy Crouch has been very
17:55popular. I've met her once and, you know, she would seem really supportive of
18:00the work that we were doing with young people in Medway, and I think always
18:04had a lot of integrity and credibility, so I think from that
18:08perspective, yes, that would be sad to see her step down, but yeah, I'm
18:13not really sad to see the Conservatives lose all their seats, to be honest.
18:19Stuart, you must have worked with Tracy Crouch a little bit? I've met her a
18:22couple of times. I think on so many levels there's still just, you know,
18:27people who, there are MPs who generally go there who want to help their
18:31community, and she's a fine example of that, and I wish her well in her new job,
18:35but I think I'm with her on a lot of those issues. I think the country
18:40requires change, and I think this government and the MPs that support it
18:45deserve to go, because they've had, we've had 14 years of terrible government,
18:52terrible laws being made, and each one of them has to have an element of blame to
18:57them, and the country wants change, and it looks like tonight they're going to have
19:00change. So, we were talking about turnout just before we went off to Ollie, and
19:07you're talking about change there, we're talking about the, you know, all of this
19:10kind of stuff. The interesting thing about this, a lot of people think this
19:14hasn't been necessarily the most inspirational campaign, that there hasn't
19:17necessarily been an overriding narrative. We've been looking back at times
19:22tonight to 1997, which is the obvious touch point for tonight, and that cool
19:26Britannia moment, the moment when it wasn't just about politics, it was about
19:31art, and it was about a kind of sense of identity around the country. Do you think
19:34we've missed out on that moment in this election campaign? I was, yeah, I mean
19:41it's obviously because I'm a Green, I've got very sort of strong views on what
19:46kind of society, you know, I'd like to live in, but I do think that the Tories
19:51have really trashed the country, and it was a perfect opportunity, I think, for
19:58Labour to come with a really great, new, positive vision of hope and, yeah,
20:06prosperity, green prosperity for our future, and I felt that that was really
20:10missing something, like you say, something that people could really think, yeah,
20:13brilliant, we can really, whereas I think the view is, well at least it's not the
20:17Tories, we just want the Tories out, and in fact lots of people that I've
20:22talked to on doorstep have said to me, really love your vision, love your
20:24policies, but we need to vote, we need to vote Labour to get the Tories out. It
20:28doesn't feel like there's this big kind of momentum of people around a big
20:32Labour vision, I don't, I don't know. This matters a bit, doesn't it, because if
20:37Keir Starmer is elected with a majority of, I mean we're talking about 410 seats
20:41in the exit poll, but that's based on less than 40% of the popular vote, and
20:45there's a sense that an awful lot of those people are just waiting for a
20:48mistake from Labour, and they would immediately bounce back and go and vote
20:51for somebody else. Then he doesn't quite necessarily have the political
20:54capital that he thinks he does. No, absolutely, and it's completely different
20:58to 97 when Tony Blair, if you remember when he came in, that first term he
21:02didn't really achieve anything, but there was that element of trust, because you
21:06saw him having a vision, so we trust him to his second term. Keir Starmer hasn't
21:13delivered a vision, but then the Tories haven't. Their campaign's been terrible,
21:15it's been the most negative campaign I've ever seen. I don't know what
21:19Rishi Sunak stood for, all I knew is he was putting up pictures of cats and
21:23dogs and saying if you vote Labour they're going to die. I mean that's not a
21:27way to run a decent campaign. I think there's been a fundamental change in how
21:31people vote, and if you looked at the Boris Johnson and the Red Bull period,
21:36people lent him his vote on the condition that it would deliver something,
21:40delivering level up, regenerate the high street. They're going to ask for that
21:45same question to Keir Starmer, and they will expect a delivery in that first
21:48Parliament, whether he's got the money or the political willpower to
21:51deliver it. Unless he does, we'll probably see a one-term Labour government.
21:56That's interesting isn't it, because we've come out of a period of political
21:59dynasties. We had the Thatcher dynasty effectively, we had the Blair dynasty,
22:02we've had the Cameron and then others dynasty. Do you think that's over now? Do
22:07you think that we might be in a position where the voting kind of becomes
22:10more unstable from election to election? I mean I think it would be
22:16great if we could move to a PR system where actually we are seeing
22:20different voices in our political system, and we're seeing a different way
22:24of politics where we're actually working a bit more collaboratively, listening
22:29to different views, debating policy, trying to find kind of common
22:33ground, and doing the right thing, rather than this sort of
22:40more tribal and adversarial politics. I don't know
22:49if it's over, because I don't know if the political system that we have
22:53will allow the system that we've got where one party has to... I think just
22:58chipping on that, we've seen again that shift in how people deal with politics.
23:02The tribal politics is over. You speak to a lot of people that they no longer see
23:06themselves as a Labour voter, or a Tory voter, or even a Lib Dem voter. They look
23:10at each party, look at their policies, look at the persons running it, and say
23:13what are you going to deliver for me? What stuff can you get to me? And they're
23:16less more likely to swap parties, depending on what the policy and what
23:20they can deliver. We're going to see a lot more shift, and that's where
23:24proportional representation comes in, because that's the perfect system that
23:26allows people to do that, because you can hold parties and people to a
23:31much higher account, because they have to work every single vote. Without that we'd
23:36be still having these safe seats where you can stick a Labour rosette on a
23:39donkey, or a Tory rosette on a donkey, and they'll still get elected. So I think we're
23:43going to see a shift of how people do it, and parties have to adapt to that, and I'm
23:46going to say that's where Keir Starmer can't just sit back and think I've got a
23:50massive majority, I can sit back for four years, he's got to deliver on day one.
23:54And it's going to be very tough for him to do that in the financial climate
23:57that we're in. One other thought, you're both Medway. Medway Council has been
24:03Labour-run for a year. We're now going to have them working with a National Labour
24:08Government. Do you think that that changes things in Medway fundamentally?
24:11I wish it, I hope so. I mean the local authorities we all know don't have
24:19enough money to do the things they're supposed to do, so it's actually a really
24:21really hard job for whoever's in power. And my hope would have been actually if
24:25with Labour coming in, that they will give more money to local authorities to
24:28do the jobs that they need to do. I don't know that that's going to be the case.
24:31It's got to come from that magical money chip again. So I'm not sure how it's going to,
24:35I'm not sure quite how it's going to help make a difference, unless
24:39the central government are willing to actually properly support financially
24:43the local government. So I don't know how it can can really help.
24:49Is there a useful check and balance in some ways, having a
24:54Labour-run council like this working with a Conservative government and
24:57having to compromise over some of the issues? We saw that with the
25:00council tax, for example, rises that were provided. I think it'd be nice to see
25:04an element of compromise in all politics. I think compromise has become quite a
25:07dirty word in politics. It seems to be one or the other and absolutists attack
25:11each other. I personally believe that the role of the MP in a council is
25:17about that relationship and what they can bring each other. And I
25:20think potentially having two parties, you know, they're both at the same
25:24party, would develop that personal relationship. So you know, so
25:27Mince Maple might have a more personal, a better relationship with three Labour
25:31MPs and therefore might work and get that sort of funding to the right places,
25:35rather combative, where you're arguing over where the money, where the houses
25:39and all that sort of go on. So I would like to see it as a more combative, but
25:43as Kat says, the money's not there, nothing's going to change. Because this
25:47has an impact on some very specific local issues, doesn't it? So Labour's
25:51growth strategy, for example, might have a direct implication for what's going on
25:55at Chatham Docks at the moment. Do you think that we might see some
25:58movement on that? Are we going to see the docks being given up for housing?
26:03I mean, I hope not, but it's, I don't know, Labour's position at the moment is a
26:11bit, yeah, it's not really very clear what they're supporting at the moment.
26:15Obviously before they were really, you know, all in to try and save the
26:19docks, but now that it sort of seems to be complicated and I'm not too sure. I
26:23don't know what difference the kind of relationship with central government
26:27will make on that. Because Keir Starmer is committed to building houses in huge
26:32numbers, isn't it? I mean, I think he said 1.5 million houses. And Labour
26:37councils are going to be the people that have to deliver that effectively. Yeah, I
26:40mean, it's one of those few policies that I actually agree with Keir Starmer. We do
26:44need housing, I'm 100% for that. But it has to be the right housing in the
26:47right location and it shouldn't be at the sacrifice of very important
26:50infrastructure like the Chatham Docks. There are other places you can do it,
26:53there's other ways you can do it, so it doesn't impact the environment as well.
26:56So what I would like to see maybe is potentially the local plan at some
27:04point and that's a really key message from what the council said. So maybe with a
27:08local plan and a Labour government we might see a bit more sort of drive to
27:14get these houses built but make sure that they meet the environmental
27:17standards that we demand it. Make sure the local community engaged with it and
27:20the infrastructure is there and that's the key, the infrastructure to be. We've
27:24seen that on this election where we've had Kelly Tellhurst celebrating the loss
27:28of 170 million infrastructure bid for Medway. Hopefully we'll have MPs
27:33working with Medway Council to ensure that our infrastructure bid actually goes
27:36ahead and it helps the people in the area. Yeah, I mean, to be honest I was
27:40quite happy that that infrastructure bid didn't go ahead because it wasn't enough
27:43for the 12,000 houses that were being planned to be built on the peninsula
27:46which is, you know, as we've said, grade-one agricultural land.
27:50For people watching, this was a bid that was related to bus routes and train routes between the Hoopaninshire and Chatham.
27:55Yeah, and it was all for the Hoopaninshire and it was all this thing, we've lost money for Medway, no, it's very specific money that was for the
27:59peninsula but not even for the peninsula, for the residents there. It was to
28:02enable 12,000 new houses to be built there and the people on the peninsula
28:06did not want that and I know that because I knocked on so many doors on
28:09the peninsula. So if we're talking about engaging with residents and working out
28:13housing solutions and that was not the right solution for the peninsula or for
28:18the natural environment. Of course this is the problem with a housing policy
28:21because you said there you're firmly in favour of building more houses but you
28:24don't want them in the docks, we don't want them on the Hoopaninshire, you've got
28:28Capstone Valley, you've got, you know, the Lodge Hill farm, you know, all these kind
28:31of areas where people don't want houses. It's finding the places where people do
28:34want them that's the trick, isn't it? And I think, I think, so where the lived-in policy
28:37comes in is we want the housing, we've got a very ambitious housing
28:41target but our key to that is we're doing it through community
28:44engagement policies where we talk to the community right at the start and sit down
28:47with them and say, look, we need housing, we all agree we need housing, let's
28:52work out where they can, what infrastructure do you need there, what
28:55need that, do you need a bus route, do you need a school, do you want that, let's work
28:58that out, get it in place to put the housing in and then we build housing
29:01with brilliant environmental standards where we can protect the biodiversity,
29:05make sure they're net zero, put solar panels on all of them, make sure they've
29:08got heat pumps in them and then we can do that from the start and then
29:12communities come together. There's been quite a few Lib Dem councils across the
29:15country that built those houses with the community together and they've been
29:20very popular locally but you need to have that chat and I think what we saw
29:23from the Medway Tories and potentially with the Medway Labour is this sort of
29:27top-down, we're going to stick houses here and there and everywhere.
29:29Decide and then consult, not engage.
29:32Exactly. We can go over now to East Dannet, we've just been talking about Craig
29:36McKinley, this was his seat, he isn't standing now but Millie Bowles can tell
29:40us a little bit more about what's going on there.
29:45Hi AAS, I'm in East Dannet. Craig McKinley was our MP here for a very long time but
30:04unfortunately he had to stand down due to his battle with sepsis but today he
30:09has been elevated to the House of Lords. On Twitter he's given his heartfelt thanks
30:15to Rishi Sunak, he says it's given him a platform to campaign for his sepsis and
30:21limb loss awareness. He has a prosthetic on his forearm and his leg and he was
30:30coined the Bionic MP but unfortunately that was for quite a short amount of time as
30:37Rishi Sunak called the election the same day he came back to Parliament.
30:45Thank you, thank you Millie and apologies for just a few little
30:52connection issues there with our internet link to Dannet.
30:56Obviously one of the big questions that's going to come out over the
31:03course of the next few hours is going to be about the future of some of the party
31:07leaders here. As you've said before, Ed Davey is going to see this as a big, big
31:12win for him. We know we know Sir Keir Starmer is going to be very happy. What do we
31:16think will happen with Rishi Sunak come the morning? Oh, God knows. I mean he
31:22flip-flops more than anything on this. He said that he's going to come out and
31:26stay as an MP. My gut feeling he's already got his plane ticket to
31:32California booked. David Cameron said something similar didn't he? Exactly and I
31:36think there'll be an element of spin, they'll try and spin it
31:39so that it's not as bad as it could have been. It could have been a lot worse but
31:42he has run a terrible campaign from the start. He had the biggest
31:49chip to play that no other party has any to call when the date was and he got
31:54that wrong. He didn't tell anybody about it. They were in complete disorganising.
31:57He has to take the brunt for that and I'm afraid if I was a Tory member and a
32:03Tory MP I think he would have to go straight away. So you think gone in the
32:07morning? Gone in the morning. Probably, yeah I guess so. I mean the
32:14campaign was... I felt like he was just one man and where was the party? Where
32:19was everyone else? I think I saw Penny Mordaunt on one leader's speech but you
32:22know you see the other campaigns. You've got buses of people and
32:27it's just always him by himself. It felt very very lonely. So yeah I think it
32:32might just be a... if he doesn't go it'll just be a one-man band. A good example is the
32:37fact a lot of the the Medway Tory leaflets pretty much didn't have a
32:41single picture of Rishi Sunak on them. It was definitely a local campaign. I
32:45think Kelly Tauhurst said the word local in a video like 50 times. I think that's
32:49where it is. They know he's not an asset for them and I'm pretty sure he'd be
32:53gone. It's interesting you mentioned campaign literature because that's
32:57something that is interesting. Obviously the Conservatives got in a bit of
32:59trouble because they were they were putting green colour on some of their
33:02leaflets at one point in this campaign. A similar kind of thing. The Liberal
33:06Democrats and Conservatives are both quite keen on using this trick of
33:09producing election leaflets that look like local newspapers and have branding
33:12like local newspapers. Do you think there needs to be a little bit more
33:15control over how parties communicate with the public? I think definitely on that case
33:20we've seen a lot of Tory literature go out barely with the word conservative on
33:25there. Using green colours but using a lot of other like different off colours.
33:30I think the newspapers on there, they have a purpose because, speaking as a
33:38political geek, people get turned off by if they see the same leaflet over again.
33:42So if they see a newspaper they'll... It's an attempt to kind of hoodwink them into thinking it's a trusted news brand.
33:47Not hoodwink. It's just, oh that's different. I'll have a look. I mean you have to use it
33:52carefully and you have to be honest with people. Make sure your brand is on top of
33:55it. But I do think what we've seen from the Tories is basically even them being
34:01embarrassed to be a Conservative on their leaflet. And I've seen that on so
34:06many leaflets across the country today. There's a wider issue here about
34:08political communications now. I think all parties are kind of pulled
34:12into that to an extent. How do we tidy that up? How do we, particularly in a
34:16social media age, you were talking about viral pictures of kittens and all the
34:19How do we get some kind of rules in place?
34:23I think it's really important. For me it's about honesty and truth in
34:29messages that are being put out there. Because in today's age where you've got
34:34information coming from so many different places, it's really hard to
34:37know what is real, you know, with fake news, what is real and what's not. And I
34:42think politicians need to be really held to account with what they're saying and
34:47make sure that it is truthful and accurate. Because I've heard in this
34:50election campaign from leaders, you know, statistics that are completely wrong.
34:55Some that are not completely wrong but definitely misleading. And I don't think
35:01that that is, I think there should be rules around that because I don't think
35:04that's right. And that people need to know where they can go to get actual
35:07true and factual information. There's a movement within the Welsh Assembly I
35:12think to introduce, if someone is shown to have said something false, a
35:16politician, they have to correct the record within two weeks or they will
35:19face penalties. Do you think that should be a wider? Yeah I think that's really good.
35:23But it's how that's done, I don't know, you know, how they're conducting that.
35:27But I know, for example, that in the past there can be, I mean the media play a
35:31part of this as well, you know, thinking about newspapers where there'll be big
35:33headlines and it will be false information. And then they'll have to say
35:38it's, you know, apologise or say actually that was wrong. But then you'll find it
35:41on page three in small writing, you know, a few days later no one notices, everyone
35:44still remembers those big headlines that WEM's leading. So I think, yeah, it
35:49needs to be, it definitely needs to be tightened up and make sure that any
35:52false information is put right in, you know, with equal weight to how it was
35:56put wrong in the first place. Title rules? Yeah, I mean, it generally surprised
36:01me that there's no actual specific rule that says you can have to tell the truth
36:05on any campaign. You're not allowed to lie about a candidate or lie about their
36:10conduct and we've seen people pulled up on that. But there's no actual rule
36:14that says you have to tell the 100% truth on that and the Electoral Commission
36:18are pretty obvious of that. Does the Electoral Commission need to have a look
36:21at that rule and say actually we need to put that out? Or do we need to look into
36:24local journalism and get that boost up? Because you're the best people here to
36:28fact-check some of this stuff that comes out and I think, you know, we've seen
36:32quite a few fact-check social media stuff and a few newspapers come out but
36:38I think MPs at a local level need to be held accountable more than that.
36:41We're about to go to Tunbridge Wells, we're going to speak to Ellie there
36:44about what's happening. In one word Stuart, are you going to win Tunbridge Wells?
36:47I'm feeling positive, so yes, I think we're going to win.
36:50Stuart says yes. Ellie, how is it looking over there?
36:53So that's right, I'm currently in Tunbridge Wells Sports Centre where the election
36:59count is in full swing. We've just been told that the turnout is 69.2% and the
37:05verification process is now complete. In attendance at the moment I have two
37:10candidates, that's John Gaiger from Reform UK and an independent candidate
37:15Hassan Kassem. I'm yet to see the four other candidates here this evening.
37:24Thank you very much Ellie, thank you very much to my guests also Stuart Bourne,
37:28Cad Jamieson. We're now going to go and see some of the election issues that
37:32have been affecting Dartford over the course of this campaign.
37:37We opened in 2020, just before the start of the COVID pandemic. Our opening evening
37:45was actually the night that Boris Johnson went on telly and delivered the
37:49news that all pubs are closing. So we've been through such a turbulent spell, I
37:55think inflation hitting over 20% in the last 12 months or so has just had the
38:02biggest impact on everything we do as a business. The cost of bringing stuff
38:07into the pub, with that sort of rise on it in terms of the utilities and the
38:13electricity bills that we're sort of facing at the same time, it's sort of
38:17coupled together, it's an absolute disaster for the industry. Sort of you
38:21just don't really know what's around the corner, so it's hard to be optimistic.
38:27Certainly won't be putting my vote to Conservative. It just seems like the
38:32government's been in disarray for quite a period now, since the Brexit
38:37referendum, Mrs May's government into the Boris Johnson government and the
38:42fiascos and everything that's happened since then. It's just been one big
38:46whirlwind of chaos that's followed the government around for about seven,
38:51seven, eight years now.
38:57I'm a retired mental health social worker. Okay, it's 11.08.
39:08We started this shop in July 2011. In the 80s, people came to Britain either to
39:17study or to work, but because of the economic situation in all other
39:23countries, quite a lot of people have moved into Britain. It's a good thing
39:28because quite a lot of people who have specific skills, they are here to work
39:36and use those skills, which is good for the economy. Quite a lot of people have
39:42moved from London into Dartford because of the influx of housing. It's a problem.
39:50In fact, as a result of that, what we did some years ago, we had to create that
39:57board there for people, customers or anyone, if they have a flat to let, a room
40:04to let, they just come and advertise it freely. Whoever is the MP for Dartford
40:09and is doing things to benefit people in Dartford.
40:21So I came from Nigeria and I came in 2008. So I grew up in South London where
40:29everything's noisy, you can hear sirens, you can hear people, it's just so chaotic
40:34and that's one of the things I love the most about living in Dartford and I know
40:38I'm coming home to peace, I'm coming home to less people, I'm coming home to
40:41community. So my son's autistic and he's nonverbal and growing up, because he's
40:47still quite young, in school and within his community. His school imitates real
40:52life for him because there are small classes, there are smaller
40:56classes in comparison to mainstream where you have 30 children in a class
41:00and for me I feel like the government needs to create more specialist school.
41:04I'm not a big fan of mainstream with a specialist unit because I'm indecisive.
41:09Do you know how you're going to vote? I'm still going to stick to Labour just
41:14because... Do you know why you're sticking to Labour? Yeah I just feel like what right
41:20now is sort of like Conservative and Vadwaal. Now I think it's just a change
41:26of the helm. You know there was a lot of misdemeanour around Dartford before it
41:31got cleared away. So it's not like, there is nowhere that is safe. Yeah Dartford is
41:35better than most places but nowhere is safe. A lot of businesses have had to
41:39close down because it's not safe.