Predator Pets (2018) Season 1 Episode 7
Scott and Zuzana live behind 10-foot chain fences; not to protect themselves from intruders, but to protect intruders from their surprising pets. Dave and his dog Alice have an incredible bond, but Alice is no ordinary dog; she's a dingo. Join us in Ken Foose's Exotic Pets Store where you can find everything from ferrets and hedgehogs, through to snakes, giant spiders, scorpions, and lizards.
#documentary
Scott and Zuzana live behind 10-foot chain fences; not to protect themselves from intruders, but to protect intruders from their surprising pets. Dave and his dog Alice have an incredible bond, but Alice is no ordinary dog; she's a dingo. Join us in Ken Foose's Exotic Pets Store where you can find everything from ferrets and hedgehogs, through to snakes, giant spiders, scorpions, and lizards.
#documentary
Category
🐳
AnimalsTranscript
00:00Humans have had a close relationship with animals for thousands of years.
00:26Scientists agree the domestic dog has been a trusted pet for around 15,000 years, and
00:31cats became part of the household from 10,000 years ago, and now it's estimated there are
00:37at least 600 million pet cats in the world.
00:41Exotic pets have also been kept for thousands of years.
00:46It's well documented that the Egyptians kept baboons as pets, and exotic animals kept in
00:51the home feature in many ancient texts.
00:55In modern times, the keeping of exotic pets has increased.
00:59A staggering statistic is that there are more tigers in the U.S. alone than there are in
01:04the wild.
01:09Animal owners truly believe they are playing a role in preserving the numbers of exotic
01:13animals, but on the other side of the debate, there are those who believe it is a cruel
01:18practice to keep any animals in captivity.
01:22This series explores the issues from both sides, from those who know the dangers, but
01:30see the benefits, to others who condemn the keeping of exotic pets.
01:35Their stories follow.
01:48The entire perimeter of this rural Nevada property is surrounded by 10-foot chain fences
01:53topped with barbed wire, making it seem more like a prison compound than a family home.
02:05But Scott and Susanna, the couple who live there, aren't worried about possible burglars.
02:11They're more concerned about protecting the public from their unusual and potentially
02:15deadly pets.
02:22Their 10-acre property is home to a variety of exotic creatures, including tigers, lions,
02:27wolves, and other predators that many would consider too dangerous to keep at home.
02:32You don't eliminate the danger, what you do is you mitigate the risk.
02:40When it comes to safely keeping predators as pets, the more familiar the animal is with
02:45their handlers, the safer the interaction is.
03:05Susanna is clearly very comfortable with her feline companion, and although the lioness
03:09is obviously unsettled by the presence of our camera crew, she shows no sign of threatening
03:39When Scott first met his partner, Susanna, she already owned some unusual pets, including
04:01reptiles and big cats.
04:06I met Susanna, I was actually a defense contractor working at the Air Force Base, and when I
04:13met her, she was downsizing.
04:14She had two tigers and five dogs, and one or two that could have been considered wolf
04:20dogs.
04:22Even though she is trained in business and economics, Susanna spent most of her life
04:27being hands-on with animals, starting as a child riding horses in Eastern Europe.
04:33She has been keeping reptiles and dogs since the early 1980s, and big cats since the mid-90s.
04:40Shortly after I met her, I found out she had tigers, and it was a case of, you know, I'd
04:45like to go see my tigers, I was like, oh, okay, we'll go to the zoo, and you know, she
04:48has some of the tea trees of her own, and what she'd do is she'd hand me a milk bottle
04:53and go here and give her a bottle of milk, and I was milk feeding her.
04:58At first, Scott was understandably apprehensive about meeting Susanna's bigger cats, but he
05:04quickly became familiar with the unique requirements of owning exotic pets.
05:09To me, they're like extra-large dogs, but that do weigh 400 pounds, 500 pounds, 600
05:15pounds, and you've got to take that into account when we get animals.
05:19We start right away when we get them, no matter if they're, you know, three weeks old or six
05:24months old, training them on a leash, teaching them that no, they don't jump on us, no, we're
05:28not a play toy, we're here for love and affection, and, you know, to move you around, but, you
05:34know, we're not going to roughhouse with you and play, you know, we'll give you all the
05:37toys you need, give you the playmates, or give you the entertainment you need, but not
05:42with us.
05:45Those playmates generally come from the local dog rescue, and act as companions and teachers
05:51to the exotic animals.
05:53Actually, some of the dogs we got are wilder than the tigers, because they're actually
05:57born in the wild, and a rescue group picks them up, and we home some of them, and they've
06:03ended up with either tiger or liger, and part of the reason we do it is, well, first we
06:09do it at young, but it gives them a companion, gives them a playmate, and they learn from
06:14the dog how to play, because the dog won't allow the rough tiger play, so it tones the
06:21tiger down a little bit.
06:26My worst animal bite was from two dogs fighting, and I was breaking it up, and I got in between,
06:33and I got bit instead.
06:36They have disagreements, usually, at feeding time, who gets the biggest piece, you'll see
06:41that.
06:42Dogs do that together anyway, and they're very respectful of each other, and the dog
06:46is usually the boss.
06:52And it's not just the dogs that come from rescue situations.
06:56Some of the animals here have been surrendered by private owners, who learn the hard way
07:00that keeping an exotic pet is not at all like keeping a domestic dog or cat.
07:08It's a lot of work, a lot of dedication.
07:10I know it's not for everybody.
07:12It's something you've got to put a lot of thought into, if you go into it.
07:17But if you want it, you've got to be prepared to deal with a lot of issues.
07:22It's not just, I have this animal, and it looks great.
07:25No, you have this animal, and you've got to take care of it, because they're completely
07:30dependent on you.
07:34Scott and Susanna are well aware that taking care of their animal's welfare is a full-time
07:39job.
07:40You know, you don't do something like this just because it's a cool thing to do.
07:45It's not like I can take two weeks off and go to the beach somewhere.
07:49No, I've got to worry about them being fed, being watered, being cleaned, veterinary care,
07:56for any reason.
07:57I'm always sore.
07:58There's always something to do.
08:01Every day's different.
08:02It depends on the time of year, in the winter, because the property's so vast, and we have
08:07to have water to all the animals.
08:10If we have freezing temperatures, check to see if water hoses are broken, if water manifolds
08:14are broken.
08:16Make sure that animals haven't destroyed something.
08:19It's never dull, I can tell you that.
08:21We've taken in a lot of animals, and we just take them in like you take an animal from
08:27the shelter.
08:28It just needed a new home, and we treat them like a pet.
08:33In fact, Scott and Susanna even take the unusual step of making sure their pets get enough
08:38exercise by walking their big cats on leash.
08:52It's a practice that most pet owners are very familiar with, but when the animal you're
08:57leading weighs between 300 and 600 pounds, and is capable of killing you within seconds,
09:03it's a risky activity.
09:05And when your predator pet is wary of a camera crew, it's a practice that could be life-threatening.
09:15He's the one that came from Las Vegas Zoo.
09:18Yeah.
09:19He's an attention hog.
09:20He wants to be on camera everywhere.
09:26And he's the only one we don't leash walk, because they were hands-off with him, so he
09:31doesn't know what a correction is.
09:33And he's just perfectly happy, and he's really easy to move, because he'll just follow me
09:40anywhere.
09:41So I'm going to put a transport cage up to his enclosure, and he'll walk right in for
09:45me.
09:46Yeah, you really hate it here, huh, buddy?
09:49The relationship between human and pet takes on life-changing importance.
09:54And the animals you're dealing with are highly effective predators, with claws sharp enough
10:00to sever blood vessels, teeth that can rip through flesh and sinew, and jaws strong enough
10:05to crush bones.
10:08Certain people don't want us to have these animals.
10:11It's so special that, you know, or so dangerous, I shouldn't have it.
10:14Well, are you going to take away my chainsaw, too, because it's so dangerous I shouldn't
10:18have it?
10:20I understand some of the stuff on the animal welfare issue, but that should be for any
10:25animal.
10:26You know, don't have one standard for exotic animals and a different for your dog or house
10:30cat.
10:31It should run across the gamut.
10:32Making one animal more special than the other, to me, is wrong.
10:36You know, they all should be treated well.
10:39American Humane is an organization dedicated to protecting the welfare of animals.
10:44Their focus is on the care of captive exotics, more than on the debate over whether or not
10:50they should be kept in captivity.
10:53I am not okay with people who take on private exotics that haven't give a lot of thought
11:00to what it's going to entail long-term, because eventually they're going to run into a problem
11:05with resources, with care, with land, with security.
11:11And unless you have given a lot of thought to that, you're just not in a position to
11:15own an exotic like a tiger.
11:19The problem is, with a lot of people here in the U.S., you have some money, you have
11:25some means, you have some curiosity, and you think, ah, I'll take on a tiger and see what
11:30happens.
11:31But it's not a good deal for the tiger, and sometimes it's not a good deal for the person.
11:36Even those highly experienced with keeping dangerous exotic animals agree that it is
11:41not for everybody.
11:43The thing is, can you get a tiger?
11:46Yes.
11:47Can you get a Ferrari?
11:48Yes.
11:49Is it for everybody?
11:50No.
11:51A Ferrari's not a good family car.
11:52I don't think a tiger's necessarily a good family pet.
11:56Never.
11:57Nope.
11:58And, you know, this is someone who loves the animal, loves the species.
12:01In fact, my favorite animal, and I get asked this a lot, it's not a dog, it's a cheetah.
12:05So if I could own a big cat, it'd be great.
12:07But like for most who own tigers in the U.S., it's a novelty.
12:11They shouldn't own them.
12:12You know, they don't deserve that privilege of ownership with these animals.
12:16I don't think it's thought through in a lot of cases.
12:18No.
12:19No, even with my experience, my expertise, 20 years as a vet, I would not own a tiger.
12:25There are an estimated 10,000 big cats living in captivity in the United States.
12:30The majority are privately owned.
12:32And in many jurisdictions, people can keep a big cat on the property without reporting
12:37it to local officials or even to their neighbors.
12:42People think, you have a tiger, what if it gets out?
12:44Well, the fact is, especially with tigers, or any big cat, if they've gotten out, nothing's
12:51happened.
12:53There's no record of any big cat attacking, much less killing, anybody off the property.
12:59It's always on the property, on their territory.
13:02More of a case of you, as a person not used to being around tigers, would not know how
13:16to react properly if a tiger charged at you.
13:22Versus me, as I know what to do, you know, I can break it off in two seconds.
13:26You will turn and run, and all of a sudden, you have a tiger crawling up your back.
13:32Animal attacks often occur when people react in a way that the animal doesn't understand
13:37or simply hasn't seen before.
13:39Like with the wolves, part of their greeting is mouthing.
13:43And they'll just come up, you know, put their mouth on your arm, they're not biting down
13:47or anything.
13:48But if it was anybody else that doesn't know that, they'll yank their arm away, and all
13:52of a sudden, they got mauled by a wolf, and the wolf had no intention of doing that.
13:59Animals put in unfamiliar situations are often more afraid of humans than we are of them.
14:04And that's when an encounter can become deadly.
14:07In other cases, owners are teaching their pets bad habits.
14:11And a lot of it comes from not knowing what they're doing.
14:15And some people just do the wrong things in raising them.
14:20I remember seeing one video of one guy that used to play tug-of-war with his tiger at
14:27feeding time, you know, play tug-of-war.
14:29Well, his daughter ended up putting her arm in the enclosure, and the tiger did what it
14:35was trained to do, play tug-of-war.
14:40It's instances like that where, you know, the injuries and deaths come along.
14:44And the people being injured are the handlers, owners, or people in and around the big cats.
14:50And it's very simple.
14:51It's sort of like, if you don't want to die by skydiving, don't go skydiving.
14:55If you don't want to be injured by a big cat, don't go where the big cats are.
15:00So just why are Scott and Susanna willing to go where the big cats are?
15:05For the love of the animal.
15:06There's nothing like it when they come up and seek a reassurance from you.
15:10Something makes it nervous.
15:11It's like, is it okay?
15:12Yeah, yes, it's okay.
15:13Yeah, you can go do it.
15:15About 95% of what I do it for is for the animal, whichever animal it may be.
15:23Some animals are more affectionate to others.
15:25You build a strong relationship with certain ones.
15:28The ones you raise from three weeks old, or the one you get four months old, it's just
15:34how the relationship develops.
15:43Australia is made up of two-thirds of desert.
15:54It's a harsh place for any animal to survive.
15:59This one has adapted perfectly to its environment.
16:06The dingo is a carnivore that was introduced from Asia around 5,000 years ago.
16:13And it has thrived in Australia ever since.
16:17A subspecies of the wolf, they can be seen as a pest by farmers and are known to kill
16:25livestock.
16:26But can they be a good pet?
16:30Dave Graham recognizes the dangers, but has chosen one as his companion.
16:36While it's rare to see a pure white dingo, what makes this one even more unusual is that
16:41the owner has fallen in love with her.
16:45Do I consider Alice a pet or a best mate?
16:49I think she's like my girlfriend.
16:52I can't be without her, and I don't think she can be without me.
16:55She owes me, she controls me, she's, oh my God.
17:00We have some arguments, but she always wins.
17:03And she runs the household, she runs everything that we do.
17:08Dave is a farmer and a qualified animal behaviorist from Queensland.
17:13And from his experience working with dogs, he totally understands the genetic makeup
17:18of the dingo.
17:19A dingo is, quite literally, a dog that has gone back into a wolf-like state.
17:26When they first came to Australia, they went straight back into the bush and have become
17:30that wolf-like creature with the five elements that all the dogs that we now have have been
17:35bred out from.
17:36Dingoes have everything.
17:37They track, that's sniffing out their prey, they stalk their prey, which is where we've
17:42now got all of our herding breeds come from, they chase down their prey, which of course
17:47is our hunting dogs that we now have, they consume, rip apart their prey, and then of
17:52course they also have that social aspect.
17:54They do work together, they really do work in packs.
17:58Using their paws, using their teeth, really rip anything apart, and they can get right
18:04inside, get the exact part of the animal that they want to eat, with the amazing dexterity
18:09that these guys have.
18:13Farmers have blamed dingoes for causing large amounts of damage to livestock.
18:19As a farmer, Dave has witnessed some of the damage done to his sheep by wild dogs.
18:25When you grow up in the outback on the inside of the dingo fence, you have a difficult relationship
18:32with wild dogs, so my entire life I've always seen wild dogs as an enemy, because I've seen
18:40the damage that they've done on our livestock, on my sheep.
18:43There were some nights that they would come in and take out 90 odd sheep, but not kill
18:49them, just rip them apart, and my job of course was to come through and put them down in a
18:55humane way, and that was always difficult for me, to appreciate the beauty of the dingo
19:01in the bush, but also the damage that they can bring to our farms.
19:06The dingo fence, the world's longest fence, originally built in the 1880s as a rabbit-proof
19:12fence, was converted in the 1940s into a dog barrier to protect sheep and cattle from dingoes.
19:20Over 5,000 kilometers long, and spread across three states, it has been partly successful
19:26in stopping dingoes from crossing the border and killing livestock.
19:31The dingoes it managed to get through were often shot by farmers, as they were considered
19:35pests, so how does anyone consider this a safe pet?
19:42It's been a long journey for me to appreciate how beautiful and how valuable dingoes are
19:46to our bush, but I'm under absolutely no delusion whatsoever that wild dogs and vulnerable animals
19:57mean lots of blood.
20:03There is a contradiction. In his farming life, Dave had to destroy wild dogs that were killing
20:08his livestock. Alice was the one dingo that stole his heart.
20:15Alice was found about three and a half years ago. I was on the inside of the dingo fence
20:20in the outback of New South Wales, where wild dogs are exterminated. A farmer came across
20:27a litter of pups in a den, and as he was putting them all down, after he'd already put the
20:33mother down, of course, one of these off-siders, who was a contractor from the city, said,
20:38no, I really want to keep the white one. So he did, and took it back to the city, and
20:42learned very, very quickly that dingoes are not dogs. You have to be extraordinarily skilled,
20:47and you have to have extreme management plans, and also very, very, very good fences to be
20:53able to keep a dingo in, because they are wanderers, and they don't require human interaction.
20:59And that's what allows these relationships to flourish.
21:04In a well-managed situation, it is possible to have an incredible relationship with a
21:09dingo, as Dave has with Alice, together with an appreciation of the role of the dingo in
21:15the ecology of Australia.
21:17Look, she has 100% trust with me. Yeah, our whole relationship is built on mutual trust.
21:23She knows I won't drop her or hurt her, but it's her favourite thing. Hold her upside
21:29down, and she's happy. She'll be there for hours. But just loves it. But all dingoes
21:36love it. Anyone that has a dingo, that's what you do. You hold them upside down, and then
21:41they're happy.
21:47Mark, from the Armadale Reptile Centre, looks after two dingoes, Kai and Jay, who were both
21:55previously kept as pets. When the owners discovered how much maintenance was required to keep
22:01them, Mark agreed to take the dingoes into his care.
22:06This is a great problem with a lot of people with pets. They don't think about it first.
22:12They go by feelings, not by their head. You can't just buy them on a whim. They're not
22:18like pups. Pups will fit in. They're very, very forgiving. Dingoes aren't really forgiving.
22:30Mark has had to work with the dingoes to gain acceptance from them. In particular, the older
22:35dingo, Kai, who is the alpha male, took longer to accept him.
22:40I've had Kai growl at me to start off with. Eventually, he accepted me, but I couldn't
22:46go near Kai. Jay was fine. He was younger, though. He was a little pup. That's the way
22:52he acted. But the other one backed off, and he growled a little. And when they growl,
22:57you stand back.
22:59Unless they're humanized, they'll keep away from people. But in areas like Fraser
23:04Island, where people feed them, they get used to it. And if you don't feed them, they'll
23:10attack you.
23:18Fraser Island is a heritage area situated off the coast of Queensland.
23:23Fraser Island is a heritage area situated off the coast of Queensland, which has a population
23:28of protected dingoes. The public are given guidelines to be dingo safe while on the island
23:34for very good reason. There have been many cases of people being bitten by dingoes on
23:40Fraser Island, including a nine-year-old boy who was fatally attacked in 2001.
23:47Look, what I try and do with Alice is educate people that you need to be respectful of any
23:52wild animal in its environment. It's king. And you have to respect it. Don't go near
23:58them. Don't feed them. Don't do anything except for appreciate that they are doing
24:03their job by existing in the bush as Australia's apex predator.
24:07When you start to feed a wild animal, it's going to start to lose the fear. And then
24:11as soon as it loses fear, well, then it's going to look for food when you're not supplying
24:15it, and you may come into conflict.
24:21Alice is an albino dingo, and it must be remembered that at her core, she is a pure blood. And
24:27there is always a risk that the wolf within could come to the fore, something that Dave
24:33never forgets when he takes her into the public domain.
24:36They are predators. There's no two ways about it. They develop their wild instincts as well.
24:42One of the ways they show their being alpha is height. They like to get up above you,
24:49looking down on you. You notice that our fences are six foot high, and they angle back into
24:55the enclosure. That's so they can't climb out, because they can climb a six-foot fence.
25:00They're a wolf. Anything that gets in their enclosure is food. It doesn't matter what
25:04it is. A rat runs through or something like that, they'll eat it. A bird flies low, they'll
25:10catch it. A young child could upset one and it could snap, and they do have very powerful
25:15jaws. They'll kill very quickly, and you can't stop that.
25:31While attacks on humans are relatively uncommon, one of the most well-known dingo attacks occurred
25:38in 1980 near Uluru, Central Australia. Lindy Chamberlain, mother of nine-week-old baby
25:45girl Azaria, was convicted of her murder. The Chamberlains maintained their baby was
25:51taken from their tent by a dingo, and in 1986, following the discovery of Azaria's jacket
25:58near a dingo lair, Lindy Chamberlain was immediately released from prison.
26:05In 2012, following years of speculation and inquiries, the coroner concluded that the
26:11cause of Azaria's death was as a result of being attacked and taken by a dingo.
26:17When you ask people, instantly they think of Lindy Chamberlain, the terrible death of
26:21her daughter by the jaws of a dingo. So that's prevalent in people's minds, but I think we
26:26do have a love affair with dingoes, because they're just so strange, so distant, and so
26:32rare. I mean, you would be hard-pressed to find too many Australians that have seen a
26:37real dingo in the wild, because they naturally just blend in to the environment. That's the
26:43job, and that's why for hundreds of years of white settlement, and of course the thousands
26:47of years that they've been here during Aboriginal settlement, they have just inserted themselves
26:52into the ecology. But at the same time, these guys are using those jaws every single day
27:00to get through life, and when you need to eat to survive, it brings you up against humans,
27:06because we're growing animals out there, sheep, cattle, goats, pigs, and of course these guys
27:12are hunting in that same territory, so we do really have a love-hate relationship in Australia.
27:18Alice has a natural tendency to investigate her surroundings, a trait that's typical of a dingo.
27:26She uses her highly-tuned senses to great effect around the house.
27:32One of the things that makes dingoes different from dogs is that dingoes love to climb.
27:38They're up on top of everything, into everything, it doesn't matter how small the surface is.
27:44They need to check it out thoroughly, and know what's going on in their environment.
27:51Yeah, she loves getting up on top of things, but it's really this super investigation,
27:56and this crazy brain that just needs to know exactly what's going on.
28:01They always look like they're chilled, but I think it's because, well, they've got a lot to think about
28:06that they've just investigated, and they're just going through all their different TV shows
28:10that they've got inside their head of all the different adventures they've been on.
28:15One could be easily mistaken, after seeing Alice's relationship with Dave,
28:19that dingoes make an ideal pet.
28:22The reality is that Alice is a wild animal, and by her very nature, is a predator.
28:33I love my dingo, but they do not make good pets.
28:37They're a wild animal that belongs in the wild, it's just that, at the moment, I belong to Alice.
28:43They don't bark, which seems great, but they do everything else that could possibly drive you crazy.
28:49They shed continuously, everything gets covered in dingo hair.
28:54They get into everything, and of course, trying to contain them is almost impossible,
28:59but at the end of the day, they don't need us.
29:01They don't need to be looked after, and when you've got several hundred breeds of dog to choose from,
29:06I'd stick with dogs.
29:09It's clear that dingoes are a high-maintenance animal,
29:12and anyone who tries to domesticate one will have limited success.
29:17Dave, who has a license to keep Alice, has worked with dingoes for many years,
29:22and knows what's involved to keep Alice under control for her own safety, and the safety of others.
29:29It doesn't matter where I am, Alice will always be tethered to me, or tethered to one of my domestic dogs.
29:35It's just a case of, if she feels that she needs to run off on a trail,
29:39she will run off on a trail after a rabbit, or after a rat, and she's gone.
29:44So, I've got to make sure that she is absolutely safe at all times.
29:49At the end of the day, she is magnificent.
29:52She is magnificent. She is an incredible, loving, adorable friend.
29:57She's just so sweet, but you've got to always remember, she's a wild animal.
30:04And not that she could turn in any second, not that she's unpredictable, but she is predictable.
30:09She will fight to survive, and that's what they've been doing in this country for 5,000 to 8,000 years.
30:16So, it's not that I don't trust her, it's that I do trust her that one day she could bite,
30:21and could really do some serious damage.
30:2868% of American households own at least one pet,
30:32and many are choosing to own animals that could be considered exotic.
30:36The legal definition is subject to local jurisdiction,
30:39but generally an exotic pet is one that is rare, unusual, or a wild animal,
30:45not typically kept by humans.
30:47Often, that's because those animals can be deadly.
30:52It's better to be bitten by an angry snake than a hungry snake,
30:55because a hungry snake won't let go for a while.
30:58But they're very popular and should not be kept around small children,
31:05because the small children are edible.
31:09More than 20 years ago, Ken Foose opened a reptile and exotic specialty store.
31:14And it's the type of store that is getting harder to find in the U.S.
31:18The animals he sells range from those that can just give you a nasty bite
31:23to those that can kill in a matter of minutes.
31:27This is our second largest selling animal.
31:31You would think I'd be in a reptile store.
31:33It would be all reptiles, but this is a pygmy hedgehog.
31:37They're very popular, we sell hundreds of these,
31:40and I wouldn't own one if you gave it to me.
31:44But we sell a lot of them.
31:46It's basically an animated rock.
31:48Regulations around owning exotic pets are different in every state of the U.S.
31:53In Nevada, pretty much anything goes.
31:56There's not a lot that we can't have.
31:59I mean, I can have a tiger in here for sale.
32:03Why would I?
32:04I'm not qualified to own a tiger.
32:07Most of the people I know are not qualified to own a tiger.
32:10It's the same thing with primates.
32:11We can sell monkeys here.
32:12We can sell chimpanzees.
32:14We can sell anything we want.
32:16But 99% of the people on this planet are not qualified to own a monkey.
32:21Period.
32:22And I sold monkeys for five years,
32:26and I just got tired of looking for that 1%.
32:30Foose's biggest selling pet may not look frightening,
32:33but as a carnivore, it certainly can bite.
32:37It can also be dangerous to the environment,
32:39and that's why it's illegal to own one across the border in California.
32:44You can own a snake, a tiger, or even a bear,
32:47but you can't own a ferret.
32:51Many of Ken's customers are committing an offense
32:54when taking their new furry pets across the state line from Nevada.
32:59But Ken is very careful that he doesn't break the law
33:02when selling animals, including ferrets.
33:05He even plays a role in lobbying government
33:08to ensure that regulations surrounding the keeping of exotic and dangerous pets
33:12are relevant for both animals and owners.
33:17My biggest concern with keeping dangerous reptiles and amphibians,
33:23I'm talking about rattlesnakes, large constrictors like him,
33:28or something that is potentially life-threatening.
33:34If someone comes in here and buys a rattlesnake from me,
33:37I, of course, quiz them.
33:39How are you doing this? Where do you live?
33:41I ask them where you live because in the county,
33:44they're not going to let you have one.
33:46In the city of Las Vegas, you're required to have a permit,
33:49and I wrote the regulations for the permit.
33:52If you live down the street,
33:54and you said you were qualified to keep a rattlesnake,
33:57I'll sell it to you.
34:00And if you die, or your wife dies, or your kids die,
34:04or your dog dies because of the snake,
34:07I don't care.
34:09Your choice, I don't care.
34:12If the three-year-old girl living three doors down in her backyard
34:16gets bit by the snake because it escaped from your house,
34:20that I care about.
34:22And the reason is, people die from hamster bites.
34:25People die from all kinds of animals.
34:28And when you accept the risk that comes with owning an exotic animal,
34:32you've accepted the risk.
34:34Animal ownership laws and regulations are constantly changing,
34:38and Ken's whole team are passionate about supporting animal owners' rights.
34:43They went from, we were able to keep any size snake, really,
34:47to, okay, well, now you can keep a snake that's typically under 12 feet,
34:50but you need to have this permit and this,
34:52and the permit's the same as where you would own a sloth,
34:55or a hide buddy, or anything bigger that requires bigger space.
35:00I have to sit there and notify every one of my neighbors.
35:02I have to measure from my front door to the edge of my street,
35:05from the back door to the edge of the street, the back door to my fence line.
35:08It's just government overreach,
35:10wanting to know everything that you keep in your house and why you're keeping it.
35:13And it's something that we fight for.
35:15I mean, all of us that are passionate fight for it and come together
35:18and try to make sure that those laws don't pass.
35:22Staff member Georgia has 48 reptiles,
35:25including several ball pythons, a reticulated python,
35:29a couple of boas, some iguanas, some red-footed tortoises,
35:33a water monitor, and that's not all.
35:36Nine ferrets, the genet, five dogs, three cats, and a bunch of rats.
35:45Like many exotic pet owners,
35:47Georgia's life would be turned upside down by more restrictive animal laws.
35:52I think I would do my best to move because I wouldn't want to give up.
35:56That's, like, my thing.
35:58You know, I love them all, so I wouldn't. I would leave.
36:03As fun as ferrets may be,
36:05they'd be easy prey for many of the other animals in Ken Foose's store,
36:09though Nevada has strict ideas about which snakes locals are allowed to keep as pets.
36:15Only venomous snakes native to Nevada and rear-fanged snakes
36:19are allowed to be kept in the state.
36:22There are two types of venomous snake.
36:24Those that inject venom through fangs in the front of their mouths,
36:28like rattlesnakes or cobras,
36:30and those with fangs at the back of their mouths.
36:33They chew the venom into their prey,
36:36and then there are the snakes that can literally squeeze the life out of you.
36:41All right.
36:46Hey, Ken, what are you pulling out here?
36:49This is a tiger reticulated python.
36:53It's about 15 feet long.
36:56Here, Gads, grab the other end of this one.
36:58My back won't handle this.
37:00They do very well in captivity.
37:02Like I said, the only real downside to them is they get too big.
37:06If a snake like this bites you, you're going to know it.
37:11And you'll bleed.
37:13They're not deadly.
37:15They won't kill you.
37:17But they'll hurt you a little bit.
37:20And snakes aren't the only creatures in store for the venomous bite.
37:25This is a beaded lizard.
37:27They come from Mexico and Central America.
37:31They are venomous.
37:36They've got these venom glands in their lower jaw.
37:42And they don't have fangs, but they have very, very sharp, jagged teeth.
37:46They're actually really easy to keep, and they're generally pretty mellow.
37:50But it's also the excitement.
37:51You've got a beaded lizard.
37:54There's something romantic about having one.
37:57Beaded lizards can grow to three and a half feet long
38:01and are related to the gila monster.
38:03They're the only two venomous lizards in the world
38:06and can deliver an extremely painful bite.
38:09They just tend not to let go.
38:12They will hang on to you forever.
38:15There is no anti-venom for this.
38:18They won't kill you.
38:20Years ago, we had someone break into one of the cages
38:24and stole one of our beaded lizards.
38:28And it was a baby.
38:29It was about four inches long.
38:32And he put it in his pocket.
38:35As he reached into the cage to grab it, he got bit.
38:39And then when he put it in his pocket, he got bit again
38:43and ended up going to the hospital.
38:46So he recovered. He made a full recovery
38:48and, in fact, came into the store about a year later
38:51and stole something else from us.
38:53But we caught him that time.
38:55But they're very, very cool, and people like them because they're a novelty.
38:58They're different. They're not lethal.
39:01It's not an animal that can kill you.
39:02It's almost like the throat, same thing.
39:04There's a lot of people that keep rattlesnakes and cobras and things like that.
39:08And I think it's just the novelty of it.
39:10People that just really like venomous reptiles.
39:13I can understand it. I don't own any myself, but I used to.
39:18And there's kind of a thrill there, and they're very, very neat.
39:21And it's not just venomous reptiles that people consider exciting pets.
39:26Arachnids, better known as scorpions and spiders,
39:29are also a popular, if not unusual, companion.
39:37Nothing elicits as much fear in so many as the spider.
39:41Yet, exotic pet staff member Gaz has been fascinated with them from a young age.
39:48I was about eight years old, and my first pet was two leopard gecko lizards.
39:53And then after that, it was a tarantula, a rose hare.
39:56Yeah, so they were my first kind of pets.
39:58And then my mom didn't like snakes, so I got a corn snake from a friend of mine,
40:02and I had to keep it hidden.
40:03I had it hidden for a year before my mom found out.
40:06The largest of the spiders, tarantulas, may appear deadly,
40:10but their venom won't kill you.
40:12That's not to say that their large fangs won't cause some damage
40:16or that their venom is completely harmless.
40:19You know, there's certain species of tarantulas that it's not recommended to handle,
40:23like some of the old world species, like the Pocletheria,
40:26you know, from like India, Sri Lanka, those areas.
40:32They've got a pretty potent venom.
40:34It's going to make you feel pretty rough for a few days if you get bitten by one of those.
40:40That's a Goliath birdie, and now they are very big, very big fangs, and very aggressive,
40:45so it's really not recommended to hold those guys.
40:49Large fangs and potent venom aren't a tarantula's only means of inflicting pain on their human owners.
40:55As a defense mechanism against larger predators,
40:59many species of tarantulas flick tiny hairs off their abdomen.
41:03These hairs can irritate the eyes, nose, and even the lungs.
41:09So, this is a new world species, so they've got these urticating hairs,
41:13which is their first line of defense is to flick these hairs,
41:16so they're a little bit docile, you know, so they're not prone to bite.
41:19Their first line of defense is to flick hairs, so I wonder if it'll do it.
41:22See how he's rubbing his back legs now against his abdomen?
41:25That flicks up these hairs, so he's a bit of a hair flicker, but usually this species is not too bad.
41:29Oh yeah, they've got fangs, and you know, they've got venom, just like all spiders.
41:34There are more than 1,700 different types of scorpion,
41:38though only about 20 of them have venom powerful enough to kill a person.
41:42The most dangerous scorpion, the Indian red, could kill you within 24 hours.
41:47Yeah, I mean, just a few weeks ago I was stung by an emperor and an agent.
41:51I was, you know, I was just being foolish, you know.
41:54But yeah, they're actually a really easy going.
41:57Don't threaten them, and they do pretty good.
41:59I mean, the thing with these, you want to be more worried about their pinch than the sting.
42:03Their pinch is really hard, they don't let go.
42:05They'll make you bleed.
42:06Yeah, they'll make you bleed, man, it's real hard.
42:08Yeah, they'll make you bleed, man, it's real hard.
42:10But their sting, like I said, I got stung by them.
42:12Once again, it was like a wasp sting.
42:14You know, a little bit of irritation for about 30 minutes, and that's it.
42:18As long as you don't, because that's a big stinger, see, a stinger in there.
42:22It's like a nail going into your hand.
42:25And it's not just teeth and fangs you have to watch out for.
42:29Many of the animals Ken sells can hurt you in more than one way.
42:34There's a risk to anything.
42:36It's like I said before, it doesn't matter whether it's a hamster.
42:39There's always an inherent risk.
42:41Of course, we would tell people this is a rear-fanged snake, be careful.
42:45But beyond that, this is another animal that could never hurt you.
42:49The venom is not strong enough to do more than, like, localized swelling.
42:57The snakes, the animals that I have in here, quite frankly, that hurt you the most are things like these.
43:04Claws.
43:07It's the teeth and the jaws and the claws.
43:14These, these are not from snake bites.
43:17These are from these people's, these animals' toenails.
43:21Now these, the key thing here, there we go.
43:25The key thing with these things is you control the legs.
43:28That way you don't bleed.
43:29This is what I call tame.
43:33When they first came in, there was no way I could hold them like this.
43:35I would be bleeding all over the place.
43:38I've never seen one try to bite.
43:40But they rip you to pieces with these very sharp claws.
43:44So many of the animals in Ken's store have bites that can rip skin or inject venom or claws that can draw blood.
43:53Why would anyone want to own them?
43:57They're just such cool animals, you know.
43:59It's just, you know, I've always found them fascinating.
44:03From the tiniest of little like common house spiders, you know, it's just beautiful.
44:08They're just fascinating animals, man.
44:09I've always been fascinated by them.
44:11It's the thrill.
44:12It's why do people race cars or hang glide?
44:16It's everybody has their own adrenaline fix and that they've chosen.
44:23And this is, a lot of people, this is it.
44:25And for as long as there is a demand for exotic pets,
44:28Ken Foose and his team will continue to fight for the rights of animal owners to keep them.
44:34Not everyone should keep a lizard.
44:35Not everyone should keep a dog or a cat or even a mouse.
44:38Why would anyone have the big python or have this or have that?
44:43And I'm like, people jump out of perfectly good airplanes every day.
44:49Why?
44:50Are you going to ban skydiving?
44:51And there are a lot of these legislators say they're trying to protect us from ourselves.
44:57Well, if you're going to protect us from ourselves, ban smoking or ban drinking
45:04or ban skydiving or car racing or football.
45:08There's a lot of stuff we do to hurt ourselves and we do it on purpose.
45:13So it's, it makes absolutely no sense to ban skydiving.
45:18It makes absolutely no sense to ban something that's actually as benign as this.
45:48Ban.