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00:00impressed him and it's going to be a very interesting season for Bob Melvin. Now, I think
00:04let's suppose he's going to get a pass here, right? It's his first year on the job. He'll get
00:08the GM. He'll get somebody to work with him. The Sabian and Bochy dynamic is very fascinating to
00:14me. It's very fascinating to me. And that leads me to say this, Shaski, Bo Mel has to manage his
00:20ass off in 2025. He has to manage his ass off. Now, Bochy may not come back here. Who knows?
00:28But with one year left on his deal with Texas and Sabian's got one year left on the Yankees,
00:32and you called me yesterday and kind of brought this up. Boy, the dots are aligning here.
00:38Sabian's coming back. You know, he's coming back. Something.
00:42Bo Mel's going to be the guy that we focus on in 2025. There's no doubt about that.
00:46It's so interesting how we bestow, you know, and I'm not faulting anyone, John Shea or anyone else.
00:53Like, you know, this guy did great work over here and he did great work over there.
00:58It's so hard in these front offices in modern sports to know who's doing what.
01:02Like right now with the Warriors, we all think Mike Dunleavy's like the main guy,
01:06but we don't know how much of an influence Lakeup and other people in that building are to him.
01:14I don't know who that might be, whether it be Lakeup family or not, or just other people.
01:19I look at the 49ers, Martin Mayhew, Adam Peters, Ron Catharn. Am I pronouncing it?
01:26Ron.
01:27Ron Carton.
01:28Ron Carton. Thank you. Sorry. I knew I messed that up. I mean, how many people?
01:32Who would it award this year?
01:33Yeah, that's fine. How many people have been plucked from the Niners front office?
01:37Plenty.
01:38I think they had a pretty good draft.
01:40Yeah, I do too.
01:41You know, I mean, like, right. So it's very difficult to know who's doing what.
01:45And so like when you're the number two, like everybody gets credit when you're succeeding.
01:51When you're not the number one guy, it all falls down on your shoulders.
01:54And some people are great number twos and not number ones, which brings me right to the Tony
02:00Soprano line, which where Silvio says to him, like, you know, like all due respect.
02:05And he starts criticizing some of his tactics as as the main guy.
02:09And Tony says to him, I pulled up the quote right here.
02:12All due respect, you got no blanking idea what it's like to be number one.
02:16Every decision you make affects every facet of every blanking thing.
02:20It's too much to deal with almost.
02:22And in the end, you're completely alone with it all.
02:25Yep.
02:26Meaning some people are great coordinators and not great head coaches.
02:30No doubt.
02:30Some people are great number twos and not number ones.
02:32It's just it's true.
02:34Yep.
02:34Yep.
02:35No, it's so true.
02:36It's very true.
02:38So where would he go from here?
02:40Like, where do we go from here?
02:43I can't wait to see what type of free agents they try to attract.
02:46The winter meetings coming out, wherever the winter meetings are this year.
02:49How's that going to play out?
02:50Who's the GM going to be?
02:53Now, getting rid of Farhan, I think is, you know, I think everybody's refreshed from it.
02:56As John Shay opened up when we had we first brought him on, he said,
03:00well, there's nothing but smiles in that room.
03:02Nothing but positive energy.
03:03Loveman, you were down there yesterday.
03:05Did you agree with him?
03:06Because he started off and said the story yesterday was buster.
03:08And I'm like, OK, I think that's part of the story.
03:11It's part of the story.
03:12I still wanted more on Farhan.
03:13I'm with you.
03:14I'm not ready to turn the page yet.
03:15I'm with you.
03:16I'm ready to turn the page on him not being the president of baseball operations.
03:20But there's going to be some more pieces out there that discusses the Farhan tenure.
03:25One thing and what happened.
03:26And real quick, again, I bring back as we have the King's Tale of Media Day.
03:31I ran into somebody.
03:31I had no idea they worked with the Giants.
03:33No idea.
03:34But this is something we discussed over and over over the last three years.
03:39Bob Myers in the office of John Lynch.
03:41He speaks to everybody, shakes everybody hand.
03:42Remember, Shanahan got hired to add everybody out there.
03:46Multiple people, multiple people have told me
03:49Farhan walks in a room.
03:50He looks angry, doesn't say anything to anybody, doesn't speak or anything.
03:54It doesn't even have eye contact.
03:55It's really strange.
03:57Why would you want that type of you don't want people walking on eggshells around you?
04:00Well, if you're going to be that way, you better be Bill Belichick.
04:02You better be good.
04:03You better be good.
04:04You better be Belichick.
04:05Right.
04:05But like Chip Kelly, the Eagles players talk about it with Chip Kelly.
04:08No question.
04:09It's like, dude, who are you, Chip?
04:11What's going on here?
04:12So when you lose like here's the other thing, like I do want to know from people,
04:17how are you going to remember the Farhan era?
04:18Because we've got all offseason to digest Posey.
04:21And we're going to be able to critique and rehash all of the strategies, everything.
04:26But I'm just going to ask you, like, because I have a thought and I want to get it out there.
04:31How are you going to remember the Farhan era?
04:34Me?
04:35Gosh, how am I going to remember?
04:36Will it change over time?
04:38Could it change over time?
04:40Yeah, underwhelming.
04:42I would say underwhelming.
04:43All right.
04:44And I'll use that word.
04:45And platooning is a word that comes to mind, right?
04:50Not sticking to the script.
04:52Grievances, which we discussed yesterday.
04:55Players not being all in.
04:57There was just so much noise around the Farhan Zaidi era.
05:00And think back to when the Giants hired him.
05:03It's like, oh, man, this guy is.
05:05Oh, my gosh.
05:06He built the Dodgers, not Andrew Friedman.
05:08He was the mastermind.
05:10He was the straw that stirred the drink.
05:13And he comes here and it's like, I don't know if this guy is ready for this job.
05:17And it's quite obvious early on that maybe he wasn't quite ready for the job.
05:20Now, 2021 ended up being a fluke.
05:23Let's just call it what it is.
05:242021 was an outlier.
05:26It was an exception to the Farhan Zaidi era.
05:29They won a lot of good games.
05:30Don't forget, they went 32 and 6 against Colorado, Arizona that year.
05:33So they took care to beat the bad teams that season.
05:36And they won some dramatic games, no doubt about it.
05:40But that was that.
05:41They were mediocre and they didn't.
05:43And Posey used the word identity.
05:45And maybe you could sum that up with the Farhan Zaidi.
05:47I know I'm all over the place here because there's so many words that's popping in my
05:50brain right now.
05:51But maybe identity.
05:53Maybe that's the one.
05:54Farhan failed to build an identity for the San Francisco Giants.
05:58We just never knew who they were.
06:00What type of team are you?
06:01Are you athletic?
06:01Are you running bases?
06:02Are you hitting on runs?
06:03Are you pitching or rotation?
06:05What are we?
06:06Well, what they were was extremely stubborn.
06:11I think he did a lot of good things.
06:14Now, the overarching, you didn't win enough is ultimately why he's not here.
06:19I would point at the drafting and the developing and the identifying and the lack of willing
06:25to risk a big, bold move.
06:28But the stubbornness for me is what did it in.
06:30You told me on the front end, we are going to be cutting edge.
06:34We are going to be evolutionary when it comes to the thinking.
06:37Think about the rules that have happened.
06:39They shift.
06:41The shift band is in place.
06:43You can't shift.
06:45The pitch clock, the three throws over to first base, three batter minimum, right?
06:50The bases are larger.
06:53Name one element of all those rule changes where they got better at over time.
06:57They didn't.
06:58They were stubborn.
06:59They were stuck in their ways, right?
07:01They were stuck in their ways.
07:02And so to me, their unwillingness to evolve on the fly and acknowledge some of their limitations
07:09did them in.
07:10And straight up, this is again, Buster said it.
07:13I'll say it.
07:14It's pretty simple.
07:15We talk about football.
07:16Hey, guys, it's about blocking and tackling.
07:19And that's a funny thing we say.
07:21But think about it.
07:21Like partly why the Niners didn't win the Super Bowl.
07:24They didn't block well.
07:25They didn't block well.
07:26Execution.
07:27Right?
07:28And I look at baseball.
07:28It's very simple.
07:29Throw strikes, catch the ball.
07:31Put the ball in play.
07:32Those three things.
07:33They didn't do those.
07:35They didn't throw strikes.
07:37They didn't play catch.
07:38They were dead last in errors almost every single year.
07:41It's bad baseball.
07:42I mean, really bad baseball.
07:43And so like those things you could tell me about someone's Babbitt and their WRC Plus
07:49and all these stupid analytic things.
07:52Does your team play catch?
07:54No, they didn't.
07:55They didn't play.
07:56Will Posey say, we're going to play clean, crisp baseball, which basically tells you
08:00that they haven't played clean, crisp baseball.
08:04So the Forhans-Ide era, man, it's something that.
08:07Now, did he set the Giants back?
08:08I do want to give him credit.
08:10I know the farm rankings are one thing, but this Bryce Eldridge kid, one player could
08:15turn the whole farm around.
08:16And if Bryce Eldridge pops, if he becomes a player that a lot of people think he could
08:21be, then you know what?
08:22Thank you, Forhans-Ide.
08:24Because now you got a first baseman for the next 10 years because he looks like the real
08:27deal.
08:27And you got Matt Chapman.
08:29So your corners are, your corners are fine.
08:31Well, Chapman, they brought Chapman in on the one-year deal.
08:36Posey got the Chapman deal done, though.
08:38No, no.
08:39It's obvious.
08:40Yeah, I mean, it's obvious.
08:42But I will give him credit for that.
08:44Because Posey did mention like, yeah, if you want to listen to Scott Boris, he'll tell
08:47you everything that happened.
08:48How great was that?
08:49How good was that?
08:49That was great.
08:50How good was that?
08:51If you want to listen, hey, just read Slusser's piece about Scott Boris.
08:54He'll tell you everything that happened.
08:55That was a shot at Boris.
08:57It was.
08:58I'm going to be interested to see how Boris operates with the Giants moving forward.
09:02It's going to be very interesting.
09:03Well, you have to be careful with Scott Boris because as much as you might hate him, you
09:07are going to have to do business with him at some point.
09:08No doubt.
09:09No doubt.
09:10So it's a fine line to walk.
09:11It's a fine line.
09:12No doubt.
09:12But he was basically saying, like, I got this deal done.
09:14That's what I took out of it.
09:16In fact, he was right on that.
09:17He said, I was listening to various things, and he said that I called up Matt directly
09:24and I said, hey, do you want to be here?
09:26Because we want you here.
09:27And we were really close on the contract, but it was going to probably go off into the
09:30offseason.
09:31And I knew we were going to fall far behind.
09:34And instead of going.
09:34And that's where, see, that is the key.
09:36That's where a guy like Posey with his stature can sit down and say, Chapman, come on, man.
09:41I like the way you play.
09:42You want to be here.
09:43I know you want to get every top dollar.
09:44We'll figure the money part out.
09:46Can we agree?
09:47Can we get down?
09:48And that's, you know what that was?
09:49That's the equivalent.
09:51Jerry West calling Kevin Durant.
09:53I've been waiting to say it.
09:54It's Jerry West basically saying, look, these guys have been champions.
09:58You play the best basketball of your career.
10:00It's all about these rings.
10:01It's Shaquille O'Neal telling the story where the lights go on and forth.
10:05Dude, dude, dude.
10:06Hey, you could do all the movies or whatever, but you see these rings and these trophies.
10:11You want one of these?
10:12Come be a Laker.
10:14And it just means more.
10:15And I agree.
10:15It means more.
10:16Chapman was on the other side of the bay.
10:17Yeah.
10:18He saw he knows about the deal.
10:19You live this.
10:20He lives in San Francisco for crying out loud.
10:22Knowing what, you know, now does a small party.
10:25You think that the Bob Melvin thing should have like we should have known like it was
10:31about a year.
10:32Farhan was basically grooming Buster.
10:34Like, I don't buy the Buster.
10:35No, I don't.
10:36Came up with it this summer.
10:37I think that he's had an open invitation from Greg Johnson for multiple years.
10:41And it was come here, you know, search out the culture of what we got here.
10:46Figure out what job you want to do.
10:47And it's yours.
10:48Listen, and no, I'm with you on that real quick.
10:50Let me address the text.
10:52I don't have to do this, but I would do it anyway.
10:54I get it.
10:54Farhan's raw meat right now.
10:56He's going to fill up a lot of airtime, but you're making it personal.
10:59Even after bringing in John Shay, who said Farhan's a good guy.
11:02I liked him.
11:03It's not personal.
11:03We're critiquing his his execution as a president of baseball operations.
11:10Farhan may be a great guy.
11:11I wish I got to know more like the fact that he brought up the bear.
11:15It's like, all right, that's what I want.
11:16I want to hear you talking about something.
11:17Fantasy football.
11:18I was dying to talk to Farhan about fantasy football.
11:21I'm a fantasy football geek.
11:23Family man.
11:23Seems like a good.
11:24But I never got to know Farhan.
11:26I got to know Farhan, the baseball man.
11:28And the baseball man just wasn't good enough at his job here in San Francisco.
11:32So to your point about Posey coming here and he said, hey, there's no doubt.
11:36He said it's just like John Lynch in Denver.
11:39He's sitting there after his playing days and he's in a war room with John Elway.
11:42And he's at the combine with the Denver Broncos brass taking notes, seeing how to scout,
11:47learning the game in and out, learning how to make connections.
11:50That's basically what Buster has been doing behind the scenes.
11:52There's no doubt about it.
11:54He's been a little more visible around the yard, out and about.
11:57We just inducted him to the Bay Area Sports Hall of Fame.
12:00Then all of a sudden, oh, you're moving back to the Bay Area.
12:02There's no doubt he's been taking notes over the last season.
12:05And Greg Johnson, matter of fact, it's time for Sam Ludman.
12:08Ludman, I want you to set this up because I believe you asked Greg Johnson.
12:11I know he's on the phone right now, but I believe you asked Greg Johnson about that.
12:14And Greg kind of slipped up saying, yeah, I kind of wanted this for a while.
12:18Wait, so did it come up over the last month or has Greg Johnson been plotting this for
12:23quite some time?
12:24I want to know more about Greg Johnson.
12:26Because you know why?
12:27There's just so much more I want to know.
12:29Tim Kawakami sat down with Greg Johnson mid-Odyssey.
12:31I keep referring to this podcast.
12:33Remember, he asked him about Farhan's.
12:35Yeah, I don't know why Farhan hasn't signed.
12:38I don't know why he hasn't signed a deal yet.
12:40It's there.
12:40I don't know.
12:41He said he'll get back to it.
12:42I never believed that.
12:44No.
12:44One thing that I think about that.
12:46I think about that.
12:47Contracts lingering.
12:48You're like, I'm not going to sign it.
12:49No, you're out of there.
12:51Like, we were pretty critical of him.
12:53I'm not expecting everyone to want to come on and do, you know, media with us.
12:56Like, I get it.
12:57Trust me, I do.
12:58I really do.
12:59But how many times did we say, hey, we would love to have him on behind the scenes?
13:03And look, I probably I'm going to be fair here.
13:06I probably wouldn't want to come on with us if I was him either.
13:09But I also see an opportunity, right?
13:11And if I can win you guys over, you and I have talked about this.
13:14It's really hard to critique someone who you meet and shake hands with.
13:18It just is.
13:18I don't care who you are.
13:20It's much more easy to criticize someone on the Internet and from afar when you don't
13:25have to walk into the locker room and see them every day.
13:28I'll be the first to admit that.
13:30And I wanted him to come in because I had questions that I wanted to ask him.
13:33And you know what?
13:33I wanted to give him an opportunity, not just win me over.
13:36Who cares about me, but the fans.
13:37It would help this Q rating.
13:38Absolutely.
13:39I think it would help this Q rating.
13:40And I've experienced it about this.
13:42I'll never forget how I had to cut you off.
13:44But Javi Lopez told me as a young kid, as we tell can work King's tales.
13:48You could be critical of these players.
13:50No, I'm just trying to educate.
13:51I love it.
13:52I love to be constructive.
13:53Criticism is fine because I have to go to those locker rooms.
13:56I've been in that situation.
13:57Like, damn, I was just kind of ripping this guy earlier today.
13:59And but they respect it as long as you do it in a very professional way.
14:05And Farhan has to get that.
14:07He has to get that right.
14:09Well, I mean, you know, it just I don't know, man.
14:13I think I think it does go a long way to make yourself approachable.
14:17And I look at, like, whether it's Bob Myers, Dunleavy, John Lynch.
14:22We've had the opportunity to talk to all of those people.
14:24Right.
14:25Joe Lacob.
14:26They don't shy away from things.
14:27No, they don't.
14:28And if there's a tough question, I mean, remember when I had to ask?
14:31Well, I even said to Bob, Bob, I'm sorry to ask you this question.
14:34It was about the whole Draymond and Jordan pool thing.
14:36He's like, hey, look, it's your job.
14:38I get it.
14:38And I'm not going to answer it because I want to keep certain things public.
14:42So I think you earn more bees with honey.
14:45That's just the way I view things in life.
14:47Loveman real quick.
14:48Go ahead.
14:49I want because you asked Greg Johnson about the Buster Posey.
14:51When did that become a thing?
14:54Yeah, so so really quick, just to set the stage.
14:56So after the press conference, you know, everyone leaves the stage.
14:59So Bob goes in one direction.
15:00Buster went in another.
15:02And then Greg went in the third direction.
15:03So I walked after Greg Johnson because I did want to ask him, you know, when?
15:07Why now?
15:08Why did you make the decision now to move off from Farhan to Buster?
15:12And he basically said, you know, it all kind of came together rather recently.
15:16But, you know, Buster was kind of ready to go.
15:18And that's what really accelerated it.
15:20And that's how they were able to come to the decision.
15:23We have the sound for this.
15:24We can play Greg's words.
15:25But he kind of, you know, downplayed the impact of the Matt Chapman deal having any sort of,
15:30you know, impact on whether or not they wanted to move off of Farhan for Buster.
15:35The thing that I thought was really interesting, Shasken, you kind of alluded to this.
15:39I do think Greg has kind of wanted this for quite a while because he said, you know,
15:43he joked with Buster that he'd wanted him for this job.
15:46And I asked Greg at the very end, you know, who approached who first on this?
15:50And Greg said he had been approaching Buster for a while,
15:53but this time Buster came to him on it.
15:55So very interesting how this all came together.
15:59I don't know when, unfortunately.
16:00He was walking away at this time.
16:02It's a while.
16:03Three months, four months, five months, a year.
16:06What's going on here?
16:07My theory, just my
16:10finger pointing.
16:11My theory is I think Greg wanted Farhan out last year when Gabe Kapler was fired
16:17because we always ask, you know, why move off Gabe but not Farhan?
16:21I think Greg did want Buster in last year instead of Farhan.
16:25But Buster did not want the job at the time for whatever reason.
16:29He cited several times talking to his wife about taking this job.
16:33So my guess is Buster wasn't quite ready to take it last year.
16:37I think if he wanted it last year, we would have had Buster Posey taking over.
16:41That's just my theory.
16:44I'm with you because Greg Johnson, again, on the Tim Kavakami podcast this past season,
16:48midway through the year, and he was feeling good.
16:49He jumps on the podcast and he said, well, yeah, Farhan hasn't signed anything yet.
16:54I don't know what the deal is.
16:55I told him it's right there.
16:56And he's just like, yeah, I'll get back to it.
16:58What?
16:59Huh?
17:01Long term security?
17:02Running a baseball team?
17:02He may not get another shot.
17:04I thought Greg was very boring.
17:06The last couple of months, I'm flipping my opinion.
17:10I want to know more about him.
17:12I do too.
17:13Dave Fleming coming up here in just a second at 9.20 on a River Islands guest line.
17:18We'll talk to Fleming about the move.
17:20It starts on Buster Posey running it.
17:22And he'll be on the call for Miami and Cal Saturday night.
17:27Fleming's going to wear a split cap.
17:29Miami and Cal.
17:30He's already got it.
17:31He's already got it.
17:32Though, if that was a split cap, though, Cal, Miami, it would be hard not to get it.
17:36Fuck.
17:40By the way, Michael Irvin, did you see the video on him getting fired up down in Miami?
17:43Oh, my gosh.
17:44All right, Fleming.