London Mayor Sadiq Khan sits down with London Standard Editor Dylan Jones to talk about the capital, its problems and his plans for the future.
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00:00There's been an exodus of London's rich because of fears over the government's tax rates and I'm a
00:06big believer in trickle down in terms of the fact that this affects everybody because it's going to
00:11affect restaurants, taxis, cleaners, department stores, everyone. What can we do about that?
00:16Because there is a big narrative at the moment of the rich leaving London, many of whom are bound
00:22for places like Milan. We've got to make more than one offer, not just tax. There are a number
00:27of things we do to attract people to London. So when you're somebody considering whether to invest
00:33in London versus Frankfurt, Berlin, Dublin, Paris, Barcelona, or to be a student here,
00:39or to be a non-dom, or whatever, there are a number of things you look at, right? Tax is one
00:43of them. I'll come to tax in a second, I promise. There are other issues. The quality of restaurants,
00:48the quality of culture, the quality of schools, the universities, sports, and so forth. So you
00:58say all these in the round. One of the things, though, when I speak to people thinking about
01:03investing here who've not invested in the last few years is the instability of our country.
01:08We've had five prime ministers just in the time I've been mayor. We've had Liz Truss's
01:14kamikaze budget, a 49-day prime minister, last in stock of the world.
01:19The rich are not leaving because of the previous five Tory leaders.
01:23Well, I'm sorry they have left because of the last five Tory leaders. For every one person you
01:28could tell me who's leaving, I can give you examples of businesses thinking about investing
01:32here. And the proof is going to be the government, working closely with the government, is holding
01:37an investment summit in London on October the 14th. If nobody turns up, your thesis is right,
01:42and everyone's leaving because of this government. I want people to be wealth creators here,
01:46whether you're British or whether you're from overseas. I'm really proud we have more than
01:50100 unicorns in London. I've got no problem with people creating wealth. I encourage it.
01:58Generates jobs, and so forth. And I think whenever I speak to Rachel and Keir, they both understand
02:04how the ecosystem works. Neither of them wants people to leave this country. And I'm hoping
02:09that people recognise change is stability, because people haven't had stability for the last
02:16few years. I think we'll agree to disagree on that one. But what do you hope to have achieved
02:23by the end of the third term, an unprecedented third term? Yeah, look, I want people in three
02:30and a half years' time to feel they're better off, they're safer, they're healthier, they think our
02:38cities are fairer. I want London in three and a half years' time to be considered a byword for
02:45opportunity, whether you're a young person, whether you're a business, whether you're a
02:49start-up, whether you're an accelerator, whether you're a sports person, whether you're an artist.
02:54To think about London and the word association is opportunity. And over the next three and a half
02:59years working with the government, I call this a moment of maximum opportunity. Working with
03:04the government, we're going to help with the national growth agenda, but also make sure rather
03:09than us being at fisticuffs with the government, then working against us, inverted commas, levelling
03:13up, working with the government to bring in investment to make sure that City Hall is the
03:18helping hand for Londoners, for businesses, for entrepreneurs, for artists. You flip-flopped over
03:23rent freezes. Do you want them or not? I definitely want them. And we're going to, by the end of this
03:28term, have 6,000 homes in London built where there is rent control. I'm working with the government
03:37to have more council homes being built and homes with social rent being built. Why? Because that
03:44enables people to pay a social rent, put money aside for a deposit, which otherwise, unless you
03:48have a bank of mum and dad, you can't do. And the other key point I'm trying to get across to
03:53Angela Rayner, who's in charge of housing for this government, is the government's got an ambition
03:58to build 1.5 million homes, and a big chunk of those to come to London. Social rent homes, homes
04:05for rent, homes to purchase, market value homes, a combination of all those things, diversify,
04:10thousand supply. Any taxi I get into, and if I make the mistake of telling them what I do,
04:17I get an earful about you. Traffic in London is terrible. What are you going to do about it?
04:24So we're a city now whose population is 9.7 million. If you compare and contrast New York
04:33is around 8.2 to 8.4, depending on which numbers you look at. So the size of London hasn't grown,
04:39geographically speaking. We're basically 400 Roman villages. Our population has grown
04:44in a humongous way. So we've got to think about how we get about our city, but also where we do
04:48leisure, work, play, study. We've got to encourage more people, if it's possible, everyone can,
04:57to walk, cycle, use public transport. Currently it's 64% either walk, cycle, use public transport
05:03to free up the roads for those people that need to be using the roads. Taxis, commercial drivers,
05:09buses, and so forth. So to your black cab driver, the more cars I can take off the road that don't
05:15need to be driving, you know, people like you and me don't need to be driving, that enables less
05:21traffic for commercial drivers and black cab drivers. Congestion costs us money in terms of
05:27people being stuck in the car rather than fixing the leak if they're a plumber, or installing
05:33wire if you're an electrician, or getting a disabled person from A to B if you're a black cab driver.
05:37Oxford Street, what do you hope to achieve with this? Full pedestrianisation or what?
05:43I visit cities across the globe all the time, both as a tourist and as the mayor, and when I
05:49see what Barcelona have done with La Rambla, when I see what New York has done with
05:55Times Square, when I remember my memory of Oxford Street, I'd sat at jobs in Oxford Street
06:01over a number of years, different outlets from Debenhams to Barrett's and elsewhere,
06:06and I compare and contrast my memory of Oxford Street with my experience of Oxford Street.
06:11Oxford Street, I love it as we do, it's tired, it's got competition from online,
06:18from out-of-centre shopping centres, there have been flagship shops that have left Oxford Street,
06:24candy shops have taken over and so forth, and so I've been frustrated at what should be a source
06:31of national pride has become a source of national embarrassment. Just imagine we could curate a
06:37space where in addition to there being activity, pedestrian-friendly, green avenue or boulevard,
06:46we could think about how we can curate the evenings, how we can bring culture into our...
06:50So entertainment venues?
06:52Absolutely, absolutely. You know it better than I do. Evenings, you know, it's like it's
06:59Tumbleweed going through Oxford Street, you know, why aren't we having pavement-style cafes? And
07:04here's the key thing for me, we can take residents with us, we can take businesses
07:10with us, but Oxford Street is really important to our national economy in terms of business rates,
07:17in terms of corporation tax, in terms of income tax paid by workers and employers, and so if we
07:23get this right, not only will the businesses benefit, but it's part of our growth agenda as
07:27well, but also somewhere I want to go that's pleasant, that's enjoyable, that's a destination.
07:31Would you have any interest in resuscitating the Garden Bridge?
07:35The issue with the Garden Bridge was the cost and the location. I'm in favour of more river crossings,
07:41so I'm really pleased to have been the mayor that will carry through the Silvertown crossing
07:45in the east of London. So if you would stand on Tower Bridge and look east, there are 18 river
07:53crossings. I beg your pardon, look west, there are 18 river crossings. Look east, there are only two,
07:58so we'll have another river crossing, Silvertown Tunnel, in the east of London. In relation to
08:06pedestrianised bridges in the centre or the west, I look at each scheme on its merit.
08:11What's the plan with the Gaza marches?
08:13One of the joys of living in a democracy is I get people like you holding me to account.
08:17That's a joy of a democracy. I've got family and friends living in countries
08:22where there is no holding to account people in positions of power and influence.
08:25It isn't just journalism, which is important. It isn't just voting, joining a political party,
08:31it's signing petitions, lobbying a parliamentarian or a mayor, going on protests, demonstrations,
08:37marches. I think it's something we should be really proud of, that even though men agree with
08:41what you're protesting about, you've got the right to protest in our wonderful city. There's a buck
08:47coming up. But if you do protest, you've got to act within the law. You've got to make sure it's
08:53safe. You've got to make sure it's peaceful and you've got to make sure it's lawful. So if anybody
08:57goes to any protest, whether it's a pro-Gaza protest or another protest, please, please,
09:04please, I'd encourage you to don't break the law, be peaceful and be safe. If you're not, by the way,
09:10the police will step in. If not make an arrest today, then I've gathered the evidence to make
09:14an arrest at some further date in the future. What's your message for London's Jewish community?
09:20I'm your biggest ally. I'm upset. I'm heartbroken. I'm angry that for the last year in particular,
09:32there have been many occasions where you've not felt safe going about our city. There have been
09:37occasions where you've been scared to leave your home. I've known for many, many years that if you
09:44go to a certain type of school, a Jewish faith school, if you go to a certain place of worship,
09:50a synagogue, you require extra protection because you're Jewish. That can't be right.
09:54Antisemitism is the oldest form of hatred known to mankind. And those of us who aren't Jewish
10:00must provide allyship and solidarity and support and empathy and listen. I mean, you know,
10:08I learned so much spending time with not just Holocaust survivors, but the children and
10:12grandchildren of them, but also spending time with those friends of mine who are Jewish,
10:17so I can understand how frightening it is to be Jewish.
10:21Why are there two cycle lanes on Park Lane?
10:24One goes one way, one goes the other way. Oh, do you mean the Park one? Which one do you mean?
10:29Oh, it's very simple. The Park is closed in the evenings, so you can't use the evenings,
10:33but also the Park cycle lane is a shared space with pedestrians and with cyclists,
10:38and pedestrians have been run over, almost run over, and are very scared to use that shared
10:42space. So what we've done is we've increased capacity by having a segregated cycle lane
10:47on the road, which means pedestrians aren't in danger of being run over.
10:52That is an annoyingly rational answer.
10:55Look, there's a great line in a Kevin Costner film, if you build it, it will come.
11:00When you eventually step down, who would make a good mayor?
11:03Somebody who feels the rhythm of our city, somebody who's forward looking,
11:07somebody who's ambitious for this city, somebody who understands the values of this city.
11:12You've got to be pro-business, you've got to be pro-social justice, you've got to be somebody who
11:17lives, breathes and sleeps London. This isn't a job, it's a vocation, it's a way of life, you know,
11:23I'm never off, and that's the sort of mayor I want of our city.
11:27Would Grayson Perry make a good mayor?
11:29He'd be great. They'd be great. I mean, this guy, I'm not sure what his wife would
11:35think about this, by the way, or his daughter, but this guy just gets it in relation to,
11:40I see him at events and we always have a chat and there's always interesting chats,
11:44but he's got this great ability, which you've got as well actually, which is you listen.
11:50You may not agree with what the other person is saying, but also he's engaging. I think he'd be
11:55great. Will fixing Hammersmith Bridge be easier with the Labour government?
12:00It needs to be, honestly. It's just a disaster what's happening in that part of West London.
12:04I mean, there are children who are going to make a long journey to get to their schools.
12:09There are families cut off from their parents because of the bridge being closed who need to
12:12use their car or a bus. The council can't afford to pay the £250,000 it costs to repair the
12:17bill. We can't afford to pay for it. So what is the solution? Because it can
12:21embarrass me. The government's got to step in.
12:23You know, there's no alternative in relation to that. I know the council's speaking to the
12:27government in relation to those issues. We're lobbying the government as well. The government
12:32know that it's an issue of funding. And so, you know, I'm not sure, bearing in mind that the £22
12:39billion black hole, whether it can be done in the short term or it needs to be done.
12:42It can't. The status quo is not an option.