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00:00It's a pleasure and an honor to welcome another man who's running for office.
00:04You're running for re-election, Congressman Glenn Ivey of Maryland.
00:07Thank you for being with us.
00:08Thanks for having me.
00:09You are a Democrat, a member of the House Judiciary, the House Ethics Committee.
00:15Yes.
00:16What's this election about?
00:17Well, I mean, in some ways, it's going to determine the fate of the nation,
00:21the direction of the nation, and the direction of the world.
00:23I think if Donald Trump wins, it's a very dramatic difference from a victory by Kamala Harris.
00:29And is it about what?
00:31Because we've heard people, even the young people, telling us, you know,
00:35young people saying, we don't care too much about these rule of law issues and all that.
00:39We're more interested in the economy, and we think Trump's better.
00:42Yeah, I think we have to, you know, walk and chew gum at the same time
00:45and make sure we're taking care of both of those things.
00:47The economy certainly is critical, and I think, frankly,
00:51the United States is doing pretty well on the economy.
00:54I know it hasn't gotten to everybody, and so there's concerns for people
00:57who are still struggling on the piggy bank issues.
01:00But overall, you know, inflation's coming down, unemployment's at historic lows.
01:06We've been adding thousands of new jobs every month for about 50 months now.
01:10Things do seem to be going in the right direction.
01:12And the Fed cutting interest rates, again, I think is going to be a big step in the right direction.
01:17With respect to the democracy and rule of law issues,
01:20I think those are things you can underestimate until you lose them.
01:23And we want to make sure that that doesn't happen,
01:25because we can see what happens with other countries
01:28when they lose the democracy and rule of law guidance
01:31that's been the hallmark of the United States for so many years now.
01:35They regret them when they lose them.
01:37Are people kind of sleepwalking into something?
01:39You were not yet a congressman on January the 6th, 2021,
01:43but you have long experience on Capitol Hill.
01:46When you walk around this city today, is it almost forgotten about?
01:51Because seen from across the Atlantic, we're wondering why this isn't more of an issue.
01:58Well, I think it depends on which sector of the country you're talking to or talking about.
02:03I'm African-American. When I was a young man, the country was still segregated.
02:07I know what it's like to not be able to vote.
02:09I know what it's like to be unable to go to certain schools and certain stores and the like.
02:14And, you know, those of us who are old enough to remember the world before Roe v. Wade
02:19and it's sad to see that again.
02:21Women in a generation who've lost the rights that their grandparents and mothers had.
02:26It's easy for us to move in the wrong direction if we're not careful.
02:30We see a growing gender divide over this issue of reproductive rights.
02:33What happens to the women's movement if Donald Trump is elected?
02:36Well, it's hard to say, but I think it strengthens it in some ways,
02:40certainly in the states where those rights have been taken away already.
02:44And it could get worse.
02:45There are certainly states who are looking to take away abortion rights,
02:49even in the cases of rape and incest.
02:51And I'm sure there's going to be a national effort by the Republicans to make that a nationwide ban.
02:56So it's going to be a big fight.
02:58I think even if Harris wins, there's going to be a push by the Republicans to do that.
03:03Having the White House in Democratic hands, I think, makes it easier for us to fend that off
03:08and restore the rights of women's right to choose.
03:11Glenn Ivey, you're an attorney, a former attorney general for the state of Maryland.
03:16Donald Trump, in the last few days, would you characterize his remarks as veiled threats
03:24against, say, the former Congresswoman Liz Cheney, the press?
03:28Or are they actual threats? Should they be prosecuted?
03:31Well, I mean, I think he's been making threats like that for years now, unfortunately.
03:36Are they veiled?
03:37I think they're pretty straightforward.
03:40Legally, you have to have the ability to carry it out immediately,
03:44so it's not going to be a criminal prosecution.
03:47But he still has three of those left that are over his head,
03:50so it's not like he'll be out of the clear.
03:52But I think the bigger point, though, is that if he gets control of the government,
03:56the Army and the Department of Justice, he can misuse them.
04:00In fact, in the last administration that he had,
04:03the only thing that kept that from really getting out of control were members of the Cabinet,
04:07Secretary of Defense refusing to seize ballots,
04:10or have the military used to suppress peaceful nonviolent demonstrations.
04:16So making sure that that doesn't happen or that he doesn't weaponize prosecutors
04:21to go after his enemies that he's put a list out about,
04:24that's the stuff that we have to worry about.
04:26How strong are institutions? Is there a plan if he's elected?
04:31Yeah, there's a fight that'll have to happen, but I think we've seen that he pushed it to the brink
04:36when he was in office in 2017 and through 2021.
04:40We don't want to see that again.
04:42We want to make sure that we just keep him out of office,
04:45defeat him here at the ballot box, and we don't have to worry about those issues.
04:49We can begin to repair the rule of law and democracy here in the United States.
04:54Congressman Ivey, you mentioned all those court cases that are still pending.
04:58If Kamala Harris is the winner, should she pardon the former president?
05:03I don't think so, no. And she could only pardon the federal cases.
05:07So there are two state cases that are moving forward,
05:10and I don't think the governors in those states should pardon him, either.
05:12He should be held accountable for what he's done.
05:15That's happened in a couple of cases already with respect to the civil liability for sexual assault
05:20and the corporate fraud that his company committed,
05:23and I think he will be held accountable in the remaining four criminal cases.
05:27Just to be clear, does that mean he should go to jail?
05:30I think so. He's talked about two tiers of justice.
05:34The tier that he's on, he's complaining about being overly prosecuted.
05:38If he'd committed all of these things as a regular person,
05:42not only would he not be allowed to run for office, he'd have trouble getting a job.
05:46So I don't think being in the White House and being the president of the United States,
05:51he shouldn't be eligible for that.
05:54The acts that he's committed already should disqualify him from holding the presidency.
05:59But your U.S. judiciary system is slow.
06:02You know, he gets due process, he gets the rule of law rights that he complains about not having.
06:08He still gets them anyway, but I think he'll still be held accountable ultimately.
06:12Ultimately. What are your constituents telling you?
06:16What is highest on their minds?
06:19There's a lot. Certainly they want to have Kamala Harris in the White House.
06:22Certainly they want to have better opportunities with respect to the economy,
06:27grocery and gas prices. They want to continue to see those come down.
06:31Unemployment and jobs, I think they want to see more of those.
06:34And I think they want to see things happen that allow them to live, you know,
06:38take care of rent and mortgage, have their kids have opportunities to thrive,
06:42go to get education and get good jobs.
06:45The stuff that we've always wanted, but we've been having to fight about lately.
06:49I asked about January the 6th earlier, because January the 6th, 2021,
06:54it was the moment where both houses of Congress meet to certify the election,
06:59normally a formality. The U.S. vice president refused to sway.
07:05And Donald Trump had to exit the White House.
07:10It'll be the new Congress that will certify the election this time.
07:16What will happen if Republicans are in control for that certification process?
07:22I think certification will still happen, provided that we win the majority of the states
07:27that we need to get the 270 plus votes in the electoral college.
07:31You're still going to have Trump and others complaining that the election was stolen.
07:35But at some point, I think we have to, again, hold them accountable
07:38and make sure they follow the rule of law and basic democracy.
07:42You know, if you lose, you vacate office and permit the peaceful transfer of power.
07:47In this sense, it's a peaceful continuation of power with the Democratic Party from Biden to Harris.
07:52One final question for you. What are the tea leaves we should be reading?
07:55What should we be looking for throughout this day? What are you looking at?
07:59Well, I mean, in some ways, I'm not in a battleground state.
08:02Maryland is deeply blue and, you know, clearly Harris is going to win there.
08:06But some of the states that are going to be in play, Pennsylvania is a big one.
08:10But there are others that have gotten interesting very recently, like Iowa.
08:16If Harris wins those states, you know, this could be a blowout.
08:19So we'll see.
08:20You think that's really possible?
08:22We'll see. You know, it's up to the voters to decide.
08:25It feels like a toss up to me.
08:27But when I saw that poll that had her up in Iowa, that was astonishing to me.
08:32So we'll see.
08:33Glenn Ivey, many thanks for being with us.
08:35Thanks for having me.
08:36All right. Appreciate it.