Veteran dance and EDM promoter James “Disco Donnie” Estopinal sits with Billboard Live Senior Director, Dave Brooks to talk about his long career in live music and the future of the fan and artist relationship.
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00:00Hello everybody
00:02I'm Dave Brooks, and this is my guest and my interviewees are usually for today
00:08James
00:09disco Donny Estepin all I
00:12Like your shirt you um sold out five Red Rocks, you know
00:16I got a guy here who can give you that and display ads and billboard if you want to the agent world
00:22Yeah, yeah five Red Rocks next time six. I mean, so
00:26anyway
00:27You I know everybody's thinking like what?
00:30What am I doing up here? And I'm thinking that as well. So and my family so they're like why it was nobody else available
00:39We we have a guy who traveled the furthest possible to be here
00:46You know, I'm Donny
00:49Donny James disco you
00:52I'll print your business in Texas and Florida and that you're based in
00:56Puerto Rico explain that how do you how do you operate at a poor Rico?
01:01Why well, I mean, I think it's a very mobile business. I mean, especially like in the last 10 years, but yeah
01:08I've been in Puerto Rico about 15 years and I just you know, I married a Puerto Rican and wanted to raise my family
01:15There and so yeah, so I've been there and luckily the business adjusted now where everybody's mobile
01:21So it's not that big of a deal. How much did you import Rico though?
01:24How's the I mean how many shows you have to do like in Puerto Rico? I don't do that much in Puerto Rico
01:29Yeah, it's complicated, right? I'm sure it is. I'm sure
01:34But you know you're you're not the first disco right you come from a lineage of discos
01:41Your family growing up in New Orleans your dad was in the
01:45Show business tell us about your your early life for people who don't know about but yeah, I'm a disco jr. Actually, so
01:53basically
01:55My dad was a you know
01:59Lawyer, he went to graduate from college in three years went to law school
02:04you know opened his you know was opened his own law firm got married had a kid and
02:09He decided that he didn't want to he didn't want to be a lawyer a father or a husband so
02:18But he made it he made it to the to the pen right yeah, I was like no, I don't wanna do this anymore
02:23So, um, so he left or maybe you know, my mom says she threw him out. I'm not really sure that there's an argument there
02:30right, so he just when I was like seven or eight he disappeared for a year and
02:36When he turned back up he was a
02:40DJ yeah at a nightclub and his name was disco Jim. This is the 70s, right? So he was popping
02:45Yeah, he had it. He had it going on
02:49Yeah, he was in New Orleans is this crazy scenario where he he lived in an RV and
02:55It was at a country club a golf course
03:00swimming pool and
03:02Nightclub, so
03:04And he lived at that place in an RV. So as an eight-year-old was like, wow, this is amazing, right?
03:10Yeah, so my mom he I was like, I want to live with dad my mom's like, oh no, no, no
03:14No, so yeah, there was a that was my introduction into the the whole
03:19nightlife scene I saw a lot of things that probably I shouldn't have seen and
03:25You know, it was it was very open back then, right?
03:29Hesitant to right. I mean we talked about the floor before the state theater you had you had come to
03:36Appreciate the kind of burgeoning rave scene, but you weren't quite sure you wanted to make a living yet, right?
03:42You wanted to make it better. Oh
03:44About getting the rave scene. No, I you know, I was on the I was like on the straight and narrow
03:49I had come back home from I had gone to school in Baton Rouge. I was engaged to my
03:55High school, sweetheart. I was gonna I had gone to school for accounting
04:00Yeah, I was gonna take over my mom's CPA firm. So I was working for her. She's paying me like $6 an hour, right?
04:06Okay. No, you know like this is my life. So
04:10And I was young, you know, and I was basically
04:14Thinking this is gonna be my next 40 years. Yeah, and I just felt like something was kind of missing
04:20I started waiting tables at night at a restaurant to actually make some real money
04:26Since my mom was wasn't paying me. Right? I'm sorry mom. And so yeah, basically I
04:33went into an event and
04:36You know, it was I had been to
04:40You know, I've been chasing something different. Yeah in New Orleans all the time
04:44I had been to like the I had been to the goth clubs
04:48I had been to like the gay clubs and I had been to like these video bars
04:54So I had seen all these people
04:56like in their
04:58Subsections, but none of those were like a perfect fit for me
05:01But when I walked into this to my first rave, it was basically all these people were together
05:08Yeah partying together
05:09So it was you know, they basically had the drag queens and the b-boys and I'm like you guys all hang out together, you know
05:16Yeah, yeah, what did you tell me? Like why didn't you tell me? Why don't I know about this?
05:21so that's when I kind of got excited and
05:24about the scene and
05:26I dove right in from that minute forward. I like never looked back. I basically was like they didn't have enough
05:33They didn't have a lot of people at it, right? But the people they did have were so
05:38Diverse and it just so special and with the music and
05:44Everything that how nice everybody was it was like I got to be involved in this and so the next day I was at the
05:49thrift store buying clothes
05:51You know, I was I went a hundred percent in you became just good on me. Well, yeah
05:57Yeah, maybe I was already him. I just yeah
06:01You know the glasses
06:04I don't know how it works. But um, so so what you started you started doing
06:09Show promotion you started street teaming, right?
06:11I mean, how did you go from kind of being a hang around to a guy who was putting on your own shows?
06:17And doing some of this the state theater
06:19Um, I basically was just I was taking flowers off the table and just passing them out and inviting my friends to parties and stuff
06:27Like that. It's Easter. Yeah, just like on my own. Yeah, and people started
06:31Noticing it and
06:35And somebody
06:36Wanted to hire me and I'm like no I have two jobs, you know, I'm just doing this for yeah
06:42Yeah, I got two jobs, you know, yeah, and so
06:46Basically, I was like, I don't want to get make any money off of this
06:49I'm just want to make more people come and I don't want them to be left out like I was so basically
06:55The guys like no, I'm gonna pay you pay you, you know go out every night promote here's 5,000 flyers
07:01So I got rid of those flyers and you know, it was hard to pass out flyers in
07:061994 just with artists that nobody knew was right. I'm giving them like something that's Chinese like, okay
07:12Yeah, nobody knows what this I'm like, oh, it's gonna be fun. Just you have to sell it
07:15You just can't give a flyer to somebody and so you had to really work it and tell people why they should go to this
07:20event and
07:22Yeah, I just remember there was like 600 people there it was like the biggest event in New Orleans and
07:27At the end of the night the guy gave me like two hits to ecstasy
07:31And I was like, of course, I ate him right away, right? And then I said, well, that's not a lot
07:39Even hitting me yet, right? So but you know, that's when I realized that the next person that asked me to
07:47to work to
07:50You know to promote their show, yeah, give me 50% of the door, right?
07:53Okay, so I was kind of more savvy than I was forced into the business. Yeah, but by ecstasy
08:01Speaking of ecstasy
08:05So, how so how did you
08:09I keep the state theater. Eventually you get your own venue, right?
08:12You would you had kind of business promoter you see how the promoters and the venues operated, you know
08:19These can be some sometimes kind of chastity, but you figured out a way to make drones a space of yours. Tell us about that
08:27yeah, well, I mean I think the original stuff that we were doing was a lot of it was in warehouses and
08:34We would lie to the owner and tell me we're a fraternity party or something like that. Okay. Yeah, so we
08:40So like the original stuff that we were doing was very and we were very young and stupid
08:47With you know, no
08:49security
08:50Serving alcohol no age limit. No, I'm sure no right nothing. Nothing. No permits
08:56Get one cop and he would watch the front. So that was like that was our big protection there
09:01Do you once in a hot day rent out meat lockers?
09:04Yeah, we went for a month. We told a guy we were a sound company and that last
09:10Yeah, it didn't smell that good
09:13but
09:14Yeah, so but basically
09:16eventually, I realized at some point as the scene kept growing that we had to get into like a legitimate venue and
09:23That's when I found State Palace Theatre, and I was very lucky because it was kind of when you know that the
09:32Whole grunge thing was tapering off. Yeah, so they were looking for more business. So I was able to book
09:3912 dates in one year and nobody in the u.s
09:42Could do that, right? Yeah, so I
09:45Could have my six months in advance already booked out and people knew
09:50That that venue was safe because a lot of engines still getting shut down. They weren't legal and stuff like that
09:55So that's when and it was in New Orleans
09:57So New Orleans is a very special place on its own that people like to travel to
10:02There's a lot of weird stuff going on there all the time. So we weren't that weird
10:06We were like kind of like just another
10:08Like an additive to what's going on in New Orleans because there's like crazier stuff going on in New Orleans right than raves
10:13so right, but
10:14So the fans knew like hey, this is a discotheque. I'll buy a ticket. It'll happen
10:20The artists know like they'll get paid and they'll show up right and you get some
10:23It's some regular business. It was just regular
10:27It was I mean it was I took a lot of shit because they were on it was on Ticketmaster
10:31yeah, and so, you know, but you know, it was a
10:34At the time I understood what people we because we had like a special at the time we had some special underground
10:41Scene that we were trying to keep but in the end to grow and to make it safe and better for everyone
10:46Yeah, and to expand it to more people we had to go legal
10:50And so there was people upset with me, but it was the only it was a natural progression
10:56Right, but so going legal though. I mean
11:00As you're going legal quote-unquote right you're being legit
11:03There are forces at play there are forces in the government who are wondering is this guy legal? Is this guy?
11:10up and up and
11:14The rave act passes right Joe Biden famously is passes a rave act which
11:23Creates certain penalties for businesses that you know that
11:27We're drugs if you can take place, right
11:32Were you targeted by this law and what what what happens
11:36Just goes on in the rave acts
11:38No
11:38well
11:38that was at the time like at at you know at one point like the DA came to my house at like 6 a.m. in the
11:44morning and
11:45you know roused me from whatever I was doing and I came downstairs and they basically were like
11:52you know that we're watching you and and
11:56and
11:58Basically, we want to you know, like we want you to stop doing shows and you know, you're killing people and
12:06The premise is that like you're doing raves people do drugs at raves
12:11There's just like it's your fault, right? Right, right
12:14It's not I'm not doing I'm not selling other drugs and I'm not yeah to them
12:18But right I'm creating the environment where they are doing them. Yeah, there's crack house laws of the time
12:24This is the night this is 90s and yeah, so they come to my house and they I tell them they you know
12:30They asked me who the drug dealers are and then they I'm like, I don't know and then they you know
12:35Offer me a job and they so they asked me what I'm getting paid a year and they're basically we'll pay you triple
12:40Yeah, I don't know. They give me a car and they leave
12:47Mirror glasses, it was like fucking sabotage. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, it was them. So anyway
12:53Basically, um, you know, I think well, I'm in a clear we're boys now I got their card. Yeah, you know, they'll call me
13:00You're calling
13:02Call them Thanksgiving dinner maybe but no, right. Yeah, so at one point
13:10They ended up raiding
13:12our venue and they raided it before the show and and
13:17Luckily, I was like still primping and I was getting ready
13:21Yeah, I was getting ready whatever and so I'm in the car and this is like cell phones are brand new
13:25So my cell phone was giant. Yeah, and somebody calls me and I don't come here the DA's here. I'm like, oh shit
13:31yeah, so then
13:36For what reason I wonder what they had a
13:39They had a theory and they had gone in front of comp. This was all public knowledge
13:43They had a theory that we were basically bringing the drugs up into the shows before the events and that we were selling them
13:50From backstage with okay VIP passes
13:53So they ended up opening up all the speakers and all the turntables and searching all the employees. So
14:01The feds their theory was you were a drug you were you're basically laundering drugs through the business
14:08People were coming there not for the artist
14:10Yeah, or for the music or for the scene they were coming there to buy drugs and we're supplying those drugs, right?
14:16Yeah, yeah, because that was the only way this is a jack conspiracy because we had security and we had everything so they watched all
14:22that yeah, so
14:24Yeah, but they so they raid the place. I think one bartender had a joint on him or something
14:29so they
14:30like they they confiscated the glow sticks and they they considered all that drug paraphernalia at the
14:39I remember you telling me they took
14:41You know
14:45Tore everything up and now I've I stayed at the I've camped out there was a restaurant
14:52Underneath the venue and I camped out there and I was telling the promoters we had like 4,000 tickets sold
14:58So I was like, everybody was in line. So I just said hey just wait wait
15:02We'll see, you know, we're gonna open up the doors. And so it's they got tired. They were in there like an eight
15:09So
15:10It's ten. So they had to you know, they they went to leave the D
15:14I was sitting in the restaurant the D agents came in like and I walked right out behind them and
15:21I walked to the front door and we opened the doors and they were pissed
15:33No, they were like they thought that they thought I was gonna stop doing shows cuz they
15:38Had busted us, but they didn't bust me with anything. Yeah. Yeah, I had it all in my pocket
15:44But you you were charged though
15:47You were charged they charged us. Yeah the next so they did tell us before they left
15:52They said hey, you know have your lawyer
15:54Contact us and so on Monday that month that next month we did the show
16:00they weren't happy with that that you know, they weren't able to stop us and basically on the next Monday we went in and they
16:07The lawyer was like, are you you know, the my partners the venue owners had their wives there and stuff and just meet dumbass young
16:14Me, I'm like, oh, you know, this is like a game. And so they said, okay sit down. It's like, okay
16:20Well, you're gonna they're charging you with the crack house law. Uh-huh. So for the drug, they've been to eight of your shows
16:27So the drugs that they purchased that your shows that's 18 years
16:30And so right away one of the wives goes down like in the chair crying and stuff like that
16:36And so and then it's like well, that's not the worst part
16:40there can they're charging with a CCE, which is a continuing criminal enterprise that which is they use for the mafia and
16:47And that's 20 to life. And then that's when I fell on the floor
17:00By running this place you're knowingly
17:03Running a drug operation, even though there was no connection to you any of the drug sales or whatever
17:10Yeah, it was a theory really if you read the law
17:13It's kind of crazy because anybody that worked at that venue the bartenders the security. Yeah, everybody is
17:21Could be charged with this so I use all that and the criminal justice scene
17:26I mean, I mean the criminal justice system is crazy because and I didn't really have any money at the time
17:31But at least I had something and so but the way they
17:34Put you into that. I mean they were like we're gonna have a hundred agents on this. This is a big case
17:40It's a test case and we're gonna go down and take down all the rest of the promoters
17:44And so we're gonna put all this money into it. We're not gonna let you go
17:48We win nine nine point nine nine nine nine nine nine percent. They never stop saying that nine. Oh shit
17:54ninety-nine point nine nine nine nine nine nine nine nine
17:57Damn well, what who won that one point? Oh, oh one percent. Okay, so
18:03You're like wow, you have to really think about it. Yeah, and they threaten you
18:06They're like we're gonna arrest you on TV and your mom's gonna see you and the people you went to high school with I said
18:13Mr. Man is gonna see me
18:16He's gonna see me on TV. I was like so I mean you get you get scared. Yeah
18:21But you
18:24You held out I held out luckily like the they announced the people thought it was like tax evasion or drug sale or something like
18:31that they they
18:33held out
18:35My lawyer was like, oh just my lawyer was telling me show me what jail I was gonna stay in
18:40Like look, it's just grass here and there's like a basketball court and you just can't cross that. There's no fence
18:45You just can't cross the street. I'm like, oh, that's not too bad
18:48You start thinking like that, right? I mean, it's like, okay. Well, okay, I can play basketball
18:54It's grass. Okay, that's better than my house. So
18:58No, really? I was like you have to think about it because the there's there's the justice system
19:04It's weighing life or one year, right? So I had to think about it
19:09Yeah, they had to offer for one year. They just wanted to get me so they can get everybody else
19:14Yeah, and that's what they kept telling me. So
19:16Look they announced their case and it just kind of totally went over like a lead balloon like it was on talk radio
19:23News week Time magazine Peter Jennings. Like I was doing all this stuff and people were like this isn't
19:28This isn't real right and people writing letters into the papers
19:31But you can't keep drugs out of prison and you're gonna put this guy in jail for a pre-enrolled promoter
19:37Yeah, so then they so you got involved and then I had support from the whole nation and then I'm like, yeah
19:44Fuck you. All right. I was right. I wasn't ever taking that deal. Never. I didn't think about it. I'm standing up
19:52And you won
19:54Well, I didn't win. No charges. No charges. I'm still trying to do it. Yeah
19:59They haven't got me yet that when I walked out they said they were gonna get me
20:03Some at some point. Yeah, so we got some time. Yeah
20:07So then you would so
20:10We're glad we want to hear about Bob Stillerman, you know, like
20:13And that the craziness of what you were trying to form SFX. So I'll do better
20:17But I mean you you get you keep building building this career you begin doing a lot of work
20:23Tell us about why don't you tell us about where you do with with?
20:27insomniac and then it kind of set us up into going into meeting Bob Stillerman and
20:33Trying to create the world's biggest raving company. So like in the 90s. I started like basically
20:39Working with other people and different markets and stuff. I started working with past wall here in LA
20:45and
20:47And then we kind of we stopped for a little bit and after the whole like crack house thing came
20:55Then, you know, basically we started working together again
20:58We started building up kind of insomniac is like a national type of company and that's what it was
21:04Another world
21:07Yeah, well, I mean, yeah, well, I mean so basically, you know, I mean they were they were going they were going after everywhere
21:13Okay, you know just didn't it didn't work out. You know, just they it just
21:17the
21:18The cases didn't work people didn't repeat the public didn't buy it. I mean you're talking about 25 years ago
21:23So yeah, yeah, there's a different world, right? So you had to
21:26but now yeah, like basically I was
21:29I'm working around the country. I worked with Pasquale. We were building on insomnia taking EDC to Orlando
21:36In New York and Chicago and Dallas and Denver and see it beyond one of the Seattle
21:42so I started working on that and at some point, you know as
21:46sometimes some of these things happen and this like people have a
21:50Disagreement right or falling out? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah ever heard of that. I'm really good at making deals
21:56I'm just really bad at contracts, right? Yeah, so
22:12Yeah, I don't know fucking discusses but let me tell you this story so
22:18Yeah, I mean like at some point
22:21Pasquale, you know, I was living in Puerto Rico. He's here. He's doing all the meetings and stuff like that
22:26So I'm I'm playing his card here. Like he's probably like Donnie's not doing shit
22:31like I'm not I'm not getting any benefit from the
22:34Previous times so, you know, he's like, oh you don't own any of this stuff and I'm like, okay
22:39well, I don't agree with you, but let me go see what's out there and
22:45So, you know I went and met with live nation AG and they were like
22:51We've been meeting with Pasquale for three months
22:53for six months and
22:55He never mentioned you I was like, oh shit. I am toast, right?
23:01That was like all I needed to know right? So they gave me the answer right there
23:05That's like those are all your shows and the country. I'm like, yeah, like oh
23:11Yes, sorry. Yeah. Yeah, so, you know, that's when I knew that it was time to kind of
23:17Even though I had was shown the exit that was time for me to run out the exit, right? So basically
23:23You know, I freaking
23:26Created a deck about rolling up EDM
23:31Other EDM promoters and companies and like-minded people and
23:37You wanted to create the world's biggest raving company it had been like had been discussed it was yeah
23:42It wasn't like a unique idea it had been done before and other businesses and stuff
23:46So it wasn't like something that but I'm I at that point put it into motion
23:52Yeah, so maybe I was a facilitator a way to not have been the idea person. So but
23:58yeah, so I met with a
24:00Ron Burkle out here like literally but by the time I had a meeting with Pasquale in
24:05Four months at four weeks. I had a I had an offer for the for to do it and then another four weeks later
24:11I met Bob Sillerman
24:13And he was like, oh, I'm in a hundred percent. Yeah, he's like shook my hand
24:18He's it's a done deal. So I was like, okay
24:22How much do I have to spend? He's like a billion dollars. I
24:25Said a billion. Okay. Well, I was like, what do I start? He's like as soon as you leave here. So that's what I did
24:31So what so a billion dollars? What were you like?
24:35You're buying concert promoters buying you bought sound music companies. You're buying
24:40I mean you were
24:42was the
24:43How did it work? Obviously?
24:46You're spending cash where you were buying stuff in stock and special deals, right? Yeah. I mean look I didn't really I was kind of
24:53Obviously not I was a kind of a rookie to what those how those deals work
24:56Yeah, so I he didn't really actually have that money in the bank. Um, so
25:01Sort of asked that question like saying let me see your bank account there, but show me your phone
25:06but so
25:08Anyway next time I got this so he basically yeah, I mean some of the stocks and was cash
25:14I was basically using my relationships to bring people in and meet with Bob and he's very eccentric
25:20yeah, he would have like on these wig hats and like fuck you t-shirts and and people are like there's people from like
25:29Amsterdam and they come in their suits and this guy's sitting here laying on the table
25:34Like when they walk into the meeting and he's like, ah, you're gonna remember this meeting and I'm like, oh, yeah
25:40They're gonna remember this meeting. So it was interesting to say the least
25:44and
25:45Yeah, I mean it was it was crazy times and a lot of people that had been working very hard in the scene
25:52Were able to actually kind of realize some kind of financial gain
25:57Yeah, and so it felt good for me to be able to introduce those people to that
26:02It didn't work out for everyone, right?
26:05So but I think that theory and I guess the the the plan was good. The execution just didn't work out, right?
26:12It's a complicated thing to do, you know, obviously it's a role of a company like that
26:17Consolidated and then flip it to somebody else. It's a stock market play, right?
26:23and
26:26Company everyone through reorganization and when the bankruptcy it was
26:31It was operated as a company register had been is desperately organized
26:36You were put in a position now. You could run this company
26:41but
26:43In the heart of the pandemic
26:45You know April 2020
26:48When the concert business is completely shutting down
26:51You're offered a gig to run the company for
26:55the cap, you know the
26:58Capital partners, but instead you decide do something else. What did you decide to do?
27:03Yeah, I mean, um, so
27:06You know, we had the bankruptcy at SFX
27:08I guaranteed to our everybody that I'd hired that I would they would not lose money
27:12I would pay them through some fake invoices or whatever, right? I'm gonna have to pay I hired you
27:18This is how this business works, you know, no agents gonna let me walk away from some freakin
27:22Yeah, some offer that I put in it doesn't matter what a court says
27:26So that that all that was this is nonsense. So I had to pay everyone
27:31anyway, so
27:33Then we started this new company called lifestyle and I had already
27:39Yeah, the reorganized company they had bought the old debt and we had already
27:44There was somebody was interested in buying
27:47my company which was actually like my name and my people people had been with me like 20 years and stuff and
27:54I had a fiduciary responsibility to kind of entertain this and so
28:00And I was like, I didn't like it. I was like this doesn't feel right
28:03like this like that this doesn't it was somebody that didn't make me feel like
28:08warm inside
28:09so I had already started the
28:11Conversation like I wanted the first writer refused to buy my company back
28:15if an offer was made or at least to match that and so this is all like literally like three or four months before
28:22Kovat hit and
28:24You know basically
28:27right when
28:28The whole market shut down whatever March 12 13th or whatever
28:33You know, of course my dumb ass goes online. I'm like we're giving everybody refunds and blah blah blah, you know
28:40happy Kovat and so
28:42you know the
28:44People like that are my bosses are like hey, you can't give refunds. You can't say that. Yeah
28:51I'm like, well, if we're not gonna get people refunds right now
28:54Like when are we gonna give it give it to them? Right? Yeah, and and so like we got to take it back
28:59I'm like, I'm not taking it back. You know, it's like it's it's out there now
29:02Yeah, we'll figure it out. And then they were like, well, we need to start talking about layoffs
29:07I'm like, well, we're one day into this. Yeah one day and so I was like, that's it
29:15I'm taking the company back. So literally that I'm buying it back. I'm crazy
29:19And so by literally yeah, this is March 12 13th shut down
29:24People are getting fired at agent like laid off at agencies
29:27They've been here like 10 years like and and then by April 1st, I had the company back
29:32Like a big dummy a big big dummy. Don't do that. Don't buy your company back. So stupid. Well, you have it
29:39you're operating today and
29:41Unfortunately, we are out of time
29:44We want to hear but first we're out of time
29:48But you have it. I mean, I think you've had you've had your wins. You've had your losses
29:53So this is like the this is like episode one. I know
30:01So
30:07Our life lives, huh