"The doors of the state of Pakistan are open for dialogue, but..."
Category
🗞
NewsTranscript
00:00The situation has never been good. It was either bad, very bad or less bad.
00:05As I said in the beginning, the situation has been going on since 1947,
00:10from the time the army was operated on to today.
00:16It has never been good. But there are two or three components to it.
00:19What you are talking about, social media and other things,
00:23this is exactly what is happening. Absolutely.
00:26India is also investing its money there.
00:28The Gulf state, which we call our friend, is also on the Gwadar port.
00:32I know the reality of that as well. They have invested millions of dollars there every year.
00:36I don't want to name names, you know it, I know it.
00:38Those realities are in their place.
00:40But putting everything in a box of security is also a suicidal approach.
00:45There are issues.
00:47For example, in Gwadar, when Karachi's businessmen, Lahore's businessmen,
00:52big, big people went to buy land,
00:55and suddenly the local population didn't even know what was happening in Gwadar.
00:59Who raised that issue?
01:01The nationalists raised it.
01:03Of course, people will talk to them, they will follow them up.
01:06If the traditional mainstream political parties don't talk about it,
01:10in their political or power vested interests,
01:13all the public issues, if the nationalists raise them,
01:16and then their militant wings will take them and run ahead,
01:20then I will give them less credit, I will blame the mainstream political parties,
01:25the traditional political parties.
01:27And it is wrong to shout in the same room.
01:30I have two editorials.
01:32Now, this is neither a political version of anyone, nor are they your political opponents.
01:37I have an editorial in front of me from February 4, 2025.
01:41Don's editorial is very good.
01:43He said that the element that talks about issues in a democratic fashion,
01:48even if it is someone's voice,
01:50we have the example of Sinn Féin in Ireland,
01:53there was a militant wing and a political wing.
01:56He said that those who talk about issues in a democratic fashion,
02:00they should not demonize the state.
02:03And now cases have been filed against the Baloch right activists.
02:07If Marang Baloch, I say, is someone's spokesperson,
02:11if she comes to Islamabad,
02:13then wasn't it better to have a conversation,
02:16instead of terrorist cases being filed against her,
02:19and other cases are being filed against her,
02:21and she was arrested in front of the National Press Club.
02:24Who will talk to whom?
02:26I just want to know from you,
02:28that if you say that we are ready to talk,
02:31you tell me, who are those legitimate people,
02:34who you think should talk?
02:36Because obviously, the people who are running this movement,
02:39they will talk, right?
02:41Is there any legitimate person,
02:43a partner to a dialogue,
02:45that none of them are legitimate?
02:47Look, Mr. Malik,
02:49the question is very big,
02:51and there is an opinion making going on,
02:53and obviously we are in a dialogue,
02:55and this is what is good.
02:57So that we can talk about Balochistan in the same way,
02:59and I request you,
03:01that instead of a segment,
03:03it should be a series of programs,
03:05then only it will be covered.
03:07Because there is so much in your question,
03:09we are doing the whole program on this,
03:11you can take your time.
03:13Thank you, Mr. Malik.
03:15You mentioned the Kalat Army Operation,
03:17now Kalat,
03:19now there is a background behind this,
03:21the background is that
03:23the creation of Pakistan and India
03:25was through a British Parliament Act,
03:27and that act said that
03:29the princely states
03:31will either stay with Pakistan,
03:33or they will go with India,
03:35they had no independent status.
03:37Jam of Laspela,
03:39Nawab of Kharan,
03:41Nawab of Makran,
03:43they with their princely states,
03:45with Pakistan,
03:47in 1947 only,
03:49unconditionally allocated.
03:51Khan Kalat asked for time,
03:53and he writes in his biography,
03:55Inside Balochistan,
03:57that it was an article of faith for me to join Pakistan,
03:59no one gives an example of that.
04:01The first insurgent was his younger brother,
04:03who writes about Pakistan,
04:05for 2-3 months,
04:07and Kalat,
04:09if you look at the map of Balochistan,
04:11it is a small place,
04:13and to make it operate in Balochistan,
04:15or to make a police operation in Ramiar Khan,
04:17and make it an operation in Punjab.
04:19So, coming to your next point,
04:21you talked about Nationalist politics
04:23and mainstream political parties,
04:25what does the constitution say?
04:27The constitution says that
04:29it is the right of Malik to do business in Gawadar,
04:31and it is the right of Sarfaraz Bugti to do business
04:33in Karachi, Peshawar, Lahore.
04:35Now, if you violate the constitution,
04:37then I don't think
04:39the constitution makers
04:41would have thought about it.
04:43Yes, it is true that people should come
04:45and do business,
04:47Baloch is also doing business there,
04:49Pashtun is also doing business there,
04:51on ethnic grounds,
04:53if you specifically say that
04:55Karachi people will not leave Pashtun people,
04:57then the population of Pashtun people
04:59in Karachi will also increase.
05:01So, look at all these things.
05:03Yes, I agree with you on one thing,
05:05that we should not look at
05:07the same house,
05:09the security house,
05:11your development paradigm,
05:13your security paradigm,
05:15they have to move parallel,
05:17because if you do development,
05:19it will complement the state,
05:21it will complement the state,
05:23so we have to do development,
05:25we are doing it,
05:27you know, today in the whole of Balochistan,
05:29I can say with challenge,
05:31that the reset we have done in education,
05:33merit has not been violated in one place.
05:35So, these are the positive things.
05:37No, no, my question is left in the middle,
05:39my question is left in the middle,
05:41that in the dialogue,
05:43the people you call nationalists,
05:45you call them opposition,
05:47you may call someone a terrorist,
05:49whatever, those houses are your choice,
05:51fill them as you like,
05:53do you think there is any legitimate
05:55dialogue in this?
05:57If you decide that we are not ready to talk,
05:59then tell me,
06:01who can we talk to?
06:03Where can we start?
06:05I was coming to your question,
06:07because I write your questions,
06:09and then point wise,
06:11because your questions are long,
06:13so the answer is also long.
06:15I was coming, you intervened,
06:17I will tell you.
06:19See, who do you want to dialogue with?
06:21If there is a political issue,
06:23you talk to the nationalists,
06:25you are having a Jalsa Jaloos,
06:27you are having a dialogue with Marang,
06:29you write with him,
06:31that you will do this, you will do that,
06:33this is what the constitution allows us.
06:35Now, the matter is not in their hands,
06:37the matter is in the hands of Bashir Zaib,
06:39the matter is in the hands of Dr. Lala Nazar,
06:41the matter is in the hands of Bihar Bihar Bari,
06:43so and so on,
06:45the 6-7 separate groups,
06:47the violent groups.
06:49Now, from those violent groups,
06:51who do you dialogue with?
06:53Are you ready to dialogue with all of us?
06:55Do you like it or not?
06:57The decision has to be made in the battlefield.
06:59Now, take the example of 1971,
07:01now it has been proven that
07:03it was an intelligence-driven war
07:05against the state of Pakistan.
07:07Now it has been proven,
07:09even though earlier they did not believe it.
07:11Now tell me, when did the dialogue happen?
07:13When Pakistan surrendered,
07:15after that the dialogue started,
07:17that what to do with the 90,000 prisoners,
07:19what to do with the territory,
07:21what to do with the assets,
07:23so the decision has to be made in the battlefield.
07:25Yes, if there is a conflict,
07:27suppose that today,
07:29with my offer,
07:31I am giving this offer in front of you,
07:33we have not given it,
07:35Sadr-e-Pakistan has given it,
07:37everyone has given it,
07:39suppose that from these terrorist groups
07:41or nationalist groups,
07:43whatever name you want to give,
07:45put it in the box,
07:47suppose that Dr. Al-Anazar says
07:49that I am ready for the dialogue,
07:51we will have a dialogue with them,
07:53we will mainstream them,
07:55or the second tier leadership of the terrorists
07:57who are present in the mountains,
07:59they themselves are living a luxurious life,
08:01some are in Europe, some are elsewhere,
08:03the second tier leadership who are present in the mountains,
08:05who have been incited,
08:07who have been deceived,
08:09with that we have left our doors open for dialogue,
08:11that whoever surrenders,
08:13there is a surrender policy,
08:15we ensure that they come here
08:17and facilitate their children's education,
08:19health, which is our poverty,
08:21the government tries to facilitate it,
08:23the state tries to facilitate it.
08:25Then there are some people,
08:27like Mr. Khan Qalat,
08:29who are not violent,
08:31like there are a few more people,
08:33Allah will say that we have this kind of thing,
08:35that we are offering to everyone,
08:37we are trying to talk to everyone,
08:39we are messaging,
08:41whoever will come on dialogue with us,
08:43but the people who are doing violence,
08:45can they be allowed in the middle of this?
08:47You said that the doors of the state of Pakistan are open,
08:49but I think that behind that open door,
08:51Mir Safraz Bukhti is standing
08:53with a loaded gun,
08:55because you said earlier
08:57that this matter will be decided
08:59on the battlefield,
09:01so you already seem to me convinced
09:03that there is no use of dialogue,
09:05if you are not open minded,
09:07you are the chief executive of the province,
09:09and if you are already convinced
09:11that this matter will be decided
09:13on the battlefield,
09:15then this is a non-starter
09:17on negotiations,
09:19that is why it is not happening,
09:21that you have a very hardline approach.
09:23Not at all,
09:25Mr. Malik,
09:27you may not be able to interpret me correctly,
09:29or my argument may not be right,
09:31I am telling you that
09:33any conflict is resolved,
09:35I am saying this theoretical thing in the world,
09:37that all the insurgencies in the world,
09:39all the separatist movements,
09:4190% of them have been resolved
09:43on the battlefield,
09:45that is why I am saying this,
09:47who is interested in fighting?