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00:00In Pope Francis' obituary, you called him a pontiff who shook up the Catholic Church.
00:07How did he do this?
00:08Well, he did it in a number of ways.
00:11First of all, his primary, one of the primary mottos of his pontificate was to look from
00:19the peripheries towards the centre instead of from the centre out towards the peripheries.
00:24Now, that came, that he enacted that in various ways.
00:30First of all, his first trips were to places that had been, I would say, second-rate.
00:38Other people would have considered second-rate places.
00:41His first trip was to go to Lampedusa, which is an island south of Sicily, which many thousands
00:49of migrants have died trying to get to this island.
00:53And that was his first trip to underscore his concern for migrants.
00:59And then the countries that he visited after that, I think Albania, he went to the far ends
01:04of the earth, and he never visited most of the main capitals of Europe, which was the opposite
01:11of what some previous popes had done to sort of go to these centres of Catholicism like Paris
01:18and London, other places, Lisbon.
01:21He did go to Lisbon later on, but first he went to some places that were really far-flung
01:27and have very few Catholics.
01:28Let's...
01:29Let's see.
01:30Let's see.