Sen. James Lankford took questions from the business community on Wednesday.
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00:00Would you please join me in welcoming our senior year senator, Jake Lankins?
00:11It's really good to visit with everybody.
00:13I hope you have submitted some questions on it, because I'm going to try to save as much time as I can to be able to go through questions,
00:18because there's a lot going on right now, and it's helpful to me as well to be able to get context on what people want to be able to talk about
00:25and the different questions and thoughts that you have.
00:27So happy birthday to my friend.
00:30I'm a senior United States senator, but I'm still a younger than Tony.
00:36But Chuck Grassley serves in the Senate, and he's 91, so that's one with a one at the end of it as well on it,
00:44and he's still serving every day in the Senate, so we're not looking here to retire anytime soon.
00:48So you have a lot of fun.
00:49So you have to be able to take it on.
00:52It is really a pleasure to be able to be here and to be able to be in the conversation today.
00:55I've made this time as often as I possibly can.
00:59What's interesting to me is the number of places that we have been and the conversations that we've had.
01:06I have to say a memorable conversation from several years ago when we had this, let's play at once,
01:11where some of you were there in the room, and this was not at this hotel, at a different place.
01:15And during the middle of my Q&A time, a water pipe broke, and it started flooding the room.
01:22Do you remember that time?
01:23There's like a back corner of the room on it, and for those of you that are here, you're like, oh, yeah, I remember that one.
01:28And so it's always interesting to be able to be in the dialogue.
01:31You set up a welcoming group for me outside this time, and I appreciate that.
01:35That'll make this welcoming.
01:36That's economic development downtown.
01:38I propose to be able to come down to town and be able to be here.
01:41Let me say two quick comments on things, and then I want to get your questions as fast as I can.
01:48The things that I'm hearing the most as I'm traveling around the state right now is where are we heading economically,
01:53what's actually occurring, what's going on with the tariffs, what's going on with trade,
01:57what's going on with tax, what's going on with Medicare, Medicaid, Social Security.
02:02I happen to serve on the Finance Committee in the Senate.
02:05The Finance Committee, let me just run through the jurisdiction of the Finance Committee in the Senate.
02:10It is tax, Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, and trade.
02:17It's a little bit in the news right now.
02:20We as Oklahomans are very proud to be able to be in the position that I'm in the Senate on the Finance Committee.
02:25Kevin Hearn is on the Ways and Means Committee in the House.
02:28There are very few states that have somebody that's on the Tax Writing Committee in both the House and the Senate.
02:33So that's a great benefit to us as we start talking about how we are going to shape the tax code in the direction that we're going to go in the days ahead.
02:41So let me just set a couple of context things to you.
02:44We begin with the most obvious of them.
02:46This year, the United States will overspend its budget by $2 trillion.
02:52That's not total budget, overspend its budget by $2 trillion.
02:59What happens when the United States of America borrows $2 trillion, by the way, again?
03:07Well, here's what happens on that.
03:09We suck up all the money out of the market, and so it makes interest rates for home mortgages go up, because there's more competition for those dollars.
03:20It makes it very difficult for third-world countries to get access to capital, because the United States is borrowing so much money on the global market,
03:28and the United States has been the safe place to be able to actually buy our homes.
03:32And so it makes it harder for them.
03:34And it pushes countries to be able to go to places like China to be able to get access to capital, because the Communist Chinese would be glad to be able to do that,
03:43but they've got a few strings attached in the process that comes to them when that happens.
03:48It's not just our economy.
03:50It's the global economy that is affected.
03:53And it's every single person in America, and their borrowing capability, is affected when we as a nation overspend.
03:59Now, I have brought this up year after year, and year after year, we as Oklahomans have said, yeah, we've got to do something about it.
04:10This is the year.
04:12We've got to do something about this.
04:14We have to find a way to be able to reduce spending.
04:16To tell you how far out of ours we really are right now,
04:19if we were spending the same amount that we did the year before COVID and had the revenue that we have now,
04:28to say the revenue that we have now, or the tax income now, in the spending from the year before COVID,
04:34the United States would be in balance this year.
04:38It's not that long ago.
04:41But we're not.
04:41The spending went up during COVID, and it just stayed up.
04:47And it's been very hard to be able to turn that back.
04:50So we've got to be able to go back to individual programs and just say, well, what's required by law?
04:55If it's not required by law, we should turn that down.
04:58If it's something we've added on since COVID, we need to take a look at that and to be able to say,
05:03does that need to be turned back to a level that maybe it was before COVID?
05:06And we need to look at all of our programs and the way that we're actually doing spending.
05:10These are things that every family does, every business does, on a regular basis.
05:14But the last time the federal government did a reinventing government was under the Clinton administration.
05:20Under President Clinton, the federal government reduced 400,000 federal jobs.
05:27We lose track of that.
05:29The reinventing government that President Clinton did was real,
05:33as they went through agency by agency and just asked the question,
05:37are there jobs that we can actually remove or reduce?
05:40Now, granted, President Clinton did that in seven years.
05:44President Trump is trying to do it in seven weeks.
05:47I do understand that.
05:48There is a difference on it.
05:50But we are long overdue for a re-evaluation.
05:53The last time we had a balanced budget where we were receiving the same amount that we were spending
05:59was under President Clinton.
06:01And there were hard decisions that were made during that time period, and they were made.
06:06And it started to bring us back into balance.
06:07And I understand this is the parts of the conversation at times to be able to talk about difficult things,
06:12but this is really a family conversation that we've got to have as a nation
06:15to try to figure out how do we do this.
06:19Because we have to do it all together.
06:22Now, I understand the President's leading in.
06:24He's trying to do as many things as he can.
06:25But ultimately, this is going to be Congress's responsibility.
06:27The courts are going to continue to be able to push back on the executive branch and to say,
06:31that's a law that was passed by Congress, signed by a president.
06:35That's a program that's in place.
06:37So Congress has to come back and revisit this.
06:39So we'll have to be in bipartisan conversation, ultimately, to determine,
06:44how do we actually slow down the rate of spending?
06:46We're not going to get back in balance a year.
06:48But to do that would be a catastrophic change in the federal – across the entire federal budget
06:53and across the country, and quite frankly, globally.
06:56It's still true that when the United States gets a cold, the rest of the world gets pneumonia.
07:01So we do have to be attentive on how we handle our economy.
07:06But we are going to have to take care of some things to be able to be engaged.
07:10While we're in the process of trying to be able to have these arguments,
07:13there will be 10,000 things that are thrown out there.
07:15Most of them will never happen.
07:18But according to social media, all of them happened yesterday.
07:22I do understand that.
07:23Let me give you a for instance.
07:25We started talking about Medicaid and saying,
07:29we've got to deal with some structural issues with Medicaid.
07:31Immediately, social media exploded and said,
07:35this is going to cut off Medicaid entirely.
07:37Then they're going after Medicare.
07:39Then they're going to shut off Social Security.
07:41Wow.
07:43That moved fast.
07:44Here's what the proposal was initially on Medicaid only.
07:48By the way, with the tax proposal we're talking about on what's called reconciliation,
07:54by law, we cannot do anything on Social Security.
07:58So not only is there no proposal on Social Security right now at all that's even being discussed,
08:03by law, we cannot even talk about it.
08:06So no, there's nothing being changed on Social Security.
08:09But I will give you a caveat.
08:11Eight years from now, Social Security goes and solve it.
08:15That means every single Social Security recipient, their benefits will be cut by law by 20%.
08:20That cannot happen.
08:22That cannot happen.
08:23So the real question is, when are we going to have the grown-up conversation about Social Security
08:30to be able to make sure that we stabilize that program long-term?
08:33Something that Tip O'Neill and Ronald Reagan did decades ago.
08:37When is that going to happen again?
08:39And how are we as a country going to encourage lawmakers to say,
08:42sit down with each other across the aisle and solve that problem?
08:48That still has to occur.
08:50On the Medicaid side, we need to talk about that.
08:53Here are the two big proposals that are out there on Medicaid right now.
08:56One is, on most of our social safety net programs that are in the federal government,
09:01there's also a work requirement.
09:03I go back to this, but you know when the work requirement got added in?
09:07Under President Clinton.
09:08That's when we got added in.
09:11Almost all of our social safety net programs happened back then.
09:14That used to be a nonpartisan issue, where it was,
09:18how are we going to encourage people to be able to get back to the workforce,
09:21because the workforce is where you rise out of poverty.
09:25The Brookings Institute, which is the center-left think tank,
09:28the Brookings Institute has for years actually put out their own study to say,
09:32how do people that are born in poverty rise out of poverty?
09:35Year after year, they do this study, and year after year,
09:37it comes out with the same results.
09:40Three things occur.
09:41These three things occur.
09:4297% chance you rise out of poverty if you're born in poverty.
09:46If you wait until after marriage to have children,
09:50if you graduate from high school, and you have a job of any type,
09:55even if it's entry-level minimum wage,
09:5897% chance that you rise out of poverty in your life.
10:0297%, wait until after marriage to have children, graduate high school, and have a job of any type.
10:10If we want to help people to be able to rise,
10:14one of the things that we should do is help people to be able to get to employment.
10:18That should be an incentive.
10:20And I've said this to this group before.
10:22I will say it again.
10:23I don't believe that work is punishment.
10:26Work is actually purposeful, not punishment.
10:28It gives us a reason to get out of bed.
10:30It changes the perspective from what's happening in my life to how am I serving other people.
10:35It turns our attention to how can I serve rather than how can I be served.
10:39Work is beneficial.
10:40And for those of us from a Christian worldview,
10:43in the Garden of Eden,
10:45before the fall,
10:46there was already work.
10:47Remember, God told them to tend the garden
10:50before the fall.
10:52Now, it got harder after the fall.
10:54I'm well aware of that.
10:56But work is not punishment.
10:57We were created to be able to work.
10:59We were created to be able to serve each other,
11:01to be able to care for each other in that way.
11:03And that's beneficial for our families
11:05and for our communities on this.
11:07So here's our crazy idea.
11:09Medicaid right now,
11:11for healthy adults
11:13with no children, no dependents,
11:16there is no work requirement.
11:19It's one of the few social safety net programs
11:21that doesn't have that.
11:22We're not talking about disabled individuals.
11:25We're not talking about moms with young children.
11:27We're talking about adults with no children
11:30that are healthy,
11:31that are on the Medicaid program.
11:33Why would we not have a work requirement there?
11:35What difference would a work requirement make in that?
11:38Well, the first thing is,
11:39if they get into an employment somewhere,
11:41most likely they're going to get employer-based healthcare
11:43and they're off their program entirely.
11:46That helps every single part of the program itself.
11:50That's a big issue,
11:51to be able to just incentivize people
11:53to be able to get to a job of any type on it
11:55and to be able to get employer-based healthcare.
11:59Those things make a difference in our federal budget.
12:01Here's another one.
12:02Right now,
12:04if someone lives in Arkansas,
12:07sees the light,
12:08and they move to Oklahoma,
12:09when they get here,
12:13if they're on Medicaid,
12:15it's very likely Medicaid
12:16is still paying Arkansas's benefit
12:18and Oklahoma's benefit.
12:20Very likely.
12:22Because the system is literally not being updated.
12:24So if they move in a year,
12:26to be able to know where to be able to pay.
12:27So that $3 billion is lost
12:30just from Medicaid literally paying
12:33for the same treatment in two different states,
12:37when there was only one treatment in one state.
12:41There are some structural problems that are in Medicaid
12:43that are in the billions of dollars
12:44that we should be able to address.
12:46Those are some of the crazy ideas
12:48that we're bringing up.
12:49They want to actually have a rational conversation
12:50with someone about Medicaid.
12:52They go,
12:52I said that kind of makes sense.
12:53Why didn't we do that a long time ago?
12:55There are billions of dollars
12:57and other things that we're trying to examine
12:58to say,
12:58how do we actually get this back
13:00to a stable system
13:01so we can operate this?
13:03And as you go throughout the federal government,
13:05we're trying to ask those questions
13:06of every single program
13:08to say,
13:09what can we do
13:10to be able to pull back our spending
13:11on the tax piece of it?
13:14Because in the bill
13:14that we're going to try to bring,
13:15we're hopefully going to bring this
13:16by the end of July.
13:17If it gets past July,
13:19blame it on Kevin Hearn in the House.
13:21It wasn't the Senate House.
13:22Tell him I said that too.
13:23We'll see it.
13:24But the Senate House
13:26are working together
13:26because by the way,
13:27Kevin and I have had lots of meetings
13:28and conversations
13:29to be able to talk about
13:30what are we doing together
13:30to be able to see
13:31if we can't get it
13:32into a central proposal
13:34on this to get this resolved.
13:36We hope to have this done
13:37by the end of July.
13:39Here's what the major part
13:40of the proposal is.
13:41I hear a lot of folks
13:42that say,
13:42okay,
13:42this is a huge tax decrease.
13:46Can you tell you
13:46what it actually is?
13:48Currently scheduled,
13:48right now,
13:49every single tax rate
13:50in America
13:51goes up January 1st
13:53of next year.
13:53The calendar,
13:55literally the calendar shift
13:56when that occurs,
13:57every single tax rate
13:58goes up.
13:59Some of my colleagues,
14:00I've heard them say
14:01this tax piece
14:02is only for billionaires
14:03and billionaires.
14:04Let me say this again.
14:05Every single American's
14:07tax rate will go up
14:08January 1st of next year.
14:12So our first step is
14:13just keep the rates
14:15the same as they are.
14:17Does that sound radical?
14:20Just don't make them go up.
14:21They're not going to go down either.
14:22Sorry,
14:22we still have a giant deficit.
14:25But just keep the rates
14:26the same as they are.
14:28That will help
14:29every single small business.
14:30That will help
14:30every single family
14:31to not have an impending doom
14:33coming up next year.
14:35For the average family,
14:36they're only going to be
14:36about $4,000 a year
14:38more in taxes
14:38if we don't act on this.
14:41So it is important
14:42that we actually act on this.
14:44The second thing
14:45we're trying to do
14:45is to try to make
14:46the tax changes permanent
14:47so that a calendar date
14:50doesn't change
14:50the future rates
14:51that Congress
14:52changes the future rates
14:53so that we don't have
14:55to worry about
14:55another ticking time bomb
14:56again another five
14:57or six years in the future
14:58that we know
14:59that's the rate,
15:00that stays the rate,
15:01and that we can
15:02at some point vote
15:03to be able to do that,
15:04but there's a large-scale
15:05debate to be able to do that.
15:06So rates would stay the same.
15:09Rates would be permanent.
15:10We're also trying to deal
15:11with some of the business
15:12aspects of it
15:13that are pretty common sense.
15:14Let me give you one
15:15that I'm reading right now
15:16called full dispensing.
15:17Full dispensing
15:18is a pretty rational argument
15:19on this.
15:20When you buy a big piece
15:22of capital equipment,
15:23you can expense that out
15:26over several years.
15:27You're going to pay
15:28the same amount of tax on it,
15:32but it would be so much better
15:33if you get to write it off
15:34in the same year
15:35that you buy it
15:36because that's when
15:38you have the big expenses
15:39business.
15:40So what I'm trying to do
15:41is to be able to say
15:42the same year
15:43that you buy
15:43a big piece of equipment,
15:45you should also be able
15:46to deduct that
15:46that same exact year
15:48not have to slowly deduct it
15:50over several years.
15:51What difference does that make?
15:52It encourages a lot
15:53of businesses
15:54to go ahead
15:54and buy that big piece
15:55of equipment
15:55because they know
15:56they can write it off
15:57this year on their taxes.
16:00That encourages them
16:01to produce more,
16:02be more efficient,
16:03add more people in.
16:04The person that actually
16:05made that piece of equipment
16:06sells additional pieces
16:07of equipment
16:07and it keeps
16:08the economy rolling on that.
16:10It's a common sense piece
16:11that makes no difference
16:12in the amount of revenue
16:13coming into the country,
16:14but it makes a big difference
16:16in actually how the economy
16:17actually runs.
16:18Let me give you another one.
16:20This has been an ongoing
16:20project for me
16:21for a while.
16:23Nonprofits.
16:25In 2017,
16:26we doubled
16:27the standard deduction
16:28so it made taxes
16:30a lot simpler
16:31for a lot of people.
16:33But here's what it also did
16:34is admit
16:35the vast majority
16:36of non-profit donations
16:37are not tax deductible anymore.
16:39If you deduct
16:40your non-profit donations,
16:43I'll smile at you
16:44and say
16:44you're in the top
16:459% of Americans
16:46because the top
16:489% of Americans
16:50are the ones
16:50that itemize
16:51and the ones
16:52that actually get
16:52the tax benefit
16:53from giving
16:55to non-profits.
16:56I'd like to make
16:57that tax benefit
16:58from giving
16:58to non-profits
16:59for every American
17:00and any American
17:02that wants to be able
17:03to do that.
17:04Why?
17:05Because the non-profits
17:05are an essential part
17:06of our social safety net.
17:07Our safety net
17:09are our families,
17:10our churches
17:10and non-profits
17:11and then government.
17:13And right now,
17:14we are not incentivizing
17:15giving to non-profits.
17:17And I know Americans
17:17are generous.
17:18I've heard that all the time.
17:20We're generous people.
17:21We give anyway.
17:22But people give more
17:23in December
17:24for a reason
17:24and it's not
17:25the Christmas spirit.
17:27It's because they know
17:28I've got to give
17:29an extra amount
17:29to be able to go
17:30towards taking this off
17:31on my taxes
17:32if you're in that group.
17:33But if you're not
17:33in that group,
17:34then you're the 91%
17:35of Americans
17:36that don't get
17:37to write off
17:38your non-profit donations.
17:39You don't have
17:40the same incentive.
17:41Also this,
17:42let me just set this number
17:43out for you.
17:45The average American
17:46gives 1.7%
17:48of their income
17:49to non-profits.
17:501.7%.
17:52From the time of COVID
17:55and just before
17:58when the 2017 tax bill
17:59actually kicked in
18:01to now,
18:02non-profits
18:03have $20 billion
18:04less in giving
18:06because of that change
18:08to the tax bill.
18:09$20 billion.
18:11That's a huge effect
18:12on the hungry,
18:13on the homeless,
18:14and the hurting.
18:15A huge effect.
18:17So I want to be able
18:18to turn that back on.
18:19There's a million
18:20other little fights
18:21on tax bill.
18:21And if y'all have questions
18:22about it,
18:23we'll get a chance
18:23to be able to go through it.
18:24Otherwise,
18:24I'm going to make everybody
18:25fall asleep
18:26in their concert
18:26talking about tax issues.
18:29But just know
18:29this is the time.
18:30If you've got ideas
18:31and thoughts
18:32on tax issues,
18:33this is the time
18:33to be able to bring it
18:34because we have
18:35a lot of issues
18:36that we've got to be
18:36able to deal with,
18:37whether it's IECs,
18:39for oil and gas,
18:40or whether it's non-profits,
18:42or whether it's
18:42full expensing.
18:43There's a lot of things
18:44that we're dealing with
18:44right now
18:44and going through
18:45the details of those things.
18:46So we'll set that aside
18:47and talk about it later.
18:48The last thing
18:49I want to be able
18:49to talk about
18:49and I'm going to get
18:50to your questions.
18:51Have you heard
18:52there's a little
18:52conversation internationally
18:54about tariffs?
18:54Has anybody heard that?
18:57It's not been
18:58in the news much,
18:59so you might have missed it.
19:00Let me bring this up here.
19:03The President's been
19:04very focused
19:05on trying to be able
19:06to negotiate
19:06with as many countries
19:08as fast as he can.
19:09To say,
19:10what can we do
19:10to be able to bring down
19:11trade barriers?
19:12And just about everybody
19:13I've talked to here
19:14said we've got to
19:15bring down trade barriers.
19:16We have countries
19:17that we do a lot of trade with,
19:18like Vietnam.
19:20We do a lot of trade
19:21with Vietnam,
19:21and by the way,
19:22that's a remarkable story
19:23of the United States
19:24and Vietnam
19:24five decades later
19:26in the amount of trade
19:27that we do with them.
19:29But Vietnam
19:30has some very real trade barriers
19:31with blocking
19:32the American products
19:33coming into them.
19:35One of our closest allies,
19:36Australia,
19:37they fought
19:38every single war with us.
19:40The Aussies
19:40have been right next to us.
19:42We have a very close
19:43relationship
19:43with the Australian government.
19:45But the Australians
19:46also block
19:47American beef
19:48from going into Australia.
19:50When you go to McDonald's
19:51and get your hamburger,
19:5280% of that beef
19:53is American,
19:5420% of it's Australia.
19:56But if you go to Australia,
19:58there is no American beef
19:59in that
20:00because they block it out.
20:03We need to fix that.
20:05We're friends
20:06in Australia.
20:07We should be able
20:07to resolve that.
20:08The largest democracy
20:09in the world
20:10is India.
20:12India has very high barriers
20:14to American products
20:15coming in.
20:15And I understand
20:16they have more
20:16than a billion people
20:17and they're trying
20:18to be able to work
20:18to be able to rise
20:19out of poverty,
20:20but they're blocking
20:21American goods
20:22coming into their country
20:23that are open markets
20:25for a billion people.
20:27We need to be able
20:27to bring those down.
20:29Currently,
20:29the Vice President
20:30is actually just
20:30leaving out from India
20:31from sitting down
20:32signing an initial proposal
20:34about what to be able
20:35to work through
20:35to be able to get
20:36to bringing
20:37those trade barriers down.
20:38That's a good thing
20:39to be able to work
20:40on bringing
20:41all those trade barriers down.
20:43This crowd knows
20:44I'm not a big fan
20:45of tariffs.
20:47I'm just not.
20:48The tariffs are a very
20:49effective negotiating tactic
20:51to be able to say
20:52you need to come
20:54to the table
20:54to actually be able
20:56to negotiate.
20:56I've had all kinds
20:57of conversations
20:57even recently
20:58with the United States
20:59Trade Representative,
21:01with our Treasury Secretary,
21:02members of the administration
21:03about how the negotiations
21:04are going.
21:05And the negotiations
21:05are going as fast
21:06as they can go.
21:07And they're trying
21:08to lock it in.
21:09My advice to them is
21:10lock down as many deals
21:12as you can
21:12as fast as you can
21:13as soon as you lock
21:14one down
21:15and announce it
21:15and let everybody know
21:16we're making progress
21:17and we're clicking
21:18through the different
21:18countries and agreements.
21:20The President's announced
21:21even in the past 24 hours
21:22that he's aggressively
21:23working to be able
21:24to bring down tariff rates
21:25and things like China
21:26and to be able
21:27to actually engage
21:27and say let's sit down
21:28across the table
21:29and to be able
21:29to resolve things.
21:30We do need to get rid
21:31of trade barriers.
21:33We do want to be able
21:34to open up opportunities
21:34for American companies
21:35to do more business
21:36all around the world.
21:38We do need to block out
21:39trade barriers
21:40with other countries
21:41that we're even close
21:42to a relationship with.
21:42Israel is one of our
21:45closest partners
21:46in the world.
21:48Israel has had
21:49a 17% tariff
21:51on American drugs.
21:57Benjamin Netanyahu
21:58just announced
21:59that is going to zero.
22:02That's a big deal
22:03for American companies
22:04and the opportunity
22:05to be able to sell
22:06a record world.
22:07So even with our friends,
22:09these things need
22:10to be resolved.
22:11But my advice is
22:12resolve as quickly
22:13as we can.
22:14Stabilize the opportunity
22:15where people can actually
22:16do contracts
22:17because our worst case scenario
22:19is people pause
22:20for two, three, four months
22:21to be able to figure out
22:23what's going to happen
22:23in the future
22:24and we start having
22:25supply chain issues
22:26like we did during COVID
22:27where there's one or two parts
22:29that people just can't get
22:30and we start to be able
22:32to be able to know
22:32what's going to happen.
22:33So I'm staying engaged
22:35on this.
22:36I am very optimistic
22:37that they're going to land
22:38some very significant
22:39trade agreements
22:40to be able to open up
22:41new markets
22:41and in the meantime
22:42be able to bring tariff rates
22:43back down again
22:44so that we can actually
22:45continue to advance
22:46our trade around the world.
22:48I want the United States
22:49to be known as the place
22:50to sell,
22:50the place to buy,
22:52and the place to be able
22:52to do business.
22:53We should be that way.
22:55All right,
22:55let me open this up
22:56for questions.
22:56What do y'all want to talk about?
22:58We're talking about
22:59any of those issues
22:59with Thunder, basketball,
23:00whatever you want to talk about.
23:02Yeah.
23:03Okay, thank you.
23:03Thank you, Senator Langford.
23:05Okay, so we're going to move
23:06into our question
23:07and answer portion.
23:09I have a question
23:09to get us started,
23:11but please continue
23:12to use that QR code
23:13to submit your questions
23:15to us.
23:16You did cover
23:17a lot of the questions
23:18that we've received
23:19in your opening comments,
23:20but I'm going to get
23:21them all rolling with this.
23:23Earlier this week,
23:24the Hill reported
23:25that you've urged
23:26the Senate to return
23:27to the, quote,
23:28grunt work of legislating.
23:30What do you believe
23:30has been preventing
23:31that from happening,
23:32and how do you see
23:33yourself and your colleagues
23:35setting an example
23:36to get the Senate back
23:37to actively pass
23:38this legislation?
23:39Thanks for putting
23:40that question up.
23:41Yeah, the Senate
23:42is a place where
23:43you have to be able
23:43to sit down
23:44with people you disagree
23:45with and be able
23:45to solve problems.
23:47And it's not simple.
23:49You've got to sit down
23:50and say,
23:50you and I both agree
23:51there's a problem,
23:52we don't agree
23:52on what the solution is.
23:54And so we have to sit down
23:55and just actually
23:56go through the process.
23:57The biggest part
23:58of that is the committees.
24:00Our committees
24:01have not actively worked
24:02to be able
24:03to move legislation,
24:04with some big exceptions,
24:05but most of the committees
24:06are not actively working
24:07to be able
24:08to move legislation
24:09through the speed
24:10we need to be able
24:10to get it done.
24:11The committees
24:11is where you sit down
24:12almost an equal number
24:13of Republicans
24:14and Democrats,
24:15and you have to be able
24:16to hash out that issue.
24:17Your staff are working
24:18it through,
24:18members are working
24:19it through.
24:20The more we can resolve
24:21things in the committee
24:22structure,
24:23the better it is,
24:24the more likely it is
24:24that action moves
24:25across the floor
24:26and actually gets passed.
24:28I think America
24:29needs to see progress.
24:31They don't need
24:31to see good luck.
24:33They need to say,
24:34we've got 50 problems,
24:35what's the first one
24:36we're going to work on
24:37when we get done
24:37with that one,
24:38what's the second one,
24:39what's the third one?
24:40That's just grunt work
24:41of going through the process.
24:42And so that's my encouragement
24:43to Leader Thune,
24:44who's been great
24:45on this, by the way.
24:46He's been very aggressive
24:47pushing back on the committees.
24:49It's my encouragement
24:50for my colleagues as well.
24:54Okay.
24:54So you play a key role
24:56in crafting a bipartisan
24:57border security
24:58and immigration reform bill.
25:00It included provisions
25:01like building the wall,
25:02increasing border patrol agents,
25:04and enhancing asylum processes.
25:06Given that Republicans
25:07now hold a trifecta
25:09in government,
25:09do you believe a version
25:11of this bill
25:11has a better chance
25:12of passing?
25:13And what adjustments
25:15would you make
25:15to secure its passage
25:17in the current
25:17political landscape?
25:18Yeah, interesting
25:19question on that.
25:20Thanks for bringing up
25:21the traumatic moment.
25:22I'm sorry,
25:22I appreciate it.
25:23I have to tell you,
25:25that bill,
25:27I still stand by it.
25:29When people have actually
25:30read the bill,
25:31most people that have read it
25:33and gone through it
25:33go,
25:33oh, that's not what
25:34social media said it was.
25:36And that's not said it.
25:37Occasionally,
25:38social media is wrong.
25:39Just occasionally.
25:40The bill actually reshapes
25:44how we actually process
25:46folks coming across the border
25:47and we close some
25:48of the loopholes
25:49that are in the asylum system
25:50that are a real problem
25:51that have been a problem
25:52for it in decades
25:52and everyone knows it.
25:54And it really changed
25:56the system of how we do it.
25:58When you get to the end,
25:59if you make an asylum request
26:00to come across the border,
26:0297% of the people
26:03do not qualify for it.
26:05But they won't find that out
26:06until the very end.
26:07So they're here
26:09sometimes for years
26:10until they actually
26:11find out at the end,
26:12oh, I don't qualify
26:13for asylum.
26:14Now 3% do,
26:15but 97% don't.
26:17So this is how radical
26:18that bill was.
26:19We took the information
26:21at the end
26:22and moved it
26:22to the beginning.
26:25And so you'd find out
26:26within days or weeks,
26:28no, you don't qualify
26:29and you'd be turned around
26:30rather than five years later
26:32find out you don't qualify.
26:34That didn't seem
26:34that radical to me
26:35to be able to shift
26:37the rules of the end
26:38to the rules of the beginning.
26:39Second thing we did
26:40was said if the cartels
26:43flood the border
26:43with let's say 5,000 people,
26:45they flood the border,
26:46which they do often
26:47because they can break
26:48the system,
26:49when that occurs,
26:51we don't even screen
26:52on those days.
26:53If you get overwhelmed
26:54with people,
26:55then we just turn
26:56everyone around,
26:57all 100%.
26:58No one gets in
26:59during those days at all.
27:00I thought that was
27:02a pretty common sense thing.
27:03We called it
27:04a break last moment
27:05because we knew
27:06if we turned people around
27:07without that,
27:08the courts would say,
27:09no, you've got to
27:10screen people,
27:10so we're actually
27:11going to make law on it
27:12and to say,
27:13if the system is overwhelmed,
27:15no one gets in
27:15until we can actually
27:16do an orderly process on it.
27:18Now that turned into,
27:20we're letting 5,000 people
27:21in a day every single day,
27:23which was totally false,
27:24but it didn't matter.
27:25It got repeated enough
27:26that everyone just bought it.
27:28So here's what I think
27:30is going to happen.
27:30I think for the next two years,
27:32the president's going to use
27:33every bit of executive authority
27:34he could possibly use
27:35to be able to dramatically
27:37reduce the numbers.
27:38And let me just tell you,
27:39the numbers have dramatically
27:40reduced, dramatically.
27:42When I was arguing out
27:43through the border bill
27:45and the Biden administration,
27:46we had 12,000 people a day
27:49that were illegally
27:50crossing the border.
27:51Now we have less than 200 a day
27:54even attempting.
27:56From 12,000
27:57to less than 200.
28:00Dramatic difference.
28:02Here's what I think will occur.
28:03I think the courts
28:04will do some rulings
28:05and will say to the president,
28:08you can't do that.
28:09You can't do this,
28:10but you can't do that.
28:12And as soon as they can't do that
28:14comes out with the courts,
28:15the cartels
28:16will start doing that.
28:19They will train people
28:20coming across the border
28:21and they'll make sure
28:21they say a certain phrase,
28:23go to a certain place,
28:24do a certain thing,
28:25and will start to be able
28:26to penetrate that new policy.
28:27It's the exact same thing
28:28that happened
28:28under the first Trump administration.
28:30Under the first Trump administration,
28:31they clamped down very strongly
28:33on the border
28:33the first two years.
28:34By year three,
28:36almost a million people
28:37that year illegally
28:38crossed the border.
28:39Almost a million.
28:41That's when they created
28:42Romania and Mexico.
28:43They created Washington policies
28:44trying to be able to test out
28:45how can they manage this.
28:46I think by year three,
28:48we'll start to see
28:48some of the numbers
28:49come up again.
28:50I'm not gearing for that.
28:51I'm just telling you,
28:52the cartels are losing
28:53billions of dollars
28:54in trafficking people right now
28:56and they're business people as well.
28:58In illegal activity,
28:59but they're business people.
29:01And they will find a way
29:02that they will exploit
29:03those loopholes.
29:03And so we will need it.
29:04So my anticipation is
29:06by year three,
29:07we're going to sit down
29:08in a bipartisan way
29:09and we're going to start
29:10working through
29:11how to be able to close
29:12some of these loopholes
29:13that exist no matter
29:14who is president.
29:16Also, I think a lot of people
29:17have been surprised.
29:18President Trump,
29:18in his very first interview
29:19that he came out with
29:20when he sat down
29:21with Kristen Walker
29:22right after he was elected,
29:24that very first interview
29:25he came out and said,
29:27I want to legalize
29:27DACA recipients.
29:29I want to make them citizens.
29:31And I think a lot of people
29:32were shocked by that
29:33in that very first interview.
29:35I was not.
29:36I've heard him say it privately
29:37multiple times.
29:39But legalizing the DACA recipients
29:41and getting them citizenship
29:42requires an act of Congress
29:44to do that.
29:45What he's really saying is,
29:47I want to do a bill.
29:48So come and talk to me.
29:50Let's negotiate this out.
29:52So that was a pretty clear
29:53signal to my Democratic colleagues
29:54that I've reminded them
29:55of often,
29:56this is going to require
29:57both sides sitting down
29:58to be able to work this out.
29:59So it's coming,
30:00but it's not today.
30:03Okay.
30:04So the availability of beds
30:06for the acutely mentally ill
30:07in government-fed facilities
30:09is at a critical low.
30:11Is there an avenue
30:11in which Congress
30:12could incentivize
30:13the private health industry
30:14through tax credits
30:15to expand out that space
30:17in their facilities
30:18where they're not
30:19always operating at a loss?
30:21Yeah.
30:22Incredibly difficult.
30:23This is one of those partnerships
30:24with many of those
30:25are Medicaid recipients.
30:27This is a partnership
30:27between the state of Oklahoma
30:28and between the federal government.
30:30Some states have been more aggressive
30:31on this than others.
30:33Our state, by the way,
30:34has significantly turned up
30:36care for those individuals
30:38that have intellectual disabilities
30:39or that have mental issues
30:42that they're trying to be able
30:43to process through
30:43or substance abuse.
30:45So I do hand it to our state.
30:47We've done a lot
30:48in the last five years.
30:50They've turned up funding.
30:51They've turned up opportunities.
30:52There's new construction
30:53that's going on.
30:54But we're not caught up yet.
30:56We still have a ways to go.
30:58The prime mover on that
30:59is actually going to be
31:00the state of Oklahoma
31:01or it's going to be
31:02the federal government
31:02to be able to help that.
31:04And our state is taking note of that
31:06and is aggressively doing it,
31:08but we've got to be able to do more.
31:09But we're going to do
31:10a little bit at a time,
31:11and we're doing that
31:12a little bit at a time right now.
31:14Can you talk a little bit
31:15about the fact
31:16that we are one of three states
31:18that has Medicaid enshrined
31:21in our Constitution
31:22and maybe how Oklahoma's
31:27are feeling right now
31:27or hospitals are feeling
31:29or providers about the potential
31:31of two cuts
31:32and what that's going to do
31:34to our state budget?
31:35Yeah, there's a lot of conversation
31:36about what would it mean
31:38on cuts in Medicaid.
31:40There's a couple things with this.
31:42One is our state does
31:45what a lot of states do.
31:46We have what we call
31:46a provider tax.
31:48Okay, so don't gloss out on me.
31:49Okay?
31:50Give me just a second.
31:51I'll go faster.
31:52The state literally taxes
31:54long-term care facilities,
31:56hospitals, others,
31:58and say,
31:58you pay an extra amount.
31:59We'll put that into our state portion,
32:01and then we'll get more federal funds down.
32:03We'll get more federal funds down.
32:05That'll come back to your hospital line.
32:07So the hospital typically breaks even
32:08or goes into black
32:10by what they donate in
32:11on the provider tax
32:13to what actually comes back to them.
32:15Any view in hospital care?
32:16You can clarify this if you want.
32:18I'll give you equal time
32:21to be able to answer that.
32:23Some states do more than others.
32:24Ours is 4% for our providers.
32:27Some states have as high as 6%.
32:28What that does
32:29is that pulls down more federal funds.
32:31Everybody knows this game
32:33has happened for years.
32:35It was designed to say
32:36the state has a certain portion
32:37they put in,
32:37the federal government
32:38has a certain portion they put in,
32:40but states are going to providers
32:41and saying,
32:41if we're going to get more Medicaid funds,
32:43we've got to kick in more.
32:45At some point,
32:45we've got to figure out
32:46how to be able to cap that,
32:47control that,
32:48manage that in some ways.
32:50And that's part of the debate.
32:52It's really going to push on
32:54some states like,
32:54I'm going to say,
32:55California and New York
32:56and Illinois,
32:57who have numbers like 6%
32:59provider taxes
33:00that are very, very high
33:01for those,
33:02to be able to help push back
33:03to try to figure out
33:04how do we actually
33:05ask the states to do
33:06what the states said
33:07they were agreeing to do
33:08instead of then passing on
33:09an additional tax fund.
33:11Now, I told you
33:12not to gloss over on it,
33:13but that's one of the areas
33:15of Medicaid we're talking about
33:16and trying to be able to figure
33:17out what's the right number
33:18and the right percentage.
33:18We're all keenly aware,
33:20especially of rural hospitals.
33:22I've been home,
33:23this is now my,
33:24this is my third week
33:25this year
33:26to be back in Oklahoma.
33:28And man,
33:29it's really nice
33:29to be back in Oklahoma.
33:30Because we've been in D.C. a lot,
33:32we've been moving a lot
33:33of things very rapidly there.
33:35But I spend a lot of time
33:36with rural hospitals as well
33:37while I've been home
33:38because they are
33:39the most vulnerable
33:40in the system.
33:41And to be able to make sure
33:42that the system
33:43actually works for them.
33:44Interesting side note on this,
33:45the rural hospitals
33:47I've spoken to,
33:48all of them have said
33:49Medicaid is now
33:51their best payer.
33:53Better than Medicare,
33:55better than commercial insurance,
33:56their best payer
33:57is Medicaid.
33:59That's a huge shift
34:01that's just occurred
34:01in the last few years
34:02in the way our state
34:03does the payments
34:04and what's actually happening
34:06on the federal side as well.
34:07And I've literally heard that
34:08from every single rural hospital
34:10that I've talked to.
34:11So I'm grateful
34:12that that part of the system
34:13is actually working better
34:14than it has in the past.
34:17With the current
34:18administration's focus
34:20on deregulation,
34:21for example,
34:22environmental regulations,
34:23where do you see
34:24those efforts going
34:25in the next few years
34:26and what impacts
34:27do you think
34:28that will have
34:29on business in Oklahoma?
34:30Yeah, so there'll be
34:31several agreements
34:32that are out there
34:32that can be made
34:33to deal with environmental
34:34regulations.
34:35And let me be clear on this.
34:36If you look at
34:37the executive orders
34:38that the Trump administration
34:40has done
34:40on environmental regulations,
34:42read the executive order.
34:44Again, not
34:44much on social media,
34:45read actually
34:46what's on the executive order.
34:47They've been very clear
34:48on all of that
34:49to the EPA administrator,
34:51to others,
34:52to say,
34:52you fulfill everything
34:55that is required
34:55by the law to fulfill,
34:58but find areas
34:59where the administration
35:01in the past
35:02has gone beyond
35:03what the law requires
35:05and in those.
35:07So basically,
35:08if this was an act
35:09of Congress,
35:10if this was made into law,
35:11do it,
35:13follow the law.
35:14But if there were
35:15additional things
35:16that were made up
35:16that were new requirements,
35:19don't.
35:21That's what they're
35:21going after initially.
35:23And by the way,
35:24I'm pleased to be able
35:25to say that.
35:26We are a nation of laws.
35:27And if it's in the law,
35:28we need to be able
35:29to follow it.
35:30And if it's just
35:30a preference issue
35:31that's causing billions
35:32of dollars of damage
35:33to our economy
35:34and making things unstable,
35:36that's just an executive action
35:38that was taken
35:38at some point
35:39in the past
35:39that's literally
35:40making it harder
35:41to be able
35:42to do business.
35:43So that's what
35:44they're going after
35:45in every single area
35:46on this.
35:46And by the way,
35:47our federal courts
35:47are still out there.
35:49Every single one
35:49of these are going
35:50to be challenged.
35:51We'll go through
35:51the court system
35:52to be able
35:52to be evaluated
35:53on that.
35:54And I have great respect
35:55for where we are
35:55in our federal courts.
35:57They'll continue
35:58to be able
35:58to do their job.
35:59It takes time
35:59to be able to do it,
36:01but they'll continue
36:01to be able
36:02to do their job
36:02to be able
36:03to make sure
36:03the checks and balances
36:04continue to work.
36:06Okay, you got one more?
36:07I've got one more.
36:08And for those of you
36:09in the room
36:10that don't know,
36:11you have a new book out,
36:13Turnaround,
36:13America's Revival,
36:15has been widely praised
36:16by notable figures
36:17like former Secretary
36:18of State Mike Pompeo,
36:20former Congressman
36:21Trey Gowdy,
36:22for its thoughtful
36:23reflection,
36:23humor,
36:24and inspiration.
36:25In it, though,
36:26you address
36:27the divisiveness
36:28our country
36:28is experiencing.
36:30What responsibilities
36:31do elected officials
36:32have to ease
36:33the division
36:34in our state
36:34and country?
36:35We do have
36:37responsibility on that.
36:38Thanks.
36:38I don't want to put
36:38that question on the desk.
36:39Thank you for that.
36:41The book I put out
36:42actually came out
36:43two weeks ago,
36:43and it is called
36:44Turnaround,
36:44America's Revival.
36:45It's only had been
36:46writing for three years.
36:48It's not recent.
36:49As you can imagine,
36:50my time is pretty limited.
36:51I think it's been
36:52on the plane.
36:53It's been weekends
36:54when I've been home,
36:55and I would say to my wife,
36:56I'd go into study
36:56in our house,
36:57and I'd say,
36:58I'm going into the coal mine.
37:00I'll come out
37:01of the coal mine
37:01when this chapter's done
37:02and just keep working on it,
37:04just keep chipping away on it.
37:05And then it's just come out.
37:08It's really two things
37:10that are happening.
37:10One is,
37:11it's a challenge to us
37:12as Americans
37:12to say,
37:14stop voting for people
37:15and think they're going
37:16to do it.
37:17And I don't mean
37:18just follow their word.
37:19I mean,
37:19do everything.
37:20I have so many people
37:21that I've talked to
37:22who say,
37:22I elected that person
37:23they're going to take care of
37:24and I don't have to do anything.
37:24I was like,
37:25that's not America.
37:26We all are engaged
37:27in our church,
37:28in non-profits,
37:29in local communities,
37:30volunteering in our schools.
37:31The reason America's been
37:33so strong historically
37:34is because every American
37:35has an opportunity
37:36to be able to serve
37:37their fellow Americans
37:38in practical ways,
37:39and we do it.
37:40At the moment we sit down
37:42and say,
37:43I elected those people,
37:44they'll do it.
37:45Mike Neal,
37:45he'll take care of all that.
37:46At the moment we do that,
37:49then we begin to get weaker,
37:51and we wonder
37:52what just happened.
37:53It's because we,
37:55the people,
37:56sat down.
37:58And so a big part
37:58of my encouragement
37:59is find an area
38:02that God is giving
38:03a passion for
38:04and go volunteer.
38:05Go get engaged.
38:06Go participate in that.
38:08Go find that.
38:08And I give a lot
38:09of Oklahoma illustrations,
38:10including some
38:11from Tulsa area,
38:12to be able to talk about
38:12here are things
38:13that I've seen
38:14in the past.
38:15One of them
38:15is from Sperry.
38:16I'll let you just
38:17read the book sometime
38:18to be able to read that story.
38:20One of them
38:20is the Big Ten Ballroom.
38:22That's in North Tulsa.
38:23But I've got multiple
38:23different illustrations.
38:24I would say,
38:25here's where people
38:26actually engaged.
38:27They saw something
38:27and they wanted
38:28to be able to get engaged.
38:30So I tell some of the stories
38:32from American history
38:33and from us currently,
38:34by the way,
38:35because I think
38:35we have the opportunity
38:36as a state
38:37to be able to set the example
38:38for the rest of the country.
38:40The second part of the book
38:41really focuses in on
38:42what I would say
38:44is the theme of,
38:45you know they can't hear you
38:46when you yell at the TV, right?
38:49We have become a nation
38:51that our signature emotion
38:52is anger.
38:55I've yet to meet somebody
38:57that can tell me
38:59they make their best decisions
39:00when they're angry.
39:03We don't.
39:05But we're becoming a nation
39:06that every day
39:07we want to be angrier
39:08than we were yesterday.
39:10And there's plenty
39:11to be angry about.
39:12I get that.
39:13But just riling up our anger
39:14didn't solve the problem.
39:15We talk a lot
39:17in our staff
39:18about there's a right thing
39:20to do
39:20and a right way to do it.
39:22We have to do both of those.
39:23We talk a lot
39:24as a staff to say
39:25if there's a fire
39:26pour water on it
39:28not gasoline.
39:30But right now
39:30you get social media clicks
39:32and you get praise
39:33and you end up
39:33in the 24-hour news
39:34at night
39:35if you are the loudest
39:36angriest person
39:37in the room.
39:39That may help them
39:40get social media clicks.
39:41It doesn't help us
39:42as a country.
39:42We don't need that right now.
39:45We need to solve
39:46our problems.
39:47And that involves
39:48bringing the dialogue
39:48up and volume down
39:50and trying to be able
39:52to figure out
39:52how to be able to resolve that.
39:53So I do
39:54I'm quite frankly
39:55pretty blunt with us
39:56to say
39:57what can we do
39:58to actually start
39:59to be able to work this out
40:00and I'll lay us
40:01some very practical ideas
40:02on that personally.
40:04For me
40:05and it's funny
40:07because I made a joke
40:08about some of the protesters
40:09that are out front
40:10I don't mind
40:12sitting down with people
40:12I disagree with.
40:13I just don't.
40:14If they want to work
40:15towards a solution
40:16okay you're my fellow American
40:17you're my fellow Oklahoma
40:18and you're a neighbor
40:19you see a problem
40:20I see a problem
40:21I want to be able
40:21to hear you out
40:22let's figure out
40:23how we actually resolve this.
40:25But when it's just all about
40:26how loud can we yell
40:27at each other
40:27I just don't have time
40:28for that.
40:29I've got a lot of other
40:29things I can do.
40:31I don't have time
40:31to have people yell at me.
40:32Plus
40:32no one's ever convinced me
40:34by coming and yelling
40:35and cursing in my face.
40:37No one's ever moved me.
40:38I've never once said
40:38you know what
40:39you're so smart
40:40I should think like you.
40:41I've just never said that
40:43to someone screaming
40:44and yelling in my face.
40:45So I don't find that helpful
40:46for me to be able
40:47to do that to someone else
40:48because I assume
40:48that they're the same
40:49like I am on that
40:50to be able to do it.
40:51So for me
40:52and as funny as it sounds
40:53I had a book released
40:55at a theme tank
40:57in Washington DC
40:58called AEI
40:58and at that book release
41:00we literally had protesters
41:01that showed up in the crowd
41:02to be able to scream
41:03and curse at me
41:04in the crowd.
41:05And I have to say
41:06to the organizer
41:06at the panel
41:07I was like
41:07I promise I didn't
41:08blame these people
41:09but this is exactly
41:10what I'm talking about
41:11is the problem right now.
41:13We're all so angry
41:15that we won't actually
41:16sit down and be able
41:17to work stuff out.
41:19We, the people
41:20have to sit down
41:22and resolve the hard problems
41:23and I think we can.
41:25We're Americans.
41:26We're known for solving
41:27the hard things.
41:28Lots of other countries
41:29around the world
41:30and I list some of those out
41:31that they see a problem
41:32and go
41:33it's just always
41:33going to be that way.
41:34We as Americans
41:35say there's a problem
41:35we should fix that.
41:37So I say to us
41:38let's set the example
41:40as Oklahomans.
41:42We see the problem
41:43if the country
41:45is growing out of control
41:46in our anger
41:47then why don't we
41:48set the example
41:49for the rest of the country.
41:51Why don't we
41:52sit down with people
41:53we disagree with
41:54instead of saying
41:54them and us
41:56why don't we
41:57actually start
41:58working that out.
41:59I don't think
42:00that's too radical
42:01of a concept.
42:02That's what we have done
42:02for the rest
42:03that's what we
42:04should do again.