New Acquisitions – Collector talk: private collections, corporate collections and public institutions in dialogue.
Gudrun Ruetz, private collector and founder of Art’Us Collectors' Collective, Susanne Kaufmann-Valet, curator for 20th/21st centuries, Staatsgalerie Stuttgart, Sarah Haberkorn, curator of LBBW Collection.
Host: Elke Buhr, editor in chief of Monopol magazine.
(in German language)
Art Cologne 2023, Talks Lounge. Cologne (Germany), November 18, 2023, 12-1pm.
Gudrun Ruetz, private collector and founder of Art’Us Collectors' Collective, Susanne Kaufmann-Valet, curator for 20th/21st centuries, Staatsgalerie Stuttgart, Sarah Haberkorn, curator of LBBW Collection.
Host: Elke Buhr, editor in chief of Monopol magazine.
(in German language)
Art Cologne 2023, Talks Lounge. Cologne (Germany), November 18, 2023, 12-1pm.
Category
📚
LearningTranscript
00:00 [no audio]
00:09 I am very happy to be able to open today's Art Cologne talk program
00:16 with our LBBW Art Talk with Monopol,
00:20 a cooperation of the LBBW collection with Monopol and Art Cologne.
00:24 Let me introduce myself. I am Elke Buhr, I am the chief editor of Monopol.
00:28 I am very happy to be here and I am also very happy to be part of our talk,
00:33 which is about to start.
00:35 I will introduce the panel members first.
00:39 Today we are an all-women panel,
00:41 which we did not do for ideological reasons,
00:44 but because it turned out to be so, and I think it's very nice.
00:48 To my left is Susanne Kaufmann.
00:52 She is curator for the 20th and 21st century at the Staatsgalerie Stuttgart.
00:57 In our collector's talk, she represents the public institutions.
01:04 To my left is Gudrun Rötz.
01:07 She is a private collector and the founder of a collective
01:11 of collectors called Art as Collectors Collective.
01:16 We will discuss what that is.
01:20 To my right is Sarah Haberkorn.
01:22 She is the curator of the LBBW collection, the collection of the Landesbank Baden-Württemberg.
01:28 The LBBW collection has a big presentation in the upper hall.
01:32 You can get to know the collection even better there.
01:35 We at Monopol got to know the collection very well,
01:39 because we have just released a very nice special edition this year
01:44 about the new acquisitions of the collection,
01:49 where we present artists and works.
01:51 You can also take a look at our booth when you come by.
01:55 It's about collecting, public and private collections,
01:59 and how they interact.
02:01 I think that's a big topic at the exhibition,
02:04 which many people are interested in.
02:05 At the exhibition, I meet many private collectors,
02:09 but also representatives of institutions.
02:12 The question is, who buys what and for whom?
02:18 It's about the tension between what you want for yourself,
02:22 and maybe also the money,
02:24 and what collecting means for the public.
02:28 We want to get a little closer to that in our conversation today.
02:31 But first, I'd like to know from Gudrun Rütz,
02:35 what the Art as Collectors...
02:38 Oh my God, I can't pronounce it.
02:40 It's best if we stick to the collective.
02:42 The name is "Insofernprogramm",
02:45 and we want to be a group, a collective,
02:48 a community of equal rights, equal private collectors,
02:54 who have come together to do more for the artists
03:00 we collect.
03:02 And with that, I'd like to say,
03:04 we can always stick to the collective.
03:06 We are currently four collections,
03:11 each individually, started about six years ago.
03:16 And our idea, which is also the discussion at the moment,
03:21 is, where can we have a common warehouse?
03:25 Are the works of art collected somewhere in the center?
03:30 For us, we have a virtual show warehouse,
03:34 where we make the works available,
03:36 completely neutral, and with our common approach,
03:41 we don't have an economic approach,
03:43 we really want to be able to put the works of the artists
03:48 as strongly as possible into dialogue,
03:51 to make them available for exhibitions,
03:54 to initiate exhibitions ourselves,
03:56 or to provide support for existing exhibitions,
04:00 to support book projects.
04:02 I think that's the second key word,
04:04 sharing art with others,
04:07 and supporting each other in this.
04:09 Maybe you can explain a little more
04:12 how that works.
04:13 It's a digital database,
04:16 where everyone can set up their works.
04:18 And who is supposed to search in there?
04:22 Who is it meant for?
04:24 We just noticed,
04:27 in the prelude to our conversation...
04:29 Excuse me, is the sound okay?
04:31 Sound people?
04:33 I'll try again.
04:36 Okay, sorry.
04:38 We noticed that we are a great team,
04:43 in that our collective is not an open source database,
04:49 that everyone can click on on the Internet
04:52 and scroll through.
04:53 What do they have?
04:55 Because our interest is that we, as collectors,
04:59 stay in the background and are only supportive,
05:02 and are not present in this.
05:04 Therefore, we wish for cooperation
05:07 between artists and institutions,
05:10 and provide access to the database
05:13 by appointment.
05:15 In principle, it was perfect today,
05:17 in the preparation,
05:18 that we agreed to look through the database together.
05:24 I felt like a target group
05:26 when I read everything again.
05:28 I thought, perfect,
05:29 we are preparing a collection presentation.
05:31 Let's see what we can do.
05:34 Yes, Mrs. Kaufmann,
05:36 tell us how you collect as an institution.
05:41 How does it work?
05:42 How do you decide what you want to buy?
05:46 Where does the money come from?
05:48 How does it work?
05:49 That is a very complex question,
05:51 because we have been collecting since 1843.
05:54 I think that is an important point.
05:56 We are a historical institution,
05:58 that has been collecting for a long time.
06:00 We have collected works of art
06:03 from over 800 years in our collection.
06:05 From genres, to photography, to painting,
06:08 to our huge graphic collection,
06:11 which alone contains over 200,000 works.
06:14 That means, we have been collecting for a long time,
06:17 and in all genres.
06:19 We also have media art works.
06:21 All genres are there.
06:23 And collecting is also very complex,
06:25 because we always imagine
06:27 that it can be collected in public institutions
06:28 in a very large scale.
06:30 That is also the tradition
06:32 that distinguishes our collection
06:34 from the rest.
06:36 But it is only possible to select and collect
06:38 only a small part of the current contemporary art,
06:42 and especially the historical works.
06:45 When we face a challenge,
06:47 like in 2017,
06:49 when we made big purchases
06:51 for Wilhelm Lehmbrug,
06:53 that is a purchase
06:55 that is central to our collection.
06:57 It is a challenge for us
06:59 and our museum to secure.
07:01 But this means that the state
07:03 has been exhausted for a long time.
07:05 We always seek support
07:07 and of course also cooperate,
07:09 for example with the
07:11 Federal Cultural Foundation,
07:13 with the Siemens Kunststiftung,
07:15 and we always look for strong partners.
07:17 A very important aspect
07:19 are the friends of the Staatsgalerie,
07:21 who are really remarkable,
07:23 because there are 9,000 members.
07:25 It is a very broad,
07:27 public and effective model
07:29 in the Staatsgalerie,
07:31 which has shaped our collection
07:33 with loans for many decades.
07:35 We are very committed to this.
07:37 We are a team of curators.
07:39 Hendrik Bündke is responsible
07:41 for the 20th and 21st centuries
07:43 together with me.
07:45 We also go to the fair
07:47 this afternoon
07:49 to think about
07:51 what could be an option
07:53 in the field of contemporary art.
07:55 But then the idea is really
07:57 taken back to Stuttgart.
07:59 We have our curators' meetings.
08:01 We introduce it to the director,
08:03 Ms. Lange.
08:05 It takes a long time
08:07 to think about
08:09 what we suggest for the purchase.
08:11 In Baden-Württemberg,
08:13 the money is of course
08:15 released by the Ministry
08:17 and we then make applications
08:19 to get the funds
08:21 for the collection.
08:23 How long does it take?
08:25 Very long.
08:27 When I imagine
08:29 that we are here at a fair
08:31 and one or the other
08:33 decides to have this work
08:35 for his collection,
08:37 our model is a very different
08:39 long-term model.
08:41 It can take half a year
08:43 or a year.
08:45 We often talk to artists
08:47 who do exhibition projects
08:49 and we hope that we can
08:51 take the work into the collection
08:53 when it is finished
08:55 so that it can last
08:57 a year until it is declared
08:59 that it belongs to the
09:01 Staatsgalerie.
09:03 For us, this is an ideal case.
09:05 Something that is created
09:07 for an exhibition project
09:09 in our house
09:11 and then goes into the collection
09:13 and always has a collection
09:15 reference to the historical collection.
09:17 Can you go to the fair
09:19 and buy something quickly?
09:21 It doesn't work like that
09:23 for us either.
09:25 For us, the purchasing process
09:27 takes about six months.
09:29 We have certain half-life
09:31 compared to you.
09:33 Our collection history
09:35 also refers to 50 years.
09:37 After all, it is really good
09:39 for a company collection
09:41 in Germany, 50 years.
09:43 You have to have this story
09:45 in your collection.
09:47 We have now collected
09:49 3,000 works together
09:51 and the collection LBBW
09:53 is one of the largest
09:55 German contemporary art
09:57 collections in Germany
09:59 in terms of quantity
10:01 and quality.
10:03 The purchasing process
10:05 has been like this since 2018.
10:07 We have called in
10:09 a collection curatorium
10:11 and it is called in
10:13 the form of a collection
10:15 of the LBBW collection.
10:17 We have a collection
10:19 of over 1,000 works
10:21 and we have a collection
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26:19 of over 1,000 works
26:21 and we have a collection
26:23 of over 1,000 works
26:25 and we have a collection
26:27 of over 1,000 works
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26:31 of over 1,000 works
26:33 and we have a collection
26:35 of over 1,000 works
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26:43 of over 1,000 works
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27:07 of over 1,000 works
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27:11 of over 1,000 works
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27:17 and we have a collection
27:19 of over 1,000 works
27:21 and we have a collection
27:23 of over 1,000 works
27:25 and we have a collection
27:27 of over 1,000 works
27:29 and we have a collection
27:31 of over 1,000 works
27:33 and we have a collection
27:35 of over 1,000 works
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27:41 and we have a collection
27:43 of over 1,000 works
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28:01 and we have a collection
28:03 of over 1,000 works
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28:07 of over 1,000 works
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28:13 and we have a collection
28:15 of over 1,000 works
28:17 and we have a collection
28:19 of over 1,000 works
28:21 and we have a collection
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28:25 and we have a collection
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42:21 and we have a collection
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42:41 and we have a collection
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42:45 and we have a collection
42:47 of over 1,000 works
42:49 and we have a collection
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42:53 and we have a collection
42:55 of over 1,000 works
42:57 and we have a collection
42:59 of over 1,000 works
43:01 and we have a collection
43:03 of over 1,000 works
43:05 and we have a collection
43:07 of over 1,000 works
43:09 and we have a collection
43:11 of over 1,000 works
43:13 and we have a collection
43:15 of over 1,000 works
43:17 and we have a collection
43:19 of over 1,000 works
43:21 and we have a collection
43:23 of over 1,000 works
43:25 and we have a collection
43:27 of over 1,000 works
43:29 and we have a collection
43:31 of over 1,000 works
43:33 and we have a collection
43:35 of over 1,000 works
43:37 and we have a collection
43:39 of over 1,000 works
43:41 and we have a collection
43:43 of over 1,000 works
43:45 and we have a collection
43:47 of over 1,000 works
43:49 and we have a collection
43:51 of over 1,000 works
43:53 and we have a collection
43:55 of over 1,000 works
43:57 and we have a collection
43:59 of over 1,000 works
44:01 and we have a collection
44:03 of over 1,000 works
44:05 and we have a collection
44:07 of over 1,000 works
44:09 and we have a collection
44:11 of over 1,000 works
44:13 and we have a collection
44:15 of over 1,000 works
44:17 and we are happy
44:19 to have loans from other institutions
44:21 or from other private collections
44:23 or from other private collections
44:25 that cannot be included in our collection.
44:27 that cannot be included in our collection.
44:29 A very important point is
44:31 that when we include works
44:33 in the collection,
44:35 the connection to the collection
44:37 does not necessarily have to be guaranteed
44:39 in the presentation.
44:41 This is something
44:43 that the future will show.
44:45 This is something
44:47 that the future will show.
44:49 This is something
44:51 that we can and want to
44:53 put our works out of the collection
44:55 into new contexts.
44:57 The second question
44:59 does not apply to the company collection
45:01 because we do not borrow.
45:03 But to the first question I can say
45:05 that there are many overlaps
45:07 to other well-known collections.
45:09 We also have Gerhard Richter,
45:11 Rosemarie Trockel,
45:13 Cindy Sherman,
45:15 but you have to think
45:17 about when you collected them
45:19 and you bought them
45:21 very early.
45:23 Today our collection concept
45:25 is located in such a way
45:27 that we collect very contemporary.
45:29 The market is still very, very,
45:31 very wide and we also buy
45:33 young positions.
45:35 That is why our collection
45:37 is very individualized
45:39 with its own focus.
45:41 Could you also say something
45:43 about how original you want to be
45:45 as a collector?
45:47 That is a bit of a mean question.
45:49 I would say
45:51 not different from the two collections.
45:53 As a private collection
45:55 you are characterizing yourself
45:57 by bringing your own identity
45:59 to the fore.
46:01 An identity
46:03 about the composition of the artist,
46:05 the time,
46:07 the actuality,
46:09 when you acquired the artist.
46:11 That is why it is important
46:13 for us to move forward
46:15 in a stringent and permanent way.
46:17 We don't have the problem
46:19 of getting too old
46:21 for that.
46:23 It is not a sport,
46:25 it is not a high-performance sport.
46:27 We can accompany it for a long time.
46:29 That is very nice.
46:31 At this point
46:33 I would like to thank you very much.
46:35 We have to wrap up now
46:37 and we will continue
46:39 with Franz Ackermann's artist talk
46:41 in the next LBBW Talk.
46:43 I would like to thank you
46:45 for this wonderful panel
46:47 and for the great audience.
46:49 We will see each other again soon.
46:51 Thank you.