L'immigration au cœur du débat aux États-Unis - 18/02/2024
MEDI1TV Afrique : L'immigration au cœur du débat aux États-Unis - 18/02/2024
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00:00 [MUSIC PLAYING]
00:03 [MUSIC PLAYING]
00:06 Welcome.
00:11 To a new episode of Morocco, a trip
00:13 mid-March in this episode.
00:16 Immigration, fishing in the United States,
00:18 and what is happening in Texas.
00:21 We're bringing immigration and migratory
00:23 to Morocco, fighting migration to sustainable
00:26 continental development.
00:28 The United States is a fishing war
00:30 for immigrants worldwide, boasting the largest
00:33 foreign population of immigration.
00:36 As of 2021, nearly 14% of its population
00:40 is foreign or abroad, highlighting
00:43 if you do or don't.
00:44 Yet, immigration remains a polarized issue,
00:48 central to the nation's political discourse,
00:51 as lawmakers grapple between the intricate balance
00:55 of economic benefits, security concerns,
00:58 and humanitarian obligations.
01:01 For years, the climate conflict that
01:03 demonstrated this dynamic were complemented
01:06 immigration reform, leaving the executive and the judiciary
01:09 branches to navigate the contentious policy landscape.
01:14 The debate has intensified under former President Donald
01:16 Trump's administration, marked by significant efforts
01:20 to tighten immigration control and overhaul
01:23 asylum policies.
01:25 In contrast, President Joe Biden
01:27 has arrived in office with promises of reform,
01:29 aiming to undo his predecessor's actions.
01:32 However, his agenda has changed,
01:35 with further amid the spike in migration
01:37 and the restricting of the endemic era
01:40 of border restrictions.
01:43 The issue is taking a new turn, with Trump urging
01:46 Senate Republicans to talk by partisan efforts
01:49 to bolster border security, fearing it might have
01:53 an impact on the upcoming presidential election.
01:57 So, in New York, Texas, meanwhile,
02:00 there are urgencies as the battleground
02:02 for anti-global implant to change state and federal
02:06 authorities over immigration control,
02:09 spotlighting the issue in the upcoming presidential race
02:14 amid a surge in Southern war cross.
02:16 As we shift our gaze to Africa, a continent often
02:20 depicted to the land of displacement and migration
02:23 driven by poverty, war, barriers, and conflict,
02:27 the narrow of an immigrating migratory wave
02:30 is a crisis.
02:32 However, Morocco offers an expressing
02:35 commitment to demonstrating regional collaboration,
02:38 particularly with West Africa,
02:41 favoring an even greater African integration.
02:45 Morocco's evolved standard of self-propulsion
02:48 and from a country of transit,
02:50 becoming little by little a true host country,
02:53 strengthening its strategic position as a bridge
02:56 between Africa and Europe.
02:58 A global and inclusive approach of migrants
03:01 that reflects the regional dynamic driven by Morocco,
03:05 as the OECD notes, migrants contributing significantly
03:10 to their home nations' economies,
03:14 the regional impact remains less understood,
03:16 underscoring the need for further exploration.
03:20 In this episode, we'll delve into the cross-division
03:23 around the binding security measures
03:26 and development initiatives to address illegal migration.
03:30 To discuss these topics in the studio,
03:33 to the distinguished guests,
03:34 we have with us Sheriff Benny Martinez,
03:36 the Lidwam Enforcement in Brooks County, Texas.
03:40 It's a significantly impacted area of migration
03:43 to the proximity of the county
03:45 to the US Mexican border.
03:46 His role involves addressing challenges
03:49 related to undocumented migration,
03:51 to the trafficking and the safety of migrants
03:54 and its population.
03:56 Our second guest is Bill Michael.
03:58 He teaches in the University of Maryland
04:02 and George Washington University.
04:04 He provides news commentary to such stations
04:08 in the Middle East such as TV Kuwait,
04:10 Saudi Arabia TV, Al-Hurra, and BBC Arabic.
04:14 From Morocco, we'll be joining Dr. Lassana Kartit
04:19 who is a professor of international relations
04:23 and political system at the Graduate Institute of Management
04:26 and researcher here in Tunisia.
04:29 But what he is doing from Morocco
04:31 is our co-champion,
04:32 director and trigger of Focus Consulting,
04:35 and he's the sultanate of US Marine Corps veterans.
04:38 Welcome, Lassana.
04:39 Welcome everybody.
04:41 We'll start with you, Sheriff Benny Martinez.
04:45 Sheriff, in 2022, a Gallup poll revealed
04:48 about 20% of Americans view immigration
04:52 because of it as a threat to US security,
04:55 yet simultaneously regard to illegal immigration
04:58 as a critical threat to American security.
05:01 What is the current sentiment among the U.S. population
05:04 towards immigration amid the ongoing crisis
05:07 that you see on the southern border?
05:10 I think the issue now is the fact that you're looking
05:13 at 160 different countries filtering through locations
05:18 where they have easy access to come across
05:21 and not having...
05:22 Listen, the current problem is that people
05:25 from 160 countries, in an irregular way,
05:28 infiltrate our territory through easy access.
05:33 Nowadays, it becomes a real problem.
05:35 I've always worked in the Bronx County
05:37 and I've been a security attorney there.
05:40 Let me say on how we deal with it,
05:43 there's a way in which we deal with it,
05:45 right?
05:46 You have to have order in place,
05:48 and in these times of issues,
05:50 especially when you have masses,
05:53 and when it's...
05:54 You know, you didn't...
05:55 I think there's not so much crime
05:57 that people would then think is a threat.
06:01 That's not a problem.
06:02 There is crime within that group,
06:05 rather than being a solve,
06:06 rather than being a spray with whatever issues
06:09 you might be dealing with.
06:10 If you do that, you don't have any component
06:12 to the issue that occurs.
06:13 And then it can really grow into a real serious situation
06:18 that you just can't handle at the end of the day.
06:21 What are the differences that you're seeing
06:23 from the Trump administration
06:24 to the Biden administration when it comes to immigration?
06:27 I think that's an easy one, order.
06:29 There's no order now.
06:32 The fact that when this administration,
06:34 before it took off, is they were already announcing...
06:37 - It's an open border.
06:38 Okay?
06:39 So, the difference between the two resides in order.
06:41 Because we already know this.
06:43 And a lot of these people that are coming over
06:45 from Georgia are coming in with a visa in the United States.
06:49 More Trump said, he much negotiated with Mexico,
06:53 with the remaining Mexico,
06:55 and applied the law that's already in Mexico.
07:00 It's not being applied now.
07:02 So, if you apply order to that, the rule, so to speak,
07:05 it simplifies things.
07:07 And it's in the order of the facts.
07:09 And there's nothing more to get done
07:11 as to what's occurring here.
07:13 And that's only the reality of the laws
07:16 that were already in place.
07:17 And Trump simply said it would be legal.
07:21 And that was in the matter that, again,
07:25 Trump's rhetoric was totally different, right?
07:28 So, that also deterred people from coming over
07:32 to the United States.
07:34 But when this new administration came in,
07:38 it completely erased whatever was created
07:40 in the previous administration.
07:42 - Chris Lapatina with us via Zoom.
07:45 - Chris Lapatina is with us today via Zoom.
07:47 For example, President Obama, his immigration policy,
07:51 he has neglected the internal problems of immigration,
07:54 President Obama, by adopting the DACA program in 2012,
07:58 or through the reunification of migrant families.
08:01 - And the reunification of families from Central America.
08:05 - How do you respond to criticisms
08:08 that are coming to the Democrats
08:11 who have been primed by all these years of frustration,
08:14 such as what Sheriff Martinez has talked about?
08:17 - Well, I think that's a good point, Mark.
08:20 And one of the important things that he's shown
08:23 that we're going to be denying him
08:25 what he's shown today is that the United States
08:28 has not had a concrete, strategic plan
08:31 for the Democrat presidents and Republican presidents.
08:34 Looking at the Democrats and Republicans in Congress,
08:37 unlike Morocco, there is a well-established plan
08:39 that is supported by the government.
08:43 Our recent presidents have all failed in one way or another.
08:46 It's interesting that you brought up Obama,
08:49 because as the Sheriff said,
08:53 Mr. Trump has been prized by so many
08:56 because of his border policy.
08:57 But yet, when he ran for president this time,
09:00 some of his own opponents, Obama's being more efficient
09:05 in expulsion people than President Trump was.
09:09 And that just shows the failures
09:11 on both sides of the aisle in the United States
09:14 when it comes to protecting our borders
09:16 and how we're in the crisis that we are right now.
09:19 - Crisis it is.
09:21 Let's get a report and dealt with.
09:23 - Yes, it is a real crisis.
09:25 So we're going to try to deepen our reflection
09:27 on this migration issue with the report
09:29 of our correspondent, Jeanne Mansour.
09:31 - A little bit closer.
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12:15 - Thank you, Jeanne.
12:19 So Bill Michael, Joe Biden promised to bring
12:22 a certain normality to politics.
12:24 That hasn't been the case so far.
12:27 What's the signal about his campaign
12:29 for President Joe Biden, what's your message now, Bill?
12:32 - I think President Biden has really exacerbated the problem.
12:38 In 2020, he was laughing at President Trump
12:43 and looking at a wall.
12:46 And he turned the way Democrats look back at him
12:51 as being not attentive to a very critical issue.
12:57 But ironically, I think that Biden advocated
13:02 to use human resources.
13:04 I think that Biden's big policy have been extended
13:08 to other domains and other regions.
13:10 For instance, the city of Denver in Colorado
13:12 has now 40,000 illegal immigrants,
13:15 with a total population of 60,000.
13:19 This is a crisis extending to the American thousands.
13:22 - Sheriff Benny Martinez, you're in the southern border,
13:25 right here in Texas, at the heart of the battle right now.
13:30 You're a member of the federal government.
13:35 And different states, different governments,
13:37 have handled these issues of undocumented migrants
13:41 differently.
13:42 How does that hinge the system?
13:44 You've got California, Arizona, New Mexico, and Texas,
13:49 all in this northern border.
13:53 How does that hinder your ability,
13:56 and your colleagues, to ensure that the law is followed
13:59 by the sheriff, to hold the law in the United States?
14:02 - Well, as a sheriff, we took an oath
14:05 to defend the Constitution of the United States,
14:08 and our respective states.
14:09 - And we all know that only 5% of those people
14:14 that were summonsed to court,
14:16 people in their respective states, 5%.
14:20 So every state has their own government, so to speak,
14:24 who kind of has the situation,
14:27 the back is, and it remains that,
14:30 it's not being done, because it all depends
14:32 on what that state, respective state, represents.
14:36 And then some states, like New York and Chicago,
14:38 and you have those that are really welcoming,
14:42 but as you all know now, you have
14:44 the whole big crisis in New York,
14:46 and they're all blaming it,
14:49 to get what happened.
14:51 What you're always trying to do is control the border,
14:53 and what you have to do is to get the law secured.
14:57 It has always been, the wall is more of a barrier
15:00 than anything else, okay?
15:02 I know that it should come up,
15:04 but that's what you have to do.
15:06 You have to have all in order first,
15:08 in order for everything else to be in there.
15:10 How can anyone just be crossing the river,
15:13 and that happens, knowing very well that they'll swim.
15:16 We don't have to be, you know,
15:20 and back in the county,
15:22 you know, it's about 900 bodies that we have already recovered,
15:25 while they're dying, 70 miles north of the river.
15:28 Our production team went out to the streets of Washington, D.C.,
15:31 to ask our fellow citizens,
15:33 their point of view on these issues.
15:36 I'd like you to listen to their voices.
15:38 I believe that,
15:42 everyone should have an opportunity to live in the United States.
15:46 So, I don't agree with the new policy of
15:51 migrants at the border.
15:53 Thank you.
15:55 I think Biden's policy,
15:57 or rather, the immigration policy, is broken.
16:01 I think Biden's immigration policy is a real failure.
16:08 We've seen in recent years a large number of migrants
16:11 arriving at the border in a difficult way,
16:13 and the President must do something about it.
16:15 President Joe Biden should do something about it.
16:19 I think we need fair...
16:20 I think it's imperative to establish fair and equitable immigration policies,
16:25 that recognize that we've always been ready
16:28 for those that sought a better way of life.
16:32 Even though we need to be orderly,
16:34 but we need to continue to lift up the flames of liberty,
16:39 to show how hard that we welcome the poor,
16:43 and to show her fleeing persecution.
16:46 I think the Republicans are going about it all the wrong way.
16:49 I think that Trump has...
16:51 They've allowed Trump to interfere.
16:54 I mean, he's not President.
16:55 I think the Republicans are going about it all the wrong way.
16:58 They've allowed Trump to interfere,
17:00 even though he's not President, or whatever.
17:02 ...to dictate what their vote's going to be.
17:06 I definitely do not support the Republican position
17:11 on immigration,
17:12 and the actions taken by Gregg Abbott in Texas.
17:15 I'm also not a big fan of Joe Biden's
17:18 approach to immigration.
17:19 I think his harsh immigration reforms
17:21 that he's trying to get adopted by the Senate
17:23 are no better than the reforms that Trump has put in place.
17:28 So, yeah, I think they're both doing terrible things,
17:35 and I think we need a different option.
17:37 Both doing terrible things.
17:40 And the other channel, which I mentioned,
17:41 I'm sure, is being responsible for the situation.
17:45 And it seems that there's some challenges
17:47 coming up in England as well, from the United Nations.
17:51 They're grappling with some of these challenges.
17:54 How is the United Nations in New York City
17:57 playing into the migration problem in Brookes County?
18:01 Well, you know, the United Nations
18:03 plays a critical role in representing the refugees,
18:06 and they're all about refugees,
18:07 and they're all about taking care of them,
18:10 but they don't have the in-case.
18:12 So I say, "Well, what happens is,
18:14 what's happening with all these federal fundings
18:17 that only respect the responsibility
18:19 of the citizens themselves?
18:20 What is the accountability
18:21 of that particular country's people to fund?
18:24 They're the ones assuming this responsibility
18:25 for their own people.
18:26 They're all citizens, and they're not doing it.
18:29 So why should other countries do what they're being provided
18:34 for free?
18:35 And it's an argument that can go on and on, right?
18:38 So it's just one of those issues that needs to be addressed.
18:41 You're right.
18:42 It's no one is against immigration,
18:44 illegal immigration.
18:46 Yes, the issue is that the human element
18:49 accounts for the rapes that occur in Brookes County.
18:53 That is not to be taken at all.
18:55 There's nothing in any country right now
18:57 that nothing that the ordering facts
19:00 that are happening right now
19:01 to validate the millions of dollars
19:04 that the United States is providing for NGOs.
19:07 That all these are taxpayer money.
19:10 So there's a lot of issues here
19:13 that need to be addressed, absolutely.
19:15 There's not one perfect fix.
19:18 No.
19:18 All right.
19:20 Chris Lapetina, as the sheriff said,
19:22 not one perfect fix.
19:24 If we go back in history,
19:26 Ronald Reagan was really the last man
19:28 to have an immigration reform bill.
19:30 His administration was the administration.
19:32 When I was with the George W. Bush administration,
19:34 there was an attempt to do immigration reform.
19:37 Obama tried to do immigration reform.
19:39 He and all the other congressional leaders around the table
19:43 said, "Let's try to do a fine grant on capital."
19:46 So how can persistent division within Congress
19:50 regarding this issue be explained to our viewers?
19:55 It's interesting that you mentioned Reagan.
19:59 If you remember, President Trump was proposing a wall
20:03 about a people-per-person wall,
20:06 and he was definitely pushing that on the wall
20:09 on this issue.
20:11 And certainly things have changed that way.
20:13 I think more and more people are open to expanding
20:16 that kind of border now,
20:18 which shows that the things are changing,
20:22 but at the same time, things are getting worse.
20:25 And so I think that finally, hopefully,
20:28 the American people are winging the bargain
20:30 to demand as a representative
20:33 a solution that addresses both sides of the issue.
20:37 The state of Texas used razor wire
20:39 to deter the undocumented migrants
20:42 to cross the border into the US.
20:45 How did this method trigger the current conflict
20:49 between federal government and the state in your home area?
20:54 Well, the saga between the Texas and federal government
20:57 continued right through Texas and federal government,
21:00 and the razor wire was the solution to the boobies.
21:03 These two elements that have been used
21:06 or have been tried to be used by Border Patrol
21:09 embedded themselves in border walls
21:12 for this thought to take them right,
21:14 because they're abusive.
21:16 So that's where that came from.
21:18 The fact that we have a current,
21:20 that's all you're trying to do is deter them,
21:22 because you have a lot of unidentified people
21:25 that filter into, of course,
21:28 the individuals that you refer to.
21:30 We don't know who they are in the country.
21:32 So we need to find out who's causing the border.
21:35 I mean, the mass death that happened back in '99,
21:38 it was over here.
21:40 Now they can definitely filter to the ground.
21:42 Bill Michael,
21:44 you know, certain international media outlets
21:47 are disagreeing and have seized on this dispute
21:50 between federal government and Texas authorities
21:53 to speculate about a potential secession
21:55 from the United States,
21:57 some sort of a bizarre assertion.
22:00 Can you offer an explanation
22:02 for the type of provocative propaganda
22:05 that's coming out of some outlets across the globe?
22:08 I agree with you.
22:09 This assertion is provocative
22:11 and it is just so unprovocative.
22:13 The possibility of Texas seceding from the United States
22:16 is very unlikely.
22:18 It is a very confusing situation,
22:20 because Texas was admitted to the United States
22:23 in 1837 and its own constitution
22:26 and it was designated as the Republic of Texas.
22:29 But this does not translate to any real movement
22:32 toward the Texas independence.
22:34 Texas will remain a state.
22:37 Very true.
22:39 So following a series of appeals,
22:42 this one actually reached the Supreme Court in Texas
22:45 which has de-judged a federal appeal
22:48 that wanted to prevent the demantelment of the borders
22:51 and it was reaffirmed by the Texas authorities.
22:54 So how does that handcuff do to do your job
22:57 as a sheriff?
22:59 It doesn't.
23:01 We have state laws that we can do
23:03 that will cover us on enforcing the wrongdoing.
23:07 So it really doesn't impact the state of Texas
23:10 in that manner.
23:12 Bill, one last question for you.
23:15 I know Sheriff Martinez brought it up
23:18 on the 11th of September.
23:21 So we saw in the years following the terror attacks
23:24 of 2001, numerous reports
23:27 and reports about Al-Qaeda attempting to exploit
23:30 the border case.
23:32 Now we see Chinese migrants, for example,
23:35 coming across the border a lot.
23:37 Russian migrants coming across the border
23:39 a fairly large number.
23:41 So what's your position on this story
23:43 and potentially bringing about some sort of sell of some type?
23:47 Do you have concerns now regarding
23:50 ISIS, Tehran, Hezbollah, China,
23:54 these other forces that are coming into the country?
23:58 Is it an international threat?
24:00 What sort of alarm bells goes off in your head?
24:02 Definitely.
24:03 It is a very serious matter and a lot of people
24:06 who want to cause harm to the great nation.
24:09 And we as an American have a right to defend ourselves.
24:12 I acknowledge that the American frontiers
24:15 have been happening through different events.
24:18 We have some lessons learned from the events
24:21 of September 11.
24:23 At the same time, America also has learned
24:26 from the lessons of September 11.
24:28 We have now a more vigilant policy
24:31 and a more careful eye to monitor
24:34 and to impute the vulnerable
24:37 because of the malveillance of these people.
24:40 But still, America remains vulnerable
24:43 because the viciousness of these people is just increasing.
24:46 So I believe that our more secure,
24:49 but we still need more security
24:51 and the possibility of the occurrence of this vile
24:55 is still to come and could never be forbidden.
24:58 That's good.
24:59 Thank you very much Bill.
25:01 Thank you Chris.
25:02 Thank you Sheriff.
25:03 We'll be back with more of this story.
25:05 Yes, and this show.
25:07 Intermission.
25:08 [Music]
25:17 Welcome back to the second part of Morocco
25:19 from Washington.
25:21 In this segment, we're going to talk about
25:23 the migration and border security in Morocco
25:26 as well.
25:27 I think, how is this country dealing
25:30 with the problem of security in the United States?
25:33 We'll see how Morocco, as a friendly country,
25:35 deals with the crucial problem of securing its borders.
25:38 A question that is of paramount importance
25:40 in the fight against terrorism,
25:42 the treatment of human beings,
25:44 and organized crime,
25:45 a challenge that Sheriff Martinez has raised
25:47 in the context of his state, Texas,
25:49 and his home country.
25:50 We now have the pleasure of welcoming
25:52 Dr. Lassane Akkartiet from Rabat.
25:54 So, welcome.
25:55 Could you explain to us the approach
25:57 adopted by Morocco on this issue of migration?
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28:00 Dr. Akkartiet, how does Morocco
28:04 respect the balance between the legal aspect
28:07 and the humanitarian aspect
28:09 on this issue of migration and Morocco?
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29:33 Dr. Akkartiet, can we compare
29:53 the Moroccan approach
29:55 with the approach of other countries
29:58 in the North Africa region?
30:01 And how does that relate to the European neighbors,
30:04 especially Mediterranean countries
30:07 like Spain, France and Italy?
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31:50 Thank you, Dr. Erekret.
31:55 And we look forward to continuing our conversations with you
31:58 and your students in the next episodes where we work.
32:01 That is based on the Moroccan students together
32:04 to tackle the challenges and the great challenges they have to get through.
32:07 Thank you for being with us today.
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32:13 Chris Lapetina, let's go back to you.
32:16 Why would international students be jeering for regular immigrants
32:19 from Africa to Europe?
32:22 In fact, the white-hired migration of African immigrants
32:25 has been widely documented in the media across a whole different kind of venues.
32:28 It's often painted as a mass exodus of individuals
32:31 seeking to find security and opportunities in Europe.
32:34 This phenomenon is a public debate not just in places like Europe.
32:37 Beyond the economic challenges,
32:40 are there other factors using this movement of African immigrants
32:43 to travel across continents?
32:46 Well, certainly, I think when we talk about the right way to make a better life,
32:49 the economy is often the first thing that's mentioned.
32:52 It's of course on a moral agenda.
32:55 The political system of Morocco has social stability,
32:58 which also has a policy of welcoming immigrants.
33:01 And we all know His Excellency,
33:04 the king, about 10 years ago,
33:07 instituted the humanitarian approach
33:10 by his immigration,
33:13 and I think that that approach has spread this global world
33:16 and has been a very important part of the life of this place
33:19 where you can have a better life on a whole array of things,
33:22 not just when it comes to economics.
33:25 Bill Michael,
33:28 most of the people migrating away from sub-Saharan countries
33:31 from Europe via Morocco,
33:34 complicate the task of the Moroccan authorities.
33:37 So do you believe that the European countries
33:40 provide sufficient financial and municipal support
33:43 to support Morocco's efforts to manage this challenge?
33:46 Regrettably, no.
33:49 The European countries should intensify their support for Morocco
33:52 because Morocco is in a crisis in the form of migration
33:55 because Morocco really is confronting a crisis
33:58 by its own and through its own means.
34:01 It would also be beneficial
34:04 if the Europeans solicited the help of the United States and Canada
34:07 to help Morocco manage these waves of immigrants.
34:10 So far, Morocco has been successful
34:13 in establishing and challenging
34:16 asylum or refugee settlements
34:19 to either cross its borders toward Europe
34:22 or settle permanently within the premises
34:25 of the Kingdom of Morocco.
34:28 This means that the European countries
34:31 are not yet ready to accept
34:34 the help of the United States
34:37 or Canada to help Morocco manage its own problems.
34:40 However, Europe seems to lack a coherent strategy
34:43 in the face of the migration crisis,
34:46 whether it be Libya, the Syrian crisis
34:49 or movements from Iraq and Afghanistan towards Europe.
34:52 The Syrian crisis is another example
34:55 and also Iraq and Afghanistan
34:58 which are long-term political solutions
35:01 aimed at facilitating the integration of these immigrants.
35:04 This collaboration would be beneficial for both Europe and the Europeans.
35:07 Thank you, Bill.
35:10 The immigration issue in Africa has historical and economic dimensions
35:13 that set it apart from the situation in the United States
35:16 which was never a coloniser of South American countries.
35:19 So, some advance that European colonisation of Africa
35:22 is one of the main causes of poverty
35:25 and unemployment in Africa.
35:28 It suggests that Europe should bear some responsibility
35:31 for addressing these consequences.
35:34 Let's watch this report
35:37 by our production team.
35:40 The issue of immigration in Morocco
35:43 has undergone structural transformations
35:46 both in terms of quality and political approaches.
35:49 While Morocco was a source of immigration to Europe,
35:52 it is now a country of transit
35:55 and stability for legal and illegal immigrants.
35:58 Today, the European Union considers Morocco
36:01 as the most important partner
36:04 outside the European continent
36:07 in the fight against clandestine immigration
36:10 and even contributes in part to the financial support of this partnership.
36:13 Morocco considers today this significant evolution
36:16 in the crystallisation of new dynamics
36:19 in the relations between North and South.
36:22 Some believe that European contribution
36:25 is not limited to a simple support or assistance,
36:28 but that it plays a major role
36:31 in the social and economic situation
36:34 of the African countries
36:37 that export clandestine immigration.
36:40 These countries have been subject to the plundering of their resources
36:43 and the impoverishment of their populations,
36:46 delaying economic growth
36:49 and fuelling frontal conflicts for private colonial gains.
36:52 Since the problem of immigration
36:55 is beyond national borders
36:58 and requires a broader vision,
37:01 the Kingdom of Morocco,
37:04 under the impulse of His Majesty King Mohammed VI,
37:07 adopted a balanced approach.
37:10 It considers the clandestine immigrant
37:13 as a humanitarian solution
37:16 and that it is a solution
37:19 that is suitable for its humanity.
37:22 Morocco has also initiated
37:25 the construction of economic partnerships
37:28 with the Sahel countries of South Africa,
37:31 seeking to address the problem at the source
37:34 and to propose alternatives
37:37 that meet the needs of a rich continent
37:40 and that aim to save African citizens
37:43 the use of measures that have contributed
37:46 to their delay and poverty.
37:49 Benny, a simple comparison between
37:52 the migration situation in the United States and Morocco
37:55 reveals similarities,
37:58 although Morocco serves as a transit point
38:01 rather than a final destination for migrants.
38:04 This brings me to my question for you.
38:07 Many people are moving inland,
38:10 as we mentioned,
38:13 to Denver, New York or Chicago,
38:16 meaning that the so-called "inland states"
38:19 are also concerned
38:22 and must participate in the management
38:25 of these migrant flows.
38:28 Well, absolutely.
38:31 I've had interviews with some of the individuals
38:34 who have already had experience
38:37 in several states,
38:40 such as Maryland, Pennsylvania,
38:43 Colorado, and the Midwest and Nebraska.
38:46 Their previous experience makes them eligible
38:49 for work visas,
38:52 thus facilitating their transition
38:55 to other opportunities
38:58 without having to take considerable risks
39:01 to maintain their security
39:04 and facilitate their professional mobility.
39:07 Sheriff, too often you're dealing with the recovery
39:10 of dead migrants who have not yet reached their destination.
39:13 Can you explain to us how this is happening for you?
39:16 It's just something that you never get rid of.
39:19 And it is at this point
39:22 that I'm profoundly invested in this issue,
39:25 simply because we pick it up every day
39:28 when we hear about the recovery of dead migrants,
39:31 the call of a mother looking for her child.
39:34 It's an experience that doesn't leave anyone insensitive,
39:37 each meeting being unique and borne out of a deep humanity.
39:40 It's one of the most heartbreaking situations.
39:43 Bill, in recent days,
39:46 African migrants have increasingly chosen to settle,
39:49 whether legally or, unfortunately,
39:52 in many cases, illegally.
39:55 Why is Morocco a destination
39:58 for migrants who want to settle more sustainably?
40:01 An excellent question.
40:04 The wisdom of King Mohammed VI,
40:07 the kindness of his people
40:10 and the service he provided
40:13 are key elements.
40:16 Morocco rarely refuses to help immigrants
40:19 entering, thus creating a welcoming atmosphere,
40:22 and in doing so,
40:25 it is a good example of how the government
40:28 is using the presence of its citizens
40:31 to provide more opportunities
40:34 for people to cross the border.
40:37 Morocco has adopted a different approach.
40:40 Morocco has illustrated,
40:43 as you know,
40:46 a strategy, I believe it dates to the year 2014,
40:49 to benefit economically both the migrants
40:52 and the country.
40:55 There is also a declared strategic vision
41:02 affirming Morocco's ability to establish
41:05 close ties with sub-Saharan Africa,
41:08 thus creating an extension of the dialogue.
41:11 These factors embody a remarkable humanitarian attitude.
41:14 In other words,
41:17 Morocco's immigration policy reflects
41:20 the highest human values and offers an example
41:23 of how the world can progress
41:26 towards a better future.
41:29 Thank you, Bill.
41:35 The New Humanitarian recently published an article
41:38 highlighting that while the rest of the Maghreb
41:41 is often criticized for its aggressive policies
41:44 Morocco has chosen a more tolerant approach
41:47 and is reaping political and economic benefits
41:50 from that liberal attitude.
41:53 Let's watch this report.
41:56 The New Humanitarian website published an article
42:10 entitled "Instead of looking for a vocabulary,
42:13 Morocco benefits from migration to the South".
42:16 While the rest of the Maghreb relies on
42:19 an aggressive approach that characterizes
42:22 the treatment of African immigrants and political asylum seekers,
42:25 Morocco has officially chosen a more tolerant approach
42:28 and with this liberal approach,
42:31 Morocco is reaping political and economic benefits.
42:34 The author mentioned the words of Heydou Haith,
42:37 an immigration expert at the University of Amsterdam,
42:40 who said that Morocco welcomes around 70,000 African immigrants
42:43 and that this number includes both legal and illegal immigrants.
42:46 Over the last two decades,
42:49 the number of immigrants in the Kingdom has increased
42:52 and Morocco has become a destination for African immigrants,
42:55 especially from the West African region,
42:58 a strategic decision based on geopolitical and economic interests.
43:01 The author continues,
43:04 "Since His Majesty, the King Mohammed VI
43:07 took power in Morocco more than 20 years ago,
43:10 Morocco has forged close ties with African countries
43:13 through the aid and academic education
43:16 that the Kingdom has provided to these countries,
43:19 in addition to the Kingdom's investments in these areas.
43:22 Senegalese, for example, enter Morocco without a visa
43:25 and now constitute the largest percentage of legal immigrants
43:28 in the Kingdom.
43:31 Regarding the national strategy of immigration and asylum
43:34 in Morocco, the author states,
43:37 "In 2014, Morocco adopted a clear immigration policy
43:40 formulated in the National Strategy of Immigration and Asylum
43:43 that provided access to all legal immigrants
43:46 to all public services
43:49 and even some advantages for immigrants."
43:52 The immigration policy of Morocco
43:55 includes the access of all legal immigrants
43:58 to all public services in Morocco,
44:01 and even some advantages for immigrants."
44:04 The immigration policy of Morocco has received many praises
44:07 at the international level.
44:10 The report of the UN's head states that the Kingdom's policy
44:13 deserves praise and provides the world with a real example to follow.
44:16 In 2019, these Moroccan policies
44:19 deserve to be mentioned
44:22 and provide the world with an example to be guided by.
44:25 Thank you.
44:28 Let's go for a question with our special contributor, Chris Lapetina.
44:31 Chris, Morocco has emerged as a front runner
44:34 in addressing African migration issues
44:37 initiating a significant reform in African sub-Saharan migrants
44:40 and legal statuses to allow immigration
44:43 to 50,000 migrants from sub-Saharan Africa.
44:46 What sets the Moroccan approach to African migrants
44:49 apart from other approaches?
44:52 Well, I think we've heard a lot of it
44:55 already on this show, Mark.
44:58 I mean, Morocco is an open society.
45:01 Morocco has a...
45:04 I think we've already addressed this subject in depth
45:07 in this show. Morocco stands out as a global economy
45:10 with a stable political leadership
45:13 that does not fear the integration of the global economy.
45:16 The maturity and intelligence of the Moroccan people
45:19 can be seen by the understanding that well-managed
45:22 and well-organised migration can just inflate a new energy
45:25 to the economy. Contrary to some of its neighbours
45:28 who fear outsiders because they fear their own people,
45:31 the Moroccan people are generally satisfied
45:34 with their society and with their society
45:37 and with the new opportunities that come with migration.
45:40 And that's the difference in welcoming
45:43 the new opportunities that come with migration.
45:46 Thank you, Chris. Bill, through an agreement
45:49 with the African Union, Morocco has been chosen
45:52 to host the new African Observatory on Migration,
45:55 an observatory that is charged with tracking migration
45:58 and coordinating government policies across the continent.
46:01 How effective is this observatory
46:04 in addressing the challenge of illegal migration
46:07 across the continent?
46:10 Morocco has the potential to succeed,
46:13 but it also has to be supported by the world.
46:16 In other words, sufficient funds are necessary
46:19 to avoid any crisis.
46:22 In addition, a deep training of the staff is essential.
46:25 It is essential to establish strong relations
46:28 with other nations that have already played a similar role,
46:31 thus allowing Morocco to draw lessons
46:34 from its experiences.
46:37 International recognition is just as crucial,
46:43 and that's limited to the regional leaders.
46:46 The support of the United Nations and the approval
46:49 of other EU bodies is also necessary.
46:52 In addition, the publication of the results
46:55 will be of importance to demonstrate
46:58 the progress that has been made in the management
47:01 of the problem of immigration,
47:04 with the hope of ending this phenomenon
47:07 of illegal immigration successfully.
47:10 Yes, sir.
47:13 Sheriff Martinez, the experts have highlighted
47:16 the importance of the contributions
47:19 that migrants have had to our society,
47:22 whether it's through funds, whether it's through
47:25 skill transfer, whether it's through technology,
47:28 knowledge sharing, government models,
47:31 exchange of values and ideas.
47:34 Given these benefits, should such contributions
47:37 be spent on the application of the law on immigration?
47:40 As a legal agent, I would say that it's not
47:43 appropriate to justify the violation of immigration laws.
47:46 What is necessary is the implementation
47:49 of a system that respects the state of affairs.
47:52 We understand the economic interest,
47:55 but that should not be a justification.
47:58 If the process is regulated, individuals can legally
48:01 enter, participate in exchanges and be properly paid.
48:04 This is a way to demonstrate that nothing
48:07 in the United States is in conformity with the law.
48:10 It is essential to remedy this situation
48:13 to guarantee fair working conditions and to
48:16 prevent the exploitation of undocumented workers.
48:19 Absolutely.
48:22 Bill Michael, the UN Economic Commission for Africa
48:25 has stated, I quote, "Migration can be a crucial
48:28 pillar for the development of African economies
48:31 and the economic providers of the immigrants
48:34 from expatriates and the financing of development
48:37 projects in African countries."
48:40 So how important is this?
48:43 It's also very critical.
48:46 It's essential to offer these immigrants good jobs
48:49 and to ensure that the remittances sent from overseas
48:52 to the local population are safe from any
48:55 bad handling or criminal activity.
48:58 And also, you have to integrate Moroccan experience
49:01 in a global perspective to solve the problem
49:04 of illegal immigration.
49:07 This is why I said that the United States should support
49:10 the illegal immigrants to help integrate and assimilate
49:13 these illegal immigrants.
49:16 It has many benefits, both politically and economically.
49:19 By fostering dialogue and cooperation,
49:22 it contributes to the development of the
49:25 structure of the international monetary and economic system.
49:28 In addition, Washington should observe the Moroccan experience
49:31 more closely, strengthen its support,
49:34 and the results could be mutually rewarding for all parties involved.
49:37 Thank you, Bill.
49:40 Sheriff Martinez, as a law enforcement officer,
49:43 you have been a co-chain in the appointment of the count.
49:46 You have been a witness to the fact that the United States
49:49 has been a key player in the fight against the illegal immigrants
49:52 and in the fight against the human trafficking.
49:55 You have been a witness to the harm of human trafficking,
49:58 the harm of women and children,
50:01 the passage of legal drugs across the border,
50:04 and the discursive killing of illegal drugs
50:07 across the border, which has caused the death
50:10 of many Americans.
50:13 Regrettably, these are all too common.
50:16 If you were given the opportunity to work with the Congress
50:19 and the Biden administration to come up with a solution
50:22 to all these issues, where would you begin?
50:25 Well, it's a good question, and it's a difficult question,
50:28 in the sense that because you have so many moving parts on it,
50:31 you almost have to look at the citizens.
50:34 I think that's a really good question,
50:37 and I think that's a really good question,
50:40 because there are so many variables at play.
50:43 It's almost necessary to look at the citizens at the base.
50:46 Because they have to account to the voters,
50:49 which complicates things.
50:52 I think simplicity is a key factor to really understand the question.
50:55 However, it takes time, and by engaging with the citizens,
50:58 by listening to their opinions, and taking the time
51:01 necessary to come up with solutions.
51:04 It can be done, but it depends on the approach adopted.
51:07 Of course, there's always a political side in this.
51:10 There's always a political side.
51:13 And this will continue on in the months,
51:16 and unfortunately, probably, the years ahead.
51:19 But we want to thank you for watching Ma'al Makhrib in Washington.
51:22 We want to thank our guests, Bill Michael from Rabat,
51:25 our special guest, Dr. Jackson Pratt,
51:28 from Brooks County, Texas, of course,
51:31 the Sheriff of Martinez,
51:34 and from Zoom, our special contributor, Chris LaPetina.
51:37 Also, thanks to Jehan Massour,
51:40 and thanks to our program's producer and director,
51:43 Mohammed Saeed Al-Wafi,
51:46 and all the production team staff here in our studio in Washington.
51:49 Bring to me Mark Feifley,
51:52 and we'll see you next week in a new episode of Ma'al Makhrib in Washington.
51:55 Ma'al Makhrib min Washington.
51:58 (Music)
52:01 (Music)
52:04 (upbeat music)
52:07 (electronic music)