NSW Health Minister Ryan Park grilled about Manning Base Hospital redevelopment by Senate estimates committee.
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00:00 I wanted to ask you some questions, Minister, about Manning Base Hospital,
00:03 which as you would know is stuck between stage one and stage two of redevelopment
00:08 and in really dire condition. When will stage two be completed?
00:12 I'll refer to Rebecca Walk from Health Infrastructure at the moment, but Manning
00:20 Base Hospital, as has to be brutally honest to this committee and this committee should be informed,
00:27 is significantly challenged at the moment with our capital spends across New South Wales.
00:34 Infrastructure Australia recently indicated around about between 13, let's just say 13%
00:42 increases in capital in terms of cost escalations and things like that. That has put pressure,
00:50 no doubt people in local government would have been feeling this, that has put pressure on
00:57 all of our regional and rural hospitals, including the Manning Base build. So that's important
01:04 just to give a, I suppose, a context of what's happening.
01:10 Now in terms of Manning Base, I actually spoke with the local member there yesterday and she
01:16 also raised some concerns with me about Manning Base that the Secretary and the Deputy Secretary
01:22 are just working through at the moment. I don't have a date around, but it is a $100 million
01:30 investment in stage two. They'll be providing modern facilities, enhanced services and that's
01:36 for the communities obviously of both Tarry and Manning Valley, the region in broadly.
01:41 Currently we're looking at the project scope is being reviewed because of some of the cost
01:47 escalations and I've been pretty upfront about that. That's a challenge that every infrastructure
01:54 delivery arm of every government or every local council or every private organisation
01:59 is facing these cost escalations of, according to Infrastructure Australia, not my figures,
02:04 of around at least 13%. Some we hear, Rebecca, the CEO of HI will tell you that sometimes that's
02:10 close to 30% and that's just what we're dealing with in a market. So I don't have a date on
02:16 that at the moment, but we are looking at that scope. I am concerned about the cost of stage
02:22 two given that the cost of stage one doubled and I think you've alluded to some of the cost
02:26 pressures happening at the moment. But I'm also really concerned about the scope being reviewed
02:30 because that means you can get a redevelopment that doesn't actually meet clinical need on the
02:35 ground. Manning Base Hospital, like Albury Hospital, is routinely running at a bed deficit and it's
02:41 already really difficult to staff. Is there a update on bed capacity for stage two at Manning
02:49 Base? I might refer to Rebecca if you'd like to give any further detail. Thanks, Minister. I can't
02:57 comment specifically around bed capacity and we can take that on notice, but I can confirm that
03:02 we are working with the district around what their priorities are in relation to the scope.
03:08 With these kind of hospital redevelopments, how can the clinicians who work there and members of
03:12 the community actually find out things like planned bed capacities without resorting to
03:16 members of the upper house putting through orders for documents? We work with the local
03:21 health district and with a number of user groups throughout the project in consultation around what
03:28 those needs are and what the priorities are and then we develop the designs as a result of that
03:32 in accordance with the available funding envelope. Sure, so you've talked about how you develop the
03:36 designs, but how are those communicated? The feedback I'm getting from multiple regional
03:41 hospital redevelopments is frustration with a lack of transparency around this kind of detail.
03:46 We have clinician user groups, we work with different parts of the hospitals and the local
03:53 health districts around how we communicate with staff, the community, including the
03:59 Indigenous community, but particularly, yes, with staff around those different areas.
04:04 Minister, you would have seen the recent media reporting on the unsanitary conditions at the
04:09 hospital at the moment while it stalled between the redevelopment stages. In response, health
04:14 infrastructure NSW was reported to say that it would "continue to keep the community updated".
04:20 What's actually being done to address those conditions in the short term?
04:22 Well, I'll let HI talk about it, but we are obviously wanting to make sure that all of our
04:29 hospitals are clean, safe, tidy, all of those things. That's a responsibility that I take very
04:38 seriously, it's a responsibility that the Secretary takes very, very seriously. So,
04:43 any of those issues, obviously, we were working on the ground through HI, but I understand from
04:51 the local member and discussions that I've had with her, and she's also written to me on a number
04:56 of issues, that she does have some concerns about Manning Base. The Secretary and the Deputy
05:02 Secretary who look after systems and performance is just having a look at their data and having a
05:08 look at what is happening there. It's not to make any insinuations or accusations, but we do want
05:15 to, when people from the community, including local members, think there is a concern at their
05:19 local hospital, this is a part of the process to have a look at it. That's why we're doing
05:25 this. That's what we will do, we'll no doubt do it at many, many other hospitals as we have. No
05:31 doubt when the former government was in place, when people like myself and others, they were
05:36 decent enough to have a look at whether there was an issue there that we needed to get to the bottom
05:40 of. A system like ours that is constantly changing and constantly under big influxes of people
05:51 moving in and out of it, we've got to constantly take seriously any concerns raised by people,
05:56 have a look at it. Quality is something that's very important to us, as is safety. We'll continue
06:02 to do that. I'm not sure if you want to talk about the specifics of what works on the ground.
06:07 Because we're still in the planning phase of that project, the specific cleaning around the
06:11 hospital is an operational issue between the LHD and potentially HealthShare. It's not a matter
06:16 for health infrastructure at this stage. Okay, so if it's not a matter for health infrastructure,
06:20 who can answer the question about what's being done in the short term to rectify the issues?
06:23 Does anyone want to take that one? Susan? Are you able to be more specific about what the issues
06:29 are, Chair? Yeah, so there were some issues with dampness. Clinicians thought that there was a
06:35 risk of mould. There have been photos shared of peeling paint, discolouration around vents
06:40 in clinical areas of the hospital. I'm happy to take that up with the Chief Executive of
06:46 the District and address those issues. Thank you very much. Manning based clinicians told the Rural
06:51 Health Inquiry that clinical staff choose not to stay in the area due to poor infrastructure and
06:56 support. And clinicians I've spoken to this week told me again that it's demoralising to work in
07:01 such uncertainty and decline. Minister, are you monitoring the impact that these years long and
07:08 disruptive redevelopments have on staff and operations at the hospital? Yeah, it's a challenge.
07:12 I've got to be honest, this is one of the most difficult parts of our capital expenditure,
07:17 where we, no doubt the other government found this challenging as well, where we are doing upgrades,
07:24 what the impact that has on the existing facility, a facility that needs to run and continue to
07:30 operate. It is something that I speak with staff about. We've had discussions with HI about. We do
07:37 our very, very best to make sure that an operational hospital continues to operate as we
07:43 transition into a new facility. But I'm not going to sit here and say, hey, we get it always right.
07:49 And I'm also not going to sit here and say that every hospital that we have is unbelievable in
07:57 terms of its infrastructure and rebuild and upgrades. That's not the case. Some of the
08:03 facilities are older and we need to continue to roll out investment in that area. I, like the
08:10 previous minister, and no doubt the previous government, have to get that balance right
08:14 between making sure that we get adequate staff in these hospitals as well as upgrading the physical
08:20 infrastructure. But I know, having spoken to staff on the ground, that an environment that is pleasant,
08:25 that an environment that is conducive to good quality health care is also a good environment
08:31 to work at. And I'm not saying that every single hospital meets the needs of our 170,000 employees.
08:39 I'm not saying that at all. But I am saying that we are doing our very best to improve and upgrade
08:45 hospitals right across regional, rural and remote New South Wales. And I think that
08:52 the government that follows this one should be doing the same as well.
08:56 [BLANK_AUDIO]