Executive producer Mark Ford and director Erica Hanson chat with THR's Brande Victorian to discuss Lifetime's docuseries 'Where is Wendy Williams?' during the THR Frontrunners Lifetime Showcase held at San Vicente Bungalows in Los Angeles. Ford and Hanson spoke about having the former daytime talk show host's family's blessing to release the docuseries which has raised questions about Williams' ability to consent to the project, given her deteriorated state as a result of her diagnosis of primary progressive aphasia and frontotemporal dementia (FTD).
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00:00The Wendy we met at that juncture was different than the Wendy we had seen a few years before.
00:13And after having long conversations with our management, they said, listen, that wasn't
00:18Wendy on her best day.
00:19She's going to go get some help, go to a treatment center and come back, and then she's going
00:24to be ready to do this.
00:28We kind of took them at their word and jumped into it and did legal agreements with all
00:33of her lawyers, her management.
00:36It took many months to get a deal done that Wendy signed and Wendy was good with.
00:42And then we sort of jumped in and hired Erica and the team, and they began filming what
00:48became the rest of the film, which was very unexpected, the twists and turns that it took.
00:56I think you can see in the film, we're trying to grapple with what's going on as it's happening
01:01to her and to us, because it wasn't the story we expected or pitched, or what we were expected
01:09to capture.
01:10But I think it ended up being something that is incredibly human, incredibly real and true.
01:18And once her family got involved, it allowed us to take the story in a whole different
01:23direction, which was what happens to a family whose mother is in some way incapacitated
01:29and the guardian is put in charge of her life.
01:31So most of the film that you see in here, she was under, actually the entire time, she
01:36was under illegal guardianship and taken out of her family's care.
01:40So it became important to us to illustrate the danger, frankly, that we believed she
01:45was in, which got more and more serious the longer we filmed.
01:52And I think Erica and her team were incredibly compassionate.
01:55That's why they were hired, because they all had experience with addiction or other mental
02:02health issues in their lives.
02:05And so we tried to create as sensitive a boundary and cushion around Wendy as we could.
02:11And this film took over two years to make.
02:15So it wasn't like, hey, let's go in and just film and slap together.
02:18It was a very stop-and-go, stop-and-go procedure.
02:22And I think Erica could speak a little bit to what it was like kind of on a daily basis
02:26with her.
02:27Yeah.
02:28You know, I came on board this project because I was really interested in what is it like
02:34for a woman in her late 50s to embark on the next chapter of her life.
02:38And then it became very clear.
02:40We were a very small little team.
02:41It was a very intimate little team.
02:44And we all cared so much about telling this story honestly and truthfully and sensitively.
02:50And as Mark said, when we started, it became clear that addiction was still a big issue
02:57for her.
02:58She's always been very open about her issues on her show and her life.
03:03And I also think we saw firsthand the devastating impact of the loneliness and isolation she
03:08had since COVID.
03:11And then as it progressed, and I talked to Wendy.
03:15We talked to Wendy every day when we were filming about what we were doing.
03:19She definitely had opinions.
03:22And I think in the end, we really pulled the curtain back or the veil of what was happening
03:28in her life at this particular time under the care of a court-appointed guardian.
03:33And to be perfectly honest, I was terrified at certain points that she might die in that
03:39apartment because the stairs, she has lymphedema, her drinking.
03:44It was very scary.
03:45There was no food in the apartment.
03:48And I often thought, what would happen if we weren't there?
03:51And she was alone.
03:53She was lonely.
03:54And she loved having the company.
03:56And then we felt it wasn't easy.
03:59It's not an easy film to watch at times.
04:01At times it was very painful to film.
04:03But I think we all wanted to show the truth of what was happening.
04:08And then really work with her manager because the guardian would not speak to me.
04:14I mean, the guardian hung up on me, to be honest.
04:16So it was through Will, who we kept pushing and saying, because we saw a decline, that
04:23something had to happen and change because she needed help.
04:26And then now Wendy's in a safe place.
04:28I sometimes really worry, where would she have been if we weren't there?
04:32But she's in a safe place getting treated.
04:34And I wanted to talk a little bit more about the filming.
04:37We see there's at least, I think, two times you show that you decide to stop rolling the
04:41cameras.
04:43And then each day, you kind of don't know, will she be in a state to be filmed?
04:46Will she not?
04:47How did you decide when to roll the cameras?
04:49How did you decide, this is private, we don't want to show this?
04:53That's a great question.
04:54And honestly, as a little team, we talked about it all the time.
04:57And I think you see in the trailer at the moment when we just thought we were going
05:01to go off and buy some vapes.
05:03And all of a sudden, it spiraled.
05:06And I think that was one of the first moments, I remember talking to you.
05:10And I just felt, along with Michael, my colleague, this was time, it was time to stop.
05:16And I wanted to make sure she went home, that she was safe.
05:19And it was very challenging to navigate at times.
05:22It really was.
05:23And sorry.
05:24No, I was just going to say, and there's obviously a lot that was filmed that never was shown
05:30and never should be shown.
05:31So that was a process also in post-production, where just because we filmed it doesn't
05:36mean the world needs to see this.
05:39So yeah, we had a long time in lifetime where our amazing partners in that and not pushing
05:44us and not asking us to put things in that we didn't think were part of the necessary
05:51arc to tell the story.
05:52And unfortunately, this isn't a happy story.
05:56This is a sad story about someone who's in physical and mental decline, and also in jeopardy,
06:02and is being kind of cared for, quote unquote, by someone that's a stranger to their family.
06:09And that then became the story for us is, how does this happen?
06:15Should this be allowed to happen?
06:18After doing research, in this film, there are many, many thousands of families that
06:23are dealing with exactly the same situation without the resources that Wendy has.
06:28And so it then became important to allow her family to use this platform to talk about
06:33their frustration with the legal system.
06:37And it's also important to state that no one knew.
06:40We did not know that Wendy had dementia moving into this.
06:43We would never have rolled film, Lifetime never would have greenlit it.
06:46No one would have done anything.
06:48We found out she had dementia very, very late in the process when the family revealed that
06:53to us on camera.
06:55And as soon as that happened, we're like, Wendy's done.
06:58But the story isn't done, because the family now wants to have this platform and try to
07:04make a change for themselves, for Wendy, and for others.
07:08And as you mentioned, her family is such a key part in the narrative, the new narrative
07:11that emerges.
07:12Can you talk about getting them on board?
07:14Were they hesitant?
07:15I know her sister, we don't see her until episode four, and she decides to be a part
07:19of it.
07:20Can you talk about your conversations with them?
07:22They were hesitant at first, and it took quite a while, actually.
07:26But I think when Kevin Jr., right, and Alex really became very supportive of it, and honestly,
07:36Kevin Jr., I'm a mom, and it was agonizing for me to see his struggle and how much he
07:43cared for his mom, and how do you deal with a mother who's struggling with addiction,
07:47how powerless you feel, and knowing that something else was wrong, but what was it?
07:52So I think it took them time to feel comfortable with us, and what was the story we wanted
07:57to tell, and we wanted it to be honest, and they wanted it to be honest.
08:02And it was also the only way they could get to see their mother.
08:05Oh, that's true.
08:06They had no access to her in New York, they weren't allowed to fly up and see her.
08:10So by filming, what you see in this film is literally the first time she saw her son in
08:16over eight or nine months.
08:17And her niece, when Alex, that day, Alex was truly so excited to see Wendy, she hadn't
08:23seen her in a year, and then was devastated when she discovered the reality.
08:28All these things were missing from the apartment, this, you know, the role of this publicist,
08:32what was happening to the people that were around her?
08:36And like Wendy says early on, if it can happen to me, it can happen to you, and that really
08:40is the truth of this situation.
08:43And I want to talk about the expert opinion piece as well, because, you know, as a viewer
08:46watching it, I'm thinking the same thing.
08:48She's with her family, why can't they just take her to Florida, or why can't, you know,
08:52they stay with her?
08:53And there is this kind of element, as you mentioned, the guardian is kind of the shadowy
08:57figure.
08:58And I think when we see her with the publicist, it's almost a fear they have of doing things
09:02without, you know, her consent, they kind of let you know the parameters of guardianship
09:07are kind of boundless.
09:08Can you talk about the editorial decision and showing that, and the experts, you know,
09:13that you brought on board?
09:16Digging into the legal aspects of it, it just became essential that because whenever we
09:23asked ourselves about it, I'm like, I really don't know anything about this.
09:26Someone teach us what's going on, how is this possible?
09:30Why is this happening to Wendy?
09:33And so it was really important to find those people that understood the shadowy practices
09:38of how these laws have been passed, and now they're being executed.
09:42We can't, there's no court record of them going in and it's all secret, and you can't
09:49access it.
09:51So we don't even know why, you know, as producers, that Wendy was removed from her family's care
09:56and put into a, you know, a guardian's care, and the guardian won't explain it either.
10:02But from our own research, you know, it didn't seem like there was anything so egregious
10:06that would cause that decision to occur.
10:10And you can also just tell, Wendy's family are very nice, lovely people, and who would
10:15you want taking care of you if you were in this condition?
10:17A stranger?
10:18Or, you know, your sister, your niece, your son, your nephew, you know, all these people
10:24that want to have a role in her family.
10:27So yeah, it was super important for us to draw back the veil on that and like, get into
10:32it as much as we could in the film.
10:34I just wanted to add one thing too, that I still find it incredible that I couldn't imagine
10:39if I were not able, if my child couldn't call me.
10:43Her son, her family can't call her.
10:45They don't know where she is.
10:47She has to call them.
10:49And it's been a year, more than a year.
10:51How is that possible?
10:53You know, how is that possible?
10:54And if now, knowing that she has dementia, then you have decline.
10:58And if you were a 24-year-old, and you care about your mom, I just can't imagine not being
11:03able to go see her.
11:06When we talked about, you know, separately, some of the criticisms, you know, that came
11:09out and people saying, you know, should this have come out?
11:13Was there ever a moment where you thought, we may not put this out?
11:16And ultimately, how did you decide that you would?
11:20There were many moments from the first day on that we thought this probably won't air,
11:26you know.
11:28And the big turning point for us was when her family came on board, you know, and then
11:33started telling us the truth about the situation that Wendy was in.
11:37Because as you can imagine, it was very frustrating for us as producers to be seeing Wendy in
11:42the condition she was in.
11:44But everyone that was around her in her management and, you know, our publicist was basically
11:50saying she's fine.
11:51You know, we're going, she is not fine.
11:54There's something wrong here.
11:55What's wrong with her?
11:56Why won't you tell us?
11:57You must know more than, you know, you're sharing.
12:00And then ultimately, when the family came on board and trusted us, they told us the
12:05truth, you know, of what was going on.
12:08And so that helped us rationalize in some ways, like, this story is bigger than just
12:14Wendy and this family.
12:15This story is about something that is happening in the American legal system that no one knows
12:20anything about.
12:21And this is a way for this to, you know, be addressed.
12:26And the family was adamant that the piece be put out.
12:29By the way, we sat and watched the entire four hours with her family, all the members
12:33of her family, her management watched all four hours of it, you know, and didn't ask
12:38for one change.
12:40So if they had had different reactions and had other thoughts, then I'm sure we would
12:46have reconsidered and thought about addressing those notes.
12:48But they all said this is too important not to share.
12:52Wanda's comment in the trailer, if it, like, if this is the system, it's broken, you know,
12:57and what should I do?
12:58It's my sister.
12:59No, and I was just gonna say, like, Wendy is such an iconoclast, and we, you know, it's
13:04in the film.
13:05And, you know, you can, everyone, we accept everyone's, by the way, judgments on it.
13:09It's not for us to say, whether you feel it's exploitive or not, you know, I think that's
13:14a subjective decision that everyone needs to make for themselves.
13:18But she said, going into this, there are no boundaries, there are no, you know, I'm a
13:22famous person, and my entire career has been based on not respecting celebrities' privacy.
13:28So why would I be any different, you know?
13:30And so, I know that doesn't necessarily rationalize it, but it is very fitting that Wendy Williams
13:35is someone who's willing to show you the truth, warts and all, you know?
13:42I mean, the story is also very much not finished, you know, since this documentary came out,
13:47there's been a lot of questions, where is she still, you know, with her guardianship?
13:51Are there plans for you all to continue to follow her story, or do a larger piece on
13:56guardianship itself?
13:57You know, can you tell me where you might take things?
14:00Certainly no plans currently, right now with Wendy, because I think this story needs to
14:03kind of unfold, and the family needs to have the freedom to do what they need to do, you
14:08know?
14:09And, but I think that piece of the story definitely isn't over.
14:13And look, if Wendy, if there's a happy ending, you know, if there could be a happy ending
14:17to this, we would love to be a part of that.
14:19But that's so far down the road, and not really something we're thinking about.
14:23And the guardianship piece, yeah, I mean, we have a couple projects in development where
14:27we would love to dig deeper into that conversation, and not just in the celebrity realm, but for
14:34real people that are dealing with these issues.
14:37The power is absolute, it's just extraordinary.
14:39And the secrecy, I mean, health and finance, I mean, it's just, I would be terrified if
14:45someone in my family had a court-appointed guardian.
14:47And what did Diane Diamond say, who wrote the book, she's, there's a new book out by
14:50Diane Diamond who's in this, there's this piece that said over 95% of people, once you're
14:56put into a guardianship, you don't get out.
14:59It's very, very difficult to overturn it.
15:03Thank you all for shedding a light on it and sharing your experience with us.
15:06Thank you.