Kiran Bedi Interview in English
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00:00On behalf of the thousands of only 96.8 FM listeners, let me begin by thanking you for
00:25agreeing to share some precious moments with us.
00:28You have been an inspiration to mankind as a whole, and to womankind in particular.
00:33Tell us, why did you choose the police force as your career?
00:35Well, I guess it goes back to my kind of upbringing.
00:40It was very patriotic, it was very sensitive, it was very justice sensitive in a way, and
00:47I was looking forward to working with my government.
00:51And also, I believed in the strength of persuasive power, you know, I wanted to actually exercise
00:57persuasive power, and for me, policing was a very powerful instrument of persuasive power
01:04and corrective power.
01:05And what has been the guiding principles in both your career as well as your family life?
01:10Guiding principles has been basically prioritization, it goes by needs, but every relationship for
01:16me has a space and a time for itself.
01:21I don't muddle up situations, I go by need basis.
01:25I'm basically very time sensitive, and also very focused according to the, and I provide
01:31according to the need.
01:32Right.
01:33How much of an effect has your family had on you, Kiran?
01:37Total.
01:38I'm a product of my family, totally.
01:40I'm a product of my family support.
01:43I'm a product of my family habits.
01:46My habits are exactly like my father, the sports habit, a habit of hard work and discipline
01:52is exactly like my mother's.
01:54I'm a total inheritor of a combination of my mother and my father, and then as I grew
02:00up in my career, my hard work or whatever more I could put in was because of extensive
02:06support I got from my parents, mother most of all, father for my upbringing, and my husband
02:14and my in-laws.
02:15I'm a very strong product of family support.
02:17Dr. Kiran, let's talk about the stint which made you very popular.
02:22Were you overwhelmed when you were given the task of managing the notorious Tihar Jail
02:26back in 1994, and how on earth did you turn around the place in just two years?
02:31You see, I went to the Tihar prison management after about 22 to 23 years of policing experience,
02:39and I'm glad I had that wonderful experience before I got the prison assignment.
02:44And in those 23 years of policing, I had used policing, I had delivered policing as a concept
02:50of welfare policing.
02:52It was always welfare oriented, it was always preventive policing, it was a lot corrective
02:58policing.
02:59Punitive policing was a last resort in all my career.
03:03I never knew that I would one day run a prison of 10,000 prisoners, but prior to the prison
03:08assignment, entire approach was always, how do I reach out welfare?
03:14How do I reach out larger security?
03:17How do I provide preventive policing?
03:19How do I prevent crime before they happen?
03:22And when they happen, how do I work on correction so that the person does not go back to repeating
03:27crime?
03:28So therefore, this is the kind of experience I had gone through the prison.
03:32And it was just a brilliant fertile ground for me to continue with that correction, continue
03:39with the prevention, continue with the welfare concept.
03:42So I was actually groomed so subconsciously, so much by nature that I went to the right
03:48place at the right time.
03:50You have introduced, I think, the concept of self-policing.
03:52Now, is that something new or has it existed before in some other form?
03:57Well, when I introduced the concept of self-policing in my police training, when I headed the police
04:03training in the Delhi Police, unfortunately the practices which we did bring in did not
04:09exist.
04:10So they were first time and I wish I had not been the first one to introduce because without
04:15the self-policing concept, you cannot be a good policeman or a woman.
04:20Because if you do not self-police, then who are you policing?
04:23How are you policing?
04:25Because you may need self-policing yourself.
04:27So therefore, when I introduced the concept of self-policing through meditation procedures,
04:32self-audit, self-reflection, ethical education, it improved the quality of the product or
04:41the production or reproduction of ideas or attitudes remarkably.
04:46But I can't imagine any training without the concept of self-policing.
04:51So unfortunately, they had not existed earlier till we introduced them.
04:56But it came to me because that's what I personally practice and I personally believe in.
05:02And I thought that what had made me enjoy my policing was constant concept of self-policing
05:09because I didn't need to be told by my seniors what to do.
05:13I didn't need to go to a training institute to remain sensitive.
05:16I didn't need to be told by a vigilance department to stay honest or be polite or be kind to
05:22women or be kind to elders or be kind to or not use third degrees, to use compassion.
05:28It all came through the concept of self-policing.
05:31I just transferred something which I personally gained or learned from my habits, from my
05:36family.
05:37It's very humble of you indeed, Dr. Kiran.
05:39Now, you've already spoken about your family.
05:41But I'd like to concentrate a little on your mother.
05:44You once said you lost your feeling of fear when you lost your mom.
05:48What did she mean to you and how much of Kiran Bedi would be attributed to her?
05:53I think I had a living divinity to her because she was a symbol of selfless love.
06:00She was a symbol of total discipline and hard work.
06:05She was a real mother.
06:06She was your mother which one would love to say mama, my mother.
06:10I think that is the feeling I had about her because she was a symbol of selfless love
06:17and constant love and love till the last breath of her life.
06:21She was a woman who believed in doing her duty as much as her body could deliver.
06:28She was an indefatigable energy.
06:30She was a very determined woman, strongly courageous.
06:34I think that's the time when she breathed her last.
06:38Since I loved her the most, there was nobody else after in the sense that who could beat her.
06:44So I became fearless of losing anything more after that.
06:47Inspiring indeed.
06:49Now, tell us a little bit more about Navajyoti and India Vision International,
06:53the two NGOs that you founded.
06:55You see, one of the organizations, the first one, Navajyoti,
06:59was born as a concept of belief in crime prevention.
07:03Treating the root and branch.
07:05Treating the root and branch of crime.
07:08So Navajyoti was born as a drug abuse treatment program in 1986-87.
07:14So many years ago, almost now go back to nearly 20 years,
07:18nearing 22 decades of organizational work.
07:21So I started drug abuse treatment program as a crime prevention measure.
07:25Started to rehabilitate women to wean them away from drug trafficking.
07:29Took children who were abusing drugs and even peddling drugs,
07:33putting them into school.
07:34So I started to work with crime prevention
07:37because I knew it was later on going to be otherwise crime detection.
07:41So this is how Navajyoti was born.
07:43We reached out to drug addicts for treatment.
07:46We reached out to schooling for children.
07:48We reached out to vocational training centers for women.
07:51Now, as I was moving up, people demanded institutionalization of this work.
07:56And that is how Navajyoti was born and incorporated in 1988.
08:00Since then, it's continued to flourish and continued to grow.
08:04It went on adding more programs, but cornerstone of the program,
08:08the genesis was crime prevention and rehabilitation
08:12and treatment of root and branch.
08:14But India Vision Foundation was born in 1994
08:18when I was awarded the Ramon Max Luce award for government service.
08:21And at that time, I was Inspector General of Prisons.
08:24India Vision, and it brought an award of US$50,000.
08:28Every award, I think for me, means added responsibility
08:33and a clear message that do not stop.
08:36Carry on. You're duty-bound to move on.
08:38So India Vision Foundation, I could have named it in my name
08:41or the name of my mother or father,
08:43but we named it as India Vision for me.
08:45It was my award to my country,
08:47which enabled me to be whatever I was.
08:50I named it as India Vision Foundation
08:52because that name is the largest for me.
08:54And that started to focus on prison reform, crime prevention,
08:59and particularly education of prisoners' children,
09:02rehabilitation of vocational training for women in prison.
09:06Since then, now it's nearing 11 years,
09:09program has gone on non-stop.
09:11Kiran, you have inspired so many lives.
09:13Who are those who have inspired you?
09:15I look for inspiration.
09:17The books have been inspiration.
09:18Individuals who are strongly courageous and ethical
09:21were my inspiration.
09:22Well, my parents were my inspiration to begin with,
09:25but then if I would go by the individuals,
09:28then it was Mahatma Gandhi who was my inspiration.
09:31Mother Teresa was my inspiration.
09:34Golda Meir was my inspiration.
09:36Vivekananda was my inspiration.
09:38Even Margaret Thatcher, a strong woman
09:40who would take decisions, right or wrong,
09:43would be my inspiration.
09:44Women and men who were strong, courageous, ethical,
09:48self-sacrificing, giving, compassionate, spiritual,
09:53they were all my inspiration.
09:55And books, my teachers, my situations,
09:58my home, my parents, my mother-in-law,
10:01equally sacrificing and spiritual was my inspiration.
10:04You must have faced failures in life too.
10:06Can you name any and also tell us
10:08how you overcame that failure?
10:10I don't consider any moment,
10:12any situation of failure, believe me.
10:14If I would lose a tennis match,
10:16and you know I was a tennis player,
10:18I was a nation tennis champion
10:20and a national tennis champion.
10:21For me, it was never a defeat.
10:23It was a lesson to be learned to do it better next time.
10:27So in fact, the word failure never existed in our family.
10:31This was the one word which was never used
10:34in the family saying, this, you failed here.
10:36It was just said, here's a lesson to be learned
10:39and do better.
10:40So for me, every situation which needs to be bettered
10:44is not a failure, but a lesson to be learned.
10:47Beautiful.
10:48And you have achieved so much in your lifetime.
10:50What would you consider
10:51as your biggest achievement or success?
10:53I think if I would have to say it
10:56because you're asking me,
10:57then it would mean a whole new concept of policing,
11:01the concept of welfare policing,
11:03the concept of welfare and restorative justice
11:06in the prisons.
11:07That a belief and a confirmed belief
11:10that if you work on crime prevention,
11:12you don't have to work on every time on detection as much.
11:16And then if you work on reformative justice
11:19and restorative justice,
11:21then further you will have a better quality
11:23of crime control.
11:24And that if you involve mind, body, environment
11:28and spirituality, you can bring in greater reforms
11:32in the prison system.
11:33You can use persuasive power
11:35and a police officer could be the greatest welfare officer
11:38in the society because he or she could work
11:41on root and branch alongside.
11:43Policing is not just a punitive power.
11:45Policing actually is a corrective power.
11:48It is the largest welfare and security power
11:51a police officer can exercise.
11:52I would do believe that probably these were the new concepts
11:56and participative policing.
11:58Most of my policing came
11:59and all my prison management came through three C models.
12:02It was collective, it was corrective and community-based.
12:06My policing has been these three Cs,
12:08collective, corrective and community-based.
12:11This is a model in fact I've given through my book.
12:13It's always possible in the end to think
12:16this is my contribution to the criminal justice system.
12:19A great contribution indeed.
12:21Kiran, if there's one trait that has characterized
12:23your 55 years of existence, what would that be?
12:27I think I'm very organized.
12:29I'm very disciplined.
12:30I'm basically by nature, very hardworking.
12:33I value time hell of a lot.
12:35I value every moment.
12:37I don't let a moment slip by.
12:39If I'm meditating, then I am meditating.
12:42If I'm exercising, then I am exercising.
12:44If I'm reading, then I am.
12:46I'm pretty focused by nature and I'm very organized.
12:50I'm very systematic in my life and my living
12:53and I'm multitasking by nature, hugely.
12:56There's a huge habit of multitasking right from my childhood
12:59and I think that's how I would say
13:01that's what my life has been the way
13:04and I've loved it so far.
13:05And most of all, I'm grateful for divine good health
13:09because without good health,
13:10it may have been so difficult to do what I did.
13:13So with gratitude for good health
13:16and the good environment I got,
13:17I could achieve all these multitasking, disciplined living.
13:21Kiran, just one last question.
13:23This program, Bhanum Vasapadme,
13:25aims to inspire people by telling them that
13:28if this personality has done it, so can you.
13:31Now, as you turn 56, what would you want to tell
13:33our listeners who may be looking for a spark of motivation?
13:36Well, I would say that anybody who's listening,
13:39you've got your five senses intact.
13:41You've got your five senses which nature gifts you
13:44as you're born.
13:45I think you're already gifted.
13:47You've already gifted.
13:48You've got it all.
13:49And braver are those who got any one sense less
13:53and then do it despite that.
13:55But if you're born with these gifts of nature,
13:59you have it all.
14:00So therefore, God has already given you,
14:02or nature has already given you
14:04as you're born as a human being.
14:06What you do with these five senses
14:08is your gift to the world
14:10or your gift back to nature.
14:12And you use those gifts to optimum utilization
14:16and right use of your ethical use of the time
14:20which one gets 24 hours per day.
14:23This is how I value 24 hours of my day.
14:26And I think that's the gift I return as gratitude
14:29back to society, back to the community
14:32and to my parents who expected this all from me.
14:34Thank you very much, Dr. Kiran
14:35and all the best for your future endeavors.
14:38Thank you for this happy birthday gift.
14:40♪♪♪
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