Kent Politics Show Special: Election 2024 (01:42-02:25)
Watch back KMTV's live coverage of the UK's 2024 General Election results.
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00:00Welcome back to KMTV studio here in Medway and I'm delighted to say that I'm joined by KCC leader Roger Gough.
00:13Now Roger, we've been talking off camera there a little bit about the exit poll.
00:17It's a really difficult night for the Conservatives.
00:20But 131 seats, would you have taken that at the beginning of the night?
00:25Certainly it's at the higher end of what was projected
00:29and equally if we look at what's projected for Kent or indeed for Kent and Medway,
00:33although it comes for these purposes to the same thing,
00:36seven Conservative seats, which would be again at the higher end of what many of us perhaps feared was the case,
00:43certainly during the campaign.
00:45I think you have seen a little bit of solidifying in the closing week or so.
00:50But there was no doubt that at many stages it looked as though it could be an even bigger setback.
00:56But look, that's just relative to expectations.
01:00We have to be realistic, this is a very, very bad night for the Conservative Party.
01:04And when Rishi Sunak called that general election, were you surprised?
01:07Yes, I was.
01:09I think that I was surprised because I thought that there was an effort to land a number of points
01:15about what was happening with the economy, some of the challenge to Labour's plans
01:21and I thought some of those things were just beginning to land a little bit.
01:25So that was something that you would want to continue. So I was surprised, yes.
01:28And as Leader of the Council, you must have been like, gosh, we're going to be in for a hard time now,
01:34trying to get out on the doorsteps with the candidates as well.
01:38What's it going to be like for you now, if the exit poll is to be believed,
01:43that there's going to be a Labour government by the end of the night?
01:46How are you going to work with a Labour government?
01:49Well, I think firstly, we will treat every government in the same way.
01:54So we've had a government of our own party for a long time.
01:58That has not stopped us standing up for what we think is right for Kent
02:03and challenging when that's appropriate.
02:06When you get to the stage when you are actually judicially reviewing a Home Secretary from your own party,
02:11then I think we are willing to take on government or to work with government of whatever party.
02:18And if you go back actually to the new Labour years,
02:21obviously there are points where, unsurprisingly,
02:25a Conservative council and a Labour government will come into conflict.
02:29There were also many areas where they worked together very successfully.
02:32So we will seek to work with, frankly we have no choice,
02:36but we actually believe it is quite doable to work with a government of whatever party.
02:41But clearly we would have to see what attitude a Labour government takes.
02:45What I think is interesting is at the same time,
02:47we do see what seems to be quite a big change to the overall political complexion in Kent.
02:52So if the projections are right and you have 11 Labour MPs, 7 Conservative MPs,
03:00that is a big shift from where we were.
03:02Even in 1997, if you look across Kent and Medway,
03:06it was 9 Conservative MPs out of what was then 17.
03:11So it's back a bit from that.
03:14And that would seem roughly compatible with the Conservatives nationally
03:18getting 131 seats to the 165 that we got back in 1997.
03:24And you have obviously been out campaigning with some of the candidates.
03:29What has the mood been like over these last six weeks behind closed doors?
03:33Surely with this type of result on the horizon,
03:36it must have been a really difficult time.
03:38Well, yes, clearly.
03:39Look, we are all realistic and I think many of us have been around in campaigns for quite some time
03:45and I think you know the signs.
03:47So what I think we did see was a whole number of candidates in seats
03:52which were extremely marginal, working tremendously hard.
03:56Certainly I sought to give them support
03:58and I know actually many of my colleagues in the Kent County Council Conservative group
04:04put in enormous hours working with their local candidates.
04:08But we knew from the start that this was going to be a very, very difficult election.
04:13I would say that perhaps if you were to go back six weeks,
04:18maybe we might have hoped to achieve slightly better than this projection if it's accurate.
04:24If you were to go back three weeks,
04:26I think this looks relatively stronger than we might have feared.
04:30So when would have you gone to the polls?
04:32So when would have you called the election?
04:34Well, it's not my call because that is the Prime Minister's job.
04:39But as I say, I was personally surprised.
04:42But in one sense, frankly, I think from the point of view of the country,
04:46overall it was a good thing because we've been in this pre-election phase over a long, long time.
04:52I think you see how it affects how government operates,
04:55certainly from the point of view of public mood as well.
04:58I think lots of people wanted it done.
05:01And in that sense, frankly, I think the Prime Minister did us all a service by going sooner rather than later.
05:07But there's some very senior MPs who will be losing their jobs this evening,
05:12not just here in Kent, but across the UK.
05:16We've seen that Jeremy Hunt is projected to lose his seat.
05:19Grant Shapps is projected to lose his seat.
05:22Here in Kent, Damien Green is projected to lose his seat in Ashford.
05:27Former Deputy Prime Minister, been a longstanding constituency MP in Ashford.
05:34What about Damien in particular?
05:37Because that's someone who a lot of our viewers will know.
05:41What kind of a loss would he be?
05:43I think an enormous one.
05:44And I have to declare an interest.
05:45Damien's a friend, has been for many, many years.
05:48In fact, long before I lived in Kent even.
05:51So I know Damien very well.
05:54I think he is an immensely wise political head.
05:58He brings huge experience.
06:01And yes, it will be a huge loss if indeed that's how it turns out.
06:05Clearly, there are a whole number of these seats which are still right on the cusp and could go either way.
06:11So some of those which at the moment we're projected to hold, we may or may not.
06:16Some of those we're projected to lose, we may or may not.
06:19But either way, if we were to lose Damien, I think that would be a loss to Parliament.
06:25Because he is undoubtedly somebody who's got huge experience.
06:28A lot of wisdom has made a great contribution.
06:31Thank you, Roger.
06:32So we're just going to go off out around the county again.
06:35We've got Joe in Sittingbourne and Sheppey, which is one of these seats that we have said that is pretty tight.
06:40It's projected to go to stay Conservative at the moment.
06:45So, Joe, what news do you have for us?
06:48Right. So the turnout numbers have just come in.
06:5148,000 people. Sorry, I've got that wrong.
06:5441,088 people have come out and voted.
06:58But the interesting thing is that it's very low.
07:0251.97 people in terms of turnout came out.
07:10But that is really low, really, really low.
07:13Last time in 2019, it was 61.2%.
07:16So it's a massive drop.
07:18So you can kind of get the sense there's apathy maybe from voters.
07:22I've talked to a lot of candidates.
07:23They've all mentioned that on their door knocking and how they think their campaign has gone.
07:28They've all said, you know, there's a lot of apathy.
07:30I think I've changed a lot of minds.
07:32But people said they would vote for me.
07:34But have they really? Well, that's the proof in the pudding.
07:37Joe, thank you very much.
07:39So, Roger, just reacting to that, Sittingbourne and Sheppey, the turnout really low there.
07:43It's a shocking figure, actually.
07:45Do you think that's got something to do with Gordon Henderson standing down?
07:49Possibly, but I think it'd be interesting to see, and I haven't looked at all the figures there,
07:53the comparison of how much of a drop that is by comparison with elsewhere,
07:58because I think overall we're seeing falls in turnout.
08:02There could be a whole variety of reasons for that.
08:04I think part of it is that the election has, I think, been seen as a bit of a foregone conclusion.
08:10People forget that 1997 was actually a significant fall in turnout
08:17from what had happened five years previously because it was, I think, seen as a foregone conclusion.
08:23And, in fact, 2001, lower still.
08:26We seem to be in that same phase.
08:28I think also that many voters, frankly, have lost faith in us
08:33without necessarily fully embracing what Labour offers.
08:37Labour has clearly done spectacularly well,
08:40but a big part of that has been the falling away of the Conservative vote,
08:44as well as undoubtedly some significant political strategic achievements, if you like, on their part.
08:51But, nonetheless, there isn't, I think, a huge sense of optimism there across any of the parties, sadly.
08:59That is something which all of us who are engaged in that world need to work hard to regain.
09:05And, therefore, I think that's playing out in the turnout.
09:08But it would be interesting to see, and I haven't seen the comparisons,
09:11as to what happens in Sittingbourne and Sheppey.
09:13When Joe gave those figures, I was quite astonished to hear that.
09:18Well, if Labour do take home 410 seats tonight, they'll be very pleased.
09:24But Keir Starmer said that he listened after the 2019 election
09:30and wanted to change the Labour Party.
09:33Clearly, that's helped, as well as some circumstances within the Conservative government, of course.
09:39Now, what would you, as a senior member of the Conservative Party here in Kent,
09:44a council leader, one of the biggest councils in the country,
09:49how do you want the Conservative Party to change?
09:52Everything's been spoken about in commentary, whether it's this move to the right
09:58or trying to be in that centre ground for people who may be wanting to vote Labour,
10:05to try and win some of those back.
10:07Where do you want to see the party go and what do you think is realistic?
10:11Well, I think the first thing in terms of being realistic, I think there are two things.
10:15One is we should not expect to be able to turn all of this around quickly.
10:21I'm afraid it's taken a long time to get to the point that we find ourselves in tonight.
10:26We will be in opposition, a lot of public attention will go on to a new government
10:32and therefore, to believe that we would be the centre of attention, we won't be for some time.
10:38And I think it's very important to be realistic about not believing that there's a magic bullet for the party's problems.
10:45I think we've got to work long and hard to actually rebuild the confidence that people can have in us as a governing party.
10:54I've always said the Conservative Party above all else has been seen, if you like, as the Captain Sensible of British politics.
11:00The people who you can actually believe you can trust to run the country, run the government and do so effectively.
11:07And there is no doubt that that reputation over the last few years, along with a number of other things, has taken a big hit.
11:14So I think above all, it is actually achieving a really serious engagement with what has gone wrong,
11:22working to rebuild that record or that level of trust and confidence on the part of voters.
11:31And that is going to take time.
11:33But I think haring off in pursuit that there is one magic bullet that's going to solve the whole problem, I think would be very, very unwise.
11:40Well, there's almost certainly going to be a leadership contest.
11:45I'm pretty sure, I think most people think that Rishi Sunak won't be the leader of the opposition after tonight.
11:53What kind of leader do you want to see, though?
11:55Do you want to see a One Nation type of Conservative?
11:59Or do you want to see someone further on the right of the party, a Soheila Breverman, that kind of character?
12:04Well, personally, I've always considered myself a One Nation Conservative.
12:08So you can take from that what you will.
12:10But actually, to me, what's most important is the spirit and the approach which is taken.
12:16Because it is about actually rebuilding, as I say, that reputation.
12:20It's also about a degree of honesty.
12:23One of the problems I think we've seen in this election, and goes back actually to what we were saying a moment ago about turnout,
12:30is there's been a horrible sense by voters that none of the parties are really quite facing up to the scale of the challenges that we face as a country.
12:39And certainly, again, being in local government, leading a council, I am acutely aware of what certainly some of those are,
12:46and how challenging the next few years look.
12:49And the voters are right to think that. I don't think there has been that level of engagement.
12:54So I think actually a bit of, as I say, honesty about what it is we confront,
13:00that's going to be a really, really important part of what a new leader does.
13:03Well, we can see how engaging the voters have been in Ashford.
13:07We're going to go over to Imagine now and hear about the turnout there.
13:13Yeah, so we just got the voter turnout figures for Ashford.
13:17We've been told that the turnout was 62 percent, which is slightly lower than previous election counts.
13:26In the 2019 election, it was around 68 percent.
13:29So it is slightly down on that figure.
13:33There are potentially 73,000 voters for Ashford.
13:37And so that works out at around 45,000 people casting their ballot this evening.
13:43We will get the results around 3, 330. We're expecting the results to be announced around then.
13:49It's worth noting that this seat has changed due to due to boundary changes and it is more urban and less rural.
13:58And that might account for the slightly lower vote count.
14:02But as I said, Ashford voter turnout figures is 62 percent.
14:08Thank you very much. So, Roger, we're talking about the turnout there. It's down on last time.
14:13But not by the same level as we've seen in Sittingbourne and Sheppey.
14:16And that was very interesting to hear it. By the way, before we go any further,
14:19can I just pick up on listening to Majid and Joe and so on?
14:23I understand because we were talking about this, weren't we, before we came on air,
14:27that we think KMTV is pretty much unique across the country in doing this,
14:32in covering all these counts, in giving, in this case, Kent-wide coverage.
14:37And I do think that is fantastic because it is something that that level,
14:42with everything we've seen that's happened to local news and local reporting in recent years,
14:48I think having something like this for Kent is a tremendous resource.
14:52But coming back to what was said a moment ago,
14:55it's interesting, isn't it, that that decline is so much less than in Sittingbourne and Sheppey.
15:00So I think we will have to look for some very specific factors in that case.
15:04But I think the more general point about a lower turnout and what seems to lie behind it,
15:09I think that still holds. Because Damien Green actually did want to,
15:12first of all, thank you, Roger, for those very kind words.
15:14We're working very hard through the night. We're staying up just about everyone,
15:17including everyone on camera. Let's talk a little bit more about Damien,
15:22because he's one of the most well-known politicians in the county,
15:27former Deputy Prime Minister. Why did he want to go to the Weald, do you think?
15:32I know that he lives in that area.
15:37But was it because it was going to be a much safer bet for him
15:40if he was going to stand in the Weald rather than in Ashford?
15:42Would the polling numbers have been there around the time of selection?
15:45Well, I think it's fair to say anyone could see that one seat was much more rural
15:51and more likely to be solidly conservative than another.
15:53What Damien's thinking was behind that is not, frankly, for me to judge.
15:57He's the one who could answer that.
15:59But it's fair to say he had a perfectly legitimate claim on it,
16:03because a significant part of that new seat does come from the old Ashford constituency.
16:08And as we say, the new Ashford constituency is much more concentrated, much more urban.
16:15So he had a perfectly legitimate claim in putting himself forward for it.
16:18That was not, in the end, what the local conservative association
16:22for that new constituency decided to go with.
16:25And they have Katie Lamb, who I've met, who is the conservative candidate there.
16:30But, as I say, Damien had a perfectly reasonable claim on it.
16:34Just a little bit about Katie Lamb. Not many people know much about her.
16:37She's had a pretty impressive CV already.
16:41Can you tell our viewers a little bit about her?
16:44Certainly. I met her a couple of months ago.
16:46She came to see me at County Hall.
16:48I think we were scheduled for an hour, and we overshot considerably.
16:53She's very bright. I was actually very impressed by her.
16:55And I think she'll be, if, as seems very likely, she is returned,
17:00I think she, again, will be a big asset to the House of Commons.
17:03She's worked for Boris Johnson. She was a deputy to Dominic Cummings.
17:08And she's also worked for Sweller Brethren.
17:10Does that give you an idea of her type of politics?
17:13Is she on the right side of the Conservative Party, would you say?
17:16Again, I think she would have to answer that better than me,
17:18because when I spoke, we were addressing very much
17:22what I would think of as practical issues.
17:25What is it the Kent County Council, all the areas that we cover,
17:30the impact that that would have on the people who will be,
17:33I'd hope and expect, her constituents,
17:36and the areas on which we could look to work together.
17:39So it was a very practical, very focused conversation.
17:43Beyond that, I couldn't judge.
17:45We're going to go out again, Roger.
17:47We're off to Folkestone and Hyde this time to get a turnout.
17:50And we've got Finn there.
17:52So can you tell us a little bit about the turnout there, Finn?
17:57Hi. Quite a few people have turned out from Folkestone.
18:01We've got 43,000 voters, and that's 61% of the constituency.
18:06It's quite interesting here.
18:08We've been told that the Conservatives are predicted third place.
18:13Third place, Finn.
18:15So is it reform coming in second place at the moment?
18:21We haven't got a clear confirmation.
18:24It may be reform.
18:26OK, but you've heard that the Conservatives could end up third.
18:29Thank you very much, Finn. Roger, get your reaction to that.
18:31Third place.
18:33We were off camera, but I hope you saw my reaction.
18:36That would be astonishing, because that has been a Conservative seat
18:39over a long, long time.
18:41Of course, Damien Collins has been there since 2010.
18:43Before Damien, it was Michael Howard.
18:46And it's one which, again, I know that Damien and his team
18:49put in an enormous amount of work in this campaign.
18:52So clearly, this is at the moment a projection.
18:54We'll have to see.
18:56But, of course, what you do have is actually quite a complex mix
18:59of different political groups in the whole Folkestone and Hyde area.
19:04So you have a Liberal Democrat presence, you have a Green presence.
19:08And reform, it's worth thinking in these terms generally,
19:12that if you look across the county, some of the proxies,
19:17if you were trying to think of where might you expect reform to come through,
19:21take a look at where UKIP was quite strong
19:24at the time of the county elections in 2013.
19:27And there certainly were a number of UKIP gains in Folkestone and Hyde.
19:31But I don't want to speculate. Let's see what the actual results are.
19:34It's interesting because there was only one,
19:36where there might have been a very brief other Cabinet visit,
19:39but the most high-profile Cabinet visit in Kent during the campaign
19:43was James Cleverley.
19:45Folkestone and Hyde was one of his stops.
19:47Why don't you think there was more visits here in Kent?
19:50Why didn't Rishi Sunak come to Kent? Why wasn't he supporting?
19:53Why didn't Jeremy Hunt, although I know he was off clearly battling his own seat,
19:58but was that the case that everything was just spread too thin
20:02to be able to get to all of these what are usually
20:05absolute Conservative strongholds?
20:07Why wasn't there more action on the campaign down here?
20:10Well, again, I can't speak for what...
20:12With Keir Starmer starting his entire campaign from Gillingham.
20:16I don't know, is the short answer, but what I would say is this.
20:20I think one of the challenges probably that the Conservative Party
20:23faced nationally was exactly what, on a smaller level, we faced
20:27and I faced when thinking about where do I deploy my efforts?
20:31I mean, I do a lot in my own local area, but where do I deploy my efforts?
20:36And trying to work out where marginal effort will make the most difference
20:41is really, really challenging when you see the polls going the way that they were.
20:45And, of course, what's been distinct about this election too
20:48is we have all these MRP projections,
20:51some of which were throwing out some very wacky outcomes.
20:56But, again, trying to really work out, as I say,
20:59where you can best put in visits or indeed any other effort
21:04is really hard under those circumstances.
21:07Well, Roger, thank you ever so much for now.
21:09I know that we've got Alan Baldock waiting to come in
21:12from Canterbury City Council,
21:14so it'll be great to get you two to have a chat together.
21:17So we're just going to cut to our election holding still for a moment
21:21whilst we get Alan in.
21:25SILENCE
21:55There we go.
22:26SILENCE
22:33OK, we're back.
22:34So we can see from a national perspective there's more seats coming in.
22:38We're expecting some of the Kent seats to start announcing
22:42in the next couple of hours.
22:44But we're joined in the studio now
22:46by Canterbury City Council leader Alan Baldock.
22:49Thank you ever so much for joining us.
22:51And we've been having a great chat with Roger,
22:53who's had a brave face on.
22:55That's probably the best thing to say.
22:57So how are you feeling this evening, Alan?
22:59Is this an absolute roaring success, or could you be greedy?
23:03Could you have wanted some more seats?
23:06I was saying to one of your colleagues in Canterbury a little bit earlier,
23:10I'm a cynical old politician.
23:12I want to see the votes in the bag, you know.
23:15And we've all sat there looking at all the votes coming in
23:18and thinking, oh, this is looking great.
23:21And then everyone's counted all over the room
23:23and then they're all put together and the votes come and go
23:26and you think, oh, this is a nervy bit.
23:28So there's some seats that I'm really interested in
23:30that are going to be really, really close,
23:32which is Herne Bay and Sandwich, which, you know, is Roger Gale's.
23:37Are we going to win that one?
23:39It's been close.
23:40Electrical Calc has been putting it just a point or two apart
23:43and then it separated last week to become just looking like
23:47he was heading to get that back.
23:50And also Favisham and mid-Kent.
23:53You know, wouldn't that be an amazing win for Labour
23:56if we can pull that new seat off?
23:58And it's really, really close.
24:00So those two, I'm really looking forward to results for those.
24:04And turning the right-hand side, East Kent, back to Labour
24:12is going to be really good if we can pull it off.
24:15A long way to go.
24:16And as I said, we've got lots of votes to count first,
24:18so let's not count our chickens too much.
24:20And as you hear, we must talk about Rosie Duffield,
24:23who is a good 20 points ahead,
24:26which if you think about that seat traditionally,
24:29we were only talking about it several years ago,
24:32about it being the longest standing Conservative seat,
24:36now a really safe Labour seat.
24:38But Rosie's had her problems with the Labour government,
24:43sorry, Freudian slip, the opposition at the time,
24:47the soon-to-be-the-Labour government,
24:49not invited to campaign events.
24:52Is she really gunning to be a Labour MP?
24:56Have you spoken to her behind closed doors?
25:00Did she think about defecting to someone else?
25:02Is she really signed up to a Keir Starmer government
25:05as a Labour MP, Rosie Duffield?
25:07Yeah.
25:08I mean, we meet quite regularly.
25:12You know, Rosie is Rosie.
25:15You know, she...
25:16And maybe what fine people might think,
25:18she has opinions, she has her views,
25:20and those views are loved by some and hated by some.
25:24But is she a good MP?
25:26Yes, she is.
25:27Has she got a fantastic team?
25:28Yes, she has.
25:2960-odd thousand pieces of casework have been done by that team
25:33in just a few years.
25:35And every single week, she's working with people,
25:37helping people, her team are working with them.
25:39She's a great constituency MP.
25:42She has her views.
25:44But not invited to events when Keir Starmer's in Kent, though.
25:48That's happened on several occasions,
25:50and she's been very vocal about that.
25:52And she's been very vocal about the Natalie Olphek defection
25:56as well down in Dover.
25:58She has her views.
25:59You know, the point being, we don't all have to nod and do...
26:04I do as I'm told because I'm a council leader.
26:06You know, Rosie is an MP.
26:08She has some freedom to do as she wishes to.
26:10But she's a Labour person through and through,
26:12and that's a definite...
26:13You know, I don't see Rosie Duffield defecting anywhere,
26:17to be quite honest with you.
26:19It's just not there.
26:21And when there are these infights within parties,
26:23because I think the Conservatives have done a bit of that in the past.
26:26We have done them.
26:28So what is it like trying to toe the party line
26:31when certainly there must be MPs just...
26:34or former MPs waiting to talk about
26:37how badly this campaign's gone for the Conservatives?
26:41What's it like when there is that bucking of heads behind closed doors?
26:46Well, I think always divisions within parties are pretty painful things.
26:50Now, an element of it is always going to be there.
26:52You look at the history of the Conservative Party,
26:55the history of the Labour Party.
26:57Division to a degree has been the norm.
27:02But when it gets to a point where it becomes really, really built in,
27:06really damaging, and from the point of view of my party,
27:09it's happened to us on a number of occasions.
27:11It happened particularly in...
27:13If you go back to the 1992-1997 Parliament,
27:16and if you go back to the equivalent time for this,
27:21I was actually a parliamentary candidate for the Conservatives in 1997.
27:25So I was conscious of being on the receiving end
27:28of all that division and all those problems that had built up.
27:32And then there are times when, yes, there's always debate and challenge,
27:35but it's not nearly as destructive,
27:38and you go through a little bit of a cycle on it.
27:41Yes, it is damaging.
27:42I would say that, as a council leader,
27:46there is a huge amount of the business you do as a council leader
27:49that you just have to get on with.
27:51And the ideological divisions within a party,
27:55or indeed actually sometimes even the party political divisions,
27:58particularly between central and local government,
28:02are less important than the fact that you have certain jobs
28:06you've really got to get on with.
28:08So to a certain degree, as a council leader,
28:10you can focus on the things that really matter
28:13within your areas of responsibility.
28:16But nonetheless, as I say, an element of that division is normal.
28:20Getting it to the point where it becomes really, really damaging,
28:24that is not.
28:25But when it does happen, parties suffer.
28:27And I think, again, you've seen that for my party,
28:30you've seen it in the past for the Labour Party.
28:32Absolutely, yes.
28:33And we'll talk about a couple of the issues on the campaign now
28:36that came through or made a cut through.
28:40So Labour, we were told over and over and over and over again
28:45by Rishi Sunak that taxes are going to go up.
28:47Do you think that's the case, Roger?
28:49Do you think we're going to see Labour put taxes up quickly?
28:53I don't know whether quickly.
28:54I suspect they will find themselves under a very big degree of pressure on that.
28:59And, you know, we already see the public spending projections,
29:03which both parties have endorsed, are immensely tight.
29:07And therefore the challenge will be how do you actually respond to that?
29:12Labour have said so far, I mean, one of the key objectives
29:15is we want to be the fastest growing economy in the G7.
29:21Well, you know, good luck is, I'm afraid, my response on that
29:24because the degree to which any government,
29:27particularly in the short term, can manage what the growth rate is,
29:31I think it's pretty limited.
29:34So I think there's a cyclical upturn that will help the new government
29:39to a degree, but I think they'll still be left facing
29:42some really, really hard choices.
29:44And I suspect part of that will put that upward pressure on taxes.
29:47And obviously it's a hugely challenging time for councils,
29:52for unitary authorities.
29:54Will you be getting on the phone to central office saying,
29:57can we have some more money, please?
29:59Actually, we would be daft not to, wouldn't we, really?
30:02But we all will.
30:04We will put pressure on, of course we are.
30:06But I think there's some things in the Labour manifesto
30:08which make me quite happy.
30:10I mean, one is my big bugbear, which is about neutral neutrality.
30:14It's in their manifesto that they're going to be working towards it.
30:17Have they put enough in there for me? A bit more would have been better.
30:20But they've acknowledged it, and that's the first time
30:22a government has properly acknowledged that it needs to be sorted
30:25and the reasons behind it.
30:27So we can help rebuild it.
30:29I was going to say the Conservative government did actually have a go
30:32at neutral neutrality issues, and you'll remember that got torpedoed.
30:36Only at the expense of the environment.
30:39So that's there, which is good.
30:41But the other thing is there's a commitment
30:43to a longer-term funding commitment,
30:45which for Roger and for us will be enormously helpful.
30:48The Conservative government, that hopefully is finished now,
30:52has had a Hunger Games system running for years,
30:57and it is immensely challenging to our teams, our staffing.
31:02It's demoralising.
31:04It's everything that's bad about funding.
31:06Just to fix the amount of money, whatever we're going to get in,
31:09if it's not as much as we would like, to know what you're getting
31:12year upon year, every year, would be just amazing.
31:15So those two things and that funding, longer-term funding
31:18for local councils from Labour would be huge.
31:23If we can do that now for the next funding cycles,
31:25for next year and onwards, that would be awesome,
31:28and then that gives time as well that we can start getting funding
31:31sorted out and in the right pots as well.
31:33Yes, and I think you'd find a fair degree of agreement
31:35between us on that.
31:37What I would say is there are two slightly different elements within it.
31:40There's the multi-year funding settlements,
31:42and we've seen far too many single-year settlements.
31:46Actually, when I'm trying to look at our budget pressures,
31:49clearly we've got huge pressures in areas like adult social care,
31:53children's social services, SEN.
31:56In Alan's case, it'll be very much the temporary accommodation.
32:00Absolutely, yes.
32:02When you're trying to work out what your situation is
32:04over a number of years, it's much harder to do that
32:08and take that more strategic approach if you've only got
32:11single-year funding settlements.
32:13I think cross-party, we would, all of us in local government,
32:16urge that.
32:18I think I am in agreement, actually, about...
32:21You're agreeing a lot.
32:23Yes, on this we absolutely are, but not on everything,
32:26by any means, but on this we certainly are.
32:28The system of competitive funding and competitive bidding
32:32and small pots of funding too is counterproductive.
32:37The current or outgoing government did recognise that.
32:40If you go back to what was in the devolution white paper,
32:44Michael Gove was certainly looking to move it more in that direction.
32:47But frankly, the further we can go in that direction, the better,
32:51because it is, as you say, it makes big demands on teams
32:57in local government.
32:59There are better things for us to be doing than constantly
33:02writing bids, a number of which will not necessarily be successful.
33:07Stability, predictability, let us know where we stand,
33:11let us know it on a multi-year basis, and then we can get on
33:15with seeking to fix the problems we have.
33:17Yes, I totally agree.
33:19We've got a turnout report from The Weald now from Yaya.
33:24Is Yaya there?
33:26Yes, I am.
33:28So, Yaya, tell us about the turnout at The Weald.
33:32Yes, so the turnout at The Weald has just been announced
33:35not too long ago.
33:36It was 67%.
33:38According to the actual calculus, it was a predicted 63%.
33:41So a lot more people have come out to vote than was expected.
33:45We have 48,000 of the 70,000 in the electorate,
33:50which is quite a high turnout there.
33:53This means that Kent is going to get a new MP,
33:56because The Weald is the newest seat,
33:58and it's going to give Kent an extra MP as well,
34:00because they've never consisted here.
34:02So just to confirm, it's a 67% turnout for The Weald.
34:07We are expecting the ballots to all be tallied up by 4.30,
34:11and then, yes, we'll have the newest MP in Kent after then.
34:15Yaya, thank you very much indeed.
34:17So, turnout a little bit higher there for once,
34:19because we've been hearing about turnout being terrible.
34:21Why do you think that is?
34:22Because of this new constituency?
34:24Or, you know, it's going to be a safe Tory seat.
34:27So Tories have come out to vote.
34:29Roger, you must be delighted.
34:31Delighted if they have, absolutely.
34:33But I think that to some extent you will see...
34:37It will be interesting to see what the pattern is across,
34:40particularly the social composition of seats.
34:43So we know nationally that turnout is down.
34:46We were talking earlier on and reflecting,
34:48weren't we, on Sittingbourne and Sheppey
34:50and what appears to be an absolutely precipitous drop there.
34:55Are we seeing between more urban, more rural,
34:59between more affluent or less affluent,
35:02or other features of particular constituencies,
35:05are we seeing rather different trends in terms of turnout,
35:09albeit within what's overall a declining picture?
35:12I suspect we are, and it would be interesting to see
35:14what some of those from other parts of the country,
35:18again, what that's telling us in terms of the kind of areas
35:21where you've seen the biggest falls in turnout.
35:24Just talking a little bit more about the east of the county,
35:28as it's your patch, Dover.
35:31It was a huge, huge story when Natalie Elphick defected.
35:36Who knew if she knew what was coming down the line?
35:39It was almost played perfectly into Labour's hands,
35:43really, when the election was called.
35:46But the polls have been saying that Dover was going to go Labour
35:49for some time. Why is that?
35:51It's a huge issue, the immigration crisis.
35:55The small boats has been a huge part of political discussion
36:00over the last couple of years.
36:02So why are people in Dover, who are in the front line of this,
36:06going against the Conservatives and going for a Labour candidate?
36:15Dover has many mining traditions still embedded in its communities.
36:21There's big Brexit voting as well.
36:23That's there as well.
36:25I don't think the people are silly.
36:29I mean, they know where the answers lie.
36:34And we should give them faith for that, to be quite honest with you.
36:38They've had their flirt, if you like, with the Brexit issues
36:42and the far right and things.
36:45But it's a big constituency.
36:48And I think they've probably got their faith.
36:51They also, I think, are very sensible, pragmatic people.
36:57Yeah, but people know.
37:00We try to prejudge people, pre-select and pre-think.
37:04Actually, people know where their answer lies.
37:07They're demonstrating with their feet and going out and voting.
37:11I think it's proof enough.
37:14Although it's been a classic swing seat, hasn't it?
37:17So from memory, it went Labour in 1997.
37:20It did, yeah.
37:22And it came back to the Conservatives in 2010.
37:25So it is one of those seats.
37:27And actually, there are a number of them historically across Kent.
37:30It'll be interesting to see what the pattern is when we see the results,
37:33which have moved with the change of government.
37:35So they're absolute bellwethers.
37:37And Dover's very much been one of those.
37:39That's, I think, a point I'm making.
37:41You trust them people to vote what they know is going to be best for them.
37:45It's as simple as I think, isn't it?
37:47I don't think you can predict it, can you?
37:49They decide themselves.
37:51We have some breaking news.
37:53A reform seat has been called, and it is Lee Anderson.
37:57Right.
37:58Which is not wholly a surprise.
38:00Not wholly a surprise.
38:02So they have one on the board.
38:04They've actually declared the results.
38:06Actually declared the results.
38:08So far, since we've been talking, the results are coming in thick and fast.
38:1133 Labour seats have been called now.
38:14Three Conservative, two Liberal Democrats, and that one reform.
38:19So, yeah, it's going to be a long night, Roger, unfortunately.
38:22It is.
38:23They're predicted to have 13, aren't they, on the exit polls?
38:26They are.
38:27It's quite significant.
38:28Given a lot of the polls were saying there would be two or three seats,
38:31we'll wait to see what happens in Clacton.
38:33That's what everyone's looking at.
38:35But, yeah, so Lee Anderson took 42% of the vote,
38:41with Labour coming in second.
38:43Conservatives all the way down in fourth are on that seat.
38:47Is it Green's third?
38:49No, it was an independent.
38:51Independent.
38:52So we're going to go back over to Medway Park.
38:54Roger, thank you ever so much indeed.
38:56Alan, thank you very much indeed.
38:58We're going to have a piece from earlier in the campaign about Herne Bay
39:01and then we're going to be into Medway Park.
39:03Outspoken and longstanding,
39:05Sir Roger Gale has been on the front line of Kent politics since 1983.
39:11Now the 80-year-old Conservative candidate
39:14is fighting his ninth election battle in the county,
39:18this time for the newly formed Herne Bay and Sandwich seat.
39:22But with some polls pinning the constituency as a toss-up
39:26between the Conservatives and Labour,
39:28Gale is laying out his pitch for undecided voters.
39:32I think the voters in Herne Bay and Sandwich have a very clear choice.
39:37Somebody who they know can do the job,
39:41is committed to the things that they want to be committed to,
39:44in terms of Manston Airport,
39:46in terms of protecting the rural environment,
39:49in terms of protecting the future for their children and their grandchildren,
39:53or the alternative which is very untried
39:57and represents a party that has no clear aims other than to obtain power.
40:02Down the road in Minster,
40:04Labour candidate Helen Whitehead is out canvassing.
40:07The deputy leader of Thanet District Council
40:10has had quite a storied career herself,
40:12putting her public sector knowledge at the forefront
40:15on the campaign trail.
40:17I've been a deputy headteacher, FEN-related.
40:22I've worked for the NHS.
40:25I've worked for most public services,
40:28so I have an excellent understanding of where we are facing issues
40:32and how much we need change across those systems.
40:37I think, from that perspective, it's essential to have a new voice
40:41because we have had an extended period of continual decline
40:45in our public services,
40:47and I'm someone who has worked within them, seen that,
40:50and knows how to change it.
40:52Meanwhile, out on the high street in Birhington-on-Sea,
40:55voters are beginning to make up their minds.
40:58I probably would have voted reform,
41:01but I'm frightened if I vote for reform
41:04that there won't be enough people doing it
41:08and Labour will sneak in, and that's my biggest worry.
41:12With everything that's been going on over the last 12 years,
41:16I couldn't possibly vote for the Tories again.
41:19I have voted for them in the past,
41:21but I couldn't possibly do that now.
41:23I'm leading Conservative, yeah,
41:26because I think things are getting better.
41:29Things are getting better. Inflation is back down.
41:32Conservative.
41:33Conservative.
41:34Conservative.
41:35Obviously, Roger Gale has been the MP here for quite some time.
41:38Yeah, cos I like Roger Gale.
41:40I think he's done a lot of good,
41:42and I don't want Labour getting too many seats.
41:46With such a big constituency encompassing so many different views,
41:50it remains unclear which direction the seat could go come polling day.
41:54Oliver leaves the sacks for KMTV in Herne Bay and Sandwich.
41:58And for a full list of candidates in all of Kent's seats,
42:02just go to Kent Online.
42:04Here in Herne Bay and Sandwich,
42:06it's Thea Barrett for the Green Party,
42:08Angie Cohen for the Liberal Democrats,
42:11Roger Gale for the Conservative and Unionist Party,
42:14Amelia Randall for Reform UK,
42:16and Helen Whitehead for the Labour Party.