The event builds off of Variety’s existing “Doc Dreams” franchise, a video series highlighting the filmmakers behind the year’s leading documentaries. Previous “Doc Dreams” participants include the filmmakers behind “Free Solo,” “Fire of Love,” “The Vow,” “The Rescue,” “Being Mary Tyler Moore” and many more.
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PeopleTranscript
00:00All right, well, thank you all for joining us today.
00:15I wanted to start with, you know, each of these films tells a story of defiance and
00:20perseverance.
00:21And they're also all call-to-action films that I encourage everybody to see.
00:27But I wanted to start by asking each director about the origins of each film.
00:32They have interesting origin stories.
00:35So I would like to start with Mary.
00:37I mean, how did Bad River come about?
00:39And it seems like it was a long time coming.
00:44So there's the short answer and the long answer.
00:46I'll try and make the long answer really brief.
00:49When I did my very first movie about 20 years ago, I got a call from a coach who was Navajo,
00:56from the Navajo Reservation, to the city, Arizona.
00:59And he said, I've just seen your film.
01:01It was called A Hero for Daisy.
01:03I love it.
01:04I've got an amazing basketball team here on the Navajo Reservation, all teen girls.
01:10They are the best players in the country.
01:12I cannot get them recruited to Division I schools.
01:17What can you do?
01:18I had made one movie at that point and did not find the funding quickly.
01:25However, his words rattled in my head for years.
01:29So my partner on Bad River, Grant Hill, who owns the Atlanta Hawks, NBA great, we came
01:36out with a film, A Most Beautiful Thing, which was right after the murder of George Floyd.
01:41The film got a lot of attention.
01:43There was extraordinary activity.
01:45And I said to Grant, I think now is the time.
01:48There may be an interesting opportunity to amplify a Native story.
01:53And then I had a wild chance encounter with the chairman of the Bad River Band.
01:59And we began a series of conversations.
02:01And he said, this was while COVID was full on, by Zoom.
02:06And he said, why don't you come to the reservation and we'll do some canoe diplomacy.
02:11And I was like, I used to row, I was a rower.
02:14And I was like, I don't know what canoe diplomacy is, but I'm totally up for it.
02:20And thus began a journey that was life-changing in many ways.
02:23I just want to, I forgot to do this.
02:25I want to just, for those of you who did not see Bad River, it chronicles the Wisconsin-based
02:29Bad River Band's ongoing fight to protect Lake Superior.
02:34The film details the threat that Bad River Reservation faces due to a 70-year-old pipeline
02:39that is an imminent risk of rupture, which runs through its land.
02:44And we're going to move on to Hassan, who directed Madea.
02:48And I'm just going to say that Madea is about a Yazidi teenager who is here, Madea, living
02:54in North Iraq, who survived being sold to ISIS and remains desperate to reunite with
03:03other members of her family, her mother and father, who were abducted by the terror group.
03:08So Hassan, what I read was that you met Madea in 2019, after she had returned from ISIS
03:16captivity.
03:17She was 13 years old.
03:19And after meeting her, you just, from what I read, is that you knew that she had to tell
03:24her own story and you gave her a camera and you told her how to film.
03:30Can you talk about what that discovery was like that you thought, I'm not going to be
03:35the one filming that she needs to be?
03:37What would happen?
03:38Yeah, I had been playing or sort of interested in the power dynamics between director and
03:46participant.
03:47I found and find it to be heavily, you know, in the hand of a filmmaker.
03:53So I, you know, I had various ideas of how I could experiment with re-leveling that.
03:59And I thought, if I just, you know, kids and teenagers, Madea was 13, 14 at the time, they're
04:06very intuitive.
04:07It's not just intuitive with the technology, but intuitive with storytelling.
04:11You know, it's TikTok.
04:12It's Instagram.
04:13Yeah, as you said, when I went over, I'm not Yazidi, I'm not from the region.
04:19And so I thought, you know, a way into this community, into this story, it had to be,
04:26you know, it had to end up with Madea telling her own story and her people's story.
04:31So we thought maybe it would be creative vignette, it would end up as creative vignettes or some
04:36kind of online extra material.
04:39So when we got that first batch of material back, we were blown away, not just by how
04:44quickly Madea and her brothers took to cinematography, but sort of the depth of what they had to
04:51say.
04:52It really, you know, from probably week number three, they had and she had really grabbed
04:56the reins of this film.
04:58Well, Madea, today is Madea's what, one year, you've been in New York for one year today,
05:04is that right?
05:05Yes.
05:06Which is amazing.
05:07Yeah.
05:08When Hassan asked you to take a camera and film yourself and talk about your feelings,
05:17about what happened to you, was there any hesitation or were you nervous to do that?
05:24You know, because you were talking about very personal, horrible things that have happened
05:30to you.
05:31So how did you feel?
05:33My feelings was great.
05:35And then before, I was want to be an actor.
05:43And then when Hassan gave me camera, I was feel shy a little bit.
05:50But when it's take like one, two weeks, and then I start film, like, it's called asthma.
06:01And yeah, the camera, it's a little camera, it's very, like, small.
06:10And like, before, I was don't have friends, and I trust friends, and then therapy.
06:21I was make a video and then camera helped me to, like, speak my story and then my people
06:29story.
06:30Because I was want to make something for my people, like, to show people, like, what happened
06:41to my people, like, Yezidi genocide, because Yezidi, like, genocide is still going like
06:4710 years, yeah.
06:49That's why I make a movie and then I was don't know it's gonna be like this, like, it's gonna
06:57be big movie.
06:59I was think it's gonna be short in YouTube, like something like this.
07:06But now I see in traveling the world, it's made me so surprised.
07:12Yeah.
07:13I'm so happy.
07:16I'm so happy that it is being seen all over the world.
07:20Sara Mani, the director of Bread and Roses, and Malala Yousafzai, yes, is the producer
07:27of Bread and Roses, which charts the seismic impact that the fall of Kabul to the Taliban
07:34in 2021 had on women's rights and livelihoods.
07:38The documentary film follows three very brave women in real time, as they fight to recover
07:43their autonomy.
07:45Sara, I wanted to ask you about my question.
07:49One of the most striking things about the documentary is that you give viewers the first
07:54hand, a first hand window into the lives of these women as it's happening, as their rights
07:59are being taken away from them.
08:02I'm wondering if you were there, because there's also a main cameraman.
08:07Was that you?
08:08Or were you in the country?
08:09Or was that someone else?
08:11And how did you find that person?
08:14When Taliban took over Afghanistan, I was not there.
08:20Just three days ago, I went to Europe to attend a film festival.
08:26So I locked the door and I took some clothes and left.
08:32But when I arrived, I understand that I'm not able to go back anymore.
08:37So when these things happened, I was thinking, what can I do as a filmmaker?
08:45So then I find out that it's best to go and find a charity and start working for charity.
08:53Because I knew there were so many women, they were only breadwinner of their family.
09:01And they lost their job and they have to feed their children.
09:05Plus they are going to the street and doing administration against Taliban to take back
09:13their rights and all the rights they have.
09:19And they are not able to go out to get a job, education, everything.
09:24They lost everything.
09:26So through this charity, we managed to support these women for some time with food, very
09:38important needs.
09:42So then they start sending me videos about their daily life, and then how they are going
09:49outside, doing administration.
09:53And I start collecting these videos as a part of historical movement of women in Afghanistan.
10:02And then after some time, suddenly I receive an email from Jennifer Lawrence Production
10:08that if you want to make a film, we are happy to support you.
10:14So first I thought it's a spam, I just deleted it.
10:20And then this email come back again after one week.
10:26This time I searched to see if Excelling Cadaver exists, but oh, it's true.
10:35So yes, that's why when she expressed her willingness, I already had some archive.
10:43We built a team and we trained several protagonists.
10:47And then I switched off working for charity back to filmmaking.
10:55And then we trained protagonists, we had cameraman, camerawoman, and then the process of making
11:04Bread and Roses started.
11:06Well, Malala, I wondered when you joined this film, and also having faced the Taliban in
11:14your native Pakistan, you understand better than most the situation that these women were
11:20in.
11:21I'm wondering if you conversed with them at all before the film came out about, I'm wondering
11:29if you've talked to them about the risk involved or made them feel better about putting themselves
11:36on camera.
11:42The reality that Afghan women face is horrifying and heartbreaking.
11:48Because Afghanistan is the only country in the world where girls are banned from accessing
11:52secondary education or going to universities, and women are prohibited from work.
11:57And the Taliban have issued more than 100 decrees and edicts limiting women systematically.
12:03Afghan women activists and other human rights experts, including many from South Africa,
12:08have been calling it a gender apartheid.
12:10While I have been busy in this whole activism to bring attention to the stories of Afghan
12:16women, I came across an early version of this documentary Bread and Roses.
12:22And when I saw the stories of these incredible three Afghan women, I immediately said yes
12:27to Jennifer and Sahra, because while I was doing all the work to bring attention to the
12:33fact that Afghan women are erased from public life and they are locked from accessing any
12:41opportunity, we need to use this opportunity through this documentary to actually bring
12:46the voices of Afghan women to the global stage, to give as much attention to it as we can.
12:53And what these women are doing is a form of resistance, is a form of resilience, and it
13:00is their way of the fight.
13:01So that's why I immediately became a part of it, and I think we can all share our solidarity
13:06with them by spreading their word and sharing their story with as many people as we can.
13:12And I think it will help us build huge momentum in supporting the activism that Afghan women
13:20and girls are doing.
13:21You will be surprised to know how Afghan women are usually excluded from the conversations
13:25that are happening at the international level about their own future.
13:31Their rights are not on the agenda, or they're not in those rooms where people from other
13:36countries are deciding with the Taliban what the future of the country should look like.
13:40And we know that there is no future for Afghanistan if women and girls are excluded.
13:44They make up 20 million of the population, and these three women risk their lives on
13:50behalf of those 20 million women and girls.
13:54They're incredibly brave, and we need to come forward to share our solidarity with them.
14:06Mary, and Bad River, you know, it's a David and Goliath story, but what I really appreciated
14:11is that you interviewed Goliath.
14:14You got the other side.
14:16Oh, we did.
14:18You interviewed Endridge, which, can you explain, they're a company that has the pipeline, right?
14:25Right.
14:26This is a story of a small tribal community in northern Wisconsin that is battling a 71-year-old
14:33pipeline that cuts straight through the heart of the reservation.
14:37The pipeline now, according to a lower court judge, is at imminent risk of rupture, which,
14:43if that happens within hours, will be in Lake Superior.
14:47And as the chairman of the Bad River Band said, Lake Superior is our freshwater stronghold.
14:53What we're doing, fighting so hard to protect this resource, is for all Americans, especially
15:00with extreme weather, and this is our patriotic duty.
15:05We are patriots to this country.
15:07And I remember thinking, wow, all right, let's talk to the other side.
15:13And adding insult to injury, the pipeline operator has been operating, notwithstanding
15:19the fact that three miles of the pipeline corridor, their rights expired 10 years ago.
15:25And they're just pumping away.
15:27So I called the pipeline operator.
15:31It's a Canadian pipeline operator, fully really expecting that the interview would be declined.
15:37But I thought it was really important to extend the interview.
15:41We're not creating propaganda.
15:43We're really delving into difficult, challenging legal issues.
15:50And so I asked for an interview, and they said, well, when is the film coming out?
15:55And I said, well, we're going to wait for the lower court to issue a decision.
15:58They said, normally, when something's in litigation, we will not ever comment, but we will comment.
16:07And this was really interesting, because I had done another film about Backpage.com,
16:13and it was a huge sort of joggernaut of a project.
16:16And that company did not accept a request for interview.
16:20And here we are, how many years later, and the company went out of business and was shut down.
16:26So they may have taken a look at some of my prior work and said, maybe it's a better idea
16:31to own our narrative.
16:34And I think they said to me, well, can we see the questions in advance?
16:39And I said, no.
16:41For the same reason, I will not give questions to anybody that I interview in advance,
16:49including members of the Bad River Band.
16:52And that was a really interesting, I thought they were going to decline.
16:56And ultimately, they didn't.
16:58And I very much appreciate that they didn't.
17:02However, their perspective in terms of safeguarding the profitability of this line is on full
17:11display, I think, in this film.
17:14And it shows the clash of cultures between one that is driven by quarterly earnings and profitability.
17:26And we have a community who is a disenfranchised community.
17:31And they have turned down $80 million to settle this case to protect everyone in this room,
17:38all Americans, for the longer-term goal that we all have fresh water.
17:43Amazing.
17:44I wanted to talk about this idea of agency and the balance of power between filmmaker
17:53and participants.
17:55It's been a conversation that's been happening in the doc community for several years now.
17:59There's actually a documentary about it called Subject.
18:03Sara and Hassan, the decision to give a camera to your subjects made them filmmakers in your film.
18:10But how did that work in the edit?
18:14Did your participant see cuts?
18:17Were they a filmmaker, essentially, in the entire film?
18:22Or were they DPs?
18:25How did you look at them, I'm wondering?
18:31When they went to Kabul street and do demonstration, they didn't do for our film.
18:40They did.
18:41But also, they managed to filming themselves.
18:45But the good thing is that we had a cameraman and camerawoman to support, because the situation
18:51was look like they were not able always to filming themselves.
18:56Because of stigma in Afghanistan, it's not easy to send a cameraman or even camerawoman
19:02inside the family.
19:05There are always male members that making decision for women that whenever she has right
19:13to share family story outside or not.
19:18That's why they decide to filming inside the house themselves.
19:23I think it was very helpful for us to tell their story with authenticity and, of course, respect.
19:32We have intimate access to their life, how they manage all this demonstration, but also
19:40they support each other whenever they arrested or they have any issues with the Taliban and
19:48with their families.
19:50The magic is once Taliban were beating our cameraman, broke his camera and take him to
20:00go to their police station.
20:03But these women stop Taliban, save the cameraman.
20:11In editing room, I think all filmmaker have difficult time in editing room.
20:19But also wonderful time too, because when the problems are out, it's unbelievable joys
20:27coming and you're relieved.
20:32I think because I know what I want, things goes well.
20:40Only difference was we had five protagonists and then we have to reduce it to three.
20:47So it was very difficult choice, but we have to make it.
20:51Hassan?
20:52Yeah, I mean, when we started, of course, we wanted to, the dream was to instill some
21:02sense of agency, give it back to Madiha.
21:05We couldn't have dreamed what it would become.
21:07But yes, she was involved in, as she said, documentary film was not even in her vocabulary.
21:15So we broke it down from day one, here's our plan, we're going to be, we gave her the
21:21promise of time, her and her family, that this is not going to be three weeks.
21:24This ended up being four and a half years.
21:28And we explained sort of the whole process as much as we knew it, festivals, distribution,
21:35where we saw this ending up.
21:37And we gave them very clear expectations.
21:38I think that was really important that we weren't going to make promises of, of course,
21:44now she's here in New York as a Brooklyn girl, as she says, we didn't, you know, that wasn't
21:49the promise.
21:52And then yes, she was, we would show her scenes that were potentially, you know, there's a
21:56scene where she talks about how her family doesn't believe her, that she's struggling
22:00with her mental health.
22:02We'd show her scenes.
22:04We always reviewed footage together.
22:06And then yes, all the participants were shown the final cut afterwards, and especially Madiha.
22:12And we actually, you know, we had numerous workshops about intentional filmmaking and
22:17consent and, and sort of how we were going to go about this, this true collaboration.
22:23And at the end, she just said, why do you keep asking me if I want to tell my story?
22:27And so we sort of followed that lead and, and, you know, she's in the edit, she, she
22:33really, she drove the narrative, not from an editor's perspective, but whatever she
22:38wanted to talk about in the film is sort of what we included.
22:41So you'll find there's, there's no politics, not because, you know, we didn't want to,
22:46we didn't want to talk politics or the Kurdish Iraq issue or the Kurdish Turkish issue, it's
22:50just that, that was not on Madiha's mind at the time.
22:54And we find it's made, it's made it quite palatable for different sects and different
22:59branches and different governments to, you know, screen this film and then just see it
23:03as what it is.
23:04It's a coming of age story in the, in the hills of Iraq, and it's not a big political
23:08piece yet.
23:09We're screening in consulates around the world and the Yazidi issue 10 years on is sort of
23:13being brought back to the spotlight.
23:16Can I add something?
23:17I just remember in, in my case was because I was not able to go back to Afghanistan as
23:26a filmmaker, and I have to do everything from a border of Afghanistan.
23:33I stayed in one country in the border.
23:36So we have to deal with logistical issues, like how to transfer all the material from
23:43these women from their phone and teach them how to delete if, if they are arrested.
23:50But also dealing with a team that they were living in difficult situation.
23:59But also we had a team living in different Zoom time, like US, Europe, Afghanistan, Iran,
24:07Pakistan.
24:08And we, when we want to talk to all the team, it was really difficult.
24:14But they are all was not really a matter.
24:18The most important and challenging was we were dealing with the deep human story of
24:25this woman, a story of loss, resilience, and hope.
24:30And it was really challenging for us to, to cope with this emotionally with their stories.
24:38I mean, it's hard to watch too, but Malala and Medea, I mean, in participating in your
24:45respective films, I mean, is the idea that something it will have impact around the world?
24:52Was that why you chose to, like Medea, do be a participant in your film and then Malala
24:58produce Red and Roses?
24:59I mean, do you think that their documentaries can make an impact and really change things?
25:05100%.
25:08I think this documentary helps us give a voice to Afghan women, give a stage to Afghan women
25:16while they are facing a reality where the Taliban are trying to silence them, erase
25:22them and basically limit them to the four walls of their houses.
25:28So I do believe that this documentary is a form of resistance for them.
25:32And the more we can share their story, it will give hope to Afghan women and to further
25:37add to the activism that is happening more at the global stage.
25:41And I think it's, you know, when I look at my own activism and the activism that other
25:45incredible young women and girls are leading, including Medea, it is, you know, it's our
25:50stories that we hope will help people make sense of all the horrible things that are
25:55happening, that we should question, we should challenge and we should change.
26:01Medea, do you want to say anything?
26:03Oh, yes, of course.
26:07So I hope so.
26:09My movie, like when I was filming myself, my people would say, Medea, why are you doing
26:21this? You girl, you don't push to doing movie stuff and then doing video stuff.
26:29And then they was don't let me.
26:32I ride my bike and then swimming like classes and then a lot of stuff.
26:41And now when my movies like do well and it's shown around the world and then now I saw
26:49in my Instagram, people send me message.
26:53How do you make this movie?
26:55How? Yeah.
26:57How we want to make movie too.
27:00The girls told me, I told her, like one of my friends, like my child friend, I told her,
27:10but you before you told me movies gonna not show the world and it's not gonna be well.
27:19And now you told me, how did you make movie?
27:23Um, so, yeah, I hope so.
27:28Like everybody see my movie and I'm not just because of Medea's story, because of my
27:34people's story about my people, about my like genocide happened to my people, because
27:42almost the genocide is going like now at this day to because I don't know, like
27:51uh, 3000, I think.
27:55Yeah, up to 3000 Yazidi captivity or otherwise missing.
27:59Yeah, yeah.
28:00They're still missing.
28:02Like, especially like, like my mother, my father is still there in ISIS.
28:08I don't know where is they now.
28:11And a lot of people like my cousins.
28:15Uh, yeah, I wanna like, uh, people support my movie and I'm not just my movie because
28:23not it's not my movie.
28:25It's not my story.
28:26It's my people's story.
28:28It's a Yazidi story.
28:31Yeah.
28:32And then I, I wanna like inspire other girls to not just because Yazidi girl we have in
28:41Gaza, Lebanon, Ukraine, girls, we have like around world, like from Afghanistan to now.
28:54Maybe they are a bad situation.
28:57The girls, like I always say, girl power.
29:01And then I, I wanna be a lawyer.
29:07Uh, that's why I wanna be like, inspire other girls to help them.
29:13Yeah.
29:18Um, I wanted to switch gears a little bit and talk about, um, like ethical standards
29:25and documentary filmmaking with all three directors.
29:27Um, you know, unlike journalists, there's no widely accepted standards, um, for documentary
29:32filmmakers.
29:33Um, you are expected to buy, abide by, but the discussion of, you know, there's nothing
29:39that you have to abide by, but the discussion around moral responsibility, um, for nonfiction
29:44filmmakers towards their subject heated up the summer after a Washington post piece came
29:48out, um, about the, um, Matthew Heineman's 2022 documentary retrograde where an Afghan
29:56man allegedly was murdered by the Taliban as a consequence of being a participant in
30:00the film.
30:01Um, what, how do you approach each director on the panel?
30:05How do you approach, um, your filmmaking when you, when you're doing, when you're making
30:11a film about such a sensitive topic where people's lives are on the line?
30:18Um, I am from Afghanistan.
30:24I grew up in Afghan family and I understand stigma and I understand how much we can go
30:32forward with the sensitive issues.
30:35I always, um, in my past films or short or documentary feature film, I, um, focus on
30:44social issues, especially sensitive taboo, like insist.
30:49I made a film about insist and I, um, I mean, every, every local filmmaker, um, are important
31:00for their own societies because they know their society and they know how, uh, how much
31:09they can, uh, take risk.
31:13And nobody, nobody else can tell the story that local filmmaker can tell.
31:21I mean, it's good that we are able to travel everywhere and make a film, but about, um,
31:27sensitive issues is we have to be, be careful because in Afghanistan, telling a women's
31:34story can, um, cost a life for, for that woman.
31:40Um, I, I, I, like I live with this and I grown up with this and I, I understand how much
31:47I should do risk and how far I can go.
31:52So sometimes, unfortunately, it's, um, it's difficult to, for international filmmakers
32:00to go to other countries when it's in the conflict and the touch sensitive issues.
32:06So we have to be careful, of course, and we have to put the priority in our priority,
32:12the security of our protagonists.
32:15But also at the same time, we have to talk about what's happening in our society because
32:21the silence is exactly what the terrorist wants.
32:25If we keep silence because we are scared of them.
32:28So that's, that's, we are following their role.
32:31We don't follow the role of terrorist.
32:34We are speaking up.
32:35We are sharing our story.
32:37But at the same time, we have to put their security in our priority.
32:45Yeah, just to echo, of course, it's, we're Medina brothers and her community.
32:50The, this is an off traumatized community.
32:53This is, this was their 74th genocide.
32:57So when we arrived, the first thing, and just to repeat is we promised them time that this
33:02was not just, we're going, we're not going to come in, film for a few weeks about the
33:06sexual slavery and all the lurid details.
33:09It was going to be time and we were going to work with the community and within the
33:11community.
33:12And then on top of, of course, Medina and participants seeing the edits, commenting
33:19on whether they wanted to be blurred, whether they thought this word should be removed.
33:24We, you know, we brought everything back to the community.
33:28If they were uncomfortable with it, even in a little bit, you know, in any fashion,
33:32we would remove it.
33:34Medina had, you know, in one of the scenes, she's able to identify one of her perpetrators.
33:41And, you know, we went back and forth.
33:43Are we going to blur this ISIS fighter?
33:45Of course, it's propaganda that they all put online.
33:49And we just, we didn't, you know, we didn't land anywhere.
33:51And then we brought it to Medina and she said, you know, you're not going to blur him because,
33:55you know, there's a chance this is a form of justice for me.
33:58So there's a chance he could be seen or someone in a village in the middle of nowhere could
34:03recognize him.
34:04So we just let Medina and the community lead.
34:08And of course, we built the film.
34:09And the Nadia Murad Code of Ethics is a great place to start.
34:13And that's where we started.
34:15Nadia Murad Ziazidi, a Nobel Prize winner.
34:17But, you know, it goes so much further than intentional filmmaking and do no harm.
34:23It really, you know, we believe it needed to.
34:26And hopefully we succeeded.
34:28You know, everything needed to be led by the Yazidi community and those movie was about.
34:34So our project is a little bit different with respect to the risks.
34:39Certainly, members of the Bad River Elders spoke amazingly to cultural genocide,
34:46true genocide over the history.
34:48But they could speak freely in a way that perhaps was much more dangerous for the other
34:54two directors.
34:56That being said, from a journalistic ethics standpoint, I used to be a lawyer, highly
35:01irritating to all those around me.
35:04But I think it's really important and how we operate is journalistically rigorous as if
35:11we're reporting for The New York Times.
35:13And I think that's really important for a number of different reasons.
35:18We did a sex trafficking project that had was called I Am Jane Doe.
35:22It had wild impact.
35:24And we worked with sex trafficking, trafficking survivors.
35:27And so I did not show these young people the film could have been triggering.
35:34But we did offer mental health professionals sort of like right there on the spot.
35:40And we and same thing with this particular project.
35:44There were a lot of people that had great trauma that they speak to in Bad River, but
35:50also like these other films, great resilience and courage, which was so exciting to hear.
35:56But we similarly offered up that opportunity to have mental health professionals.
36:01I thought that was part of our responsibility.
36:04And then conversely, how we operate is we do not show rough cuts to our participants
36:12ever, just like a New York Times reporter will never show the piece.
36:17However, I to this day with participants in my movies, they come to Boston, they say,
36:25hey, can we stay for a night?
36:26And they stay for a year if they're going to school.
36:28Like it's I think it's all about and I'm sure you would agree.
36:33It's all about developing trust with the people that you are working with.
36:37And that is sort of crucial and foremost.
36:42And the other thing we do on the back end is we share for all of our social impact projects,
36:48we share 50 cents on every dollar of profit back into the community.
36:52Very few people do that.
36:54What does that mean?
36:55It means I'm in a community as a blue-eyed non-native or wherever community I'm going
37:03into and there's a sense that I'm not just showing up.
37:08Grab the story and leave.
37:10Which you've probably read many, many accounts of complaints in the wake of certain documentaries
37:16where people show up, take the story and leave.
37:19And that's just simply not how I operate.
37:22And I just what I say to participants is please, I want you to feel comfortable.
37:29If you don't like what you said, it will be off the record while we're filming.
37:35Anything you say, you can rephrase.
37:40We as a general principle will not use malicious comments.
37:44People say things by mistake.
37:46We don't put that in the film.
37:48We're very, very careful about the long-term effects that film is forever.
37:55And comments may be just in the moment and be very, very hurtful.
38:00And so we're sort of overly cautious when we go into the edit room about that.
38:04So as a consequence, I think we have built extraordinary relationships in the communities
38:10with which we've worked.
38:12And it's a privilege.
38:13And it's an honor.
38:15And I think that's how we approach sort of both that journalistic piece, but also the
38:21trust that we hope to achieve when we go into these communities.
38:28One of my last questions is going to be about distribution, which I write about all the
38:33time.
38:34Social issue films are having a very difficult time finding distribution in the current marketplace.
38:43And but, you know, Bread and Roses is Apple TV.
38:47I believe Bad River is Peacock.
38:50Yes, and Xfinity, Black Experience Channel.
38:53And we opened with AMC Theatres in multiplexes across the country earlier this year, which
38:59is pretty shocking and stunning.
39:01Wow.
39:02And then, Medea, I'm not sure what is going on with distribution.
39:05Can you talk about it?
39:06And after you do that, I just want to talk about the celebrity endorsements involved
39:11with each of these films, because I wonder if that helped sell like Bread and Roses after
39:16your Cannes premiere or, you know, helped like Edward Norton was involved with your
39:21film.
39:22But let me just start with you.
39:24What is the current distribution status with Medea?
39:27Yeah, so we're with Together Films, who's here somewhere.
39:31They've done an amazing, amazing job.
39:34We don't have distribution right now, but we have.
39:36So we just returned from London late last night where we had a BAFTA screening and we
39:41opened seven cinemas there.
39:43So we are in numerous cities theatrically.
39:47Yeah, it's we started out as well.
39:50We're still a tiny indie doc team, but we were like four people in Iraq.
39:54And often it was just me and Medea and her family in Iraq, self-funded and then private
40:00donations, very limited institutional support.
40:04Together came on after our Copenhagen international premiere and sort of took the reins.
40:11And, you know, they've done an amazing job, but it's it's it's difficult.
40:17It's really difficult.
40:19And just to segue into the celebrity EP.
40:23So Emma Thompson is our executive producer.
40:25And that was just randomly I had made.
40:28I was an English teacher at the time and I had made a refugee video that went viral.
40:32And she DM, she wrote me an email and it just ended with all the power to your elbow.
40:38And it was just one sentence.
40:39And then we became friends somehow and she would watch Cuts.
40:44She was not officially attached at all.
40:45She watched Cuts.
40:47Her and Medea have built an amazing friendship.
40:51And I met her for the first time five years later.
40:53And my my girlfriend at the time was saying, you know, how do you know she's not a catfish?
40:57Like this could be any Emma Thompson.
40:59I said, well, it's a very thoughtful catfish who's giving me wonderful intros to CAA and
41:08is giving notes on Cuts.
41:12And we were we were laughing about this two nights ago.
41:15Very clever question by your girlfriend back then.
41:17Yes, yes, I know.
41:20She's been incredible.
41:22What I thought would be name only.
41:24And just it was we just caught lightning in a bottle to have us.
41:27It's turned into, you know, she wrote so many letters to film festivals,
41:34possible distribution outlets.
41:36And now she, you know, she hosted the Baptist screening last week.
41:40It's, you know, we're very, very lucky to have her.
41:44But and I don't think we're sitting here today without her attached, which is unfortunate.
41:50Yeah, well, yeah, but that's the climate we're in.
41:53I mean, and then you have Jennifer Lawrence, obviously in Malala.
41:57Who else?
41:58There's a lot of people in your celebrity visor.
42:01Am I wrong about that?
42:02No, just two wonderful people.
42:04OK, does that do you feel like that helped in terms of selling to Apple?
42:14I don't have any answer for this question, probably.
42:18Yes, because yes, because it's it's wonderful that these two women, Malala and Jennifer,
42:29they generously share their platform with women and Afghan women of Afghanistan.
42:35And they trust me to direct this film.
42:39And I think it was very helpful to raise this their voice.
42:46But then but we had, you know, like it takes some times for us
42:53because of the security of our protagonists to to take all of them out of Afghanistan,
42:59including their family, and then also blur some faces to then to release the film,
43:07because it was important for us to make sure that everyone is safe and secure in the film.
43:17So we actually caught some amazing wind when we're opening in 15.
43:23We started with 15 cities and Jason Momoa posted our trailer organically.
43:30He saw it on Quanah Chasing Horses feed.
43:33No, he didn't.
43:34A group in Wisconsin, a student group reached out to him and said,
43:37look, we're trying to protect Lake Superior.
43:39We post this amazing trailer.
43:42And all of a sudden we see it up on Jason Momoa's feed.
43:44And of course, shit hits the fan like everybody's going crazy.
43:48Then, of course, Edward Norton, who is co-narrates posted, then Mark Ruffalo posted.
43:54And then the really amazing thing is Leonardo DiCaprio posted the trailer.
44:00And we opened in 15 cities.
44:02And I get a call that first weekend from AMC.
44:05And they said, congratulations.
44:07And I said, huh?
44:08And they said, not only are we extending you, but we're expanding the footprint.
44:13And we expanded up to the maximum we could under our E&O policy.
44:18We were not going to let go of that E&O policy for several reasons.
44:23And the film lasted in theaters for nearly two months,
44:27which is, think about that for a documentary.
44:30And that, I think, was the power of some of that active social media.
44:37And then on the back end, with respect to Xfinity and the Comcast team,
44:42this is our second project with that team.
44:47And I feel like some of this is also relationship building.
44:50And yes, it's true.
44:52Different platforms are going to true crime or sports or others.
44:56And the people at Comcast are just sort of extraordinary and have become good friends.
45:02And there's somebody here today, Carolyn Kim from Comcast.
45:07So we feel very lucky that on the back end,
45:12we were able to say to Peacock, let's have this conversation.
45:16But it's also very challenging when you're not a big studio film.
45:22And for example, I'm laughing because somebody sent me today,
45:28the New Yorker has a crossword puzzle.
45:30And 41 down is, what is the name of the 2024 documentary
45:35about Blank River's fight for sovereignty?
45:39And I was like, all right, how did that happen?
45:42That we're an answer in the crossword puzzle, right?
45:46And so you see how you seep into the cultural conversation.
45:50We were nominated for three Critic Choice Awards,
45:53despite not mounting any kind of significant campaign.
45:56And sometimes, you know, you just put one foot in front of the other.
45:59And sometimes you get lucky and good things happen.
46:02Yeah, it's a lot of work.
46:03But yes, I want to thank all of our panelists.
46:07I especially want to thank Medea and Malala.
46:10The courage that you show all women around the world is amazing.
46:13So thank you.