Sohla El-Waylly went from dreaming of Michelin Stars to being a YouTube Star.
The New York-based food creator never set out to be an internet personality. Her original dream was to become a Michelin-starred chef, working in high-end restaurants. But after a failed attempt at opening a restaurant with her husband in Brooklyn, Sohla found herself unexpectedly pivoting to food media.
"It was accidental," Sohla told Shawn Walchef (@calibbqmedia), host of Restaurant Influencers. "I didn't know anything about media like I didn't know what the New York Times was or Bon Appetit or any of this stuff. So none of it intimidated me.”
Sohla started out writing recipes and articles for Serious Eats, where she was able to experiment and find her voice without much pressure.
"It was kind of good because I got to figure a lot out while nobody was paying attention," she said. "Because nobody read anything I wrote for years."
Her unique perspective as a self-taught chef, rather than a traditionally trained food writer, eventually led to opportunities at higher-profile outlets like Bon Appetit, the History network, and the New York Times. Now millions have watched her cooking online and on other big stages like The Big Bunch on MAX.
Watch now to learn about about making meals for the internet, secrets of YouTube success, and her personal tech stack.
The New York-based food creator never set out to be an internet personality. Her original dream was to become a Michelin-starred chef, working in high-end restaurants. But after a failed attempt at opening a restaurant with her husband in Brooklyn, Sohla found herself unexpectedly pivoting to food media.
"It was accidental," Sohla told Shawn Walchef (@calibbqmedia), host of Restaurant Influencers. "I didn't know anything about media like I didn't know what the New York Times was or Bon Appetit or any of this stuff. So none of it intimidated me.”
Sohla started out writing recipes and articles for Serious Eats, where she was able to experiment and find her voice without much pressure.
"It was kind of good because I got to figure a lot out while nobody was paying attention," she said. "Because nobody read anything I wrote for years."
Her unique perspective as a self-taught chef, rather than a traditionally trained food writer, eventually led to opportunities at higher-profile outlets like Bon Appetit, the History network, and the New York Times. Now millions have watched her cooking online and on other big stages like The Big Bunch on MAX.
Watch now to learn about about making meals for the internet, secrets of YouTube success, and her personal tech stack.
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NewsTranscript
00:00Like with the New York Times, it's like a crew of six
00:04with like three cameras and an audio person.
00:08And then something like History Channel,
00:09it's like a crew of 50 and then Ancient Recipes goes up.
00:1150 people.
00:14Wow. Yeah.
00:20Welcome to Restaurant Influencers
00:21presented by Entrepreneur.
00:23I am your host, Sean Walchef.
00:25This is a Cali BBQ Media production
00:28in life, in the restaurant business
00:31and in the new creator economy.
00:33We learn through lessons and stories.
00:35We are so grateful to Toast,
00:37our primary technology partner at our barbecue restaurants
00:40for believing in this crazy idea,
00:42this storytelling idea to launch a show with entrepreneurs
00:45so that we could talk to the best storytellers on earth.
00:48And today we have a very special treat for our audience.
00:52If you're new, welcome to the show.
00:54If you have been a long time listener, thank you.
00:56We are grateful. We appreciate it.
00:59We keep getting the opportunity to do really cool things
01:01and tell really cool stories.
01:02So today we have Sola L. Whaley
01:07and she is a New York Times bestselling author.
01:09She is a James Beard Foundation winner.
01:12You can find her on Big Brunch.
01:14You can find her on Mystery Menu at New York Times Cooking.
01:17You can also find her on History Channel, Ancient Recipes.
01:20She has 589 followers on Instagram.
01:25She is very active storyteller on that platform.
01:28200,000 followers on TikTok.
01:30She also has an awesome newsletter on Substack,
01:3258,000 subscribers.
01:35She is a master at what she does best
01:38and we're so excited to have you on the show.
01:40Welcome.
01:41Hello, thanks for having me.
01:43Where in the world is your favorite stadium, stage or venue?
01:50For like watching stuff?
01:51For anything, for performing, watching stuff,
01:54going out, anywhere in the world?
01:58Huh?
02:02I don't know, Madison Square,
02:04no, I hate Madison Square Garden.
02:05I take that back.
02:06It can be small, it doesn't have to be big.
02:09Comedy cellar.
02:10The comedy cellar?
02:11Yeah.
02:12Sweet, awesome.
02:13Let's go to the comedy cellar.
02:15Okay, sounds good.
02:16How many people fit in the comedy cellar?
02:18I don't know, like-
02:19Couple hundred?
02:2070?
02:2170, even better, 50.
02:22It's small.
02:23Perfect, that's my kind of audience.
02:25It's definitely like a fire hazard.
02:28It's a basement.
02:29I haven't.
02:30Yeah, it's a basement
02:31and they definitely put an illegal number
02:33of people in there, even during COVID.
02:38Well, let's go to the basement.
02:41Let's invite some VIP guests,
02:43the people that listen to the show.
02:45We like to say the people that play the game
02:46within the game.
02:48Hospitality is hard.
02:50Restaurants are hard.
02:52The work that we do is hard, but it's very rewarding.
02:55It's something that I wouldn't find myself
02:59as a restaurant owner being able to have conversations
03:01with such accomplished people as you
03:04if it wasn't for the willingness to jump off a cliff.
03:08So we're going to go to the comedy cellar.
03:11I'm going to bring incredible people there.
03:13We're going to talk to entrepreneur.
03:14We're going to talk to Toast
03:16and we're going to give you the mic.
03:18And I'm going to ask you,
03:21how do you tell the story of food?
03:25How do you tell the story of the food
03:28that you've brought to life in your cookbook?
03:30Let's start with your cookbook.
03:31No, let's start with the cookbook.
03:32I mean, I think it really depends on the,
03:37the audience differs with the platform.
03:39Let's go cookbook first, print.
03:43Print, well, cookbook specifically,
03:46you know, since it is longer form
03:48and once people have the book, you have them.
03:52So it's very different from short form media,
03:55digital content, because you can offer more context.
03:58You have more time with the person.
04:01So I can be a lot more in-depth and nerdy.
04:03My book's very, very nerdy.
04:05So it's like, I don't just tell you how to make a thing.
04:08I tell you all the reasons why I'm making all these choices.
04:12So it's like, you can really go on the journey with me
04:14and learn a lot.
04:16Because I feel like when you're creating content
04:18for digital, you have to be really short, really fast,
04:22really like hooky, really trendy.
04:25And that's kind of what's happening
04:26with a lot of restaurants as well now too.
04:29So I feel like when you're comparing it to a restaurant,
04:32I would say a cookbook is more like a tasting menu,
04:35while digital media is more like a la carte.
04:42Because with the tasting menu, people are already there.
04:45You got them.
04:45They paid 30 days in advance.
04:48So you can give them the fun stuff.
04:50You can get more wild.
04:52So I feel like, yeah, when it comes to the cookbook,
04:54I'm just a lot more in-depth, less trendy.
05:01I think it gets more real.
05:04Do you remember dreaming of the cookbook?
05:08I never wanted to go into food media.
05:10It kind of is how things worked out.
05:12It was never the goal.
05:13So I wanted to-
05:15What was the goal?
05:16Oh, I wanted to be like a fancy Michelin star chef.
05:19Yeah, I was all about tasting menus and stuff.
05:24So the first half of my career
05:25was just working in restaurants like that.
05:31I did a lot of fine dining in New York and LA.
05:35And then my husband and I opened a restaurant in Brooklyn,
05:37which at the time, we really thought we were ready for it,
05:41but we definitely were not.
05:46It was really rough.
05:47We didn't have any investors.
05:49We didn't have any partners.
05:51So we were just like back of house people
05:54trying to do it all.
05:56Yeah.
05:57And we did not know what we were doing
05:58when it came to the financials and the front of house
06:02and the guest experience and, oh, reservations,
06:06all of that stuff.
06:07We were trying to figure all that out
06:08when both of us had only been back of house.
06:10So it was really rough, did not go well.
06:13And then after the restaurant closed,
06:15I didn't want to go back into restaurants.
06:18It was just like, I just wasn't ready for it.
06:23And then I kind of ended up in media.
06:26And it was, since it was accidental,
06:30it's been kind of fun
06:32because I haven't had any expectations.
06:36You know what I mean?
06:37Because I spent all of my life dreaming about Michelin stars
06:42and I didn't know anything about media.
06:44Like I didn't know what New York Times was
06:47or Bon Appetit or any of this stuff.
06:49So none of it intimidated me
06:51because I spent my whole childhood
06:52looking up to like Grant Ackett's.
06:54Yeah.
06:55So it's been, there were no dreams, which is kind of better.
06:59I feel like we should not have dreams.
07:00We should just do stuff and see what happens
07:03because dreams just like set you up for failure.
07:09You know what I mean?
07:11I appreciate the candor and I really appreciate you
07:16talking about the failed restaurant.
07:18We have obviously a deep restaurant audience
07:21that can resonate with opening and closing restaurants.
07:25The name of the restaurant was Hail Mary, is that right?
07:28Yeah, it was our Hail Mary Pass, basically.
07:32Yeah, because we tried to get investors,
07:35we couldn't get any.
07:36So we had to, we couldn't open where we wanted to open.
07:40So we got this, the space we got was in Greenpoint
07:43before it got cool.
07:45Like Greenpoint's cool now, it's expensive now,
07:47but when we moved in there, it was not yet.
07:49So the space was really affordable and kind of terrible.
07:55We were next to a bar called Tender Trap, which,
08:00which they don't exist anymore,
08:02but at the time they did a lot of like illicit activities.
08:06They had like late night underground wrestling.
08:10It was not a good, yeah,
08:11it was not a good neighbor, basically.
08:16So they would have like very, very wasted clientele
08:19stumbling into our place, which we were trying to make fancy.
08:23So it was rough, but yeah, we tried to like bootstrap that
08:29with like very little money, like we had an irresponsibly
08:33small amount of money when we opened it up.
08:35So we did everything ourself.
08:38Like we upholstered all the banquets with fabric
08:40we found on the sidewalk.
08:43So none of them matched, which I thought would be
08:46kind of cool, but no, people did not like it.
08:51So yeah, it was really thrown together.
08:54I mean, I'm glad we did it, but I'm realizing now
08:57we needed like 10 X more money.
08:59Yeah, usually that's usually the biggest,
09:02the biggest failure is not having enough capital.
09:06We learned that the hard way.
09:08Thankfully, we figured out ways to keep our restaurants
09:11open over the last 16 years.
09:13But you said you fell into food media by accident.
09:16What was the accident?
09:19After the restaurant closed, my husband immediately
09:22got another job at, did you know Ando?
09:28It was a Momofuku place.
09:29So he started working literally the next day.
09:31We'd had our auction, everything got shipped away
09:35and he went back to work and I wasn't ready.
09:37So I didn't know exactly what I wanted to do.
09:39So I applied to every job, every food related job.
09:44And I heard back from Serious Eats and I was like,
09:49okay, cool, let's try that.
09:52It was just like the first place that called me back.
09:55Yeah.
09:56I applied to be like-
09:56What was the position for?
09:58It was an assistant editor.
10:01So it was kind of scary because I'd never written before.
10:04And they don't function quite like
10:07traditional media companies.
10:09Like other places like New York Times,
10:11there's a pitching process and there's like editors
10:13who help you with your writing
10:16and coming up with your stories.
10:17But with Serious Eats, you just have to make,
10:20you have to write two articles a week.
10:22They're like at least a thousand words with a recipe
10:25and you're kind of just on your own.
10:28You just have to create this content and put it out.
10:32It was pretty scary because I'd never developed recipes
10:34like that for the home cook and I'd hadn't written before.
10:38But it was kind of good because I got to figure a lot out
10:42while nobody was paying attention.
10:44Yeah.
10:45Because nobody read anything I wrote for years.
10:47So it's a good way to start.
10:51Like no one's paying attention to me.
10:53And I guess I kind of work well on my own
10:56because that's kind of how I learned a lot about cooking too.
11:00Because I was a pastry chef for a bit.
11:03And when you're a pastry chef,
11:05nobody really pays attention to what you're doing.
11:09Interesting.
11:10Like I spent years in a basement by myself
11:12just like making bread and like nobody cared.
11:16Yeah.
11:16The owners didn't care.
11:18They were like, oh, you're under budget.
11:20Keep going.
11:21Do not skip this ad.
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11:28at our barbecue restaurants.
11:30And now here I am interviewing Shaquille O'Neal
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11:34We want to hear your Toast story.
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12:02When you think,
12:04let's talk about new media versus traditional media.
12:07You said that people didn't care
12:10and you had the ability to experiment.
12:12You didn't know about writing.
12:14Can you talk about your first traditional media job?
12:17What was the differences?
12:19Oh, like when I went to a place with pitching and stuff?
12:23Yeah, exactly.
12:25Well, I'm glad that I had that time at Siri Seats
12:28to kind of figure out my point of view
12:31without any outside influences.
12:34Cause then my next job was at Bon Appetit
12:37and I had a very different voice from everybody else.
12:42The majority of the people who work there
12:44studied in writing.
12:47It's like mostly Ivy League people.
12:50They've all have like this, a lot of education.
12:53I don't have that background.
12:54So I kind of came out of nowhere
12:57with a totally different perspective,
12:59which I think helped me.
13:02Like I did very well in the pitch meetings
13:04because I was just coming out of left field.
13:08Cause everyone else had this like very traditional
13:11Ivy League higher education.
13:14And I was a cook who just like taught himself how to write.
13:18So I think it was an advantage
13:19cause I was a little bit of an outsider.
13:23When did you first start doing video?
13:28I did video at my first job.
13:31A lot of like hands and pants.
13:33Okay.
13:35Which it's just an overhead camera and you just cook.
13:39It's very strange in the beginning
13:42because I just cooked without anybody watching
13:45in a restaurant.
13:46So when you're cooking for a camera,
13:49you have to do things like awkwardly.
13:52Like you have to have the VitaPrep backwards,
13:57you know, facing the camera
14:00or like the cutting board might be like,
14:02you can't really tell from the video,
14:04but the cutting board might be like a foot away from you
14:07just to make it easier for the camera to see.
14:09But you're reaching over.
14:10A lot of times if you watch a cooking video
14:13and you're like, why are they chopping so weird?
14:15It's probably cause the camera's in like a weird place
14:17and the producer's making them reach and do weird things.
14:20So it is like really awkward.
14:22I've gotten pretty, it's like kind of second nature now.
14:27Like I automatically will tilt the bowl towards the camera
14:31or things in a specific way.
14:33But in the beginning,
14:37I had the video producer would just yell at me like a lot.
14:41Like,
14:46cause when you-
14:47Do you have a story?
14:48I mean, cause there's the production level,
14:52it's got to be different for all the shows
14:54that you do, right?
14:55Oh yeah.
14:56Like the amount of people that are on the set,
14:58like the, how did you script it out?
15:01What happens pre-production?
15:02What happens during the shoot?
15:03What happens post-production?
15:05Can you bring us into the,
15:07how the media sausage is made?
15:09I mean, yeah, it's very interesting. Every single thing I've done is very different.
15:14So, some things are just me and one camera. And that camera person is doing audio and also like
15:22directing and producing and basically doing it all. And it can vary from that and like not scripted.
15:26And then it could go as much as like Big Brunch is like, I don't know, there's like 30 cameras.
15:32Wow, really?
15:33A hundred person crew.
15:35Wow.
15:37Multiple, like, I didn't know that there were so many kinds of directors and producers and
15:43everyone has an initial that I don't understand.
15:47They're all like, you're in your own little world on set, right? But then they have something called
15:53Video Village. That's like, you can't see it. And it's like all of the, they can see all of
15:57the footage, like all from every, like all 15 cameras. And there's like 10 producers in there
16:02looking at everything. So, it's like, it's a big range, how many people are on it and
16:10how much pre-production and stuff. So, oftentimes a lot of internet content, it's just like,
16:14like with the New York Times, it's like a crew of six with like three cameras and an audio person.
16:22And then something like History Channel, it's like a crew of 50 and then Ancient Recipes goes up.
16:2650 people.
16:29Wow.
16:31That's amazing.
16:32It's kind of crazy how different every single shoot can be.
16:37Yeah.
16:38So, I just have to, for me, I have to try and think about like, I'm just talking to you.
16:44Yes.
16:45Because I feel like it can get a little intimidating if I think about all the other
16:49people in the room. So, I have to always just try and focus on who's the audience,
16:53who am I talking to? I try and keep it like as intimate as possible because I feel like
16:58it's easy to get distracted and start acting like, especially with like a bigger team,
17:04you kind of want to start, there's like an instinct to want to act like you're giving a toast.
17:12You know what I mean?
17:13Yeah, for sure. Absolutely.
17:15Like, instead of it being like an intimate one-on-one thing, you kind of start talking a
17:20little different and a little bit louder and like, you got to keep it in check. And remember,
17:24connect with the camera and the person behind the camera. My favorite thing is to get to know
17:29whoever's operating the camera.
17:31Really?
17:32That's like, that's for me the best trick. I become friends with them. I find out about their
17:37wife and kids. And then I feel like it's easier because then I'm just like, I'm just talking to
17:42Dylan. I don't know about all these other people. It's just me and Dylan here. And it's fun because
17:47I ended up becoming really good friends with whoever the ACAM is because they're also the
17:51closest to you on set. You guys spend the most time together. And I feel like that's like my way
17:55to forget about the other like hundred people that are in the room. But yeah.
18:01That is an incredible insight. That is, did somebody teach you that or
18:05was that instinctively? Do you remember your first camera person?
18:09Nobody taught me that. Nobody taught me that. Nobody teaches you anything.
18:14No one teaches you anything.
18:16No.
18:17Thrown to the wolves. Figure it out.
18:19Yeah. Figure it out. If you mess up, you don't get another job basically. Yeah. There's like
18:2450 other people in line to take your job. So.
18:26Yeah. No kidding. Can you share a little bit about the difference in the platforms,
18:33like what you're creating for? Like when you're creating for New York times,
18:36obviously you're putting all this time and effort, even with a six person crew,
18:41and you want it to be one long form video, but you're also getting short form video. You're
18:45hopefully getting an article. Can you share a little bit about that?
18:49How do you make the most out of those production shoots?
18:52Well, New York times is great because there is a lot like, even though it is a small team,
18:57everyone's really hands on. So we brainstorm a lot together before we even shoot to try and
19:03really like think about how to stretch the content. Like we just did a Thanksgiving special.
19:11Um, and it's crazy. Cause it comes out in Thanksgiving. We shot it in
19:17July and we started working on it in like May.
19:22Um, but like we had pre planning. Yeah. Yeah. There's, it all happens like very far out,
19:31which I think as the audience, you don't realize. And then sometimes what happens is like,
19:36Oh, Buzzfeed and, and New York times and Bon Appetit all do like the similar recipe and
19:41everybody thinks we copied each other. And it's like, no, we just all had the same idea a year
19:45ago. There's no copying. Um, I swear it just happens. But, um, yeah, so we, we have a lot of
19:53like pre pro meetings and we'll talk about the recipes and test them and taste them. And then
19:58from there figure out like, Oh, this might be good for social. Let's do an article on this. Um,
20:04let's expand on this recipe. So there's a lot of that, but then you also figure a lot in the moment.
20:10Um, and like every audience is different. So for New York times, their audience, they really cook
20:18like on TikTok. Yeah. TikTok it's entertainment. Most people who watch food videos on TikTok,
20:23they're not actually making the food. Yeah. No, like some of my best performing videos
20:28on TikTok was just like, one was just me drinking a margarita in my pantry
20:32and I got like 5 million views. Um, but New York times they're here for the recipes. Like
20:40yes, their people are there. They want help for Thanksgiving for weeknight meals.
20:45So it really begins with the recipe there more than anything else.
20:50Can you share a little bit? I saw one of your Instagram posts about your, your refrigerator,
20:56the hinges on your, but I laughed, I laughed about it. Please share the story. But the reason
21:02why I see a lot of restaurant tours that we talk to our audience, their fear of storytelling on
21:09the internet is something like that is waking up the next day and saying, Hey, what are you an
21:14idiot? Like, why haven't you fixed it? Please share the story. Well, okay. So I live in the
21:20East village. Yes. So the apartments here are like, unless you're a millionaire, there's something
21:26wrong with every apartment. Okay. So our, our fridge is like jammed up against the wall
21:35with cabinetry built around it. It does not budge. It's completely crammed in there. And the,
21:41the way that the door opens, like kind of like backwards. So like, I kind of have to like,
21:45open the door and then scooch in to look at the fridge because there's also what you can't see
21:50from the videos. There's like a wall right next, like in front of it. So the fridge just like
21:54barely opens. And anytime, any, in any video where you can see my fridge, I get flooded with DMS,
22:03mostly from men who are like, Hey, you know, you could just like switch the hinges on your fridge.
22:08And it's like, no dude, no. The second we moved in here, we tried that. Of course we tried it.
22:15It's like the most obvious what's really annoying is, okay. I'm sorry. I'm sorry.
22:21As a man, I have to tell you, please tell me this. I was so happy to see the content because
22:28that's the content that makes it real. That makes, I mean, that's why we do what we do.
22:33I mean, it's, you have the courage to share something that's real and relatable, right?
22:38It is. It's relatable because it's, go ahead, please.
22:42Well, it's like, it's like, do you really think I didn't think of the most obvious solution?
22:48I live here. I live with this fridge.
22:51I film here.
22:52I film here. I opened this fridge so many, like I've opened this door hundreds of times. I wish
22:58I could switch the hinges, but yeah. So I just had to clear, clear it up for the internet because I
23:05did a fridge tour for a New York times, like social video. And then I woke up to thousands
23:09of DMS thousands, thousands telling me to change the hinges. It was the most engagement I've gotten
23:16for anything. It's fantastic. Can you talk specifically about YouTube? What have you
23:22learned about creating on YouTube? YouTube is it's like, I feel like it's much harder than
23:34Instagram and TikTok. You don't really know what's gonna like slap. And I still don't know,
23:42like, I know that people like cheese pulls that tends to do well. And for some reason,
23:48they really like it when you eat a lot of things or like if there's mild discomfort happening.
23:53Yeah.
23:54Like I did a series with Babish where I had to do like ridiculous things like cook one handed,
24:01or I don't even remember, make astronaut food. I don't know. I was like under distress. I was
24:08under a lot of distress. And the more distress I was under, the better it performed.
24:13Jeez. It's not a good recipe.
24:17Yeah.
24:19If you're a creator that loves to stress, you'll do great on YouTube.
24:22But you see it. It's like, you know, that term in shitification.
24:27What is it?
24:28And shitification.
24:29No.
24:30The longer something continues online, the shittier it has to become to satisfy the audience.
24:37And you see it happening like with Babish and with like Joshua Weissman,
24:41they both started doing some cool stuff. Like Babish did like these really cool
24:46recreating food from TV. Joshua Weissman did a lot of teaching. And now they're both
24:52sitting around eating every single frozen pizza.
24:55Like, that's what they're doing now. Joshua Weissman just did a video where he ate every
25:00single fast food pizza in America. And it's like trending. And, you know, they got to do what they
25:07got to do. It's no shade to the creators. But it is unfortunate that that is where it always leads.
25:15It's why I've been afraid to start my own channel. And I just visit everybody else's channel.
25:20Because I don't want to sit around and just eat frozen pizzas. Like,
25:25when are you going to start your own channel?
25:27I don't think it's happening. No.
25:29It's definitely going to happen.
25:31It is. I don't know. It's like.
25:34It's 2024. Just so we can timestamp this. This is definitely, you know, it's going to happen.
25:40YouTube's the new TV.
25:42Once you start on YouTube, you can't stop.
25:46Once you start on Instagram, you can't stop.
25:49I stop and start on there all the time. But YouTube, I feel like you can't stop.
25:53And we all know where it's going to end. It's going to end with me eating, like,
25:58every single variety of mac and cheese known to man. Or, hey, let's go have every single
26:03chocolate chip cookie in America. Like, that's where they all end. And I just can't.
26:08There's no way around it. I'm going to be making giant food like, oh, let's make the
26:12world's largest cheeseburger. Like, that's what always trends. And I don't feel like I'm ready
26:18for that. One month after this comes out, we'll edit it before, since we have a little bit of
26:29leeway. Oh, my gosh. Start here. Can you talk about the promotional side of once the book,
26:39once you actually have the book, does it sell by itself or do you actually have to do something to
26:45help sell it? Well, I mean, I did the traditional stuff,
26:48like going on a book tour and stuff like that, which was very successful. But the most successful
26:55thing is just to go online and be like, hey, I have a book. Every time I do that, it sells.
27:01It is great how nowadays you have so much control. I don't think anyone's really dependent on
27:10traditional media to promote anything anymore. I did get very good reviews from all of the places,
27:18but what did best was when I was just like, oh, hey, guys, remember, I have a book,
27:22and then the sales would go up. But it is kind of hard. You kind of start to feel.
27:28I don't know. I prefer to show people how to cook rather than constantly tell them to buy stuff.
27:33For sure. Can you share a little bit? We have a creator economy business owners that are now
27:38starting to become creators, understanding that everyone can become their own media company. Can
27:42you share a little bit of insights into brand deals? How do you choose which brands to work with?
27:49What have you lessons learned along the way? I mean, I think you have to go with brands that
27:54you like because people can tell if you are being inauthentic. So definitely go with a brand that
28:03you like. In the beginning, it can feel a little scary to say no, but I think it's important. A lot
28:10of new creators, you can tell that they're just saying yes to everything. But you have to be
28:16patient because if you start working with brands that aren't authentic to you, your audience will
28:24recognize it and they're not going to stick around with you. I was really lucky. I was
28:31really excited when I got to do a deal with Häagen-Dazs. Really? Well, Häagen-Dazs, I love ice cream.
28:39It is like my favorite dessert. Didn't you grow up in a 31 Flavors? Yeah. Baskin-Robbins. Yeah,
28:45but like, okay, like if we're being real, Baskin-Robbins isn't very good.
28:51Fair enough. Fair enough. Tell me about Häagen-Dazs.
28:55Well, I was never allowed to eat anything but Baskin-Robbins. It wasn't welcome in our home.
29:00I like it. My parents would get very upset,
29:05so it was really exciting for me to have other ice creams and Häagen-Dazs is like the OG premium
29:11ice cream. There's a lot of people trying to do premium ice cream now, but back then they were
29:16like the first ones and I think they're still really standing strong even with all the competitors.
29:22And what are you doing with them? Oh, I just talked about how I like ice cream.
29:30On video? Yeah, on video. Social content, digital content? Yeah, it's pretty simple.
29:39That's awesome. Tell me a little bit about what are you planning for next year?
29:45When you look at the school stuff that you've done this year, the book, what does next year
29:51look like? I'm working on another book. Already? Yeah. Well, I mean, I was supposed to start
29:57last year, so I'm behind technically. Yeah, I'm working on that and I guess my cooking has
30:05changed a lot because I just had a kid. Congratulations.
30:09Thank you. Yeah, that actually happened during Häagen-Dazs, so it was even more applicable
30:15because it was the only joy in my life. I've only started sleeping again like recently,
30:21but my cooking has changed a lot because coming from a restaurant background, I feel like a lot
30:27of my perspective on recipes was really focused on technique. I want you to learn how to sear
30:36properly. And a lot of people were drawn to that, but now with a kid, I'm realizing that it's more
30:43about convenience. Maybe you crowd your pan a little just to get dinner on the table a little
30:51faster. And my cooking has just changed a lot because I used to have a lot more time to think
30:58about what I want to cook and to go shop and clean and all of that. And now I literally will have 20
31:04minutes to make dinner. So, I think that my new lifestyle, my recipe development is going to
31:13evolve and I'm still kind of figuring that out. So, I guess it's like figuring that out and really
31:19figuring out what this next book is going to be. Those are the main things on deck. Yeah.
31:24AMT – Anything on the social side, on the digital side?
31:29CB – I have no plans. I'm very spontaneous.
31:33AMT – Spontaneous. How do you keep up with all the content? How do you say no?
31:41CB – How do I say no?
31:43AMT – Yeah. It seems like you say yes if you have that much going on.
31:48CB – Well, I have people that I say no to and then they say no for me,
31:53which makes it easier to say no. You need a middleman. It makes it easier to say no.
32:00AMT – There it is.
32:01CB – It's worth their percentage.
32:03AMT – That's the secret. Fair enough.
32:07So, I would love to hear about your personal tech stack. So, we believe that we all have the
32:13greatest tool that's ever been known to business owners and creators and we have access to the
32:19internet. We can connect with so many people all over the globe that are going to find this on
32:23Spotify or YouTube or wherever they find it. Are you an iPhone or an Android user?
32:29AMT – iPhone. Are you an Android user? Every time I get a blue text or green text, I'm so confused.
32:39CB – Fair enough to say we've been doing this show for three years and I don't think anyone
32:45that has been a guest on this show has been an Android user.
32:47AMT – Good people.
32:49CB – Good people. Storytellers and hospitality professionals tend to be using iPhones.
32:55AMT – I don't trust Android users. What are you trying to prove?
33:01CB – I have a couple people on my team that are Android users, but we love you,
33:07Aaron. Even when you hear this video, you know we love you, but eventually one day,
33:12you'll come to the right side. Which version of iPhone? Do you always get the newest phone?
33:19AMT – Yeah.
33:19CB – Okay.
33:20AMT – Yeah. It really does make a difference.
33:22CB – Will you wait in line or how do you do it?
33:24AMT – No. We have that thing where you just like –
33:27CB – You just get it automatically.
33:29AMT – Yeah. I don't know what it's called. My husband does those things.
33:32CB – Okay. That's perfect. Do you prefer phone calls or text messages?
33:39AMT – Who prefers a phone call under the age of 50? A text, of course.
33:46If you call me and no one's dead, you're never allowed to call me again.
33:50CB – Do you leave voice messages?
33:54AMT – No, I hate that. No.
33:57CB – How many emails do you get a day?
34:00AMT – Well, like 50 spam.
34:03CB – 50 spam?
34:04AMT – And maybe 10 real ones.
34:06CB – And of the 10, how many do you enjoy reading?
34:10AMT – None of them.
34:11CB – No emails.
34:13AMT – None of them.
34:13CB – No email joy.
34:15AMT – I have serious email anxiety. So if it's something that's important,
34:21I'll put it off for a long time. I'll leave it unread for as long as I can.
34:25I'm afraid to look at it.
34:26CB – How many is in your inbox right now? Do you inbox zero or do you keep those unread?
34:32AMT – 174.
34:34CB – That's a lot.
34:36AMT – Is that a lot?
34:37CB – I don't know. There's people with thousands, so that's not a lot.
34:41AMT – I think it's pretty good. Yeah. That's like two days of emails.
34:44CB – How do you listen to music?
34:45AMT – Apple music.
34:48CB – Apple music. No Spotify.
34:50AMT – I've been using it since I was in college. I'm old. I've been using it for 20 years. I can't
34:56change.
34:56CB – You can't change? Do you use Apple Maps or Google Maps?
35:01AMT – Google Maps.
35:03CB – Google Maps.
35:04AMT – Is that the wrong answer? I've never used Apple Maps.
35:06CB – No, Apple Maps is no good.
35:08AMT – Okay.
35:08CB – It's just not good. What app do you enjoy using the most?
35:14AMT – New York Times Games.
35:23CB – New York Times Games.
35:25AMT – Uh-huh.
35:25CB – That's a good one.
35:27AMT – Yeah.
35:27CB – Which app do you wish you didn't have on your phone?
35:31AMT – Instagram.
35:33CB – Instagram. Why is that?
35:36AMT – It's my job now, so it's not fun anymore.
35:41CB – It's not fun anymore. Fair enough. TV. Do you watch TV?
35:47AMT – Yes.
35:48CB – Do you stream? Do you have YouTube TV? YouTube? Netflix?
35:53AMT – We have every single streaming app.
35:56CB – You have all the subscriptions?
35:58AMT – Yeah.
35:58CB – You have $400 a month in subscriptions?
36:01AMT – It's probably $200, but we really enjoy TV. So we got the Max, the Hulu, Amazon.
36:12CB – Netflix.
36:14AMT – Discovery, Netflix, of course, Paramount, Peacock.
36:21Peacock has all the wrestling.
36:23CB – All the wrestling?
36:24AMT – Yeah.
36:25CB – You watch wrestling?
36:26AMT – My husband does. It's got all the WWE stuff.
36:29CB – Okay.
36:29AMT – We have to have Peacock. It's essential now.
36:32CB – I love it. That's awesome.
36:34AMT – There's even more that I can't remember.
36:36CB – What is the best place for people to connect with you? Your website,
36:41newsletter, Instagram?
36:43AMT – Instagram.
36:45CB – Instagram. Cool. Is there anything that you think an aspiring creator should know
36:53in 2024 and beyond?
36:54AMT – Get an entertainment lawyer.
36:57CB – Really? Why is that?
37:02AMT – They're the only person you'll be able to trust. They'll defend you against the brands
37:09that are going to be predatory, as well as managers, agents, publicists. The lawyer is
37:16the most important person on the team. They earn that 5%.
37:19CB – Amazing.
37:21AMT – Mm-hmm.
37:23CB – That's great advice. Thank you for sharing that. It's been an honor. It's a pleasure. Huge
37:29fan. Can't wait to hopefully have you on the show sometime in the future. But what you're doing,
37:35it's inspirational. We're grateful that you spent some time with us today.
37:39AMT – Thanks. Quick question. Is that real New York or a photograph?
37:44CB – No. That's a wallpaper.
37:47AMT – Oh, it fooled me.
37:49CB – Yeah. No, not bad, right?
37:51AMT – Yeah.
37:51CB – It fools 90% of the people when I-
37:55AMT – I was like, where are you? What is this office?
37:57CB – No, no. We're in San Diego. We're in San Diego. But New York reminds us to think big.
38:04AMT – Well, it is that foggy today, so I was very convinced.
38:09CB – Ah, fair enough. Well, thank you so much for your time. And to the audience,
38:15we appreciate you. If you guys want to connect with me, at Sean P. Walcheff, S-H-A-W-N-P-W-A-L-C-H-E-F.
38:22We appreciate you. Stay curious, get involved, and don't be afraid to ask for help. We'll
38:27catch you guys next week. Thank you for listening to Restaurant Influencers. If you want to get in
38:33touch with me, I am weirdly available at Sean P. Walcheff, S-H-A-W-N-P-W-A-L-C-H-E-F.
38:41Cali Barbecue Media has other shows. You can check out Digital Hospitality. We've been doing
38:46that show since 2017. We also just launched a show, Season Two, Family Style, on YouTube with
38:53Toast. And if you are a restaurant brand or a hospitality brand and you're looking to launch
38:59your own show, Cali Barbecue Media can help you. Recently, we just launched Room for Seconds with
39:05Greg Majewski. It is an incredible insight into leadership, into hospitality, into enterprise
39:13restaurants and franchise, franchisee relationships. Take a look at Room for Seconds. And if you're
39:19ready to start a show, reach out to us, betheshow.media. We can't wait to work with you.