What is the future of the transatlantic relationship, now that Donald Trump is back in the White House? At the sidelines of the Munich Security Conference, Lithuania's President Gitanas Nauseda spoke to DW's Teri Schultz.
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00:00Mr. President, normally here at Munich we're talking about very serious security and defense
00:06issues, literally military arsenals, ammunition ramp-ups, things like that.
00:12Now we seem to be talking about the transatlantic relationship and the, you know, actually the
00:19strength of it.
00:20So with what you've heard here today and at NATO over the last couple of days, I mean,
00:26what's your assessment?
00:27Lithuania and the United States normally have very strong ties, don't they?
00:31Exactly, and this is really the situation where we are closely watching these discussions
00:38about the transatlantic bond.
00:40But you know, you mentioned our abilities and our military capacities or capacities
00:47of our military defense, and we are talking about transatlantic bond.
00:53I think those issues are interlinked, and our ability to deliver more, to produce more,
01:01to take more responsibility, to go to the burden, to share the burden fairly, it's very
01:11important.
01:12And right now we have very concrete figures, one billion military defense of United States
01:18and one trillion and five billion euros of European Union.
01:27So this is the reason why Americans are asking us to do more.
01:32And I think and I believe this is not about the transatlantic bond.
01:36The transatlantic bond will remain strong, at least this is the task of the countries
01:46like Lithuania, because we always relied on strong transatlantic bond.
01:53And we are ready to take those responsibilities to increase our defense spending and we go
01:59radical way.
02:00We plan to increase our defense spending up to 5-6% of GDP in 2026-2030.
02:09That's right.
02:10You are one of those countries who hasn't shied away from this responsibility.
02:12You've also got a border with Russia.
02:15The front line states are generally the high spenders, but therefore, as you said, these
02:21issues are interlinked.
02:22So does this continuous stream of insults that you seem to be getting today in this
02:29speech, not you personally, he didn't mention Lithuania as one of the countries, but does
02:34this help?
02:36That isn't necessarily going to make you spend more or make the laggards who are at 1.2%,
02:41that's not going to make them spend more.
02:43So is this really the way to do it?
02:45I don't know.
02:46I remember 2019 as the discussions between the partners, they are also not very polite
02:53and sometimes the accusations which were not very pleasant to some people sitting at the
03:01table.
03:02But at the end of the day, we achieved the result and NATO became stronger.
03:08Is this the same situation now?
03:13It's too premature to draw the conclusions and to say that probably we will go this way.
03:20I would prefer the very honest and frank conversation between the allies, between the partners,
03:27not accusing each other.
03:30Friendly and frank.
03:31Yes.
03:32And if that leads to higher defense spending in Germany, France, Spain, other countries
03:38which are quite far away from Russia and Russian aggression, then I would say, okay, we can
03:47go this way.
03:48But of course, we all understand what are the long-term threats and long-term threats
03:54are really very dangerous.
03:57And Russia poses long-term threat for next 20, 30 years.
04:02We have to realize that.
04:04The frontline countries understand it very well.
04:07But that's exactly the point.
04:09J.D. Vance didn't talk about that in his speech.
04:11That would normally be a big topic when you're facing a war right across your border.
04:18Yes, exactly.
04:19And what is going on now in Ukraine, this also could be solved in two ways.
04:29Quick solution, quick deal, or the deal which is appropriate and acceptable for Ukraine
04:39and for whole Europe.
04:41First way is wrong way to go, because I think Russia is not ready to make the fair deal.
04:48Russia wants to have the break to regroup, restructure, produce more ammunition, military
04:56equipment, and then organize the next offensive.
04:59I don't know where it will be.
05:01Maybe in Ukraine, maybe there will be other targets, including Baltic countries too.
05:10Another way, second way, is just to try to find fear, peace, and speak with Russia from
05:19the position of strength.
05:21Probably Ukraine is not ready to speak from the position of strength, but United States
05:27are ready.
05:28They can impose the sanctions.
05:31They can reduce the oil prices across the world.
05:35And it would hit Russian economy severely.
05:39This is not the case right now.
05:40We imposed so many sanctions, we imposed so many sanctions in European Union.
05:47But did they help us to stop Russia's war machine?
05:52Unfortunately not.
05:54Last question, wouldn't you feel better though if Europeans were part of these negotiations?
05:58Like you say, you bring a different perspective.
06:01You bring also the ability to impose sanctions, to add security guarantees, which is what
06:06would be expected from Europe.
06:09If you're excluded from those talks, how can you trust them?
06:12Of course Europe should be here, because this is about not only the security of Ukraine,
06:18but this is about the security of whole Europe.
06:21As I mentioned, Ukraine is only the first target.
06:25This time the play is much more difficult and complicated, and of course Putin will
06:32not stop in Ukraine.
06:34If he succeeds there, there will be the second target probably in Europe.
06:39This is the reason why Europe has to be at the table, has to decide, but of course in
06:45order to achieve that, Europe should have very strong position what to do, what should
06:52be the conditions of this peace.
06:54And so far we are not united.
06:56Unfortunately I have to admit that there are some countries which are going different way.
07:02And we cannot reach the consensus at the table.
07:06This is a problem, but we have tried to solve this.
07:09Okay, that's all our time.
07:11Thank you, Mr. President.
07:12Thank you so much.
07:13All the best.