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00:00decision in the case relating to the Venezuelan removals under the Alien Enemies Act.
00:04So the Supreme Court seems motivated to work with some expediency here.
00:08Certainly a lot of moving parts. Thank you so much for...
00:10All right, you're just listening in there to that segment on the Hill discussing the latest.
00:14Let's continue on as they also spoke with a former FBI agent about this,
00:20talking about what it means for Kilmar Obrego to be deported and some of those tattoos as well.
00:26Let's listen in to this segment here on Live Now from Fox.
00:30A former FBI agent who focused on counterterrorism.
00:33Chris, thanks so much for being with us.
00:35We've heard the term terrorist used a lot over the last couple of days.
00:41You're an expert in this field. What constitutes the word terrorist?
00:47Well, terrorism, by definition, is the use of force or violence to intimidate
00:52a population for political or ideological perspective or endeavor or agenda.
00:59So the use of intimidation of communities, the use of crime, violence to further your personal views or position
01:09constitutes terror in its various forms.
01:13And also, good morning.
01:15Thank you for allowing me to visit with you and happy Easter to your audience.
01:18Happy Easter to you as well, too.
01:20On this, though, is this a legal definition?
01:24Because he's been called this repeatedly by the administration officials.
01:29Is a gang member, although, you know, gangs are known to engage in horrible kinds of criminal behavior,
01:35are they necessarily meaning the legal law enforcement standard of terrorism?
01:40They can be.
01:43I mean, it depends on the tactics that they use and the approaches that they use.
01:47Gang members use terrorist tactics to achieve their criminal organizational objectives.
01:54And one thing I will say is that, you know, this isn't the first time that transnational organized crime gangs
02:01have been recognized as a national security threat.
02:04It was also recognized under the Obama administration that transnational organized crime was, in fact,
02:11a national security issue.
02:12So this isn't the first time this discussion has come up.
02:15And during my time at the Terrorist Screening Center,
02:18we had begun monitoring and tracking the activities of certain transnational organized crime organizations
02:27or gangs for that specific reason.
02:30So I don't know if you heard our previous conversation just now,
02:35but, you know, local police in Prince George's County released some information about an encounter
02:40with Mr. Obrego Garcia back in 2019.
02:44They said that he had indications of association with MS-13.
02:50However, he was not charged with a crime,
02:52and they had no subsequent run-ins with him until the day he was arrested later by ICE itself.
03:00What, in your view as a law enforcement professional,
03:04tells you whether or not somebody is an MS-13?
03:08Well, you have to look at the articulable facts and circumstances surrounding Mr. Garcia,
03:14and you have to look at the reasonable suspicion that he might be,
03:18or he could be engaged with gang activity, he could be engaged in certain crime.
03:24And that's where law enforcement investigative work comes into play,
03:28where you start looking at, again, his affiliates, his activities, his life patterns,
03:34and things of that sort.
03:36And as well as the, you know, the markings on his body,
03:39if he had the tattoos that were recently shown in the public,
03:45you know, it gives you a strong indicator that he's affiliated with those people or that organization.
03:50But what do we know about this protective order, Chris, though?
03:53Because the court decided that if this guy got sent back,
03:58he could be in danger from the very group that he's being accused by the administration of being a member of.
04:05Well, I think actually he was more concerned about violence from a separate gang,
04:10the 18th Street Gang, I believe they were named as.
04:14He was associated with MS-13.
04:17He made his case to an immigration court, which found his case compelling.
04:22But he was also issued a deportation order by the same immigration system.
04:29So I think at this point you have a more complex interweaving of authorities
04:34that has to be looked at at the level of the attorney general,
04:37the secretary of DHS, and, you know, White House officials.
04:40Well, one thing hasn't changed.
04:42Brego Garcia remains in that El Salvador prison this morning.
04:47Chris Payota, thank you for shedding some light on the intricacies of the screening
04:52and how these operations work from a law enforcement standpoint.
04:57Chris Payota, the former director of the Terrorist Screening Center, joining us live this morning.
05:01All right. Thank you so much to our Fox 5 team.
05:03And, of course, this was the moment.
05:04Senator Chris Van Hollen on social media saying,
05:07I said my main goal of this trip was to meet with Kilmar tonight.
05:11I had the chance.
05:12I have called his wife, Jennifer, to pass along this message of love.
05:16I look forward to providing a full update upon my return.
05:20So a lot to make of this story this week about Kilmar Abrego Garcia,
05:27the Maryland father that was wrongfully deported to El Salvador.
05:32Chris Van Hollen made it his mission to go to that country and visit him.
05:36He did meet with them.
05:37And he also spoke with the media immediately in the aftermath of this.
05:41Let's take you right now out to this from earlier on this week
05:45as Senator Van Hollen met with the media to detail what the meeting...
05:49David Albert Smith.
05:50So, here we go.
05:52...
05:54...
05:58...