At Wednesday's House DOGE Committee hearing, Rep. Brian Jack (R-GA) questioned the head of USA Fencing about the inclusion of transgender athletes in women's sports.
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00:00Jack from Georgia.
00:01Well, thank you, Madam Chairwoman, and thank you for convening this hearing.
00:04Under your leadership, the Doge subcommittee has been one of the most active subcommittees across Congress,
00:09and my constituents are proud of our work to eliminate waste, fraud, and abuse of taxpayer dollars across the federal government.
00:15And today, it is no surprise that our colleagues on the other side of the aisle have spent a majority of their time
00:20desperately avoiding the issue before us because 80% of Americans, Republicans and Democrats alike,
00:27believe biological men should never compete in women's sports.
00:31Mr. Leifelt, as Mr. Fallon noted, you are testifying today under subpoena because you refused to appear before us voluntarily.
00:38Why did you refuse our initial invitation to testify?
00:42Congressman, thank you for giving me the opportunity to address that.
00:45Our CEO of the organization, Phil Andrews, was offered as a witness,
00:50and we felt, given his full-time capacity that he operates in this role,
00:54that he would be able to answer the questions more thoroughly than I can.
00:58However, since I'm here, I'm happy to be here and answer your questions.
01:01And as chairman of USA Fencing, how many members of USA Fencing are biological men
01:05who have participated in women's competitions?
01:08Rough estimate.
01:09Rough estimate, sir.
01:11I believe that it's roughly 200 total, with I think 39 that are transgender women.
01:19And of that group of biological men, how many have won championships in women's competitions?
01:25Rough estimate.
01:26I couldn't tell you the specific number, sir.
01:29Five, more than ten.
01:31I'm honestly not sure, sir.
01:33I mean, I have the data on how often cisgender women prevail against transgender women,
01:37but specifically the number of medals, et cetera, I'm not sure off the top of my head, sir.
01:42And conversely, how many biological women are participating in men's competitions within USA Fencing?
01:47Thirty-four percent of our events are mixed, sir, and so it's fairly regular for that kind of event to happen.
01:53There are plurality of our events.
01:55And again, I'm just referring to specifically male, non-mixed competitions, specifically male competitions.
02:01How many biological women are participating in those, to the best of your knowledge?
02:04So, just so I understand your question, sir, biological women competing in the men's division, sir?
02:09Yes.
02:10I'm not sure, sir.
02:11Okay.
02:12Well, I think the disparity alone, as we've seen, confirms that this approach is inequitable.
02:16The data across other sports affirms that in recent years, over 600 female athletes have lost more than 900 medals to biological men in women's sports.
02:25And again, over 80 percent of Americans, Republicans, and Democrats alike agree that biological men should never compete in women's sports.
02:34Mr. Leifelt, and I mean this with respect, in your capacity as a representative of USA Fencing, have you ever impersonated a woman?
02:40No, I have not, sir, not to my knowledge.
02:43I ask because I understand you have a history of creating fictitious female personas.
02:48In one instance, you impersonated a woman named Dorothy and wrote an email to yourself, which you then published on social media, for all your followers to see along with your response.
02:57Do you want to comment on that?
02:59Yeah, I do, sir.
03:00Thank you for giving me the opportunity to address that.
03:01It was a poor attempt at humor.
03:02It was unbecoming of me as a leader of this organization to post that, as I did.
03:08And quite frankly, moving forward, that's not something that's going to happen again.
03:11It's unacceptable.
03:12And it's not something that should happen with any human-to-human interaction, period.
03:19Ms. Turner and Ms. McNabb, I want to commend both of you.
03:22You are both very brave women.
03:24And, Ms. Turner, your courage that you displayed on March 30th galvanized millions of Americans in support of the simple truth that biological men should never compete in women's sports.
03:33And with my remaining time, Madam Chairwoman, I'd like to learn a little bit more about the culture within USA Fencing.
03:38Specifically, Ms. Turner, reporting suggests that you previously raised your concerns of the policies with which you have to face to USA Fencing officials.
03:48What was the response when you did so?
03:52I had done so privately, and the answer is that they did not respond.
03:57But I have known of other members of USA Fencing, a mother and a daughter, who did come to USA Fencing asking, saying that they did not approve of the transgender policy, and they were told that they would be sanctioned.
04:13And did you or have you feared retribution from USA Fencing with respect to your brave stance and, likewise, your concerns you've raised before you took that stand?
04:21Yes, and I still do. I don't think I'll ever get a fair bout again from a referee or that I'd be welcomed without harassment.
04:29And why do you think that culture exists? Just, you know, you've experienced it. I'm curious, your own perspective as it relates to the culture that tolerates this type of behavior.
04:39I don't think they communicate well with people who oppose this policy. No one ever asked me what I thought.
04:46And I think maybe if they had, they'd know what my stance was, you know.
04:52Well, you're bravely led us to ask you your thoughts today in front of the American public.
04:56So grateful for both you, Ms. McNabb, and all of our witnesses for testifying.
05:00Madam Chairwoman, I yield the remaining four seconds to you. Thank you very much.