Essence Grenada Prime Minister Package V3
Transcript
00:00 racism and the need for reparation and the impact on black people all over the world
00:04 is something that is ongoing and that has legacy issues even today. So when we talk about the need
00:10 to ensure that people of African descent worldwide are treated fairly, that's an ongoing challenge
00:15 that we face and that we have to continue to talk about. Prime Minister Mitchell, it's so
00:23 wonderful to join you here in Grenada. I'm News and Politics Editor for Essence magazine, Melissa
00:28 Noel, and I really want to get into this conversation by first starting by talking about
00:33 the U.S.-Caribbean partnership that was formed in 2022 to address certain issues such as climate
00:38 change, arms trafficking, and just the needs of the Caribbean region. Recently, Essence had the
00:45 opportunity to join Vice President Kamala Harris on her historic first trip to the region as VP,
00:50 and there was a lot that came out of that meeting, including a hundred million dollar
00:55 investments in aid to the Caribbean region. In your opinion, how successful has this partnership
01:01 been and where do you think it, where do you foresee it going next in terms of moving from
01:07 the meeting side now to of course the action side? Well first I'd say the U.S. has been a
01:13 traditional partner and ally of the Caribbean obviously for several decades and so we're happy
01:19 that that partnership continues, but I also will be frank and say that we are also happy that I
01:25 think the U.S. has begun to realize that we are friends, we are neighbors, and that it needs to
01:31 listen to us a bit more because you know for all of the obvious reasons, geographically,
01:37 we speak, we're in the same region of the Americas, we're very close by,
01:41 we share a lot of the same common values, democracy, human rights, multi-plural society,
01:48 so we certainly think the renewed interest that has come about, maybe partly driven by external
01:53 factors, is certainly welcome and obviously we welcome the fact that the Vice President,
01:58 not just the Vice President, but even the Secretary of State for example, attended the
02:04 Caribbean's 50th anniversary meeting in Trinidad, so it certainly demonstrates that at the very
02:10 highest level of U.S. government, there's renewed interest in the Caribbean. We welcome the
02:16 initiatives particularly as it relates to climate change, but that's really in a sense a messy drop
02:23 in the bucket, not even a drop in the ocean, because 100 million, greening it alone could
02:28 use 100 million and it wouldn't be impactful in terms of the significant challenges we face with
02:33 climate change. They need to transition to renewable energy for instance and they need
02:39 to deal with mitigation and adaptation measures, particularly when it comes to infrastructure,
02:45 because of damages that are posed by weather patterns. So what I would certainly say is that
02:49 it's a start, we need to do significant work and crucially we need to simplify how we actually get
02:58 the resources, because one of the challenges we face is that everyone pledges, but when it comes
03:03 to actually getting the money, oftentimes the mechanisms and the modalities are so obscure
03:09 and so complex that by the time you get to understand what is required to actually get
03:14 this money deployed, so much time has passed that it becomes not impactful. So there has to be a
03:19 simplified, a straightforward means by which these announcements of aid or development funding
03:25 actually is able to get to governments or get to NGOs or get to the private sector
03:28 so that we can actually deploy it. So that's one area that I think significant work
03:32 needs to be done and then the second area is we actually need significantly more support.
03:37 Thank you so much for that and you made some very specific points there, particularly where
03:42 climate change is concerned and to that point with the Caribbean, you know, definitely taking a lead
03:48 and you should be at the centre and focus of that. Now switching from climate change and some of the
03:52 other issues that it addresses, how do you think the Caribbean or the Caribbean's role can be in
03:58 that partnership where the issue or the issue of reparations is concerned? While not a part of that
04:05 particular partnership, certainly a global conversation that is taking place and seeing
04:10 how the Caribbean's role and CARICOM's role, the role it's playing in that. Well I think given
04:17 America's own unique history with the slave trade as well, with the civil war, with the civil rights
04:25 movement, with race relations in the US, I think the United States domestically more than any other
04:30 country I think understands the importance of ensuring that all of its citizens are treated
04:36 correctly, fairly, equally and if you don't do that the devastating consequences that it can
04:41 have domestically on a country. So I think once you take that global perspective, it should be
04:47 one of the countries championing the need to address the need for reparations and so I think
04:53 it is uniquely placed to do so because I think even domestically it has to confront that same
04:59 history and I think for example the state of California has begun to do so. So I think all
05:04 of the states in the US which are particularly impacted by this should also be leading in that
05:09 regard and be setting an example. Now there are other countries you know in the region that has
05:13 a similar challenge you know. Latin America, South America, Central America have significant
05:21 pockets of aborigines, have significant pockets of Afro persons who are descendants of Africans
05:28 and they face the exact same problem perhaps in worse conditions and it's not talked about.
05:35 There are significant parts of South America which has attempted to eliminate black people.
05:38 You know people don't pay attention to those things but if you look at a country like Argentina
05:43 you know all of South America is football crazy. If you pay attention to Argentina's history you
05:47 see Argentina does not have black players. That's not by accident, that's by deliberate systematic
05:53 action that was taken. So you know racism and the need for reparation and the impact on black
05:59 people all over the world is something that is ongoing and that has legacy issues even today.
06:04 So when we talk about the need to ensure that people of Afro descent worldwide are treated
06:09 fairly and that's an ongoing challenge that we face and that we have to continue to talk about
06:13 and the US, I would give the US this perhaps more than any other country. I don't think it hides its
06:18 flaws or its faults. I think there's generally a willingness to at least recognize that you have to
06:23 debate it, you have to talk about it if you're going to get consensus. So I think they certainly
06:28 can be a champion for advocating that this is an issue that needs to be addressed. CARITAM,
06:33 certainly given our own experience as well, will continue to lead on this issue and will continue
06:38 to advocate because we are small. Even when you put us together we are small in numbers but I
06:43 think the one thing the region has shown despite the fact that we are small in numbers we punch
06:48 above our weight almost on any aspect. So whether it's diplomats, advocates, entertainers, sportsmen,
06:54 Nobel laureates, you name it, we have it. So I think we just have to continue to make sure that
07:00 we don't let our size limit our need to continue leading and advocating on this particular issue
07:06 of reparations. Thank you so much for that and I think I don't know will the conversations continue
07:11 certainly but then the actions right we're seeing the conversations take place but I think what
07:15 I've been most or has been most gratifying to me is seeing the global push to take actions
07:21 versus just you know talking about it or sometimes having the diaspora wars online as we've been
07:28 talking about quite recently. So I'm going to take a turn here and move from kind of you know
07:36 U.S. policies and partnerships to what's happening right here in Grenada and that specifically has
07:43 to do with the fact that there was the launch of the inaugural Unleash Conference in May of this
07:49 year where you urged financial institutions to actively support the development of the creative
07:55 industries in Grenada calling it calling it a foreign exchange earner and a way to help diversify
08:01 the local economy here. In addition you spoke about creating a specific government policies
08:08 in support of it. Can you share any additional details on some of those policies that have been
08:15 and are being creative created in order to support Grenada's orange economy as it continues to evolve
08:23 and grow? Certainly I'm happy to do so. So we are taking a very strategic and comprehensive approach
08:29 to the cultural and creative sector and I think we are perhaps well placed to do so to some extent
08:36 because we have a blank canvas. I think we've viewed the creative, I don't even think the word
08:42 economy is something that was popular two or three years ago. In a sense I think creative people were
08:49 either viewed as persons who had hobbies and did something because they simply liked it or for the
08:53 fun of it. So I think we are just from a consciousness point of view seeking to awake the
09:00 populations particularly the youth population awareness that the creative economy is an economy.
09:05 It's a multi-billion dollar economy and that we not just in Grenada but I think in the OECS
09:11 maybe to a lesser extent Jamaica and Trinidad have missed out completely on this and we need
09:18 to recognize that given our creative abilities, given our talent, this is something we need to
09:22 view from a business career perspective as well. So I think just the conversation first and foremost
09:27 and that's part of what our mission was meant to address and then secondly as we talk about
09:30 economy what do you need to create an economy, what do you need to create an industry from the
09:34 necessary legislative support, the necessary fiscal support, the education, the physical
09:39 infrastructure that comes with that and critically the financing. So just as a start there's never
09:44 been an office of creative affairs and we've created that just to get to the point where we
09:50 can start documenting the people who are in that space because if you don't know the people are
09:54 then you can't connect with them, you can't speak with them, you can't help them. So that's just one
09:57 of the things we did right off the bat. The second thing we did is to recognize that creatives
10:03 oftentimes are disadvantaged because the tools they need to work with you have to import it
10:08 and if you're trying to build a sector that is in its infancy you need to be able to support it
10:14 and so what we've done is to in fact give fiscal incentives where we've zero rated that and import
10:20 duties are one of the tools that creative needs. They need to be able to do what they do.
10:25 So whether it's cameras, whether it's material for painting, you know for music, you name it we've
10:32 zero rated this so that they can import this into the country at a cost that is manageable for them.
10:39 We've begun extensive discussions with all of the financing institutions because one of the
10:44 challenges that the financing sector does not understand the creative economy or the creative
10:49 space. So how do you value a creative work? What's the revenue stream? You know none of that is
10:55 understood so we recognize we have to spend a lot of time in fact educating and explaining that and
11:00 that's one of the strategic imperatives that we are pursuing because if you can't get the financial
11:05 sector to understand how you value a photographer's work or you value a painter's work then basically
11:11 they will not be able to come up with financing models that will allow them to support that.
11:16 But outside of that in terms of just direct support itself the government recognizes that it has to
11:22 at least in the nurturing stage provide some direct financing to our creatives so that they too
11:29 can in a sense get on their feet and get running. So we've established a creative fund
11:33 that creatives will be able to apply to to get some at least seed money to be able to
11:39 to address that. We're also speaking to our partners in the financing field. So for example
11:45 On Leash is partly sponsored by the Latin American and Caribbean Development Bank
11:49 and we're very very happy that that has happened because I think the bank recognizes
11:54 that's a vast untapped area within the region and if we can really support it, it has enormous
12:02 potential because the market isn't green either. The market is the world and there are obvious
12:07 examples of it but oftentimes I don't think it's internalized from a commercial point of view.
12:11 If you take Jamaican dance or music for example and what it means for those persons in that space
12:16 the world doesn't come from Jamaica, it comes from the rest of the world and I'm saying even
12:20 if you take regionally, you know the amount of Jamaican artists who have performed outside of
12:25 Jamaica in the region who literally earn their living. It's not just the the lead artists but
12:28 the band, the production crew, the photographers, the dancers, everything that's involved.
12:32 Everybody that's involved in the production worldwide.
12:35 Precisely, that's how they make their living but I think we don't understand that you know
12:40 and I think the average person just thinks about I'm going to a concert, I'm going to an event. So
12:44 they don't understand the significant industry that's behind that and I think if we are able
12:48 to explain that to a population even from school it becomes easier for a five or six-year-old boy
12:54 to say I want to be a stylist, I want to be a photographer rather than the traditional
12:58 professions that we only need so much of and in any event you probably will be limited in terms
13:04 of your space. So you know just from I would say even lawyers there are very few intellectual
13:08 property lawyers in the region and the reason for that again is misappreciation or unappreciation
13:15 of the vast potential that the creative economy can produce just from an intellectual property
13:22 perspective. So we certainly think you know it's an exciting opportunity and that's why we're very
13:28 keen and eager to support it. Thank you so much for that and I've been seeing just you know just
13:32 the energy that that conference brought and the many creatives that I've had the opportunity to
13:37 speak with and their not only excitement but also just knowing the engagement is there and the and
13:44 the support as you said from a financial standpoint to them to really you know take their
13:49 creative processes and things that they're doing to the next level. So moving right along here we're
13:53 here for Spice Masks. I want to speak to Spice Masks in particular where the creative sector
13:58 is concerned. There's so many fantastic you know amazing great Canadian creatives that are you know
14:06 in this space whether it's the costumes or the set production or just on the road and so on and so
14:11 forth. Talk to me about the meaning of masks here particularly when we think of Jab Jab and some of
14:17 the more traditional masks aspects here in Grenada. What it means to Grenadian people and how
14:23 supporting that those creative instincts and that creative drive here not only you know helps with
14:29 the I guess like the spiritual and the roots of where it came from and those roots of resistance
14:34 but also how it's going to move it forward. So I mean you know carnival is a special thing.
14:40 Perhaps one of the most special times on island. I think just from the fact that the entire country
14:45 is involved in one way shape or form is really truly nationalistic. The pride comes out,
14:52 the revelry, the interconnectedness you know it's one time when truly as a nation the entire
14:59 country is galvanized in one way shape or form. Even those you know take part in it you know use
15:04 the opportunity to have it with friends, family to go to the beach. So I think just from a united
15:09 perspective any dispute would be over who should win or who should not you know but outside of that
15:15 it really unifies the country that's one. Obviously from a creative perspective you know it really
15:21 demonstrates the creativity of our people. One of the things that I think we underestimate is that
15:27 you don't need much to be creative. In a sense Jab Jab in particular is a reflection of that. It's
15:32 a bit of a free mask in the sense that you don't have to pay for anything. You can truly take
15:37 whatever you have and make it your own from a costume, from an all-mask perspective and I think
15:42 that's important because what it demonstrates it's a great equalizer right. It's not like you need to
15:48 have money to be able to take part or to have fun and I think that is absolutely critical to remember.
15:54 I mean the spirituality of it there's an energy that you get when human beings come together and
15:59 they're all doing the same thing or taking part in that activity. In a sense if you go into
16:03 St George's on juvenile morning you can you can feel that in the air. You can feel that atmosphere
16:08 and that's really in a sense what carnival, what masquerading is about. The fact that you know if
16:12 you're not from the country you can come and feel that vibe, feel that energy and that tells you
16:17 you know from a perspective of accomplishment and from a perspective of building a small nation
16:21 that if we replicate that in other areas that energy, that oneness then you're able to achieve
16:26 great things and then traditionally obviously tells the story of where we're coming from.
16:30 That story of survival, resistance but ultimately triumph, you know celebration and that is critical.
16:38 It is not just oftentimes we focus on the celebration, no, but the fact is we've had to
16:43 fight for carnival. We've had to fight for jab jab, right. You've had to fight for a lot of
16:48 cultural expressions. Drumming was illegal, right and people need to understand that.
16:53 It still blows my mind to this day you know every time I think about it and just sit in that space
16:58 and just appreciate the fact that we get to do it anytime we want. You can go down the road right now
17:04 and see someone drumming and don't take that lightly. Yeah, you know so there are symbols of
17:09 resistance and the drum is perhaps the quintessential symbol of resistance so we have to
17:14 appreciate that and it's also again acceptance of who we are and you know you may play on it
17:22 but the idea of jab jab I think also talks about acceptance of your blackness, acceptance of your
17:29 the fact that you're a descendant of Africans, acceptance of the fact that our foreparents did
17:33 not accept being slaves and despite even if it took three four hundred years we came out of that
17:40 and those are things that are significant to me and so when I talk about spirituality it's deeply
17:45 embedded in that you know. So you know there are other aspects of our culture, Rastafarianism
17:51 for example is a classic example where even persons of Afro descent would have scorned
17:58 or ridiculed or ostracized them but they never gave up. They persisted and today Rastafarianism
18:04 or the dreadlock hairstyle for example is singly traced to the Rastafarian movement. Then you can
18:10 talk about things like marijuana and the in a sense the final acceptance that the demonization
18:15 of marijuana that would have been perpetrated over the years. Somebody stood up to that,
18:20 somebody resisted that oftentimes at significant personal, economic and in many instances the
18:26 ultimate sacrifice where people you know lost their lives over things like that and it tells
18:31 you the story that if you don't resist things sometimes, if you don't challenge what I call
18:35 received wisdom that you could find yourself in a society where people dominate you simply because
18:41 you refuse to question things or you refuse to say is this the right thing and so in a sense
18:45 carnival in my view is reflective of all of this because if we didn't have foreparents who were
18:50 prepared to say I'm going to drug even though you say it's illegal then we may very well have
18:54 we live in a society where we are still enslaved. If you didn't have persons who are prepared to say
18:58 I'm going to play jam even though you say it's illegal then we would not be able to have the
19:02 cultural art form that we have and so whether it's the vehicle, the shot, the wild Indian mask which
19:07 a traditional mask that we still need to embrace and teach our people about the steel pan
19:11 and what that represented and where it came from. Again you know we recently celebrated the
19:17 international day of the steel pan. The United Nations has been able to recognize this and
19:23 sometimes we take those things for granted right but these are achievements by small countries
19:28 in a global context and we have to we have to never underestimate those things and it
19:35 demonstrates how in my mind as I said you know collectively and individually as small islands we
19:41 contribute significantly to the civilization of mankind. So you can simply ask what would the
19:46 world be without the steel pan or now what's the world without jab jab right. We don't want to live
19:52 in a world like that. Exactly so you know it adds color it adds humanity because oftentimes the
19:58 relentless pursuit of materialism you know makes us in a sense slaves to I call it the material
20:05 goddess and we have to recognize that life is more than accumulation of material things.
20:09 It's about our humanity, our dignity and to my mind in a sense the creative art form is the
20:16 greatest testament to our humanity or then we become robots. Yeah and I think one of course
20:22 to have our traditions and to be able to hold on to them is more valuable than anything that we can
20:27 touch our own because we have them forever and we can share them with whomever. Yes. So to wrap
20:33 this conversation here the last question I have we just kind of built on the creative sector the
20:40 folks involved in it you know we talked we touched on the spirituality the economic side of things
20:46 some have expressed concern about the potential loss of the traditions right in in favor of or
20:54 in move of the commercial aspects of carnival so beyond the carnival season and with new things
21:01 like the uh the conference that is taking place this new creative affairs sector and so on and
21:07 so forth how you how do you foresee the education piece of this these important elements of the
21:13 creative sector expanding to new audiences through the efforts of the Grenadian government?
21:19 So I think fundamentally we have to start at the schools because culture is something that is
21:24 learned and taught yes and if we don't do that then yes there's a risk that you you lose the
21:31 traditional aspects so I think that's one of the things we absolutely have to address. We can't
21:35 take it for granted that our kids will play band we have to teach them we can't take it for granted
21:39 that our children will learn how to make costumes we have to teach them we can't take it for granted
21:43 that they will sing concerts you have to teach them because the reality is you know they are
21:47 bombarded by cultural expressions from outside of Grenada through the internet through television
21:53 you know through the social media all the time so it's important if you want to preserve something
21:58 you have to fight for that you have to draw that in a sense a wall of protection around it so I
22:02 think from that perspective that's one of the things we have to do as a government and as a
22:05 society and I think if we do that it will certainly put us in good stead in terms of ensuring that our
22:10 cultural iconic practices creations will survive for generations to come but I also want to say
22:20 this I think that's important you know I was having a conversation with Mr. Killer yesterday
22:24 and one of the things he pointed out which I think is valid that for a lot of the traditional areas
22:28 we have to incentivize people to get involved into the traditional areas and if we don't
22:34 incentivize and we just simply leave it like that then the market will move and the market is driven
22:39 by commercialization then people will take part in things or promote things that they believe
22:43 they will simply get a commercial return on so if we want to encourage other cultural aspects
22:47 as a government we have to incentivize that and I think that's very good advice coming from someone
22:53 yeah sort of reach the pinnacle of Canadian creativity for sure so you know that also means
22:58 we need to listen to the creatives a lot more to get their input and their guidance as to how we
23:03 fashion the development of some of the areas that are that are more traditional and that we may feel
23:08 is not being widely embraced and I think if we get that sort of input then we'll be able to make
23:12 wiser policy decisions.