Brussels, my love? The new migration pact has few fans
In this edition, we break down the nail-biting vote on the EU migration pact, hear how press freedom in Slovakia is under threat and ask how Ursula von der Leyen is handling the so-called Piepergate scandal.
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00:00 [Music]
00:12 Hello there and welcome to Brussels, my love.
00:15 Euronews' weekly talk show about all the news here in Brussels and beyond.
00:20 I'm Maeve McMahon, thanks for tuning in.
00:22 Coming up this week, after years of mismanaging migration this Wednesday marked
00:28 another baby step towards new EU legislation.
00:32 MEPs gave their final blessing to a pile of migration laws meant to fix the status quo.
00:39 But with EU elections approaching fast and many frustrated with how irregular migration has been managed,
00:44 we're asking if this pact is too little and it's coming too late.
00:48 And all eyes on Slovakia, the central European country of 5 million people,
00:54 came up a lot this week because of Peter Pellegrini, the newly elected president,
00:59 is seen as pro-Russian and anti-Ukraine, something frowned upon in centre circles here in Brussels.
01:05 We zoom in on what this new appointment will mean for Bratislava's ties here
01:10 and check in on rule of law in Slovakia after months of anti-government protests.
01:15 A warm welcome to our panel this week, Damien Busselager, German MEP with Volt Europe,
01:21 Laura Shields, the founder of Red Thread EU, and Jan-Christoph Ullchen, German MEP from Renew Europe
01:29 and one of the vice presidents of the European Parliament.
01:32 Great to see you all. Thank you so much for being here.
01:34 But before we hear your views, let's just hear how MEPs gave their final approval
01:39 to one of the most divisive issues in EU lawmaking this week.
01:42 That's the migration and asylum pact.
01:48 After almost four years of debates, this week saw the EU migration and asylum pact
01:52 go through the chopping board in seek of approval from the European Parliament.
01:56 Deemed historic, the details are dense, full of legal mechanisms and procedures.
02:04 The bottom line, as of 2026, new rules will manage migration
02:10 to take the burden from countries like Italy, Greece or Malta.
02:17 Countries will have a choice, host asylum applicants or pay their way out.
02:21 For some, it does not go far enough. They want a zero-asylum policy.
02:28 Others say it will increase human suffering and human rights violations.
02:32 It will be up to EU capitals now to rubber stamp it after the sell-it to national parliaments.
02:44 So this is the biggest overhaul of EU migration rules for a decade.
02:47 I think we're talking about ten regulations and policies,
02:50 perhaps one of the reasons it took so long to get passed through.
02:53 Jan Christoff, the Commission President Ursula von der Leyen,
02:56 she called it a huge achievement for Europe.
02:59 What's your view? Is it a huge achievement or is it just the fact that they managed to agree on the deal?
03:03 That's actually historic here.
03:04 It's a big step. It's a big step because for, you mentioned, a decade,
03:09 this was blocked among the member states because there were member states
03:13 not wanting to discuss migration topics at all.
03:16 And so that we managed to achieve this, to compromise this in this mandate
03:22 and we got this final vote is a huge step forward because it cannot stay as it is at the moment.
03:27 We have so much human suffering on the one hand
03:30 and we have so much lack of control and lack of good procedures on the borders
03:36 that it was necessary to do this step.
03:38 Damien, I guess you would disagree.
03:40 I saw your group put out a statement saying that this was a shipwreck for migrants.
03:44 But would you not agree that in fact a deal is better than no deal?
03:48 I think it's interesting to finally come to some form of a conclusion.
03:53 I mean, it's true that for 10 years, the 27 interior ministers were not able to even sit on the table
03:59 to discuss this issue. But you should also look in what direction you're stepping.
04:04 And I think this is not a step forward, but it's a step back. Why?
04:07 Because it's not going to actually improve the situation for either the migrants,
04:12 the asylum seekers, the countries at our borders.
04:16 There's no actual solidarity when it comes to helping each other as a European Union.
04:21 So I'm not quite sure.
04:22 Because there is no solidarity as we've seen for the past 10 years.
04:25 It doesn't exist.
04:26 Exactly.
04:27 That's what they want to do.
04:28 And this pact doesn't change anything when it comes to solidarity.
04:31 So there will be no real relocation of people across Europe.
04:35 There will be stronger border procedures.
04:37 There will be more prison camps, if you want, at our borders.
04:40 So from the content of what we agreed, I'm sorry, but I cannot find this good.
04:44 And I've seen there was outrage in a number of national medias, Laura, this week.
04:48 Many arguing they don't want to be told what to do by Brussels.
04:52 They want to have control over their immigration policies,
04:55 arguing that their governments were just kind of shoving this under the carpet without consulting them.
05:00 But this, of course, is about stopping irregular migration.
05:03 Has the message not been clear?
05:05 Well, I think what it tells us is that every country experiences irregular migration and migration in different ways.
05:11 So Ireland, which is one of the countries that was really kicking off, you know, it's a small island.
05:15 It's up in the northwest of the EU.
05:18 It's in the Atlantic.
05:19 It's always had a special deal on certain things.
05:21 Their experience of irregular migration is going to be very different from, say, if you're in Italy or even the Polish experience,
05:27 where they've taken a huge number of refugees from Ukraine.
05:30 There's been the whole border issue with Belarus.
05:33 So every country experiences migration and irregular migration very differently.
05:36 And they do want to have the sovereignty over it.
05:38 I mean, if you think about what Brexit was about, it was let's take back control of our borders.
05:43 Now, we can discuss whether this is a myth, but that idea of sovereignty really plays into we get to control who comes in.
05:49 And this is the argument, Damian, we're hearing this week in Ireland.
05:51 They're saying we don't want to welcome anyone.
05:53 We don't want to have solidarity.
05:55 We don't want anyone else coming to our country.
05:57 Yeah, I think you can see how strange the discussion about migration is.
06:02 I mean, there's no far right party that didn't grow on this topic across Europe.
06:07 They all grew on the topic of migration because it is this really old narrative of us versus them.
06:12 And it works very well because you can picture people.
06:15 But first of all, we have a lot more migration that is coming in for labor.
06:19 I think that's super important.
06:20 That's why I would really like to almost get away from the term migration system and call this an asylum system.
06:26 And now the question is, does this asylum system that we have built actually help with anything?
06:31 You talked about how the effect on the countries is, but what's the effect on the people who are vulnerable, the asylum seekers themselves?
06:38 And here I fear that, you know, where we made a good experience in Poland and the rest of the EU with the Ukrainians and the temporary protection status.
06:46 So this fact that they could just go to an authority and get a visa, if you want.
06:50 That we are throwing all of this completely out of the window.
06:54 We have now more lengthy procedures, more people in camps, which will be more traumatized.
06:59 So I don't really see how this is going to help.
07:01 And summer is coming, of course, and we'll see more people arriving.
07:04 We saw a couple of deaths just this week off the Greece island and 400 people have died already on their way to Europe this week.
07:11 But the problem here really is for the for the left groups, Damien, it's to right wing this policy.
07:16 And for the right groups, it's to left wing.
07:19 And it's curious here we're seeing as well the far right and the far left united here.
07:23 Yeah, but from my point of view, it's a stroke of good balance, because if you are to right wing for the left and to left wing for the rights, it's a centered approach.
07:33 And I think that's a bit of a fallacy, to be honest, because I'm not neither left nor right.
07:37 And I fear that, you know, just saying, oh, the far right is never happy because we didn't actually build walls.
07:43 They don't want to find solutions on migration, to be very clear.
07:45 They don't want to find solutions.
07:47 I would never see my position similar to the position of a far right.
07:50 No, no, no, no. That's very clear.
07:53 They come from different angles.
07:54 But I think the problem is that some people deny that there are mixed migration flows.
08:00 There are people arriving in Europe, fleeing from war, fleeing from persecution in their country.
08:06 And they're mixed with people wanting to seek a job.
08:10 So both arrive at the same time.
08:13 They arrive with the same migration flows.
08:15 And in a certain way, you have to, as we want to help those who are in need of help, we need to find a way in order to, yeah, to do a kind of prioritization of those who are in need of help.
08:33 And so we do those checks at the border and we will try to get out or get rid of those who are just claiming.
08:45 And the idea is to use detention centers, essentially, in order to do this.
08:48 Yeah, but detention center is a strong word.
08:51 It's a strong word.
08:52 But indeed, they will be kept for a short period at the border where you have this border procedure.
09:00 And then they're channeled to the next procedure.
09:04 You can be in these procedures, these so-called border procedures, and they're looked at the camps with the barbed wire, like three, four layers of barbed wire.
09:11 You can be there more than a year if you take all the different periods together.
09:16 But that's not the aim.
09:17 The aim is to have quick procedures.
09:19 And, I mean, you draw a picture of barbed wire.
09:22 And if you look at Moria, for example, on Lesbos, this camp, which was disgusting, there was even European money available, but the government did not use it.
09:33 And the idea, of course, with this pact looking ahead is meant to fix these problems, right?
09:36 I mean, Laura, do you see the benefits of having a pan-European migration pact like this?
09:40 Will it settle the queries and concerns of people?
09:43 Because it just seems to be igniting them.
09:44 Well, I can understand the politics of having a pact.
09:47 We'd have to see what happens on the ground with the implementation, whether it is brushing the problem away or if it's actually going to do anything.
09:55 I think that politically it does give some politicians some red meat, if that's the right word, ahead of the EU elections.
10:03 So, for example, Emmanuel Macron, we know, is going to campaign on this against Marine Le Pen in the European elections.
10:08 Whether or not that's walking into a trap is another matter, because actually immigration is an issue for the far right.
10:14 They make it an issue for their electorates, but that doesn't mean it's a massive issue for everybody else until it starts being talked about.
10:20 And then suddenly it's like, oh, immigration, it's the thing that worries everyone.
10:23 So we need to be careful what we wish for here, because, you know, and then people such as Damien or people who voted for him, they're going to be disgusted by this, actually.
10:32 Because when we get to a situation where children are being detained or fingerprinted or, you know, all the rest of that, that is grubby, frankly.
10:39 Your voters will be disgusted. And I think the word you mentioned there, Laura, was key, implementation, because we've already seen the reaction from a number of governments.
10:48 Poland, Hungary have already said that they do not support this pact.
10:52 We saw Viktor Orban saying on Twitter this was the final nail in the coffin of the European Union.
10:57 This is the right same pact that he will have to communicate and sell to his people.
11:02 First of all, I think we walked into a trap of constantly talking about asylum in the sense of boats.
11:07 Even here in the background, I see now, you know, migration equals boats.
11:11 This is the image that is in the minds of the people.
11:14 So the first thing that we have to do is get away from talking constantly about asylum, which is one of a lot of issues that Europe has to deal with in general.
11:22 So that's the first one. The second point is, yes, because of this pressure from the far right, we have been trying to be more restrictive.
11:29 You can say this in different ways, but it's a more.
11:32 And I think the what we will find out will create more images of people in camps, even if they're less people.
11:39 And this will drive the far right vote even further.
11:42 I think what we should have done is quite simple. Distribute the people across Europe.
11:46 Go through fast asylum procedures. And yes, if there is a no at the end, you do not get asylum.
11:50 We only have the right to seek asylum, not to get it.
11:53 Then there should be some form of return. But if returns don't work, then you at least distributed across the European continent and you can go.
12:00 Of course, I fully agree with this, but there's no political majority for this among the member states.
12:06 And that's why they will not. That's why we that's why we voted on something worse.
12:10 Now that the state is called. I'm very much convinced of this.
12:13 I've seen more when it was full with 20,000 people and nobody wants this again.
12:17 But this is not the current situation. And that's why member states are allowed pay their way out. Right.
12:21 They are allowed to pay their way out. But I think you have some countries saying that they don't even want to pay their way out either.
12:26 They don't think they should have to. So it does seem this point about forced solidarity that you were talking about.
12:31 I mean, it doesn't exist. It hasn't improved solidarity. It seems to be very transactional.
12:35 I think your point also about the images of the far right in the camps.
12:38 We should also remember climate change is going to make this situation much worse.
12:41 People are going to want to move out of areas. And I'm not even talking about asylum or fleeing war or conflict here.
12:47 When job opportunities dry up, when there are issues over resources, people are going to want to move and they are going to want to go to what they perceive to be richer places.
12:55 And I do think some of this packed by the sounds of things is not going to address the fundamental causes of why people leave their countries in the first place.
13:03 And so I think the question is, can we build the perfect system? And it will be very difficult.
13:08 But I think there's a couple of rules for me. First, you do not put human beings into camps. I'm sorry, but I don't think that's a good idea.
13:14 Second, you should try to ensure that the process of asylum is very fast and that people can be at the point where they need to be integrated later on.
13:23 And a little bracket here in Germany, I think once asylum procedures were actually looked at and not because of Dublin, they were already in Greece registered.
13:31 It's still pretty high, the percentage of people that actually deserve asylum.
13:35 So, yeah, so this whole reality on the ground, they're not happening as fast as you would like them to see.
13:41 Exactly. But I think what we did now is the exact opposite. We try to keep everyone at the borders in camps, which will not help.
13:47 People will try to sideline the official asylum system, even if they would have the right to seek asylum.
13:51 We also create this new thing in admissibility that basically if you came through Turkey, which is a safe third country, like you could have stayed there, basically.
14:01 Your asylum procedure is not even going to start. So you again...
14:05 That's not true. That's not true. It depends on the case.
14:09 So if you only pass through, for example, for a short period because it was fleeing war from Syria, those are not inadmissible. That's not true.
14:18 But what is true is you can pay your way out. And I think this is something our viewers are very interested in.
14:23 This idea that governments can pay. How will that work?
14:26 We have a solidarity mechanism in there. There's a solidarity mechanism if a lot of people arriving in one country and this country claims help from the European Union,
14:35 the Commission will have a look at it and then say, OK, we will ask member states of the European Union to take over migrants arriving in Malta, for example, or Greece or wherever.
14:47 And then every country has a share. And if there are countries not willing to take them, they have a fine to pay.
14:59 So there's actually an obligation to take people. But if this obligation is not used, they pay a fine of 20,000 euro per person.
15:10 So that's the way it works. So for the first time ever, there's a solidarity mechanism in there.
15:17 There have been solidarity mechanisms before, but they were all not binding.
15:23 So we had the Valletta Agreement where people, where countries agreed on distributing people arriving via boat.
15:31 I just want to do one sentence very briefly, very briefly, that Damien is right.
15:37 We need to get rid of this image that all of them arrive via boat, via the Mediterranean.
15:42 This is not true. Most of them don't arrive this way.
15:45 Laura, I just want to say it shouldn't be called a solidarity mechanism because it's very far removed from solidarity.
15:50 And that's, of course, why NGOs are furious. Even this week, as those votes were taking place, we could hear protesters in the in the chamber shouting,
15:58 do not vote on this pact. This pact kills. I believe you were in the room.
16:02 But also 161 organisations and members of civil society called on MEPs to ditch the pact.
16:08 They do not like it because they will see young families and children being detained at the borders, increased returns, lower safeguards and more pushbacks and increased mass surveillance as well of migrants and people of colour.
16:21 And we should also remember that there have been various deals that have been done with governments such as Tunisia,
16:27 which don't have the greatest human rights records or the processes in place to do rapid asylum processing either.
16:35 And there have been reports of violence, of human rights abuses and pushback.
16:38 So it does just feel like the EU is outsourcing a lot of this dirty work to other countries,
16:44 which if you are somebody who wants to vote for the EU, wants to believe in the idea of Europe and upholding standards and human rights, it makes that very difficult to sell.
16:53 I think there's this illusion that you cannot build a system that works more in a more humane way.
16:57 And if we look at what we have currently agreed, I feel that for the countries at the border, it's not going to be a big help.
17:03 When you look at the people who are in a vulnerable position, who need to be going through these procedures fast and then integrated fast so that they're not traumatised, it's not a good result.
17:12 But if you look at what people in the normal population will see when they hear about asylum, I think they will see these border camps now with barbed wire.
17:21 But then it's side out of mind. People do not have that much solidarity.
17:25 The reality is that the far right will definitely use these pictures of people.
17:30 Not just the far right. I'm talking about the centre right as well.
17:33 I think we have to grow up in terms of how we speak about asylum.
17:37 Just to give you a random example, in the last German general election, the term migration was not used in any of the chancellors' debates because people are afraid to even talk about migration.
17:48 So I think, and there we very much agree, we need to talk about labour migration and that we are in a competition for international talent right now.
17:56 We have shitty demographics. We have to really wake up and become immigration societies in a way that is more positive and not let ourselves be driven by a far right.
18:06 Interesting point. People are afraid even to mention that.
18:08 You'll be campaigning in the next couple of months. How will you be approaching this topic?
18:13 To be honest, it's true. I'm working on migration since 15 years.
18:17 For example, I stopped talking about migration on social media because you have so much shit talk in these posts that you cannot even manage this.
18:31 So it's a problematic situation. But I just want to say that in this pact there are not only negative points.
18:39 There is as well, we harmonise standards on reception conditions, for example, there are very good points that you voted by the way.
18:48 So it's not only black and white here.
18:51 Well nothing is just black and white. Laura?
18:53 For the voters who really care about this, it's really going to matter.
18:56 I'm just thinking about this from the perspective that we have elections in two months, European elections.
19:01 To the voters that this really matters to, it's going to be an issue for them going into this.
19:05 My advice would be to politicians such as yourself who don't want to talk about it, don't talk about it until you're asked,
19:11 and focus on the things that actually matter that are major concerns.
19:15 So even in the UK, I know it's not in the EU anymore, but the whole small boats thing, Rwanda stuff, it matters to a small proportion of very right wing voters.
19:24 Other people, they care way more about the NHS and the cost of living.
19:28 They don't like seeing people in boats. I know we need to get away from this idea that it's just people in boats, but it is not their top concern.
19:34 That's a very interesting conclusion, but that brings this discussion to an end.
19:38 For more details of course, you can visit Euronews.com.
19:42 But for now, stay with us here on Euronews, because shortly we'll be telling you why everyone in this town is talking about the new president of Slovakia,
19:49 even though his powers are rather limited.
19:52 [Music]
20:00 Welcome back to Brussels, my love, with me Maeve McMahan, where we're taking a look back at the week in European politics.
20:07 Well, this week saw a new face arrive on the political scene in Europe.
20:12 Now, he doesn't have a whole lot of power, but the new president of Slovakia has made headlines all across Europe.
20:18 Peter Pellegrini won on a pro-Slovakia ticket, promising to put his country first, but staying a loyal member of international institutions and bodies.
20:27 Was there much talk about Peter Pellegrini this week in the European Parliament?
20:31 To be honest, there was quite some concern in the Parliament, because we see another government emerging very critical to what's happening in Brussels,
20:44 and not willing to be part of finding reasonable compromises.
20:50 But that's what we need in Brussels, right?
20:52 Compromises, of course.
20:54 So people coming in.
20:55 So is Slovakia Europe's new problem child, given the Prime Minister, Robert Fischl, has already, as you said, clashed, and now his friend and ally will be the president?
21:03 I think it's a very concerning direction that we see.
21:05 I mean, I was in Ukraine when he got elected, actually, this week.
21:08 And I mean, obviously, it makes you a bit concerned if you see that we have literally a dictator, Putin, running into Ukraine, trying to win over territory.
21:19 And then within the European Union, we are weakening the stance of support for Ukraine.
21:24 I think that is very scary.
21:26 But it's not only about the foreign policy.
21:27 It's also about democracy.
21:29 It's about the rule of law.
21:30 I think it's very, very scary.
21:31 But on foreign policy, that's how I think he won the elections, putting billboards all over Slovakia, saying, we will not send you to Ukraine to fight.
21:37 We can take a listen now to the new president, Peter Pellegrini, who will be taking up his job in a few months.
21:42 Slovakia will always stay Slovakia.
21:44 Slovakia will never be Czech Republic, never will be Poland, never will be United States, and also not Hungary.
21:51 We will stay a sovereign Slovak Republic with our own ideas, our own brain, and our own traditions, and so on.
21:58 We are a member of NATO, and it will continue.
22:04 So it is not any turn towards Moscow or something like that.
22:07 Only because we have our own opinion doesn't mean that we are changing our international policy.
22:13 Peter Pellegrini there, promising that he will be a loyal member still of NATO, but he's very close to Moscow, in fact.
22:19 And we've seen the Slovakian foreign minister, Laura, recently travel or speak to Sergey Lavrov.
22:24 And also, Fico, the prime minister, did actually also stop arms exports going to Ukraine.
22:31 So I think actions do speak louder than words.
22:34 But I think what's interesting here is that Slovakia, like Hungary, is placing a huge emphasis on national sovereignty, independence,
22:42 and you don't get to push this around.
22:44 But at the end of the day, they still want to be part of this EU family, because they get more out of it from being inside than they do from outside.
22:50 So I think we can expect difficulty and tough talk and a lot of messing around.
22:54 And yes, encroachment on media and civil society, which is not great.
22:58 But I don't think we're looking at a situation where these countries are going to look for the door to leave, because where are they going to go?
23:05 Well, on that point on encroachment on the media, actually, we wanted to hear from a Slovakian and hear how Slovakians felt about this recent election of Peter Pellegrini.
23:13 So we caught up with the Slovakian journalist who's based here in Brussels, Jaromir Novak.
23:18 I'm not sure if you can say that he's openly pro-Russian, but he's started to use this narrative that we have to stop a war in Ukraine.
23:27 Never at all talking about that we have to stop the aggressor, which is Russia.
23:32 So but we are talking in general about we have to stop a war.
23:35 But we have in the same times 30, maybe 40 percent of people spreading more and more pro-Moscow narratives.
23:43 And they are pro-Moscow-oriented, which is really worrying.
23:46 Talking about the society, it is really possible that Slovakia will shift more and more towards the Hungarian path.
23:54 We already feel that in our newspapers and our agencies and our TV, there are more and more pressure.
24:01 Even I start to feel in my agency and it's coming from the government or from the political parties who are in government.
24:08 Jaromir Novak, you can see the heat is already on.
24:11 We're hearing there from he's been a reporter for many, many years.
24:13 And we all remember the awful murder as well of the investigative journalist.
24:17 Well, I was going to say that's what brought the last FIAT government down and sent them into the wilderness for a few years.
24:22 And I think it's also important to remember that the outgoing president, I've forgotten her name, Susanna Kaputová.
24:30 Kaputová was here in Brussels this week.
24:32 Yeah, but she said her reason for not running again was because she was getting death threats.
24:35 I mean, none of this is a sign of a healthy system.
24:38 Now, I know that unfortunately we're living in an age where politicians, particularly women politicians,
24:42 are getting more of this kind of abuse leveled at them.
24:45 But when you have a president of a country saying that her main reason for not running again is death threats,
24:50 that's not a sign of a healthy democracy.
24:53 Well, the prime minister, I believe, has called journalists snakes and prostitutes and mad
24:57 and called and wants to give NGO funding in fact to pensioners.
25:01 I think the issue here is very well, as you said, that we shouldn't mix this up with being more conservative, for example, or more right wing.
25:09 This is not the problem. The problem is that they are anti-democratic.
25:13 And we have seen this also with, you know, Orbán.
25:16 They're constantly trying to say, yeah, I'm just more conservative and you don't like this in the EU.
25:21 No, the problem with Orbán and with FIATSO and also with this guy is that they're anti-democratic in the sense that they don't like journalists questioning them,
25:28 that they want to concentrate power, that they are corrupt.
25:31 It's very Trumpy.
25:32 Well, Victor Orbán will be in Brussels next week giving a speech at the Conservatives Conference.
25:35 So I'll be doing my best to try and interview him and have some questions with him.
25:39 Good luck.
25:40 But what can be done really here?
25:42 What leverage does the Commission or you as an MEP have when you see situations like this and so much pressure on the media?
25:48 But we have leverage if there's actually media freedom shrinking, if there's actually things happening like we saw in Hungary,
25:58 like we saw in Poland where the freedom of the justice was not guaranteed.
26:05 There we have leverage about money.
26:08 And it's good because this is something we achieved in this mandate.
26:12 But at the moment, we cannot do a lot if they want to have a pro-Russian stance.
26:19 This is their choice.
26:20 But at the end, we have this problem that Russian interference in Europe is growing, and that's very worrying.
26:26 I just have actually a question for you.
26:28 Did the leverage with the money work, though, with Hungary and with Poland before?
26:31 Because it felt like it was all very tangled up and fraught and it didn't – you know, it took ages and it didn't really get anywhere.
26:37 So do we actually know that being able to withhold funds makes a difference?
26:40 I think that's a whole other space.
26:42 But I think it does.
26:44 To be very clear, before we had no leverage.
26:47 Now we have the leverage of money.
26:48 It's better to have a leverage than to have no leverage.
26:51 Does it work at the end?
26:52 I don't know, but I think it –
26:54 I think the other EU leaders also need to wake up.
27:01 I still, you know, hear Scholz talking about Hungary or Slovakia as a foreign policy issue.
27:07 This is not a foreign policy issue.
27:09 This is an internal EU issue, and they need to also take up the responsibility.
27:13 We can take away voting rights.
27:15 We can take away a lot of cash.
27:17 But for that, you know, there needs to be an awakening in the Spanish prime minister and the German chancellor.
27:22 Well, let's see if it comes up next week.
27:24 Of course, there is an EU leaders' summit taking place here in Brussels.
27:27 But that wraps this discussion.
27:29 Thank you so much to our panel for being with us, and thank you so much for watching.
27:33 We'll see you soon here on Euronews.
27:35 And if you want more analysis, check out euronews.com.
27:38 [MUSIC]
27:46 Welcome back to Brussels My Love, Euronews' weekend talk show.
27:50 I'm Maeve McMahon, and along with my guests,
27:52 we're taking a look back at some of the stories in the news this week.
27:56 Now, this week, MEPs met for a mini plenary session here in Brussels
28:00 before their last mammoth session in Strasbourg at the end of the month.
28:04 And one topic on many lips was a letter sent to the Commission President Ursula von der Leyen
28:10 about her decision to hire Germany's Markus Pieper, an MEP, a former MEP,
28:15 to a brand-new post of the SME Enterprise Envoy.
28:18 Now, it's a new job, and it comes with a very handsome salary of over €19,000.
28:23 This appointment has raised a lot of questions about Ursula von der Leyen's transparencies,
28:27 and MEPs even had a vote this Thursday in Brussels about whether or not they could cancel this appointment.
28:33 How did you vote?
28:34 In favour.
28:35 As in in favour of having this position taken away from Markus Pieper?
28:40 Yes, because this has not been a proper process.
28:44 For me, you should choose the best person, and not the person that's this close to your political views.
28:50 Indeed, it's important to remind our viewers that this is a colleague, a friend,
28:53 from the same political group as Ursula von der Leyen.
28:56 Laura, your take on this? Did it reach your radar?
28:58 It did reach my radar.
29:00 I don't know how much of the radar it will reach of people who aren't German, perhaps,
29:04 because obviously he was a political figure over there as well.
29:07 But I think that she has got some problems associated with her.
29:11 You know, getting the next candidature to be President again of the European Commission is far from guaranteed,
29:17 and even within her own party it's not completely sure she has all the votes, even though they say that they do.
29:22 But I don't think it's going to have a huge impact outside Brussels, beyond Germany perhaps,
29:26 because they know who Markus Pieper is.
29:27 What was your take on this? How did you vote?
29:29 So, for me, the core problem is that von der Leyen is campaigning towards her own party,
29:34 and that's the only thing that matters, and then she's campaigning towards the 27 national leaders,
29:38 because they are the ones who actually will appoint her.
29:40 We will have some form of a vote, but with this kind of little tricks that she did now,
29:44 she's getting the leadership of the conservatives behind her.
29:47 Why did she appoint Mr Pieper?
29:49 Because it was getting a bit tight on the list in his region,
29:53 because of the CDU currently introducing a quota also, a gender quota, so it was getting a bit tight.
30:00 So they needed to find some room.
30:02 They found some room in the European Commission, and then they put him there.
30:05 So I think we need to wake up a bit to why these things are happening,
30:09 and they're happening because von der Leyen is accountable not to European citizens by the votes that she's like a real candidate.
30:15 She's not even running in any region of Germany. She could have.
30:18 Her name's not even on the ballot.
30:20 One man who's not very happy about that is her colleague and former EU Commissioner Thierry Preton,
30:27 the Frenchman in charge of industry.
30:29 He's been taking to Twitter a lot lately to criticise her.
30:32 Even the day that she got endorsed by her party in Bucharest a few weeks ago,
30:36 he said despite her qualities, she's been outvoted by her own party,
30:40 and the question is can we entrust her with running the EPP for another five years?
30:44 I find that fascinating because you've got to wonder where Macron sits on this as well.
30:48 It's hard to imagine that Thierry Preton, who is very close to Macron,
30:51 was putting this stuff out there without some kind of sanction or some nod on the wink from Paris,
30:57 and yet at the same time, Macron has been very open about saying he wants her to get another term.
31:02 So I don't know what's going on there, but I think this breaking of cover is quite an interesting development.
31:09 It was a very strange tweet, stabbing his boss right in the back there, and he was bragging about it then.
31:14 And saying that Macron...
31:15 But he's right. But he's right.
31:17 Thierry Preton's right?
31:19 Yes, I think he's right. This is a really problematic situation,
31:24 and as a Commission President, she should not use her position like this.
31:29 Yes, and we need to remember that she wasn't voted in last time.
31:32 She was the candidate who was the compromise, who was pushed in right towards the end,
31:37 and on top of that, I think it was some socialist or something...
31:40 So who should be the next Commission President?
31:42 We will have a candidate that is proposed by the Member States, and we will see who it is.
31:45 And who do you think should it be?
31:47 I think it should be someone that is actually going to the citizens and saying,
31:50 "Here's what I will do over the next five years. Please vote for my political group, my political direction,
31:55 and then I'll deliver." But we don't see that yet.
31:57 So the Conservative candidate doesn't care about campaigning,
32:00 and is maybe even legally not allowed to do it.
32:02 Then we have the Social Democratic candidate that nobody knows.
32:05 I don't know if anyone...
32:06 Schmidt, indeed. Thank you so much to our panel this weekend.
32:09 Jan Christoph Ullin, Laura Shields, and Damien Busselager for being with us here.
32:13 And as usual, if you have any comments or any topics that you'd like us to dive into,
32:17 reach out on brusselsmylove@euronews.com.
32:21 We're also on social media, Instagram, X, and even TikTok.
32:24 See you soon on Euronews.
32:26 ♪