POGO BAN Paano isasagawa ng PAGCOR ang pagpapasara sa mga POGO? | The Mangahas Interviews
“Effective today, all POGOs are banned.”
Ito ang naging pahayag ni President Ferdinand “Bongbong” Marcos Jr. sa katatapos lang niya na State of the Nation Address (SONA) noong July 22 kung saan tuluyan na niyang ipinagbawal ang pag-operate ng mga Philippine Offshore Gaming Operators o POGO sa bansa.
Ayon naman sa Philippine Amusement and Gaming Corporation (PAGCOR) , tinatayang nasa 40,000 Pinoy na nagtatrabaho sa 43 na mga legal na POGO ang maaapektuhan sa kautusang ito ng pangulo.
Ang plano ng PAGCOR sa pagpapatupad ng total POGO ban at sa mga manggagawang Pilipino na mawawalan ng trabaho, alamin kay PAGCOR chairperson and CEO Alejandro Tengco sa #TheMangahasInterviews.
Ito ang naging pahayag ni President Ferdinand “Bongbong” Marcos Jr. sa katatapos lang niya na State of the Nation Address (SONA) noong July 22 kung saan tuluyan na niyang ipinagbawal ang pag-operate ng mga Philippine Offshore Gaming Operators o POGO sa bansa.
Ayon naman sa Philippine Amusement and Gaming Corporation (PAGCOR) , tinatayang nasa 40,000 Pinoy na nagtatrabaho sa 43 na mga legal na POGO ang maaapektuhan sa kautusang ito ng pangulo.
Ang plano ng PAGCOR sa pagpapatupad ng total POGO ban at sa mga manggagawang Pilipino na mawawalan ng trabaho, alamin kay PAGCOR chairperson and CEO Alejandro Tengco sa #TheMangahasInterviews.
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NewsTranscript
00:00:00On the President's order, all POGOs with licenses will be closed in December.
00:00:12The problem is, those without licenses will continue the illegal operation.
00:00:19Let's talk about this with the Chairman and CEO of PagPort, Mr. Al Tengco.
00:00:26Good day, Mr. Tengco.
00:00:28Good day to you, Ma'am Malu, and to all the listeners of your program.
00:00:34Okay. Do you have a detailed plan, step-by-step, on how to close the POGOs?
00:00:42It's like this. You know, the President ordered this last Sunday, July 22, Monday night.
00:00:54The next day, I arranged and talked to the team in PagPort.
00:01:04We were hit by a typhoon and heavy rain due to the low tide.
00:01:11My priority was to prioritize the relief operations of PagPort last Sunday,
00:01:19where we were able to visit several cities and municipalities in Metro Manila,
00:01:26as well as provinces like Bulacan and Pampanga.
00:01:32The truth is, yesterday, we had a meeting.
00:01:37You may have heard that we attended a hearing in the Senate yesterday regarding this issue.
00:01:46The good news, to answer your question, we held a meeting of the Department of Labor and Employment.
00:01:57It was led by Secretary Benny Guzman.
00:02:01As you may remember, the President's order was not limited to PagPort.
00:02:09After he announced that he will instruct PagPort to wind down the POGO operations,
00:02:23there was a pandemonium inside the Congress.
00:02:26But the next thing he said was, I'm ordering DOLE and my economic managers to talk
00:02:41so that we can see how we can improve the welfare of our Filipino workers.
00:02:52Just as a brief background, that's why I mentioned it,
00:02:56your service to Secretary Benny Guzman is now in progress.
00:03:01Okay.
00:03:02He's with DOLE's director in NCR, Director Bambi, and his two assets.
00:03:15PagPort is also with the head of the Overseas Gaming Licensing Department and the OIC of PagPort's legal department.
00:03:29Let's talk about the number involved.
00:03:33How many POGOs will be closed and what is the winding down process?
00:03:40How will they be warned that sorry guys, time's up?
00:03:44First, I want to clarify, the ban that the President ordered is for all, not just POGOs.
00:03:57I want to clarify, first of all, during the middle of last year, 2023,
00:04:09we should have declared in the probationary status that there are 298 POGOs, more or less,
00:04:18that I have already reached with a license.
00:04:22That's 498 that I have already reached.
00:04:27Okay. After the follow-up, after the consultation, we were informed, we were not only informed,
00:04:39but we also saw that the licensees that I'm referring to are no longer involved in the gaming operations.
00:04:48They are now profiteers.
00:04:50What now?
00:04:51More or less.
00:04:52What they are doing is not gaming anymore.
00:04:56They are now criminal impetus.
00:04:58Okay.
00:04:58Okay.
00:04:59There is a credit card fraud.
00:05:02There are investment scams where they are soliciting investment from senior citizens,
00:05:11not only from the Philippines, but also from America, Japan, China, and other countries.
00:05:19All right. Okay.
00:05:20Third, they have a love match where the Filipinos are soliciting from a foreigner.
00:05:29There's nothing they can do if the foreigner is not just cheating on their love match.
00:05:41So after we saw that, we immediately decided to declare the status of all of them as professionals.
00:05:51Of all of them, 290 plus.
00:05:54Okay. That was last January, a little less than that, and we asked them to reapply again.
00:06:03Okay.
00:06:04Because we saw, and aside from that, we also changed the balance and guidelines of overseas gaming licenses.
00:06:17Because the image of the term POGO is very bad, we should have rebranded it.
00:06:28IGN.
00:06:29That's why it became Internet Gaming Licenses.
00:06:33Okay.
00:06:34So that way, we're able to distinguish between the legal and the illegals.
00:06:41Okay. So in short, it's confusing, 38, 41.
00:06:46No. The explanation for now is that when we purged the list, the number fell to 46.
00:06:57All right. 46. Okay.
00:06:59When it fell to 46, the monitoring was suspended. The enforcement was suspended.
00:07:06Three of them are suspended at the moment.
00:07:10So in short, this is what we're talking about.
00:07:14There are 43 now who have licenses that we call Internet Gaming Licenses.
00:07:24Please explain Chairman.
00:07:26We have the so-called POGO, the IGLs of your licenses.
00:07:31There are also support services in your registration.
00:07:37It seems like in your list, April 2023, it's still long.
00:07:42The Anti-Money Laundering Council said there are still many, not just 43.
00:07:48What is the truth?
00:07:50The 298 that I mentioned to you, the 298 that I reached when I was appointed as the chairman and CEO,
00:08:02the 298 is now complete.
00:08:06All of them?
00:08:07Including the master licensee.
00:08:10Okay.
00:08:11They have service providers.
00:08:13All right.
00:08:14Where the service provider should only do is backroom operations, IT support, customer service,
00:08:23all of those are included.
00:08:26We have, during the time we strengthened it, the so-called special BPO.
00:08:33Okay.
00:08:34What does a special BPO do?
00:08:38The special BPO, you know gaming is all over the world now.
00:08:44It's like a hot pan de salt.
00:08:47If we go around the world, gaming is the primary thing that the government or government is doing in every jurisdiction of money.
00:09:03They regulate, they collect.
00:09:06The truth is, I don't know if you've read it, in one day, they announced, can you imagine, United Arab Emirates?
00:09:14Correct.
00:09:15They announced that they will open gaming and the first thing they will have is an electronic lotto.
00:09:23Okay. All right.
00:09:25So what does the support services do?
00:09:29What they do is, their primary role is to support the master licensee.
00:09:38Okay. All right.
00:09:40What happened is, Ma'am Malu, it's not like that.
00:09:43Yes.
00:09:44What happened is, you have a master licensee, under him, there are ten service providers that were involved in the administration.
00:09:54These ten should not accept any type of payment.
00:10:03You know what happened.
00:10:05They are the ones who accept the payment and the painful part is, even if it's a fee, they don't pay for the service.
00:10:13Okay. In the Senate, Senator Riza Ontiveros called for a corporate bail, the layering that's happening.
00:10:21You said there's a master licensee, it looks like there's a sub-licensee, these service providers,
00:10:27and it looks like there's no clear legal status.
00:10:32But how did it happen that they are not in the lotto?
00:10:37Because it looks like that's our problem now, not just corporate bail, but blanket.
00:10:42There's a lot happening.
00:10:44Ma'am Malu, I cannot talk about the shortcomings or what was done in the last administration.
00:10:54That's why I told you, if I may continue my explanation, we listed those service providers.
00:11:06We really commanded, together with the guidelines, together with the Balangkas, the new IGLs,
00:11:13that they cannot accept any type of payment from the so-called service providers.
00:11:22What they can do is the following. First, tightly backed office support.
00:11:30All right.
00:11:31Number two, customer service.
00:11:34All right.
00:11:35Third, they can use it as their daily assistance.
00:11:49Backed office support.
00:11:51Okay.
00:11:53So IT, backed office support, and that's it.
00:11:59Customer service.
00:12:01Okay. Third.
00:12:03You were caught.
00:12:05First, you need to write a report so you can justify why we need to give you SP.
00:12:13All right. Okay.
00:12:15Not all of them. To prove it to you that the Balangkas became good, not all of them will ask for a license to be a service provider.
00:12:28All right. Okay.
00:12:30So that means they cannot be abused.
00:12:32Second, we do not allow up to 10 service providers to have one master licensee.
00:12:41Now, it's one is to one.
00:12:44If your application for a service provider license is approved, you can have only one for each master licensee.
00:12:56Okay. So in a good way, when you saw that, Chairman, in 2022, you were placed in the PAGCOR.
00:13:03Now, the issues are popping up, human trafficking, torture, etc.
00:13:09What happened is that there's a need for a deluge of opposition in Pogo, that's why President BBM declared a total ban.
00:13:20What happened in between 2022 and now, July 2024?
00:13:25Do you have a clear...
00:13:27The clear thing is, I assumed office date August 2022.
00:13:34Correct. Yes.
00:13:36I will confront you, Malu, and all of your listeners.
00:13:40What I thought in the beginning is that this is just revenue shaving.
00:13:44Meaning, they were not remitting the proper license fees to PAGCOR.
00:13:53Because the first thing I saw, ma'am, is that the collection is very low.
00:13:57Again.
00:13:59So I said, this is revenue shaving. It's reducing the revenue by 2 percent, which is a big decrease.
00:14:10Immediately, because that's the only thing I saw, we're about to enter.
00:14:16Immediately, what I did was I ordered all operators to pay an additional 20 percent.
00:14:27Okay.
00:14:29It didn't take long for everyone to pay an additional 20 percent.
00:14:35So I will further confront you. I'm happy because I will gradually increase the income.
00:14:44When it comes to 2024, I asked for an additional 20 percent and they paid it.
00:14:54Okay.
00:14:56What I said to myself is that I'm getting better because I'm getting the hang of it.
00:15:02Until May 5, 2024, the issue that we received an SOS message from a foreign nation
00:15:23that an embassy of a country nearby intervened in our region.
00:15:34They are asking for help because they are being forced by their employees.
00:15:44First, they did something bad.
00:15:48Second, they already took their passports and they are not being allowed to leave the compound.
00:15:57All right. Okay.
00:15:59Did this SOS come from the embassy of China?
00:16:03No.
00:16:05It's an Indonesian national.
00:16:08Okay. Indonesian national.
00:16:10The ambassador of Indonesia was able to contact PAOK, TF and Executive Secretary Lucas Bersinil.
00:16:18All right. Okay.
00:16:20Before that, there was a hearing in the Senate because there were inquiries about citizenship and compound in Bambantarla.
00:16:29After that, it was in Pampanga.
00:16:31What happened inside the PAGCOR?
00:16:34Do you have a parallel inquiry that was launched?
00:16:37Because they said that it's not just these two places that have problems, there are many in Metro Manila.
00:16:44There are many...
00:16:46First, let's go to what happened to the SOS.
00:16:51That's the reason why when I saw criminal activities,
00:17:02we are seeing signs of torture, ongoing human trafficking problems.
00:17:12That's when everything was changed and declared probationary.
00:17:18So this was in June or July, middle of last year.
00:17:23Okay. May 30.
00:17:25That's why they immediately cancelled the license of those who are no longer eligible.
00:17:31And the truth is, there are more than 130 or 150 who did not apply.
00:17:42They know that they will not be able to implement the new policies of the new licenses that we will introduce.
00:17:54That's why the result is that there are 46 people left.
00:17:58Okay. Wait a minute.
00:18:00Now you're asking, I will just add.
00:18:02You said that in Pamban and Bora.
00:18:04The truth is, in our jurisdiction, they don't have licenses anymore.
00:18:10Okay. All right.
00:18:12If you add the comment that there are many people who are still on the streets,
00:18:16let's just think that it's this simple.
00:18:19It started with 278 people.
00:18:23Now it's 40.
00:18:25It's a simple math. Let's just make it 50.
00:18:28They make 250 and they are hiding everywhere.
00:18:33They don't have licenses.
00:18:34None. All of their operations are illegal.
00:18:38That's why they are still in our jurisdiction.
00:18:43All right.
00:18:44So Chairman, that's the concern of some.
00:18:46When you said that they don't have licenses and you declared it illegal, what is the next step?
00:18:51Are you asking for help from the police or the NBI to padlock and take all the documents,
00:19:01to save the people, whether they are Filipinos or non-Filipinos,
00:19:05in the places that you're saying are 250 illegal?
00:19:09You know, Ma'am Malu,
00:19:11we have been coordinating with the leading agency now,
00:19:18the two, the Department of Interior and Local Government because they are able to contact the police.
00:19:26Correct?
00:19:26Correct.
00:19:27And the POTF.
00:19:30Correct.
00:19:31Led by Usec Gilbert Cruz.
00:19:34Correct.
00:19:35The head of that is Executive Secretary Bersamil.
00:19:41Usec Gilbert Cruz is in charge of the operation.
00:19:44Now, we have been closely coordinating with them.
00:19:51We are giving the information as to who doesn't have a license.
00:19:57It is updated.
00:19:59The entire police force is updated.
00:20:01But the problem is that the authorities are not enough.
00:20:06Like the POF, they don't have a condom.
00:20:09Correct.
00:20:10How will they have the opportunity to go around the Philippines and monitor or have intelligence?
00:20:21Okay. All right.
00:20:22So it's easy to say Chairman, even if we say there is a total ban,
00:20:26you don't have a license to give,
00:20:29all licenses will be withdrawn,
00:20:31but there are still 250 who don't have a license and are possibly operating underground.
00:20:38So it means that this is not just a problem of PAG-COR,
00:20:41this is a problem of public order,
00:20:44this is a problem of other offices like our local officials,
00:20:49the MNPC, and other groups like DILG.
00:20:54So how is that?
00:20:56It's not enough that there is a ban on COGO.
00:20:58Do you have a complete plan?
00:21:00You know Ma'am Maluy, that's my concern.
00:21:05And because I believe that even if we are able to execute PAG-COR with DOLE,
00:21:13with other departments or government agencies,
00:21:17even if we are able to follow the President's order to totally ban all the COGOs around the country,
00:21:28we have a big problem and it will be a big challenge to local government units,
00:21:37to the authorities, police authorities,
00:21:40to our government on how to enforce the COGOs that we have said.
00:21:51That will be a big challenge because I believe, and many believe,
00:21:59that they will not return to the country where they came from.
00:22:05Especially in a country where we know that COGOs are totally prohibited.
00:22:13If you see or catch a COGO, whether yesterday, today, or tomorrow,
00:22:21what I see is that you will go straight to jail and you will be judged there.
00:22:28Why will they return?
00:22:29They will just stay here.
00:22:32Now Chairman, let's talk numbers.
00:22:35They said that there are 41,000, that's what you said, 40,000 Filipino employees in these COGO establishments.
00:22:43But there are also about 20,000-plus foreigners.
00:22:49What will happen to them? You said that they will not return.
00:22:53But has there been clarification on the immigration status of these foreigners?
00:22:59Like what I told you earlier, we started talking to DOLE earlier this afternoon.
00:23:08In the next few days, there will be a meeting with various agencies and departments of the government.
00:23:18Bureau of Immigration, DOLE again, the Philippine National Police,
00:23:28the group of Secretary Belair Abalos and DILG.
00:23:31The truth is we started about three weeks ago, Ma'am Malu.
00:23:35Secretary Belair Abalos has already called, this is before the announcement of the President in SONA,
00:23:44all government officials of Region 1, 2, and 3, Region 4, and Metro Manila local government officials.
00:23:55Secretary Abalos and all government agencies are not willing to cooperate.
00:24:04We are talking to all LGUs because they are the ones on the ground.
00:24:12We are talking to them to be active so that they can teach us where these people really are.
00:24:24So hopefully, with the help of Capulisan, with the help of PAGCOR, with the help of DOJ,
00:24:35the Filipino citizens, including the local government units, they will be the ones to act.
00:24:43When January comes, they will be able to feel who is operating illegally.
00:24:50Okay. But Chairman, our problem is if the local officials or lawmakers or other characters are patrons or protection of these POGOS.
00:25:04Isn't that included in the equation that there might be political backers of these POGOS, especially the illegal ones?
00:25:12You know, I don't want to talk about that because they might say that I will teach them who they are.
00:25:21I don't have enough evidence.
00:25:24But there is a strict instruction from the President, a presidential directive made during the State of the Nation address.
00:25:37And if you will notice, it was the most applauded, pandemonium broke loose in the halls of Congress.
00:25:47If I were a patron, I might be afraid now because I saw that President Marcos Junior's instructions were accepted.
00:26:06If I were them, I might back off and say that I will not be a patron to you. This directive is heavy.
00:26:19That's my personal opinion. I said I don't have evidence.
00:26:26You and I don't have evidence that we know what's going on. Maybe we hear about it, but we don't know what's really going on.
00:26:40But what I can see is that the directive is very strong.
00:26:47Correct. But that directive came after the agencies were advising the Department of Finance and the Department of Foreign Affairs.
00:26:58They said it's okay to remove all of those POGOS because the social cost is greater than the economic benefit or taxes.
00:27:07You seem to be in the middle because it seems like a big revenue loss for the court.
00:27:15To be honest, the President just responded to the public clamor. It's not like it was removed immediately.
00:27:23Did you advise him before the SONAN?
00:27:28We talked and I gave my opinion. He's the President. He will make the final decision.
00:27:41I told him and I told the Congress and I told the Senators, whatever will be the final decision of the President, I will support it.
00:27:56I gave my opinion. I showed him what will be the revenues of the POGCOR and BIR.
00:28:08I also told him that it's not just the 40,000 Filipinos who will be affected, but there are so many ancillary businesses or support services.
00:28:20There are security guards, messengers, housekeepers, driver, transport division, restaurants, and retail stores.
00:28:35But in the end, it's clear to me that the decision of the President is based not only on the number of income, but also on the image of our country.
00:28:55All right. So if 40,000 are directly employed in these establishments and as you said earlier, indirectly servicing or earning from all sorts of assistance or services,
00:29:09how many thousand Filipinos do you think will be affected directly or indirectly?
00:29:15Directly and indirectly, we saw Senator Benny earlier. Maybe more than 100,000 to 150,000.
00:29:26We will put it in the conservative three to four members in a family because there are so many. You know, there are families. Some are mothers and some are wives.
00:29:41But if you put it in the top, more than 100,000 Filipinos will be affected indirectly and directly.
00:29:49What Soljen and others are saying is that there is a need for an executive order or a legal issuance to implement the total bans in POGO.
00:29:59If not, what is that? You gave a license and now you will return it suddenly.
00:30:04That's right. That's right Ma'am Malu. I had the opportunity to have an excellent discussion with Solicitor General Maynard Guevara.
00:30:18At the hearing in the Senate. That's his opinion. He said it's better if you don't have a problem later on.
00:30:30As you said earlier, the legal parties have a little problem. They are looking for a way to be included in a presidential directive because of criminal activities.
00:30:52I'm not a lawyer and I believe that it's part of our discussions in the coming weeks so that we can implement the directive of President Ferdinand Marcos.
00:31:12So in short, if you will implement it from now on, from August to December, it will take five months for the revocation of licenses.
00:31:24But the peace and order situation in illegal POGO, it looks like there is a need for a separate or parallel plan.
00:31:32That's true. It's not my assumption, and I want to share this with you Ma'am.
00:31:40The POGO will not stop. The PNP will not stop, led by Secretary Bernhard Avalos, in the illegal POGOs.
00:31:58The truth is, they have people they should visit and visit. So you're right, while we are arranging the so-called exit plan,
00:32:15we are knowing that on a parallel basis, the police authorities are going to pursue all those illegal operators as of today.
00:32:28Is that realistic Chairman?
00:32:31To be honest, we don't know until there are local officials involved, where those illegal POGOs are located.
00:32:41Because some of them are on the list of PAGCORP supervised establishments.
00:32:46You also have a lot of work and you're focusing on gaming operations.
00:32:52But those police operations, even if it's from you, it's illegal, it's hard to see all of them.
00:33:00You're right on that. That's why I said earlier when we started talking, this is a big challenge.
00:33:10Correct.
00:33:10For the police, for the law enforcement authorities, this is a big challenge.
00:33:19But I said earlier, that's a big challenge for them and for PAGCORP and for me,
00:33:25so that the order of President Federal Marcos Junior can be implemented.
00:33:31Okay. Now let's talk about the money involved.
00:33:35In your report and the report of the Department of Finance, the taxes of the POGOs will be billion pesos.
00:33:44That's if all of them will be remitted.
00:33:47That's three times more than the taxes that PAGCORP had remitted to BIR in 2022, your data,
00:33:56which is nine billion from the POGOs.
00:34:00Aren't you going to cry that there will be a reduction in your remittance?
00:34:08This is how it is. During the pandemic, the income of PAGCORP fell from 298 companies.
00:34:20If I'm not mistaken, it's Php2.2 billion. Of course, they said there's a pandemic.
00:34:27But when I assumed in 2022, it recovered and we collected Php3 billion in 2022.
00:34:36In 2023, we have Php5.3 billion.
00:34:41In this year, it won't change because until the end of the year, the order of the President to wind up,
00:34:51if we're lucky, Php6.5 to Php7 billion.
00:34:55PAGCORP share only.
00:34:58Now, what will go to BIR?
00:35:02BIR is almost two and a half times.
00:35:04If we can get Php6 to Php7 billion, BIR will collect Php15 billion.
00:35:15PAGCORP will have a regular relationship with BIR under the leadership of Commissioner Jun Lobagi.
00:35:24That's why it matches.
00:35:27We are checking how much you collected in the quarter.
00:35:32That's why it's good to have a relationship.
00:35:35It's only now that there's a good relationship between PAGCORP and BIR.
00:35:40So if the operation of 43 companies is until December,
00:35:44it means there's a small remittance payment of taxes.
00:35:49Next year, you might have to pay more.
00:35:53How much estimate will you lose in PAGCORP?
00:35:57In PAGCORP, for 2025, if my projection is Php6.5 to Php7 billion, we will lose Php6.5 to Php7 billion.
00:36:08In other government agencies, Secretary Leguizamo will lose Php100 million because of the employment fees.
00:36:16In the Bureau of Immigration, Php100 million.
00:36:21But in PAGCORP, if you ask me if I'm worried because the income will drop,
00:36:27I will tell you that I will compensate the people who will lose their income from me to other people who will find a job.
00:36:38How will you compensate?
00:36:40No. It's not like that. Okay.
00:36:42As far as I know, an integrated resort in Quezon City will open soon.
00:36:49Okay. All right.
00:36:51I don't want to mention the name.
00:36:53What is it?
00:36:55Second, in the next year, 2025, I expect that we will have a new integrated resort that is currently in the finishing stages here in Entertainment City.
00:37:11All right. Okay.
00:37:14Starting this year, 2024, up to 2028, as I step down in PAGCORP, we will have a new integrated resort almost every year.
00:37:27Not only here in Metro Manila, there will be a new one in Clark and a new one in Cebu.
00:37:33All right. Just to be clear, the integrated resort is combined, mixed use. Hotel...
00:37:40It's like a township. There's a casino, there's a place dedicated to restaurants, not just one or two, but numerous restaurants, and then hotel and resort facilities.
00:37:57All right. Okay.
00:37:59Chairman, AMLC listed PAGCORP operated or supervised gaming establishments.
00:38:06Aside from the 43 POGOs that are likely to be closed by December, how many will remain and what are the operations? Integrated resorts and what else?
00:38:17Number one, integrated resorts.
00:38:20Let's say the POGO is totally disbanded. There are integrated resorts.
00:38:27Correct.
00:38:28There are 41 operated casinos of PAGCORP.
00:38:34All right. Okay.
00:38:36We can see that. Its brand is a very, very known brand, Casino Filipino.
00:38:44Correct.
00:38:46Third, there's Rising Star, what they call electronic gaming or e-casinos.
00:38:54So out of those three, that will be the core business of PAGCORP.
00:39:02Okay.
00:39:04I believe that if our projections are not delayed in construction, the PAGCORP will lose P7 billion.
00:39:15It will be covered by the new investors.
00:39:19All right. Chairman, I don't know how you will look at this. People have two minds about the work that you do, gaming, gambling, casino operations.
00:39:30Because it's for the good things that your revenues will bring, in terms of education, health, etc.
00:39:39But what do you think? Do we see a day where we don't need gaming, casinos, and other operations to support and sustain public good like education and health?
00:39:53You know, if you will look at it, one of the reasons why PAGCORP was established is to regulate gambling.
00:40:08Correct.
00:40:10And in so doing, we're able to generate revenue.
00:40:16What I see, Ma'am Malu, if we stop the life of PAGCORP one day, the proliferation of illegal gambling will continue.
00:40:33And the sad part, it is not being regulated, and even worse, we're not generating any revenue from it.
00:40:42Okay.
00:40:45I've been here almost two years. I can see that the desire of Filipinos for gaming or gambling is there.
00:40:56So, if you will stop this, I am confident that it will continue.
00:41:05You mentioned earlier ISABONG.
00:41:08Ma'am, ISABONG, the operations of ISABONG, it was suspended in May, early May 2020.
00:41:22But between me and you, and everybody who is listening to us today, ISABONG is still there.
00:41:34Correct.
00:41:36Ma'am Malu, PAGCORP generated a little over 6 billion pesos in the year 2021 to September 2022.
00:41:48From ISABONG?
00:41:50From ISABONG alone.
00:41:52Today, PAGCORP is not receiving a single cent.
00:41:59Okay. So, who is earning now?
00:42:02The ones who are gambling.
00:42:04Sir, they say that gamblers have two worlds.
00:42:09Those who are poor, like SAKLA, ASABONG, BLASTOO, and other operations that are done by collectors and bookers.
00:42:25And those who are rich, those you are saying, integrated resorts, casinos, etc.
00:42:31So, you are right, maybe Filipinos have an inclination for paydirt.
00:42:36Big money, big time, all at once.
00:42:39But it's like two different worlds.
00:42:41Those who are poor, like SAKLA, LOTO, etc.
00:42:44And you, casino and integrated resorts. What do you think about that?
00:42:51You know, it is basically a combination.
00:42:55That just goes to show you one thing, Ma'am Malu.
00:42:59Whether rich or poor, whether they are part of class A and class B, even the C, D, and E, are all, majority of them, gambling.
00:43:16So, what I am saying is, I would rather regulate it properly than just leave it with the government not gaining a single centavo.
00:43:28You know, Ma'am Malu, let's talk of the good side.
00:43:30PagCorp gives back 70% more or less of its gross revenue to the nation building.
00:43:40Infrastructure.
00:43:42Infrastructure.
00:43:44We give 50% straight to the national treasury every month.
00:43:48And then we have the Philippine Sports Commission.
00:43:525% of our income goes to the Philippine Sports Commission.
00:43:56We support the Dangerous Drugs Board.
00:43:58We are part of the Universal Healthcare Act.
00:44:02The PhilHealth.
00:44:04That's why the benefits of our countrymen are increased.
00:44:10PagCorp supports that.
00:44:12PagCorp supports that.
00:44:14But they said they will give back the P89 billion.
00:44:16They are asking for a remit.
00:44:18You know, Ma'am Malu, that's already internal.
00:44:20I will not read that.
00:44:22The good side is really, we help out the president in his social projects.
00:44:30PagCorp is rolling out starting in September and you will hear this.
00:44:36This is the first opportunity for me to announce.
00:44:40We will be rolling out our PagCorp-initiated infrastructure projects.
00:44:46We will be giving away school buildings, social civic centers, e-learning centers, and wellness centers.
00:44:58We will be giving that to the entire Philippines and not just concentrated in one place.
00:45:04And my goal is to hopefully reach the farthest of the farthest.
00:45:10So that our countrymen will feel that there is an organization, a corporation, owned by the government,
00:45:19that will bring blessings to those who are far away from our country.
00:45:27That is a very good goal.
00:45:29But on the other hand, it's like redundancy.
00:45:34Those are the jobs that should be done by the departments and government agencies.
00:45:40So it's like you already have in the General Appropriations Act, the National Expenditure Program,
00:45:45the funds for the services and establishments that you mentioned.
00:45:50Why will you have your own direction?
00:45:54You know, Mamalu, let's talk of classrooms.
00:45:58Since I was born until now, we still have a problem with the classrooms.
00:46:05Is PagCorp wrong in helping to increase the number of classrooms?
00:46:12Second, for example, this PagCorp project of e-learning centers.
00:46:18You know that e-learning is the in thing today.
00:46:23You know, we will now go to the different municipalities and provinces.
00:46:28We will look for areas where there are big central schools,
00:46:34you can see the buildings in the provinces and schools.
00:46:39We will put in the middle a building that will become an e-library.
00:46:46There will be 24 workstations.
00:46:51There will be workstations there.
00:46:55Boy, can you imagine.
00:46:57If there is internet.
00:46:59Yes, we brought back the internet.
00:47:02PagCorp will pay for it for 1 year or I think even 2 years, maybe 1 year.
00:47:09And the students, public school students can use it either as an e-library
00:47:16or an IT learning classroom.
00:47:20So provided, Mamalu, it's complete.
00:47:23There are computers.
00:47:25All of that is already there.
00:47:27Our youth will just enter.
00:47:30All right.
00:47:31It's fine if it's not equitably, fairly, judiciously.
00:47:36Your project will be placed in the right place where it's really needed.
00:47:41But the elections are in May.
00:47:43Isn't that why the politicians are running?
00:47:47Arborin, your project?
00:47:49Maybe that's where we will see how I will manage Chairman Altenco in the future.
00:47:58I said, if I have a desire here, and maybe you are one of the people who will monitor me,
00:48:04I will trust you.
00:48:05I know you from doing research.
00:48:08I will try and do everything to reach the places that need e-learning,
00:48:18need social civic centers, need e-libraries or e-learning centers,
00:48:26and need wellness centers.
00:48:28And if you want, I will be there so you can see where my projects will reach.
00:48:34Okay. You are really an Athenist.
00:48:37Man for others.
00:48:38You are men who matter in 2020.
00:48:41Thank you.
00:48:42Hopefully, I told them, when I gave my acceptance speech,
00:48:49if there is a big challenge for me in this time,
00:48:53I should be able to fulfill the closure of all POGOs by the end of the year.
00:48:59If not, I am a man who matters, a man who does not matter anymore.
00:49:05How about the appeal of legal POGOs?
00:49:10Because some of them might opt to go to court and delay your process of closing down or winding down.
00:49:17Some of them might actually really challenge you elsewhere.
00:49:20Not just to the President, but to the local government units that gave their business permits.
00:49:26What are the steps that you will take to make sure that before Christmas,
00:49:32which is the closing year, the POGOs will be closed?
00:49:36I don't want to put them first.
00:49:39I also don't want to think that those are the steps that they will take.
00:49:45But in the coming weeks, it will be clearer for us to implement what we should do.
00:49:56And one of the things that we are looking at is, do we need a law?
00:50:02Do we need an executive order?
00:50:05That much, we are looking at this early.
00:50:08And maybe, I was telling the Senate, maybe hopefully by the end of August,
00:50:13we have a clearer understanding and a clearer picture of what path we will take
00:50:18to be able to achieve the said order of President Bongbong Marcos.
00:50:25What will happen in reality is foreclosure.
00:50:28You will be padlocked.
00:50:30But do you have an economic relief or claim on payment, moving out, and reparation of these companies that are legal?
00:50:41Ma'am Malu, I don't want to put them first.
00:50:46We will work together with the government and we will study that.
00:50:53And maybe, aside from those companies, the priority is what we can do to help the workers in need.
00:51:02Again, I don't want to preempt the announcement of DOLE,
00:51:09but I was very happy with the meeting with Secretary Lecuesma over lunch.
00:51:14And they have a good plan for those who will be displaced.
00:51:19And all he was asking is that I have a point person coming from PACOR,
00:51:27and a point person coming from DOLE, so that basic, we can reconcile the numbers as to exactly how many.
00:51:37Because I say more or less this much.
00:51:41So with the first step, we will be able to establish how many will be affected.
00:51:48And what the options will be for them.
00:51:51So I do not want to preempt, but I'm telling you, I'm studying that aspect.
00:51:57Okay. We have a list of those employed directly.
00:52:01Yes. In fact, Secretary Lecuesma was very happy that we have the names.
00:52:08Hopefully, the passport that he showed us will not fail.
00:52:12But we have the names and the current position for the job.
00:52:17Secretary Lecuesma and NCL Director Bambic said,
00:52:22Oh my God, that is valuable information for what they call as their matching.
00:52:28Work or work matching.
00:52:31They will see that Juan de la Cruz, what is his specialty?
00:52:36He's good in encoding.
00:52:38Okay. He's good in encoding.
00:52:40Maybe he can do BPO in Taguig.
00:52:45Translator, Maria de Leon.
00:52:50Translator, we will recommend her to the translators.
00:52:55So there will be matching.
00:52:58Not lab matching, what they do now.
00:53:01If not, work matching.
00:53:04Work skills matching.
00:53:06Yes. Skills matching.
00:53:08Secretary Lecuesma was very happy that we have a list.
00:53:14And the list, we will update it as of July 31st.
00:53:19And that will be the basis of what programs we will offer to these workers who will be displaced.
00:53:28Are there Filipinos and foreigners who are on the list and will help?
00:53:33We are talking about Filipinos first.
00:53:37Because if their work visa is cancelled, unless they can get another job,
00:53:44they don't have a working visa, they have to go home.
00:53:49All right.
00:53:50These Filipinos have been employed for a year or six months.
00:53:54Will there be a separation pay that will kick in?
00:53:57That's one of the things that the Department of Labor and Employment is studying now.
00:54:05Chairman Tengco, to be honest, you said that this job is a big challenge.
00:54:10It's not just the 43 that are legal, but what will be done to the illegal 250 plus.
00:54:17So when December comes, what will you see? A picture or a situation?
00:54:23Will we have a happy Christmas? A sad Christmas for the workers?
00:54:28For the legal operators, they don't have to wait for Christmas.
00:54:35They are already sad.
00:54:37My feedback is that they cannot accept that they are living well.
00:54:46There are a lot of overseas investors, but they were hit by this directive
00:54:55just because of their foolishness or criminal activities.
00:55:00That's why they are already sad.
00:55:03But I think if all the government agencies will help and unite,
00:55:10then every Filipino will have a happy Christmas
00:55:15because we will be able to implement the directive of President Ferdinand Marcos.
00:55:23Okay. Is there no third way?
00:55:25For example, the state takes over the legal POGO operations.
00:55:32In my opinion, that's difficult because I have a very simple principle in life.
00:55:39The government should not be involved in any form of business.
00:55:44That is what the experts should follow.
00:55:47So it's still difficult if I'm the one you're asking.
00:55:52But isn't that the job of the PAG-COR?
00:55:54You're the regulator and at the same time you collect all the fees due.
00:55:58Yes, but for PAG-COR to operate these internet gaming licenses,
00:56:06I don't think we are capable of doing so.
00:56:11I have to be very blunt and be honest about it.
00:56:15Would another path be taken like a subsidiary or consolidation of these POGOs
00:56:24and therefore there is an operator overall in charge?
00:56:30Honestly, it does not cross my mind.
00:56:34That has not been part of any of the discussions I have made with other government departments or agencies.
00:56:44I honestly believe that is not an option.
00:56:48Okay, okay.
00:56:50It's like there's a franchisee.
00:56:52Now, just a short question.
00:56:54The former Secretary Harry Roque said that he appealed on behalf of a service provider for Lockistar.
00:57:04What is the truth about that?
00:57:06Is he a lawyer or not?
00:57:08Because it was confused in the Senate hearing.
00:57:10You know, Ma'am Manu, your story will not change.
00:57:14Because I am the witness to everything that happened,
00:57:20along with the head of the Overseas Gaming Licensing Department of PAG-COR, Atty. Jessa Fernandez.
00:57:29So, we are both just telling the story of everything that really happened.
00:57:36Secretary Roque asked for an appointment on my behalf.
00:57:43I had a chance to meet him on July 26, 2023.
00:57:50When he went to my office, he was with a woman named Cassandra Lee Oh.
00:57:58Cassie.
00:58:00Cassie.
00:58:01They investigated Cassie's problem.
00:58:04And the problem was the non-payment of her life to PAG-COR by their authorized representative.
00:58:14His name is Mr. Dennis Cunanan.
00:58:19So, Ma'am Cassie received a letter from the OGLD, Department of PAG-COR,
00:58:31saying that if they cannot correct their arrears,
00:58:39first, their license will be cancelled,
00:58:42and second, they will no longer have the right to give a license to PAG-COR.
00:58:48Okay.
00:58:49So, Cassandra said,
00:58:53Chairman, while we are in jail,
00:58:58someone is paying a partial payment.
00:59:03And our request is that the balance should be free over time.
00:59:08Okay.
00:59:09I told her, you know.
00:59:11Patak-patak.
00:59:12Yes, patak-patak.
00:59:13In SMA, four gives.
00:59:18So, I told her,
00:59:19Ma'am, if you wish to reapply because your license is in probationary status,
00:59:29make sure that you will pay the total amount of your debt to PAG-COR when you qualify as an applicant.
00:59:38If you do not pay that during the time that you are reapplying,
00:59:44there is no hope that you will be given a license.
00:59:48So, she paid almost 500,000 dollars over time.
00:59:56Okay.
00:59:57Now, Secretary Rote did not force me.
01:00:03She did not tell me, hey Chairman, give me something.
01:00:10No. She is the one who talked.
01:00:12Now, I don't know Cassandra Leong.
01:00:15She is a material person in the investigation of the Senate.
01:00:22In Lockistar.
01:00:24Lockist South 99.
01:00:26Lockist South.
01:00:27Lockist South 99.
01:00:28So, what Secretary Rote said,
01:00:32she only accompanied Cassie because Cassie is her client and she wants to help.
01:00:39So, whether he is a personal lawyer, whether he is a lawyer of Lockist South 99,
01:00:48and a lawyer of the company that he was saying that Cassie owns,
01:00:55the whirlwind, I don't know the truth.
01:00:59We have heard it.
01:01:00When Lockist South 99 submitted the reapplication of their license,
01:01:08or the renewal of their license,
01:01:12in the attachment, the name is written.
01:01:16Legal, there's a box, legal.
01:01:18It is written that it is owned by Lockist South.
01:01:20But when I asked Secretary Rote, she said there's no authority on her.
01:01:25We trusted her.
01:01:27But the connection of the renewal application of Lockist South is the organizational chapter.
01:01:33Correct.
01:01:34That's where the name is written.
01:01:37If she didn't force her to put her name there, maybe I shouldn't have followed her.
01:01:44I would have trusted her.
01:01:46That's what she said.
01:01:48But there's no correction when the old chart was submitted.
01:01:52There's no connection.
01:01:54The truth is, Ma'am Malu, we did not approve the renewal.
01:02:02Not because of this corruption, but because of internal findings by our security department.
01:02:10Related to?
01:02:12We saw some gadgets that should be gone.
01:02:20We also saw that their directors are just a bunch of people.
01:02:28So we did not renew.
01:02:31That's why it's clear.
01:02:33Lockist South 99 does not have a valid partner.
01:02:37Okay. And Ms. Cassie is already in Singapore.
01:02:40That's what the police said yesterday.
01:02:44Our law enforcement agency has information that she is in Singapore.
01:02:51All right.
01:02:53Chairman Al, we learned a lot from your explanation.
01:02:58I hope we can keep an eye on this because it looks like there's no end.
01:03:02The next chapter of this investigation will continue.
01:03:07I think they really have a lot to say.
01:03:10Because as far as I can see, they also have personalities
01:03:16that seem to be behind all illegal criminal activities.
01:03:21Is that political?
01:03:23I don't know.
01:03:24But I can feel that they have something to say.
01:03:29All right.
01:03:30So corporate layering, corporate bail is our problem.
01:03:34Legal, it might be closed because you have a duty there.
01:03:38Illegal, our police should be punished.
01:03:42Yes, Ma'am.
01:03:43That's the big challenge for the police.
01:03:47The challenge for me in the Department of Labor,
01:03:50in the Department of Justice, in the Department of Indian Local Government,
01:03:54in the PAPF, is to implement the order of President Ferdinand Marcos Jr.
01:04:02that is totally banned almost in the country today.
01:04:06Okay. And you think it will be implemented?
01:04:09We will not be beaten and the promise and order of the President will not be broken?
01:04:14We will do everything we can,
01:04:20we will study and think about how to implement this order.
01:04:27Because as I said, not only me and you, but also the people of the Philippines will benefit from this.
01:04:34All right.
01:04:35On that note, we thank you and give our best regards.
01:04:41And it's good that the order of the President, Chairman and CEO of PagCorp, Mr. Al Tengco, is still early.
01:04:50Thank you very much.
01:04:51Thank you very much, Ma'am Maluc. Thank you for the opportunity.
01:04:55And pray for us so that we will be successful in the future.
01:05:11Thank you.
01:05:41Thank you.