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Video Information: 17.02.22, Religion session, Goa
Context:
What is the relation between spirituality and religion?
Does religion matter to people?
How can one comprehend religion?
Has religion really been successful in its purpose?
Does the absence of religion benefit man?
What is the role of religion in a man's life?
Music Credits: Milind Date
~~~~~
Be a part of the Live Sessions: https://acharyaprashant.org/hi/enquir...
Want to read Acharya Prashant's Books?
Get Free Delivery: https://acharyaprashant.org/en/books?...
~~~~~
Video Information: 17.02.22, Religion session, Goa
Context:
What is the relation between spirituality and religion?
Does religion matter to people?
How can one comprehend religion?
Has religion really been successful in its purpose?
Does the absence of religion benefit man?
What is the role of religion in a man's life?
Music Credits: Milind Date
~~~~~
Category
📚
LearningTranscript
00:00Acharya ji, thanks for agreeing to talk with me again in Goa.
00:09I know you have very limited time, so I'll make this quick.
00:14Welcome DDS.
00:18So I guess something that keeps coming up in my mind is, what is this deal with religion?
00:25It seems so irrelevant, it seems so childish to me, and yet so many people seem to believe
00:32it with such militant fervor and zeal.
00:36And I'll give you my example, that I remember as a child, my mother would take me to the
00:43fire temple, and I used to hate it because it was the most stupid thing I would do, that
00:50you had to put the so-called holy water on yourself, you had to go in front of the fire,
00:57you had, and then when you came home the priest would supposedly pray on the fruit, and the
01:02fruit was supposed to be holy fruit that tasted better, and it didn't really taste better.
01:06I think it's similar to langar, people say it tastes better in the temple than in the
01:12house, but then you're not supposed to let it fall on the ground, you're not supposed
01:16to give it to people who are not part of your religion.
01:19This just seems so stupid, and it just seemed like a cult, and I didn't experience anything
01:25different in that temple, or eating the fruit, but it seemed like my mother and other people
01:32experienced something different, or to me it seemed like people were just pretending,
01:37and I didn't want to go on with that farce.
01:40But I've noticed this happens in most religions, like just now as I was on the way here, there
01:45was mass in temple, and people were standing like this, looking at the sky, and I'm not
01:50sure there was anything happening to them when they did that, it just seemed like a
01:55put on social convention.
02:06You called the whole thing childish, and that gives me a point to start from, say, who are we?
02:28We are born kids, immature, dependent, enslaved to their physical tendencies, bodily configuration
02:57and habits, that's how human beings are born.
03:08Now physically it is evident that we are born small and dependent and immature and unwise,
03:23and it appears when you just look at the body of the kid, that in the course of time,
03:32over the next 20-25 years, we grow up, and when we grow up physically, we are said to
03:49be adults, mature, thoughtful, wise, free, capable, independent, but that does not really
04:10happen or always happen in the psychological sense, the growth, that is.
04:20Inwardly we are born a kid, and we remain the kid.
04:33What is a religion then?
04:44There is a religion that liberates us from our inner tendencies and inner weaknesses
04:57and the inner darkness, and there is a religion that acts as a toy in the hands of the child.
05:14So religion is not one thing, but two things really.
05:24To keep these two distinct, I sometimes call real religiosity as spirituality and the common
05:37kind of religion that you refer to as just organized religion.
05:51Unfortunately, as would be evident, mostly what we see is a display of the latter kind
06:02of religion, where instead of religion being able to grant us the benefit that we so deeply
06:21need, it actually becomes a continuation of our immaturity.
06:34It actually becomes another bondage on the one who is already in so many chains.
06:54The presence of the wrong kind of religion should not convince us into thinking that
07:08the childish displays of ceremony and hollow superstitions and rituals and practices are
07:21all that is there to religion.
07:29These are mostly acts of ignorance.
07:36You could call these rather as distortions in the spirit of religion.
07:47That's not real religiosity.
08:01We need real religion.
08:07Religion is not just an unnecessary thing foisted on us by history, by tradition, by the priests.
08:24Religion is a liberating force, true religion, pure religion.
08:35Not the branded kind of religion, not what goes by in the name of religion.
08:45Religion is not an unnecessary addition to the long list of problems we already have.
09:01If religion is true, it is a solution rather to the core problem that we have.
09:14But I understand where you are coming from, mostly overwhelmingly what we see is just
09:27the wrong kind, so I understand.
09:35So you said true religion, not the organized kind, and you said true religions are liberating force.
09:43So what exactly is this true religion?
09:46Is it the life of the saints?
09:49Is it, what's its essence if it's so corrupted today?
09:54Where can I find it or what is it?
10:01See the essence of true religion is self-knowledge.
10:10Why is the essence self-knowledge?
10:14Because as we said true religion has to be a liberating force.
10:20Religion exists for us, therefore it has to do intimately with our condition.
10:33We must know what our condition is, and that is self-knowledge, and when we know what our
10:41condition is, then we know what to keep in ourselves, what to drop, what ails us, and
10:55therefore what could be a possible solution.
11:00This process of self-knowledge with deep assurance that freedom from the internal
11:24bondages is possible, is the essence of true religion, pure, simple, direct.
11:37This is what true religion is.
11:39Freedom from bondage?
11:41Freedom from inner bondages that we are born with, and the bondages that get manifested
11:50in the world around us, in our social systems, in our education, in our family, in our politics.
12:00Because they are within us, we see them all around us.
12:04So if you look at the human being, inside of himself he is deeply conditioned, the body
12:12itself is the primary conditioning, and then all around him are forces that only deepen
12:29and aggravate his conditioning.
12:32So that's the human condition, and that's why man needs religion.
12:37Religion is not unnecessary.
12:41As long as we are who we are, we will continue to need religion.
12:47As long as the kid is born the way he is, we will continue to need religion.
12:57It seems like such a tough sell because if you're rational and intelligent, you see through
13:05the farce of organized religion.
13:07How do you see the benefits of religion if all you know is the organized religion nonsense?
13:14So if you see the kiosk that happens during Diwali or Holi or Christmas or Eid, you lump
13:22all religion as, okay, it doesn't matter if it's X, Y, or Z religion, they all do the
13:28same nonsense, and it's better for me to just step outside of this religion umbrella because
13:34wherever I go to find religion, it seems nonsensical.
13:41See I understand that it's very evident that a lot of organized religion is quite nonsensical,
13:54but I also wonder why the same mind, the same faculty that sees through the farce of
14:04organized religion fails to see through one's inner farce.
14:14We are very quick to deplore all the foolishness that happens outside of us as organized religion.
14:25We see that and we must see that, that's good, but why don't we see all the foolishness
14:32that constantly happens within us and also gets patronized by us.
14:41If we can see that, then we are truly religious.
14:45In fact, it is a mark of true religiosity to see that a lot of organized religion is
14:55fake and corrupted, but if you truly have the discerning eye that penetrates through
15:03fakeness, that knows the reality of fakeness, then why is that eye unable to look at one's
15:14own self, this inclination to know one's own self, one's center of operations, one's cluster
15:31of identities, one's inner contradictions, this is self-knowledge, this is the foundation
15:40of true religiosity.
15:44It seems like seeing the farce outside is very easy because I'm drawn towards the outside.
15:54This is almost, no one's told me, I've never learned how to draw myself inwards or when
16:04I go to people who claim to know that it's like the fake meditation, the fake close your
16:09eyes and imagine you're in bliss, which again seems like another fakeness.
16:14So I guess why am I so drawn outside and when it comes time to think inwards, the only concepts
16:26I have are what I've studied, so biology, the heart flows in my body, my heart pumps,
16:32the chemistry, the physics of the body, but all that is again outside knowledge of the
16:39inside, if that makes sense.
16:40So what is inside knowledge of the inside?
16:45When you're talking of the heart that pumps blood and all the physical mechanism, there
16:52is somebody who is looking at all this, who is the one looking at all this and is the
16:59looking proper and pure.
17:03True religion has to do with this looker, the observer, the experiencer of everything.
17:12You put your hands on your chest and you say, oh my heartbeat is probably abnormal right
17:18now.
17:19Who is the one experiencing the heartbeat?
17:24Who is the one experiencing a particular emotion?
17:28Who is the one having a thought?
17:29Who is the thinker?
17:33So if you are content with just looking at things physical, whether outside of yourself
17:42or inside, then you are at best a rational man who looks at things and who looks only
17:49at things.
17:53But if you can also look at the looker, if you can look at the thinker, if you can look
18:02at the one who calls himself as I, then you are a religious mind.
18:13When you say look, I'm assuming that's a metaphor because again to me it seems like I can't
18:19really see the one who is seeing me in the physical sense.
18:24But you do that all the time, don't you?
18:26When you say I am angry, have you not looked at yourself?
18:37To be honest, I think when I say I am angry, I just say it out of habit and conditioning
18:42when I feel a certain way in my body, that X feeling has arisen, therefore I must be
18:48angry.
18:49Let me put it this way, you are acting in a certain way and then due to the presence
19:01of a person or because of the presence of a helpful condition, you just realize that
19:14you are doing it all wrong or you are mistaken in the way you are approaching things and
19:20then you suddenly say, oh, I am mistaken.
19:26I am mistaken.
19:29What does that tell about the inner thing?
19:34That I take it, its existence as a given.
19:38That it operates, it can make mistakes in its operation and that you can remain happily
19:49unaware of the internal mistakes and that it is possible to see that you are mistaken.
20:00That's the inner worker and that inner worker remains shielded, veiled, concealed, we do
20:14not come to know of the inner worker.
20:18But it is possible to know of it and often do, we do come to know of it and that's when
20:23we say things like, oh, I am so mistaken or I was so mistaken.
20:29So it's the ability to analyze, introspect and see how we were mistaken or how what we
20:39thought was true wasn't really true.
20:42Yes, it's that and a bit more than that because you see when you analyze and introspect, that's
20:48all with respect to the past.
20:51Something has already happened.
20:53Something in the form of data is present to be analyzed, something is available and lending
21:01itself to scrutiny and then you sit down and defect it and analyze and whatever.
21:11True religiosity consists of doing exactly this but in real time.
21:19So self-observation does consist of introspection and contemplation but it's also much more
21:31than that, it's about knowing yourself right now as you desire something, as you think
21:44of something, as you rush towards a particular goal, as you are happy or sad or dejected,
21:55as you suddenly feel hurt, that is self-knowledge in its most useful form, to know it right
22:04now because if you know it in the past, that is if you know it after the deal is done,
22:12the event is gone, then the utility is limited, whatsoever had to happen to you has already
22:22happened and remember the role of religiosity is to help you.
22:30It is not just an external obligation, it's an inner demand, it's an inner requirement.
22:39We need religiosity because we are born fettered and in several ways incapable, however, that
22:53is not our destiny and that's the reason why we need religion truly.
23:00So Chagaiji, by real-time self-knowledge, for example, if I want to go to a restaurant
23:07instead of just going eating and coming back after two hours, it would be noticing that
23:15I feel the urge to go to the restaurant, asking myself why restaurant, why this restaurant,
23:21is it really the best use of say two hours of my time, what else would be in that self-knowledge
23:29real-time evaluation?
23:31This that you are talking of and something more than that, being very alert to the stimulus
23:43that provokes the desire within you, seeing how the thought arose and drove you into action,
23:57seeing it then and there in real time, that obviously does not preclude what you said.
24:09Thinking, analyzing is a part of true religiosity, but true religiosity goes way beyond thought
24:21because thought is incapable of addressing the real nature of our bondage.
24:34Thought is way too slow to catch up with the inner mechanism that's lightening fast.
24:47Thought is not the right vehicle, not that thought is not useful there, but it won't suffice.
24:54So one has to be incredibly sharp and attentive.
25:00Sharp and attentive to what?
25:01The impulse?
25:02To what is happening within, just as you catch with your eyes, anything that's happening
25:10in front of you, you catch with your senses, a fly just comes and right now lands on your
25:19arm and don't you notice it instantaneously, that instantaneous appreciation of what is
25:31going on internally is true religiosity, coupled with the deep faith that what is happening
25:43within need not continue to happen that way, that freedom from all this happening, this
25:52entire ecosystem of conditioning and bondages and compulsiveness is possible.
26:05These two together, knowledge that I am in bondage and faith that my destiny is liberation
26:13from all bondages, this is true religiosity.
26:19So it sounded like thought, if I understood correctly, thought is too slow to have real-time
26:28situational awareness.
26:31So I guess I'm trying to put words to what that awareness is, is it like just a sense
26:37and impulse, a feeling in the body that this desire arose and you catch it?
26:45You feel a certain way, you...
26:48It's something that knows the feeling, it's not a feeling, it is something that knows
26:56the feeling, you know that you are feeling, you are not just feeling, right now you are
27:02behind and beyond the feeling, so you know the feeling and you know the feeling even
27:08as it is rising within you, captivating you.
27:15So is this what they mean when some of the sense look, observe, watch, be mindful, is
27:24this what they're pointing to?
27:27It is that and beyond that, it's not about being mindful, it's about being in knowledge
27:37of, in instantaneous knowledge of what fills up the mind.
27:42So mindfulness too is a small thing when it comes to religiosity.
27:51The mind is not the equipment, the instrument that can watch really, or even if it does
28:03manage to watch, it's a lazy and inefficient watcher.
28:12The mind itself has to be watched, when you watch through the mind, then you are watching
28:21through a distorted and colored lens, and a lens that cannot have a 360 degree view,
28:31the mind watches fragments and even those fragments, it watches in a prejudiced way.
28:40Therefore this very tendency of the mind to watch in a prejudiced and fragmented way has
28:48to be watched.
28:51It is therefore something, as we said, behind and beyond the mind.
28:59So this again sounds like some of the stuff I've read about in organized religion that
29:07God is all-knowing, all-powerful, you can't, beyond.
29:11How am I supposed to know?
29:13All I know right now is my emotions and my mind, I don't know this beyond and it.
29:20Right now we do not know our emotions and our mind, it is when we are beyond our emotions
29:27and our mind that we know our emotions, we think that we know our emotions, we do not
29:37know them, we are emotional without knowing a thing about emotions, we think without knowing
29:45a thing about thoughts, we exist without knowing who is the existent one.
29:54So as you said, you know, God is all-knowing and all that.
30:03So there has to be a point beyond our existence, our thoughts, feelings, emotions and everything
30:11that there is to the human life that can look at all this, I don't have a better word so
30:21I say look at all this, that point that can look at all this, that point you can equate
30:30to God, if need be, if you are interested, otherwise there is no need or you can call
30:39that point as the true self, as who you really are, that one as it is called in Vedanta.
30:53How do you develop this faculty, I feel like I don't have it, in that all I do is either
31:05think or feel emotions.
31:07You don't really have to develop this faculty, you have to ask yourself what is it that prevents
31:14you from knowing something so intimate to you, you say your feelings, you say your life,
31:24you say your relationships, your love, your fears, your thoughts, who else is supposed
31:33to know them if they are yours, you live with them, they are your entire life, they are
31:41not even yours, they are you, take all that away and you will find you are left with nothing,
31:50my body, my mind, if these things are taken away, the me itself does not exist.
32:00So if that's who I am, how do I manage to not know them, what prevents us from knowing
32:10what just kindled desire in me, how do I manage to not know what ails me and why I am not
32:22in a good mood this morning, how do I manage to not know that even as I am sitting over
32:30a task, there is something else crying for attention within, how do I manage to not know
32:37that I may claim I am moving in a particular direction for a particular reason but my real
32:46intentions are different, how do we remain so unaware internally, we meet someone and
32:59we smile, how do we manage to not know that the smile is fake, we argue with people and
33:10we feel that we are arguing in a rational way, we think that our differences are objective
33:18and hence the argument or the debate, how do we manage to not know that most of that
33:26is just personal, that all the argument might vanish when it comes to another person saying
33:37just the same things, because the argument often is not about an issue, the argument
33:45is largely about the two parties taking up the issue, how do we manage to not know that,
33:54how do we manage to convince ourselves that we are rational people, and all that is happening
34:04within us, very very close to us, how do we manage to keep ourselves in dark?
34:11It's a great question, I've never really gone that deep into it, what, is it because I think
34:24I know what I don't really know?
34:27Yeah, that's what, we think we know what we don't really know, and we convince ourselves
34:35that we know, because admission of one's ignorance is painful, and that's the reason why true
34:45religion talks so much of austerity, sacrifice, willingness to inflict pain on oneself, humility,
35:08an admission of one's real estate, I don't want to kid myself, I know where I really stand.
35:18So it sounds like the austerity and sacrifices, that was another thing that I didn't really
35:24understand why people had to be so ostentatious in terms of sacrificing milk, fruits and even
35:33killing animals.
35:37The problem is that they're not sacrificing the ostentation itself.
35:43And that it sounds like that's the root of what the sacrifice is, that give up what's
35:48dear to you.
35:49That's what sacrifice is really meant to be, sacrifice that which is of no value and is
35:58yet occupying very prime position within yourself, it's like somebody encroaching on prime real
36:12estate in the heart of your city, you don't allow the squatters to continue, that sacrifice,
36:22getting them evicted.
36:28And it sounds like now it's just become an excuse to party, get drunk, do stupid things.
36:34We said right in the beginning, religion could either be something that helps the inner child
36:40grow up, or it could become something like a toy in the hand of the child, and a rather
36:52enfeebling toy, a toy that keeps the child, the child.
37:03Because it doesn't ask the child to look inward.
37:09It tells the child you're already grown up, just as you said that we think we already
37:16know, so we don't ever come to know.
37:20Similarly, this rather harmful toy, organized religion, tells the inner child that you already
37:30have truth and liberation and the real thing, whereas the child really has none of them.
37:40But when you are convinced you already have it, you lose all zeal to look for it, to put
37:48energy into the search, and the search is gone, the inquisitiveness is gone, and the
37:59possibility of freedom is gone then.
38:04So I've talked a lot about the bad examples of religion because they're so obvious and
38:09in my face, but what are the good that religion has done to this world?
38:18You know, the great Indian saint, Kabir Saheb, there are words from him, he said,
38:31ना होते जो सादु जन जल मरता संसार।
38:38He said, if in absence of religion, had religion not been there, the world would have simply
38:51burnt itself down to ashes.
38:55You see, man is a tremendous animal.
39:00Man carries all the instincts of animals with unmatched firepower in the form of intellect.
39:15Intellect that manifests itself as knowledge and then as technology.
39:23So we are animals with huge guns and nuclear arsenals.
39:32If we have even to this date managed to somehow survive with at least a bit of sanity, it
39:43is due to the becoming effect of religion.
39:50It's evident what the shortcomings of religion are, it is evident how polluted and corrupted
39:56organized religion is, but we do not realize that religion is also, true religion is also
40:07the basic source of all goodness.
40:11Where does compassion come from?
40:16Who will tell you that what we usually call as love is not love at all and that there
40:22is something called true love which is possible to us?
40:27Religion does all of that.
40:30So if there is anything that you see as good in the world, you wouldn't be wrong in calling
40:42it as something religious.
40:44That's the service of religion to this world.
40:49Religion is again not an ideology.
40:50Religion is not something that you wear.
40:54Religion is your very inner urge to not suffer.
41:01And that way it would mean that all of us are religious.
41:03All of us are religious.
41:04Yes.
41:05Whether we claim it or not.
41:06It says that some people follow true religion and others even with their innate yearning
41:24for freedom somehow due to the effect of ignorance end up following a distorted version of religion.
41:34But we all want to be religious.
41:37In fact, every single desire that any human being has is the desire for liberation and
41:45therefore religion is our first desire.
41:50Religion is at the root of all desires.
41:56So it sounds like it doesn't matter what label you give yourself.
41:59You could be claiming to be religious but very irreligious.
42:04You could be claiming to be an atheist but if you want to be free of your suffering and
42:08you acknowledge it, you're religious whether you claim it or not.
42:13See there is nobody who does not have desires.
42:16And if you have desires, you want something.
42:21Religion is to know what is that something that we really want.
42:30Maybe one last question.
42:34So is there a difference?
42:36So I know I've disparaged organized religion but is there a difference between the founder
42:44of the organized religion and the religion?
42:47Because I remember reading the Bible and the Koran as a child and a lot of it just seemed
42:59to make no sense.
43:01There were fiery gods, there were taboos against things that are considered normal today and
43:06I'm reminded of a quote by Gandhiji in South Africa.
43:11Someone asked him, why don't you like Christians?
43:13And he says, I love your Jesus.
43:15I just wish more of you Christians were like your Jesus.
43:22You see, on one hand it is true that Christians are probably not much like Jesus, Buddhists
43:35are not so much like Buddha, Muslims are probably not so much like Muhammad, that is true.
43:45But you must also realize that true religiosity is beyond the founders of religious streams.
44:02It is your own inner urge.
44:04It is something very very intimate to you.
44:09Would you say you won't be religious had some other great person from the past not
44:17brought those things to you?
44:21We need to be grateful to the ones who brought the teachings to us.
44:29But then the fact is that you anyway needed them on your own and even if somebody else
44:40did bring the teachings to you, you still need to go through the long and arduous and
44:51very demanding journey of self-observation.
44:58Otherwise the teachings just won't suffice.
45:02So on one hand, it's good that we be grateful to the greats from the past.
45:12On the other hand, we must realize that the responsibility is very much our own.
45:22Just going through the motions, just restricting ourselves to what has been said in the scriptures,
45:32just calling ourselves followers of religious sects or religious personalities, won't take
45:39us very far and I'm saying that along with the humble submission that mankind has benefited
45:52a lot due to the contributions of the sages and the seers.
46:01But still, it is your life and irrespective of how much others have tried to help you,
46:11you still need to fight the battle very much by yourself.
46:24So I have to study for the exam?
46:26You have to study for the exam.
46:28Somebody else might have provided the textbook, that's alright.
46:35And even if the textbook does not exist, let's see a calamity strikes mankind tomorrow
46:43and all the textbooks get destroyed, it is possible.
46:48We are not very different from the dinosaurs, it's possible.
46:54You would still need religion or would you say now that no religious books exist, therefore
47:00no religion exists.
47:02That's not true.
47:03As long as man exists, religion will have to exist.
47:08Religion can't be a thing of the past.
47:10Religion has to do with our suffering of this very moment.
47:15How can it be a thing of the past?
47:17How can religion ever be dead?
47:19As long as we are there and our consciousness is there, the need for religion is always there.
47:27This makes a lot more sense when you reframe religion as honest self-inquiry to stop myself
47:33from internally suffering.
47:36It seems like part of the human condition, not something that's an imposed outside value
47:48account.
47:49You see, within us we have these two forces, there is the force that we are born with in
47:59the physical way, that limits us as a body, and then there is the deep, deep urge to be
48:10liberated.
48:18The forces of bondages within us can play havoc even with the agencies that assist our liberation.
48:35Also religious books and conventions are examples of such possibly helpful agencies.
48:50Our inner darkness purposefully distorts them so that they are no more effective towards
48:59our liberation, and when they do get distorted, then the same darkness that distorted them
49:07now mocks them and says, see how foolish all religion is.
49:13The question is, who turned religion into this stupid display of foolishness, of ignorance,
49:25of everything that is despicable, who distorted religion to this extent?
49:33We did that, and it is indeed very remarkable, very very interesting that having distorted
49:42religion, now we say that religion is a force of corruption, it's like the Ganga emanating
49:51from the Gangotri, pure and clean, and by the time it reaches the low-lying areas, you
50:03pollute it and you add all kinds of nonsense to it, and you also divert the waters, you
50:09do this, you do that, all kinds of stupid things that we do with our rivers, and then
50:13you say, oh see how filthy the river is, is the river filthy or did you turn it filthy?
50:22And if the river is filthy, would you bury the river under some giant sand dune or something,
50:29or would you rather cleanse it and purify it, remember you need the river, and remember
50:36in spite of your need for pure water, you were the one who polluted it, that's how foolish
50:42you are, but instead of the spectacle of polluted religion becoming a reminder to us of human
50:54foolishness, to us it becomes a reminder that everything in the past was nonsensical, and
51:07today we are super smart and wise and we need to throw away all the garbage called religion,
51:16that's how stupid we are, that's how stupid mankind has always been, and that's why we
51:22need religion, but even as I say all these things, I obviously fully agree that what
51:37we see in the name of religion today is not a liberating force at all, religion is in
51:44dire need of purification, and in fact if you say that so-called religious people are
51:56worse off than non-religious or irreligious people, then I would probably agree.
52:09So it sounds like we've taken this thing that was meant to help us and in our self-destructive
52:18way we've just rebranded it, so we don't have to use it and we can continue in our ignorance.
52:29The teachings are handed over and it ultimately depends on you what you want to do with the
52:37teachings, you could turn them into something very dead, very ritualistic and use them
52:45as things of self-harm, that's what we said, even if somebody has done a great work for
52:52you in the past, it depends on you today how you want to use the work for yourself, how
52:59you want to take the work forward, it's your own intention and urge that ultimately matters,
53:05otherwise of no use are even the greatest of teachings.
53:16Thank you HRIJ, thank you Darius, this has given me a lot to think about even though
53:25the thought is limiting, we'll continue with this at some other point, it's a long and
53:37very important discussion, and I know I have other questions as well, we'll go more into it.