24 Hours in Police Custody S01E06 Honour Thy Father (10th November 2014)
24 Hours in Police Custody S01E06 Honour Thy Father
Original air date - (10th November 2014)
A Muslim Pakistani man is suspected of committing an honour crime against his 26-year-old daughter after she married an illegal immigrant. She said that her father beat her with an iron and tried to force her to leave her husband and move back in with her family. The father said her husband only married her to gain British citizenship. The father was charged with kidnapping, assault occasioning actual bodily harm and common assault. He was convicted of ABH and sentenced to 3 years imprisonment. The other two charges had been dropped.
Original air date - (10th November 2014)
A Muslim Pakistani man is suspected of committing an honour crime against his 26-year-old daughter after she married an illegal immigrant. She said that her father beat her with an iron and tried to force her to leave her husband and move back in with her family. The father said her husband only married her to gain British citizenship. The father was charged with kidnapping, assault occasioning actual bodily harm and common assault. He was convicted of ABH and sentenced to 3 years imprisonment. The other two charges had been dropped.
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CreativityTranscript
00:00If I show you some photos of your daughter, how hard did you hit her?
00:18Are you embarrassed by her?
00:22Do people look down at you and your family because of her?
00:27Do you want to have control of her?
00:30You're laughing. Why are you laughing?
00:33Is that funny?
00:45Once a suspect is in custody,
00:48the police have 24 hours to investigate and interview.
00:53After that, it's either charge or release.
00:57You have been arrested on suspicion of human trafficking.
01:00On suspicion of stalking.
01:02On suspicion of GBH.
01:04Possession and making of indecent images of children.
01:07On suspicion of conspiracy to murder.
01:09Start explaining.
01:13It's the police's job to ask what really happened.
01:17Where were you on the 28th of March?
01:19Where were you on the 28th of March?
01:21It was not me. I was not there.
01:23That could have been 101 people.
01:25But it's nothing to do with me.
01:30Police! Open the door now!
01:36Who's innocent? Who's guilty?
01:39Why would Pete say that you'd assaulted him?
01:41Because he's deluded. He's a drunk.
01:43Well, that's nonsense.
01:45Police! Drop your hand!
01:48From the streets to the interrogation rooms...
01:51Where's the knife? Did you have a knife?
01:53He makes specific threat that he is going to kill her.
01:57From the suspects to the head of CID.
02:00That's one hell of a shirt, David. I'm loving it.
02:06These are the men and women who have just 24 hours to find the evidence.
02:10I'm not letting him get away with it.
02:12I want him nixed and charged.
02:14If he kicks off, I'm out of the door.
02:16I'm a lover, not a fighter.
02:18Will they discover it before time runs out?
02:23Good news?
02:25Yeah.
02:27Got him.
02:30CLOCK TICKS
02:43Think of your most exciting sex, yeah?
02:47And you're nearly there.
02:49I can't wait till Monday. I can't wait to see him.
02:52I've got a Forest Game ticket.
02:54Six of us are going, so I'll put all the family going.
02:57Is that when they're having the break?
02:59Yeah. What are you going to sing?
03:01Champions? Freddie Mercury?
03:03We are the champions...
03:05What else do you sing?
03:07We're on our way back, we're on our way back.
03:10What else? Fuck the FA, we're on our way back.
03:13Right, I'm going to...
03:16When I tell people I'm a detective, sometimes they're a bit shocked.
03:20People outside of work.
03:24I'm a bit girly, I suppose.
03:26A bit ditzy sometimes.
03:28I'm not a typical police officer.
03:33Is that my curly whirly you're eating?
03:35Why?
03:39Do you want to come out with me and get this boy?
03:41Yeah, I don't know what address he's at, but do you?
03:43Yeah. So we'll go out and get him, shall we?
03:45I was a travel agent when I first left school,
03:47and then I was a personal banker for a couple of years,
03:50and then I went to something that was different every day,
03:53so at 22, I decided to join the police force.
03:56These stab vests? Yes.
03:58No, it comes up like that.
04:01They don't fit properly, and when you wear them,
04:04they're so uncomfortable.
04:06I haven't even... I haven't even got mine.
04:08That doesn't fit, does it?
04:10I think your problem is your top half's too high.
04:13Yeah, but look, someone could stab me in there.
04:16Yeah, they could if they... Yeah.
04:18No, but I'm being serious now. They're not fit for purpose.
04:21OK.
04:23When I was in uniform, going out to the scenes and everything like that,
04:26I wanted to take it that step further in actually investigating it,
04:29cos when you're in uniform, you leave it at the arrest stage,
04:32you don't really know what happens, whereas when you're a detective,
04:35you can follow it through, right through to the court stage,
04:38and it's a lot more interesting, I think.
04:40It's... Hold on, let me just get my bearings.
04:43I love the job.
04:44I didn't think I'd still be in it now, after nine years,
04:47but I wouldn't do anything else.
04:49Cappy, we're going.
05:01A 60-year-old man has turned himself in at the police station.
05:05This morning, a distressed 999 call was received
05:09from his 25-year-old daughter.
05:20HE SPEAKS HINDI
05:37Sergeant, I've got a gentleman in.
05:39Congratulations.
05:40Come and handle him yourself in the front office.
05:42You speak English? He's got...
05:44Is it a language line? Nah, I think he's all right.
05:47I think between you, Hob and me, we can sort it out.
05:50Between Hob and...? Pakistani, Bengali and Indian.
05:53I think we can sort it out.
05:57Give him some grudge.
05:59DIP is his daughter. Basically, she's recently been married.
06:02Family's not happy with the marriage.
06:04Where were you born in? Pakistan. Pakistan, yeah?
06:09Do you understand why you've been arrested?
06:11Do you understand the allegation your daughter has made?
06:15OK, don't talk to us about it now, because we're not interviewing you.
06:18Another set of officers will interview you,
06:21and that'll be an opportunity for you to give us your side of the story.
06:24OK?
06:32Can he have his pro-beads, you're saying? Sorry?
06:35He's asking if he can have his pro-beads.
06:38Yeah.
06:40Have you got a prayer mat in here?
06:42Yeah, we do, yeah.
06:44Quran prayer mat. It works.
06:47We've got it all. Good.
06:49Are you properly washed for the Quran?
06:51Are you properly washed to handle the Quran?
06:54Have you got one too? No.
06:59We don't have a prayer room as such, but you can pray in yourself.
07:05We'll be able to tell you.
07:07Ash, you got your iPhone on you? iPhone?
07:10When you take him down to his cell, just get the compass on...
07:13Oh, the... Have fun and show him where Macau is, will you?
07:21Luton, being one of the most diverse towns in the country,
07:25brings its own kind of problems and issues.
07:29Communities themselves, within the Muslim community,
07:32do kind of like to deal with matters
07:35themselves because calling the police is embarrassing to the community
07:40because it could be frowned upon or shame is brought on the family.
07:44Would you like us to tell anyone you're here with us?
07:47No? OK.
07:49OK, this officer's going to take you to his cell.
07:51Be patient. At some point, like I said, we'll interview you
07:54and then we'll decide what's happening after that, all right?
07:57M6 room, please.
08:05MUSIC PLAYS
08:36A quarter of Luton's population is Muslim.
08:42Hi there, you all right?
08:44In charge of maintaining good relations between the police
08:47and the community is Inspector Hobhock.
08:50Hello. How are you?
08:53How are you doing? You good?
08:56Yeah, no, about yourself?
08:58There isn't a significant amount of Muslim officers
09:01within the organisation.
09:04I'm the only Bangladeshi police officer in Bedfordshire Police,
09:07for example.
09:08You've got my number, you can contact us.
09:10Certain parts of the community probably frown upon the fact
09:13that I'm a police officer because they feel that I've signed an oath
09:16to the Queen and some people aren't against British values.
09:20How are you, all right?
09:21But there was nothing that was going to stop me.
09:23Do you know what? Watching the Bill and Tony, the area car driver,
09:27as he was known as the Bill character, made me want to join the police service
09:32and from there I used to think, you know,
09:34one day I could lock away bad people and I could help people as well.
09:40Five years ago, Bedfordshire Police set up a department
09:43to deal solely with cases of honour-based violence.
09:48Honour is... How can I explain honour?
09:55How can I... I can't explain it.
09:57I can explain it in my cultural way.
09:59It's a... Not a strength is not the word.
10:02It's like a bond within the family.
10:06It's to do with reputation.
10:08Reputation is the key.
10:10It's the key because you have such loyalty, is the big word.
10:17Bringing shame on the family is seen as a really disrespectful thing
10:21and it could lead, in the worst-case scenario, to death.
10:26It's not something we want to be dealing with.
10:35The honour crime case has been handed to Sergeant Jim Kinnear
10:39and PC Simon Day.
10:43Tonight, they'll ask the suspect to give his account of the incident.
10:47I say a statement.
10:49I make this statement to the police in relation to an assault
10:52on myself by my father.
10:54My father and my family did not approve of my marriage.
10:57They've done everything possible to end it.
11:03My dad wanted me to stay at home and just cook and clean at home.
11:08That's it.
11:11Didn't go to college, didn't go to uni, never worked.
11:14They were very strict, not very modern.
11:20I wanted to go out, work and make my life.
11:25I did tell my parents, my dad, that there's this guy I want to marry,
11:30but he didn't approve and he just flipped.
11:34I escaped from there.
11:36And then we got married.
11:40Both of my parents told me to pack my bags and leave my husband
11:43as they were taking me back to Luton.
11:45That time my husband was out, I was alone, I felt pressured,
11:48so I did what they asked me to do.
11:50I spoke to my sister in regards to the situation.
11:52I made sure I missed my husband and I wanted to see him.
11:55My father overheard the conversation.
11:58He says, who are you missing?
12:00And I told him I was talking about my husband.
12:02My father lost his temper.
12:04Angry, shaking, grabbed an iron off the...
12:08Oh, it was an iron off the ironing board.
12:10I thought it was an iron bar. It's an iron.
12:12He grabbed the iron and started beating me up, beating me up,
12:14hitting me, hitting me, hitting me.
12:16Then he strangled me, kicked me.
12:18I thought he was going to kill me that second.
12:21In front of my niece and nephew.
12:24He was saying that to my mum, I'm going to kill her,
12:26I'm going to kill her. She ruined our family name.
12:31I am aware my father will be arrested for the assault on me,
12:34but I do not want to go to court.
12:36If I return to Luton, I will be found, located by my family.
12:40I'm in fear of further assault and intimidation.
12:43I will not give evidence against my father.
12:46And we know of honour-based violence.
12:48We know where it leads.
12:50Often in the UK, it leads to sometimes murder, manslaughter,
12:54and, you know, torture.
12:56Yep.
12:57So we know of what serious it can get.
12:59So where do we want to go with this?
13:01Well, we want to interview him, obviously.
13:04That would be a good one for you as well.
13:06Yep, definitely.
13:07Yeah, HPV is always a good one to have under your belt.
13:10Yeah, OK.
13:11Right, crack on.
13:12Thanks, Odd.
13:21The only thing about safeguarding that really worries me at the moment,
13:24or concerns me about this girl,
13:26is that I believe she's gone back to her address,
13:29whether the rest of the family knows where she's at.
13:32She has said she just wants to find somewhere safe now,
13:35where she can no longer be located.
13:40Sorry.
13:41Do you want me to come back?
13:43You pray, yeah? OK.
13:45No worries. You'll be back in no time.
13:48No worries. You'll be back here soon anyway, so...
13:51We'll speak to this guy tonight
13:53and just see exactly what we can do with him.
13:58With the daughter unwilling to testify,
14:01the police must now try and probe
14:03whether her father's version of events stacks up.
14:06Over here.
14:08Have you ever been interviewed before?
14:10No, no.
14:11Never been arrested?
14:12No trouble, no nothing.
14:14Just my work.
14:15Even now, I am 60.
14:17Yeah.
14:18And I'm still on the building site doing labouring.
14:21Yes.
14:22And when I'm not working, I go up to the mosque.
14:25Does it take your religion very seriously?
14:27Gives me good.
14:28It gives me good.
14:29It gives me good.
14:30It gives me good.
14:31It gives me good.
14:32It gives me good.
14:33It gives me good.
14:34It gives me good.
14:35It gives me good.
14:36Gives me something to do, keep me peace of mind.
14:41The first question is,
14:43are you responsible for causing injuries to your daughter?
14:49No.
14:50OK.
14:51My daughter, I look after her for 26 years.
14:54Yes.
14:55After 26 years, she put me in trouble here.
14:57OK.
14:58Because she is mentally ill.
15:00She's not mentally right.
15:02That's why I was guiding her all the time
15:04and she was doing everything all right.
15:11There is some Pakistani gangs in Uttar.
15:14Yeah.
15:15What happened, these people,
15:17they do, like my daughter, mentally ill, can't think for herself.
15:22What they do, they use them to get married
15:25because they have no legal status in this country.
15:28Do you think this man, her husband, is part of this gang?
15:31Of course, he is part of this gang.
15:33He is part of this gang.
15:34OK.
15:36Passport finished two years ago.
15:38No legally can work.
15:42Take my daughter, taking our own money
15:45and beating her all the time.
15:47He's beating her?
15:48Beating her all the time.
15:54In Muslim world, when something like this happens,
15:58we think it's the biggest insult for us.
16:00OK.
16:01A daughter married like that,
16:03that's the biggest insult to the family.
16:05OK.
16:06If your daughters are getting married,
16:09you don't know, your wife don't know,
16:11your children don't know,
16:14do you think it's good or bad?
16:16No, I'd like to know.
16:18Yeah, I'd like to know.
16:19Because I think it's the biggest insult to the Muslim world.
16:24OK.
16:26MUSIC PLAYS
16:29Tell us what happened on the 27th.
16:32Yes, what she said.
16:34Yes, yeah, well, what happened on the 27th?
16:36No, I mean, if you tell me what she said,
16:39then I can tell you whether this is true or not true.
16:42Yeah, can you tell me what happened?
16:45I just got into an argument.
16:47OK.
16:48What she's saying, I beat her with this and that,
16:51that's what these guys been beating her up,
16:53and I go up there and I pick her up and bring her home.
16:56So then what happened?
16:58Well, then nothing happened.
17:00Did anything happen at all, any other arguments?
17:03Well, after that, I go to sleep.
17:05I go in the morning, I get up, I go to work.
17:07Has anything happened between you?
17:09Anything physical?
17:11Not far as I know.
17:19I'll see you in a minute, then, yeah?
17:22Yeah, go on, go on, I'll take it for you.
17:27There's your water.
17:34Have we got any cloths?
17:37He wants to wipe his toilet seat, it's disgusting.
17:46There you go.
17:49There's your tissues.
17:52And there's a bit of wet.
17:55All right.
18:02You've done what you had to do,
18:04and at least she's safe for tonight.
18:07They're going to put her in a hostel or something for tonight,
18:10bed, breakfast, or hostel.
18:12She's agreed to that for one night, until we get him dealt with.
18:15OK.
18:16Great.
18:18Come on.
18:46Morning.
18:48Hi, how you doing?
18:50Asleep? Do you want to eat breakfast?
18:53Do you want a drink?
18:55No? OK.
18:59M1, common assault on his nan.
19:02She's in her late 70s.
19:04Apparently it's not the first time he's assaulted her.
19:07Don't know how he'll be this morning,
19:09but he'll be off the court soon enough, anyway.
19:12M3, he is a harassment.
19:15They found...
19:17Hobbs said he was wanded and didn't have anything on him.
19:20Ash said he found a lighter on him.
19:22He said it was just tucked in his waistband.
19:24Hobbs has a feeling it was hidden in an orifice.
19:27He was intoxicated. He'll be fine now, I dare say.
19:30But anyway, he'll be out of your hair soon enough, no issues.
19:33Yeah? Is that a joke?
19:35Out of his hair?
19:37He hasn't got any.
19:41M6.
19:44He's an honour-based violence job.
19:47A young girl, she married against her family's wishes.
19:52Same religion, but they didn't want her to marry him,
19:55so Dad took it upon himself to attack her with an iron.
20:03Good morning. Could you put me through to Safeguarding Adults?
20:07The daughter's file has now been passed
20:10to the force's dedicated honour-based violence department.
20:17I deal with the high-risk instances that come in,
20:21and I'm up to my ears.
20:24In the last six months, I've had roundabout 120 referrals
20:29made directly to me,
20:31and that's incidences of forced marriage or honour abuse.
20:36OK, thanks, then. Bye-bye. Bye.
20:39It's not a religious matter.
20:42No religion endorses honour violence.
20:47The thing that makes me most angry about all of it
20:50is how can anybody treat their daughters like this?
20:55I've got a daughter.
20:57I can't imagine for one minute subjecting her to abuse.
21:03It's not honour, is it? It's dishonour.
21:06Honour is the wrong word for it.
21:10The severity of the case means it's been passed up to CID.
21:15PC Esther Morris will brief DC Rachel Chandler.
21:19Arranged marriage? No. Love marriage.
21:22And that marriage is all right? Yes, fine marriage.
21:25In the past, these cases weren't dealt with properly.
21:29People didn't speak about it.
21:32And when they did, a lot of the victims weren't believed.
21:35And we have to believe them.
21:37Don't have a choice. We have to believe them.
21:39You know, we have one chance.
21:42And that's a favourite saying amongst forced marriages and honour abuse.
21:47One chance to get it right, to save these people.
21:51Otherwise it might be too late.
21:54Dad's beaten her with the iron.
21:56He's done this in front of a two-year-old and a six-year-old,
22:00her sister's children, and in front of the sisters and mum.
22:04None of them will make a statement.
22:07They will all side with the dad.
22:09What I find a little bit worrying is there's a warning marker
22:13for mental health and learning difficulties.
22:18I've contacted the mental health team,
22:21SEPT and social services, adult social services,
22:24and there is no issue with her mental health at all.
22:28Has she got a worker there, a mental health worker or something?
22:31No, she hasn't. There's nothing.
22:34They've got referrals from members of her family saying she's mental.
22:40Which comes into play with something else, actually.
22:43Apparently he was first account interviewed last night.
22:46Father turns around and says, it's a pack of lies.
22:49She's mental. She's mental. No, she's not. She is not mental.
22:53When did he get a nickname?
22:551928, last night.
22:57We'd better get on with it, then.
22:59Cheers, guys. Thank you.
23:02If you could do the MG3 for me, please, Andy.
23:05Can you start typing it?
23:08I've heard this about you, Rachel.
23:11You've got all that.
23:13Yeah, if you can start scanning it all for me so I'm ready to go to CPS.
23:17If you go and do the interview...
23:19No, I'm not scanning. I'm a victim.
23:22I'd be disappointed if he's not removed.
23:26I'd be disappointed if he's not remanded.
23:28Ten minutes on my death.
23:31Have you been sunbedding again? No.
23:34Is it out of a bottle, your tan, is it?
23:37Have a seat. Have a seat.
23:39Oh, they're nice and white.
23:56An honour-based violence crime is a good crime to investigate.
24:00It's got lots of different aspects around it.
24:03You want to make sure you cover every single angle.
24:07I feel so sorry for the victim.
24:09Obviously, I've been brought up in a different background
24:12and I'm not aware all this goes on.
24:14It's only dirty.
24:17DC Chandler's goal is to remand the suspect in custody.
24:21DC Chandler's goal is to remand the suspect in custody
24:24in the hope that his family will feel safe enough
24:27to give evidence against him.
24:3324 hours isn't long,
24:35especially when you need to get the victim's statements,
24:38the offender's interview, all other aspects of it.
24:41You do need further time.
24:45Rachel, what's the matter? What's the matter?
24:47Nothing. You're very quiet.
24:49Jo, I'm trying to get on with this.
24:51It is frustrating, but I like the pace of it.
24:53It's a challenge to get a charging station within that time.
24:57So, why have you got to do a second interview?
24:59I told you a bit, Cathy. I know why we've got to do it, don't worry.
25:02All right.
25:08Rach, from an evidential point of view,
25:10did we recover the iron that she was hit with?
25:12No. No?
25:14Simon Hancock is DC Chandler's superior officer.
25:19Don't underestimate Rachel Chandler
25:21for, on the face of it, how she talks.
25:24Rubbery!
25:26Behind that, there is a very intelligent person.
25:30She is actually waiting to go onto the major crime unit
25:33that deal with murders, kidnapping, child deaths, stuff like that.
25:38She's got what we call the investigative mindset.
25:42But you'd have thought you would have recovered the iron?
25:45You'd have thought so, wouldn't you, for tests?
25:48Well, you'd have recovered it as well, because it's evidence.
25:51Yeah.
25:52And then they could look at the size of the iron plate
25:54to see about injuries and stuff if it comes down to it, couldn't they?
25:57It's a consideration, isn't it?
26:03It is Rachel.
26:05Oh, we came round to see about the incident
26:08that happened with your sister yesterday.
26:11Oh, really?
26:12Are you willing to give a statement to the police?
26:21And you're willing to go to court to say that, are you?
26:26Yeah, if you give a statement, you can be called to court.
26:32OK, thank you. Thanks, bye.
26:36Joyce had a call from one of her sisters,
26:38and she's saying that on Friday at nine o'clock
26:42she had a phone call from the victim saying,
26:45my husband's beating me up, and she put her mum on conference call
26:49and said, can you come and get me?
26:51So, neither do I, but they've all been talking now, haven't they,
26:54and discussed...
26:55Yeah, don't believe her.
26:56Why would she do that to her?
26:57Because the dad is such an influence on them.
27:01BELL RINGS
27:06Who do you want to ring?
27:08The wife, actually.
27:10My sergeant has asked if you can be interviewed
27:12before you can ring your wife.
27:14Because it's a family issue, we need you to be interviewed first.
27:23Can you hear me, buddy?
27:26Can you hear me, buddy?
27:40Hiya. Hiya, my name's Rachel.
27:43I'm a detective at Luton Police Station.
27:46Hiya, you all right?
27:48There's been a breakthrough in the investigation.
27:50The suspect's daughter has accepted protection
27:53as a significant witness.
27:55She will now testify against her father.
28:00I'm trying to keep him at the police station,
28:02but I will let you know, OK?
28:04OK, that's excellent.
28:05If you keep this number and I'll give you a call
28:07and let you know what's happened, is that all right?
28:10Bye-bye.
28:13BELL RINGS
28:23The suspect has been in custody for 15 hours.
28:27So far, he's refused the offer of a lawyer.
28:31OK, so that's why I'm asking, do you want a solicitor?
28:34We're offering you free legal advice.
28:36Yeah, if you have one.
28:38OK, let me sort that out for you, OK?
28:41I'm going to go and sort that out for you now, OK?
28:59The central mosque in Luton has learnt of the suspect's arrest.
29:03Its president has asked for a meeting
29:05with the police's community cohesion inspector, Hobhock.
29:10Within the Muslim community,
29:12they don't want to almost trouble the police to an extent.
29:16The Muslim community like to kind of go to the mosque leaders
29:21or faith leaders before coming to the police
29:24to try and resolve their situation.
29:27Hi, as-salamu alaykum. You all right?
29:29You all right? Inspector Hobhock.
29:32How are you?
29:34I've been...
29:35We wanted to meet you for a little while, actually, so...
29:38You're welcome. OK.
29:43You know, he's been in this mosque for the last 20 years now.
29:48OK.
29:50You know, he prays here.
29:52Mostly he comes in the evenings or weekends.
29:55You know, he's a very good person.
29:58What the wife told me, this is a story.
30:01My husband never beat my daughter.
30:03This is all a lie. They framed him up.
30:05That's what she said, yeah.
30:07There's a great concern in the community.
30:10The guys coming from abroad,
30:13especially, you know, visit with us,
30:15they come here and they pray on our girls.
30:20You know, when the girls go out,
30:22they make them friends, then they tell them they love them.
30:26They show them that they're millionaires, so and so.
30:29And they trap them, yeah?
30:31And then they marry them for the reason to stay in the country.
30:35Country.
30:36This has happened in our community a lot, yeah? A lot.
30:40But as a... I have five daughters as well, yeah?
30:44If something happens like that, I won't like it either, yeah?
30:48You know, I've given choice to my daughters,
30:51wherever they want to get married,
30:53but not the guys, you know, coming as a visit visa.
30:57You know, you go to check on the guy,
30:59was he a visitor before he go married? Yes.
31:03Then he's framed up, the girl's father as well.
31:07I know you talk about framed up a lot here,
31:09but the police are duty bound to investigate it impartially
31:12and they'll look at the vulnerability of this victim, for example.
31:15You know, they will do everything possible to get best evidence from it.
31:33Part of the father's story has proved to be true.
31:36The immigration records of his son-in-law have been checked.
31:41I know that he's here illegally and they are looking to support him,
31:44so that could be the case, but just because he's here illegally
31:47doesn't mean that he's assaulted her.
31:49OK, and when you were at home, when your dad came to get you,
31:53your husband wasn't there, was he?
31:57He's gone now. OK, that's excellent.
31:59From speaking to her, I don't think she has got mental health issues.
32:02I think she's just a vulnerable girl who's not street wise.
32:05Bye-bye.
32:07I think she is in love with him and she's genuinely married to him
32:10because she wants to be with him.
32:12Whether he feels the same about her, I don't know.
32:23Right. There are several other instances.
32:27Esther Morris has discovered that the daughter says
32:30her father has assaulted her on more than one occasion.
32:33She disclosed that she'd been assaulted by her father
32:36on the 14th of the 3rd.
32:38He had slapped her around the face after she'd gone into his room.
32:41She talked to him, informing him that she wanted to get married.
32:47She's alleged abuse between 2004 and 2012.
32:53He regularly hits her and abuses her.
33:05Esther Morris has now spoken to the police force
33:08that's looking after the daughter as a significant witness.
33:11And she's actually said to them that she was under threat to go back.
33:18Dad actually said to her,
33:20if you don't come back with us, you're going to get your head smashed.
33:23Can we get that in a state, can I?
33:25Yeah. I don't know if you want to give them a ring if you carry more bones.
33:29Hi, is that Simon?
33:31Simon, it's DC Chandler from Bedfordshire Police.
33:34We've got a prisoner in custody at the moment
33:37and offensive kidnaps have been disclosed.
33:40And then the kidnaps happened in your area.
33:42Now an allegation of kidnaps been made,
33:44the chances of charging and remanding the suspect have strengthened.
33:48But I just need a couple of lines in a statement
33:51saying that she got in the car with him because her dad's threatened her,
33:55which I haven't got in a statement already.
33:57The problem is, I'm on a tight clock.
34:02Thank you, bye.
34:04He goes, oh, you're a star dealing with it for me.
34:10So what are we going with CPS for kidnap? For kidnap and assault.
34:13I think that's still a good tactic to put it to CPS anyway
34:16and let them underwrite the decision.
34:18We've got to. We're going to protect her.
34:20If she's killed, then at least we've tried.
34:33The suspect's solicitor has arrived
34:35and will be sitting in on DC Chandler's interview.
34:39At this time, I am going to further arrest you for kidnap, OK?
34:43So you don't have to say anything, but it may harm an offence.
34:46You've not mentioned when questions start to be laid to you in court,
34:49anything you do say may be given in evidence.
34:53I need to ask you, before we start the interview,
34:56are you responsible for the offence of ABH?
35:00Are you responsible for the offence of kidnap?
35:06If an offender goes no comment in an interview,
35:08I look at it as if there's something to hide.
35:11Either they've committed the offence or there's aspects around it
35:14which is likely to put them in the situation
35:16and being involved in the offence.
35:18With no comment, it does raise suspicion levels.
35:21We've spoken to your daughter.
35:24She said that you and your wife told her
35:27to leave her husband and to come back to Luton and to pack her bags.
35:32Why was that said?
35:34Did you threaten to assault her if she did not come back to Luton?
35:38You're laughing? Why are you laughing?
35:41Is that funny?
35:44Or is she making that up and that's why you're laughing?
35:55She's told her sister how much she's missing her husband
35:58and how much she wants to go back to him.
36:00How did you react to this?
36:03You weren't happy, were you?
36:05You got angry, you started shaking with rage, you were that angry.
36:10Why do you not want her to go back to this husband?
36:14Do you want to have control of her?
36:17Do you scare her so you have got control of her?
36:29OK, if I show you some photos of your daughter,
36:32the first photo showing her face,
36:34you can see all the reddening around there.
36:37Have you caused that?
36:39Was she like that when you picked her up?
36:42The answer to that question would be no
36:44because you've told us that you picked her up and she had no injuries.
36:50So those injuries must have been caused
36:52since she came back and she was in your house, weren't they?
36:59How hard did you hit her?
37:01How hard did you hit her?
37:07Are you embarrassed by her?
37:10Does she cause problems to your family?
37:14Do people look down at you and your family because of her?
37:18Her marrying this man that you don't know,
37:21has that caused problems for you and the community?
37:27OK.
37:28Is there anything you want to say before I turn the tapes off?
37:31Is there anyone I can speak to which would disprove your involvement
37:34in the events of ABH or kidnap?
37:39If there's nothing else you want to say, the time is now 12.14
37:44and you'll be concluded.
37:59DC Rachel Chandler is waiting to hear from the Crown Prosecution Service.
38:06Kathy, are you making tea? No.
38:08I can't get up and leave the phone because of her CPS phone.
38:11Strange, isn't it? Can you hear the phone ring over there, Sarge?
38:14I should think you can hear the phone ring from the town centre.
38:17There's no reason why she can't get the kettle on.
38:21She wants to convince the CPS to remand the suspect to prison
38:25and charge him with kidnap.
38:27PHONE RINGS
38:29Hello, Robbery.
38:32Hi. It is.
38:36Although he's outstanding, obviously, in our view,
38:40the mum and there's a sister,
38:42obviously, we've got problems at the moment with them providing evidence
38:45because, obviously, he's going to go home.
38:47If, obviously, he's remanded and he's locked up,
38:49there is potentially those statements which we can get that way.
38:54But, obviously, there's risk to the victim.
38:57It will be very, very difficult to prove the kidnap side of things.
39:02I'm not going to charge it today
39:05because what I'm going to do, I'm going to say he's bailable
39:08because of poor code text.
39:10Is he saying they don't believe we're about the kidnap side of things?
39:14Let me just speak to him.
39:16Hello.
39:18Oh, it's DS Hancock. Are you all right?
39:20I'm all right in thinking, then, that what we're saying is
39:23is that the complainant, we don't really believe what she's saying.
39:30What she's saying is, is that against her will,
39:34she was taken to Luton.
39:36Based on what's happened in the past,
39:39she perceived that to be that if she didn't do it,
39:43she'd face harm.
39:45Yes.
39:47Yes, that's a kidnap made out, isn't it?
39:50No, let's take it a stage at a time, cos I really don't understand that.
39:54So, if I say to somebody, get in my fucking car,
39:56otherwise I'm going to smash your face in,
39:58and they get in my car,
40:00that does not constitute fraud under a kidnap legislation.
40:03Is that what we're saying?
40:05My perspective, and I do mean this,
40:08is making sure that justice is seen to be done
40:12and that the victim of crime gets looked after
40:15and protected in a way that I would want one of my family members
40:20to be looked after and protected.
40:22Well, would you not, then?
40:24So, if somebody pulled up next to you and said,
40:26get in my car, otherwise I'm going to shoot you...
40:29Yeah.
40:34So, what I'm asking you to do is just be specific
40:36about what point of the kidnap you don't feel as though
40:39we've demonstrated under the lower-threshold test.
40:42Why not?
40:51At the end of the day, I'm sure we're singing from the same hymn sheet.
40:55In the honour-based violence, cases are very delicate and sensitive.
41:00And, well, as you'll appreciate,
41:03the evidence-gathering is frustrated sometimes
41:06when the head of the family
41:08is exactly...
41:10So, I would hope that we would stand up and say
41:12there is a very real and evident danger
41:15to the complainant, to the complainant's husband,
41:19to the police not being able to secure the evidence
41:23to prove one way or the other who's telling the truth in this case.
41:28I know where you're coming from.
41:30There's an argument from both sides, but let's have that in court.
41:34I think from a prosecution point of view,
41:36we should be protecting the complainant and the investigation.
41:43No problem. What is your name?
41:46Andrew. Simon, by the way.
41:48Thanks for the chat. I'll put you back on to Rachel. Bye.
41:51Hiya.
42:05We don't know where this guy is.
42:07He might not realise what an inflammatory town Luton is for this sort of, you know...
42:11Why don't you just say to him, get in my fucking car now,
42:13I'm going to beat you up, you'll be all right, you'll get away with it.
42:16He seems like quite... He seems like quite...
42:19At least you can... You know, he seems like quite a nice chap.
42:25The CPS will call back when they've reached a decision.
42:29Cathy?
42:31Yes, all right, I'll put the kettle on.
42:34Are you going to murder her?
42:36Don't you... Don't start blinking your eyelids at me!
42:40Show me your wobblies!
42:43PHONE RINGS
42:45Hiya. Bear with me a minute.
42:47Where's Hank? Can you phone Hank? It's urgent, Lee.
42:49Whenever we call CPS now, we always get Manchester.
42:54You the best.
42:56We'll decide if you're the best in a minute after this phone call.
42:59Andy? Andy, you all right?
43:02Are you all right?
43:12No, it's... Thanks for reconsidering it.
43:20That's brilliant. Thanks.
43:22He needs an MG7. I'll just get an MG7 for you now.
43:25OK, we'll do it. OK.
43:29Yeah, he re-read it and he's, um, convinced.
43:45I'm going to charge, yeah, for three offences.
43:48Yeah.
43:51So, what are they going... What have they gone for, then?
43:54Kidnap. Wow!
43:57Aviation common assault.
44:03OK, you're charged on the following offences.
44:05You don't have to say anything, but it may harm an offence.
44:07If not mentioned now, something which you may later rely on in court.
44:10Anything you do say may be given in evidence.
44:13Kidnap.
44:15Act of bodily harm.
44:17Common assault.
44:21Do you want to say anything to those charges?
44:23No? OK.
44:25In this case, I've made an assumption
44:27that if I allow you to leave this custody,
44:29you'll go on to interfere with this witness,
44:31that is, your daughter, OK,
44:33and or commit further offences, OK?
44:36Why would I make more trouble?
44:38I don't know. People do it all the time.
44:40I don't know.
44:43I don't know. People do it all the time.
44:45Kidnap is a very serious offence.
44:48So what more are you capable of doing?
44:51Personally, we don't want to find out, OK?
45:02Sorry?
45:04DC Chandler.
45:06Chandler.
45:08I am underestimated sometimes.
45:10I am switched on and I do know what's going on out there.
45:13But why am I going to make more trouble?
45:15I'm already in big trouble. Why am I making more trouble?
45:17People do. People get charged with things
45:20and they go out and interfere with things,
45:22which is why you're getting kept here.
45:24Madam, maybe you're getting a lot of misunderstanding.
45:27At the end of the day, you're staying here, OK?
45:30Do you want to pop your shoes off?
45:33I hope if he has done it, then he is convicted,
45:36cos I want to make sure that that girl is safe
45:38and she can get on and live with her life and be happy.
45:59Right, madam. Thank you.
46:09You can't forget what has happened to you, no matter what.
46:14How has it changed you as a person?
46:18Well, I lost everything.
46:21Everything's...
46:23I'm alone now, so I just have a husband,
46:26don't have anyone else, no family, nothing.
46:29They hate me.
46:32I've been disowned.
46:34I've been left alone.
46:36I've been disowned.
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