" Molana Arhay Hain??" Aniqa Nisar Ke Sawal Par Murtaza Wahab Ne Kya Kaha?? Ahem Guftagu
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00:00Now we will come to the important issues and cheap justice, but one thing is very surprising for me Mr. Murtaz Abab.
00:05You just said that you have not seen the Musawwida. Now it is not being called Musawwida.
00:09By the way, yesterday Mr. Rana Sanawala has given it the name of working paper in our program.
00:13Because it was not an official thing which was approved by the cabinet, so it was called working paper.
00:17Now you also did not see the working paper.
00:20Then Maulana Ghafoor Haidari who came and spoke to the press outside also said that we also did not see the working paper.
00:26But the interesting thing is that this was the news of ARY News and this news is correct.
00:31That the working paper which was also called as raw draft by Bilawal Bhutto Zardari
00:36was also with Bilawal Bhutto Zardari and also with Maulana Ghafoor Haidari.
00:40So why did the leadership not share the working paper with those people who were involved in the meetings and discussions?
00:52I am requesting you that in the discussions you were engaging on the point of view.
00:59The working paper is approved by the cabinet and after that it had to be included in the parliamentary committee.
01:05Then it would have become Musawwida.
01:07To the best of my knowledge, listen to me.
01:11To the best of my knowledge, the perspective of the Wafaaqi government that it was not approved by the cabinet.
01:16To the best of my knowledge, it was not approved.
01:19In the parliamentary committee, there was a discussion on broad based ideas.
01:23In which there was a discussion about the constitutional court.
01:26And the different political leaders stated their perspectives.
01:30And when Bilawal Sahab met Maulana Fazlur Rahman and when he met the Prime Minister,
01:37both the times he conveyed his point of view that yes, there should be a constitutional court in this country.
01:44How will the constitutional court be constituted?
01:47What will be its principles?
01:49It is necessary to deliberate and agree with the consensus.
01:54But conceptually, the People's Party agrees that yes, there should be a constitutional court in this country.
02:00Sir, where did you have to keep it, Mr. Murtaza Wahab?
02:03Because till that night, till the night of Sunday, we were expecting that Musawwida has just been passed.
02:09The constitutional amendment has just come and things are going to be streamlined.
02:12The government's burden has become heavy.
02:14The burden of its allies has become heavy.
02:16Where is the problem?
02:19See, again, what you were expecting, all these conspiracies were going on.
02:24But naturally, to do anything like this, two prerequisites were necessary.
02:29One prerequisite was that the government's...
02:32I am sorry, I am cutting you short, Mr. Murtaza.
02:33I am sorry, I am cutting you short.
02:34We were not expecting that.
02:36Actually, that expectation was increased when the meeting continued on Saturday and Sunday.
02:40And all the senators were made to sit.
02:43And then they were sent to the lodges.
02:46And then they were told that they will be called.
02:48So, this expectation was increased by the government and the allies.
02:54Well, there is a difference between increasing expectations and reality.
02:58I am requesting you that the basic principle of legislation,
03:03according to that principle, if the government moves a bill,
03:06then it has to be approved by its cabinet.
03:09And the second thing is that if something is started from the parliament,
03:13for example, the speaker has formed a committee to strengthen the parliament for the reformation of the constitution.
03:21Or it has to come through that committee.
03:24These two prerequisites were not fulfilled.
03:27Nothing could be finalized in that way.
03:31So, I think that perhaps that consensus could not be built,
03:35because of which these things could not be formalized.
03:38Now the meeting has been extended.
03:41The government has time, its allies have time,
03:44the opposition parties also have time to sit together
03:48and propose a solution to the people of Pakistan
03:53in which there is respect for the institutions,
03:56and at the same time, you can solve the issues of justice for the people.
04:03Please tell us that Bilawal Bhutto Zardari has said,
04:06I have no doubt that the next Chief Justice will be Mansoor Ali Shah.
04:12This doubt was arising due to this constitutional amendment.
04:16Should we say that this constitutional amendment will take place after the arrival of a new Chief Justice?
04:24No, I will explain it to you.
04:27What Bilawal has said is absolutely correct.
04:31Because according to the current law,
04:36the senior most judge of the Supreme Court becomes the Chief Justice of the Supreme Court.
04:42So, after the retirement of Qazi Faidiza,
04:45Justice Mansoor Ali Shah is the senior most judge.
04:49And according to the law, it is his right to be the Chief Justice of the Supreme Court.
04:53So, we are saying that in the constitutional amendment of Mr. Bhutto Zardari,
04:56the panel of five judges will be selected by the Prime Minister.
05:00That part is over.
05:03I have told you that such a thing has not been finalized yet.
05:08But this seems to imply that if Mansoor Ali Shah is coming,
05:13and at this time, according to the law and the constitution,
05:16the senior most judge will be the Chief Justice,
05:18then it means that if the constitutional amendment comes before that time,
05:22then that matter will not take place.
05:24That is, the matter of the panel of five judges will not take place.
05:28Or it may be that the constitutional amendment will take place after the arrival of Mr. Mansoor Ali Shah.
05:33Let me make it easy for you.
05:36If the constitutional amendment comes from the let and becomes the constitutional court,
05:40then you never know.
05:41Who knows, Mr. Mansoor Ali Shah may be his Chief Justice.
05:43There is no guarantee that who will become the Chief Justice.
05:46It is written in it.
05:48It is written somewhere that who will become the Chief Justice.
05:51You are saying that Mansoor Ali Shah can be the judge of the new constitutional court.
05:58Absolutely.
06:01The criteria that is being quoted everywhere is that
06:06either he can be a judge of the present Supreme Court,
06:11or a judge of the retired Supreme Court,
06:14or a judge of the High Court,
06:17or a practicing lawyer.
06:20So, I think that Mansoor Ali Shah meets all the criteria.
06:23Let's extrapolate this scenario.
06:27If you are saying that Mansoor Ali Shah,
06:29because I have no doubt that Mansoor Ali Shah will be the next Chief Justice of Pakistan.
06:35But you are saying that Mansoor Ali Shah can be the Chief Justice of the constitutional court.
06:39Then who will become the Chief Justice in the Supreme Court?
06:41Mr. Murtaza Wahab.
06:43Again, there will be senior judge after him.
06:47Neither I nor you can change the procedure in the constitution.
06:51We have to follow what is stated in the constitution.
06:54The constitution says that this will be the procedure.
06:57The constitution says that this will be the procedure to amend the constitution.
07:01The constitution says that the affairs of the state,
07:04will be exercised by the people of Pakistan through their chosen representatives.
07:09Neither Murtaza Wahab can do it,
07:11nor Anika can do it,
07:12nor anyone who walks on the road can do it.
07:14The decision has to be taken by the people of Pakistan.
07:19Tell me Mr. Murtaza Wahab, is Maulana Wahab coming?
07:25Maulana Wahab is not coming.
07:27Again, I am not a translator of the JUI.
07:30No, this is an easy way.
07:32Mr. Murtaza Wahab.
07:33This is Mr. Zardari's departure.
07:36This is an easy way that I am not a translator.
07:39But Mr. Zardari's departure is a certain stake of the People's Party.
07:42It cannot be completely brushed aside.
07:46If you had given me a chance to answer,
07:49then I would have commented on this.
07:51I said that naturally I am not a translator of the JUI,
07:55so I cannot speak on their behalf.
07:57I can tell you my assessment,
07:59because I was present in the two engagements with Maulana Wahab,
08:02of Bilawal Putto and Mr. Zardari.
08:05Maulana Wahab is fundamentally in favour of the establishment of a constitutional court.
08:09He has no objection to the establishment of a constitutional court.
08:13And he and Mr. Bilawal, to this extent, are on the same page.
08:18And perhaps the federal government is also on the same page.
08:21Now, what will be the parameters of that constitutional court?
08:26I think it needs to be deliberated and chalked out.
08:30As soon as a consensus is built,
08:32I think Mr. Maulana can come to it.
08:35In principle, he has not opposed it.