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(Current Affairs)
Host:
- Kashif Abbasi
Guests:
- Chairman PPP Bilawal Bhutto Zardari
Exclusive Interview of Bilawal Bhutto Zardari
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(Current Affairs)
Host:
- Kashif Abbasi
Guests:
- Chairman PPP Bilawal Bhutto Zardari
Exclusive Interview of Bilawal Bhutto Zardari
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NewsTranscript
00:00Assalamu alaikum dear viewers, you are watching the program with Kashif Abbasi, with us Bilawal
00:26Bhutto Zardari is present, he is the chairman of Pakistan People's People's Party.
00:29Bilawal sahib, Assalamu alaikum.
00:31Assalamu alaikum, Kashif Bhai.
00:32Bilawal sahib, the backdrop of this is that Kamran Murtaza sahib spoke yesterday on a TV channel.
00:41I will read out the conversation and let you listen to it, if you want I can make you listen to it as well.
00:45I have not seen it, you please listen to it.
00:47I will let you listen to it, then you can listen to what he said about you and that night,
00:52the day this dispute was discussed between you and Maulana sahib.
00:55I will say the whole thing with full responsibility.
00:58The day he had to vote, the night before that, at around 2 o'clock at midnight, he sent it to Maulana sahib's house in a black envelope.
01:08We were just starting to read it, when Bilawal came.
01:11So I said to Bilawal sahib, Chairman, have you seen this in Article 8?
01:16Bilawal sahib said, yes, I am helpless and there is no other way, this kind of impression was given.
01:21We said to Bilawal sahib, what is this matter?
01:23So Bilawal sahib started to tell about his helplessness.
01:27Bilawal sahib said to me, you should agitate this, I was not able to act on this, but it is our helplessness.
01:34Bilawal sahib, I did not think that one day I would say that when it comes to human rights and constitution,
01:40Maulana sahib must be protecting it and you are watching a people's party drama.
01:43Maulana sahib, first of all, you should know that whether it is Pakistan People's Party or Fazul Rehman sahib's JUI,
01:53I do not know much about Murtaza sahib's past.
01:56But I can tell you that I had a lot of disagreements with Maulana Fazul Rehman sahib on a lot of political issues.
02:05As far as the role of the constitution and the role of the democratic system in this country is concerned,
02:11Pakistan People's Party has the same role as Maulana Fazul Rehman's JUI.
02:17If this constitution is successful in this country, then Pakistan People's Party and after that the Ulema of Islam Jamaat have the biggest role.
02:32As far as human rights are concerned, you can look at the constitution of Pakistan People's Party in 1973 or any other constitution.
02:43If you have any human rights in this country, if you have any freedom of the press in this country,
02:50you can take the protection of any part of the constitution because Pakistan People's Party put it.
02:57It gave you that right and obviously its protection is my responsibility.
03:01That is why, Mr. Bilawal, I think everyone will say that whenever it comes to the protection of the constitution and human rights, people look at the People's Party.
03:09And that is why there was a problem that you were watching the drama when all this was happening, didn't you see all this?
03:14What I have heard on your show, unfortunately, there has been a miscommunication.
03:24If Mr. Kamran had picked up Mr. Muqtada Wahab's phone, we would have clarified it in person by now.
03:32However, there was no compulsion, no fear, nor was there any fear.
03:39I can tell you that whether it is Bilawal Bhutto Zardari, Martyr Respected Benazir Bhutto,
03:45or Sadr Zardari, or Qaida-e-Awam Martyr Tulfiqar Ali Bhutto,
03:48we do not do politics of fear, nor do we do politics of compulsion.
03:53Nor has Moulana Fazlur Rehman Sahib ever done this kind of politics in his past.
04:00Again, I do not know what Mr. Kamran Muqtada's past is.
04:05As far as the point that you are talking about,
04:09that night, when I arrived, Mr. Kamran Muqtada started reading the draft, not before that.
04:18Along with that, I have a habit that I want to read it myself, I want to understand it myself.
04:29So, in every aspect, in every draft, in every shift,
04:34although I am not a lawyer,
04:38but the point that Kamran Muqtada was making from a legal aspect,
04:43I could have answered it, and I was answering it there as well.
04:47As far as the amendment of Article 8 is concerned,
04:51he is absolutely right in saying that the government's proposal,
04:56not only the amendment of Article 8,
05:00but along with that, Article 23,
05:04they wanted to establish the military courts in a complete manner,
05:09through a new amendment, and along with that, the amendment of Article 8.
05:13The amendment of Article 8 was presented by the government earlier.
05:17In that, there was mention of personnel, of their installations,
05:21and with examples from all over the world, this amendment was presented to me.
05:27When I read that amendment, from my own party,
05:31I understood that the protection that we can put in this amendment,
05:36is that we must put in the condition of active duty,
05:41so that the people of Pakistan, the citizens of Pakistan,
05:45are protected.
05:47When this matter was raised with Kamran Muqtada Sahib,
05:51Maulana Fazl Rahman Sahib,
05:53they raised another objection.
05:57I did not oppose that objection,
06:00I accepted that objection,
06:02that the objection that you are raising, you are raising it correctly.
06:06Sir, but why didn't you raise this objection?
06:09Sir, did you hear my answer?
06:12Yes, I heard it.
06:14The proposal of the government in Article 8,
06:19which was the objection of Maulana Fazl Rahman Sahib,
06:23or Kamran Muqtada Sahib,
06:25that night, before sitting in the committee,
06:28the next day, in which we had to discuss this matter in detail,
06:32I proposed an intermediate way,
06:35through which we could address this issue.
06:39At that time, Kamran Muqtada Sahib was not present,
06:43but the other members of the JEOI were present in that room.
06:46For them, I felt that it was a compromised way,
06:50an appropriate way.
06:53The next day, when I again sat with Kamran Muqtada Sahib,
06:57in the parliament, when we were waiting for Maulana Sahib,
07:01whenever I could sit with him on any point of this amendment,
07:05I spoke to him.
07:07He had his own handwritten notes.
07:09With regard to the amendment of Article 8,
07:11he said that his personal opinion is that
07:15the amendment of Article 8 should not be amended.
07:21I told him,
07:23you go and tell me,
07:25this is your personal opinion,
07:27and if this is your community's opinion,
07:31then I will speak to the government,
07:33and we will get rid of the entire amendment that you are proposing.
07:38Kamran Muqtada Sahib or Maulana Fazal Rehman Sahib,
07:42we were not getting an answer.
07:45Until Maulana Fazal Rehman Sahib reached the committee room,
07:49I got rid of the amendment of Article 8,
07:52on which Maulana Sahib and the Pakistan People's Party had a different opinion.
07:57I got rid of the amendment of Article 8,
07:59on which the government had a different opinion.
08:01Along with that, I got rid of his objection to Article 51,
08:05on which I got rid of the amendment of Article 51.
08:07But the conversation that is going to take place,
08:09the constitution that is going to be drafted,
08:11the dialogue that is going to take place,
08:13I cannot do that through television.
08:15We have to do that in person.
08:18So I am giving you a message,
08:20to Kamran Muqtada Sahib,
08:22that from tomorrow,
08:24Wahab Sahib is trying to call you.
08:27Maulana Fazal Rehman Sahib and I,
08:29in the presence of all of us,
08:31had decided that
08:33we had to sit down immediately.
08:35Kamran Muqtada Sahib had asked for two days.
08:38Those two days are going to pass.
08:40We have to sit down.
08:42If this is the seriousness of the JUI,
08:44and I understand,
08:46I understand that this is the seriousness.
08:48That is why we are not doing this from today,
08:50we have been doing this for three generations.
08:52Kamran Muqtada Sahib has requested that
08:54while he is taking out time for television,
08:56the work for which we have decided
08:58that we have to sit together
09:00and make a consensus document
09:02of the Pakistan People's Party
09:04and the Jamaat-e-Ulema-e-Islam
09:06which we can go ahead
09:08and make a consensus
09:10with the government
09:12and other Jamaats.
09:14This is the political path.
09:16This is the democratic path.
09:18If we adopt this path,
09:20we will benefit everyone.
09:22Sir, but after listening to you,
09:24it seems that Kamran Muqtada Sahib
09:26is not answering your call.
09:28Why?
09:30Kamran, unfortunately,
09:32I have to say
09:34and what can I say
09:36about this,
09:38I will definitely speak
09:40to Maulana Fazl Rehman.
09:42I am not trying to call him myself,
09:44but when in my party,
09:46like Maulana Fazl Rehman
09:48that is why I said
09:50to my party representatives
09:52that they are giving me a report
09:54that they were not able to contact me.
09:56Sir, this dispute,
09:58this draft,
10:00Maulana Fazl Rehman
10:02said about this draft that
10:04there can be no greater treachery
10:06in the nation and country than this.
10:08Akhtar Mengal Sahib said
10:10that when the bill was presented,
10:12it was understood
10:14why it was hidden so strictly.
10:17What are you doing with us?
10:19Under this bill,
10:21anyone can be arrested at any time.
10:23I am happy that I resigned.
10:25Why didn't you see this?
10:27Which condition,
10:29you tell me,
10:31which condition,
10:33which line
10:35can they arrest
10:37anyone at any time?
10:39Sir, the rate petition
10:41can be done under section 199
10:43if someone is arrested illegally.
10:45They go to the High Court under section 199.
10:47You have also amended that.
10:49No action can be taken against the state or the administration.
10:51Excuse me.
10:53Under the amendment of section 199,
10:55the Pakistan People's Party
10:57and Muslim League Nawaz
10:59have different opinions.
11:01The opinion of the Pakistan People's Party
11:03was that because
11:05you are making a legal court
11:07on a legal level,
11:09then you should
11:11make a legal court
11:13on a legal level
11:15and the court
11:17should be responsible
11:19for fulfilling
11:21section 199's
11:23fundamental rights.
11:25And the issues of common citizens,
11:27which are 50%
11:29cases of the High Court,
11:31which are of murder,
11:33which are of theft,
11:35which are of injustice,
11:37which are of terrorism,
11:39we want to get justice
11:41as soon as possible.
11:43As far as the issue of
11:45restriction of national security
11:47vis-a-vis section 199 is concerned,
11:49I am opposing it
11:51in an ideal world.
11:53But at this time,
11:55the Pakistan People's Party
11:57does not have two-thirds majority.
11:59Sir, without you,
12:01no one else has two-thirds majority.
12:03I am just going to follow up that sentence.
12:05Neither I nor anyone else has it.
12:07So I have to convince them
12:09and they have to convince themselves.
12:11So somewhere
12:13there has to be a compromise.
12:15But sir, there is no compromise on principle.
12:17Looking at you, I feel that
12:19you have raised your hand
12:21and whatever you said, you agreed.
12:23I said that we should meet with
12:25the AUI and other parties
12:27and take everyone's input
12:29because if I saw
12:31from one point of view,
12:33I had my own point of view
12:35and according to my point of view,
12:38you brought up some terms
12:40because of my point of view.
12:42If you have another point of view,
12:44you can come and see.
12:46But I cannot answer this question
12:48to Muslim League Nawaz.
12:50They tell me that you are being
12:52deceived.
12:54We were deceived even then
12:56and still no one is engaging
12:58with you with seriousness
13:00and interest.
13:02This is the tactic of the opposition.
13:04They do not want us
13:06to do this.
13:08I say that this is not the case.
13:10I have a relationship with
13:12Maulana Fazlur Rahman
13:14and his Jamaat from three generations.
13:16We have been doing politics
13:18with each other.
13:20Sometimes we are in the opposition
13:22and sometimes we are in the government.
13:24We have done justice
13:26to one Jamaat in the government
13:28and to the other Jamaat in the opposition.
13:30So I feel that as far as
13:32Maulana Fazlur Rahman is concerned
13:34he wants to sit with us
13:36with a lot of seriousness.
13:38If he sits with us
13:40then I can say
13:42with a lot of confidence
13:44that we will be able
13:46to bring more improvement
13:48in the reforms that are going to happen.
13:50But if he is not interested
13:52or for any reason
13:54he cannot sit with us
13:56then I will have to
13:58do the consensus
14:00with the players and members
14:02of the Jamiat.
14:04We will have to agree on some points
14:06and they will have to agree on some points.
14:08In that scenario
14:10then the objection of the JUIF
14:12whether it is on Article 8
14:14or Article 51
14:16or according to Article 199
14:18which is the security one
14:20if we have to take votes
14:22according to a minus JUI formula
14:24then there will not be
14:26any JUI proposals.
14:28If he sits with me
14:30and makes consensus documents
14:32with the People's Party
14:34then the consensus documents
14:36of the People's Party and JUI
14:38will be able to make that majority
14:40and no other draft majority
14:42will be able to make it in that scenario.
15:00I have been in this situation for a long time.
15:02When my grandfather was killed
15:04when my father was jailed
15:06for 11 years
15:08when Musharraf was allowed
15:10that you are an Amir
15:12but you have the right
15:14to bring reforms in the constitution
15:16Amir was given the right
15:18to bring reforms in the constitution
15:20and then the same court
15:22told the government
15:24that you have the right.
15:26And this parliament gave protection
15:29What are you talking about Kashif?
15:31270A, AA, AAA
15:33You have given protection
15:35Because of the gut-jore
15:37of the Parliament
15:39my members, the members
15:41of the Pakistan People's Party
15:43were threatened, threatened
15:45Patriots were made
15:47so that you can create a family
15:49Let's not get into this
15:51Let me answer this question
15:53Mr. Bilawal, his daughter
15:55was kidnapped
15:57In this country
15:59the system of the court
16:01Do you think it is a perfect system?
16:03No, it is very bad
16:05But it starts
16:07Mr. Bilawal, it starts
16:09from the lowest level
16:1120-30 years
16:13Give me the answer to this question
16:15I am giving it to you
16:17Go to the lowest court
16:19Answer the question
16:21Are you satisfied or not?
16:23Not at all
16:25But I am not satisfied
16:27with what you are doing
16:29You agree that there needs to be reforms
16:31Absolutely
16:33I have been talking about this reform
16:35not from today
16:37In my manifesto for 2024
16:39I am talking about the same
16:41court
16:43No, no, no
16:45I am talking about 2024
16:47The Pakistan People's Party
16:49has to make the same court
16:51The judicial appointments
16:53have to be changed
16:55according to the COD
16:57The government has accepted
16:59my demand
17:01I should tell them
17:03No, I don't want it
17:05I don't want it from today
17:07I want it from 2006
17:09Before any judge thought
17:11that there should be reforms
17:13The Pakistan People's Party
17:15decided in 2006
17:17when Iptekhar Chaudhary
17:19was the judge
17:21We decided
17:23that we should make the same court
17:25The judicial appointments
17:27have to be changed
17:29Do you know why?
17:31Iptekhar Chaudhary
17:33Iptekhar Chaudhary
17:35repented
17:37He repented
17:39like a mother
17:41What did I do?
17:43I am an eyewitness
17:45of these very same lawyers
17:47in my party
17:50that we have to do it
17:52Chief, your life is at stake
17:54My mother used to say
17:56that if you are going
17:58to have political expectations
18:00from the judiciary
18:02then this will only cause
18:04problems for the people of Pakistan
18:06She herself said
18:08that if the judges want to talk to me
18:10if the judges want to take out Jalsa
18:12if the judges want to do politics
18:14then they should form the Justice Party
18:16and talk to me
18:18I was 18 years old
18:20at that time
18:22I had understood
18:24that the opposition is against
18:26Hamza Musharraf
18:28but she was such a visionary woman
18:30She not only predicted the consequences
18:32of what you and I have witnessed
18:34for the last 15 plus years
18:36Ever since the Iptekhar Chaudhary court
18:38removed judiciary
18:40and replaced it with
18:42politicization of the judiciary
18:44Whether it is Iptekhar Chaudhary
18:46or Saqib Nisar
18:48Sometimes they go out
18:50to build a dam
18:52Sometimes they go out
18:54to build a house
18:56for the poor in Karachi
18:58Sometimes they say
19:00that we will set the price
19:02of tomatoes and pakoras
19:04Sometimes they say
19:06that Pakistan has to earn
19:08billions of dollars
19:10but it won't happen
19:12and Pakistan suffers
19:14I am not here
19:16because I am in government
19:18I am not here
19:20because I praise
19:22one or two judges
19:24For me,
19:26no judge has given me
19:28more respect
19:30than Justice Issa
19:32and Justice Mansoor Ali Shah
19:34So both the judges
19:36were sitting on my grandfather's bench
19:38who gave me 50 years of justice
19:40But I don't want
19:42to wait for 50 years
19:44for justice
19:46for justice
19:48for justice
19:50for justice
19:52for justice
19:54for justice
19:56for justice
19:58for justice
20:00for justice
20:02for justice
20:04for justice
20:06for justice
20:08for justice
20:11And it's not
20:13And it's not
20:15And it's not
20:17And it's not
20:19And it's not
20:21And it's not
20:23And it's not
20:25And it's not
20:27And it's not
20:29And it's not
20:31And it's not
20:33And it's not
20:35And it's not
20:37And it's not
20:39Sir, let me
20:41You've asked your question, can I respond?
20:43Yes, please
20:45As far as you are concerned
20:47that we have to choose a judge
20:49we have to do this, we have to do that
20:51we have to extend
20:53This is the process of legislation
20:55Every parliamentarian
20:57has the right to say
20:59that we think we should choose
21:01this way or that way
21:03These talks were not just talks
21:05they were attempts
21:07When the time came
21:09to complete the vote
21:11they came and spoke to the Pakistan People's Party
21:13that this is what we want to do
21:15So the Pakistan People's Party said
21:17you may have your own wishes
21:19but the Pakistan People's Party
21:21did not say anything like this
21:23The People's Party has a chartered democracy
21:25So after that
21:27there was no talk
21:29of extending or anything like that
21:31My point was accepted
21:33The structural point was accepted
21:35The historical demand was accepted
21:37Inshallah
21:39there will be peace
21:41There will be benefits
21:43The way people want to play politics
21:45I have seen this game and film
21:47before
21:49Sir, everyone has seen this game and film
21:51The real problem is
21:53that if the aim and objective is
21:55to appoint a judge
21:57then all these methods are correct
21:59The judiciary is allowed to interfere
22:01in every institution in Pakistan
22:03It is their wish
22:05We removed 58 to be President
22:07The Chief Justice and the court
22:09took their pass
22:11that the right to remove the Prime Minister
22:13the pass that we removed
22:15was taken by the court
22:17When we used the Parliament
22:19for the first time
22:21the right of non-confidence
22:23was also taken by the court
22:25that according to our new
22:27definition of 63A
22:29you should forget about non-confidence
22:32If you want to remove the Prime Minister
22:34you can knock on the door of the court
22:36It will be our wish
22:38I agree with you on 63A
22:40but you should punish him
22:42All the parties
22:44not 2 thirds but 3 thirds
22:46all of the parliaments said
22:48this will be the way we appoint the judges
22:50and one judge stood up and said
22:52No
22:54Your 1973 constitution
22:56should go to hell
22:58Your 30 years of hard work
23:00He threatened our amendment
23:02and forced Parliament
23:04and till date
23:06we have passed the 19th amendment
23:08and we are still waiting
23:10for a detailed order
23:12on the basis of which the 19th amendment was made
23:14They say that
23:16the affairs of the Parliament
23:18is our wish
23:20The affairs of the Executive
23:22is our wish
23:24The affairs of the Establishment
23:26is also our wish
23:28I don't know
23:30if you remember
23:32the context in which
23:34Parliament was reintroduced
23:36If we can't do it
23:38and the court has to decide
23:40then what are you
23:42deciding till date?
23:44Every Supreme Court
23:46President has criticized this
23:48Every Human Rights
23:50Judiciary
23:52has criticized this
23:54for the past 15 years
23:56The next day
23:58Farhatullah Babar
24:00was reading
24:02the report of
24:04HRCP
24:06They are demanding
24:08to make a COT Court
24:10to bring changes
24:12in Judiciary Appointments
24:14and to bring changes
24:16in Age
24:18All your points are correct
24:20The problem is
24:22there is going to be an incident
24:24You have done a good job
24:26You have done a good job
24:28You have done a good job
24:30You have done a good job
24:32You have done a good job
24:34You have done a good job
24:36You have done a good job
24:38You have done a good job
24:40You have done a good job
24:42You have done a good job
24:44You have done a good job
24:46You have done a good job
24:48You have done a good job
24:50You have done a good job
24:53You should first make a Constitutional Court
24:55and then decide
24:57who will be the Chief Justice
24:59My objection is
25:01Yesterday you said
25:03Mansoor Ali Shah will be the Chief Justice
25:05You gave a statement
25:07Pakistan People's Party
25:09person specific clauses
25:11whether it is to remove a person
25:13or to appoint a person
25:15we will not be in his favour
25:17So you will not be in
25:19Qazi Faisal's favour
25:21If you will be person specific
25:23in appointing or removing
25:25Qazi Faisal
25:27People's Party will not support
25:29Our starting point
25:31is not to be person specific
25:33So I will not make a law
25:35that will target only
25:37Qazi Faisal
25:39and I will not make a law
25:41that will only promote
25:43Qazi Faisal
25:45I want a law
25:47that can be implemented forever
25:49that can provide justice
25:51to the people of the country
25:53which our Supreme Court
25:5515% of cases
25:57political and legal cases
25:5990% of the time
26:01gives to those cases
26:03My grandfather got 50 years
26:05to get justice
26:07Every citizen should not wait
26:09This is my objective
26:11Absolutely right
26:13If the Parliament does this
26:152 or 3 institutions
26:17the people will be happy
26:19and will pray that
26:21whoever will fix these institutions
26:23will take the authority
26:25to run the country
26:27should give justice to the people
26:29instead of interfering in politics
26:31What will be the Chief Justice
26:33of Mansoor Ali Shah?
26:35Will he be the Chief Justice
26:37of Ayni Court or
26:39other courts?
26:41That decision
26:43is for later
26:45Whether it becomes
26:47the Constitutional Court
26:49or the Supreme Court
26:51it will be the Chief Justice
26:53This is the problem
26:55This is the problem
26:57for the people who are
26:59person specific
27:01This was raised
27:03in front of Fazul Rahman
27:05in that committee
27:07that people are saying
27:09that the government is partisan
27:11that PTI is partisan
27:14It is our job to do justice
27:16This is an old demand
27:18So if we
27:20bring a version
27:22which is not person specific
27:24then we can bring it forward
27:26But I am committed
27:28to getting my
27:30mother's promises implemented
27:32and I will
27:34engage with Moulana Fazul Rahman
27:36in his party despite the
27:38statements in bad taste that were given
27:40by his official representative
27:42and I will continue my
27:44efforts to ensure that we meet
27:46the numbers to try and pass
27:48the best possible legislation
27:50to bring about judicial
27:52reform in this country that has not only
27:54affected me as a person in my family
27:56but if you take a survey
27:58of any place
28:00you ask the people, you ask
28:02lawyers, you ask your
28:04media colleagues, you
28:06ask politicians, no one
28:08can deny that
28:10there should be judicial reforms
28:1280% of the people can't even deny
28:14that there should be
28:16an INE court
28:18If there is any objection
28:20that the timing is not right
28:22that the method is not right
28:24then my answer to that is
28:26that if not now, then when?
28:28But Mr. Bilawal, the way
28:30you are talking, you said
28:32the objection is on the method
28:34You also talked about the right of parliamentarians
28:36What right does a parliamentarian have
28:38Parliamentarians didn't even know
28:40on which issue to put their thumb
28:42If Moulana had agreed that day
28:44then the legislation would have been done
28:46No one knew
28:48No one knows what the issue is
28:50The court and the institution
28:52doesn't have the right
28:54to sit at midnight
28:56It is only their right
28:58who come
29:00and break the rules
29:02It is only their right
29:04who sit at midnight
29:06We say that you come
29:08and rule for 10-11 years
29:10If any parliamentarian
29:12by mistake
29:14We say that politicians
29:16don't work
29:18I think it is a good thing
29:20that we have run the house
29:22If we had tried
29:24to address every issue
29:26with this hard work
29:28there would have been more progress
29:30This is the problem
29:32because we have never seen
29:35a parliamentarian
29:37sitting at midnight
29:39It is a political benefit
29:41If it is a political benefit
29:43then you will sit at midnight
29:45This is the reason why
29:47it is a method
29:49You did the 18th amendment
29:51It took 8 months
29:53Everyone's consensus was built
29:55People were asking each other
29:57where is Musabdeh
29:59I will talk to Noonwala
30:01He said we don't know
30:03It will be a meeting at midnight
30:05You can go home
30:07You don't need to know
30:09what is written
30:11This is a person specific amendment
30:13It is for personal benefit
30:15and political benefit
30:17I can't talk
30:19about someone else's intention
30:21But I don't see
30:23any personal benefit
30:25or political benefit
30:27that I can succeed
30:29My 70 votes
30:31is because
30:33I want to fulfill
30:35my mother's dream
30:37Moulana Fazlur Rahman
30:39or Mian Nawaz Sharif
30:41or Mian Shabaz Sharif
30:43I have no connection
30:45with them
30:47My connection is
30:49that I want to show
30:51my Mansoor
30:53As far as
30:55you are concerned
30:57the way we did the 18th amendment
30:59You are absolutely right
31:01We spent a year discussing the 18th amendment
31:03All parties
31:05not only the government parties
31:07every single party was part of that process
31:09What did the Supreme Court say
31:11when they heard about the 18th amendment?
31:13They said
31:15this is a great time
31:17You got it passed
31:19When we got a majority of 3 thirds
31:21What did the Supreme Court say?
31:23We will pass the entire amendment
31:25So now
31:27Should I do it with 2 thirds
31:29or 3 thirds?
31:31I want to do it
31:33We have seen
31:35what they did with the 19th amendment
31:37We have seen what they made us go through
31:39when we legislated
31:41more reforms in the judiciary
31:43every single time
31:45It is difficult
31:47to justify
31:49what is happening
31:51We have to understand
31:53that we all agree
31:56that they have been overextending
31:58and taking samosas
32:00but
32:02what is happening now
32:04that they are going to ruin
32:06that too
32:08I advise
32:10and my input to the government
32:12is to do this process
32:14with as much input
32:16from every relevant institution
32:18and every relevant party stakeholder
32:20as possible
32:22so that we can transition in the right way
32:24At the same time
32:26we will not be fooled again
32:28we will not let anyone
32:30stand in the way of parliament
32:32doing its work
32:34Absolutely
32:36I know that yesterday
32:38the Law Minister
32:40and Naik
32:42and others were sitting
32:44with the Bar Associates
32:46to get their input
32:48I am engaging
32:50with Maulana Fazal Rehman
32:52with the hope
32:54that if we can make
32:56a consensus democument
32:58with one opposition party
33:00then maybe it can be accepted
33:02for the rest of the opposition
33:04and for us
33:06but if
33:08a politician or
33:10a lawyer from the legal community
33:12has this misconception
33:14that they can take advantage
33:16of the good wishes
33:18of the Pakistan People's Party
33:20that they can sabotage
33:22this process
33:24then this is their mistake
33:26Sir, can High Court Judges
33:28be transferred?
33:30As far as the right to transfer is concerned
33:32the suggestion we have given
33:34to the government
33:36is that
33:38there should be
33:40a consent
33:42of the judge
33:44or chief justice
33:46and this decision
33:48should be taken by
33:50the Supreme Judicial Council
33:52or the body
33:54of the Parliament
33:56and not the domain
33:58of the Executive Authority
34:00Sir, he is saying that you are destroying
34:02the High Court
34:04Yes, they have destroyed
34:06the Supreme Court
34:08In the case of Qaid-e-Awam
34:1050 years ago
34:12in the case of the martyr
34:14Mortimer Benazir Bhutto
34:17you had to wait for his death
34:19then the case against him
34:21was dismissed
34:23the police officer who was
34:25involved in the crime scene
34:27was also acquitted
34:29the common man has no hope
34:31of justice from the Supreme Court
34:33we are going to destroy
34:35they have destroyed
34:37we are going to rectify
34:39Sir, the Parliament is also destroyed
34:41like a rubber stamp
34:43your minister of law said
34:45your deputy prime minister said
34:47that he did not see Musawadah
34:49I don't know where he came from
34:51Yes, it was a rubber stamp
34:53before that
34:55the way of the Parliament
34:57when Azad Parliament
34:59was legislating
35:01it was the same
35:03it was the same
35:05that Panama, Xhosa
35:07it was the same
35:09that were the champions
35:11of Istikhar Chaudhary
35:13today when I hear
35:15the same objections
35:17from the same people
35:19the way I have given
35:21importance to that objection
35:23in the past
35:25now we have decided
35:27with a lot of respect
35:29we respect you
35:31we can talk to you
35:33we can engage with you
35:35I think we can answer
35:37all your questions
35:39we have to now
35:41like the courts have been doing
35:43running their institutions
35:45and other institutions have been running their institutions
35:47and Parliament
35:49and all other institutions
35:51have only held
35:53except for Parliament
36:11you can't say that 15 years
36:13or 20 years
36:15is too fast
36:17you can't say that 15 years
36:19or 20 years
36:21is too fast
36:23you can't say that 15 years
36:25or 20 years
36:27is too fast
36:29you can't say that 15 years
36:31or 20 years
36:33is too fast
36:35you can't say that 15 years
36:37is too fast
36:39you can't say that 15 years
36:41or 20 years
36:43is too fast
36:45you can't say that 15 years
36:47or 20 years
36:49is too fast
36:51you can't say that 15 years
36:53or 20 years
36:55is too fast
36:57you can't say that 15 years
36:59or 20 years
37:01is too fast
37:03you can't say that 15 years
37:05or 20 years
37:07is too fast
37:09you can't say that 15 years
37:11is too fast
37:13you can't say that 15 years
37:15is too fast
37:17you can't say that 15 years
37:19is too fast
37:21you can't say that 15 years
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37:25you can't say that 15 years
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37:29you can't say that 15 years
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37:33you can't say that 15 years
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37:37you can't say that 15 years
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37:41you can't say that 15 years
37:43is too fast
37:45you can't say that 15 years
37:47is too fast
37:49you can't say that 15 years
37:51is too fast
37:53you can't say that 15 years
37:55is too fast
37:57you can't say that 15 years
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38:01you can't say that 15 years
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38:05you can't say that 15 years
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38:09you can't say that 15 years
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38:13you can't say that 15 years
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38:17you can't say that 15 years
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38:21you can't say that 15 years
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38:25you can't say that 15 years
38:27is too fast
38:29you can't say that 15 years
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38:33you can't say that 15 years
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38:37you can't say that 15 years
38:39is too fast
38:41you can't say that 15 years
38:43is too fast
38:45you can't say that 15 years
38:47is too fast
38:49you can't say that 15 years
38:51is too fast
38:53you can't say that 15 years
38:55is too fast
38:57you can't say that 15 years
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43:55you can't say that 15 years
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44:33you can't say that 15 years