👉 En medio de un creciente número de estafas relacionadas con criptomonedas en Argentina, el abogado Adolfo Suárez Erdaire, ofrece consejos sobre cómo frenar esta tendencia. Destaca la importancia de denunciar estos delitos para iniciar investigaciones y potencialmente recuperar fondos perdidos.
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00:00This is Dr. Suarez with us because the scams do not stop, the number of victims is huge, the money that is lost is infernal, only in San Pedro 49 million, but doctor, the issue does not end, because scams are being made in different parts of Argentina, and in this case with cryptocurrencies. How are you doing, welcome, thank you for coming.
00:20Well, thank you very much, Pablo.
00:21How do we stop this madness?
00:23How do we stop it? First by making the complaint, what we have been saying, we have been repeating it insistently, you have to make the complaint, if you make the complaint, you exteriorize that indignation that one has through a prosecution, and the prosecution has, we can implement the means to start the investigation.
00:42For example, against the wolf of Berazategui, there was not a single complaint until someone was encouraged by a lot of people.
00:49Someone went and reported.
00:50Exactly.
00:51But I report, San Pedro, Berazategui, Crypto Moneda, Susuaya, do I recover the money or is it just that I do catharsis, I went and reported, and I make public a brutal case because the number of victims does not stop?
01:03First, it makes the case visible. Second, the prosecution is creating jurisprudence because there is no current legislation that can be against virtual platforms, wallets and others. It is a whole world to discover. So, if I give them more time, I am giving them more benefits so that they can move the money over time.
01:25This is the difference of San Pedro, which was by phone. One entered and ...
01:31But in San Pedro, the financiers also intervened. That's why we say, how do we recover the money? One is, if someone physically responsible really intervenes, who has offices, that we can make him responsible, or if it is all virtual. The more time I give him, the more difficult it is to be able to recover the money.
01:49In this specific case, in Ramos Mejia, who was the person who gave the face, who made the meetings? Because in San Pedro, for example, Pablo, you had the financier where the investors were going to charge the interests to financiers who were registered and who were under the law. In this case, how did they withdraw their earnings and who were the people who gave the face? Why did these people trust?
02:11Well, because they did an acting. They created a whole stage with this chamorro that appeared in certain places and began, like the Chinese currency, to spread the interests, the earnings, to speculate. People, in the face of anxiety, in the face of, obviously ...
02:27Necessity.
02:28Necessity, but we are also talking about people, we are talking about businessmen, we are talking about managers who trusted because the whole picture looked like this. The platform, the software, is very well created. We do not know if they have got it in Canada, if they get it in the United States, but surely someone who passed through Miami is involved in this.
02:50But still, doctor, seeing so many cases, the last ones, San Pedro, Vera Zategui, Ushuaia, one to trust, even if the Pope presents you and says, I'm going to trust you, it's impossible to trust because no one is going to give you the amount of money in interest, it's impossible.
03:08It seems to me that it is a striking behavior, because later people have a shame for a question, no, how did I fall into this? Then he does not report. But it seems to me that it is very striking to see the number of people who fall, not because we are super-endowed, super-intelligent, but because publicly this is very exposed. Then one knows that in most cases there are problems, there is a scam in between, right?
03:33Well, inside it is totally, there are a lot of people who see us inside, and after we broadcast the program, they keep asking, because the scams continue. The interior is very unprotected, unlike federal capital.
03:47But beyond all that, we talked about it with Greco the other day, the mood that people have in the face of need, and that the phone has become familiar. Today one has it until he goes to sleep. Then one sees a certain platform and begins to trust, because virtual wallets are the most common thing today.
04:05So that, mixed with a platform that gives you a profit, as Selmira said, quickly ...
04:12Stop!
04:13What profit was it here?
04:15And we were talking about 1 or 2.
04:17For example, in El Pedro it was also, yes, the 1 to 2% daily, that is, it is a profit ...
04:21But they don't pay you, nor in heaven, that is, it is possible.
04:24At the beginning they pay it, at the beginning they pay it.
04:26That is the confusion. Why do people trust? A friend comes and tells me, hey look Selmira, I'm earning 300 dollars a week. And my other friend comes and tells me the same, with this application.
04:38They are people I trust, perhaps.
04:41But you fall for your friend, not for that Chinese whore, or this Mr. Chamorro, who with just listening to him ...
04:49Of course, first for the family.
04:51Because the first one who enters the family, then your brother, your mother, tells you, look, I entered this platform, and mom talked to him in the supermarket, talked to him in Zumba, and so they all went in.
05:02Did you have money to take more people?
05:04Yes, yes, yes, yes.
05:06And there is no family member, let's suppose that mom and dad come in, as you say, to say, hey, loosen up with this, let's not put more family members, because this is a hellish truce.
05:16And we see every day a new case where people are deluded and scammed, because beyond the need, which I understand and understand, it seems to me that there is also ambition.
05:26They tell me, you are going to earn 1.2 per day in dollars, and well, and I put $ 34,000, as a man put, I don't know if there is so much need, or there is a question of illusion and ambition.
05:37That is the main problem. In fact, in the report we saw, Adolfo, how this person to whom they interviewed, first put $ 300.
05:45He ended up putting $ 15,000.
05:47Of course, they are motivating him.
05:49Because he is making a profit.
05:50They motivate him, then it is a psychological issue, and since the scammer is based on that, I repeat, it seems incredible, but this will continue to happen, because the technology, the scammers, in the ardit, look precisely how to excite you.
06:07Then they see what your tastes are, and from there they organize the meetings.
06:12Then they rent a country house, they rent a desired life, then people say, well, I have this savings, I bet more.
06:20I move it.
06:21I move it.
06:22Or those factors also appear that supposedly motivate you, the people.
06:27Well, San Pedro, how many people arrive, doctor?
06:30Well, in San Pedro, one could go and buy a vehicle, one could go and buy clothes.
06:35And how are they today?
06:36Today they are really ...
06:37Disappointed, all?
06:38Disappointed, all.
06:39Because, for example, a teacher, she tells me, I can't go out because I look bad in front of all the teachers, she told me.
06:46She first went to the exchange house and consulted, and then she went to several commercial houses.
06:51And they all had the little sign of the Chinese currency.
06:53So it is a reality that in San Pedro it was the second economy, where everything started and diversified.
06:59Then there are certain situations like Tucumán, where certain sectors are involved, even from justice,
07:07which at this time are on the side, have been left aside for investigation.
07:13And in Santiago del Estero, where the PETA platform is also, which has been a risk,
07:18they have shot the house of the lawyers who were defending the people.
07:22Is this more risky because it is cryptocurrency and because it is on the phones?
07:25Do you see it different from the previous ones?
07:27For me it is the same in San Pedro, I don't know what you think.
07:30Yes, people from the interior are much more attached to the hope of having the money again.
07:36I think that here, at least the porters, automatically try to denounce or they already realize that there is a scam.
07:44But inside, there are few, everyone knows each other, the whole town is involved.
07:48So they cling much more to the hope of ...
07:50And sorry, the humiliation factor is the main reason.
07:54What happens a lot with retirees when they are scammed.
07:56Of course, of course.
07:57They do not approach to denounce, which is very important that they do it to dispel this type of scams,
08:02precisely for this reason, to feel ashamed for having fallen.
08:06What happens is that as a counterpart you have aspirational images.
08:10These people who have luxurious cars, who go on trips, who share it on social networks,
08:14and discourses, especially through TikTok, with motivational discourses.
08:18Just as they influence, because also in other areas, such as the issue of virtual kidnappings,
08:23we get tired in the media, of spreading, of telling.
08:27The day that happens to you, it generates a doubt.
08:29Because you say, as if I was talking all day about this, I'm going to have some kind of doubt.
08:33There must also be some plot that would have to talk to some specialist in psychology,
08:39so that one falls.
08:41Because I think that many must have the great doubt at the beginning.
08:43Because it is not that they go from the beginning and take all the savings,
08:46they try 300, 400, and they go in, and they go in, and they go in.
08:50I'm saying that there must be some element that seduces in a way that one cannot control.
08:54Because if not, more than 100,000 people would fall.
08:57That the swindler does work it.
08:59And also, as the swindler knows that you get into a field that you do not know,
09:03then it expands the advantage and it is winning you, and it is eating you.
09:07And you do not realize it.
09:09Because it is not only the cryptocurrency through the cell phone.
09:12It is also managing your account, the contracts today that are handled online.
09:17Then you give an OK, and you press a button.
09:21Then, by pressing the click, you give all your life, your heritage, your geometric data,
09:26the data of your family.
09:28Today, all these people, in addition to being at a level of economic and heritage commitment,
09:33they have a level of commitment where I tell them,
09:35why do you have to file a complaint?
09:37Because it is not just to make it visible.
09:39Then they can use your data.
09:41They can use and create accounts.
09:43Be careful with that.
09:45Now we enter another variable, which is the issue of illegal gambling houses
09:49and many famous commitments.
09:51Does the money recover or does it never recover?
09:53It recovers.
09:54It recovers.
09:55What happens is that it is a fight that begins.
09:57Long.
09:58Arduous.
09:59And we also need experts to help us.
10:01From all this, many people were generated, mainly Cordobans,
10:05who are supporting us to study the whole crypto world, which is really ...
10:10It is difficult.
10:11It is very difficult.
10:12And it is new.
10:13We know that there are legal and illegal bets.
10:16Exactly.
10:17And there is a group of famous people and influencers who today have to respond to justice
10:21for promoting illegal casinos and gambling houses.
10:24The last one is Mrs. Wanda Nara, who has to go to declare justice, right?
10:27Exactly.
10:28Because they are promoters.
10:30Beyond that, they cannot say, I do not know about this situation.
10:33Everything has to be done responsibly, knowing that the game is clandestine or not.
10:38The allowed one, everyone knows it.
10:40Everyone is going to look for the other one.
10:43The one that also facilitates it is the cell phone.
10:45And the worst of all is that young people are entering from 13, 14.
10:49And what is the issue of the illegal?
10:51Because just as we cannot promote an illegal quiniela,
10:54there is a legal one, regulated, there is an illegal one,
10:57which we know is not the one that corresponds.
10:59What is the difference here?
11:00That there is a seduction plan, that there is a plan for more people to enter.
11:04First, it is captured through players that one has in the field.
11:08In small towns, there are 17, 16-year-olds who enter quickly because they are offered money.
11:15These are the ones who are in charge of distributing the chips.
11:18And they have a certain amount of chips.
11:20And you, from your cell phone, from your house, you start playing.
11:23First you start playing for one amount and then for another.
11:26Does the illegal pay more?
11:27The illegal, yes.
11:28The illegal market pays you much more.
11:30How much? The double, 20% more, 50% more.
11:33It lends you money.
11:34It lends you money.
11:35It allows you to access the chips faster.
11:38And, obviously, the double of what the illegal market gives you.
11:42And, excuse me, doctor, the key, the minors.
11:44Because they allow minors to enter without limits.
11:47What is the situation of Wanda Nara in front of justice?
11:51Because she can adopt.
11:52I do not know that it is illegal.
11:53I do not know all this story.
11:55I have a representative who got me, pa, pa, pa, pa.
11:57What is the responsibility in front of justice?
11:59Or what could happen?
12:01We consider that her responsibility is the association in front of others.
12:06That is, she can manifest that she is not responsible and that she did not know.
12:11But when I'm going to sell a product, I have to minimize the costs.
12:15If not, I am responsible.
12:17We can say that it is an illicit association at some point.
12:21It is difficult to prove it.
12:23But there is an economic responsibility for those who were harmed.
12:27She had to present herself ...
12:29It is presented on December 17.
12:31On December 17 she has to present herself in court.
12:34In a personal way.
12:35That a written statement cannot be presented.
12:37How is this?
12:38No.
12:39It's her.
12:40That is, if she is innocent, first she has to present herself personally.
12:43Except to say that she is sick, that she suffers from something.
12:46The most important thing is that she has signed a bond.
12:49I say that she has signed a contract with this company.
12:52This contract can be compromising.
12:54I say to Wanda.
12:56Let's see.
12:57The contract compromises her.
12:59As well as the fact of putting on stage a type of game.
13:03She had to warn first.
13:05If she has a representative, the representative.
13:07And I repeat again, Pablo.
13:09You are not going to promote something that first does not inform you or advise you about what you are promoting.
13:14If not ...
13:15I promote arms sales.
13:16Yes.
13:17Drug sales.
13:18Exactly.
13:19Wanda puts her face.
13:20I say from public knowledge.
13:21That ludopathy grew in adolescents.
13:23As a consequence of this, they are indebted because they take out credits to play.
13:28That they have depression.
13:29Young people who have committed suicide because of situations like this.
13:32Yes, it is a responsibility.
13:34Also that at the state level it is much greater than in other states.
13:38Because it is not that for Wanda Nara and for Cinco Influencers we enter this out of control.
13:43It seems to me that we have a very weak legislation.
13:46In every sense.
13:47It has been left behind.
13:48Because we see the San Pedro.
13:49We see this man, this Chanta Chamorro.
13:51And they shoot.
13:52And today here 40,000.
13:53Here 15,000.
13:54Here 20,000.
13:55And we keep scamming people as if ...
13:57Are there prisoners in this whole case, doctor?
13:59There are always prisoners, but they are the least.
14:02Positorto.
14:03They are delinquents.
14:04Of course.
14:05Delinquents are white gloves.
14:06But the situation, as we said, of the famous, the worst thing is that people trust that word.
14:10Of course.
14:11It's a hook.
14:12Exactly.
14:13And the influencer too.
14:14Therefore, the responsibility has to be double.
14:16But today there is no legislation that accompanies.
14:20Then each prosecutor creates jurisprudence at the time of citing it.
14:25And at the time of citing it and listening to it and seeing what is the defense that one has,
14:30there it will be in the function of the prosecution and in the function of the investigation,
14:34how to commit it.
14:36But now ...
14:37Now it was impeached for promotion and capture of gamblers.
14:41Of course.
14:42Now one actually, I think there are many who are not aware that in the networks,
14:46the dissemination and sometimes, I don't know, they promote anything.
14:49Maybe ... I don't think there is an intentionality, but it seems to me that there is no ...
14:54like there is no more information about some things.
14:57I think she didn't do it on purpose.
14:59And well, I think ...
15:00In this case, I think commissions are also charged for what is bet or something like that.
15:05In this case, I repeat, they are absolutely illegal.
15:08How can we prevent?
15:09I know it's difficult.
15:10Just as I said about virtual kidnappings, that we did the manual,
15:13don't answer the phone, hang up the phone, talk to your family.
15:17Yes, but Paulo, it's true what you said, that at the slightest doubt there you fell.
15:20But they did it to me, I had all my family outside and they did ...
15:24No, no, no, I didn't go down.
15:26But they caused me anguish because it was like to cut and say,
15:29this is nothing, but it is so armed that it leads you to generate some kind of doubt.
15:34Can we give some ... I don't know if the word is advice or some plot
15:39so that people don't fall into this of cryptocurrencies or easy money
15:43or impossible interests to pay? Is there something or is it impossible?
15:47Yes, yes, a lot of diffusion, a lot of advertising, you have to spread it permanently.
15:53First, the famous have a responsibility.
15:56That was the subject of ...
15:57It has to be added quickly.
15:58No, and in the illegal game and in the other, I say, look,
16:01I met one in San Pedro that you don't know the money he paid me
16:04and I'm influencing people to go.
16:06Exactly, that is, the influencer is tremendous because the influencer promotes today
16:10any type of advertising regarding these issues.
16:14So, in cryptocurrency, first, what you said, take into account,
16:19nobody makes money easily, I'm not going to get into something I don't know
16:25and see 30 times everything that has to do with virtual wallets,
16:29even virtual wallets allowed.
16:31Of course.
16:32And secondly, because virtual wallets also have a whole issue,
16:36and secondly, with the illegal game,
16:38knowing that behind that promotion, that I win double and others,
16:42what is there? That the illegal game does not pay taxes,
16:44that the illegal game compromises younger and younger children
16:48and that virtual chips lead to a disease,
16:51because you start with two or three games and then you finish.
16:54No, you can't stop.
16:55You can't stop.
16:56And I heard it the other day in a testimony of a person who said,
17:00I started winning, I got excited and I became precisely a person
17:06who can't stop playing.
17:07Addict.
17:08Then everything compromises. Addict.
17:09Exactly. Thank you.