WRIF Virtual Rock Room with ex-Megadeth Bassist David Ellefson
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00:00Thank you so much for watching Riff TV.
00:02Now, this interview is obviously with video, but I don't interview everybody on Zoom.
00:07That's why I put it on my Talkin' Rock with Meltdown podcast.
00:10We talk to rock artists from all over the genre.
00:12So check out Talkin' Rock with Meltdown wherever you get your podcasts.
00:16And now, to today's video interview.
00:20Man, you look relaxed. You look sunned. You look like you've spent some time on a cruise ship.
00:27Funny you say that. I just got off a cruise.
00:30You called it. You know me well.
00:33Yeah, that one left out of Florida. Is that correct?
00:36Port Canaveral. Yeah, it's basically Cape Canaveral, right?
00:38So, you know, it's funny because, you know, you see the NASA.
00:42And I've been to the NASA thing before, right?
00:43Which is, you know, where they fire off all the NASA rockets.
00:48And then as our boat was pulling out of the port, of the Canaveral port,
00:53right off the left side of the boat was SpaceX, which is Elon Musk's thing, right?
00:58And I think it was the canister because it was on, like, this moving platform.
01:03So they must fire them off of, I don't know if it's NASA.
01:06Maybe it is NASA.
01:07They fire them off there, and then they just land on top of this friggin'.
01:12It's like the thing that goes out and saves the rockets.
01:15They can bring it back in and fire it again.
01:17That's cool. Yeah, I left out of there on a cruise ship one time.
01:21I was just telling Rudy Zarzo the other day, I talked to him, as you know,
01:24and I'd never been on one of these rock cruises.
01:26So they're always at a weird time of the year.
01:28I just took, like, you know, a couple weeks off from vacation for Christmas.
01:31I can't just, like, leave again right away, you know.
01:33But one day I'll get on one of these cruises coming up.
01:36Well, I think part of it is they try to schedule it out of the way of hurricane season.
01:40The KISS cruise, I think, goes during hurricane season because October –
01:45I remember doing the motorboat, right, when Motorhead had their debut cruise.
01:49And that was in October as well.
01:51Fortunately, it was pretty good.
01:53We hit a little weather kind of coming down around Florida.
01:56I think that one went out of Miami.
01:58Miami's a popular port.
02:00Shiprock has gone sometimes out of Galveston, Texas.
02:03So it goes across the, you know, across the Gulf and then down to Cozumel.
02:09But, you know, it's – I don't really care for that.
02:12You know, that can be rough.
02:13In January, it can be, you know, it can be rough.
02:15It's cold.
02:17Going out of Florida is always pretty nice, you know.
02:19The weather's good.
02:21And so it's – this one was great.
02:24I mean, literally smooth sailing, man.
02:26It was so cool.
02:27Oh, yeah.
02:27And for those people who have never been on a cruise before, these cruise guys,
02:30they really know their weight.
02:31Even if there is a hurricane or something, they will figure out a way to avoid it, you know.
02:35Yeah.
02:36Yeah.
02:36Well, you know, the truth of it is,
02:39if you were really hauling ass, you could do that whole thing in two days, right?
02:42Down, back, right?
02:43Right.
02:43But the whole point of it is, is drive around in the ocean so people drink and gamble
02:47and that's how they make all their money.
02:49So – and – but this – yeah, this boat was great.
02:52This was – this was probably the biggest boat that I'd been on.
02:55And I think they're even moving up to a bigger one next year.
02:58You know, Shiprock has done really, really well.
03:00You know, I've done a lot of cruises for those guys.
03:02They did the motorboat cruises.
03:05Six-man did the Megadeth cruise.
03:07And that one went out of – that was out of Long Beach to San Diego down to Encinitas.
03:14Again, you could almost drive that in a car in an afternoon.
03:17Right.
03:17But, you know, it takes like five days, you know, to go out and scoot around the ocean so people could party
03:22and listen to heavy metal, you know.
03:23So how many times did you jump on stage?
03:26Because I know you did that – you know, you did Gallica's One with Randy Blythe, Lamb of God,
03:30which was awesome, by the way.
03:30I just watched the video yesterday.
03:32Somebody took a great video.
03:34I don't know.
03:34Did you know the other person taking the video there?
03:36They were like –
03:36I – on stage.
03:37I didn't.
03:38You know, so Paul Gargano from Metal Edge was on the boat.
03:41And so, yeah, and then, you know, Metal Edge, that was the grocery store magazine.
03:44Certainly, kind of the beginning of my career, you know, there was always Hip Raider,
03:48Rock Scene, Circus Magazine, for those of us from the Midwest.
03:52That's how we found out about concerts.
03:53I mean, I didn't live in a Detroit or Minneapolis or anything.
03:57I lived in a small farm town three hours away from any radio or anything hip and, you know,
04:03current going on.
04:04So I got most of my rock news, you know, from these grocery store, you know,
04:07and drugstore magazines like that.
04:09So Metal Edge probably hit the stands, you know, probably, you know, early 80s.
04:14So Paul – yeah, Paul was on there.
04:17He – yeah, he popped it up.
04:18He said he got, like, the last bar of Wi-Fi before he could – before the ship left Dominican Republic.
04:24And he fired that away.
04:27We had just played.
04:28We did the sail away that day.
04:30So, yeah, there was two sets that I did with the stowaways.
04:33The first one was Tuesday evening, and that one – that one was big.
04:37I mean, of course, everybody's there.
04:39In the nighttime, you know, that outdoor deck, there's 4,000 people on the boat.
04:43I think the boat had, like, six – could hold 6,000.
04:46So there's 4,000 people that came on board, you know, plus whatever staff the crew – the boat has and everything.
04:54So, you know, a lot of people.
04:55So I don't know.
04:55Probably a good – you know, most people were out there, and they tried to schedule them so things didn't overlap
05:01between – there was a big theater up in the front of the boat as well.
05:03So most people were there for that.
05:05So I played War Pigs.
05:09I forgot.
05:12God, what's his name?
05:13This guy that sang in Raw.
05:15Oh, yeah, yeah.
05:15I know what you're talking about.
05:16Yeah, I don't –
05:17And I'm embarrassed that I can't pronounce his name right now.
05:22Chame or something.
05:23I mean, fantastic singer.
05:25My God.
05:26So you played all the short songs, apparently, right?
05:28Well, yeah.
05:29Yeah, I had War Pigs.
05:31And then in the middle of the sound, I played a Foo Fighters song, which I'd never played a Foo Fighters song before.
05:35So I had to kind of learn it, you know.
05:37And I don't mean learn it like the part wasn't hard, but just absorb it so that you know it as a fan,
05:43so you can take it on stage and you really, you know, know the song.
05:46You know, it took a little while.
05:47Because the only Foo Fighters – I don't own any – I think I own one Foo Fighters record that I bought online.
05:51Everything else is just stuff I hear on the radio.
05:54And I like it, but I don't buy the records, you know.
05:57So it's cool, and I think Roll's great and everything.
06:01And then to see then the last song – I played the first, middle, and last.
06:06Oh, the Beastie Boys, you know, Fight for Your Right to Party, you know, which was a great closure.
06:12A few people were getting a little drunk by the end, so it's kind of like – but that was cool.
06:16I think Nixie from Stitched Up Heart was on that.
06:18Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.
06:20Yeah, Kerry King, by the way, played the guitars on the original version of that Beastie Boys.
06:24Yes.
06:25Has he ever talked to you about that?
06:27No, he never did.
06:28You know, so Rick Rubin, Def Jam, you know, Beastie Boys run Def Jam.
06:32I think that's right when Slayer got signed to Def Jam, so he had Kerry play the guitar.
06:38You know, so here's a funny story about Kerry King.
06:41So, because he's been a good friend, you know, fantastic guitar player in Megadeth for those first five shows that we did back in 1984.
06:50And he was just kind of filling in, really.
06:53We were kind of checking, is he going to leave Slayer and join the band?
06:56But Slayer was a thing, but not yet a thing, you know?
06:59And they were still kind of in this sort of metal, you know, I hate this, almost kind of a Lizzie Borden look, right?
07:08But when he went up to San Francisco with us, he saw, you know, the real, you know, epicenter of thrash metal.
07:15Yeah, and everything, Exodus, obviously Metallica were the, you know, were the reigning kings there.
07:21And, you know, just seeing what it was, you know, he went back to L.A., wiped the makeup off Slayer and, you know, got down in it.
07:29And, you know, you know, Slayer became Slayer that we know.
07:32But so it's funny, you know, on one of those gigs, Dave broke a string.
07:37Kerry had two, we all played B.C. Rich guitars, right?
07:39And so Kerry had his Red Mockingbird, and I think he had like a Black Warlock or something.
07:45And so he happened to be playing the Black Warlock.
07:47Dave broke a string on his, the Rich Bitch, the guitar that everybody saw him in Metallica with.
07:54He was playing that.
07:55And so he grabbed Kerry's Red Mockingbird.
07:58And it's so funny, there was, somebody took a picture of that, and that's the cover of the Megadeth Anthology, is Dave with that Red Mockingbird.
08:06It's Kerry's Mockingbird, right?
08:08He then, you know, we go back to L.A., and we had a manager, Jay Jones, who then, right after Kerry was in the band, our drummer, Lee Rausch, quit.
08:16And so you just realize this wasn't for him.
08:19So Jay Jones comes in the picture, gets Gar Samuelson to start playing drums in the band, right?
08:23And Gar worked at BC Rich Guitars, and his brother Stuart worked there, and Chris Poland was temporarily working there for a little while, right?
08:34Like doing some stuff.
08:35So I was just with Chris this last weekend in Atlanta at the Days of the Dead convention, and we played a Kings of Thrive show.
08:41Right, right.
08:42And so I was telling him a story, I said, think about it, so these Kaler, the Kaler Bridge, right, so there's two ridges, Floyd Rose, which is basically what Eddie Van Halen went on to use, and the competitor was Kaler.
08:55Kaler was an easy drop-in replacement with a little bit of routing, anybody could put a Kaler on their instrument.
09:00So Jay sells to Kerry one of the, or gets from Gar, a Kaler Bridge, right?
09:06So he puts it on that red Mockingbird, and all that Slayer, that like wang bar, wabby bar shit is from that.
09:15I can almost guarantee you started from that Kaler.
09:19And I was talking to Chris, I was telling the story, he goes, dude, I put the Kaler on there.
09:23That was me who put it on there.
09:24He brought it in, and I was like filing it away and, you know, doing all this stuff, so I was like, small world, you know, who knew?
09:31I remember one time when you were here at the radio station a few years back before the pandemic, and we were walking through the halls, and I can't remember exactly, I think it was a picture of Kiss you saw on a wall.
09:40And you started talking about how, you know, Kerry King would, you know, you'd go over to his house, and his dad was a cop, and his mom was a housewife or something, and Kerry would be in the back, you know, nailing pentagrams down or something.
09:49No, literally in the living room floor, he was making one of those, either the big nail, you know, he was either making that or that pentagram belt thing that he had there for a while.
10:01Yeah, it was, it was, and the Slayer guys, they all lived right by each other.
10:05They all lived at home with their parents, you know, and so they were, you know, Tom and his brother, who was one of their techs, they all lived there at Slayer, rehearsed in Tom's garage, you know, the family's garage over there.
10:17So, yeah, it was a family thing.
10:19Yeah, it's so cool that you are such a big part of that thrash history.
10:22I just saw the guys from Anthrax over the weekend, and Exodus, as a matter of fact, but you played with Randy Blythe.
10:28Now, how do you, how do you get to play with Randy, and why did you guys choose Metallica's one?
10:34That was on Shiprock.
10:35Dude, I just went where they told me.
10:38I played, but they asked me to play.
10:39That was all, I'm serious, and I've known these guys for years, and, you know, this show has really run well.
10:45They had a house band out of Nashville, a drummer, bass player, guitar player, and the bass player could also double on guitar, which he did on, you know, the songs that I played on.
10:57So, and on one, and as you can hear, they're great players.
11:01You know, they're really good guys.
11:03And so, you know, that was, there was a couple of other songs that were on the set that ended up switching out for whatever reason.
11:13But, yeah, I mean, it's funny.
11:14So, I know one just as a fan listening to it and hearing it.
11:18But, you know, it's a whole other thing when you dig in, and you put, you know, you put your instrument on, and you're really digging into parts.
11:24And, of course, that one is quite difficult because it's very hard to hear the bass on the record, right?
11:28I was going to say, yeah, is there a bass in that song?
11:30I don't know.
11:31Well, so it's Mike Heller from The Lucid, right, also plays in Raven and Fear Factory.
11:38He's, like, the biggest Metallica fan ever.
11:40So, one night we're bullshitting on text, and he sends me a version of it, you know, that has bass.
11:46It's that Injustice for Jason or something, right?
11:49So, he sends it over, and he even said, he goes, I don't think this is Jason even playing this, but someone recorded bass and put it on YouTube.
11:56So, I was listening to it, and I got to say it helped, you know, it helped kind of, there's a couple of parts that I was like, oh, okay, I would not have heard that, you know.
12:05And, you know, now we get so used to hearing it without bass that once you put bass in it, I'm going, maybe we should turn down.
12:11Maybe we shouldn't have bass on this song.
12:13Maybe, you know, pay homage to the great song that it is, you know.
12:18So, you know, it's interesting.
12:19And then I did hear, I guess, because of Guitar Hero, you know, now all these stems for all of our songs are all over the internet.
12:29You know, once Guitar Hero put, you know, even the Rest in Peace stuff, people said to me, dude, I heard your bass soloed from Rest in Peace.
12:36I'm like, how the hell did you get that?
12:38And I learned it's from Guitar Hero.
12:39So, there's one of those out there of Jason's part, you know, from Metallica songs, right?
12:46So, I heard it.
12:48So, you know, I kind of, I, you know, listened to that and was like, okay, you know, I get what he's doing.
12:52I would probably do this.
12:54And so, you know, it's kind of one of those things when you're, it's an homage, you know.
12:57So, we're not total karaoke.
13:00We don't have to play it exactly, exactly the same.
13:02So, I kind of created a part that I felt, you know, was right for the song.
13:07Have you heard the new Metallica stuff?
13:10I have.
13:11I like it.
13:11I think it's very cool.
13:12You know, you know, just as much as everything with those guys, you know, they're like Apple.
13:18You know, when they do a product launch, it usually comes off pretty freaking cool.
13:22You know what I mean?
13:22Yeah, yeah.
13:23It's like, you know, a new Metallica album is like a new iPhone launch, you know.
13:28It's pretty much awesome.
13:30And, you know, just out of nowhere, I was in Poland working.
13:33I've got this group, Dyeth, you know, over there.
13:36We're getting ready to drop a record this summer on Napalm Records.
13:39And when I was over there shooting the videos, this is, what, November.
13:43And all of a sudden, out of nowhere comes, you know, this, you know.
13:48Yeah, Lux Eterna.
13:49Yeah, yeah.
13:49Yeah, you know, that, you know, new album or, you know, new album announced, new single,
13:54new tour announced with Pantera and Five Finger and all that stuff.
13:57You're like, geez.
13:58I mean, this literally just dropped out of the sky.
14:01I don't think any of us saw it coming.
14:02And, which I thought was so cool.
14:06And, yeah, I mean, that first single especially, I thought was very cool.
14:12You know, it's, you know, look, at this point, there's only 12 notes in the chromatic scale.
14:17We've played them all in almost every possible combination of how to play them, you know.
14:22So, it's like, how do you, how do you now at album whatever it is for them and whatever, you know,
14:28even with Megadeth, it's like, geez, you know, we're on what, how many albums now?
14:31And how do we not repeat ourselves yet still keep street cred and play to those fans that want to hear us do that?
14:39Yet, you know, you're not really, you're not the same guy you were when you recorded one, right?
14:44You're not the 1987 Metallica, you're now this.
14:48So, you know, I think as we age into our career and we age into our sort of artistry, if you will,
14:56you're always looking for how do you, you know, how do you sort of scratch the itch
15:02and satisfy all parts of, you know, of, you know, kind of your creative, you know, thing there.
15:09And, you know, and, you know, it's interesting for me, as you know, you know, I've got, you know,
15:14like kind of four, four bands, you know, that I do it.
15:18And I thought it was more, but go ahead.
15:21Yeah, no, I've whittled it down, you know.
15:23Well, you know, it's one of the things that I found that, you know, going out and playing,
15:27I mean, especially when we first, you know, in 2002 and Megadeth disbanded and I, you know,
15:31F5 kind of started just sort of unassumingly.
15:35They invited me to jam with them and we wrote some songs one afternoon.
15:39It's like, that's really cool.
15:41You know, it's like, yeah, let's go back and do that on Thursday.
15:43That was fun.
15:44You know, let's do more of that.
15:45And that's, I think that's how the best musical settings happen, you know,
15:49unless it's a big group and you get the job and they hire you to be their new, you know,
15:54touring musician or something, you're playing a record.
15:57You know, when things sort of form organically, that's how they used to happen.
16:02You know, at least when I was growing up in Minnesota or whatever, you know,
16:06you kind of fall into a room with some guys and you start playing and it's like,
16:10wow, we got a thing, this works.
16:12And, you know, that's how these things develop from there.
16:15So, you know, all of them, you know, have, you know, Diath, you know,
16:21the Lucid stuff that we did.
16:23And, you know, even the Ellison Soto record that I put out back in October was stuff that
16:29I was writing with my guitar player, Andy.
16:33And then, you know, Kings of Thrash, you know, which is, is even that started really,
16:39Jeff and I were writing material.
16:42We're sitting at the Rainbow one night and he starts singing me this riff that he had
16:46from like 1988 on the So What's a good So What record.
16:48He starts singing and I go, dude, I totally remember that riff.
16:52And this is really, yeah, this was back, well, it was a year ago now.
16:55It was in January.
16:56It was back in January.
16:57Yeah.
16:58Yeah.
16:58Yeah.
16:59Which, you know, seems like it was just a couple of months ago, but it was a year ago now.
17:02We were working on, I had interviewed him.
17:05I called him in to interview him for the, for the Nick Menza movie that we're working on,
17:10the documentary.
17:11And so this was my life, the story of Nick Menza.
17:14So as we, you know, then we reconnected and we got dinner, we're hanging.
17:18He, he sort of sings this riff to me and like I said, let's go in the studio.
17:23So we went into Mike Heller's place there in LA where we cut all the stuff for the Lucid.
17:29And we just sat there for a couple of days and wrote four songs.
17:32And it was like, this is super awesome.
17:34And so we've got one of them now that we've got the lyrics and putting the vocal melodies
17:38together that will probably bust that out here on the, on the new tour coming up.
17:42Well, you mentioned Paul from Metal Edge.
17:45He's married to a Detroiter.
17:46Jeff Young, of course, is from Ann Arbor.
17:49You got Vinny in your band from Detroit, from the Lucid.
17:52Vinny, of course, from Sponge.
17:53And now you got a couple of songs with Violent J, which like came out of completely left field.
17:58And that Sweet Tooth song is so awesome.
18:02And has anybody from the Faith No More Camp given you any feedback on that one?
18:06Or have they heard it?
18:06Sure.
18:07Yeah.
18:07You know, well, we went to them and to get their permission because it's kind of like
18:11when Weird Al does, considered a parody, right?
18:14You have to go to the artist and, or the writer and ask them for permission to rewrite their
18:20song.
18:20And they said, yeah, no problem.
18:22You know, they get all the money.
18:25We didn't, we didn't, you know, which is fine.
18:26It was like, look, we, that was Vinny's idea.
18:28You know, Vin, as you know, is just a complete, he's just so fucking cool, man.
18:33He's a creative mastermind.
18:35He is awesome.
18:36And it was his idea to call, you know, Violent J because he lives there in the, in the hood
18:40by you, by in the neighborhood close by.
18:43And so it was his idea to get him on the record.
18:45So, you know, whatever Vinny wants to do, I just go with it because it's just always
18:49cool.
18:50So, and he, and he originally started rewriting the lyrics for it, kept kind of the same
18:55melody, rewrote the lyrics.
18:57So yeah, we went to Faith No More.
18:58They loved it.
18:59They thought it was super cool.
19:01They, they, they totally gave us their blessing on it.
19:03So we were able to use the song and, and yeah.
19:07So for those listeners that are viewers that haven't heard it yet, Sweet Two from the
19:13Lucid is basically our remake of Faith No More, Epic with a rewritten lyric to it.
19:19And it's kind of how, how Violent J is like way over here and, you know, left field or
19:24whatever.
19:25And, and Vinny is on the completely opposite end of the spectrum and they kind of meet
19:29in the middle, you know, cause Violent J does, you know what I'm saying?
19:32When, when it comes to like the first course and it's like, it's like complete opposites
19:36and it just seems to work.
19:38A hundred percent.
19:39And that's, that's what's so cool about the collaboration is, uh, you know, two different
19:43worlds, you know, and, you know, of course the headlines are, you know, Megadeth guy,
19:47insane, long, posse guy get together.
19:49And, you know, the funny thing is, is it, you're right.
19:52It was very random and we knew it was going to make some headlines and turn some heads,
19:56which great rock and roll should, you know?
19:59Um, and, uh, and if you don't have some haters, you're probably not famous enough.
20:03You know, I've learned that along the way.
20:07So, uh, so, um, you know, the, the, um, the funny thing is like, like the guy down at
20:15my local UPS store, right?
20:17Like I go in and he's, I know he's a big metal head and right away he goes, dude, I have
20:20a major, a big ICP tattoo down my leg.
20:24You know, I said, brother, you are exactly the guy who gets it.
20:27He loved it.
20:27Like, you know, so it's funny, like Megadeth fans, insane, clown, posse fans, they aren't
20:33so different.
20:33And there's a lot of them that cross over because, you know, they're kind of the bastard
20:37children of, of genres, so to speak.
20:40Right.
20:40Um, that they, you know, we all kind of beat to our own drum, even within our sub genres,
20:46we were the more radical ones of, of the genre.
20:49Right.
20:49So, uh, the ICP fans, I mean, I was watching interviews, you know, Dr. Phil was interviewing
20:56violent J and, and, uh, he's like, I love Vincenna, I love me some ICP, you know, I'm
21:02like Dr. Phil of all people.
21:04So I like some of their stuff.
21:05Have you met filing J in person?
21:07I did.
21:07Yep.
21:08Yep.
21:08But he was actually at our, uh, he was at the days of the dead convention in Atlanta
21:12here.
21:12Oh, just last week.
21:14Yeah.
21:14Yeah.
21:14Yeah.
21:15Yeah.
21:15So that wasn't the first time you met him, is it?
21:18That was the first time I met him.
21:19I'd never met him before that.
21:20Yeah.
21:20Yeah.
21:21Yeah.
21:22And you know, look, we make a lot of records like that, right?
21:24It's like, you know, you make records and, and, uh, um, and this one was, yeah.
21:29Cause we started working on this back in, uh, I guess it was probably early 2021.
21:35So about a year ago, uh, we were working on this EP and then Vinny came up with the idea
21:41of, he goes, Hey, I'm going to call, uh, Jay and see if we can get him on, on the track.
21:46And I forgot which, I think we did sweet two first.
21:49And then he brought him in to do a saddle up and ride, which was that first single that
21:55we put out right before Christmas.
21:57So, yeah, it's cool how that, uh, how that works.
21:59You know, like I said, uh, you know, living here in Detroit for the half of my life, it's
22:03like, you know, ICP is just kind of woven into the, uh, underground fabric.
22:07If, if, you know, if I can say that.
22:09Yeah.
22:09Whereas Kid Rock and Ted Nugent would be, you know, the big guy for Bob Seger, right?
22:14Ellis Cooper, that kind of thing.
22:15Yeah.
22:15Yeah.
22:15Right.
22:16Then I see more by where you are now.
22:18So, oh, for sure.
22:19Yeah.
22:19I mean, he's basically the mayor here, you know, anytime they need anything done, they, they
22:23don't even call the mayor.
22:24They call Alice, have him go and do it, you know?
22:27So you got the Kings of thrash.
22:29Uh, no, um, that's going to be coming up.
22:31I had to wear my, I did theme dress by the way.
22:33Nice.
22:34I love it.
22:34Dude.
22:34The machine shop got great swag.
22:36I saw people on the boat on chip rock that had machine shop.
22:39Yeah.
22:39It's just, it's like, you're in the cool club.
22:41If you've been to the machine shop, you know?
22:43Yeah.
22:43I bought a bunch of machine shop shirts for a Christmas presents this year for people
22:47out of town that don't even know what it is, but I'm like, these shirts are cool.
22:50And Kevin's a great guy, as you know, and, uh, and you're coming to town now, uh, killing
22:55this my business so far.
22:56So good.
22:56So what you're doing all those records.
22:58I just has actually listened to so far.
23:00So good.
23:00So what say I gotta, I gotta bring it up and maybe sign it, but I got the, uh, the picture
23:03disc.
23:04Oh yeah.
23:05Nice.
23:05Yeah.
23:06Yeah.
23:06Very cool.
23:07And you know, we got a little surprise on that.
23:09I've been talking to my friend, Chuck Beeler, who lives near you in, uh, in Detroit there.
23:14So, um, we're talking to him about coming up and playing, joining us to jam a couple
23:19of songs with us since that's the record he recorded.
23:22Listen, last time I talked to, uh, Dave Mustaine, uh, you know, I, I recorded for people that
23:26don't know, I recorded, uh, Chuck's parts for the audio book of the thing that came out
23:31in like 2019 or whatever it was.
23:32Yeah.
23:32The rest in peace book.
23:33Yeah.
23:34Yeah.
23:34And so Chuck kind of all of a sudden went radio silent on me and that's kind of like
23:37par for the course of what he does.
23:39But if you need me to like, you know, help him, help get them up there or whatever the
23:42case is, you know, take some drumsticks over to him.
23:44Hey dude.
23:44Yeah.
23:44Yeah.
23:45Have you talked to him lately or.
23:46You know, I, I have, uh, through our friend, Brian, uh, we've been communicating, you
23:52know, Chuck's father had just passed over the holidays.
23:54So it's kind of a, and that's when I said, Hey man, tell Chuck to let's, let's get
23:59it going, man, let's rock it.
24:00Let's come out and play.
24:01Cause he joined me when we played at the token lounge, when I came through on an Ellison solo
24:05tour there, he came up and played, I think four songs and he played great.
24:09You know, he played, he did, he's got, he's got this really kind of behind the beat, you
24:14know, again, Chuck listens to DRI and Steely Dan, right.
24:17And somewhere in the middle is where he lives, you know?
24:20So I love Steely Dan.
24:21Let's do him all the time.
24:24And so, you know, so Chuck, he's a great player.
24:26And I tell you what, he played with me that night at the token lounge, it really felt
24:31like so far so good.
24:32So what, you know, cause drummers all have different fields as every musician does.
24:36And, um, you know, it's funny.
24:38I played with a tribute band, a mega, a tribute band down in, uh, San Antonio on new year's
24:44Eve.
24:44And they had been my backing band on a solo bass story show that I did.
24:48And so they, they formed after Nick Menza died.
24:51So they, they basically, you know, they played all this mega stuff, but in particular, I said,
24:56why don't we just play the rest of peace out from top to bottom?
24:58It'll just be fun to do.
25:00So we did just top to bottom.
25:02And, and the guy played like Nick, he pushed everything.
25:05He did nothing was relaxed.
25:07Everything was fucking just hyper and vigilant.
25:10And I said, you know, you can pull a couple of these things back.
25:13He goes, he goes, man, he goes, this is how I know how to play this stuff.
25:16Cause I learned it exactly like the record.
25:18And then later in the night we played some other non-meganist stuff and he, he was a
25:22great drummer.
25:22He really know how to, you know, kind of push and pull and, and have the feel for stuff.
25:28But it's funny how, you know, these guys, they learn this shit exactly as they heard it
25:32on their, if a fill is rushed, they play it rushed, you know?
25:35And so Chuck, you know, being a, an OG and performing on so far, so good.
25:41So what, when I play those songs with him, it really feels like that, you know, he's just
25:47got the right.
25:48You know, just where he kind of places the snare drum hit and the kick drum and stuff.
25:52It really feels like it.
25:53So, you know, Jeff young Chuck and I haven't played together since Donington, 1988 castle
26:00Donington, which is now the download festival, but the Donington show we did with maiden
26:05and kiss.
26:06So I think it's pretty fucking legendary, man.
26:08I think it's, it's pretty awesome.
26:09If we can get him up there.
26:11Well, you let me know what, uh, what I need to do to make this happen.
26:13Cause you know, I'll take, I'll pick them up and drop them back.
26:16Totally.
26:16Yeah.
26:16You're, you're the, you're the monkey in the middle to make it all happen.
26:19So I'll definitely be leaning on you if I need your help.
26:21But I, but I remember when you guys played that show here, you guys played, I know you
26:25played hook and mouth.
26:26Did you play anything else with Chuck or was that the only song I'm trying to recall?
26:29I think we played hook and mouth Anarchy.
26:31Did we, um, did we play liar?
26:34Maybe I don't forgot what it was.
26:37I know it was at least, it was at least a couple songs.
26:39It, it may have been up to four, but you're right.
26:42It may have only been a couple, but yeah, he, he played perfectly fine.
26:46He practiced hard for it.
26:47You know, he's, he's not been out so much as a, as a working musician, as far as I know.
26:51So, but I mean, look, he's part of the story and this year, you know, this year's, you
26:56know, our 40 years since we started the band, you know, in 1983.
27:00So, and even over in Minneapolis, uh, I called my friend, Greg Hanovitt, who we moved to LA
27:05together, met Dave, you know, over the case of Heineken, as the story goes, we lived right
27:11beneath him.
27:13And, uh, you know, that's, uh, how it goes.
27:16And it was Greg's idea to call the band Megadeth.
27:18You know, he's another founding member of the group, so I'm having him come up in Minneapolis
27:22and we're going to do some deep dives.
27:24I said, what songs did we play with Dave right when we first met him?
27:27And, uh, he actually mentioned the song from no life to leather, uh, that made it on to
27:32kill them all.
27:32So we're going to bust one of those songs out, I think in Minneapolis.
27:35So that's, that's the whole goal of this man is to really go back to the roots, you know,
27:40small clubs, kick-ass thrash songs, even our meet and greets that we're doing where it's
27:45like, you know, these aren't the, you know, several hundred dollars to do a handshake
27:50and a picture in the drive-by.
27:51It's like, bring all your shit, you know, bring your 85 Megadeth records and picture
27:55discs, you know, bring them all your jean jacket patches.
27:59We'll sign everything, you know, let's hang out.
28:01Let's tell stories.
28:02Let's, let's, you know, let's go, let's go old school on this one.
28:06Do you, uh, do you miss playing the big arena shows?
28:09I know you're on stage, like you said, for like 4,000 people, but you know, now you're playing
28:13like clubs and different things like that, uh, do you miss it at all?
28:17You know, there's a place for all of them, you know?
28:19I mean, yeah, the ship thing was big, man.
28:21I mean, I was like playing a, you know, a mid-sized arena, you know, out in the deck
28:25because people were piled up three tiers high.
28:27I mean, you know, that was, that was a real gig, you know?
28:30Um, and, you know, then we go and we play these clubs.
28:34Um, you know, I saw a review of our Phoenix show that I think the guy really hit it on the
28:38head, he said, you know, to see me and Jeff and to hear these songs performed in a, you
28:43know, say a 500 seat club, he put the connection together that these songs were written back
28:49in that day when that's the size of how big Megadeth was.
28:52These songs were written to be played in those size venues.
28:56And as the group got more popular, uh, and we started playing bigger venues, this, the
29:01thrash stuff didn't translate as well.
29:04And that's why we started to slow some of the tempos down in the nineties, like for countdown
29:08to extinction and euthanasia, cryptic writings, you know, the songs started to change a little
29:13bit to accommodate, you know, the venues we were playing, of course, radio, you know,
29:18you guys in particular riff has, you know, always been a huge supporter of Megadeth from,
29:22you know, late eighties or eighties, you know, PSLs on through, you know, so not just the venues
29:28we played, but the station itself, you know, supporting, you know, all the singles we put
29:32out and, you know, cryptic writings was a huge era for us.
29:36You know, it was a deciding factor.
29:38Um, are we going to just continue just kind of, you know, doing, you know, thrash metal
29:46in that, or are we going to kind of reform the sound a little bit to stay competitive
29:50in, in the mix of what was happening in us?
29:53You know, we talked to, um, Iron Maiden's manager about managing us at that point.
29:57And, you know, they're, you know, obviously hit what he did with Maiden worked well because
30:02they just kept the band on the road, tour, tour, tour.
30:05And, you know, that's how he built and sustained Maiden.
30:09Um, and for us, but for us being in an American band, we knew we had a whole other audience here
30:15in America that to just be on tour outside of the world or outside of the U S would be to
30:22leave this whole, you know, territory unattended to who, so we, we took a different approach.
30:27We actually got, uh, um, you know, Bud Prager, um, and he had managed foreigner back in the
30:33day.
30:34And so, you know, he, he had, uh, sort of an understanding of, you know, that kind of music.
30:41Um, and as his partner, Mike Reneau had managed, uh, corrosion conformity and they were on the
30:47euthanasia tour with us.
30:48So that's kind of how that we made the decision to, to keep our, you know, our base here in
30:52America and Cryptic Writings was, was a record that we intentionally, you know, we wrote a
30:58lot of stuff.
30:59In fact, there's some stuff, even an end game.
31:01When I came back to the band in 2010, the song, the right to go insane, that was actually
31:04a song we wrote for Cryptic Writings.
31:07Uh, so I knew the bass part.
31:09As soon as I came back to the band, like, we got to shoot a video next week.
31:11Cause I, I've learned, I don't know the bass part.
31:13I fricking wrote the part, you know?
31:14So, uh, um, that was easy, but yeah.
31:17So Cryptic was a, you know, was, you know, a record, you know, that really helped us,
31:22you know, stay, uh, tuned in to, you know, an American audience and, and it did well
31:28around the world.
31:29Japan loved it and South America.
31:31So, I mean, it, it was definitely the right move.
31:34Um, you know, cause as you know, the nineties were a bit of a challenge once, once Seattle
31:39showed up and, you know, Nirvana, you know, the anti rock star killed the rock star kind
31:44of thing, you know, that, that was a challenge.
31:45And so, um, you know, we're one of the, you know, one of the bands that survived it, you
31:49know, and, and made it through to the other side.
31:52Yeah.
31:52It's funny how you talk about how you guys kind of slowed down the tempo.
31:54Cause I mean, when I got into radio, I was playing stuff off of rust and peace.
31:58I played hanger 18 and all that stuff.
32:00Right.
32:00And then symphony of destruction came out.
32:02And I remember telling somebody, you know, a billion years ago, I go, listen to this song.
32:07This song is heavy and it's not fast.
32:10It's like, it just, it clods along and it's just thick and full and you don't have to go
32:16to be heavy.
32:18You know, for a, for a short period, right in the late eighties, when Chuck and Jeff were
32:24in the band, uh, doc McGee, who now manages kiss managed us, um, just for a brief period.
32:31And it was because we needed to get sober and we couldn't get clean.
32:33Oh, their artists, Motley Crue, they were all getting cleaned up and getting ready to
32:38have big careers.
32:38And, you know, he made it very clear.
32:40We're not dragging, you know, drugged out rock stars around the world anymore.
32:43You know, um, any care, if you took drugs, you just had to be productive, you know, and,
32:48and, and we, we weren't.
32:50So we had to go through that by 1990, we reset rest to peace.
32:54The story carries on and we, you know, lived happily ever after, I guess.
32:58But, uh, you know, the late eighties and I remember he said, he said, I think it was
33:02him who said it.
33:03He goes, you know, Metallica is really not even that fast.
33:05They just give the illusion that they're fast.
33:08And I was like, wow, that's an interesting thing.
33:10And, and he said, he goes, you know, their name is bigger than the band is like, that's
33:14how their, the brand is big.
33:15And that, you know, people weren't using the name brand back then, you know, now it's such
33:18a thing, you know, you know, your brand, you know, and it's, it's, it's, I hate it.
33:24You know what I mean?
33:24It's, it's so fucking douchey and corporate and, you know, I mean, it's
33:28It's true.
33:28And I guess if you're a marketing guy, you use that word, you know, cause that's the
33:32buzzword.
33:32But, you know, to those of us who are, are band guys and musicians and we grew up in
33:38it, you know, yeah, we understood the kiss became this thing.
33:42And, you know, they, they taught us how to do everything, you know, Led Zeppelin, the
33:46drums were on the floor and kiss, they were on a riser, you know, sometimes, sometimes
33:50you're, yeah, you know, the Rolling Stones had a bottle of Jack and their picks on their,
33:56on their amp kiss, put the picks on the mic stand, you know, cause it just looked fucking
33:59cooler.
34:00So, I mean, kids for my generation, they showed us how to do all of it, you know, and, and
34:06just the presentation, you know, was, was so spectacular, you know?
34:09So, but yeah, it's, so it was interesting growing up in that time, you know, the eighties, cause
34:14certainly Metallica cleared the path for all of us, you know, I mean, they knocked down
34:18the big doors that needed to be knocked down with the big guns that they had and they, they
34:23made it happen.
34:23I mean, they're managed well, they actually wrote great songs and you know, so that was
34:28just, you know, obviously there was, it was that.
34:30And, and, you know, for us, um, you know, um, you know, we, we had our own, you know,
34:37flavor of, of that, but, uh, you know, to see, I don't know, I guess it was just, you
34:42know, it was just an interesting time because, you know, the, the, I, I see flyers, uh, you
34:48know, from back in the day in the eighties, you know, when I first met Dave, he said, he
34:52goes, we're not playing any clubs in the sunset strip, we know, which crushed my dreams
34:56as a kid from the Midwest, you know, cause you hear about all these bands that played the
34:59Starwood and the whiskey and all these things of legend.
35:02Right.
35:02But, you know, you get there and he was right.
35:04He goes, you know, by that time, those stages were basically, it's like the, don't they
35:08make people play, pay pay now to play the Superbowl?
35:11I think they do.
35:12Right.
35:12We're there for a year or two.
35:13They did.
35:14They were making people pay the Superbowl.
35:16So were they, were they making bands pay to play those?
35:19Yeah.
35:19Same thing.
35:20Yeah.
35:20But it's sort of like, Hey, our stage is valuable.
35:23You want to play here?
35:23You're going to pay us.
35:24It was like, and I was, you know, coming from the Midwest where we played ballrooms, bars,
35:28and clubs and all the shit that I did growing up as a teenager, I was like, pay to play.
35:33Like, aren't they supposed to pay us?
35:35Aren't we the entertainment, you know?
35:37And the more we play, the more beer they sell.
35:40Isn't that how this works?
35:41You know?
35:41So, so that's why, again, we went up to San Francisco, you know, and packed the places
35:46and, and got paid to actually play, you know, right from the beginning.
35:49So we didn't fall into that, but it's like, you know, the, the places we played in LA,
35:53uh, you know, where these, you know, like the waters club in San Pedro, uh, the Balboa
35:59theater.
36:00Uh, I think we played there with agent steel and I don't know, some other band, you know,
36:05these bands.
36:05So we, you know, we played the, we did, we were not a sunset strip band, you know?
36:09So it's kind of funny that, you know, with Kings of thrash, you know, we did those four
36:13shows back in October.
36:14And the last show that we played on that little run was at the whiskey sold out stage diving,
36:20moshing.
36:21I mean, probably like probably the club has never seen in all of its legendary 50 years
36:26of existence, you know?
36:28So it was super cool.
36:29And I'm glad we recorded it.
36:30We filmed it.
36:31Um, it's coming out on Cleopatra records, March 24th.
36:35Uh, it's called the best of the West live at the whiskey ago.
36:38So that's awesome.
36:40Yeah.
36:40So in a weird way, this tour is to support a live album.
36:43You know, usually, you know, we're talking about Jeff brought it up with kiss.
36:46He goes, so remember kiss did three live three albums.
36:48And then they finally did the live album.
36:50He goes, why don't we just forget the first three albums and just do the live album?
36:54And that's a great idea.
36:55And instead of like doing a live album as a, as part of a tour, the live album will represent
37:02the tour and right at the tour, we just support the live album.
37:04So it's kind of funny how we, we took the kiss model and flipped it and did it the other
37:08way around.
37:09The only thing kissed it differently is they recorded their live record here, which was very
37:14cool.
37:15Very cool.
37:15By the way, there are like four shows or something, right?
37:18I mean, you know, now we read in their books about, you know, how these records were made.
37:22Um, and you know, the one thing that I remember reading maybe in Paul's book that I thought
37:27was very cool is that up until that point, most live albums, you know, probably some Woodstock
37:34or Crosby stills, Dashing Young live album or something, there'd be people cheering.
37:38And then as soon as the band started playing, they pulled the audience track down.
37:42So you could hear the music, like Jackson Brown, you know, you hear these live, you know?
37:46And, uh, but we're with kiss, they kept the audience track up the whole time, you know?
37:50Right.
37:50And not even know if the audience track was from a kiss show, it just sounded fucking cool
37:54that there's like an audience.
37:55It did.
37:56It gave me the kind of this ambiance that like, man, I'm really at a fricking kiss concert,
38:00you know?
38:00That's cool.
38:01Cause I'm thinking to myself just now, you're putting anything live with Megadeth.
38:05Did you, you know, we had, there was never like, well, no, there was, there was a rude
38:11awakening that we did in 2001.
38:14We filmed it here.
38:15Was that a, just a DVD or I'm talking to like, like a CD or a record or something, or was
38:20that a DVD?
38:20Well, it was, it was a CD and album.
38:22It was when we had signed our deal with, uh, sanctuary records and we had put out the
38:27world needs a hero.
38:28We did the tour 9 11 happened.
38:30We were actually, it's funny.
38:31We were supposed to go to the original, uh, plan was to go film it and record it in Buenos
38:37Aires, which is why, you know, when Dave put the band back together, he then did that with
38:42that one night in Buenos Aires DVD that he, that he did.
38:45That was, that originally was going to be rude awakening, but why, but, um, you know, when
38:519 11 happened, it was very sketchy, whether we should leave the country, it was just a
38:56very weird time, you know?
38:57So we ended up just like the past three years we've lived in.
39:01Pretty much.
39:02Yeah.
39:03It's all coming back, but it's coming back a little weirder and different than it was,
39:08you know?
39:08Hey, you were, you were talking a real, uh, you were talking just a few minutes ago about,
39:11you know, how everyone kind of sobered up and stuff.
39:13There was a lot of sober rock artists on that ship rock.
39:16Wasn't there?
39:17There was, there was, I mean, you know, it's interesting, younger artists coming into, uh,
39:24the business I've just noticed over the years.
39:27Um, it's, you know, the old adage in the seventies and eighties, oh, sex, drugs, rock and roll.
39:32Like that is not their kudo.
39:34You know, they're all about vegan, you know, straight edge, you know, save the planet.
39:41You know, it's a very, it's a very different thing.
39:43I've never seen that on, on a, on a warp tour.
39:45It's like, this is bizarre.
39:47This is like a whole other world of, of mindset, you know, that's fine.
39:53It's just, it's, it's, uh, you know, it's a younger generation.
39:55They're into different stuff, you know, but, um, but yeah, it's, it's definitely, uh, it's
40:01that.
40:01And so, you know, ship rock is interesting because ship rock is a younger genre of music,
40:06right.
40:06Active rock.
40:07Right.
40:08And now you, you're in radio, so you know, the demographic of that, you know, of what that
40:12is, but, uh, um, you know, the, a lot of the fans that are on there are the fans who
40:17can afford to go on a cruise, you know?
40:19So they're, you know, my age or, you know, in their thirties, forties, whatever fifties,
40:23but, um, you know, there's, it's, uh, you know, I, I always say, you know, the rockers
40:28that, uh, you know, if it didn't kill them, it only made them stronger kind of thing.
40:31Right.
40:31So if you, if you didn't get cleaned up or at least figure it out, you're probably dead.
40:36Right.
40:37So, uh, if you're still alive, making music, you've probably been through, you know, the ringer
40:42a little bit, you know, getting your ass kicked by the party lifestyle.
40:46And if you're still in the game, you probably, you know, got it figured out whether you're
40:50sober or not, or you just went through a phase, whatever it is, you know, I was just talking
40:56about this with somebody just last night, uh, and they were surprised to find out that
41:00a lot of my friends who are in bands yourself and many others are sober.
41:06Well, you know, it's funny that, you know, I think, you know, you're a product of your
41:10environment.
41:10Right.
41:11And so, you know, when I grew up and I started playing, I mean, I hadn't, you know, alcohol
41:16hadn't passed my lips yet until I was 15, you know?
41:19So when I was young, I mean, I've been all my bands that I was in, none of us, you know,
41:23partied.
41:23And I remember we got a singer in the band.
41:26I don't know.
41:26We were, you know, he, he was in like 10th grade and we were in ninth grade or something.
41:30So like, you know, he started smoking weed and he'd always forget the words.
41:33And they're like, dude, you got one job.
41:35Remember the words, you know?
41:36And he, he gets stoned.
41:37Oh man, I forgot the words.
41:39I was like, okay, this guy's got to go, you know?
41:41So, and then, you know, I was always in bands with older guys.
41:45Right.
41:45I remember even when I was like 12, I joined a band with like 16 year old guys.
41:49And these guys knew, you know, Freebird and how to play Ted Nugent songs and all the,
41:53all the cool guitar playing at the time.
41:55And they had hip, cool songs that they knew.
41:58And so I always got better because I was around, you know, older, older guys.
42:03I mean, even in Megadeth, you know, I was 18, Dave was 21, soon to be 22, you know?
42:08So I was always, you know, I guess the junior thing applied, you know, I was the younger guy
42:13in the band, you know?
42:14So, but it also, you know, forced me to like pay attention to what's going on in the room
42:19and get hip to what's, you know, who's in charge, what's happening here and be, be,
42:22be on point, you know?
42:24And I think if you're, you know, if you're all fucked up and you're on dope and that is
42:28harder, you know?
42:29And it's easier, I think when you're, when you're, when you're partying, it's easier
42:33to trend into where, you know, where's the party going and you tend to be in environments
42:37where that's more of a thing.
42:38And, you know, it is what it is, but yeah, for longevity, I think, let's face it.
42:43I mean, at some point, you know, you can't do that forever or at least I, at least I could,
42:49man.
42:49I mean, I was, I tapped out at age 25 and then we made rest in peace a couple of weeks
42:53later.
42:54And I think the proof is in the pudding, you know?
42:56There you go.
42:57Well, I'll tell you what, Dave, we'll, we'll cut you loose.
42:59Of course, we'll see you here coming up on the 24th of February at the machine shop with
43:04Kings of thrash.
43:05And by the way, thanks for doing that.
43:08The five, for those that don't know, you picked a five songs with killer baselines and people
43:13would be surprised how much Motown and Beatles you guys picked between you, Rudy, JD, and
43:19Frank Bellow.
43:21You know, I guess it's probably our age, right?
43:23I mean, so I was born in 64 and by the time I started really hearing any music, it was
43:29Neil Diamond on the radio, Motown stuff, you know, Diana Ross and the Supremes and that
43:35kind of stuff.
43:35And my mom, you know, she was, she was the musician in our house.
43:39She sang in the church choir, but she had the Beatles.
43:41I want to hold your hand, 45, some, uh, Mary Wells who, uh, was in the Supremes, I think.
43:48And so, you know, she had music around.
43:50She was a big Elvis fan.
43:52And, and it's funny, I was not a big Elvis fan.
43:55I didn't.
43:56And maybe it's because my mom liked him.
43:57And so therefore it wasn't as cool, you know?
43:59And then I, of course, later would come to obviously appreciate Elvis.
44:03And in fact, I've saw my first Elvis movie.
44:05I saw Jailhouse Rock the other kind of a few weeks ago on an airplane or something.
44:10And I watched it because my mom would sit around and watch Elvis movies.
44:13And, and again, cause my mom liked it.
44:15It was like, ah, it's for your parents, you know?
44:17And, uh, now I've, now I've come to appreciate Elvis, you know?
44:21And, um, no, no matter how old you are though, you can appreciate the baselines that some of
44:25these guys wrote, like Paul McCartney.
44:27I just heard him talking.
44:28I was telling Rudy Zarzo about this, that Paul McCartney said one of his favorite baselines
44:32you ever did was the benefit of Mr. Kipe, because he said that it goes the opposite
44:36of where the lyrics are going or whatever the case is.
44:38And you're a musician.
44:39You probably get that a whole lot better than I do.
44:41Well, you know, it's interesting.
44:42So I went to Paraguay some years back.
44:44I was on a South America, 2019, I guess it was.
44:47I did a South American solo tour down there.
44:50Right.
44:50And so I was in Paraguay and, um, there's a guy who's a huge Beatles fan.
44:57He's like a home builder or something.
44:59So he's well-funded.
45:00He's got a lot of cash and he's got this whole Beatles museum, uh, that he put all
45:06of the, he bought replicas of all of their equipment from every era of the band, from
45:10the Hamburg days, from the Cavern Club, uh, you know, the, you know, Liverpool days to
45:16Abbey road, to the Ed Sullivan show.
45:18I mean, it's amazing.
45:19It's like a guitar center of only Beatles stuff, right?
45:22Every microphone, every cable, the way it comes off the mic, every guitar, I mean, everything
45:28about it's amazing.
45:30So I learned a lot about that whole thing.
45:32And, you know, um, I met Pete Best was there, right?
45:34The original drummer, he was staying across the street, so I had to go over and meet him.
45:38Um, and in, in a big part, but you know, there's that book, the art of not giving a fuck.
45:43Right in both Dave and Pete Best are in it.
45:46So I was, I was like, I got, and I asked, I said, so I got to ask you, what's it like,
45:50you know, not being a Beatle?
45:51I mean, you were there, you did all the grunt work and the club days.
45:54And then when it came time to cut the first record, he got ousted and they, they put Ringo
45:59in, you know, and, and, you know, he's a sweet guy.
46:01And, uh, he said, well, you know, I had to just get on with me life, you know?
46:06And, uh, and, you know, he said, I still had me bands and they played me drums and, you
46:11know, did his thing.
46:12So he was, uh, and I said, I said, you know, there's a book that, uh, singer of my band Megadeth
46:18is in and you're in it.
46:19And he laughed and he chuckled and he said, yes, I've heard about that.
46:23And, you know, I said, you were shown in a good light.
46:26So, uh, uh, it was, I thought that was pretty funny, but you know, I guess this guy, this
46:31rich guy would fly him down there and every year, and he'd play five songs in this Beatles
46:36in his, in this guy's Beatles cover band, right?
46:38Tribune band or something.
46:39So he got to kind of have his little thing and it was fun, but, you know, Paul was, I
46:44guess when he was hired, it was kind of John's band.
46:47It's I think, right.
46:47John kind of ran the thing.
46:49And, and so Paul joins the band and Paul was a guitar player.
46:52And I think it was literally, as I understand, a flip of a coin who was kind of,
46:56going to play guitar or bass.
46:58And, um, and Paul, you know, some would say got the shortest straw and became the bass
47:04player.
47:04You know, to me, I'd say he, he won big, but so he, he, you know, became the bass player.
47:08So that would explain why his bass lines are very melodic.
47:12He's obviously a songwriter and a singer.
47:14So he probably rewrites a lot of the stuff on piano and guitar.
47:17He doesn't just write everything on bass.
47:19So, and I think that's a big fallacy with bass players.
47:22You know, these bass players tend to just get very bass nerdy.
47:25And think only about bass.
47:27And I think I'm lucky because I learned how to play piano and saxophone and bass.
47:31And I took up guitar and I learned how to play drums.
47:34You know, you, you become a, you become a musician, you know, so that you understand
47:38what the other musicians in the room are playing.
47:40You're not just my bass, all that matters.
47:42I'm the bass player.
47:43Where it's like, well, it doesn't, you're just a member of the, of the tribe here, you know?
47:48So I think it makes you able to relate more to other musicians.
47:52And, and you're right.
47:54The Motown era, I mean, those bass, you know, in fact, the Motown house right by you there
48:00in Detroit is amazing.
48:01It's so cool because they cut all those records in that little garage.
48:04Yeah.
48:05Right.
48:05The two houses.
48:06So funny.
48:06There's a funeral parlor.
48:08I remember when I went there, there's a funeral going on.
48:09Right.
48:10And, and then there's the two houses, the, you know, the Barry Gordy, you know, houses
48:15there.
48:15One was the actual kind of record company offices and detached right to it is a, is a
48:20house where they, that was basically the studio where they cut all the records in the
48:24garage turned into a studio.
48:27And James Jamerson, of course, is the legendary bass player from that era.
48:32But, you know, the other era that was awesome for great bass playing was the seventies with
48:36disco.
48:37Right.
48:39Those guys were basically seventies was the new Motown man.
48:42And, and, you know, there are three things going on at that time.
48:46Kiss was huge.
48:47The sex pistols just came out and disco.
48:50Right.
48:50And I loved all three of them.
48:52And you would never tell anyone you liked disco unless you wanted to get beat up on the
48:56playground.
48:56Right.
48:56So, so, so I kind of kept that as my little, you know, my little secret, right.
49:02Because I would, I would listen to the bass playing.
49:04I'm like, these guys are fricking amazing, man.
49:06And the octave thing.
49:08And there's just a style that, that they played.
49:10Michael Anthony kind of played a lot of those sort of octave lines and early Van Halen stuff.
49:16Yeah.
49:16And then Kiss Made, I Was Made For Loving You.
49:19Yeah.
49:20Right.
49:20Which is, isn't it funny when you go see Kiss now, it's one of the biggest songs they have.
49:23I mean, to me, it was, I, I, I kind of tuned out at nine.
49:26Honestly, I was, I was done after Kiss Alive too, you know, side for the original songs.
49:31That was kind of, you know, and the guy just moved on, you know, Van Halen and Boston and
49:35other things were coming out.
49:36And how about the Boston bass playing?
49:38That's Tom Scholz playing bass on that.
49:39Oh, he is.
49:40And I have Tom Scholz plays all the bass.
49:42In fact, I read a great story.
49:44He had a, you know, this, so my very first bass was a Gibson EBO that my mom bought for
49:49me.
49:49And I, and I, and I looked for a Gibson because on the back of Kiss Alive, it says, you know,
49:53Kiss used Gibson guitars, right?
49:54But so I found one, a Gibson EBO.
49:58It had flat wound strings.
49:59It didn't sound anything like Gene Simmons.
50:01I was very disappointed when I got it, but I learned how to play it.
50:04And so I read more and more Bob Baisley from Cut the Ozzy Records with the Gibson EBO.
50:12Tom Scholz using EBO.
50:14But Tom, what he did, I read this great thing in like a bass player magazine.
50:18He, being the scientist that he is, he sped the tape up, cut the bass parts so that when
50:24he slowed it down, some sort of oxidation of the tape happened.
50:29Something happened where the bass got bigger and fatter and sounded just more awesome.
50:35So that, those, especially Don't Look Back and especially that first record, man, the
50:40bass playing on those two Boston records is incredible.
50:42So go Tom Scholz.
50:43Yeah, I got to drop it on the turntable now that you mentioned it.
50:46So I'll have to check that out.
50:47But yeah, that's interesting.
50:49That's, it's cool.
50:49We can sit here and talk all day about tricks that people have pulled in the studio, but
50:53I've taken up way more of your time than necessary.
50:56David, thank you so much.
50:57We'll see you on the 24th.
50:59And of course, hit me up to, to, to, to pick up any loose drummers you need.
51:04Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
51:06If I need you to go get Chuck out of the house.
51:07No, that'll be, it'll be great, man.
51:09It'll be a nice Detroit family reunion, man.
51:11It's going to be super cool.
51:12And I think, you know, to see Jeff and Chuck back on stage again, three of us, you know,
51:17jamming these tunes, it'll be super fun.
51:19So I'm looking forward to it.