WRIF Virtual Rock Room with Avenged Sevenfold's Zacky Vengeance
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00:00:00Thank you so much for watching Riff TV.
00:00:02Now, this interview is obviously with video, but I don't interview everybody on Zoom.
00:00:07That's why I put it on my Talkin' Rock with Meltdown podcast.
00:00:10We talk to rock artists from all over the genre.
00:00:13So check out Talkin' Rock with Meltdown wherever you get your podcasts.
00:00:16And now, to today's video interview.
00:00:20DV, how's things?
00:00:22Things are great, man. Things are going really well.
00:00:25You know, it's funny.
00:00:26Shadows and I, we became best friends a couple years ago,
00:00:29and he can't even hop on the Zoom call with me.
00:00:32Oh, yeah. We've just been busy.
00:00:34You know, I don't know if he's getting back from Florida or flying back from Rockville.
00:00:38I know.
00:00:40We'll get to that coming up here in just a few minutes.
00:00:42But speaking of concerts and such, how's it been so far?
00:00:45It's been awesome.
00:00:47Yeah. So how has things go over the weekend for you?
00:00:50Great, man.
00:00:52Florida was a killer.
00:00:54We just went up there and had fun.
00:00:56You know, just getting back at it.
00:00:59You know, doing that, doing what we set out to do when we were 13-year-old kids,
00:01:05except now, you know, same mentality.
00:01:08Many years later, going out there and having fun, doing it fearlessly,
00:01:12and just having a blast, man.
00:01:15Now, was this the first time since you guys have been back on stage
00:01:19that you had, like, the full production and everything?
00:01:21You know, this is the first time I've been on a big stage in five years.
00:01:28It wasn't full production.
00:01:30The festival?
00:01:32Yeah. You know, we just wanted to go out there and just reconnect.
00:01:36Yeah.
00:01:36It wasn't about, like, how much stuff can we blow up?
00:01:38You know, what can we do to top ourselves?
00:01:42It was like, go out there, be a band, be a great band by connecting with the fans
00:01:48and having fun.
00:01:50You know, I think people get so caught up in, like, oh, we need to do more.
00:01:53We need to do this.
00:01:54It's like, yeah, but first and foremost is you've got to be a great band.
00:01:57You've got to love what you do.
00:01:58You've got to be friends with the guys in your band.
00:02:00You've got to appreciate the fans.
00:02:02If you can't do that in front of 10 people or 100,000 people,
00:02:05you probably shouldn't be doing it at all.
00:02:07Yeah.
00:02:07Now, when you go on your own headlining tour, you guys will bring production.
00:02:12You guys have all sorts of stuff.
00:02:15Yeah, definitely.
00:02:16Yeah.
00:02:16So we just want to put on a show that really complements the music
00:02:20and does something different than we've done before.
00:02:24You know, challenge ourselves, challenge our fans to leave the concert
00:02:27having a new experience and a different experience rather than what they think
00:02:34they should expect.
00:02:35You know, I feel like all of our favorite bands always do the unexpected
00:02:39and all the bands that inspire me to change it up are the ones that just do
00:02:46what they think the fans, you know, expect of them.
00:02:51And that just gets boring to us.
00:02:52So we're going to try and do something unique and different that really
00:02:55complements where we are at this point in our lives.
00:02:58And it's going to be amazing.
00:02:59We're thrilled about it.
00:03:01Okay.
00:03:02So you guys have already rehearsed and everything.
00:03:03You're all set and ready to go.
00:03:05Yeah.
00:03:06We've spent, we've been working on this for many months and we are getting
00:03:15ready to, you know, put the final preparations in for the tour.
00:03:22We're going to take it through the arenas and stuff.
00:03:23And we just, we have about another week of like full scale rehearsals just to
00:03:30dial in everything.
00:03:33So we're looking forward to that, you know, but we've, we've put a lot of
00:03:35time and effort to really, really make this great for the fans, for us.
00:03:40You know, as you get older, every show is so important because, you know,
00:03:46we've been through a lot as a band and you can't take anything for granted.
00:03:48You can't take any show for granted.
00:03:52We're not the same as when we were 20 years old, where we played 280 shows a
00:03:56year, you know, now it's less, less shows, but every short show is way more
00:04:01important.
00:04:02And so we're, we're coming to bring our A game just and have fun doing it.
00:04:08Now, when I was in Nashville last month, the guys from Disturbed are down there
00:04:12rehearsing in like a, a big warehouse, which was built or whatever, specifically
00:04:17for that bands go there to rehearse.
00:04:19Do you guys have something like that where you are?
00:04:22We're rehearsing out in Vegas.
00:04:25Okay.
00:04:26Huge soundstage where we're able to build everything and run through, you know,
00:04:31mainly for the crew to get dialed in and make sure everything's operating so they
00:04:38feel comfortable, you know, leave it up to me.
00:04:41I won't pay much attention because I'm the guy that will fall off the stage, but,
00:04:45you know, becoming pretty good at that.
00:04:48But, uh,
00:04:49I didn't want to bring that idea.
00:04:50Keep going.
00:04:51Yeah.
00:04:52You know, we'll, we'll be out there.
00:04:55Yeah.
00:04:55There's spots.
00:04:56There's a couple of spots, you know, funny enough, there's a spot in Nashville.
00:04:58A few years ago when we were starting tour, Taylor Swift was in the room next door
00:05:03doing, you know, the huge scale production and, you know, seeing all that behind the
00:05:08scene stuff's always fun, especially when you're, when you're doing it yourself.
00:05:11Yeah.
00:05:11Maybe you guys should get some choreographed dancers or something.
00:05:14So is, uh, is sin like kind of the guy responsible for a lot of the production or
00:05:18the, or the stage ideas or do all you guys kind of filter in your own stuff?
00:05:22No, it's, it's always been all of us.
00:05:24Um, you know, for the actual, the stage album cycle, like I created all the artwork and,
00:05:31um, you know, but, but the ideas all come from, from all directions.
00:05:36There's no one person that does any or everything.
00:05:38It's literally a compendium of ideas.
00:05:41And that's what makes it so great because we all have faith in each other.
00:05:44Everyone's extremely talented.
00:05:47Um, and that's where the best ideas come from.
00:05:51You know, it's, it's not just one vision.
00:05:53It's, it's a collective vision and.
00:05:57You know, bringing that to life and this time around having outside insert, like outside
00:06:02influences, like having West Lang do the artwork, um, is going to lend itself to the stage show.
00:06:07And it's so, so cool.
00:06:08And it's so outside the box of stuff that we were thinking of on our own.
00:06:13And yeah, it's just, you know, wherever the best idea comes from within the group, you
00:06:18know, that's, we'll take that and run with it.
00:06:20And then everyone else will kind of elaborate on it and it makes it fun.
00:06:23It makes it exciting.
00:06:24Now, as far as the art stuff goes, if I'm not mistaken, do you guys have some sort of art
00:06:28thing happening this weekend?
00:06:30We do.
00:06:31We have a, uh, it's called, um, it's a, at beyond the streets, art galleries in Los Angeles,
00:06:38pretty well, well-known, uh, art gallery.
00:06:41And we're going to be showcasing all the original album art pieces for any fans that want to come
00:06:46see it.
00:06:48And it's really great because I feel like when you see the actual pieces in person, it's
00:06:54so, so much different than just seeing it on the artwork.
00:06:57Like I love the artwork and you can see it on the merchandise and the record.
00:07:00I actually have a copy of the record before.
00:07:04Yeah.
00:07:05Yeah.
00:07:05It's cool.
00:07:06And seeing these pieces in real life, um, our friend and artist Wes made like these 20
00:07:14something pieces and they're huge.
00:07:16I mean, each piece is like, you know, I don't even know, six feet by four feet and there's
00:07:22like 20 of them.
00:07:23So when you see them all in real life, it takes up an entire, you know, warehouse wall
00:07:27of these amazing pieces of art.
00:07:30And we just want our fans to see that, see how much we care, see how much we actually put
00:07:33into this, you know, instead of just hiring a graphic designer to come up with something
00:07:37cool.
00:07:38It's like, now we, we wanted this to be an important album, um, and show everyone our
00:07:43passion for it instead of just, you know, running through the motions or giving people
00:07:48what we think that they want.
00:07:50Yeah.
00:07:50So much more impactful when they see it in person.
00:07:53It's, it's going to blow their minds.
00:07:55I think it's really a cool thing.
00:07:57Hey, before we get into the record here, uh, you just brought up something I was going to
00:08:00ask you about anyways, but, uh, you know, Avenged Sevenfold for the good part of the last
00:08:0420, 22 years has been, you know, with, with the exception of a rev past, it's been you
00:08:08four, what keeps you guys so connected?
00:08:10And you said that everyone kind of, you know, you know, kind of gets involved with, with
00:08:14all aspects of the band.
00:08:16Uh, how do you guys manage to keep that, uh, going?
00:08:20The truth is, is that we feed off of each other's energy.
00:08:23Like we get excited about doing things new and unique.
00:08:29And that's where we rekindle the love and the friendship because I feel like you see a
00:08:39lot of bands that want to just go out there and play hits or kind of phone it in when it
00:08:45comes to making a new album so they can start a new cycle so that they can just go play
00:08:49more of the same and they start becoming bored and they start becoming sad or depressed.
00:08:54And, and for us, it's like, we need to make an album at 40 years old.
00:08:59That is what excites us.
00:09:01And is what would have made us want to pick up a guitar or make noise when we were 14 year
00:09:07old kids, you know, if we can't do that at 40, if we're just playing it safe and, you
00:09:13know, living off our past successes, instead of challenging ourselves and trying to come
00:09:17up with the best album ever that can top anything that we've ever done, whether it does or whether
00:09:22it's not, it's all subjective for, for fans to decide.
00:09:25But for us, it's about coming up with something that's monumentally important in our lives and
00:09:31careers.
00:09:32And, you know, just that, that's, what's exciting to us.
00:09:36We're all best friends and that's a true statement.
00:09:38We love each other.
00:09:39Those guys are the funniest, wittiest guys.
00:09:41We were friends before we were a band, but when it comes to a mental, a collective mentality,
00:09:47it's always how much further can we push ourselves?
00:09:50How much more ridiculous can we get?
00:09:53Cause that's what makes it fun.
00:09:54We're, we're the same kids that when, you know, we're 17, 18 years old, wearing makeup
00:09:58and writing crazy dual harmony guitar, six and a half minute songs or songs like a little
00:10:03piece of heaven or putting out a surprise release with the stage and pissing off basically
00:10:09everyone, we're those same guys.
00:10:11And if we can't do that now, and we're just going to try and play it safe, I think, you
00:10:16know, that, that would have been what would have made us, you know, fall out and fall
00:10:22out of favor with each other.
00:10:23But we just don't do that.
00:10:24We just go out there and embrace whatever we're doing, regardless of what kind of reaction
00:10:30we're going to get now, you just, you just mentioned something.
00:10:33It's like, it's like, where, where is that fine line between being really cool and kind
00:10:37of putting yourself out there and then becoming spinal tap?
00:10:39Do you ever, do you ever get to that line?
00:10:42Man, I feel like the spinal tap thing happens when you're trying to cater to something that
00:10:51you're not being true to.
00:10:52Like if you're not being true to yourself, you become a caricature of your own self.
00:10:56You know, when you're trying to hang on to the past successes and, you know, you're,
00:11:02you're, I feel like people are holding on so desperately trying so hard to, to stay cool
00:11:07or to stay relevant instead of just doing whatever they want.
00:11:10You know, all my favorite, favorite artists, you know, I saw Bob Dylan play last summer at
00:11:1582 years old and he never played one song from any, you know, hit album or anything.
00:11:22He played his new album in its entirety and he had so much fun up there and it made me
00:11:27go back and revisit his entire history and catalog.
00:11:31And the reason he was able to do it at 82 years old is because he's not trying to be,
00:11:36you know, the folk singer from the sixties.
00:11:39He's the 82 year old dude embracing it with sunglasses and a, you know, weathered voice,
00:11:45doing it because he loves it.
00:11:47And that's something that where we have made that conscious decision over the last five
00:11:52years of being home and starting families and reevaluating our lives and past successes
00:11:57and hopefully future successes.
00:11:59What kind of band are we?
00:12:01Who are we as people?
00:12:02What do we want to embrace?
00:12:05What is the point of this?
00:12:06And it's, the truth is, is to keep having fun with it and evolving.
00:12:10And, you know, you don't want to become a spinal tap moment, but you want to, you don't want
00:12:15to take yourselves too serious.
00:12:16You know, if you fall on stage and you roll around, get back up and have a great time,
00:12:21you know, don't, don't try and hide and pretend that it didn't happen.
00:12:24Show it to the world, embrace it.
00:12:25Yeah.
00:12:26I saw Bob Dylan a few years ago.
00:12:27It was the last time I was ever at Joe Lewis arena here in Detroit.
00:12:30I think you guys have played there once or twice, but anyways, I could not get over how,
00:12:34how like, how just disheveled his stage was.
00:12:37There's like wires everywhere and cords all over the floor.
00:12:40I'm like, that just seems so weird to me.
00:12:42He just goes out there to make noise and have fun doing it, man.
00:12:46And it's, he's just been in his own world forever.
00:12:50And it's, that's, what's so cool and so unique about it.
00:12:52You know, um, there's, there's no right or wrong way to do it.
00:12:57And not everyone's going to be a fan of his, but the people that love it truly love it.
00:13:02And not everyone's going to be a fan of Avenged Sevenfold and they never have.
00:13:06Um, but the fans that we do have that have come along for the ride and are excited to
00:13:12see the vision.
00:13:13I mean, that's, that's what makes it all worthwhile or the comment section or the people that hate
00:13:18us.
00:13:18That also makes it very worthwhile too.
00:13:20That's right.
00:13:20Yeah.
00:13:20I was thinking about this earlier.
00:13:22There's, there's a few bands out there that have like just diehard passionate fans and
00:13:26you guys are in that group.
00:13:29You know, that's, it's an amazing place to be.
00:13:33And sometimes you have to have a little bit of tough love when it comes to getting your
00:13:41fans to trust you, you know, because they fell in love with a certain sound or a certain
00:13:47album at a certain time in their life for a certain reason.
00:13:50And, you know, as we get older and evolve, uh, sometimes they're just holding onto that
00:13:57album or that particular way we look 10 years ago or, but really life keeps moving forward
00:14:03and keeps going on.
00:14:04And we have different experiences and different ideas that we want to share and it catches
00:14:10people off guard.
00:14:11If you're doing it right, it's going to catch people off guard.
00:14:13And rather than just us trying to ride another hail to the King or another, um, nightmare,
00:14:19trying to ride the coattails of our past successes, we could never do that.
00:14:23It doesn't work.
00:14:24It gets boring.
00:14:24I mean, to, to me, the bands that I see trying to do that, it bores me to death.
00:14:29But when somebody comes out with something fresh and exciting, um, it's always intriguing
00:14:35to me.
00:14:36And you see some of the past bands that were always fresh and exciting and that then kind
00:14:42of stopped making music, you know, the system of a downs or the rage against the machines.
00:14:48They kind of never gave themselves a chance to burn out.
00:14:54Like they're still amazing bands.
00:14:56What they did was incredible.
00:14:58And I would love to hear new music from them, but I would be so sad if it was just them trying
00:15:02to rehash their old hits.
00:15:03You know what I mean?
00:15:03And so someday I hope they, they come out and they, you know, reinvent their sound or
00:15:09have something to say.
00:15:10And they, cause I love those bands and I think it would just be amazing, but you know, there's
00:15:15a reason why those bands just keep getting bigger and bigger with time is because what
00:15:20they did was so fresh and never, you know, became a caricature of themselves.
00:15:24Now, did you guys do a little bit of chop suey this weekend in Florida or was that just
00:15:29for the first show in Vegas?
00:15:30That was just impromptu in Vegas.
00:15:34Okay.
00:15:35It was a very poor attempt with zero, zero rehearsing of playing those songs, except for just, you
00:15:45know, trying to memorize how they sound off the top of our heads.
00:15:47But it was just fun.
00:15:48These past two shows that we've got under our belt so far, they were, they were just about
00:15:55having fun, reconnecting as a band, reconnecting with the fans, no frills, you know, not, obviously
00:16:03we were all stressed out leading up to it because we care a lot about what we do and it feels
00:16:07so, it's the same energy when you're 14 years old, about to play your first concert in front
00:16:14of 20 people.
00:16:16It's the same exact feeling and energy at 41 years old, about to play the first concert
00:16:22in many years in front of 50,000 people.
00:16:25And that's what's so exciting.
00:16:26Like we haven't lost that passion.
00:16:29I can still see the looks on all my band members' faces before we walk on stage.
00:16:33You know, I can see them white knuckling, though, excitement, nerves.
00:16:38And then when I see them on stage, I see smiles.
00:16:40I see them just having a blast and doing what we were put on this earth to do.
00:16:47Yeah.
00:16:48There was probably a point during the pandemic where you didn't know when you were going to
00:16:51be on stage again, I bet.
00:16:54Absolutely.
00:16:55And, you know, there's been a few of those points in our career where, you know, after
00:17:00losing the Rev, you just don't know and you don't want to take it for granted.
00:17:04So once you do get on that stage, you really have to take all of it in and really like live
00:17:11in that moment.
00:17:11And for me, leading up to the show in Vegas, that was, you know, smaller show is intimate.
00:17:19And leading up, it was nothing but nerves and, you know, just adrenaline and walking
00:17:25on the stage.
00:17:25It was like, I felt like I was home.
00:17:27Like I'd never surprise show.
00:17:29It was a surprise show.
00:17:31Yep.
00:17:32Okay.
00:17:32So go ahead.
00:17:32I'm sorry.
00:17:33I interrupted you.
00:17:33Yeah, yeah, no, it was the surprise show, but walking on stage, it just felt like home.
00:17:39Seeing the fans, the nerves go out the window.
00:17:41You don't worry about, you know, messing up.
00:17:43You just remember that you've played thousands of shows.
00:17:46You've messed up a thousand times.
00:17:49It's all will be forgiven if you go out there and give it everything you have and just exude
00:17:55the energy that the fans are giving back to you.
00:17:59And, you know, it's really just an exciting time for Avenged Sevenfold.
00:18:05Having those five years off, being able to reflect on everything that we've done and everything
00:18:09that we want to do and feel all the, you know, excitement, the insecurities, the wonder of
00:18:18what's yet to come.
00:18:21It's really like reinventing a love for what we do.
00:18:27Yeah.
00:18:28Well, when I walked in the station today, ironically enough, nobody was playing as I walked in.
00:18:34And so that was a good omen.
00:18:35But I was kind of submersed with a lot of your stuff throughout the weekend.
00:18:39And I really appreciate you taking time and talk about this record because when I first
00:18:44heard Nobody, I was I kind of scratched my head a little bit and I liked it, but I didn't
00:18:48love it.
00:18:49And as it goes on, I start to love it.
00:18:51And then I hear we love you.
00:18:53And I'm like, OK.
00:18:54And once again, you're challenging everybody.
00:18:56Right.
00:18:57And I couldn't wait to talk to you about this record because it's so different and so fresh
00:19:02and it sounds, you know, I've been doing this for 33 years.
00:19:05It's like you think that you've heard everything.
00:19:07And all of a sudden you guys come out with a record that I'm like, wait a second.
00:19:10This is so different.
00:19:12And I cannot wait to hear the rest of it.
00:19:14You've got a copy of it sitting next to you.
00:19:16It's not even open.
00:19:16I can't wait to drop this thing on my turntable.
00:19:19Yeah.
00:19:19And that's and that's everything we do.
00:19:22We do it with a purpose.
00:19:26And that's the thing that I see.
00:19:27You know, I see what fans are saying and I and I see comments and.
00:19:32You know, a lot of people just think we're taking stuff, throwing it at the wall.
00:19:37In some some cases we do that, but we but it's still done with a purpose.
00:19:41And we knew full well that these songs in their, you know, exact order, telling a really interesting story and paint all sorts of pictures, you know, straightforward, abstract, dark, haunting, hopeful, just everything.
00:20:03Everything, everything but cliche, and it's exactly what we feel as people at this point in our life.
00:20:10And we really captured all of that in this album.
00:20:13Do I think that people are going to love it or hate it?
00:20:17Yes, both.
00:20:18I fully embrace that, too.
00:20:22And.
00:20:23To catch people off guard with a song like nobody, that song's, you know, that song's like a like a black hole.
00:20:32It's it's heavy.
00:20:34It's, you know, filled with gravity that pulls everything towards it.
00:20:40It's very weighty.
00:20:42It's.
00:20:44You know, kind of just puts you in a mood and a vibe.
00:20:48And it's different than just, you know, a riff in the verse and a hooky chorus and then throw in some dueling guitars like we've done that before this.
00:20:56We tried to do something different.
00:20:57We wanted to make a great, intriguing song that could get better with multiple listens or, you know, add some weight to this record and add some weight to what we've done in the past.
00:21:09And then with We Love You, we incorporated, you know, a bunch of different styles, took what we typically do and kind of reverse the process and tried totally different things.
00:21:24And the album is just us doing that over and over again because.
00:21:30We can't do what we've already done.
00:21:34It would be boring to us.
00:21:36Fans think that they want it, but eventually it would get boring to them.
00:21:40You know, we can't just.
00:21:43Try and ride another big metal bands, coattails or stay in their shadows forever, because that's not what we were meant to do.
00:21:51That's not where our hearts are at.
00:21:52You know, we we don't want to be the next Iron Maiden.
00:21:56We don't want to be the next Metallica.
00:21:58We want to be Avenged Sevenfold.
00:22:01And that's what we've always wanted to be.
00:22:03And in order to do that, you have to do what you do.
00:22:07And we're blessed and fortunate that whatever we do sounds like Avenged Sevenfold.
00:22:12You know, Matt's vocals are extremely unique.
00:22:15The guitar tones and sounds that we use are very much us.
00:22:20There's nobody drums like Brooks, you know, and to have all those tools and to not use them in the way that we were meant to use them would be a shame.
00:22:33If it was just us trying to be a watered down version of, you know, another successful band.
00:22:38And I see so many bands that try and do that, you know, bands that try and be the next Linkin Park or try and be the next Metallica.
00:22:43And it's just, you know, there's a little bit more of that when you're younger and trying to find your place.
00:22:50But when you really break it down and you go back to what made you want to start a band in the first place, that's where you find yourself.
00:22:58We were mixing metal.
00:23:00We were mixing ballads and classic rock and punk rock and all sorts of stuff.
00:23:06That's what Avenged Sevenfold is.
00:23:08And we love the Beatles and we love Billy Joel and we love Johnny Cash.
00:23:13We love everything.
00:23:14That's what we are.
00:23:15And that's what we still are.
00:23:16You know, at 41, we've come across different influences.
00:23:19But that's where our hearts are at.
00:23:21That's what we're, you know, the kind of music we want to make.
00:23:24And we did it, you know, pure and true with this album.
00:23:31I am so excited to listen to the record, but I want to unwrap Nobody just a little bit.
00:23:36You mentioned Sin and Brooks and Shadows and whatnot.
00:23:40And then on top of all of that, you throw in a live orchestra that you guys recorded at what, the Star Wars soundstage or something.
00:23:47I mean, that's insane.
00:23:49That was amazing.
00:23:50It was, you know, I think it's called, I think it's now the Sony Picture Studios.
00:23:55It's this old, you know, soundstage from the early 1900s where they recorded the Wizard of Oz soundtrack.
00:24:06They have a little spot on the floor where Judy Garland sang Somewhere Over the Rainbow.
00:24:10And it's just a bunch of plywood walls.
00:24:14And we had a 78-piece orchestra that took us, you know, an extra year and a half, two years of recording during the pandemic to get all those players in the room, you know, versus having people play a part and then, you know, send it in.
00:24:30We wanted everyone playing together and tugging and pulling and feeling that energy.
00:24:36And it sounded incredible.
00:24:38And we wanted to capture that and let that song kind of end, leaving a very cinematic feeling.
00:24:50And it was really, you know, about these big tones.
00:24:53It wasn't about being overly complex, you know.
00:24:56We can all write riffs.
00:24:58I mean, I could write a thousand riffs, a thousand usable riffs a day that could be good riffs that could be used for something.
00:25:08But sometimes it just takes the perfect, you know, tone or simplicity of something to get the point across, you know, because there's so many great guitar players that can come up with great riffs.
00:25:20You know, are you going to write the next great Dimebag and Daryl riff or, you know, Enter Sandman riff?
00:25:28Maybe, probably not.
00:25:29If you're trying to do that, you're probably not going to come up with something better than what's already been done by the legends.
00:25:37So be unique.
00:25:38Do your own thing.
00:25:39Come up with different tones, different sounds.
00:25:41And that's what we did, you know, especially with Nobody.
00:25:43It's a huge monster of a riff with a very unique guitar tone.
00:25:47And it's simple, but surprisingly difficult to play because it's all feel.
00:25:55And, you know, it's very easy to, with the actual tone that we used to bend it, you know, sharp or flat.
00:26:03And, you know, just finding the groove of it is what's the important part of that riff, you know.
00:26:10And it just feels big and it just feels weighty.
00:26:12And you see the last two shows we played, the live reaction, it just puts these people in a trance.
00:26:20And that's what it's meant to do.
00:26:22It's just so cool.
00:26:23Yeah, I was going to say, it is simplistic.
00:26:25Now, obviously, I don't play guitar.
00:26:26So, like you said, it's difficult to play.
00:26:28But, well, does the orchestra show up in other parts of the album?
00:26:33Definitely.
00:26:34There's all sorts of surprises.
00:26:35But we utilized it where it needed to be used to make the songs, you know, come alive in the way that we were wanting to do.
00:26:50And they're just such phenomenal players in the sounds, you know, getting that cinematic, massive recording.
00:26:59There's something so magical about that versus, you know, just getting strings that are in a, you know, synthesizer or something, which a lot of people do.
00:27:13And we just wanted to do it real.
00:27:14You know, you only get one chance at this in a lifetime.
00:27:18You only get so many albums that you can make.
00:27:20You have to give it everything you can because that's how the world is going to remember you, whether they love it or hate it.
00:27:26Like, this is, you know, this is for us.
00:27:29This is something that will live on long past us.
00:27:32So, you want to do it right, you know.
00:27:33And if that means taking more time or spending more money or confusing more people to get your point across, it's just a necessity.
00:27:43Is this, I mean, this might be a stupid question, but this is, God obviously has to be the most experimental Avenged record that you guys have put out, right?
00:27:51You know, I don't think so.
00:27:56Oh, really? Okay.
00:27:57And it's going to be up for interpretation, of course, but I feel like everybody remembers Avenged in retrospect.
00:28:06And everything that they've heard from us makes sense now because they know it's an Avenged song.
00:28:13But at the time, it was completely different than anything we've done.
00:28:18From Waking the Fallen to, I mean, from sounding the seventh trumpet to Waking the Fallen was a huge step.
00:28:25We went from a metal band with punk rock and very little singing to more of a metalcore sound to City of Evil that was very much rock and roll influenced with, you know, to the White Album that had songs like A Little Piece of Heaven and Dear God, which was country.
00:28:45And all those are Avenged Sevenfold songs.
00:28:47But at the time, people were like, what the hell is this band doing?
00:28:49They have a country song.
00:28:50They have a nine and a half minute, you know, wacky Oingo Boingo kind of Danny Elfman style song about talking about crazy stuff.
00:29:00So I think we experimented along the way always.
00:29:05And it's easy to hear in retrospect.
00:29:07So I think this album is going to catch people off guard and it's going to sound like the most out there album that we've done because we've tried stuff that we've never done before.
00:29:16But we always try stuff that we've never done.
00:29:19And we, you know, mix in signature sounds that we do.
00:29:23So yes and no.
00:29:25I mean, when you go back and listen to the Beatles, everyone knows every Beatles song.
00:29:31And they're just Beatles songs.
00:29:32But at the time, every single album was so different.
00:29:35And, you know, catching people off guard.
00:29:38So in retrospect, you know, it's easy to say this album is going to be a lot different than anything we've done in the past.
00:29:47However, I think that can be said for every album that we've done.
00:29:51Well, I've only heard the two songs like I messaged you the other day.
00:29:54And We Love You is like an amalgamation of like eight different songs and eight different genres all wrapped up into one.
00:30:00And that's what I thought I was like really intrigued by that by that song.
00:30:07There's there's stuff on this album that we've never ventured into.
00:30:10And it's more about creating music that we love versus trying to stay within a certain set of parameters to maintain being a hard rock band or or a heavy rock band.
00:30:26And like we have heavy stuff on the album.
00:30:28We love.
00:30:30That stuff.
00:30:31We love heavy music.
00:30:32We love punk rock music.
00:30:34We love the Beatles.
00:30:36We love Daft Punk.
00:30:39We love.
00:30:40I mean, a million bands, a million different artists from every facet of.
00:30:48Music that you can imagine.
00:30:50And, you know, we incorporate a lot of new and different stuff on this this time around that you're not going to be able to compare to previous Avenged albums.
00:31:04But with that said, they make for some really thought provoking, amazing songs.
00:31:13When you give them a chance and you take it in as a whole and you, you know, listen to the lyrics and you, you know, take the artwork in.
00:31:22And it's really meant to be an experience that takes you on an entire artistic voyage and journey inside of our minds at this point in our life, rather than just some, you know, right.
00:31:34Trying to write some bangers or some great radio hits, because I feel like all of our favorite radio hits were never written to be radio hits.
00:31:42When you listen to November Rain or if you listen to, you know, Chop Suey or, you know, even bands like Green Day, you know, when they came on the scene, it was it just worked because it was unique and different and they were doing what they did.
00:32:00There's no formula to write a perfect radio song.
00:32:02People try and they can end up on the radio.
00:32:04So, um, but to make something truly great, you just have to throw it out there in the world and hope it makes a big enough splash, but it has to be what, what you want it to be.
00:32:16And I think we're staying true to that and it takes some soul searching and we're all on the same page with that.
00:32:22Um, and that's what makes it exciting.
00:32:26Yeah.
00:32:26That's the thing.
00:32:27Like that, I think that's why I like vinyl so much.
00:32:29And that's why I can't wait for this one, because when you get it, it is the whole experience.
00:32:33And I don't, uh, me personally, when I hear, you know, when, when bands start dropping songs, like you guys have only dropped the two songs so far, correct?
00:32:41Yes.
00:32:41Okay.
00:32:42I, I try to kind of isolate myself from them if I can, for the most part, because I want to hear the thing as a whole.
00:32:48I don't want to get too much of the record before I hear it all together.
00:32:51You know what I'm saying?
00:32:52And with this, like, this sounds like it's going to be like a rollercoaster ride, like a, like a, like a cinematic score or something along those lines.
00:33:00It's, it's totally going to be a rollercoaster.
00:33:02And, uh, we feel the same way as, as you, you know, that's why we released the album, the stage last time around as a surprise release.
00:33:11Cause we didn't want to do the six month rollout of singles and, you know, all this stuff because it just gets boring to us.
00:33:20And, uh, you know, the album is right around the corner.
00:33:23So we wanted to give our fans, we love you, you know, just before we get back on the road, just for ourselves to go out there and play and have fun and let them have a little sneak, sneak peek into it.
00:33:34Um, but I totally share your sentiment.
00:33:39I mean, I think the album listened to as a whole, I think the entire experience, like with the vinyl, like what you're saying is just a totally different and amazing way to listen to music.
00:33:53Like it nowadays in a world where everything, you know, album comes out Friday, you look at Spotify, you listen to a couple of songs, you, somebody calls you or texts you, you know, you start Googling stuff.
00:34:02Next thing you know, you're not listening to it.
00:34:03Like you've lost your attention span.
00:34:06Um, you skip through songs and, you know, I'm guilty of it, guilty of it also.
00:34:13But when I've found albums and I give them a chance, and then I listened to them over and over again, or listen to them on vinyl and I'm forced to listen to entire side, a entire side B and look at the artwork and read the lyrics.
00:34:26And that's when you're like, you totally, you know, immerse yourself in the experience of what the artist is trying to give you.
00:34:34And you can truly decide if what they're doing is great or creative, or if it's, you know, phoning it in.
00:34:43And, and I get those opinions all the time.
00:34:44There's so many great artists now that I'm excited about.
00:34:47And there's so many albums that I'm just like, I've given them a chance to listen over and over.
00:34:51And I'm like, these guys are totally phoning it in and it's not fair to them.
00:34:55It's not fair to their fans.
00:34:57Um, you know, I can't, I can only speak for ourselves, but man, go wild, have fun, do crazy stuff.
00:35:04Like that's what it's about.
00:35:06Yeah.
00:35:06I haven't been excited for a record like this in a long time.
00:35:10And, uh, and, and from what I've heard so far, a lot of the influences on this record are really not rock influences.
00:35:17Correct.
00:35:18Totally.
00:35:19I mean, we've, you know, we've been inspired by the greatest rock acts.
00:35:24We've lived with those albums.
00:35:25We've, um, you know, we respect it.
00:35:28We love it.
00:35:29That's, it's part of our DNA and there's no doubt about that, but there's so many artists that we love and so many styles of music that we've grown up with from classical to, you know, classic rock to, I mean, R and B influences.
00:35:46And, uh, you know, electronic bands that are doing crazy, cool, unique stuff that's just out there lighthearted.
00:35:57You know, I, last night I went and saw the band a hundred gecks and I took my kids, my two small kids and they love it.
00:36:05And sometimes that's the biggest indicator for me of like, what's cool.
00:36:10What's exciting.
00:36:10Like what, what do my kids love?
00:36:12Why do they love this?
00:36:13And it's like, because there's this band that's going out there that's totally different than anything that I've heard.
00:36:20Totally fearless.
00:36:22Um, that knows exactly what they're doing.
00:36:25And most people would hear it and just instantly write it off.
00:36:28But to me, I was like, this is fun.
00:36:31This is cool.
00:36:31Music can be lighthearted.
00:36:32It can be fun.
00:36:33It can be different.
00:36:34It can be adventurous.
00:36:35It doesn't have to have rules or, or boundaries or parameters to, to keep you, uh, to keep you being a hard rock band.
00:36:43You know, I, I want to cross over to different genres.
00:36:49I want to scare the hell out of people that have never heard of a rock band.
00:36:52I want them to be like, I like this.
00:36:54I hate this.
00:36:54I'm scared of it.
00:36:55What is this?
00:36:55I just want to know more about it.
00:36:57Um, instead of like, oh, they're on this side of the aisle.
00:37:00They're, they're a rock band.
00:37:01I can't ever like that.
00:37:02Cause I like pop music or I like this.
00:37:05I just want, I want people to be like, Hey, I don't know what they're doing, but I like it.
00:37:09Or, Hey, I don't know what they're doing, but I hate this.
00:37:13But anything, but being right down the middle, being mediocre.
00:37:18Yeah.
00:37:18Right.
00:37:18You want to solicit a reaction.
00:37:20It's funny you mentioned about your kids because, uh, my wife is not in the business.
00:37:24She has nothing to do with music, whatever.
00:37:25But when she says she likes something, I pay a little bit more attention to her because
00:37:29she listens to it way differently than we may.
00:37:32And I said, I asked her about nobody.
00:37:33She goes, Oh yeah, I love that song.
00:37:34Now I wouldn't have brought that up had she not said that, but she did.
00:37:37So, you know, at least you're reaching her.
00:37:40Totally.
00:37:41It's, it's, it's a different thing.
00:37:42And you, I feel like so many people are so aimed at trying to please everyone and you
00:37:51just, you can't, even if you think you're pleasing your own fans, they'll still, people
00:37:55still aren't going to like what you're doing.
00:37:57They're going to turn on it.
00:37:58They think that they want you to write a song you've already written.
00:38:01And then when you give them that song, they're like, well, this doesn't excite me.
00:38:05Like, that's not why I fell in love with you in the first place.
00:38:08So you can't win everybody over.
00:38:10And that's just one thing that I think all artists have to accept.
00:38:14And then they need to look at themselves and what's inside themselves.
00:38:19Because I mean, this day and age, you're, you're never going to be able to win everybody
00:38:24over and, but you will be able to win some people over what resonates with me doesn't
00:38:30necessarily resonate with the rest of my bandmates and vice versa.
00:38:33But sometimes they're light years ahead of a certain sound or certain artist.
00:38:39And then I catch onto it.
00:38:42Like, oh, I totally get it.
00:38:43You know, I was giving it a hard time, but this is brilliant.
00:38:46And vice versa, there's things that I've shown to them that at first listen, they're like,
00:38:52what is this?
00:38:52You know, they write it off.
00:38:54And then years later, you see them walking around wearing the shirt or going to the concert
00:38:59because they've, you know, sometimes it's not instant gratification.
00:39:04A lot of my favorite bands ever have taken some time to digest or for me to have that
00:39:11epiphany, you know, like that moment, like, I finally get it.
00:39:15Like, this is just next level.
00:39:18And they become my favorite artists forever.
00:39:20And then I never second guess what they do and I only look forward to it.
00:39:24And I, sometimes it takes time to wrap my head around it.
00:39:28Like, what are the, what are they doing?
00:39:29Why are they doing this?
00:39:30Do I like it?
00:39:31Do I hate it?
00:39:32I'll give it a chance.
00:39:33Maybe I'll put it on the back burner for a little bit, you know, come back to it a couple
00:39:38months later and have a whole new appreciation.
00:39:41You know, it's just, there's no right or wrong way.
00:39:43It's just, it's just a really, yeah, exactly.
00:39:48One million percent.
00:39:49Yeah.
00:39:50So a couple more things on the record here real fast.
00:39:52I heard that there's a, I heard there's a, you just mentioned November Rain.
00:39:55I heard there's an epic track on it called, is it Cosmic?
00:39:59Yes.
00:39:59Yeah.
00:40:00Talk a little bit about that one.
00:40:02I feel like that might be one of the greatest ballads we've written.
00:40:12Um, because there's, there's really no way to explain it other than it's completely unique
00:40:25to anything that I've ever heard any other artists, not just band, not rock band or, you
00:40:32know, just any artists, right.
00:40:34It's, um, just a completely new type of ballad.
00:40:40And it's, it's, I mean, it's not really like a ballad in the traditional sense.
00:40:44It's, it's just a big, powerful piece of music that keeps evolving and, uh, just makes you
00:40:53feel a certain way that introduces new sounds and new techniques and styles that we've never
00:41:00done before.
00:41:01Um, and it just keeps building up and building up and yeah, I think that song is really going
00:41:09to catch a lot of fans, um, off guard and draw them into this album and create, you know,
00:41:19emotions that just pull it from the deepest part of their souls and stuff, which is what
00:41:23a great song should be able to do.
00:41:25And I think we did it, you know, with this song.
00:41:27Um, and I, I can't wait to see fans reactions, uh, you know, to the album, but to that song
00:41:35in particular, I think that's going to hold a lot of weight and be an important song for
00:41:39people throughout their lives.
00:41:41You know, the people that gravitate to that song, they'll be able to carry it through
00:41:44different, uh, different pieces of their lives, you know, happy times, sad times.
00:41:51I mean, that's all life really is, you know, falling in love, you know, having heartbreak,
00:41:57you know, having children, watching them grow, losing people that you love, coming to grips
00:42:03with the fact that someday you're going to be the person that's no longer here.
00:42:06And that song just takes you on that entire ride.
00:42:09It's, and it's kind of indifferent.
00:42:11It's just, it is what it is.
00:42:13Um, and it paints that picture exactly in that way.
00:42:18So it's, it's pretty cool.
00:42:19And I think people will, will really, um, really love that song.
00:42:24Uh, yeah.
00:42:24Like I said, I haven't heard any other songs besides those, those two, so I can't really
00:42:28compare it with anything, but I, I obviously I'm looking forward to hearing the rest of
00:42:31the record.
00:42:32A final thing here for you on the album, uh, a lot's been made about the hallucinogens
00:42:36with, uh, with shadows and with sin and stuff.
00:42:39How much of that really affected this album?
00:42:42You know, I think it affected just their mentality as, as people.
00:42:49I feel they needed that experience because you get to a certain place in life where you
00:43:01look back at all your past successes and failures.
00:43:04You look at where you're at, you look at the fact that how your lives have changed, how
00:43:09friendships have changed, evolved, you know, families, relationships, and you kind of look
00:43:16at yourself as a, you know, becoming a parent myself, you know, having children, what kind
00:43:21of person I want to be, how, what kind of mark I want to leave on this world.
00:43:27And for them, they just wanted to experience something, you know, that, that others had mentioned
00:43:33to them that it kind of, uh, gives you a whole new perspective on the world.
00:43:40And in order to be the best version of yourself, sometimes you need to take a different, a different
00:43:47perspective to see your own life, your own existence, your own relationships, your own,
00:43:52uh, pros and cons.
00:43:54And, you know, for them, that was the experience that did it.
00:44:00And they came out of it with, uh, you know, a different appreciation for, for life, for
00:44:08their friendships, for the relationships, for art that they create, what really matters
00:44:13versus, you know, the petty BS that, uh, drives men and women and bands insane, you know, just
00:44:22the stuff that just doesn't matter.
00:44:24And it was really great.
00:44:25You know, they had this, uh, kind of epiphany to like, of like, what's truly important and,
00:44:35and, uh, how to apply that to what, what they do in regards to Avenged and what, what we do.
00:44:46And it created just a really different, awesome dynamic, um, for this album, you know, cause
00:44:56I see, I've seen so many other bands, you know, get to this, let's call it like a midlife
00:45:01crisis point of being in a band or being, and we just didn't want that to happen.
00:45:07You know, sometimes you got to reflect on yourself and figure out, do whatever it takes to find
00:45:12who you are, what you want to leave behind in this world and what you love doing and rekindle
00:45:19that.
00:45:20And that helped them on that journey.
00:45:22And for me, it's been, you know, stepping outside of our comfort zone, you know, the
00:45:28stuff that we're doing in photo shoots, the, uh, the music that we're writing, the videos
00:45:32that we're creating, the live shows that we're building.
00:45:35It's bringing it back to where I wanted to be, uh, when I was 14, picking up a guitar,
00:45:45wanting to take over the world, get on stage.
00:45:48It's, you know, uh, there's, there's no confusion in what I want to do and why I want to do it.
00:45:55And I think that's the same for all of them.
00:45:57You just mentioned that midlife crisis.
00:45:59Is there a part of you that things had to pandemic, not stop the whole world that maybe
00:46:03you guys sort of put out a different record?
00:46:06Oh, you know, because it's, it's afforded you time to kind of, you know, do some different
00:46:13things probably, huh?
00:46:15It did.
00:46:15It was an absolute blessing for us.
00:46:18And we made the conscious decision where at a certain point in the pandemic, when the
00:46:24world started opening back up, it was like the mad dash of everyone.
00:46:29Hey, great, great news guys.
00:46:31You can put out an album now.
00:46:32It's time to get back to work.
00:46:33Like everyone's going on tour.
00:46:34You guys can get on tour, do this, this, and this.
00:46:36And, and we just, that kind of caught us off guard.
00:46:39And we're just like, well, are we going to just go on tour?
00:46:43Cause we need money to, to be comfortable.
00:46:46Like, is that what's going to be the ultimate driver of what inspires us to get back on the
00:46:52road or to get back to work?
00:46:54And all of us were just like, no, like we don't let, let the world figure itself out a little
00:47:01bit.
00:47:02We need to take the time that we need to make something great.
00:47:05Like, and even if that means putting ourselves outside of our comfort zones or, you know,
00:47:11not just going, getting a payday because that, that just defeats the purpose.
00:47:17Like we don't do this, you know, just so we can collect a check at our fans expense.
00:47:24Like we want them to feel how our favorite artists have made us feel.
00:47:31And I can tell you for certain that no bands that are just going out there as a cash grab
00:47:37have ever made me feel, or have ever changed my life.
00:47:41You know, I have a pretty good BS meter, but the bands that truly love it, that have had
00:47:46ultimate successes.
00:47:48It's because I feel a connection to the passion of what they do.
00:47:53And the fact that they create something that I'm not capable of, you know, they, they have
00:47:58something to offer the world, like all, all the great artists, they, they offer something
00:48:02inside their soul that, um, you know, it's like a, a, a peek into the window of their soul
00:48:08and it's genuine.
00:48:10And for us, it was like, we're going to take as much time as we need until we feel we have
00:48:17the right piece of work, the right piece of art to give to the world.
00:48:21And it put us out of our comfort zone.
00:48:23I mean, you know, you get scared, you have kids, you know, we have bills, we have, you
00:48:28know, bills to pay and mouths to feed, but at the expense of our entire life of, of work,
00:48:36it just wasn't worth it.
00:48:36So we took the time to make the art exactly what we want it to be.
00:48:41And it all came together and it took a little bit of extra time, but we're so happy with
00:48:45the album.
00:48:45Um, we put so much extra time into, you know, mixing it, getting the tones, making it perfect,
00:48:51finding the, the perfect art, you know, creating the perfect video to represent what we wanted
00:48:56to show off to the world, um, and into building our live show.
00:49:00You know, the first couple of shows that we played, they were exactly what they were supposed
00:49:03to be.
00:49:03Like it was thought out, we wanted to go out there, uh, and not stress ourselves out about
00:49:10how much stuff can we blow up or have on stage.
00:49:13Or, you know, it wasn't, it wasn't about trying to be a bench sevenfold of, you know, 2018 or
00:49:182010 or whenever people saw us last, it was about being able to be a great band first and
00:49:26foremost, which is five guys on stage connecting with an audience and having fun.
00:49:32And, and that's what we did.
00:49:34I mean, Rockville was huge for us because it was just so fun.
00:49:37And the surprise show was just so much fun.
00:49:39Um, you have to be able to put on an amazing show in front of a hundred people or a hundred
00:49:45thousand people and feel that passion.
00:49:48And we knew right away that that's, that's what we have.
00:49:50That's what, you know, that's what we felt in these last two shows.
00:49:53We feel nerves, we felt, felt excitement and, you know, we can't wait to continue this process.
00:50:01Yeah.
00:50:02It's a, you know, as far as like major headlining bands are concerned outside of guns and roses,
00:50:06most of them have put out a record already since the pandemic.
00:50:09So it, I know that you guys took your time with that.
00:50:11I can talk about this record for another hour, but I don't want to keep it, but I do want
00:50:15to ask you just a couple more things here, uh, outside the record, by the way, uh, uh,
00:50:19life is, but a dream comes out June 2nd can hardly wait.
00:50:21Uh, we'll see you here in Detroit on July 26th.
00:50:24Uh, hopefully it'll be more than the 20 minutes we saw you with Metallica in the last 10 years.
00:50:29Yeah.
00:50:30Yeah, totally.
00:50:31No, we definitely owe Detroit some more love.
00:50:34They've always been really great to us, but, uh, yeah, it'll definitely be more than the
00:50:3920 minutes and, uh, it's definitely going to be an entirely new experience and it'll be
00:50:44worth the wait.
00:50:45Yeah.
00:50:45A couple more things here.
00:50:47When I, when I saw shadows in Nashville, a couple of years ago, we hung out for quite
00:50:51a while and he told me something I never forgot.
00:50:53And I wanted to ask you about this.
00:50:54He told me you guys played with rise against one time for one pain customer.
00:50:58Is that true?
00:51:00That's probably pretty true.
00:51:02We had quite a few shows with, uh, with a few notable bands in front of very, very few
00:51:08paying customers.
00:51:09We played, uh, man, we played with rise against, it might've been a place called maxes in like
00:51:18Kansas city or something.
00:51:19If my memory serves me correct.
00:51:21And I mean, we used to go out there and be playing for each other there.
00:51:25We'd be playing for rise against and they'd be playing for us.
00:51:28And there, there were so many instances of that.
00:51:31We played with so many bands that we, we really came up with and we just did it because
00:51:37we loved it and we wanted to become better bands or hope this we can make one fan.
00:51:42And we wanted it so bad.
00:51:44That's, that's the thing that I think a lot of people don't understand is the success has
00:51:47come from a genuine desire.
00:51:49You know, even for bands like rise against it, they wanted it so bad that they would be
00:51:54willing to drive across the country, load all their gear, make no money, starve in hopes
00:52:00of gaining one fan because it's what they love to do.
00:52:04It's what we love to do.
00:52:05Um, you can't fake that.
00:52:07Like most people would quit after the first try, but you know, I remember getting somebody
00:52:14in New Mexico, um, my ID because the show was 18 and older.
00:52:22I don't even think I was 21 and there was no fans there.
00:52:25There was no one there to see this except for like five kids.
00:52:29And one of the kids wasn't 18.
00:52:31So they wouldn't let him in.
00:52:32So for the day he was me, I gave him, he was Zach.
00:52:35I gave him the ID so he could come in and see the concert.
00:52:38And we made five fans that night, you know, and those five fans in New Mexico turned into,
00:52:42you know, 500 fans into 5,000 fans and hopefully into 50,000 fans.
00:52:46It, you know, but it's because we always believed it was always important.
00:52:51Our fans have always been important, whether it's one or 10 or a hundred.
00:52:56Um, and we've done that, you know, we, we made those rounds, played those shows and being
00:53:04that, you know, older now and having some success, keeping that same mentality, bringing that same
00:53:11energy to the stage is that's where we, that's where our heads are at.
00:53:15That's where we need to be.
00:53:16Yeah.
00:53:16He told me that story and I never forgot that.
00:53:19I'm like, man, next time I talk to either you guys or rise against, I haven't talked to any
00:53:22guys from rise again since he told me that it was like a year and a half ago.
00:53:24I think I just interviewed, uh, uh, one of them, uh, right before that, Tim, I guess.
00:53:29Um, all right.
00:53:29Last thing you mentioned the Beatles a few times.
00:53:31I'm a huge Beatles fan.
00:53:32So, uh, favorite Beatles songs, favorite Beatle albums.
00:53:37Oh man.
00:53:38Um, I'm going to start, I'm going to start with mine.
00:53:42I'm going to tell you what I like in my life might be one of the most perfect songs
00:53:46I've ever heard.
00:53:48Sergeant peppers is such a great album.
00:53:50The second side of Abbey road.
00:53:52I just cannot, you just can't stop listening to it as far as I'm concerned.
00:53:57Um, you know, that kind of stuff.
00:53:59I was 11 years old when John Lennon was killed.
00:54:02Ironically enough, the guy who killed him is actually in prison in the little one horse
00:54:05town I grew up in and outside of Buffalo in New York.
00:54:08And, uh, some of my friends were guards there.
00:54:11They worked with them and whatnot.
00:54:12So I kind of had this like weird connection to that.
00:54:14Uh, but as soon as, uh, I heard John Lennon was killed, I, I, I pulled out my dad's Beatle
00:54:18records.
00:54:18I never heard him before.
00:54:19And so some of those, some of those albums were probably the first ones I heard.
00:54:22So that's probably why I have such a connection to him.
00:54:23But what about you?
00:54:26You know, when I was a kid and we'd be driving on road trips, my dad would always offer me
00:54:34a dollar if I could guess the song.
00:54:36Hmm.
00:54:37And it was always a Beatles song.
00:54:39If I could name the artist, he'd give me a dollar.
00:54:41Well, I caught on very quick that he only did that if it was a Beatles song.
00:54:45So it was always, you know, I want to hold your hand or, you know, just the early Beatles
00:54:51stuff that come on the radio when we'd be driving and he'd offer me a dollar if I could
00:54:54name the band.
00:54:55So I just started saying the Beatles anytime any song came on.
00:54:57So I'd collect my dollar, um, where I truly fell in love.
00:55:03I loved all their hits.
00:55:05I heard, uh, my dad had a record and a record player and I was about 14 and I heard come
00:55:12together and I couldn't make sense of these, you know, ridiculous lyrics, but the melody
00:55:17was so good and, and brought me in.
00:55:20And I was like, man, this is, this is way better than just getting a dollar.
00:55:24Like this, this band is awesome.
00:55:26I dove into the entire white album and the songs were just so ridiculous, you know, um,
00:55:33and so different.
00:55:34And then you get to a song like Helter Skelter and they're just screaming or, you know, why
00:55:40don't we do it in the road?
00:55:41It's just like, what are these guys doing?
00:55:43It's all over the place.
00:55:44And then they throw in their melodies and they have such great voices.
00:55:46And you realize, you know, a song like Blackbird, like that sounds hard to play on guitar.
00:55:52And these guys are recording it in real time.
00:55:54Like these guys are really good musicians on top of it.
00:55:57I mean, saying the Beatles are good musicians, it sounds stupid, but you just don't assume that
00:56:02every, everybody's really good at what they do.
00:56:04But those songs are hard to play.
00:56:06And, um, from, from there, that's what really just blew my mind.
00:56:12And I mean, I love pretty much everything they did.
00:56:15Um, I love, I'm a huge fan of the Beatles hits, you know, and there's so many, you know,
00:56:20Eleanor Rigby, and it's just, they can get dark with their lyrics and they can make you
00:56:25feel a certain way and make you kind of feel a sadness for humanity, or they can totally
00:56:29lift you up, you know, you know, they can make you feel happy.
00:56:34The, uh, in a song, like Maxwell's hammer, like, you know, the stuff they were doing
00:56:39is just so cool and unique.
00:56:42And, um, I just, I just wish there was more of that in, in what bands are willing to do
00:56:49nowadays.
00:56:50You know, it's, it's so fun.
00:56:51It's so exciting.
00:56:52Just go step outside your box and be crazy.
00:56:55Yeah.
00:56:55It's funny.
00:56:56You should mention that because, uh, I'm a big believer in it's, it's not like, uh, what
00:56:59you do for people or whatever.
00:57:01A lot of it is how you, how it makes you feel.
00:57:03And that has a lot to do with music as well.
00:57:06There are bands I hate just because it just takes me back to a time in my life where maybe
00:57:10it wasn't great or whatever the case was.
00:57:12It just made me feel a certain way, you know, but Rick Rubin, a thing that he did with the
00:57:17Beatles where he would, he would isolate tracks with Paul McCartney was amazing.
00:57:20And that, that Beatles documentary that, uh, what is it?
00:57:23The three, two, one or whatever it was I watched where they, you know, made their last record
00:57:26was unbelievable.
00:57:29Oh yeah.
00:57:30Um, yeah.
00:57:31Seeing that and getting a perspective into the studio and seeing how they operated.
00:57:36And, uh, I mean, that, that's, that was one of the greatest gifts as a musician to be
00:57:43able to see that and, um, seeing.
00:57:48I had to inspire you guys when you're, you're sitting at home watching this.
00:57:50You're probably, your juices probably start flowing.
00:57:52Like, wait a second, you know, totally seeing those guys come, come in with a riff and seeing,
00:58:00you know, then build up these songs and, uh, you know, seeing Paul writing, let it be in
00:58:08real time.
00:58:09Uh, and, you know, George coming in with, with songs and, and then seeing Ringo come in with,
00:58:14you know, uh, Octopus's garden and George trying to help that.
00:58:20And give it some better melody.
00:58:22I mean, that's kind of what we do, you know, someone will have an idea and we don't just
00:58:26write it off.
00:58:26It could be the most insane idea and we can help nurture it.
00:58:30And whether it works or not, I mean, we've thrown away a lot of great songs and, or great
00:58:35pieces.
00:58:35And we've come back and used them years later, you know, but you nurture it because no idea
00:58:40is too ridiculous or too, too dumb or, um, you know, it's everything that's thrown out
00:58:47in the universe needs to be given a chance or an opportunity because it might find itself
00:58:51at the forefront of a great song someday.
00:58:54Yeah.
00:58:54I think I heard shadow saying that you guys don't just get in a room and write, you kind
00:58:58of, you kind of bring your ideas and wherever you get them from, because, you know, I, and
00:59:03it made a perfect sense.
00:59:04He's like, if you just get in there to write, it's you're now you're forcing the creativity.
00:59:10Totally.
00:59:11And I couldn't imagine, you know, ever being able to do that.
00:59:17You, you come up with ideas, something you love, something that sticks in your head, something
00:59:21that inspires you.
00:59:22And then you, you know, throw it out there in the universe and try and nurture it, you
00:59:26know, water it, see if it'll grow, see if you can find a spot for it, see if it resonates
00:59:30with someone else, um, see if they can make it better, see if it inspires some feelings
00:59:36or emotions or lyrics.
00:59:37And, and then you have to be willing to throw it away.
00:59:41You know, if it doesn't work for a certain song or certain album, it exists.
00:59:46At least you gave it a chance.
00:59:47You came up with it, try and make a record of it, uh, make a note of it, save it.
00:59:53And you might find yourself using it years down the line, you know, it might resonate 10
00:59:57times harder in the future.
00:59:59And, you know, just always creating, trying to build, trying to, you know, explore that's,
01:00:05that's why we do what we do and it makes it fun.
01:00:11Yeah.
01:00:11Well, I'll tell you what, ZV, you've been, uh, uh, totally gracious with your time.
01:00:15I really appreciate that.
01:00:16I know you got the family and everything and you woke up early to do this.
01:00:19Uh, so, uh, thank you so much.
01:00:20I cannot wait for the record.
01:00:22Can you show that to me one more time?
01:00:24Oh yeah.
01:00:24No, I'm very, very excited about this and time is flying.
01:00:27Um, yeah, it looks cool.
01:00:30It's ready to go.
01:00:32I can't even open it yet because I'm so excited about just looking at it, to be honest.
01:00:37That tells you anything.
01:00:38Like I've been wanting to open it.
01:00:39I'm like, man, it's just, it's just so neat how it is right now.
01:00:43You haven't seen the inner workings.
01:00:44You haven't seen the stuff inside.
01:00:46You probably haven't had a good idea, right?
01:00:48Yeah.
01:00:48Yeah.
01:00:48I mean, I've, I've, you know, helped put all the art together and stuff, but this is
01:00:53the actual first copy of, of this version that I've held that I've seen anyone hold
01:00:59to be honest.
01:01:00So I'm just like, man, should I open it or should I just leave it?
01:01:04And I I'm pretty torn, but it's, it's, it's beautiful and it's, it's a piece of art.
01:01:09Well, thank you again for your time.
01:01:10Good luck on everything.
01:01:11We'll see you here in July, uh, in Detroit and I can hardly wait for the show.
01:01:16Awesome.
01:01:17Meltdown.
01:01:17Always good talking to you, man.