KillerFrogs writers Nick Girimonte and Davis Wilson discuss Houston's dominance, an extremely hot Baylor squad, questionable Kansas and a another week of meaningful Big 12 games.
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00:00 Welcome to this week's episode of Frog Fever, a Big 12 basketball podcast brought to you
00:08 by Killer Frogs.com.
00:10 My name is Davis Wilson.
00:11 With me as always is my co-host Nick Germani.
00:14 Nick, how are you?
00:15 We we as frog fans, but we'll get into that later.
00:21 What were your thoughts on the week in the Big 12 as a whole?
00:24 Yeah, it was a pretty chalk Big 12 week.
00:28 You know, there's a couple storylines that, you know, we got out of it, but a lot of games
00:33 that almost had upsets.
00:35 UCF almost kicked off Iowa State.
00:37 OU almost got Houston, but it ended up just being like, like Kansas almost won at Baylor,
00:43 but we can get into that.
00:45 But yeah, as a frog fan, I mean, this is as bad of a week as we've had all year.
00:49 It's you want to peak at the right time, but this is not going well for us.
00:54 So we'll get into that and break down what's going wrong for the frogs.
00:58 Yeah, well, we'll start.
01:01 Oh, I should say this.
01:02 We have we have our good friend Colin Post coming on the podcast.
01:07 We talked to him early last week just about some general topics about this this year's
01:14 TCU team, what he thinks about the rest of the Big 12.
01:19 He's a he's a great basketball fan, and he knows what he's talking about.
01:24 So we had a good conversation with him and he'll we'll bring him on at the end of the
01:28 episode.
01:29 But I guess for now, we'll start with the Big 12 stuff.
01:33 And I think the obvious one we'll start with, you know, TCU had a bad week, but Kansas also
01:39 had a bad week.
01:40 TCU and Kansas both went on to both lost to BYU and Baylor.
01:45 We'll start with Kansas.
01:48 Obviously they're hurt.
01:49 They're without McCuller.
01:50 What do you think?
01:51 What do you think about this team?
01:55 They have not looked good for a couple of weeks now.
01:59 And we we were concerned about him last week.
02:03 And those concerns were very real, it turns out.
02:07 Yeah.
02:08 Kansas is interesting because that BYU game, you know, BYU going to an Allen Fieldhouse
02:14 is getting the win is huge for the like to think that they could do that in year one
02:19 of the Big 12.
02:20 It's crazy.
02:21 Yes, McCuller was out that game.
02:23 So I think at that point it was a little a little OK, but McCuller coming back for the
02:29 Baylor game and I'm still losing is it's kind of troubling.
02:33 If I'm being completely honest, though, if McCuller can stay healthy like he came back
02:38 and, you know, put up 20 with ease and he was being the focal point of the offense like
02:42 he picked up right where he left off before the injury.
02:44 So I think it just proves what we've kind of said all year is that Kansas isn't that
02:52 elite team.
02:53 I think this is the most big 12 losses in the self era, maybe.
02:57 I think they're nine and seven right now, which is crazy to say for a Kansas team.
03:01 But I think as of right now, just chalks it up to where they lie.
03:06 You know, losing at Baylor is not a bad loss and losing, you know, BYU is also a really
03:13 good team.
03:14 You know, you're going to get home there, but you kind of have a little bit of an excuse.
03:18 I think they'll be fine and they'll be good.
03:22 Like I wouldn't read too into them being like crazy bad because that, you know, getting
03:28 them healthy is probably the biggest thing for them at this time.
03:31 But as we've said before, there weren't as good as people thought at the start of the
03:37 year, like their AP will finally probably drop when this podcast comes out.
03:42 You know, they're being overrated by the AP the whole year and they'll probably be right
03:46 around where they should be, which is like the 10 to 20 range, I think, you know, they'll
03:51 probably be in the three or four seed line, which is probably where they should be because
03:54 their starters are that good.
03:56 But yeah, it just proves to show that Kansas is going to be fine in terms of being fine
04:04 to like win a game or two in the tournament.
04:06 But I don't think that they'll be that top team that they've been in years past.
04:12 Yeah.
04:13 Yeah.
04:14 It's hard to it's hard to write this team off for a lot of reasons.
04:18 First of all, it's Kansas.
04:20 It's Bill Self that that program has been here before.
04:25 Maybe not exactly here.
04:27 I don't know.
04:28 Like you said, I'm not sure they've ever had this many conference losses, but they have
04:32 seen a lot of things.
04:33 Self has seen a lot of things.
04:34 And then the other reason you can't count them out is because their one, two punch is
04:39 the best we have this in the country.
04:42 So, yeah, you can't you can't ever say that Kansas is out done, you know, because they
04:51 are totally capable of, you know, they'll be there'll be a two or three seed, probably
04:58 maybe a four now, but we'll see that later.
05:02 They're going to, you know, maybe they're not a final 14.
05:06 Maybe they're not that good.
05:08 But with the two guys that they have, it's hard to just be completely out on them because
05:13 they, you know, in their first game back together, they combined for 40, 20 a piece.
05:20 And then it's kind of the same story.
05:21 You don't get much else from anyone else.
05:24 So same.
05:26 It's the same stuff we've been saying about Kansas since Big 12.
05:30 Yeah, exactly.
05:31 I think we've been all over this, but you can't you can't, you know, overreact to this.
05:38 I agree with you, because, first of all, you know, BYU TCU fans found out.
05:43 Yeah, those two teams are good.
05:45 Good.
05:46 They're good.
05:47 Yeah.
05:48 BYU going to Lawrence and doing that makes it really, really impressive, more impressive.
05:56 But those were two good teams.
05:58 This was, you know, I think they're figuring they're going to have to figure some things
06:03 out, certainly, but I wouldn't write them off yet.
06:08 Yeah, I think I said it earlier in the year, too, when we were first finding out this Kansas
06:13 team, you know, their strengths and weaknesses and stuff.
06:16 I think they're the most intriguing team in the nation just because one through five could
06:21 be the best one through five there is with the one KJ and obviously the two stars of
06:26 McCuller and Dickinson that they can go star for star with any team in the country.
06:32 And so when you take it for that, then their ceiling is like as high as it is.
06:38 I mean, they were preseason AP one coming into the year, which makes them an intriguing
06:44 team in March because you you can see Kansas going deep and obviously done it before and
06:49 stuff like that.
06:51 And then you could also see it collapsing like one injury like we've seen with McCuller
06:55 and they can lose to anybody.
06:56 You know, they lost to West Virginia UCF.
06:58 BYU at home, all that kind of different stuff.
07:02 But yeah, so I'm I'm super interested to see how they're going to click come big tournament
07:07 and come.
07:08 NCAA tournament because they peak at the right time, they could do it.
07:12 And yeah, as I said before, we can't overreact to this.
07:15 So I'm going to be super interested to see how Kansas bounces back from from what they
07:20 went through.
07:21 Yeah, yeah, for sure.
07:24 So Kansas struggled, but we'll talk about Texas now.
07:29 We have to step on the list.
07:31 They are one of those teams that seems to be peaking at the right time.
07:37 Yeah.
07:38 After they went to Kansas last Saturday and got kind of smacked around, they beat Texas
07:44 Tech on the road and then they handedly beat Oklahoma State at home, which is something
07:49 they need to do.
07:50 And we I think we need to talk about how good Texas is on the road like they I don't know.
07:57 I can't figure it out right now, but they win a lot.
08:01 They've won a lot of big games on the road like that.
08:03 TCU game was on the road.
08:04 They beat Oklahoma.
08:05 They killed Oklahoma on the road.
08:07 Now they're going into Lubbock, you know, a town that hates, hates Texas and they make
08:14 it look pretty easy.
08:15 So what do you think about Texas?
08:16 We have kind of been back and forth about Texas all year long.
08:23 And like I said, it seems like they're getting into a stride at the right time now.
08:29 Yeah, Texas has also been one of the most interesting teams because they have the talent
08:34 to they have the talent to go hand in hand with everybody.
08:40 And it's interesting because we recorded that call and interview and we had, you know, stick
08:44 around for that great convo.
08:46 But he had the take where he thinks Texas could be one of the biggest sleepers in the
08:50 Big 12.
08:51 We recorded it Monday right before the Baylor game.
08:53 So that was before these two wins.
08:55 So that was a great take on his part looking so far.
08:57 But that win at Tech.
08:59 Yeah, like they've been dominant.
09:02 I don't want to say dominant, but successful on the road more than the average Big 12 team.
09:07 That's a huge rivalry win and they had it pretty soundly and then beating Oklahoma State
09:11 soundly with no real worry in either of those games is massive.
09:17 And they've been kind of healthy and unhealthy, like, you know, getting to sue back at the
09:22 start of the year and then just kind of hanging around and really, I mean, they haven't secured
09:27 a tournament spot yet because they had that super rocky start.
09:32 But yeah, as you said, they're getting hot at the right time.
09:36 And, you know, when the sues click in a space, you Tyrese Hunter, Shedrick, Dylan Mitchell,
09:40 like you can name dudes on this team that, you know, have had success in March and that
09:46 can get it done because they had success last year.
09:50 Obviously a Smith has been around for forever, just killing it in the tournament.
09:53 So they're definitely a scary team and one that I think a lot of people should consider
09:56 being.
09:57 I don't want to say Texas is a Cinderella, but, you know, in being a higher seed that
10:04 could advance in the tournament, Texas talent is going to be way better than your average
10:08 eight, nine, 10 seat or whatever they're going to end up at.
10:12 Yeah.
10:13 Yeah.
10:14 And the other thing about them is that they have experience.
10:16 Like they made a bit of a run last year.
10:19 Max Aismas, everybody remembers his tournament runs with oral Roberts.
10:24 So he's a, he, you know, he knows about March.
10:26 She's very familiar and comfortable playing during this month, but things do get tough
10:34 for them.
10:35 They, they go to Baylor on Monday.
10:37 So we're recording this Sunday.
10:38 They go tomorrow.
10:42 And then they host Oklahoma.
10:46 And those are the two games I have left to close this year out there, eight and eight
10:50 in the conference right now.
10:51 So 10 and eight is on the, on the board, eight and 10 is on the board on the table.
10:57 I mean, but so what do you, I mean, how do they stack up against like Baylor?
11:04 Because Baylor we saw is another team that seems to be peaking at the right time.
11:08 What do you think about, I think that's a really intriguing game and we'll talk about
11:12 Baylor in a second because, you know, they've been, they've been really good, but what do
11:16 you think about what do you think they need to do, I guess, in these last two games and
11:22 then going into that big 12 tournament, what do you think they need to do to really lock
11:26 up a spot?
11:29 Yeah, this game at Baylor is going to be huge because they're both hot.
11:32 As we said, if they lose that one, I still think they're fine because I have, I think
11:37 they have a little bit of a cushion right now, just based on their metrics and you know,
11:41 their 26 and Ken Palm, I think they're right around there on the net too.
11:45 And just being around 500 in the conference, which is fine.
11:50 If you split these, I think you're fine.
11:52 Even if you lose early in the big 12 tournament, you know, you, you beat OU at home and that's
11:57 still a decent win, especially in a rivalry game.
12:00 So I wouldn't be too concerned about like, like if I was a Texas fan, I would be ecstatic
12:07 about where this team is headed because they're peaking at the right time, as I said, and
12:11 they have the talent.
12:12 So, but yeah, I'm just intrigued to watch just how good these are, because that was
12:18 kind of the next conversation I wanted to have to, which leads into a perfectly is outside
12:22 of Houston, which I think everybody can agree, or most people watching the big 12 would agree
12:28 that they're the best team and it's pretty big of a cushion.
12:30 I think even in all of college basketball, I think Yukon, Purdue and Houston are your
12:36 top three teams.
12:37 And there's kind of a gap between that and Houston has solidified itself as the best
12:40 team in the big 12 having success again, but outside of them at this point, who do you
12:46 see making the biggest run in March or having the most success for any other team in the
12:54 big 12?
12:55 Yeah, that's a good question.
12:56 First of all, I want to shout out Jamal Shedd are both of our big 12 player of the year.
13:00 Yeah.
13:01 A pick we made last week hit a huge game winner.
13:04 It was at Oklahoma, right?
13:07 Yeah.
13:08 That would have been a great because as we said, OU is kind of still fighting for the
13:11 spot a little bit too.
13:12 So that was almost a massive win for them, which would have kind of locked them up.
13:16 But yes, Shedd broke their hearts at the end.
13:18 Yeah, so we know about Houston, but I think Texas does have potential to make some noise.
13:28 I don't think they'll go the farthest.
13:30 I think it's probably between Iowa State and Baylor.
13:33 And I like Iowa State a lot, but the way Baylor is playing right now makes me want to pick
13:37 Baylor and I will pick Baylor.
13:40 They will get into it, but they, they, the score in that TCU game makes it look better
13:48 for TCU than it was, in my opinion, that was really, really horrible showing from TCU and
13:54 a really impressive showing for Baylor at TCU.
14:00 You know, they kind of get their revenge after that triple overtime game.
14:04 And then they go and they beat Kansas with McCuller, like we talked about with, you know,
14:10 they're healthy, that Kansas team was healthy.
14:12 So this Baylor team, the offense that it has is, I mean, you talk about Houston's defense.
14:21 I think this is probably the premier offense in the Big 12 or one of them.
14:26 And you know, they, Baylor's my pick just because they have guards that can score, which
14:34 I think is important.
14:35 They have the star power.
14:37 They have Meecy who's had a really impressive year.
14:41 I just think they, and you know, Scott Drew is the best of the best.
14:46 So Baylor's my pick for that team outside of Houston to go the farthest in the tournament,
14:53 just because the way they're playing right now, the talent that they have and the experience
14:59 that whole program has, you know, so that's mine.
15:04 I'll go Baylor.
15:06 Yeah, no, I think that's a solid take because I believe Iowa State's been the better team
15:12 this year, but Baylor's just more matchup proof, which I think is important in tournament
15:17 play when you're playing such different styles of teams.
15:20 Like Iowa State's defense or Iowa State's offense can just kind of disappear at times.
15:24 Like they almost lost at UCF in that type of game.
15:28 So I worry about them being too reliant on home court too, because we've seen Iowa State
15:33 being completely different teams home and away.
15:36 You know, there's still such a top tier team that has been better than Baylor for this
15:43 year.
15:44 But yeah, I think Baylor is right there.
15:47 I bought into BYU too, because they're a similar style as Baylor, and even might even have
15:53 a little bit, they're probably a little worse offense and a little better defense.
15:58 But I would still probably leave Baylor there too, just because they've been farther before,
16:04 you know, and have that experience.
16:06 Kansas, we've said before, you can't count them out.
16:11 And I think Texas, that last of that group that can kind of make that, has the ability
16:15 to make that deep run, just because those are the teams that have had success.
16:20 And then yeah, you enough to show you to be able to prove that they can make that deep
16:25 run.
16:26 But yeah, gun to my head, I'd probably say Baylor right now to agree with you, because
16:30 they're just so hot.
16:31 They have the talent, and they can play such different styles than Iowa State being reliant
16:37 on a slow pace.
16:39 But it's gonna be super interesting, because I, as we said all year, I think it's Houston
16:43 gap.
16:45 So I don't know what to expect from the rest of the big 12 come the tournament, you know,
16:49 it's the best conference of basketball, but you don't know where these teams line up against
16:52 each other.
16:53 And periods are just going at each other every night, which makes it so exciting.
16:56 Yeah, one thing about the Baylor Iowa State difference, like Iowa State has an amazing
17:02 defense outside of Houston's, I think it's the best in the country.
17:05 I mean, they have, they have the ability to shut teams down.
17:08 Yeah, like they held they held Oklahoma to 45 points on Wednesday.
17:16 And Oklahoma has, you know, not a great offense, but a solid offense.
17:19 So the thing about that is they don't have an offense, Iowa State.
17:25 Yeah, there's times where that unit disappears.
17:29 And in March, and I think in the big 12, when you have a defense and no offense, you can
17:36 navigate through it.
17:38 But I think in the tournament, you're gonna see some different style teams where you don't
17:42 know you need Yeah, you need shot makers and Baylor has so many shot makers.
17:48 I don't think Iowa State has as many shot makers.
17:51 And Baylor can score with anyone, like even if their defense is not great.
18:00 They're going to be able to put up points.
18:02 They I mean, since February 13.
18:08 So all I mean, not quite a month, they've scored less than, let's see, less than 78
18:16 once.
18:17 And that was against TCU.
18:18 And when they scored 62, that was a weird game.
18:21 But they just have that offense and the and the talent to score with anyone like, you
18:30 know, maybe it's Jacobi Walter, who's making a shot, maybe it's Ray J. Dennis, who's been
18:35 really unbelievable the last couple weeks.
18:38 Yeah, I just think they're deep.
18:40 And they they just I don't know that they have that ability to score and you know, BYU
18:46 is another team, you mentioned them, they're peaking at the right time as well.
18:50 And they have that really potent offense too.
18:53 But I just think I don't know, I like Baylor's shot making a little bit more.
19:00 And I like what they've done.
19:02 And, you know, this is that TCU game is hard to judge because they dropped into this zone
19:07 that for whatever reason, TCU could not figure out it was this basically.
19:12 It made TCU look like a high school team.
19:14 I mean, it was really bad.
19:17 But TCU is a good offense, and they figured out how to shut it down.
19:21 And I don't think they're just going to be able to go play that zone in March, because
19:26 you'll have teams that like understand how to adjust, you know, to that.
19:31 But I think it's encouraging that they did have a game where they put up 62 points and
19:36 still won really comfortably.
19:38 Yeah, the development of Eve Meesey, I think he's become one of the most elite NBA prospects
19:46 and players on their team because at the start of the year, you know, the true freshman,
19:50 he's such a raw talent, but he's developed so good where he's one of the biggest threats
19:55 for Baylor.
19:56 And he's made them such a more complete team that makes me want to buy into them.
19:59 I think a little bit more because, yeah, as you said, you know, you can go on and on with
20:03 the guards, Ray J, Jacoby, Jaden Nunn, and they're doing this without links and love
20:08 is probably going to be big 12 player of the year.
20:10 I think he's a game time decision tomorrow as well.
20:13 But yeah, they're they're getting dangerous.
20:16 And I think outside of Houston, I think teams in the big 12 that can win that are capable
20:23 of winning the national championship and I can see him winning that is Houston Baylor
20:29 and like maybe Kansas.
20:31 Like I yeah, I would say it has been unbelievable this year and their defense, as you said,
20:35 is so elite.
20:38 But when you're yeah, and they'll probably make this week succeed, they'll probably have
20:42 success in the tournament.
20:44 But once they play an elite offense, maybe they won't be able to compete as much with
20:48 them or even a team that plays the same style like they've blown games to Houston, who just
20:53 played their style but better.
20:55 They lost to Baylor and BYU, who are two of the most elite offenses in the country.
21:00 So maybe that'll exploit them and they had, you know, they haven't had nearly as much
21:05 success away as they do at home.
21:07 So I'm super interested because, you know, March is coming around.
21:11 So we get to have these conversations about who he thinks, you know, going to go farther
21:15 and you know, matchups are so big, too.
21:17 So once we get the bracket in front of us, it'll be a lot better, easier to see the picture.
21:22 But it's definitely an interesting conversation to have is to what you know, because everyone
21:27 talks about the big 12 being the best, but which teams can actually make a run?
21:31 Yeah, yeah, I think I think you're right.
21:33 I think it's I think it's for sure Houston Baylor.
21:37 Those are the two that I'm confident can win and can win it all.
21:41 I think both those teams can win it all.
21:42 Yeah.
21:43 And then the next year, we can like go through tiers if you want.
21:47 We can.
21:48 Yeah.
21:49 I think we can.
21:50 But the next year, I'd say, you know, Kansas, Iowa State, BYU and I don't know, maybe Texas.
22:02 I'm not sure they're with those teams yet, but they're around.
22:05 And then the next year is the maybe that's where Texas goes.
22:08 That teams that like Texas Tech, Texas, I think you still could, you know, make a little
22:14 bit of noise.
22:15 Yeah.
22:16 But we'll get into that.
22:17 Yeah.
22:18 We'll get into that later.
22:19 But yeah, it's really this is the best time of the whole year because.
22:25 The whole month of March, we're looking forward to this thing and we can talk about I mean,
22:30 we really do.
22:33 We're starting to really get an idea about these teams and what they what the ceilings
22:37 look like, what the floors look like.
22:40 And I just think Houston and Baylor, not only do they have a pretty high ceiling, I think
22:46 both those teams have Houston especially has a really high floor.
22:50 Yeah.
22:51 But Baylor, I think maybe this is all recency bias, but I think they have a pretty high
22:55 floor as well.
22:56 Yeah.
22:57 If I were to tier teams, I think I would still have Houston in a tier of their own.
23:02 Yeah, you're probably right.
23:03 Yeah.
23:04 Yeah.
23:05 And then throw like Baylor at the start of like Baylor, Iowa State, Kansas, and I might
23:10 even throw BYU into that tier too.
23:12 And then it gets into Tech, TCU, UT, OU.
23:19 And then like, CINC and K-State.
23:22 If they make a crazy run and those teams probably, I mean, don't you think those teams now probably
23:28 have to go win it in Kansas City?
23:30 Yeah.
23:31 Yeah.
23:32 That's what I mean.
23:33 I was like, those three are like, good enough to like, they could do it.
23:36 It could.
23:37 Yeah.
23:38 And then, yeah, and then the Boynton boys and Westphal are in the last tier there, but
23:44 those would be like my five tiers, I think that is for the Big 12.
23:48 Yeah.
23:49 I like that.
23:50 But yeah, I mean, just having five tiers in a conference shows you how many different
23:55 teams are around the same.
23:57 And I think it's, I'm just super sad to see how it's going to unravel this next week in
24:01 KC for sure.
24:03 Yeah.
24:04 Yeah.
24:05 That'll be, yeah.
24:06 It's just, there's no time like March.
24:09 Yeah.
24:10 But to put it simply, and we still have two games left of the regular season before we
24:16 go to Kansas City.
24:17 Yeah.
24:18 And a lot can happen.
24:19 So this is a, this will be a really fun week.
24:21 Do you have, I don't want to put you on the spot, but do you have a matchup, a favorite
24:25 matchup for this week?
24:27 God, you know, we talked about that Baylor UT.
24:31 Yeah.
24:32 That's a big Monday game.
24:34 So that'll be big.
24:35 Yeah.
24:36 I think it's, it's Kansas at Houston, which is going to be great, especially if the color
24:42 is healthy, which is, you know, I think from the outside in, yeah, those, those top two
24:48 tiers teams, that's probably going to be my highlight.
24:51 You know, there's always such great games that are like, I think BYU is at Iowa state,
24:57 which is going to be great.
24:58 Yeah.
24:59 This week's going to be another great one.
25:01 You know, the K state Kansas play again this week and K state, if they get a couple wins,
25:06 maybe they could sneak in.
25:07 I don't know, but we'll figure it out.
25:10 There's a lot to see in this week and a lot to see in KC for sure.
25:13 Yeah.
25:14 Texas OU is another rivalry or ivory matchups this week, which is always fun.
25:20 Yeah, it'll be, there's a lot that can happen.
25:22 We could, we could be like Baylor could, could lose both the games this week and we could
25:28 be completely out on them next week.
25:29 Who knows?
25:30 Yeah.
25:31 The thing about the, the talk with Colin, we were a lot more optimistic about this Frogs
25:37 team.
25:38 We should have, we should have warned the listener.
25:39 This was before the week.
25:41 It was literally like a couple hours before the Baylor game started.
25:45 So if we had a much different tone, yeah, exactly.
25:49 Colin would be saying different things I would imagine.
25:53 Exactly.
25:54 But yeah, if you're ready to get into some recent TCU talk.
25:58 Yeah.
25:59 Yeah.
26:00 For sure.
26:01 Let's let's take a break and talk about the disaster of a week in the TCU.
26:05 Let's do it.