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(Current Affairs)
Host:
- Muhammad Malick
Guest:
- Miftah Ismail (Former Minister of Finance)
"People are urged to tighten their belts, while new cars are bought for personal use." Miftah Ismail
"government has increased expenditures but did nothing for the people," Miftah Ismail
"The Government Never Intended to sell PIA..." Miftah Ismail's Statement
Follow the ARY News channel on WhatsApp: https://bit.ly/46e5HzY
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ARY News is a leading Pakistani news channel that promises to bring you factual and timely international stories and stories about Pakistan, sports, entertainment, and business, amid others.
(Current Affairs)
Host:
- Muhammad Malick
Guest:
- Miftah Ismail (Former Minister of Finance)
"People are urged to tighten their belts, while new cars are bought for personal use." Miftah Ismail
"government has increased expenditures but did nothing for the people," Miftah Ismail
"The Government Never Intended to sell PIA..." Miftah Ismail's Statement
Follow the ARY News channel on WhatsApp: https://bit.ly/46e5HzY
Subscribe to our channel and press the bell icon for latest news updates: http://bit.ly/3e0SwKP
ARY News is a leading Pakistani news channel that promises to bring you factual and timely international stories and stories about Pakistan, sports, entertainment, and business, amid others.
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NewsTranscript
00:00Assalam-o-Alaikum, welcome to Khabar Lahariya's 25th edition of Khabar Lahariya's
00:16Hopefully, we will have a good start to the year.
00:21Two things are very obvious, the negotiations for PTI and government will start on 6th.
00:31We are hearing about the £190 million case on 6th, that the decision has been secured.
00:36There is a likely conviction in that as well.
00:38What will be the effect of that, what will not be the effect of that, that is in its place.
00:41Then, for the past few days, there has been a lot of speculation, along with the ministries.
00:47Now, the Chief Minister of KP has said that in 2025, either we will live here or they will live here.
00:53These things are also going on.
00:55All this is in its place, but yesterday, the last day of 2024, the government launched the Udaan Programme on 30th.
01:05And it is a very ambitious 5-year plan.
01:07And if you look at its targets, they are very good targets, if they can be fulfilled.
01:13They have said that the growth, the sustainable growth will be according to 6%.
01:17Even though the growth in this quarter is less than 1%, 0.92, the first quarter has passed.
01:25But the government is saying that there will be a 6% growth.
01:28The target of $50 billion exports will be met in the next 5 years, which is now $30 billion.
01:36We will bring down inflation by 6%.
01:39And only IT, they have added $5 billion to it.
01:44That is, where a WhatsApp message does not open, the video does not open, anyway, we will talk about it.
01:50And 10% will be shared in renewable energy, everything.
01:54And in the speech of the Finance Minister, he said that we will export $60 billion by 2028.
02:04And we are seeing $10 billion of investment every year in the private sector, private investments per year.
02:11Every year, 10 lakh jobs will be created, and that is 6%.
02:16First, let me tell you about this investment.
02:20The situation is that in one of the recent visits of the Prime Minister to Saudi Arabia,
02:25the Crown Prince there, and this was told to me by a member of the delegation who was present there,
02:31he said to the Prime Minister, I do not understand what you are doing.
02:38The Saudi Arabia Investment Fund invests tens of billions of dollars in the world.
02:47He said that there are only 6 countries that he deals with.
02:51Pakistan is one of them.
02:53But the problem is that your people do not send us projects.
02:59That standard is a two-page paper, a country of 25 crores, so many people, young people, agriculture, promises, BS etc.
03:08They do not send any project as per the feasibility report.
03:11Now this is at that level.
03:13And he complained that you should fix your bureaucracy, your system.
03:19This is the latest there.
03:21I will give you a private example.
03:23We are talking about exports, that we have to grow the export industry.
03:26I know a friend of mine who has been doing this for 5 years.
03:305 years.
03:32And if he had not been helped by a senior officer of the SIFC and Chief Secretary Sindh privately,
03:40assuming it to be a national project, he would have been doing this for 5 years.
03:44Now a project has been launched.
03:46That project will earn Pakistan 300 to 400 million dollars every year.
03:51But that person has been doing this for 5-6 years.
03:54Pushing bureaucracy.
03:56Here we are talking about exports.
03:58Anyway, this is happening with the private sector.
04:01How reliable are these figures?
04:03How many hopes are there?
04:05Is this again?
04:06Earlier we used to say 4D, now 4E.
04:08Now 4Es have come.
04:10Is this again a big story?
04:13Or are these really achievable targets?
04:15I want everything to be true.
04:17We have joined by Dr. Mr. Ismail.
04:20He is a former finance officer.
04:22And he understands.
04:24He was with PMLN.
04:26Then he tried to take bold decisions.
04:28That is, he tried to impose a small tax on shopkeepers.
04:32If he had the courage, he was released.
04:34Assalam-o-Alaikum, Dr. Mirza.
04:38Wa-alaikum-as-salam.
04:42First of all, you have written such a depressing column and brought back memories.
04:46Your column on 31st December was published during the war.
04:49You point out that in the 1990s, Pakistan was the richest country in South Asia.
04:55Today, we are one of the poorest countries.
04:58In 1995, the Human Development Index of the United Nations
05:04had 6 degrees above India and 18 degrees above Bangladesh.
05:10Today, we are 29 degrees behind India and 32 degrees below Bangladesh.
05:19Similarly, we are second in the world in terms of the number of newborns.
05:25And you have written such a depressing column.
05:27Anyway, let's come to today.
05:30Tell me, the targets that the government has planned.
05:34First, let's come to digital.
05:36Because that is very important.
05:38The whole country is fed up.
05:40And they are saying that the digital economy is very powerful.
05:42And we have to invest billions of dollars in it.
05:44They are still saying that 28% growth has come.
05:47The internet is not opening up in this country.
05:50Nothing is happening.
05:52There is no international payment method.
05:54Let's come to the digital economy first.
05:56Is this a doable target?
06:00No.
06:02Look, two things cannot happen at the same time.
06:06Restrictions on the internet and trade through the internet cannot increase together.
06:11Either you impose restrictions or trade through the internet.
06:14Let me tell you an incident from Islamabad.
06:16I was in Islamabad two weeks ago.
06:18A child came to meet me in a restaurant.
06:20So I asked him, son, what do you do?
06:22He said, I do an online job.
06:24He works in a semiconductor company in America.
06:28He says, I always have to install a proxy server and work on their server.
06:33Because their semiconductor is their proprietary technology.
06:36But he says, we cannot do it.
06:38Here we cannot register a proxy or VPN.
06:41People are facing a lot of problems.
06:44You keep seeing on the internet that people have lost their jobs or lost their contracts.
06:48First of all, there is no point in shutting down the internet.
06:51Because there are no statements of the government, those statements do not work.
06:54The statements of the opposition and the PTI are working.
06:57And secondly, if you are imposing restrictions on our children on the internet,
07:01then what have you done for them?
07:03We cannot give them a job ourselves.
07:05In Pakistan, they do freelancing through the internet.
07:08They take jobs all over the world.
07:10They are sitting here, who do not get visas.
07:12Now if you shut them down,
07:14then you have to run this country only as your property,
07:19where you have to rule,
07:21and you do not have to serve the people of the country,
07:26you do not have to serve them, you do not have to make it easy for them.
07:29So it will not be possible, no matter how much we talk.
07:33I was watching something very interesting.
07:36We have been hearing for the last 1.5-1.5 years,
07:39it is better to count the government of PDN2,
07:44these were the same people who were and are still doing government.
07:47Again and again, government size, reduce the size of the government.
07:51The size is not decreasing, it is increasing.
07:54In fact, interestingly, yesterday when we were talking,
07:57S.N. Iqbal Sahib said,
08:00that we only get 10,000 Arabs after the NFC,
08:04when we give money to all the provinces.
08:06And that goes into our interest payments.
08:09Rest, we take everything in loans.
08:13Loans have also increased massively.
08:17It has gone to trillions, the government loan.
08:19But I was seeing, instead of reducing it in MEC, it has increased.
08:23Just look at the internet.
08:25When they were talking, what did they announce?
08:28National Center for Brand Management.
08:30Pakistan's products,
08:32there are no national centers for brand management in the world.
08:35The products and private sector of the countries are making their own brands.
08:38Anyway, National Center for Brand Management.
08:40One was announced, Quantum Computing National Center.
08:43One is Nanotechnology National Center.
08:46One is New Manufacturing National Center.
08:49In the past, they said,
08:51we made centers for AI, Cloud Computing,
08:55Auto Robotics, Big Data Centers,
08:59all these were national centers.
09:01No one knows what those centers have done,
09:04what results they have given, what not.
09:06These four centers are being made.
09:09What was the talk?
09:12We have to increase revenues, increase taxes,
09:14and we have to do this.
09:16Can the government be small or not?
09:18The federal government spends 8.8 crores a year.
09:24So, why don't we have these savings?
09:28Why don't we start cutting from here?
09:33Look, the owner should have a plan to do any work.
09:36There should be a plan and an intention,
09:38but first of all, there should be a plan.
09:40They didn't have a plan.
09:42This year, they increased their expenses by 22%.
09:47Current expenditures have increased by 22%.
09:51Now, when you have 12% inflation,
09:53what is the sense of increasing by 22%?
09:55Number one.
09:56Number two, the expenses of the PHDP have increased by 65%.
10:00Even after reducing it, it has increased by 65%.
10:03So, they are not reducing it from anywhere.
10:05The government of the province,
10:07we give them 12,000 Arab Rupees,
10:09which I have also written in the article.
10:1112,000 Arab Rupees means that every Pakistani,
10:13whether he is a child, an old man,
10:15whether he is poor or rich,
10:17gives 50,000 Arab Rupees to the government of every province.
10:20And the province doesn't give us any service.
10:22We don't get any benefit from it.
10:24We have only made the concept that
10:26the government should be for the ruler,
10:28and not for the services.
10:30So, they are sitting here.
10:32They have increased the government.
10:34They have increased the government's salaries.
10:36They have increased the expenses.
10:38I have no problem with increasing the salary,
10:40but they have increased the expenses.
10:42They have kept 600-700 Arab Rupees in the PHDP
10:44so that they get some benefit.
10:46So, there is no concept.
10:48Whatever they said,
10:50that we will reduce the ministries,
10:52they didn't do it.
10:54They said that we will devolve some ministries,
10:56they didn't do it.
10:58They didn't make the NFC award commission.
11:00They talked about the National Finance Pact,
11:02they didn't do it.
11:04They didn't spend a single penny.
11:06Today, I was reading in the newspaper,
11:08in Profit PK,
11:10that the variable cost of generating electricity
11:12and the variable cost of generating electricity
11:14are different.
11:16A country cannot run like this.
11:18But, this is not serious in running a country.
11:20In Punjab,
11:22I have an objection.
11:24In Punjab,
11:26the MPs' salaries have increased by 400%.
11:28The ministers' salaries have increased by 900%.
11:30So, there is an objection on the salaries.
11:32But, tell me,
11:34isn't this a simple thing
11:36that we are being told such small stories.
11:38Simply, give the local governments
11:40power, give them money,
11:42devolve the subjects,
11:44make roads, education,
11:46all this.
11:48Why are these plans being made with big names?
11:50Why aren't simple solutions being made?
11:52Isn't that a solution?
11:54Today, as we speak,
11:56in KP, there is a lot of
11:58fighting going on.
12:00The local MPs are asking for money
12:02for their budgets.
12:04The provincial government doesn't do it.
12:06The rest of the governments have done the same.
12:08Isn't this a grassroot level solution
12:10instead of making 1,800 new centres
12:12and putting up new scenes?
12:16Look, just to take one example,
12:18Google is making quantum computers.
12:20They are at least 10-15 years behind.
12:22They are at least 10-15 years behind.
12:24Google is making quantum computers.
12:26There won't be two people in Pakistan
12:28who are in Pakistan right now
12:30who can work on quantum computing
12:32or who understand quantum computing.
12:34I am assuring you.
12:36If you make quantum computers,
12:38you will build a building,
12:40it will be inaugurated,
12:42you will get jobs,
12:44you will get lawyers,
12:46you will get additional secretaries,
12:48you will get joint secretaries,
12:50you will get cars,
12:52you will get secretaries,
12:54you will get jobs,
12:56and the work will be the same
12:58as what the Agricultural University
13:00has been doing since 1970.
13:02The work will be the same
13:04as what the Agricultural University
13:06has been doing since 1970.
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26:06This is their hobby.
26:08This is their hobby.
26:10This is their hobby.
26:12This is their hobby.
26:14This is their hobby.
26:16This is their hobby.
26:18This is their hobby.
26:20This is their hobby.
26:22This is their hobby.
26:24This is their hobby.
26:26This is their hobby.
26:28This is their hobby.
26:30This is their hobby.
26:32This is their hobby.
26:34This is their hobby.
26:36This is their hobby.
26:38This is their hobby.
26:40This is their hobby.
26:42This is their hobby.
26:44This is their hobby.
26:46This is their hobby.
26:48This is their hobby.
26:50This is their hobby.
26:52This is their hobby.
26:54This is their hobby.
26:56This is their hobby.
26:58This is their hobby.
27:00This is their hobby.
27:02This is their hobby.
27:04This is their hobby.
27:06This is their hobby.
27:08This is their hobby.
27:10This is their hobby.
27:12This is their hobby.
27:14This is their hobby.
27:16This is their hobby.
27:18This is their hobby.
27:20This is their hobby.
27:22This is their hobby.
27:24This is their hobby.
27:26This is their hobby.
27:28This is their hobby.
27:30This is their hobby.
27:32We would be poor
27:34than Bengalis.
27:36We would be poor than Indians.
27:38We would be poor than Indians.
27:44welcome back to the show
27:46There is an old saying in English
27:48A penny saved is a pound earned
27:50savings
27:52govt did not reduce its expenditure
27:54they increased their
27:56listed prices
27:58added corruption
28:0065%.
28:01Now let's come to state-owned enterprises.
28:02Now look, the subsidy of 109 billion will go to the railway this year, PIA every year
28:07hits 88 billion, and 750 billion a year goes to them, PIA has not been sold to them yet,
28:14the issue of airport outsourcing is being made to them, but let me tell you one thing
28:20for the viewers, I was looking at a very interesting figure today, that when you think that you
28:27don't need money, they give us money, almost 20,000 per passenger, yes, but I give, when
28:34any person flies in PIA, then the loss and the subsidized costs that they are giving,
28:41you and me, 20,000, Mohammad Basheer who is going from somewhere, so you don't even
28:47know, I don't know, 20,000 is going from our pocket to make his flight, in the railway,
28:53almost every passenger, a passenger gives me 3700 rupees, when you add all these subsidies,
29:00so they say that there is no such thing as, there is no such thing as an invisible victim,
29:06we are victims, there is no victimless crime, it is just invisible, so understand that on
29:13a daily basis, they are giving me money, privatization, if they can't save, then why
29:19don't they sell the goods, why don't they sell, why don't they shut down the institutions,
29:24if they don't even sell, then they should shut down, at least the bleeding should stop.
29:28See, what you are saying, 19,500 rupees, 20,000 rupees, on every ticket of PIA, you have
29:34to give, on every sector, now you were selling PIA, you didn't have the intention to sell,
29:41the four serious buyers, you made the four run away, you kept one blue world buyer,
29:46and you made all of us run away, the serious buyers who told you that there is a hole in
29:51the balance sheet, so either they were thinking that we are very smart, this was discussed
29:56in the meeting, I am telling you, that no, no, we will do it, how will you do it, there
30:01is a hole in the balance sheet, there is a negative balance sheet, are they mad, the
30:05private sector, who has 80,000 rupees, 100,000 rupees to give, they know how to read the
30:09balance sheet, okay, you didn't read the balance sheet, you were smart, that we will
30:13give it like this, we will not give anything, they knew that it will not sell, now when
30:17they left, you have fixed it, and now I have heard that our big institutions, some of
30:22them are contacting the direct buyers, that come back, do something, so now they are
30:27fixing things, but they did not do it on time, neither Shahbaz Sharif nor Ishaq Dar wanted
30:32it to be privatized, Ishaq Dar, 5 years ago, 9 years ago, in 2015, made a deal with PTI,
30:38under which PIA will not be privatized, but a private sector investor will come, who
30:44has a minority stake, that a man will come, who will take a minority stake in PIA, he
30:49will put 25, 50,000 rupees in it, why will he come, there will be no management, why
30:54will he come, there is no such thing in the world, in PIA, and after that you have lost
31:01400,000 rupees, why did you lose it, because it was not your money, it does not matter
31:07to you, you have given 109,00,000 rupees to the railway, to make a loss this year, last
31:12year also you gave more than 90,00,000 rupees, next year you will give 120,000 rupees, it
31:17is not your money, it does not matter to you, you will open 1-2 stations and wear a garland
31:22every time, a picture will come, that yes, the minister had come, he opened the station,
31:26so he made a garland.
31:28They have also said, that yesterday, when Bhatta Safiq came, that this is a blueprint,
31:32a road map, it makes sense, you want it, you have made the road map, but does the planning
31:39commission become irresponsible after this, that we have given the road map, but there
31:42is no specifics in it, we will take measures to produce exports, we are making these centres,
31:48XYZ, we are doing things, but the devil lies in detail, so the road map that Blue is giving,
31:56how much responsibility does it have, when things go wrong, I am asking this.
32:01See, the responsibility is given to the one who gives the road map, when you follow the
32:06road map given by him, but if you do not follow the road map given by him, you can do it as
32:11you wish, that no, we have to do this, then the matter is over, but you are right, that
32:16neither our road map is correct, and whatever the road map is, we follow it, so never, we
32:22decide on our discretion, as we need it, as we are interested, we have decided on it,
32:29that let's put this, let's put this too, let's put this too.
32:35So what is this, yesterday these 72 pages came, what is this, is it just a fancy conversation,
32:42is it just a fancy rhetoric, or should we take this document seriously?
32:48Actually, the thing is that, there are some tables, the document that came to me, that
32:53is of 26 pages, but you have 72 pages, so I hope that the rest of the pages that I do
32:58not have, there is detail in it, this is seriously, there is nothing to take seriously, I will
33:02tell you the truth, there is nothing to take seriously in this, this is such an English,
33:06there are a lot of English, it is a very good English, and I know where it has come from,
33:10this is, I mean, you think what to talk about in this, we will do export trade growth,
33:14you have said this for the first time, haven't the planning commission said this before that
33:19we will do export trade growth, what happened about those plans, what about that growth,
33:24we have said that we will do e-governance, we will progress the Internet economy, the
33:27economy of the Internet progresses when the Internet gets shut down, right, you have said
33:33that we will talk about the environment and the environment is climate change, what have
33:38of climate change. What have you done so far? You have invested a lot of money in it.
33:43After that, you have said that we will invest in energy and infrastructure.
33:47Because of energy and infrastructure, there are problems in the economy.
33:51Tell me, how will you get the money for energy and infrastructure?
33:56And energy is already the most expensive in Pakistan. It should be made cheaper.
34:00Let me tell you one more thing. Even today, we are bringing in 1,700 megawatts of electricity in Pakistan.
34:05Whereas, all the intelligent people are saying that in five years,
34:09just like your tabletop telephony has come to an end after your mobile phone,
34:14your wire telephony has come to an end.
34:17Similarly, in five to seven years, when these batteries of electricity will come,
34:21sodium ion batteries will come and new solar panels will come,
34:24then your needs of grids will end.
34:28Or at least it will become very severe.
34:30So, what is the need to install a new minister at this time?
34:33You are constructing a dam.
34:35Shahid Abbasi and I have been saying for a long time that you must construct a dam.
34:38You should construct a water reservoir, but do not install a power station in it.
34:41You are doing more than this.
34:44When Ibrahim Khan came, he used to criticise Noon that they have installed a lot of power stations,
34:50but at the same time, they were also installing power stations.
34:52What are you doing?
34:53Because this is the money of the people.
34:55But the hydel cost is very low.
34:57No, but Mirza, the cost of hydel power is very high.
35:02Sir, the cost of hydel power is very high.
35:05The most expensive power in Pakistan is 18 cents per kilowatt, and that is Neelam Jhelum.
35:11We only get Tarbela because our fathers and grandfathers built it and left.
35:17And in 1960, Pakistan was something else in which anything could happen.
35:20Today, nothing can happen in Pakistan.
35:22Remember this too.
35:23We are not as capable as our elders.
35:26And we have become thieves, we have become greedy, we have become lazy.
35:31But after that, more things have happened.
35:33See, the hydel power you use, your initial cost is so high that you die by giving bank interest.
35:41You should make a water reservoir and when you need electricity, you can do it.
35:45At the moment, the cheapest electricity in the world, which is also in Pakistan, is solar.
35:49So you are promoting solar.
35:51And people are coming to solar anyway.
35:53But the policies of power are very bad.
35:55Even today, in power, I think the best policy would be to reduce the power rate so that more power is sold.
36:02You are selling expensive electricity at a variable cost of 500 times.
36:05Ask any economist in the world and they will say, what are you doing?
36:08Are you crazy?
36:09A unit that costs 7 rupees, 15 rupees is tax on it.
36:16So what should the government do in 2025?
36:19You have said to throw it in the dustbin, this 5 year plan.
36:25At this time, if you were the finance minister, what would you do?
36:31Look, sir, I understand the finance minister and if I criticize Aurangzeb, then I will do the same.
36:37That the finance minister's number one job is to fight with the prime minister.
36:40That is, the prime minister has to say no.
36:42That the prime minister will say, give this money.
36:44The prime minister has a hobby of spending money.
36:46That looks very good.
36:47The finance minister should say, I don't have money.
36:49But you have cut off the hands of the finance minister.
36:51You have made someone else the chairman of four committees.
36:54You have cut off the poor man's hands.
36:56But anyway, at this time, the government should first make a commission for the NFC award.
37:00And the prime minister of all provinces should sit down that until the NFC award is not changed, you will not be able to fix it.
37:05Number one.
37:06Number two, you have to bring a commitment immediately under the constitution.
37:09No, what to change?
37:10You are saying that the provinces…
37:12No, no, let's come into specifics.
37:15You are saying to make a commission for the NFC award.
37:17And reduce the share of the provinces in it.
37:19Absolutely.
37:22And reduce the five-year or ten-year plan.
37:26Every year we reduce it by two and a half percent.
37:28From fifty-seven to fifty-five, then from fifty-five to fifty-two.
37:31Do not reduce it at once.
37:33Apart from this, you come and sit down that the two taxes that you have been given, which you do not use.
37:38Property tax and sales tax on services.
37:42Give that tax to Wafaaq.
37:44At least give the property tax to Wafaaq.
37:46And we will take money from him.
37:48And we will give the money directly to you.
37:50We will give you a lot more than you are saving.
37:52Agriculture tax should also be given back to Wafaaq.
37:56There is no one who earns money by working hard.
37:59They can impose tax.
38:00But no one can impose tax on agriculture.
38:03This is absolutely unfair.
38:04We are all equal Pakistanis.
38:05Everyone should give their share.
38:06Yes, it is time for another break.
38:08Stay with us.
38:09Welcome back to the show.
38:15Agriculture is a provincial subject.
38:17How can tax be a federal subject?
38:19Why?
38:20If agriculture is a provincial subject, then industries are also a provincial subject.
38:25Then give the tax of industries to the provinces.
38:27We have said that agriculture should not be taxed on income.
38:30Income can be taxed by Wafaaq.
38:32We do not need to be ashamed that where is your income coming from?
38:35This can be taxed by Wafaaq.
38:37We need to be taxed on income.
38:39My friend says that landlords are not so rich.
38:41We do not have to take tax from them at all.
38:43We are not taking tax from those who own 12 acres of land.
38:46We are talking about Mr. Jahangir Taneen.
38:49We can take tax from people who own thousands of acres of land.
38:54This is unfair.
38:55It is not fair that you do not take tax from someone who owns thousands of acres of land.
39:00And you are taking tax from your cameraman.
39:02This is not fair.
39:03There is horizontal equity all over the world.
39:06This is not possible.
39:07First, you have to award NFC.
39:09You have to see the taxation.
39:11You have to run the provinces as well.
39:13But after that you have to reduce the taxes of the provinces.
39:16You have to tell the provinces to collect their taxes themselves.
39:18Second, you have to make the local government effective.
39:21You have to make it seriously effective.
39:22The commissioners should only be the district commissioners who should be elected.
39:26And they should be the mayors of the divisions who should be powerful.
39:29They should have police, roads, schools and hospitals in the districts.
39:35And this should happen all over Pakistan.
39:37After doing these two things, the government should make sure that the poorest people,
39:44if they want to send their children to a private school,
39:47they should be given as much money as the government spends on schools.
39:51So that they can send their children to a private school if they want.
39:54Eight out of ten children who are with us today,
39:56those ten-year-old children cannot study two sentences.
39:59So the government's schools are wasting the time of the children,
40:02which is our biggest resource.
40:04After that, you have to end stunting in Pakistan.
40:06You have to improve health.
40:08You have to give private insurance.
40:10You have to give insurance to 20% of the poor.
40:12Until you bring the Pakistanis forward, Pakistan cannot move forward.
40:16I don't know, we had made a national security state.
40:19Now we have made a form 47 state.
40:25The one who has made the form 47 has to save his government and not do anything else.
40:30So brother, until you make a social welfare state,
40:33in which you will not bring the Pakistanis forward, Pakistan cannot move forward.
40:40Hafeez Pasha's last 2-3 minutes.
40:43They say that the IMF has given a projection of 3.2% in 2024,
40:48and 4% in 2025-2026.
40:51A growth rate of about 3.5%.
40:53But they say that if the situation is going like this,
40:57and if the revenue shortfall is serious,
41:00indirect taxes will increase because of that,
41:03electricity, gas tariffs can also increase.
41:06So that inflation rate can also go up.
41:09And if all these factors happen,
41:11then you are seeing a growth rate of 1.5% to 1.8%.
41:15That is below the population growth.
41:18If this happens,
41:20then we are hearing again and again that in July onwards,
41:23inflation can increase again. Why?
41:28Okay, so in the first quarter of this fiscal year,
41:32in the first quarter of 2024-2025,
41:34from July to September, our growth was only 0.92%.
41:37It was less than 1%.
41:39You can forget about 3%.
41:41You can try to increase it to 2.5%.
41:44I think it will not be more than 2% this year.
41:47So we will become poor again,
41:49because our population increases by 2%.
41:52Why will inflation increase in Pakistan?
41:54I hope it doesn't increase.
41:55But if oil prices rise all over the world,
41:57for any reason,
41:59China's economy starts to run fast,
42:01European economy starts to run fast,
42:03God forbid, there is a war in the Middle East,
42:05then oil will become expensive.
42:06If oil becomes expensive, then inflation will come here.
42:08If cotton, cotton, wheat, etc.,
42:10the world's commodity cycle,
42:12which is going down, will start going up,
42:14then inflation will come here.
42:16I don't see any more inflation in Pakistan right now,
42:19because you have broken consumer demand a lot.
42:22Because people don't have money,
42:24people don't have purchasing power,
42:26so things are not getting expensive.
42:28But if its cost-push inflation happens,
42:32then demand-led inflation can't happen in Pakistan right now,
42:36because people don't have purchasing power.
42:40So you don't think 2025 will be an easy year economically.
42:44Do you think it will be more difficult than 2024 for us?
42:50Look, people's micro-economic situation will get worse.
42:5410 crore and 50 lakh people are below the poverty line.
42:57If there is 2% growth in this fiscal year,
43:00then the next 6 months will also be bad, obviously.
43:04In Pakistan, people will be increasing more rapidly,
43:07income will be increasing less rapidly,
43:09so people will be going towards poverty.
43:1110.5 crore people were below the poverty line.
43:14Probably by the end of the year,
43:1612 crore people will be below the poverty line.
43:18The population will probably be 25% by 2024.
43:21So we will be almost 50% in poverty,
43:24according to the World Bank's poverty level.
43:26So this is what they have given in their declared targets.
43:30One second, Mufta, on this point,
43:32in this plan, within 5 years,
43:3513% of the population will be below the poverty line.
43:3913% of the population will be below the poverty line.
43:43Is this a joke?
43:47May Allah make them successful.
43:49But when poverty is increasing in Pakistan,
43:54your first effort should be to stop it from increasing.
43:57Then may Allah make it less.
44:00But the World Bank's $2.75,
44:03according to which 10.5 crore people are below the poverty line,
44:06I don't see it decreasing.
44:08Let me tell you the reason for this.
44:10Look, Malik, in Pakistan, 25-30 lakh people
44:13come to the job market every year.
44:17When 25-30 lakh people come to the job market,
44:20and 10-15 lakh jobs are created,
44:22then unemployment increases by 10-15 lakh.
44:24It is not necessary that the unemployment of those new children increases,
44:27as compared to the unemployment of an elderly person,
44:30who is fired, laid off, and does not get a job.
44:33So, because you are not getting enough jobs here,
44:37and you are not getting enough opportunities for employment,
44:39your poverty is increasing.
44:41And because of that poverty,
44:43more problems are arising in the economy.
44:45So, this is the problem in Pakistan,
44:47that you need 6% growth,
44:49so that you can create 30 lakh jobs,
44:51and a few new businesses can open.
44:58Okay, so we must brace for a hard ride.
45:00Dr. Mifta, thank you very much
45:02for this exhaustive, incisive analysis of all these things.
45:06Mr. Razi, after listening to all these things,
45:08I think it is clear that the government
45:11must first end its own contradictions.
45:13It asks for sacrifices from the people,
45:15and in Punjab, the parliamentarians are taking
45:18an increase of 450-450%,
45:20the ministers are taking an increase of 90%.
45:23The government should reduce its expenses.
45:26The government is increasing its expenses
45:28and all this is due to loans.
45:30It is not that they are earning and spending.
45:32They are living off loans.
45:34Did you see anyone's motorcade being small?
45:37I remember when Mr. Shabashi talked in the beginning,
45:40that motorcades will be small,
45:42there will be no expenses.
45:43You can still see on the streets,
45:45that there is a minister,
45:46two escorts come, put four.
45:48The state of the bureaucracy is that
45:50the Saudi prince has to say that
45:52your people should send projects,
45:54you should not give briefs,
45:56you people are not working.
45:58Similarly, I gave you an example,
46:00people are carrying projects in their hands,
46:02export based, and they have no idea.
46:06But we are talking about export.
46:08We are talking about IT,
46:10a multiplication of billions of dollars.
46:12You cannot download it.
46:14The government has to demonstrate
46:18what we have to do.
46:20We should not silence our platforms,
46:22we should raise our narrative.
46:24But what is happening?
46:26They do not have a counter narrative.
46:28So in a political war,
46:30the entire industry is being destroyed.
46:32The entire IT sector is being destroyed.
46:34The rest will happen gradually.
46:36IT was a fast-moving item,
46:38it was a low-hanging tree.
46:40So there are many things,
46:42the main thing is attitude.
46:44The government will have to take a serious attitude.
46:46National security and being a security state,
46:48this is a big difference between the two.
46:50National security is a priority for all of us.
46:52We would do anything for national security.
46:54But is Pakistan becoming a security state
46:56in the name of national security?
46:58Should we accept this?
47:00This is not acceptable at all.
47:02And this is what is happening right now.
47:04Last year, 12 lakh middle-class girls
47:06left Pakistan.
47:08There is nothing to be proud of.
47:10This is a brain drain.
47:12This should not happen.
47:14If there is hope in a country,
47:16if there is promise,
47:18then things will not move forward.
47:20I take your leave.
47:22Allah Hafiz.