Projecting season-long hardware at 2023-24's midpoint with Kwani Lunis | Celtics Lab
Most of the teams in the NBA have played around half of their 82-game schedule, giving us enough of a sample size to get an idea of which players might be taking home some full-season hardware come April and onward.
And with the Boston Celtics currently the owners of the league's best record, it is not unfair to expect the franchise to have at least a little bling headed their way at season's end. To try to predict what awards Boston players and front office employees might be taking home come spring, the hosts of the CLNS Media "Celtics Lab" podcast got together with NBC Boston 10's and "The Big 3 NBA" podcast cohost Kwani A. Lunis to sort out which Celtics might be adding to their trophy case.
We cover everything from Most Valuable Player to Executive of the Year and everything in-between, and even come up with some of our own, team-specific awards for Boston's 2023-24 season.
We also get caught up on all the latest news, and look back at an intense week of Celtics games.
The Celtics Lab podcast is brought to you by FanDuel.
And with the Boston Celtics currently the owners of the league's best record, it is not unfair to expect the franchise to have at least a little bling headed their way at season's end. To try to predict what awards Boston players and front office employees might be taking home come spring, the hosts of the CLNS Media "Celtics Lab" podcast got together with NBC Boston 10's and "The Big 3 NBA" podcast cohost Kwani A. Lunis to sort out which Celtics might be adding to their trophy case.
We cover everything from Most Valuable Player to Executive of the Year and everything in-between, and even come up with some of our own, team-specific awards for Boston's 2023-24 season.
We also get caught up on all the latest news, and look back at an intense week of Celtics games.
The Celtics Lab podcast is brought to you by FanDuel.
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SportsTranscript
00:00 (upbeat music)
00:02 - All righty, welcome to the Celtics Lab podcast
00:11 brought to you by FanDuel,
00:12 the exclusive wagering partner of the CLNS Media Network.
00:15 I am Cameron Tepetabai.
00:16 I'm joined by Alex Goldberg and Dr. Justin Quinn.
00:19 It's about the halfway point of the Boston Celtics season
00:22 and we got a lot to talk about in terms of news,
00:25 but we're actually gonna look ahead
00:27 and predict who might win some awards this season.
00:31 We're also gonna just invent some awards off the cuff.
00:34 So to do that, we welcome in from the Big Three NBA podcast
00:37 from CLNS and from NBC Boston 10,
00:40 Kwanye Lewis, welcome back to the program, right?
00:43 - Yeah, it's been a minute, but yes, I'm back.
00:45 - So there's a reason you're here to do our awards episode,
00:51 but first, how are you?
00:52 - I'm doing very well.
00:54 How are the three of you?
00:56 - Doing great, can I complain?
00:58 - We're good, yeah.
00:59 (laughing)
01:01 - So Alex, do you wanna tell the story
01:04 of how Kwanye ended up back on the lab
01:07 specifically to talk about awards?
01:09 - For sure, so actually the last time I saw Kwanye
01:13 was at a chance encounter at the Boston Music Awards,
01:16 which I have now mentioned a couple of times
01:18 on this podcast, that music that you heard
01:20 at the top of the podcast was made by a band that I'm in
01:23 that won an award at said Boston Music Awards.
01:27 Not to toot my own horn a little bit.
01:29 - As you should.
01:30 - Yeah, toot it, go ahead and give it a toot.
01:33 - Fair enough.
01:34 But Kwanye and I ran into each other backstage
01:38 at the Boston Music Awards and got to chat and catch up
01:41 and it was really fun, just a generally great night
01:44 and I figured what the heck, she's here,
01:46 may as well see if I can get her on the pod
01:48 and the rest, as they say, is history.
01:52 - Cute, love it.
01:53 Boston is a small place.
01:55 Also, Kwanye works with Tevin Wooden,
01:58 my favorite meteorologist.
01:59 - Yes, he's so good, he's so good at what he does.
02:04 - He also always, yeah.
02:06 - Oh no, I'm sure he gets annoyed though
02:08 because now I just use him as a personal meteorologist.
02:10 I'm like, I'm headed to DC, what should I pack?
02:14 - That's great, I need a personal meteorologist.
02:17 - Well, hey Tevin, if you ever wanna come on
02:19 and talk weather, he's got a dog named Radar,
02:22 I've got, please, please do.
02:24 - Yes, that's happening, I'll text him after this.
02:26 - Yeah, I mean, bring the whole NBC Boston 10 team down.
02:31 - Perfect.
02:33 - Okay, so to follow up that thought about weather,
02:37 although the weather stinks,
02:39 apologies to anyone dealing with that.
02:41 Kwanye is gonna come talk to us
02:43 about awards, real and imagined
02:45 and so to do that, we're gonna hop right
02:46 into the lab portion of the programming.
02:49 So put on your safety goggles, your coat,
02:52 your gloves, whatever you need.
02:54 And first we're gonna start with real awards
02:56 and then later we have pretend awards.
02:57 So Kwanye, the MVP race hasn't yet really involved
03:02 much Jason Tatum buzz, really outside
03:07 of like really passionate Celtics fans.
03:11 Is Jason Tatum a bonafide contender?
03:13 How can he win it this year, if at all?
03:16 - So we actually just talked about this
03:17 on the Big Three NBA podcast, shameless plug,
03:20 but I think it's a really good question
03:22 because a common, I would say mentality
03:26 around the MVP award is the fact
03:28 that your team is the best, presumably in the league
03:31 at that point, and you're the best player
03:33 on that team and obviously contributing to the success.
03:37 There's no doubt that Tatum has been contributing
03:40 to the Celtics very good success,
03:42 specifically at their home arena as well.
03:44 But when you look around the league,
03:47 I think there are still a lot of other players,
03:49 Jokic, SGA, that are probably considered a little more
03:54 of an MVP just right now, because one,
03:57 I think also we don't talk about enough
03:59 that when your team isn't expected to do well,
04:02 that's when you also get an MVP bump as well.
04:05 So right now we were saying earlier,
04:07 like Tatum's definitely top five, if not five,
04:10 but at the same time, that doesn't diminish
04:13 what he's done in Boston.
04:14 It just so happens that there are other teams
04:17 around the league where you're looking at their stars
04:19 and you're like, well, we need to put some respect
04:21 on their name as well.
04:22 Anthony Edwards is another one we've talked about.
04:24 - Oh, cool.
04:25 - I think people are starting to wake up and realize
04:26 like a lot of good players in the league
04:28 that aren't getting the recognition
04:30 that they generally would.
04:32 - Dr. Quinn, what did Kwanee miss, if anything?
04:35 - I think she's spot on.
04:37 I see some people like, so Embiid, Jokic,
04:41 pretty much walks.
04:43 Shea Gildes, Alexander is usually in the conversation.
04:47 I've seen Luka rated higher,
04:49 but between all the things that we just heard about
04:52 as to bad team that is doing better,
04:55 I guess the Mavericks are doing a little bit better
04:56 than they were expecting this season,
04:57 but not to the degree that say like Oklahoma City is.
05:01 So for me right now, I have him just ahead of Luka,
05:05 but a lot of other people have Luka ahead of him.
05:07 - Yeah.
05:10 Well, I think, you know, when you talk about MVP,
05:14 so much of it is a narrative based award
05:16 and the narratives right now have really coalesced
05:19 around SGA, Jokic who just, you know,
05:24 wakes up and rolls out of bed
05:26 and puts up MVP numbers every single year, it seems like.
05:30 Giannis and Embiid, those feel like the four guys right now
05:34 who are really in the mix.
05:35 And I think with Tatum, you know, first off,
05:38 it's just the case that like statistically
05:41 his numbers are not as good as those guys.
05:43 Now he's having a tremendous impact on winning
05:46 as seen by the Boston Celtics stellar record
05:49 and just like his individual play.
05:52 But if you look at just the raw metrics, the raw numbers,
05:57 those guys have a numbers advantage on him.
06:00 One thing that I think is also important
06:03 about the MVP award is that you kind of have to want
06:07 to win it in a pretty public and serious way sometimes.
06:12 I think about Joel Embiid's MVP case last year
06:15 where he absolutely had the numbers
06:18 to justify winning the MVP.
06:19 He played out of his mind,
06:21 but part of the reason that he won MVP last year
06:23 is also because he kind of marketed himself for it
06:26 and his team around him really made this hard push
06:30 to the media and to, you know, the kind of voters that,
06:34 hey, Joel Embiid needs to be recognized for how good he is
06:38 and what he's doing on the court.
06:40 For Tatum, to some degree,
06:42 I don't think he's really kind of putting his hat
06:45 in the ring as much as maybe he could be,
06:48 partially as a function of just like his role on the team
06:52 and partially because I think that guy cares
06:55 a little bit more about trying to win the title this year.
06:58 And based on everything we've seen from him,
07:01 it seems like the first step for Tatum is win a title
07:05 and then maybe MVP comes after that.
07:08 So I don't know.
07:09 I think he's going to be hovering around in the mix
07:12 for a couple of years,
07:14 but I wouldn't be surprised if he's a few years off
07:16 from winning league MVP outright.
07:19 - Let me make the case for why he will win this season,
07:23 even if it's not true.
07:25 So looking over with our friends at FanDuel,
07:30 he's a plus 2,500, which puts him one, two, three, four,
07:34 five, he's sixth.
07:36 He's behind Embiid,
07:38 who I don't think will make the 65 game cutoff.
07:41 So Embiid might be disqualified 'cause that's a new rule.
07:44 Giannis, maybe same scenario, but also voter fatigue.
07:49 Luka has it, but he might miss that 65 game mark too.
07:55 And then it's Shea and Jokic right now,
07:59 although Anthony Edwards is out there.
08:01 I really like that.
08:02 I think that's where the value is.
08:03 So if there's voter fatigue and Tatum gets hot,
08:08 it counterintuitively,
08:09 so Boston has all those road games in March,
08:11 that's gonna be harder to sell the narrative,
08:14 but if they do really well there,
08:16 and then Ruffles comes out to play,
08:19 and Jordan Brand comes out to play,
08:21 you see it already on Instagram.
08:23 He has his all-star cases being floated
08:25 by all these brand partners.
08:27 So there's a world where if Jason Tatum averages 35 points
08:32 over a 10-game span at the right time,
08:35 and the right corporate partners
08:37 start pushing that out there,
08:38 and we just start talking about it more and more,
08:40 while other guys, it's clear they're not gonna hit 65 games,
08:44 I think suddenly he's a real dog in the race.
08:47 But I wouldn't put real American dollars behind it.
08:51 How's that?
08:52 - Get it together, Ruffles.
08:54 - Yeah, yeah.
08:57 All right, I mean, the real power broker
08:58 in the United States.
08:59 Wow, look how less orange I am
09:01 now that I'm looking at FanDuel.
09:02 That was remarkable.
09:05 Okay, so that's the MVP.
09:07 Let's do All-NBA.
09:08 I think I think Tatum is a lock,
09:13 if only because of the same 65-game cutoff.
09:17 Kwani, you think Jalen has it in him
09:18 to make All-NBA team this year again?
09:21 - Yeah, I think he does, but to your point,
09:25 it's been interesting watching him this season.
09:28 He's obviously contributing in a way that they need,
09:32 but I still wanna see more from him, just in general.
09:35 But I mean, numbers-wise, I don't think he'll be far off.
09:39 I have to check how many, I mean,
09:41 I imagine he definitely hit the game count.
09:43 But overall, I wouldn't be surprised if he made it,
09:47 but he does, I think, just, he knows this.
09:50 Like, this is a season where he needs
09:51 to consistently step up,
09:53 especially when Tatum's not in the game.
09:56 Obviously, we saw that they can win without Jalen,
09:59 they can win without Brown, but,
10:00 I mean, without Tatum as well.
10:02 But at the same time, I think those two know
10:05 the onus is still on them to be consistent scorers,
10:09 consistent defensively, do the best they can
10:11 to make sure this team continues on this momentum
10:15 that they have, which is winning a championship
10:17 at this point.
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10:55 - Yeah, and I think Jaylen's numbers
10:59 don't jump off the page the way they did last year
11:01 because Porzingis, White, and Drew have to eat.
11:06 So at times, it looks like he's not a solid of a player.
11:10 And in any given game, you might be like,
11:13 oh, is Porzingis the second best Celtic?
11:14 - Right, yeah.
11:16 - But no, I mean, that's just like a function
11:18 of how defenses are playing the Celtics.
11:20 And I mean, there's still times where Jaylen
11:23 does things that he shouldn't be doing, but.
11:27 - But he's still gotten better this year.
11:29 I don't wanna discredit- - Oh, for sure.
11:30 - Like there's been a significant growth in his game.
11:33 - His decision making is so much better.
11:36 I am shouting at my television so much less.
11:38 (laughing)
11:40 - Unless it's when Jaylen's making a sick play on defense.
11:43 The individual effort is cute,
11:47 and we can talk about whether or not
11:49 his all defensive case is serious,
11:53 but I feel like Jaylen would call his own number
11:57 a few too many times last year on defense,
11:59 and it didn't work out for him.
12:00 And I don't see that happening as much.
12:03 And when you don't put yourself on an island on defense,
12:06 you're set up to make plays better on defense.
12:08 So I think the decision making on both ends
12:11 has been like dramatically better,
12:13 at least as far as I can tell.
12:16 - Anyone else have an all NBA dark horse
12:19 on the Celtics team or no surprises there?
12:22 Yeah.
12:23 Okay, Kony, this one might be a little harder.
12:27 Who makes an all defense team this spring
12:31 from the Boston Celtics?
12:32 - Yikes, I would have to actually look at numbers
12:37 because no one really pops out.
12:40 Obviously being in Boston,
12:42 you're spoiled with the last few years of market smart.
12:46 I wonder if Derek White's numbers would, I love-
12:51 (laughing)
12:53 - I was gonna say something if you didn't say it.
12:55 - No, 'cause I mean, like obviously,
12:59 I'm not necessarily numbers forward
13:01 when I think about players,
13:02 but I imagine his numbers would give him
13:05 a legitimate enough case to at least make
13:08 the fringe of that list.
13:10 - If you are not on the all defense team,
13:13 on a all defense team after leading the league
13:16 in blocks from the backcourt,
13:18 I don't understand what's going on.
13:20 Like what do you want the guards to do?
13:21 - Right, right.
13:22 - Yeah, I think I'm comfortable saying
13:25 that Derek White is a block for first or second team,
13:28 all defense at this point.
13:30 I don't see any reasonable way that he gets left off
13:33 barring like a significant injury.
13:35 I think there's a couple of other guys
13:38 that could be in the running.
13:40 Drew Holiday is always in the all defense conversation.
13:43 He has been for his entire career basically,
13:46 and he is playing pretty outstanding defense in particular.
13:51 I feel like a lot of,
13:54 sometimes you might miss how much Drew Holiday
13:57 is actually responsible for on any given night
14:00 with regard to really implementing Missoula's system.
14:03 He's been lights out as a secondary defender,
14:06 as a help defender.
14:07 And as just like somebody who can kind of throw
14:10 a monkey wrench in an offense's game plan.
14:14 I think about like the play that he had against Minnesota
14:17 the other night where he just kind of rolls up
14:20 and like catches a steal off a pass
14:23 with a guy falling out of bounds
14:25 and then tosses it into the front court for a layup.
14:27 Like those are plays that very, very few people
14:30 in the NBA can actually make.
14:32 So I think Drew's gonna be in the mix.
14:34 I'm not sure that he's going to make it,
14:36 but I think he'll be there.
14:38 The other guy that I think we mentioned earlier,
14:41 but Jalen Brown is having a really excellent
14:44 defensive season.
14:46 Like definitely the best of his career by a lot.
14:49 And from a like metric standpoint,
14:53 last time I checked, he was like second in the league
14:56 in terms of lowest shot percentage allowed
14:59 on an individual matchup.
15:01 He's really playing some outstanding on ball defense.
15:06 The other thing, again, you know,
15:09 narratives factor really heavily into this.
15:11 Jalen said at the beginning of the year,
15:13 "My goal for this year is to make an all defense team."
15:17 There's definitely a world in which that influences
15:21 decision-making come voting time.
15:24 I don't wanna say he's a lock
15:25 'cause there's a lot of great defensive players.
15:27 And I think it's pretty fair to say that like
15:31 the defensive player of the year race
15:33 feels pretty over at mid season.
15:35 Like Rudy Gobert is gonna win that.
15:37 That's just, that feels like a lock at this point.
15:40 But I could definitely see a world in which Jalen
15:43 is making an all defensive team.
15:45 - Well, fascinating.
15:47 I was gonna say, I think Porzingis will take,
15:51 there's too many big guys for him to actually make the team.
15:53 - Yeah, sure, he's gonna go, yeah.
15:55 - He's gonna earn a look.
15:56 And if you look at the odds just for defensive player,
15:58 it is mostly big guys, but do these,
16:03 Justin, I'm gonna put you on the spot.
16:05 Are the defensive teams positionless as well?
16:07 - I believe that they have front and back court,
16:13 if I remember correctly, but I'm not 100% sure.
16:16 - But the all NBA teams are going positionless?
16:19 - All NBA is going positionless, yeah.
16:22 - Yeah, that was dumb.
16:24 I don't know why they did that.
16:25 That's neither here nor there.
16:28 Okay, depending on how the defensive teams work,
16:33 I think Holliday could find his way there,
16:35 but if it's positionless and it's all big guys, maybe not.
16:38 But we will see.
16:41 Okay, you can't even get odds
16:45 on an Al Horford Sixth Man of the Year award
16:47 happening right now.
16:51 And maybe that's 'cause they don't think
16:53 he's gonna play 65 games and hit the threshold,
16:56 but Quanie, flatter me, make the case
16:58 for Al Horford Sixth Man of the Year.
17:01 - I mean, what more do you need to say?
17:03 Like this man has to be there.
17:04 Like, I'm just very much amazed by Al's consistency.
17:09 Like that man could have been retired like three years ago
17:15 and he still stays in the game.
17:17 Obviously on the floor we see what he does
17:19 for the Celtics.
17:20 He's able to contribute, he's a good scorer.
17:22 But at the same time, I think just like
17:24 that genuine leadership skill set that is,
17:27 I think unmatched in the league,
17:29 especially when you think about,
17:30 like I swear, I've told this to students before,
17:33 like he gives me, he reminds me of my dad
17:35 'cause he's like, he shows up to work,
17:37 he's always so serious.
17:38 Like I always was intimidated by Al to begin with,
17:41 to be honest, just because he does give this,
17:45 he has this presence about him, but it's silent.
17:47 I think I would not be surprised.
17:50 And I mean, the players have said this too,
17:52 if that doesn't have an impact on this team
17:54 when you think about the growth that they've had
17:57 over the last few years.
17:57 And he's definitely been a constant when he's been here,
18:00 when it comes to, you know, just being like
18:02 the voice of reason for the players
18:04 in a different way in the locker room.
18:05 So obviously on the floor he's contributed,
18:08 that's obviously what they're looking for.
18:10 But I think just for this team in general,
18:12 he is the embodiment of what a six man should be
18:16 and what you'd want ideally.
18:18 - Yeah, the only reason I don't think it's absurd
18:24 that he might win it other than the games played
18:26 is I can't think of a runaway six man of the year candidate
18:29 right now.
18:30 I mean, for all the things that you identified,
18:32 I actually do think he's a bona fide contender.
18:35 It doesn't seem like that Vegas agrees with me,
18:39 but I also just like the thought experiment,
18:41 I was like, I don't really know who,
18:43 Russell Westbrook, like I don't know who gets to
18:47 be the stand in for like the presumptive winner.
18:51 So I don't know if Horford,
18:53 if you can like play one or two back to backs,
18:56 you'll hit that 60.
18:57 - I got a big guy.
18:58 - Yeah, he's on pace for like 67.
19:01 I bet I'd take the under on that, but I don't know.
19:05 It's truly remarkable.
19:06 And also when was the last time a six man was a big man?
19:10 - I think it was Montrezl Harrell for the Clippers
19:12 like three years ago.
19:14 - Okay, but besides that.
19:16 - Yeah, I mean, just really quickly
19:20 on the Horford six man front,
19:22 I feel like six man of the year is an award
19:25 that is almost always determined
19:27 like in the second half of the season.
19:29 Like some scoring guard, you know,
19:31 goes to a new team and pops off after the deadline
19:35 and they're like, oh, guard X is averaging 27 points
19:39 per game or something like that.
19:41 There's such a narrative bias around like,
19:43 if you are a scoring guard that comes off the bench,
19:46 you are the favorite to win six man of the year.
19:48 So like right now, like I feel like Malik Monk
19:51 would probably like win six man of the year
19:53 or something like that.
19:54 And listen, I love Malik Monk, super fun player,
19:57 really great energy for the Kings
20:00 and like great shooter, all that.
20:02 Al Horford impacts winning
20:04 at a significantly higher level than Malik Monk.
20:07 So maybe things will shift as perceptions start to change,
20:12 but I just feel like there's so much narrative bias
20:15 for this award being like a scoring guard
20:18 almost every time.
20:20 - You should get extra points if you're over like 35 too.
20:24 - Oh yeah, I agree.
20:25 - He's basically an old man in the league.
20:28 Like again, put some respect on that.
20:31 - One of the oldest.
20:32 - Yeah.
20:34 - They should have like a elder statesman of the year award.
20:38 I would love that.
20:39 - Actually.
20:40 - Remember the award show they did that like one year
20:44 they did the award show.
20:45 I liked that.
20:46 I don't think the players,
20:47 I don't think anyone else in the world would like to.
20:50 - We're all tired of award shows,
20:51 but ideally it would be a better award to attend,
20:55 award show to attend.
20:57 - I don't know, I thought the Emmys were cute last night.
21:01 Okay, a couple more and then we have some fake ones
21:05 to talk about.
21:06 Coach of the Year and Executive of the Year,
21:09 I think are totally in play.
21:12 Kwonye, I'm gonna keep going to you first.
21:14 If Boston is gonna win one of those,
21:15 which one would you pick?
21:17 - I feel like I'm sounding like a homer
21:19 because I'm just saying,
21:20 but this team has already proved it.
21:22 Like they've already done the legwork.
21:24 Ooh, that's a tricky one though.
21:25 I would say,
21:26 whoo, I really like both
21:30 and I couldn't make a case for both.
21:32 But I mean, sorry, I'm being so indecisive.
21:37 I would go Executive of the Year.
21:40 I would really like to see Brad Stevens get that
21:45 just because he made some risky.
21:47 I think it has to be a last, like end of the year call,
21:51 whether or not they pull off a championship.
21:54 But for him to make bold moves, i.e. Marcus Smart,
21:57 one that fans obviously were very butthurt about,
22:01 understandably so.
22:02 But then also just over the last off season,
22:06 he really has put together a team we're seeing now
22:09 that is a legitimate championship contender.
22:13 And I think the hardest part for him,
22:15 obviously he coached this team over the last few years
22:18 and we've seen the growth specifically with the 2Js,
22:22 but being able to understand that this team
22:24 has been showing potential for years
22:27 and knowing there are still a piece or a few pieces missing,
22:30 but not messing with that chemistry,
22:33 I think is a underrated art.
22:35 Like I don't think any executive go in and say,
22:38 you know, definitely that they knew
22:41 that they were picking a team that is really gonna win,
22:44 especially when you've been burned before
22:46 with this team specifically.
22:48 So I think there are a lot of kudos needed for Brad
22:51 just because knowing him as a coach, seeing him as a coach,
22:55 he had to get into like his bad cop mode as an executive
22:59 and do things that were counterproductive
23:01 to what we would think a coach Stevens,
23:03 a decision that coach Stevens would make.
23:05 But then of course, Joe Mazzulla,
23:07 being able to turn this team around,
23:09 like take this team by the reins
23:11 and continue with the momentum of last year as well,
23:14 he could easily get that award also.
23:17 So why not both?
23:19 - Yeah.
23:20 - My favorite. - Secret answer, both.
23:22 - Why not both?
23:23 - I actually think that there's a better chance
23:27 for Brad to get the Executive of the Year Award
23:30 just because of the fact that
23:32 while Joe has been doing a great job this season,
23:36 really shutting up a lot of the doubters,
23:39 Mark Dagnall and in particular Ty Lou,
23:43 I think have been taking an even more complex situation
23:47 and making something even more amazing.
23:50 I mean, no one was really surprised
23:53 to see the Celtics as a contender.
23:55 Maybe they're surprised to see them this good,
23:57 but Oklahoma City, no one really saw it coming.
24:00 Also Chris Finch is probably in the mix for that award
24:02 up in Minnesota Timberwolves.
24:05 There's some really good acts for Joe to have to follow.
24:09 And I think just because there are so many other
24:12 clear candidates for that award
24:14 that probably Brad's gonna run away with Executive of the Year.
24:18 - I think you're right on, JQ, about Coach of the Year.
24:22 I think Mizzoula will be in the same place he was last year
24:24 where he will be top three in voting,
24:26 but probably will not win the award
24:29 just because Dagnall to me feels like the runaway favorite
24:32 with Oklahoma City right now.
24:34 If Mizzoula were to win this award,
24:37 I think it would have to be like Boston wins like 65 games,
24:42 which is in play.
24:43 That's definitely on the table,
24:46 but they would have to put up
24:49 like an outstanding regular season for him to win it.
24:53 And they could do that, but it's not gonna be easy.
24:57 - All right.
25:00 I don't think we missed any end of year awards
25:03 that actually exist.
25:05 Oh, the Clutch Player of the Year.
25:10 - They have an award just for the agency?
25:15 Kidding.
25:16 (laughing)
25:17 - That's a joke I would make.
25:19 - I actually like that a little bit.
25:21 - Only their players are allowed to do that.
25:23 - I guess maybe like someone could win
25:28 the Clutch Player of the Award
25:30 if they hit a few clutch shots, I don't think.
25:32 - Last year was-
25:34 - It would have been Derek White.
25:36 - Yeah, last year was Derek Fox.
25:38 - It would be Derek White.
25:39 I mean, he had that three last night.
25:40 - It would be Derek White
25:40 if it were carried over from last year.
25:42 - Exactly.
25:43 - Well, he had that three last night.
25:45 I mean, maybe.
25:46 - I kind of feel like that is Tyrese Halliburton's award
25:50 to lose at this moment, but we will see.
25:53 - Well, unless, I mean,
25:54 I guess he can also win Most Improved Player.
25:56 Yeah, Quan, do you think any Celtics player could win that?
26:00 Or do you think, I mean, I feel like Halliburton is gonna-
26:03 - It'd be a stretch.
26:04 I think it'd be a stretch.
26:05 Unless something happens within the next few weeks.
26:09 Like a game where we're like, oh my goodness,
26:11 where'd you come from?
26:13 I mean, no one's really wowed me in that sense this year.
26:17 Just yet, at least.
26:19 - Yeah, I think the Homer answer would be Derek White,
26:22 but it's more that like,
26:24 he's just getting national recognition.
26:26 He was doing this at the end of last year too.
26:28 - Exactly, yeah.
26:30 - The push for Derek White is all-star, folks.
26:33 - It's very impressive.
26:34 It's very impressive, to be honest.
26:37 The fact that he's even getting this national attention.
26:39 'Cause generally speaking, like,
26:42 what team do you know where all the starters
26:45 are getting legitimate nods for an all-star bid?
26:47 Even if we know they're not gonna all make it,
26:51 it's pretty impressive, honestly.
26:54 - All right, well, Quan, I'm gonna keep you there.
26:56 I'm gonna ask you to make a prediction.
26:58 - Oh, man.
26:58 - So, all-star Thursday,
27:01 we'll get another round of fan voting.
27:03 And then next Thursday, we'll know the starters.
27:05 And then I think it's February 2nd,
27:07 the reserves are gonna pick something around that timeline.
27:11 So, we have some time.
27:12 Fan voting informs the starters
27:15 and then coaches pick the rest.
27:17 So, there's some parlor politics, yada, yada, yada.
27:20 Quan, just start listing them and stop when is appropriate.
27:25 Which Southlakes make the all-star team?
27:28 - Oh, well, ooh, I mean, legitimately make the all-star team
27:32 if we're being realistic.
27:34 Jason Tatum and Jalen Brown.
27:38 - Wow.
27:40 - Yeah, that's all I got.
27:42 - Wow, you beat the Homer allegations, I guess.
27:45 At this moment, Justin or Alex, do either of you disagree?
27:50 - I think Derek White can do it, guys.
27:53 I really do.
27:54 I think Jason and Jalen are basically locks at this point.
27:58 Jason is a lock, he's going to make the all-star team.
28:01 Jalen feels like with the past month and a half he's had,
28:06 it would be very stupid to leave him off the all-star team.
28:09 I really believe that Derek White has a shot.
28:12 He is just such a dream coach player.
28:15 And I think coaches love to nerd out
28:17 about guys like Derek White.
28:19 And I feel like there's a chance
28:21 that he gets that last alternate spot.
28:22 He might have to play a little better than he has recently,
28:25 but I think he could do it.
28:28 - There's a tendency that, and I've heard,
28:32 and I have no idea if this is true,
28:33 that when those coaches vote,
28:35 they tend to vote for the players
28:37 they have to game plan the most.
28:39 And if that's the case,
28:40 then it's probably going to be Chris Stubbs over Derek,
28:43 but I'm still going with Derek.
28:45 - Yeah, I don't know.
28:48 I still have a number of guards ahead of Derek
28:52 that it would be hard intellectually for coaches to pick.
28:58 I guess, but then like-
29:01 - If you say Trae Young, I'm yelling at you.
29:03 - Okay, I won't say it then, but I was.
29:08 - You're probably right, but I like defense.
29:12 - Waxey and Brunson.
29:13 Yeah, no, I mean, put it this way.
29:15 If we were drafting players to like start a team
29:18 or a fantasy franchise in 2K,
29:21 Derek White goes way higher,
29:23 even without the contract stuff.
29:25 If it's to sell seats in Indiana,
29:29 they're a little different, but I don't know.
29:31 We'll see.
29:32 Also, could any of the Celtics be in the dunk contest?
29:36 Like, no?
29:37 - No, that's not happening.
29:39 - There was some rumbles about Jalen earlier in the season.
29:42 I don't know where that's going.
29:45 - I would love to see Jalen in the dunk contest.
29:47 I've been rooting for him every year,
29:49 but I don't think he'll ever-
29:50 - We, like growing up,
29:51 I remember like Larry Bird in the three point contest
29:54 and like Dee Brown dunking in the dunk contest.
29:58 Like, we need that back again.
30:00 - I just think Jalen needs two more inches on his vert.
30:03 He keeps missing these like insane dunks by so little.
30:07 I think if he could jump just a little higher, which is-
30:10 - Or grow overnight.
30:12 - Yeah, I would love to.
30:13 - Give me Sam Hauser in the three point shootout, folks.
30:15 I need it.
30:16 - Okay, okay.
30:17 - That would be so sick.
30:19 - Oh, that would be cool.
30:21 Well, now that the skills competition is Wemby,
30:23 you know, like bring Porzingis,
30:26 bring like bring all the-
30:27 - All the tall people.
30:28 - Yeah, see what happens.
30:30 - Bring Taco back.
30:31 - Oh, that'd be great.
30:33 The fans would love that.
30:34 - Why not?
30:35 - Alrighty.
30:36 So, Kwanee, I know that you have a time crunch,
30:38 so we'll go through our pretend awards quickly,
30:40 but these are awards given for the Celtics,
30:45 inspired by former Celtics.
30:47 - Okay.
30:49 - Alex, I can MC,
30:50 but if I missed the spirit of any of these awards,
30:53 correct me right away.
30:55 - Sounds good.
30:56 - And we have a couple of them,
30:58 so Kwanee, people can get multiple awards
31:00 that you don't have to spread the love.
31:02 Okay, the first one, the Kebba Walker Award.
31:04 The player doing the most to keep the vibe good.
31:07 - Oh.
31:08 Oh, that's a good one.
31:13 - Maybe not on defense necessarily,
31:16 but just on your locker room.
31:17 - Yeah, it has to be like the spirit animal.
31:20 Let me look through this, see.
31:23 - Hey, you have to lay on.
31:24 - For Zingas?
31:25 I feel like his attitude,
31:27 like obviously when you come to a winning team,
31:30 you're gonna play better and be better.
31:32 But I don't know, I feel like he brings
31:34 like the spirit to the locker room.
31:37 I could be wrong.
31:37 What do you two think?
31:38 - Riley, hums to me.
31:39 - I don't hate that.
31:40 I think it's a good pick.
31:41 I think he's been very happy pretty much the whole time
31:44 that he's been here,
31:45 and the bromance with Jalen Brown is a thing.
31:47 - It's beautiful, I love it.
31:48 - I was gonna nominate Luke Cornett for this award,
31:52 but I'll say Porzingis.
31:54 - Yeah.
31:55 - I like that.
31:57 - I was thinking Lachey Bricep for those meals.
32:00 I think his mom is cooking, but that's not him cooking.
32:02 - His grandmother.
32:03 - His grandmother, yeah.
32:04 So it's kind of like, does he really deserve the award?
32:07 He's not doing the cooking.
32:09 - Yeah, it's funny.
32:09 - That's what people do though.
32:10 - It's his grandma who's doing it.
32:12 - Right.
32:13 - Man, true.
32:14 - All right, so it's either Porzingis or Bruce S. Grandma.
32:17 - I think I'm comfortable giving it to Chris Dobs,
32:20 but I do wanna eat that food.
32:23 - Or, and shout out Luke Cornett.
32:25 Also, maybe Mazzuola, but I don't know.
32:28 - Oh yeah, I forgot, yeah.
32:30 - His attitude is so much more confident,
32:33 and it works in a way that it wasn't working last year.
32:37 - I see what you mean.
32:38 - All right.
32:40 The Kevin Garnett Team Defensive Player of the Year Award,
32:42 not necessarily the best defender,
32:44 but the player doing the most to make the defense work
32:47 the way it's supposed to in its current form.
32:51 - See, the cop-out is gonna be Jalen,
32:54 just 'cause I know he's a big KG fan.
32:57 And I feel like if he, like,
33:01 the spirit of that award would make sense
33:03 as to like his goals.
33:05 He may not be there completely just yet,
33:08 but I would give him like a contender for the award
33:12 if it was a real award, like at the end of the year,
33:14 we'd regroup and look at his numbers.
33:16 - I like that.
33:18 I think the spirit of the award is very much like,
33:21 not necessarily like the actual best defender,
33:24 but the person who's making it work.
33:26 Like if that's the case,
33:27 Jalen is doing a lot to make this defense work.
33:30 So I respect it.
33:32 I think that's real.
33:33 - I think you're officially my attorney.
33:35 - Yeah.
33:36 (all laughing)
33:37 I like that.
33:38 I'm available 24/7.
33:39 - Yeah, 'cause I feel like white is the answer,
33:44 but I don't feel like, like he's executing.
33:48 I don't feel like he's the engine.
33:50 - Sometimes only when he's on the floor,
33:51 I think we can make the case for Peyton Pritchard as well,
33:54 which sounds really weird,
33:56 but I mean, between his offensive rebounding
33:57 and the fact that he can actually defend anyone at 6'1"
34:00 for being very generous is pretty impressive.
34:03 - We just need to see more of him.
34:05 That's the issue.
34:07 Yeah.
34:08 - I was gonna say, Justin,
34:09 that was a good impression of a lawyer too,
34:10 'cause that wasn't true,
34:11 but you said it with so much conviction.
34:13 (all laughing)
34:15 All right.
34:15 - We were all, we were all convinced.
34:17 - I'm doing my best, man.
34:18 - Pritchard is too.
34:22 All right.
34:23 The Bill Russell Player Coach Award,
34:24 the player doing the most to coach the team
34:26 on the floor or from the bench.
34:27 - Oh.
34:30 I mean, this could go to multiple people.
34:35 Crap.
34:36 I feel like I'm being stumped for a fake award.
34:38 - Well, while you think.
34:41 - Yeah.
34:44 I've been impressed with how often
34:47 Joe Mazzuola is calling plays this year,
34:50 which seems different than last year.
34:52 And it often is the case that he's checking in with Drew.
34:54 So I wouldn't be surprised if we learn
34:57 that like privately Drew is the answer to this question,
35:00 but we don't hear about it.
35:02 It doesn't, they're not making a big deal out of it
35:03 if that's the case.
35:04 - I like that one.
35:07 I'm gonna go with your theory and just say Drew.
35:09 - If, yeah, if only if-
35:13 - To encourage the Celtics to call plays more.
35:17 Okay.
35:18 The Marcus Smart Award,
35:19 a player who has the most dog in them.
35:21 - This one I struggled with because when he left,
35:26 that was the biggest question.
35:28 Like who's gonna be the one with dog in them?
35:31 And I haven't seen anyone like for real for it.
35:35 Like if the players were to get into a fight
35:38 on what's the next day, Wednesday.
35:41 Well, I don't know who they would fight, Wimby.
35:43 Like if they were to get into a fight, let's say-
35:46 - Who do you want in the air?
35:47 - Right.
35:48 Like if for some reason the Morris brothers,
35:51 like one of the Morris brothers,
35:53 like, well, that wouldn't even make sense
35:55 'cause he's a player.
35:56 But you know, if they were to like get
35:58 into a legitimate fight with someone,
35:59 I don't see anyone on this roster
36:02 really stepping up and being willing.
36:04 Not that fighting should be the answer,
36:06 but I don't see anyone that would step up and be like,
36:10 nah, like I got my teammates back like that.
36:13 - I have a kind of-
36:15 - Yeah.
36:16 - I have a kind of sneaky answer to this one,
36:18 which is that I think the player
36:20 with the most dog in them right now on this team
36:22 might be Jason Tatum.
36:24 - Oh, I was gonna say Pritchard.
36:26 All right, you defend Tatum, I'll defend Pritchard.
36:28 - Well, I just noticed that Tatum has had
36:30 a little bit more of an edge and physicality
36:33 to his game this year.
36:34 He's really been making a point to like mix it up
36:38 and get very physical in a way that I haven't seen from him.
36:42 He's bigger, he's stronger,
36:44 and he's kind of talking shit a little more on the court,
36:48 particularly in some of these big moments
36:50 where he's like blowing kisses after big shots
36:53 and snarling at people.
36:55 He's got a little nasty to his game
36:58 that I haven't really seen from him.
37:00 So I kind of wonder if maybe the answer to this award
37:03 is actually Jason Tatum.
37:07 - Yeah.
37:08 - I would go with that also.
37:09 There was a moment in the game versus the Raptors
37:12 where he basically like smacked Schroeder in the face
37:16 and knocked him to the ground and just walked away,
37:18 did not even look back.
37:19 And I was like, wow, that's his boy.
37:22 And like after the game, they were cool.
37:25 They even like-
37:26 - He signed the jersey for him.
37:27 - Yeah, but like at the time I was like,
37:30 wow, that is different.
37:32 - Not for nothing, Christophe Brzingis is tied for third
37:36 with eight technicals this season,
37:39 which is pretty impressive
37:40 'cause he hasn't played that much.
37:41 Dylan Brooks has 11.
37:43 How's that?
37:44 - Wow, Dylan Brooks, holy moly.
37:46 - He's a quality.
37:49 Using your frame, I feel like if there was a cartoon fight
37:52 and it was just like dust and fists
37:54 and we didn't know who was in it,
37:56 you would see them just like drag Pritchard out of there.
37:58 So-
37:58 - Pritchard would definitely be in there.
38:00 That's a good point.
38:01 - Yeah, I don't know if it's as much as Marcus Smart,
38:05 but we'll see.
38:07 Okay, let's keep it moving.
38:10 The Isaiah Thomas Award for the player
38:13 who is outstanding, outplaying their current contract.
38:15 Ooh, let me ask that again.
38:18 The Isaiah Thomas Award,
38:19 the player who's outperforming
38:20 or outplaying their current contract.
38:22 - I guess this one will always go to a guard.
38:25 I would say Derek White for this one.
38:27 - Yeah.
38:28 - Kind of a given.
38:29 - Congrats to Derek White for making
38:31 30 plus million dollars in two seasons.
38:35 - That sounds about right.
38:36 - The Rajon Rondo team most improved player,
38:38 the player who was on the team last year
38:40 and has improved the most.
38:41 - That's also Derek White.
38:43 - That's also Derek White, yeah.
38:44 - That's Derek White sweeping the awards.
38:47 - That's the theme of the season, I think, is Derek White.
38:51 The Robert Parrish Best New Player Award
38:54 for the player that has made the most impact
38:55 in their first season.
38:57 - Ooh.
38:58 - Brazilius?
39:01 I feel like, yeah, who else is new?
39:03 Let me-
39:04 - Drew, you can make a case for,
39:06 but it seems more like he's been making catch-up.
39:09 - Sweet.
39:10 - No Lamar Stevens here?
39:11 - I wish there was.
39:15 - Hey, we don't have an award for off-the-court stuff,
39:17 but it seems like Lamar Stevens is really thriving.
39:19 He's been reading books to people.
39:21 He addressed the VA.
39:23 - He's filled in for the Grant Williams
39:25 Community Service Award that I just made.
39:28 - That was a good one.
39:30 We can add it.
39:31 - And I'm curious if that is a,
39:33 they just, I'd be curious how it's decided
39:37 who does what charity events
39:38 and the next one and the next one after that.
39:41 - Yeah, I imagine, from what I've gathered,
39:44 like, they will never probably give us the legitimate intel,
39:48 but all the players are obligated
39:49 to do like the public appearances.
39:52 But from what I've gathered over the years,
39:54 they're like, I made the joke about Grant,
39:57 but over the last few years,
39:58 Grant was the one who would go to the Boys and Girls Club
40:02 or like do more of the pop-up last minute events.
40:05 So I wonder if they do have like a designated survivor
40:08 of like who has to go to these events,
40:12 or if it's, but I imagine,
40:14 I would hope that there's like a voluntary aspect too,
40:17 of like, oh, I don't mind filling in
40:19 on this community aspect of the role since,
40:22 you know, obviously Jason and Jalen
40:24 can't go to every single event,
40:26 but there needs to be some kind of representation
40:29 from the actual roster too.
40:31 - Yeah, they do.
40:33 I mean, we get the press release once a week,
40:34 someone's doing something, they're doing a good job.
40:37 I hope it's that Lamar and Grant are just kind guys.
40:41 - Yeah, right.
40:42 - They fill that niche.
40:44 All right, Kwanye Lunas of the Big Three NBA
40:48 basketball podcast, CLNS and NBC Boston 10.
40:52 Here's your last one, the Larry Bird team MVP.
40:55 (silence)
40:57 - I'm joking, Jason Taylor.
41:01 (laughing)
41:03 - That's correct.
41:05 - Think about it in depth.
41:06 No, I think he's proven, it's so interesting.
41:09 I feel old when I talk about Jason and Jalen,
41:12 just because like, my first year covering the league
41:16 was when Jalen got drafted,
41:18 but I feel like now I'm like their older auntie
41:22 that's watched them grow up.
41:24 And I'm just like, I'm so proud of them.
41:26 Like watching dudes grow up is so strange.
41:29 - That's so bizarre, yeah.
41:31 - Isn't it?
41:32 But to your point about Tatum's confidence,
41:34 I really have been impressed in the way that he has evolved
41:38 because he did come in as a shy, quiet type player.
41:42 You didn't necessarily know what the personality
41:44 was going to be like.
41:45 And I think part of it was also him just playing it smart
41:47 and understanding that this is a whole new level.
41:50 You have to interact with media differently.
41:52 You have to interact with fans on a whole new level
41:55 than you did at Duke.
41:56 So I think for him, there was definitely
41:58 like that learning curve of understanding the power
42:01 that he has as a star.
42:03 But watching him now walk in it in confidence
42:05 is I think very refreshing
42:07 'cause I think he's doing it the right way, so to speak.
42:11 Like he has a good image.
42:12 He's raising his son, like the image,
42:16 like the PR part of it is good as well,
42:18 but also just like when he talks accountability after a loss
42:23 or the way he talks about rallying the troops together
42:26 as a leader in the locker room,
42:28 I think he's just grown in different areas
42:30 that he's definitely going to be eventually
42:33 going to get the legitimate MVP award.
42:34 But yeah, he's earned that so far.
42:36 - Yeah, I think he, Joe and Jalen,
42:40 matured in a noticeable way this season
42:44 that is a really welcome sign if you're a Celtics fan.
42:49 - Yeah.
42:49 - All right, well, Kwani, thank you for
42:51 adjudicating our award season here.
42:56 - Right on, it's such an honor.
42:58 - Yeah, the Kwani Lewis award.
43:01 This year goes to Kwani Lewis, how's that?
43:04 You're welcome back anytime.
43:05 I'm sure I'll run into you at a game soon enough.
43:08 And until then, thanks for coming by the Celtics Podcast.
43:12 - So thank you guys for having me.
43:13 And we can also go to the Boston Calling
43:18 and see our guy, he's here performing, right?
43:20 With Meg Thee Stallion?
43:22 - Yes, no, Meg Thee Stallion.
43:23 I'm going to be playing backup bass for him.
43:26 No, I will be performing with my lovely band, Divine Sweater,
43:28 which also features a Meg that is not quite Thee Stallion,
43:32 but is definitely, I don't know.
43:34 There's some sort of horse analogy, something or other.
43:38 - I'll let Meg pick the horse.
43:41 - Yeah, let Meg pick the horse, that's for sure.
43:44 Yes, we will be playing at Boston Calling on day one,
43:47 that's Friday, and there will be roster information
43:51 as to where you can find us and when you can find us
43:54 coming out, presumably in the next couple of months.
43:57 But we are playing the show and we'd love to see you there.
44:01 - There we go.
44:02 We'll all be there then.
44:03 - All right, we'll all be there then.
44:07 Until then, Kwani, thank you very, very much.
44:09 We'll catch you later. - Have a great night.
44:11 - Okay, thank you again, Kwani.
44:13 You can check her out, like really all over Boston media,
44:16 if it's not Celtics stuff. - Truly, yeah.
44:18 - It's everywhere.
44:19 - She's just kind of there.
44:21 - The rest of us, we're gonna do the news.
44:24 And we haven't talked in a while.
44:26 The Celtics have had kind of a smattering of games.
44:28 Let me summarize and then I'll just throw it to you guys
44:31 and kind of talk about whatever was most interesting to you.
44:34 So they beat the Pacers pretty good.
44:35 They beat the Timberwolves in overtime.
44:38 They looked really bad against the Bucs
44:40 the next day and they crushed Houston.
44:43 They looked okay against Toronto.
44:45 You could talk about E-Main coming back.
44:47 You could talk about Tatum getting ejected.
44:49 You can talk about a nice game against the Timberwolves.
44:52 You can talk about waving the white flag in Milwaukee.
44:57 What stood out in the past seven or eight days to you, Alex?
45:01 - I think for me, it's gotta be that crunch time,
45:06 heroic performance against the Timberwolves.
45:08 That's where this starts.
45:10 That was a really hard game.
45:12 A game in which I think teams of yesteryear for the Celtics
45:17 would have pretty easily folded and fallen apart.
45:21 Anthony Edwards is just a relentless basketball player.
45:25 He just never stops coming at you.
45:28 It's crazy to watch.
45:30 Carl Anthony Towns is playing terrific.
45:32 I know they were shorthanded without Rudy Gobert.
45:35 Celtics were also shorthanded without Christophe Porzingis.
45:38 So kind of balances out, at least in my mind.
45:41 But to me, that's a game where if you wanna start
45:45 the Jason Tatum MVP case,
45:47 and I know we've been talking about it a lot,
45:49 it's that game.
45:51 It's the performance in that game.
45:52 He completely took over down the stretch,
45:55 26 points in the fourth quarter and overtime,
45:59 utterly dominated in that last phases of that game
46:03 in a game where Minnesota played really well.
46:07 They really wanted to win that game.
46:09 To me, it's one of, if not maybe the outright best win
46:14 of the season for this team.
46:16 And it just continues to show that like,
46:18 they really will not back down from a challenge,
46:22 except when that challenge is on the second night
46:26 of a back-to-back after playing an overtime game
46:29 against Minnesota, in which they very much did back down
46:32 from that challenge.
46:33 - Yeah, I was gonna say, yeah.
46:34 That was, let's just forget that memory forever.
46:38 - That one struck me as,
46:41 and we talked about this on the chat,
46:43 but I mean, that's about as scheduled loss
46:46 as you're gonna get.
46:47 I think they knew within about five minutes
46:50 when Jalen had no lift on his jump shot at all,
46:53 that that one was not going our way.
46:56 - Well, Glenn, what about you for the past week?
46:59 - From the past week, what I saw is that the Celtics
47:03 have this thing going, and you may have noticed
47:07 where they sit players preemptively so they don't get hurt.
47:12 So that way all of the players, all of their star players
47:15 who are important to their team get a rest,
47:19 which means Derek White needs a rest.
47:25 He's not been playing very great.
47:27 He's on the injury report for the Celtics next game
47:31 against the Spurs, I believe, with a twisted ankle.
47:35 I think we were all kind of scared
47:36 when we saw him do something to his leg
47:39 near the end of the Toronto game.
47:42 And he just has not, his lift is off.
47:44 Like his energy doesn't seem quite as focused
47:48 as it usually is.
47:50 My man needs a game off, just a game.
47:53 Let him get himself right.
47:55 - Yeah, I think that's right.
47:57 I mean, he did hit the dagger in that game
48:00 and make a clutch defensive play late to put it away.
48:03 But yes, Derek White, I think you've earned yourself
48:06 a day or two off for sure.
48:09 That Toronto game was so weird.
48:12 I didn't feel like Boston played all that well.
48:14 They just kind of won late
48:17 when Toronto started missing everything.
48:19 Zeroo had a really nice game,
48:21 but that was not like an outstanding performance
48:25 by any means.
48:26 They were great.
48:27 Yeah, go ahead.
48:28 - It was really good though.
48:30 There's been signs of this, what I'm about to say,
48:33 in recent games as well,
48:35 is on nights when they just didn't have it
48:37 previously offensively, they were cooked.
48:40 Now they know that when they can't hit anything,
48:44 they can just put the clamps on, crank it up to 10
48:46 and choke the life out of you,
48:49 which is basically what they did.
48:50 I think the Raptors shot like 12% from three.
48:53 That has got to be close to a record.
48:57 - Yeah, I mean, I would hazard Toronto's a better team
48:59 than their record indicates after that trade.
49:02 They look-
49:03 - Much better.
49:04 - Not that night.
49:05 (laughing)
49:07 - The first half, they looked good.
49:10 - But to your point, I mean,
49:11 I think that's a really important one that
49:13 under Emei, their calling card was defense.
49:16 And last year, they just like never recaptured,
49:19 not just that mojo, but like that skill or that tool,
49:23 however you want to phrase it.
49:24 And this season, it's very much so the case
49:26 that if they need to, they can not just win a game,
49:30 but define a game by defense.
49:32 And then Tatum or Brown can make individual plays.
49:35 - Just one-
49:37 Sorry, just one quick point on the defense thing
49:39 that I think is really kind of thoughtful,
49:42 which is that one of the things that I have been reading
49:46 about is how, when Missoula was hired last year,
49:50 it was like a week before the season started,
49:53 and they really didn't have time to do anything
49:55 other than kind of roll out the same defense
49:58 that they ran under Emei with worse results
50:01 because of personnel and injuries and things like that.
50:04 And I think it gets at a point which is,
50:07 I think overlooked, but important about NBA defenses,
50:10 which is that the name of the game in NBA defense
50:13 is adaptability and change.
50:15 You can't run the same thing that you ran last season
50:18 because teams will find the footage on it
50:21 and they will pick it apart.
50:22 You need to be able to create modifications or adjustments,
50:27 or just kind of, as Missoula was kind of saying
50:30 earlier in the year,
50:31 you need to have the curve ball when it comes to defense,
50:34 and you need to have a different curve ball every year.
50:37 And I feel like what I've seen from this year's defense,
50:40 obviously the personnel has changed tremendously,
50:42 so you have to start there,
50:43 but it feels like they're playing a lot more zone.
50:47 They're doing a lot more kind of like weird,
50:49 funky stuff off ball.
50:51 They're having-
50:52 - Can we pause, 'cause I really wanna talk about this.
50:57 This is something I noticed in the Toronto game.
51:00 You've probably all seen the 2-1-2 zone
51:04 where Drew has been in the middle,
51:06 kind of being the guard everybody
51:09 whenever someone needs help,
51:11 and versus the Raptors, they had Tatum doing that,
51:15 which I thought was a super interesting wrinkle.
51:18 And I wanna see just how many other iterations
51:21 they've created with this just to, again,
51:24 throw people off, 'cause it was insanely effective.
51:27 - And that's the thing,
51:28 is I feel like Joe is actively tinkering with the defense
51:33 in a way that he really was not comfortable with last year,
51:36 just like inheriting the reins from Madoka.
51:38 This year, he's really starting to experiment
51:41 and try some stuff,
51:42 which I think makes the Celtics defense
51:44 a lot more flexible and a lot more dangerous
51:47 on a night-to-night basis.
51:49 Just the fact that it's really hard to game plan
51:52 for this team 'cause Mizzou might just cook up
51:54 a different look on any given night
51:57 that could completely alter the way that you approach it.
52:00 - Yeah, he said something to that effect the other day
52:03 that basically having worked with Brad,
52:06 having worked with Madoka, and now with him at the helm,
52:10 not just Mizzou himself, but the players have
52:15 so much more under their belt to draw from on defense.
52:19 And Justin, I'm curious if Drew,
52:22 I think probably less so,
52:23 portraying us with the Wizards, if we're being honest,
52:25 but Drew is bringing things that Milwaukee had
52:28 that they can borrow from as well
52:30 and kind of explore those looks or-
52:33 - Yeah, I don't think there was too much defense
52:35 being played with the Wizards, so yeah, you're right.
52:38 - It's also, I mean, the opposite is true,
52:42 is last year, Miami changed their defense every quarter
52:46 in the postseason and it bamboozled the Celtics,
52:49 and the Celtics did not do that,
52:50 and Miami was pretty steady on offense.
52:53 So yeah, Alex, I think that's really impressive.
52:57 And part of it is also, Justin, what you identify
53:00 is they're not letting themselves roll
53:03 with their full starting lineups every night.
53:05 It's a different, I would love for the Celtics to get fined
53:09 because they're resting players too much.
53:10 That is a good team to be in the NBA.
53:13 I don't really want to end on this,
53:15 but I kind of want to wrap up.
53:17 I don't really get the NBA coming out and being like,
53:19 oh, the data on load management is unclear,
53:21 but also continue to load manage.
53:23 (Justin laughs)
53:24 I don't know what the hell that was,
53:26 but, and so I don't want to just assume
53:29 that load management works.
53:31 Like maybe the data says it doesn't, and that's silly.
53:34 However, I think that the Celtics should keep resting players
53:38 until the post-season because the stakes matter too much.
53:41 And also they are, you know,
53:44 I was at the game the other night
53:45 and someone with a signed Latvia jersey
53:47 got on the Jumbotron and Porzingis wasn't playing.
53:50 And that is sincerely a very sad story for basketball fans.
53:54 But writ large, they're always fielding a good team
53:58 that is worth the price of admission.
54:00 So they're not like derelict
54:01 in their responsibilities as entertainers,
54:05 which is part of why you carry so many good players.
54:08 Anyways, speaking of real injuries,
54:12 we're thinking of Scott Pollard
54:14 who reportedly needs a heart transplant,
54:16 and that's not fun.
54:18 And that's also not something for people on the internet
54:21 to decide whether or not they believe.
54:23 - That was so weird.
54:24 Why people did that?
54:25 Like for those who don't know,
54:27 there were a bunch of people who conspiracy theoried
54:30 his heart condition based on some limited information
54:33 decided he was faking it for attention,
54:35 which is no one really does that,
54:37 particularly when they won an NBA championship.
54:39 - And their own survivor, like Scott Pollard, whatever.
54:44 - He knows how to get attention in other ways
54:45 that don't require faking medical conditions.
54:49 Not hard.
54:50 - So we're thinking of the Pollard family.
54:53 Anyways, I'm gonna pause there 'cause I need to eat dinner
54:57 and get ready for my big basketball game tonight.
55:01 So you'll just have to ask me about the Vans and Jackets
55:04 and Marcus Smart's house next week has that.
55:07 Until then, I would like to tell everyone
55:10 that this episode of the Celtics Up podcast
55:13 was brought to you by FanDuel,
55:15 the exclusive wagering partner of the CLNS Media Network.
55:18 Thanks to Quanie Lunas for stopping by.
55:20 Thanks to Divine Sweater for lending us Alex
55:24 from his duties as bassist.
55:26 Justin, thanks for continuing to be my boss
55:31 for while we're doing thank yous.
55:32 Thanks for liking and subscribing
55:35 to our illustrious podcasts and we'll catch you later.
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