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00:00Don't want to like just look this up
00:02Sort of willy-nilly. Well like live fly. Yeah, I'll do it
00:07Well, a lot of us will know it off the top of our heads
00:11right
00:12Five and O last year to start the year. Yeah year before that. They were both
00:18two and three and three and four
00:21Okay, yeah, and then went to the NFC title game. Sure. That's 2022
00:26in
00:281981
00:30That's the year you just mentioned they they won their first two games then they lost four in a row
00:35Yeah, five of six. They were three and five
00:39went to the
00:41Went to the NFC title game
00:44And then the year before that they were also
00:47Two and three now then it ended up being a very bad year
00:51that's the year that that Jimmy missed the entire second half of
00:55the season but
00:57Jimmy was in there for portions of
01:00their their two and three start, so
01:04This really isn't that out of character
01:07It's really not that out of character
01:10And and for me, especially when you bake in and this is I think an important thing that skills just said a short time ago
01:17Like I wonder how much this matters to you all I know
01:22At the end of the story it doesn't matter at all
01:25But in this moment, how much does it matter to you the way the 49ers lose a game a lot?
01:32Okay, it matters a lot because you aren't getting beat. You've been beaten once this year, Minnesota beat you. It was a road game
01:40Minnesota is better than everyone thought including you you thought they'd be good and they're better than that. They're undefeated
01:47I didn't think they'd be five at all. I don't think that they're gonna go 17 to know but Donald is good
01:53Justin Jefferson's amazing and their defense with a unbelievable defensive coordinator is nasty. That's a good team
01:59So you went to Minnesota you got beat you went to LA which is a virtual home game
02:05It's a VHG and you spit the bit horse racing term. You gacked it away
02:11Gagasaurus Rex and you lost and then you have Arizona at home in a get-right-spot
02:16And when you beat New England, whatever and Arizona you repeated rinse and repeat
02:22Lather rinse repeat you gacked it away. You made mistakes
02:26You look like slop and so it's because of the way you've lost that is so alarming and then you add to it the injuries
02:33and
02:34you know the the perspective of now taking on Seattle and
02:37What if your own four in the conference and Owen three in the division?
02:40So who you lost to how you lost to them all those things are big factors
02:46Well, you know, it's funny cuz you're just talking about Minnesota. So I just looked at this now, you know me
02:51I don't want to get into November in December. I have no idea who's healthy who's playing
02:55I don't know what's gonna happen to the Vikings
02:56Yeah, but if you do want to play a game on paper because what place did the Vikings come in last year?
03:01Do you remember in the NFC North?
03:04What what like obviously Detroit won it yeah
03:07I think there was a third was a Green Bay Green Bay made the playoffs. So listen to this third place schedule now
03:12Yeah, I'd argue Minnesota was seven and ten Tiger Chicago
03:16So they've already beaten the 49ers the Texans and the Packers at Lambeau three playoff teams last year
03:22You can't say that it's been an easy schedule through their their first five and their five and oh and their next game
03:28They will host they've got to buy this week their next game. They will host the Detroit Lions
03:33Also very difficult and we don't know if they'll win it or lose it. But then listen to what happens after that. I
03:39mean
03:40they go to the Rams and then they host the Colts and then they go to the Jags and then they go to the
03:46Titans and then they go to the Bears and then they host the Cardinals then they host the Falcons and then they host the Bears
03:53And then they go to Seattle then they host the Packers and go to Detroit last two games the point I'm getting at
03:59If the Vikings continue to look like they currently look and if they are blessed with some health and
04:06And maybe some of you have already done this. I think you can totally adjust
04:11What the goal is for the 49ers this season?
04:14Forget the one seed
04:16Forget it. Well, you have four games behind, Minnesota. Exactly. I believe in the tiebreaker listen to that schedule
04:21Yeah, I don't know if there are four losses on it. There might be well
04:25Go
04:26Chicago's, you know pretty good. Okay division is not gonna be a cake. Well, you know, look, it's the NFL
04:32They may end up losing eight games. I have no idea what's gonna happen around the corner
04:36but this is not a schedule that is dotted like the 49ers schedule is
04:41with the Chiefs and the Cowboys and the Packers and the bills and the
04:45You know that all of this stuff that the Niners are gonna have to go through the Lions
04:49So I just I think you're squarely focused on when the NFC West
04:56and you take an early season step toward that if you can
05:01Dot your I's and cross your T's and play well tonight
05:04Yep
05:04And according to the look ahead lines that we were referencing yesterday
05:07Minnesota is underdog in eight of those games after the bye what?
05:12According to the look ahead lines their underdog
05:15Against the Rams on the road three and a half at Jacksonville three and a half at Chicago three and a half
05:22Wonder if you're right, I wonder if those don't adjust. Yeah, there's no way the Vikings are great dogs to the Jags
05:28I can see him being dogs to Chicago. Yeah, Chicago's, you know better than that soldier. Sure. They're tough
05:34They're always Detroit in the last game of the year, but that's fine, too
05:38That's fine, too, but against the Jags get out of here. Seriously. Come on. So that's not a thing
05:43I do look at you know
05:44The Niners and the number one seed and even if you win this game and you get to three and three
05:48Well, then now you're just three and a half back in Minnesota
05:51You don't even think about any seeding yet right now
05:54You're just trying to think about can we still win the West and if you lose tonight and you're two and four?
05:59Well, you're still able to win the West
06:01But now you're two back at Seattle three back if you count the tiebreaker Oh and three in the division
06:06It becomes a little bit more difficult in all the tiebreaker. No doubt. No doubt
06:11You know the word that just like bouncing around in in in my head right now like a caged animal
06:18The word is trust is bouncing around in my head and I'm curious because maybe this is the conversations that you and I have directly
06:27Had the honor of having like we do each week, you know people who really like we're in the game or are in the game
06:33Or whatever, but when I think about for example, Greg Cosell going
06:38You don't like the Niners didn't forget how to play football
06:41Right, and I hear Mike Holmgren go guys. It's injuries and I hear Ron Rivera go
06:47Their identity is missing and they're gonna get it back and and the season is just starting and then you look at all the times
06:54The 49ers have started two and three or three and five and then you look at all the times
06:58They've gone to Seattle with a lot on the line
07:00Just the last three or four years
07:03The same thing has happened every time
07:06Yet my feeling in this moment is there are a lot of people out there that don't trust
07:13That the 49ers are okay or that they're gonna figure it out or that this is gonna take a positive turn
07:20even though
07:21For five years running now outside of your quarterback getting hurt. It's kind of done. Nothing, but that every year
07:28that that's that's like the only thing the 49ers have done, but last year everyone was healthy and
07:34Including your quarterback who didn't miss a game and you had McCaffrey was healthy Debo missed a game McCaffrey missed what one game?
07:41Trent missed one game. I don't even think McCown Trent missed a game. Well Debo missed again
07:45That's it Christian missed a game because at the end of the year they pulled everybody, right?
07:49Yeah, Ray and Fred and Nick all the one-name guys. They all were healthy and this year's you're not healthy
07:55That's just last year. They've they've right they've dealt with stuff like this before
07:59They've certainly dealt like with stuff like this before
08:02Yeah, and they've had seasons where they played better down the stretch and so it's not about trust
08:07They they might do it if they get healthy
08:10Even if they lose tonight, they still might be able to go out there and and beat Kansas City
08:15You you're allowed to beat Kansas City are I checked Dallas and you've got other games after after the by and after the by they've seen
08:22To be pretty good you get healthy and you get that break and thereby comes at a good spot
08:27So yeah, it's not out of the question
08:29But it feels like this team this group and every team is different this team feels different to me
08:35it doesn't seem to me that defensively you have the same level of depth and
08:41Your front is not I don't think that your your front four is as good as it has been in previous years
08:47That's fine. That's fine. But I guess here's what I'm getting at
08:49Here's what I'm getting at like when I hear you say that you're talking about right now
08:55But what I'm trying to stop myself from doing is taking the frustration of these first five games and projecting it
09:03This means
09:05XYZ for later in the year. I have no problem if you want to say that the Niners what word do you want to use?
09:11Disappointing do you want to use ineffective? Do you want to use concerning?
09:16Do you want to do any of that?
09:17But but here's what I would push back against and I know the guys played a lot of the sound on Stiney and goo
09:22Ben Solak
09:24joined them earlier today and
09:26Ben Solak Ben Solak NFL analyst. Okay. Yeah, I mean you said it like
09:32I know that's not you. I'm not trying to be like an annoying partner. I just I'd never heard of yeah
09:39They got Zolak. I know Scott Zolak. He's very Zolak. Yes Scott Zolak screams things in Patriot games, right?
09:46He's the one who goes
09:50Yeah, I don't know thank you for checking me because I'm sure plenty of you are like
09:55ESPN in 2024 as a national NFL and a national NFL and of this all right ESPN Ben Solak
10:01okay, so the guys had him on and
10:03Listen to what to me
10:06sounds like you're pulling out a Sharpie and
10:11Defining the 49ers by these first five games
10:15Here's the nature of things. It's the NFL. It's not for long. That's what the letters stand for
10:19It is so hard to be good year over year and then Niner fans know this because Kyle's been excellent
10:24I'll have been great, but they have these eight and eight years
10:27They have their injury years when they go four and twelve, right? Like it's just it's really consistent
10:31It's really hard to go to the Super Bowl
10:33Lose and then just be back at the top of the NFC the very next year like the the elite quarterbacks can do it
10:39But if you don't have an elite guy, then it's just really challenging
10:42You know some some cracks are to show in the facade a little bit. So for me, I think the Niners are a playoff team
10:47I don't think there are an NFC powerhouse and I think that the NFC is largely a mess right now
10:53An NFC powerhouse, so maybe they get hot late down the season make another run
10:57But this isn't the same team that they were I think last year or a couple years ago
11:00I think that you're starting to see just the attrition of trying to hold together one roster and pay everybody
11:05You're starting to see that accumulate on them talk to I spit that out. Oh, yeah
11:10That is first of all, that's riddled with inaccuracies and second of all it is opinion about the quarterback
11:16Well, he said they have all these eight and eight years and then they have no they don't
11:20What what they've never gone ain't never gone ain't eight
11:23They have six and ten have been bad when they lost their quarterback period moving on
11:28Well, they were bad early and then he's certainly indicating now if you want to be good every year
11:34That's for teams that have an elite quarterback. Yeah, and that's what bugs. Ah, Ben. I'm sorry. What are you saying?
11:41Please expand, you know what he's saying?
11:43Well saying that Brock Purdy is not an elite quarterback
11:46Therefore I am going to push back and I am going to reject the opinion that he's throwing out there
11:52He is stating that this should have been expected
11:55That a regression is the way it works in the NFL the NFL stands for not for long
12:01Which is a fun phrase that everyone likes to use but I can give you all kinds of examples to the opposite
12:07What do you mean the NFL stands for not for long?
12:10There are a bunch of teams that go through a decade of playing very well, but forget a decade
12:16I mean sometimes two it's not even about a decade
12:19it's about three years or five years whatever you want to look at and since 2022 the Niners have the
12:25Third best record in football. They're 27 and 12 in the last three years and the Chiefs are
12:3239 so wonder why yeah good quarterback. The Eagles are 27 11 and the Bills are 27 and 11
12:39I would I would I guess maybe this is what I'm saying
12:41If you're in the NFL and you have who you think is a pick your number you want to do top seven?
12:47You want to do top nine? Whatever if you've got a really good quarterback and forget the rankings
12:52It doesn't matter if you've got a really good quarterback and he plays all the games
12:59Then you win most of your games
13:01period
13:02Look around the league. What when are there? Are you the Ravens are not gonna be as good? Yes, they are
13:09Yes, they are 26 and 13 Ravens are gonna be fantastic. The Chiefs are 5 and 0
13:15Wow, the Texans are in first who saw that coming the Bills are in first. No way you don't say
13:23like
13:25the 49ers
13:27Have one of those guys
13:29You can argue that and I know it's plenty of you will but that's that's my thought
13:34You know, the Falcons are suddenly better this year. What happened? What happened? They brought in a good quarterback
13:41like that
13:42That's all the Niners need is for Brock Purdy to play all the games
13:46And if he plays all the games that doesn't mean you automatically get 13 wins
13:50But I argue you probably automatically get 10
13:52But maybe 9 based on the two you've given away
13:56Because I do believe that their updated win total right now is nine and a half
14:00They're over under that's interesting because of the two that they kicked away and I think it started the year at 11
14:05So those are games that you would have looked at and counted as wins
14:09But it's interesting the idea of
14:11Putting it down in Sharpie because you can't put anything in football down in Sharpie based on the injury threat
14:17So, what can you look at right, but I can put down in Sharpie
14:21Like you can put Kyle Shanahan in Sharpie that he's a really good head coach
14:25I actually do think you can put it down in Sharpie if those guys I named stay healthy
14:30So yes, that's why you can't put it in Sharpie in my opinion
14:33No
14:33The statement I made was if those guys those guys that I just all named those teams if their quarterback plays 17 games
14:40You're going to the playoffs
14:42Period possibly the Texans are going the Ravens are going the Chiefs are going they're gonna go
14:48Well, those are like the Chiefs are five and oh
14:50They still have it
14:51They have a the wiggle room to have a couple of games like the Niners did the Niners don't have that wiggle room anymore
14:58accurate accurate
14:59but what I'm what I'm getting at is this is a longer haul than what it feels like in this moment and
15:06And and to the point that Ben is making which is essentially hey
15:11Nothing lasts in the NFL
15:13Should have known Niners aren't gonna be as good. I'm sorry Ben. I don't I don't agree
15:19There's something absolutely that lasts every time in the NFL if you have a really good quarterback
15:24And he plays all the games you go to the playoffs
15:26Like you know look at the Bengals when Joe now now they may be the thing that
15:32Would be a great rebuttal to what I'm saying. I don't know where they're gonna go, but in Joe Burroughs career
15:38It's been very clear if he's there
15:41They're gonna dance a little bit when he gets hurt which has been a lot
15:44They don't now this year they're one in four and he's healthy
15:48So maybe that's the the thing that fights what I'm saying because I think he's a really good quarterback
15:54They're an odd situation because their their defense is a problem, but think about other teams that we know for example
16:02Dallas they've made it three straight years their quarterback is good
16:06Philadelphia since Jalen Hurts took over they're in the playoffs every year Josh Allen and Buffalo
16:11They're in the playoffs every year because he is a really good quarterback
16:14We know about my homes, and you look at these other teams including tonight's opponent Seattle where Gino's good
16:21But he's not in that group good ish
16:23He's good ish, and you know CJ Stroud is a guy if he looks to be this good
16:28They're gonna make the playoffs every year Kirk Cousins is a great one because they you know he's in Atlanta
16:34And they've been elevated and he was really good in, Minnesota
16:37And Jordan loves another one where looks like they might be a regular playoff participant because he is also very good
16:43I mean, I probably shouldn't speak in the total absolute that I was it's not automatic that you go to the playoffs, but
16:50To to sort of go against what Ben is saying
16:53Usually you do like yes, there are outliers
16:56Maybe Burroughs not gonna make it this year and Kirk Cousins didn't make it every year
17:00And he's someone that's sort of like right. He's a he's a tweener anyway six years in Minnesota
17:06He was two for six okay in playoff appearance. Yeah, so I mean and he's a tweener anyway
17:10I know some people don't think he's an elite quarterback at least not at night or whatever
17:15But the point is is I disagree with this idea that teams
17:20Just like they've got a two or three year window, and then it's over
17:23I disagree now the windows as big as your head coach in your quarter
17:28Totally that's your window and and and if you are a believer in these two guys that the Niners have and I obviously am it
17:35Is my belief that the 49ers should be dancing in some form of relevance
17:40Every year like the 49ers in this moment as maddening as this year has been so far
17:47Do they not sort of like I don't know do they not have your trust. Do you not believe?
17:55That that this is going to take some sort of a positive term
17:59They do have my trust, but if the trust was at a hundred before the year
18:04It's probably at a 90 or 91 now that some of the trust has been eroded
18:08By some of the things that we've seen you have a special teams unit that is a mess
18:13You've got a red zone offense that is struggling
18:16You've got a defensive coordinator who hasn't yet found his stride, and you've got two bad losses out of your first five games
18:22So can the trust be built back up of course? It's like a stock on the stock market
18:28It goes up and it goes down and right now Shannon stock is still high in my opinion
18:33Sure, but it has slipped a little bit from where it was before the year started
18:37And I guess the the point I'm making is also a broader one
18:40Which is I just don't I just don't agree that the NFL is not for long
18:43I agree that the NFL is not for long if you're talking about your health if you're talking about your average career length
18:50Your team's loyalty, you know what I mean like we there's a number of ways we can do it
18:55But I don't buy the idea that if you're good it only lasts for three years
19:00And then you're not good because it's the NFL no no that I don't think that that's the case at all
19:06No
19:07and it all depends on a number of other factors, and I think the Cincinnati example is a good one because the
19:13Structure of ownership and front office. I don't think is very good and the head coach
19:18Zack Taylor, I thought that he was one of these wonderkins
19:21But he has not shown a great ability to win a lot of these games. I don't know what to make of him
19:26There's certain guys the thing that's yeah, McDermott in Buffalo is another one where I'm like, okay
19:31I you guys are good ish. You're good. You're good. You're a factor. You have great quarterbacks
19:36I still don't know like you know what I mean a lot of coaches
19:41If you gave me John Harbaugh Jim Harbaugh Andy Reid Kyle Shanahan Sean Payton Mike Tomlin
19:46There are guys where I'm like. Oh, I know what they try to do. I know what their identity is
19:50I know who they are. I know the way they go about their business
19:54Zack Taylor
19:56Sean McDermott yeah, they've been here for a while. I don't feel like I know the first thing no and Zack
20:01Taylor is a great offensive mind yet
20:03he's got a couple of wild cards on the offense and defensively they never seem to be very good and so if burrow and
20:11Jamar and company and Higgins and all the rest of the fellas if they aren't totally popping in their a-game
20:16They lose games and Shanahan. I think is
20:19Cut from a different cloth where he can go out there and he can be a 17 to 16 based on the way he likes to
20:25design offense
20:26Cincinnati tries to be
20:29Yeah, they want to they want to lean on their offense as they should they've got great offensive players, but yeah
20:35Let's like this is another reason where as much as we make fun of Dan Campbell
20:39Because of
20:41opening press conferences or
20:43Coming to Levi's Stadium and just playing way too loose with your kneecap off
20:49All that said I would still man I'd go to bat for Dan Campbell all day of course
20:54I know more about that guy in a year and a half
20:57Then I do about more than half the coaches in the NFL doesn't matter if you have one ass cheek and three toes
21:03I will beat your ass there you go
21:06That's how you get an Applebee's commercial like he's well they have an identity he changed a culture
21:12Yeah, it's the hardest thing to do right he changed a culture
21:16Think about these nuts Robert Sala in New York
21:20He I don't know if he tried to change the culture
21:23But he went in there with a certain approach and when the quarterback came in they clearly were not on the same page
21:29Culture wise and now he's gone well
21:31He brought in a culture killer, and they did exactly what the Niners did with Trey Lance and didn't have the emergency break glass
21:39Situation the Niners had with Brock Purdy. They drafted Zach Wilson, and he's no good
21:43Yeah, so then they had no choice, but to sign up for the culture killer and guess what they killed the culture well
21:50Not yet. They're doing I think that the team is gonna be better now, but they killed the coach. That's for sure
21:57I don't know if he killed the culture wasn't Hackett his hand-picked play caller
22:01Right Hackett still there on the staff, but he's just not calling plays anymore, but he loves his hand-picked play caller
22:05He's already lost the role there you go. I mean and again you you talk about culture and
22:12Organization and fit and you've got an owner in New York
22:14Who is not a very good owner and a GM who?
22:18Traded picks unnecessarily to bring in Rogers and the culture and the structure here is far more stable no doubt
22:24So that's another thing you can put in Sharpie