In this episode, we discuss family dynamics and boundaries with a caller concerned about his mother's new relationship, inappropriately involving his underage sister. The conversation reveals conflicting family responses and a culture of enabling that prioritizes the mother's happiness over the children's safety.
As the caller shares his struggles with past traumas and low self-esteem, we explore how his need for familial validation has led to emotional distress. Through thoughtful questioning, he begins to recognize the necessity of setting boundaries for his sister's safety and his own well-being. Ultimately, he gains clarity on prioritizing self-respect and the importance of establishing healthier relationships.
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As the caller shares his struggles with past traumas and low self-esteem, we explore how his need for familial validation has led to emotional distress. Through thoughtful questioning, he begins to recognize the necessity of setting boundaries for his sister's safety and his own well-being. Ultimately, he gains clarity on prioritizing self-respect and the importance of establishing healthier relationships.
GET MY NEW BOOK 'PEACEFUL PARENTING', THE INTERACTIVE PEACEFUL PARENTING AI, AND AUDIOBOOK!
https://peacefulparenting.com/
Join the PREMIUM philosophy community on the web for free!
Also get the Truth About the French Revolution, the interactive multi-lingual philosophy AI trained on thousands of hours of my material, private livestreams, premium call in shows, the 22 Part History of Philosophers series and much more!
See you soon!
https://freedomain.locals.com/support/promo/UPB2022
Category
📚
LearningTranscript
00:00:00Hello? Hey, how's it going?
00:00:02I think I've misplaced my question, but I can talk about it. I can talk about the issue at hand, if that's okay.
00:00:11Yep, hit me.
00:00:13Right, so I guess the core of the question was, am I trying to punish my mother?
00:00:19This came to a head recently where, well, my mother and my sister were going to a party.
00:00:27And at this party, there was a gentleman in his late 50s who'd made a move on my sister.
00:00:33My sister's extremely young, just turned 18, and my sister notifies the guy, hey, I'm a minor, blah, blah, blah.
00:00:42Mom steps in and starts talking to the guy. Shortly thereafter, well, a couple weeks later, they start dating.
00:00:49Trying to raise the issue to my mother. Mother then turns on me and states,
00:00:53well, me and my sister had confronted my mom, and she turns to us and says, well, it's your sister's fault.
00:01:01You know, with how she was dressed, she let the guy on. You know, that's why I came to approach her.
00:01:06And so this became a bit of a problem within the family, and I've been going to other family members and just trying to raise this issue of,
00:01:13look, we have an issue here where there's a gentleman in the household who my sister's uncomfortable with.
00:01:19But I've been met by accusations of, the first one was I have an Oedipal complex.
00:01:25I don't want my mom to start dating people. That's the reason why I'm stepping into this issue.
00:01:31Or the fact that I'm trying to punish my mother due to past traumas and conflicts that we've had.
00:01:36So that's the whole issue.
00:01:38Sorry, are you talking to male or female relatives here?
00:01:42Both. I've talked to my aunts and uncles.
00:01:44OK, and is it the case that both your aunts and your uncles are doing this silly Freudian psychoanalysis stuff?
00:01:51No, that was my aunt.
00:01:53OK, so that's because I was going to say that's not a particularly male response to say, ah, Oedipal complex.
00:01:59That would be more of a female psychologizing bit of nonsense to avoid the actual argument and attempt to appeal to your insecurities.
00:02:07OK, so what did the men say in the family?
00:02:13Ah, so they, the word from them is, yeah, no, I think there's a, well, there's an issue with your mother.
00:02:21However, she's really unwell, you know, she's had a hard time. Parenting isn't easy and we're bound to make mistakes like this.
00:02:27So she's really unwell, did they say?
00:02:29Yeah.
00:02:30And what does that mean, like physically?
00:02:32Well, she was just in hospital a couple of months ago, and she's come out now.
00:02:40So back then there was a bit of a scare that it might have lost her.
00:02:44And so they're just saying, look, you know, it hasn't been the easiest year for her.
00:02:47And this is a shot of happiness, really.
00:02:49So, you know, let's just let things drop and let's let her enjoy happiness whilst we have her.
00:02:56OK, interesting.
00:03:00So the happiness of your mother is very important.
00:03:03The happiness of your sister is unimportant.
00:03:08Essentially.
00:03:10Yeah, I think like my sister's now, because I live on my own, my sister still lives with my mother.
00:03:18She's been messaging me and letting me know that, you know, it's extremely awkward in the household and I've been talking to her.
00:03:25And it seems like old cycles of what I'd had before with her, where she just almost dehumanizes you, almost, in a sense.
00:03:32It doesn't matter what you want, it's more what she wants.
00:03:34Right.
00:03:35And as long as she gets what she wants, everyone's happy.
00:03:38But if you displease her in any way, if you cause any problems, then it's trouble.
00:03:46OK, got it.
00:03:48So how old is the relationship between your mother and this guy?
00:03:53Oh, very young.
00:03:55They've been seeing each other for about 11 months.
00:03:59OK, so not that young.
00:04:00It's not like a month, right?
00:04:02Yeah, not like a month.
00:04:04OK, so mother's boyfriend creeps on barely legal sister, right?
00:04:11Yeah.
00:04:13And what are your sister's opportunities to not be living with your mother?
00:04:19Can she come stay with you?
00:04:22She can't.
00:04:23I'm in a completely different part of the country and she needs to go to school.
00:04:28And so where her college is, that's where my mom's house is at the moment.
00:04:33So we're now looking for, I guess, ways for her to, I guess, get her own accommodation.
00:04:40But that'll take some time to prep.
00:04:43Why?
00:04:45Just in terms of, well, job and everything else, getting her to support herself and things like that.
00:04:53I mean, can you help her?
00:04:56I can help her, yes.
00:04:57Yeah, I can.
00:04:58OK.
00:04:59Doesn't she need to get out?
00:05:01I mean, if this creeps around, this could be negative.
00:05:04It could actually be quite dangerous, right?
00:05:06It could be dangerous, yeah.
00:05:08I guess my thinking was, well, this is a very simple issue in terms of my mom's file.
00:05:15How can you not see what you're putting your daughter through?
00:05:17Could she not deal with it rather than me, I guess?
00:05:21Could your mother not deal with it?
00:05:24No, in terms of, I see it as a very simple issue in terms of my mother.
00:05:28It's just a simple modification in behavior.
00:05:31I don't know what you're talking about.
00:05:33What do you mean?
00:05:34What is a simple issue?
00:05:35What modification of what behavior?
00:05:36I don't understand what you're talking about.
00:05:37Sorry.
00:05:38Slow down, man.
00:05:39Bring me along for the ride.
00:05:40I'd like to join you on whatever journey you're on.
00:05:43Sure.
00:05:44What I mean is, it's like with friends.
00:05:47You see a friend is doing wrong.
00:05:49People have raised this to your friend.
00:05:50You raise an issue to your friend, and your friend goes,
00:05:52ah, I see the error of my ways, and then they try to change.
00:05:55No, but your mother doesn't do that.
00:05:57That's how you facilitate the relationship.
00:05:58No, she doesn't.
00:05:59Do you think that that's going to start happening?
00:06:02How old is your mother?
00:06:06Not exactly.
00:06:07Is she in her 50s or 60s?
00:06:09Late 40s.
00:06:10Late 40s.
00:06:11Okay.
00:06:12Yeah.
00:06:13You're obviously older than your sister, right?
00:06:19Yeah.
00:06:20So your mother is pushing a half a century, and this is who she is, right?
00:06:26I had guessed so, yeah.
00:06:29No, I mean, I'm not trying to...
00:06:32I mean, I view this as a gift.
00:06:35I'm obviously completely wrong about all of this, but this is such uncontroversially horrendous behavior
00:06:44that she's giving you an immense gift.
00:06:48I mean, I get you don't want to open the present, but it is an immense gift.
00:06:56It's so absolutely horrendous, outlandish, appalling, disgusting, vile, predatory, and enabling.
00:07:06Then what possible ambiguity could there be left as to the nature of your mother?
00:07:13Oh, yeah, no.
00:07:17I guess there's a rub, because culturally, for us, there's this whole stigma around,
00:07:25if I get where you're heading here, it's, you know, I guess, branching off from your mother
00:07:30and just sort of living your own life.
00:07:32You know, she is who she is, and she's not likely to change.
00:07:36Like for us, for my family...
00:07:39Sorry, are you calling me with the argument that there's a cultural norm invented by bad parents
00:07:48that you always have to spend time with bad parents?
00:07:51Is this your counter-argument to me?
00:07:54I mean, I'm not sure who you think you phoned, but maybe you got the wrong number.
00:07:58Maybe you're looking for, you know, Philosophy Conformity 101 guy, but I don't know who...
00:08:05I'm not sure why you're calling me and saying,
00:08:07well, but, you know, there's this cultural standard invented by abusive people
00:08:12that you can't ever draw boundaries with abusive people.
00:08:15And I'm like, well, yeah, of course they would do that, right?
00:08:18Yeah.
00:08:21News at 11, government schools tend to be pro-government.
00:08:24I mean, okay, so there's a cultural standard invented by abusive people,
00:08:30which says you always have to spend time with abusive people.
00:08:33Yeah, I get that.
00:08:34It's the tax, right?
00:08:35It's the tax and the involuntary relationship.
00:08:38So I hope you're not calling me to tell me that this standard exists as if I didn't know.
00:08:45I also hope you're not calling me to tell me that this standard is something that should be respected.
00:08:52No, no, no, no.
00:08:54And look, I mean, I'm happy to hear the arguments, but it's like saying, you know,
00:09:00Steph, I brought truth and reason to people and they're uncomfortable with it.
00:09:04I'm like, yeah, and that's the deal, right?
00:09:08Yeah.
00:09:09But this, even by, I mean, even by the family's cult status or standards,
00:09:16this is pretty egregious.
00:09:18And it is a little surprising to me that no one has any problems with it at all.
00:09:29Well, I think it comes down to that cultural thing,
00:09:34wherein regardless of whatever issues, you know, they may be in the family or we may have with a person,
00:09:39suppress it all just to maintain that relationship.
00:09:43It doesn't matter what they're doing, the harm that they're doing,
00:09:46just ignore it all just to have that relationship.
00:09:50But it's not, it's not about love for family, right?
00:09:55It's not about do what's good for your family, right?
00:09:58It's not about family first, because this guy's not family.
00:10:03No, no, this is not funny.
00:10:06Stop laughing.
00:10:07Sorry, yeah.
00:10:08This is not funny.
00:10:09This guy's not family.
00:10:10If family is so important, well, your sister is family,
00:10:15and this guy is some random creep who's banging your mom.
00:10:18Yeah.
00:10:20He's not family.
00:10:22So if it's, well, family, family, family,
00:10:26then why would you choose a non-family member, a virtual stranger,
00:10:30over your sister?
00:10:33Not you, but why would the family member do that?
00:10:38I guess my only answer to that would be they care more about just maintaining my mother's happiness,
00:10:45or they don't want to entangle themselves in this issue.
00:10:48So it's just, well, status quo, whatever the mom says, you know,
00:10:51she wants this guy, cool, you guys deal with it, and we'll just carry on by ourselves.
00:10:55Okay, so then it's not about family, right?
00:10:59No.
00:11:00So what is it about?
00:11:01Yeah.
00:11:02Because your sister is the family member most in need of protection, right?
00:11:07And so if they're throwing your sister to this predatory boyfriend,
00:11:14then clearly family and protection is not the principle.
00:11:19So what's the principle?
00:11:22I guess having their own interests and needs above anyone else's.
00:11:30Oh, that's too generic, though.
00:11:32What does that mean in practice?
00:11:35Oh, I guess in practice it's just, screw you guys, I'm getting mine, my happiness.
00:11:43What I want goes, and whatever discomfort or unhappiness that may lead for you doesn't matter.
00:11:50But you just basically said the same thing with more syllables.
00:11:53What is the principle that people are operating under?
00:11:58Because, I mean, there's what people say, and then there's the truth, right?
00:12:02True, yeah.
00:12:04I guess I wouldn't know how else to put it besides my own interests and needs above yours.
00:12:10But, I mean, my own interests and needs is a pretty common thing, and there's not necessarily any immorality around this, right?
00:12:16No, there isn't.
00:12:19No.
00:12:22Hmm.
00:12:23Can you just back off a bit from the mic? I'm getting quite a lot of breathing noises.
00:12:27Ah, sorry.
00:12:29I've got one of these awful headsets.
00:12:30That's fine.
00:12:31Yeah.
00:12:33Is that a bit better for you?
00:12:35So, yeah, so what is the principle at work here?
00:12:41Now, if we say, well, everybody just wants to make your mother happy, right?
00:12:48Mm-hmm.
00:12:49Well, having a guy who's this creepy and inappropriate and wrong and obviously willing to betray her with her own daughter, I mean, this is terribly horrible stuff, right?
00:13:03So, it's not going to make her happy in the long run, or probably even in the short run that much, to be with a guy like this, right?
00:13:12Right.
00:13:13So it's not about your mother's happiness.
00:13:15Yeah.
00:13:17It's not about your sister's happiness or protection, of course. It's not about your happiness or protection. So what is it about?
00:13:26I guess it's not about getting involved with difficult things, but you see that it may be difficult to, there's an issue here with, I guess, for my relatives, they see that, okay, there may be an issue with her and this relationship, but I don't want to put myself in a situation where I'm having to work hard or, you know, I don't want to work too hard for this thing.
00:13:54So I'll just keep myself to myself and just let that situation be.
00:14:00Well, okay, but I mean, they will have to work hard if this guy, I mean, he's going to go off the rails at some point or another, either with your sister or with someone else, or it's going to be an affair or whatever it is, right?
00:14:11I mean, this is just a guy with no sexual boundaries and no sense of appropriateness and no sense of the effect of his actions, right?
00:14:20Yeah.
00:14:21Now, but it is a guy who has accurately assessed the true nature of your family.
00:14:28Yeah, no, I'd say...
00:14:29I mean, he's on the nose, right? He's bang on. He has rolled the dice and he's got the perfect score.
00:14:35Yeah, and a vulnerable daughter and...
00:14:38Yeah, most people would be like pretty appalled, right? And he took a big risk, right? Because especially with social media, if your family were to say, oh, this guy, you know, creeped on the daughter of the woman he's dating or whatever, right? And you hashtagged his name or whatever. I mean, that's a big risk these days, right?
00:14:55Yeah, funnily enough, he's got a massive social media profile, so it would be a risk for him.
00:15:03Okay, so he accurately assessed that he was going to be fine.
00:15:09Yeah.
00:15:11So he... and you're surprised, right?
00:15:16By his assessment? No.
00:15:18No, no, you're surprised because obviously you went to your family members with this story in the hopes that they'd be like, well, this is appalling. We've got to have a sit down with your mother. We've got to protect your sister. We like all this stuff, right?
00:15:30Yeah, yes.
00:15:31So this guy, the bad guy in this conversation, according to what you say, he has a better understanding of and comprehension of and assessment of your family than you do.
00:15:46That's correct, yeah.
00:15:47Because he did what he did at great risk to himself, and he accurately assessed your family's pathetic spinelessness and enablement and appeasement. And you were like, no, no, no, I'm going to get everyone to be upset about this and work to protect my sister.
00:16:06Yeah, they didn't come to protect.
00:16:09Which means the bad guy understands your family way better than you do. And I'm not saying this is a criticism, that just seems to me the empirical fact.
00:16:19No, I wouldn't disagree with you there.
00:16:20So listen to the bad guy. He's telling you exactly who your family... he's doing you a solid.
00:16:29He's doing you a favour. He's saying to you, hello, wakey wakey, this is who they are. I sussed them out perfectly, you don't have a clue.
00:16:39Yeah.
00:16:42You're running around drinking piss and trying to call it wine, I know what it is.
00:16:46Yeah.
00:16:47Exactly.
00:16:50So what are you calling me to ask about? And I don't mean this in any negative way, I just want to make sure I'm serving your needs as best I can.
00:16:59Um, well, I guess what I was heading with this was maybe there was more at fault with me and in terms of my relationship with my mother before, maybe I was actually trying to punish her. Maybe there could be an element in which these guys are right, that I am deceiving.
00:17:20What do you mean trying to punish her? I don't understand what you mean when you say trying to punish her. This sounds like more wine auntie psychologizing, but I'm certainly happy to hear the theory.
00:17:30Well, it's just that whenever there's been issues or friction between my mother and my sister or my mother and me, I've been, I guess, I push for her to try and change, to try to see her children as people, I'll characterise as.
00:17:47Okay.
00:17:48So I understand that and that's a fine thing to do, but you're in your twenties now, right?
00:17:55I'm in my twenties. Um, yeah.
00:17:59So for how long have you been trying to summon an illusory conscience in your mother?
00:18:04Uh, I would say for the past five or so years, I stepped out of a, um, a deep depression and I sort of looked around me and I saw, look, this family is disastrous. It's extremely dysfunctional. So what can I do to try and make him better? Um, I would like for us all to stay together. So let me try to at least be the voice of reason and try to sort of bring about positive ideas.
00:18:27Okay. So you've been working at this for half a decade and this is the result.
00:18:31This is the result. Yeah.
00:18:33So what does that tell you?
00:18:37Uh, it's a, it's a fruitless endeavour.
00:18:40Well, it's worse than fruitless. It's self-destructive.
00:18:42Yeah.
00:18:43It's costing you everything.
00:18:45Hmm.
00:18:46How's your dating life?
00:18:48Oh, I've just stepped out of a very, uh, painful relationship.
00:18:55Right. How long did that last for?
00:18:58Lasted for two years.
00:18:59Why did that end?
00:19:01It ended because, uh, she wanted me to be someone that I wasn't.
00:19:07Um, and that essentially it was that.
00:19:11Um, she got angrier and angrier and angrier when I wouldn't fit what she envisioned, you know, who I'll be.
00:19:17And yeah, that led to the breakup.
00:19:21Really? She didn't have any problems with your family?
00:19:25Uh, she did. Um, uh, uh, one example that I can bring up was, um, after, well, after my mum had raised, um, that, well, my dad, well, the facts of my real father for 20 odd years, I thought, well, this guy was my dad, turned out he isn't.
00:19:46You thought my real dad.
00:19:47Slow down, slow down.
00:19:48Thought what?
00:19:49Sorry. Um, she told me the truth of my father.
00:19:51Now I get that. For 20 years, you thought what?
00:19:54That one guy that we'd lived with, um, an alcoholic was extremely abusive.
00:19:58She, I thought that that was my father.
00:20:01Well, you didn't think that was your father.
00:20:04I, yeah.
00:20:05You were told.
00:20:06Yeah.
00:20:07Right. You were, you were told.
00:20:09I was told, and it was reinforced that you should try, you know, the cultural thing, maintain a relationship with him.
00:20:15He's your father.
00:20:17You can't do this.
00:20:18Sorry, what do you mean maintain a relationship with him?
00:20:19Why wouldn't you, I mean, did he leave?
00:20:22Um, no.
00:20:23Well, I guess he did.
00:20:24If your mom's dating someone new, right?
00:20:26Yeah.
00:20:27He, we ran away from him.
00:20:29We ran away and he tried to come into our lives, but I wouldn't, I wouldn't.
00:20:33Sorry.
00:20:34Slow down, brother.
00:20:35Jesus.
00:20:36Sorry.
00:20:37Are you, are you high at the moment?
00:20:38Like, Holy crap.
00:20:39No, I'm just.
00:20:40You think I'm able to follow what the hell you're talking about?
00:20:42Okay.
00:20:43So slow down.
00:20:45You, for 20 years, you said your mother lied to you about your father and said, this guy's your dad when he wasn't.
00:20:52Is that right?
00:20:53Yeah, that's true.
00:20:54Yeah.
00:20:55All right.
00:20:56So then you say we ran away from him.
00:21:00At what age were you when this happened?
00:21:03So I was about 18, 17, 18.
00:21:06When, um, me, my mother and my sister, we, uh, when he went to work, we got in a car and, uh, left for.
00:21:13Okay.
00:21:14So, but this was your mother's decision, I assume, right?
00:21:16This was my mother's decision.
00:21:18Okay.
00:21:19So there's no, we here, right?
00:21:20I mean, your, your sister was like in her mid teens, right?
00:21:22Early teens.
00:21:23Yeah.
00:21:24Okay.
00:21:25There's no, we here.
00:21:26I mean, you're dependent on your mother.
00:21:27You're 17 or whatever it is.
00:21:28You're, you know, you're still legally not an adult and your sister is much younger.
00:21:32So there's no, we here, your mother ran away from him and brought you with her.
00:21:39Right.
00:21:40Yeah.
00:21:41Okay.
00:21:42And then you still didn't know that this wasn't your biological father, right?
00:21:46No.
00:21:47No.
00:21:48And when did you find that out?
00:21:49Or when were you told that?
00:21:50I was told that last year.
00:21:52And why were you told that?
00:21:54Um, she said that this was when I'd moved into my girlfriend at the time.
00:21:59And she said, you look like you look to be in a stable, um, well, you look to be stable in this part of your life right now.
00:22:06So I thought I'd sort of tell you the truth of who your father is.
00:22:11Okay.
00:22:12But why, why would she tell you?
00:22:14Um, she had said that the, it's going to be a bit awkward.
00:22:23Um, but the guy who I thought was my father, I guess we'll call him Dave.
00:22:28Um, she told me that David found out, um, that I wasn't his son.
00:22:34And he had been, he had then started making threats to her and making threats to my biological father.
00:22:42And how did Dave find out that you weren't his son?
00:22:45Uh, so apparently they'd done some DNA testing at some point.
00:22:52Oh, like a blood type or maybe a blood type was impossible or something like that, right?
00:22:56Yeah.
00:22:57And over time as he grew watching me, um, from him, he had said that, you know, he could see that I wasn't growing into, I did, cause I don't look like him at all.
00:23:09And sorry, at what age were you when the biological testing was done or when he, the DNA testing or whatever it was, what age were you when your stepfather found out he wasn't your real father?
00:23:22So, uh, this was, this was done without me being aware.
00:23:27They'd done, I think, was it a mouth scraping?
00:23:30To get some saliva and send it off for testing.
00:23:34So this was performed, I think when I was, uh, late teens.
00:23:38Um, but I, so, and this is what I was told.
00:23:41Oh, so your stepfather found out that he was the victims of almost two decades of paternity fraud?
00:23:47Essentially, yeah.
00:23:49Sorry, what do you mean by essentially?
00:23:51No, no, no.
00:23:52That's, that's correct.
00:23:53He found out that.
00:23:54And your sister?
00:23:55My sister is his.
00:23:56Oh, so she's your half sister.
00:23:58She's my half sister.
00:23:59And your biological father, what's his story?
00:24:02Um, well, he didn't know.
00:24:06And so this all happened, this all was born from a one night stand with my mother when they were still at uni.
00:24:12Um, so he had gone off and lived his life without knowing, you know, that I had a son.
00:24:17And so some 20 odd years later, he gets a phone call saying, Hey, you have a son.
00:24:23This is his name.
00:24:24Blah, blah, blah.
00:24:25And yeah.
00:24:27So how did your mother pass you off as your stepfathers?
00:24:33Was she cheating on your stepfather with your father?
00:24:36No.
00:24:37Um, so what happened was he, my stepfather was cheating on my mother with several other women.
00:24:45And so one, at one point he broke up with them to pursue another woman.
00:24:50And that day that he broke up with them, my mom then went to her friend, my biological father for comfort.
00:24:58They had a night together.
00:24:59And I think a couple of weeks later, then my stepdad comes back and they've reformed that relationship.
00:25:06And throughout all that time, um, you know, they're obviously sexually active.
00:25:11And so she'd say that she had thought that, well, I was having more sex with your stepdad.
00:25:16So I thought that you were his.
00:25:18Um, but I guess there'd been some suspicion.
00:25:20That's so gross, man.
00:25:22Yeah.
00:25:23I mean, you got like a couple of guys, sperm swimming around your mom and, oh, gross, man.
00:25:30Okay.
00:25:31It's, it's a horrible picture.
00:25:34Um, and so when I was, when she told me, um, when I was with my girlfriend at the time.
00:25:40Hang on.
00:25:41So you're, so she told you because your stepdad was making threats towards you, your mother, your sister, and your biological dad?
00:25:49He was making threats towards my biological father and my mother.
00:25:53And the threats towards your biological father were based on what?
00:25:57Did he think that your biological father knew about you?
00:26:00Yeah.
00:26:01He was threatening to ruin his life, that he was going to do X, Y.
00:26:05Well, this is from what my mother was saying, that he was threatening to ruin his life, come up to where he was living and just make a mess of it.
00:26:13Sorry, threatening to, did you say to end his life?
00:26:16Ruin his life.
00:26:17Oh, ruin his life.
00:26:18Ruin his relationship with his wife.
00:26:19Okay.
00:26:20Yeah.
00:26:21Got it.
00:26:22Yeah.
00:26:23So you fled that environment and was your stepfather a substance abuser?
00:26:28I mean, that's such crazy behavior that maybe there were substances involved.
00:26:31I don't know.
00:26:32He was chronically drunk.
00:26:34Okay, got it.
00:26:35Yeah.
00:26:36Okay, so you and your mother flees this guy because he finally finds out that you're not his son.
00:26:46Mm-hmm.
00:26:48And your mother, of course, hid this possibility from him.
00:26:52Did she ever tell your stepdad that she slept with your dad?
00:26:55No.
00:26:58Okay, so he would have no reason to suspect until later on, when I guess he noticed that you didn't look anything like him.
00:27:05He had his suspicions.
00:27:06They did the DNA testing.
00:27:07He's not the father.
00:27:08So then your mom flees with you and your stepsister, right?
00:27:13Your half-sister.
00:27:14Mm-hmm.
00:27:15Your half-sister, sorry.
00:27:16Yeah, half-sister, yeah.
00:27:17And then what happens?
00:27:20So she flees with us to live with her sister at that point in time.
00:27:26And he then starts coming by the house, my aunt's house, drunk, making threats.
00:27:34We call the police on him several times, you know, calling her a witch.
00:27:38He's going to ruin her.
00:27:40You know, she's hurting so badly.
00:27:42How dare she do this to him?
00:27:44Things like that.
00:27:45Yeah, it's completely monstrous behavior, right?
00:27:48Yeah, so that was—
00:27:50Tannery fraud is really one of the greatest evils around.
00:27:54Well, for me, I just don't understand how she could live with herself knowing what she knew and lying to both of us.
00:28:01Sorry, what do you mean how she could live with herself?
00:28:03I don't know what you mean.
00:28:05No, it's—
00:28:06I mean, it's pretty easy if you don't have a conscience, isn't it?
00:28:09It is.
00:28:10No, it is.
00:28:11So what do you mean you don't know how she could live with herself?
00:28:13You mean, oh, you're putting yourself in her shoes and saying, well, if I were her, I couldn't live with myself.
00:28:18Yeah.
00:28:19That's naive, right?
00:28:20It's very naive.
00:28:21Okay, so stop that.
00:28:23Stop thinking that everyone's like you.
00:28:28No, that's a flaw, and that's what led to—
00:28:33I thought that after my mom had told me this, how her demeanor was when we had that meeting, I thought that she might be suicidal.
00:28:45She was very somber and just talking about how her life was—well, she didn't have much of a life.
00:28:53Sorry, so she tells you that she has engaged in almost 20 years of paternity fraud, and then she gets very somber about her own life.
00:29:05Yeah.
00:29:06Well, you know that's just a strategy, right?
00:29:09No, I didn't see it at the time.
00:29:12But does that make sense?
00:29:13She then makes it about her.
00:29:15You have to comfort her.
00:29:16You're worried about her.
00:29:17You can't get mad at her, right?
00:29:19It's a play.
00:29:21Yeah.
00:29:22In reflection, I can see that.
00:29:24Okay.
00:29:27And then?
00:29:28Yeah.
00:29:29And so that's when my girlfriend steps in, in terms of seeing the dysfunction in my family.
00:29:36So she constantly pushed me to go see my mother to try to see if she's okay.
00:29:44Sorry, your girlfriend would?
00:29:46Yeah, because she saw the dysfunction, essentially, between me and my mother.
00:29:53And did she know about the paternity fraud?
00:29:57I told her about it, yeah.
00:29:59And so she said, here are the obligations you have towards your mother, who lied to you about your father and prevented you from having a relationship with your father for 20 years.
00:30:11Yeah.
00:30:12What the fuck, man?
00:30:13Seriously, what the fuck?
00:30:16Yeah.
00:30:17Well, as I tell her about my biological father and this whole story, she then goes into a story about her own sexual misadventures, which I just did not understand.
00:30:31She was crying that, oh, how could you never tell me about, you know, this big thing's happened to you about your father, but you don't think to tell me first.
00:30:39Instead, you think once you talk to my uncle.
00:30:42Wait, I'm sorry, I'm lost again.
00:30:43I don't know what we were talking about.
00:30:45So you're telling your girlfriend about your mother's paternity fraud, right?
00:30:49Yeah.
00:30:50And then she says about her own sexual misadventures, and I don't know what those were that spiraled off of me into, I don't know what's following.
00:30:58Sure.
00:30:59No, she started talking about how her own sexual adventures at university, about several guys that she'd slept with.
00:31:09Sorry, what does that have to do with your mother's paternity fraud?
00:31:13I have no idea.
00:31:14Well, in terms of her reaction, I didn't see the link.
00:31:17She just jumped into the story.
00:31:20Okay.
00:31:21But, yeah.
00:31:22Oh, I get it.
00:31:24So your mother slept around with various men.
00:31:27You shouldn't judge her because you're with me, and I've slept around with various men.
00:31:32I can see that way, yeah.
00:31:33Okay, I got it.
00:31:34So she's making it about her, and guarding her relationship with you, and having you not judge her.
00:31:39And so she's saying, well, if you're willing to accept me, then you have to accept your mother.
00:31:45So she's using your mother's misbehavior as a way of cementing your commitment to her.
00:31:53I can see that, yeah.
00:31:54That makes sense.
00:31:56Hmm.
00:32:02Yeah, no.
00:32:03And you didn't sit there and say, oh my god, I'm dating someone like my mom.
00:32:07She makes it about her, she's manipulative, she shows no moral backbone, no moral fiber.
00:32:12How long have you been listening to what I do?
00:32:15I've been listening to you for about two years now.
00:32:17Okay.
00:32:18Yeah.
00:32:19Got it.
00:32:21Um, no, I think, I guess I was caught in a fog.
00:32:25I thought my mom was a victim, you know, poor her, this is...
00:32:30Oh, because the man she chose to be with was violent.
00:32:35Yeah, yeah.
00:32:36The man she slept with for two decades, almost, and gave a child to, she's just a victim.
00:32:43Yeah.
00:32:44Okay.
00:32:45So, I mean, you have a survival mechanism, which is to absolve your mother of responsibility.
00:32:51Because if you give your mother responsibility, what happens?
00:32:58Well, I can't give her any responsibility, otherwise she leaves, she's distant, or she abandons me, I think.
00:33:05Yeah, so she explodes in rage and threatens abandonment or whatever it is, right?
00:33:09So you cannot give your mother moral responsibility or responsibility for her life.
00:33:13So, you're roped into, and really held at almost gunpoint, you're roped into the story, I'm always the victim.
00:33:21And if you ever say to your mother, you're not a victim, you've made choices, she will explode in rage, right?
00:33:27Yeah.
00:33:28Okay.
00:33:29So, you have difficulty holding women accountable for their morals, because your mother would threaten to abandon you or punish you,
00:33:35or, you know, you would experience a death threat, in a sense, from your mother, if you held her accountable.
00:33:41Yeah.
00:33:42Okay, got it.
00:33:44So, why did things end with your girlfriend?
00:33:49I started pulling away as I just started seeing weird behaviors.
00:33:55It started, you know, with her going on about her sexual adventures, you know, as I'm trying to tell her about my father.
00:34:02And then, almost a struggle session with me and her, when a friend had come over, her just complaining about me,
00:34:08and all my faults and everything else, and I had to sit there and take it.
00:34:13Why did you have to sit there and take it?
00:34:16Oh, are you playing a victim to me now, too?
00:34:19No, no, no.
00:34:21Yeah, you are.
00:34:22Okay.
00:34:23Because you say, I had to sit there and take it. Why? Did she have you chained?
00:34:27No, she didn't have me chained.
00:34:28Okay, so why did you have to sit there and take it?
00:34:31I didn't have to sit there, but I thought by staying there and just listening, hearing around, I guess I'm doing what's needed to facilitate the relationship.
00:34:40You're doing what's needed to what?
00:34:43To facilitate the relationship, you know, if I've got flaws and she wants to verbalize in this way, then I guess I'll let me listen.
00:34:51And what did she consider to be your flaws?
00:34:54Ah, well, you know, he rolls in bed and he bumps me and, well, this was it.
00:35:01She had a list of like 15, one of them was bumping into me.
00:35:06Sorry, she had a list of 15 of your flaws?
00:35:0915 flaws, yeah.
00:35:11Okay.
00:35:12That was one of them.
00:35:14Sorry, you bumped her while you were sleeping?
00:35:16Yep.
00:35:17Okay.
00:35:18And she said, brings about trauma for her.
00:35:23And so she was like, well, I can't sleep after he does that.
00:35:27It's awful.
00:35:28And he, you know, it's a constant thing with him.
00:35:30Another one was, well, me not wanting to meet her friends.
00:35:39I'd overslept sometimes when her friends come over.
00:35:42And so that was also, you know, something that really aggravated her.
00:35:48The fact that I wasn't there for a friend.
00:35:50How pretty was it still?
00:35:52Ooh, not very.
00:35:55Really?
00:35:56You're going through a 15-point emasculating, testosterone-busting,
00:36:00ball-breaking struggle session for a woman who's not even pretty?
00:36:06No, no.
00:36:08In what way is she not pretty?
00:36:10Overweight.
00:36:11And just with how she presented herself, just not very.
00:36:19Okay.
00:36:20And was your mother attractive when she was younger?
00:36:26From the pictures that I've seen, yeah, she looked fairly good.
00:36:30Okay.
00:36:31Yeah.
00:36:32And do you have anything that you consider makes yourself
00:36:35particularly physically unattractive?
00:36:37Well, I think with me, it's just a case of, I just have extremely low self-esteem.
00:36:46I, you know, think she was, I just took her for what she was.
00:36:52She asked me out and I just thought, yeah, you know what,
00:36:54what are my options really?
00:36:56Sorry, the ugly girl asked you out and you went along with it?
00:37:00Essentially, yeah.
00:37:02That's what happened.
00:37:04Essentially, yeah.
00:37:06That's what happened.
00:37:07Okay.
00:37:08Yeah.
00:37:11And what do you mean when you say that you have low self-esteem?
00:37:14I don't know what that means.
00:37:15I mean, I know what the phrase means.
00:37:16I just never quite understand what it means in any practical sense.
00:37:20Sure.
00:37:21Well, in terms of like dating prospects, I just,
00:37:24I don't feel that I have any value in that.
00:37:28Well, I'm sorry, why would you think that you do?
00:37:31I'm not trying to poke your insecurities here.
00:37:34I'm just like, okay, so if you say, well,
00:37:37I don't think I have much sexual market value or dating market value.
00:37:41Is that wrong?
00:37:44My friends tell me that's wrong.
00:37:47They tell me that.
00:37:48No, I'm not asking your friends.
00:37:50I'm asking you.
00:37:51Sure.
00:37:52No, I feel that.
00:37:53I think, I think that's wrong.
00:37:55Okay.
00:37:56And why is it?
00:37:57Well, I've worked hard.
00:37:59I've got a good job.
00:38:00I've got my own house.
00:38:01I keep in shape.
00:38:03I, you know, I look after myself, essentially.
00:38:08And I feel, I feel that doesn't quite jive with how I feel about myself inside.
00:38:13As a result, that's what led to me being in that relationship, I feel.
00:38:19Okay.
00:38:21Let's run a real quick scenario here.
00:38:24Sure.
00:38:25What do you think is the prettiest female name?
00:38:29Ooh, Chloe.
00:38:31Chloe.
00:38:32Very nice name.
00:38:33Okay.
00:38:34So, Chloe, you meet Chloe at a park, and you start chatting, and Chloe is intelligent,
00:38:42moral, insightful, incisive, direct, a great woman.
00:38:48And she has a great family that love her, support her, raise her peacefully, and so on.
00:38:53Right?
00:38:54Mm-hmm.
00:38:55And then you go on a couple of dates with Chloe, and she says, yeah, I'd love to meet your family.
00:39:02When can we facilitate that?
00:39:04Because, you know, I'm not just dating you, I'm dating a whole family.
00:39:07Right?
00:39:08I mean, I want to make sure, obviously, that I like your family.
00:39:11I want to make sure that they're going to be good.
00:39:15If we end up getting married and having kids, that they'll be good, productive, positive,
00:39:18healthy people to have around our kids.
00:39:22And so, you know, can we do that over the next day or two?
00:39:26Mm-hmm.
00:39:28Well, I'll push back.
00:39:31I'll push back quite a bit and try and, I guess, discuss my family.
00:39:36And what would you say?
00:39:37I mean, just briefly, what would you say?
00:39:42I would say that, you know, there's a girl that's interested in meeting you guys, but
00:39:47I would like to sort of see where things go first before…
00:39:50No, no.
00:39:51What would you say to…
00:39:52Sorry.
00:39:53What would you say to Chloe?
00:39:54You said you'd push back on Chloe, saying she wants to meet your family.
00:39:56What would you say to Chloe, in the moment?
00:39:58No, I'd say to her, no, that's great, you know, that you want to meet my family.
00:40:02I'll have a word with them and we'll try and see if we can arrange a date.
00:40:06But with that, I guess I'll delay.
00:40:09Okay, so you'd lie?
00:40:11Yeah, I'd lie.
00:40:12You'd lie to her?
00:40:14Yeah.
00:40:15Why?
00:40:18Because I think if anyone from the outside world just has a glimpse of, I guess, our
00:40:24family, it's very clear to see where things are going wrong.
00:40:28It's hard to lie.
00:40:29Okay, but Chloe, as I said, she's smart, she's insightful, so she knows you're lying.
00:40:34Yeah.
00:40:35Alright, so let's play this out.
00:40:36So then Chloe says to you, hang on, there's something odd about this.
00:40:39What are you not telling me?
00:40:42What would you say?
00:40:46Then I'll tell her the truth and say, my relationship with my mum and my family is rather tense
00:40:53at the moment, and so I just want to make sure that...
00:40:57Sorry, at the moment?
00:40:58For how long has it been tense?
00:41:03It's been tense for a while.
00:41:07Okay, how long has it stopped being so vague?
00:41:09You say at the moment, then it goes for a while.
00:41:11What does that mean?
00:41:12A month, a week, a year, ten years?
00:41:14When did you last have a great relationship with your parents?
00:41:18This is going back to childhood.
00:41:20I haven't had a proper positive relationship with them.
00:41:24Only in the past five years or so.
00:41:27I guess once I stepped out of my depression, I sort of tried to...
00:41:30Sorry, you've got to slow down here.
00:41:32Ah, sorry.
00:41:33Okay.
00:41:34I'm talking to you as Chloe, right?
00:41:36So she would say, I don't feel comfortable with this lying.
00:41:41Right, so first you tried to say, you want to meet my family?
00:41:44Great.
00:41:45And I get that you were lying.
00:41:47And then I said, what are you not telling me?
00:41:49You said, well, things are a bit tense at the moment.
00:41:51And then you go for a while, and then you go, it's never been good.
00:41:56Yeah.
00:41:57So here's what I need you to do.
00:41:59I need you to stop fucking lying to me.
00:42:01Mm-hmm.
00:42:03Okay?
00:42:04Because you're a great guy.
00:42:06I'm interested in you.
00:42:09But I will not stay if you lie.
00:42:13Right.
00:42:14That may work with your family.
00:42:15That may be how you were raised, which I sympathize with.
00:42:17I really do.
00:42:20But I don't know what benefit you're trying to get out of lying to me.
00:42:25I mean, you want me to be an intelligent, perceptive woman, right?
00:42:28So you appreciate my directness, my honesty.
00:42:31I hope that I have a decent amount of character and virtue.
00:42:34So I'm trying to figure out what you're hoping to gain by giving yourself
00:42:39permission to lie through your teeth about things to me.
00:42:44That's not very honorable, is it?
00:42:47No, it's not.
00:42:48So what's wrong with just telling the truth?
00:42:51I mean, I guess it's bad, but I'm not going to blame you for your family
00:42:56when you were a kid, right?
00:42:57I mean, we don't choose where we're born, right?
00:43:02No.
00:43:03So just tell me.
00:43:06I mean, this drip-drip stuff where I've got to be alert and catch you in lies,
00:43:10I mean, it's all very Weasley, right?
00:43:12It is.
00:43:14But I guess in seeing the flaws in my family, you see just how terrible I am as well.
00:43:20And I guess if I can sort of paint a pretty picture, maybe things will go a bit better
00:43:26rather than me sort of coming out with the ugly truth of just how we are.
00:43:30So you think that by lying, you're going to look better to me?
00:43:35Oh, no.
00:43:37No, tell me how that makes sense.
00:43:39By trying to fool me and lie about some very essential topics in your life,
00:43:44which are going to come out.
00:43:45Like, you understand.
00:43:46It's all going to come out, right?
00:43:49No, you can't hide.
00:43:51So you think that you're going to make yourself look better by clearly and
00:43:57obviously lying and misrepresenting everything to me?
00:44:02I don't understand the theory.
00:44:04I don't get what the thinking is here.
00:44:08I guess having presented it to myself, though, I think it's just something that I've done.
00:44:15And I hadn't put much thought into it.
00:44:18No, you have put thought into it.
00:44:20Again, stop lying.
00:44:22You have put thought into it because you just said,
00:44:24I want to make myself better by making my family look better.
00:44:27So that's a theory.
00:44:28You have put some thought into it, right?
00:44:30I have.
00:44:31Okay.
00:44:33But you don't look better by lying to me, right?
00:44:36No.
00:44:37In fact, I think I look way worse rather than just telling the truth.
00:44:41And look, I sympathize.
00:44:43I happen to have been raised in a pretty good, honest, decent family.
00:44:48So I know that that's not the case for a lot of people.
00:44:50So I don't blame you for this or for these habits.
00:44:54I'm just not sure that you're even aware of this.
00:45:01We all make mistakes.
00:45:02We all slip up.
00:45:03We all embellish the truth from time to time.
00:45:05We all can lie from time to time.
00:45:07I'm certainly not perfect.
00:45:09But I do try and have that awareness.
00:45:11Yeah.
00:45:12And if you'd said to me, when you ask about my family, I feel really anxious,
00:45:17and I really don't want to tell you what's going on.
00:45:19Okay.
00:45:20I can accept that, right?
00:45:22Mm-hmm.
00:45:23But you just kind of blithely, like, so easily just skate in the direct opposite of the truth
00:45:29with, like, no friction whatsoever.
00:45:30That's a little chilling, right?
00:45:32Like, do you know that you're lying to me?
00:45:35I mean, are you just in some sort of blind survival mode and just, like, I don't know,
00:45:40like some octopus squirting out ink, you're just doing your thing?
00:45:46I'll call the octopus.
00:45:48It's an automatic process, right?
00:45:50It's automated.
00:45:51Okay.
00:45:52So this is like self-knowledge 101, right?
00:45:54So if lying about your family to me doesn't serve you, it must serve someone,
00:46:04because we don't act randomly, right?
00:46:06I mean, if I'm going to an ice cream shop, I lose money, but I gain an ice cream, right?
00:46:12So I'm not acting randomly.
00:46:14And they obviously want my money more than they want their ice cream.
00:46:17I want their ice cream more than I want my money.
00:46:19So it benefits, right?
00:46:21Someone has to benefit from your actions.
00:46:23Otherwise, life wouldn't really make any sense, right?
00:46:26Yeah.
00:46:27So if you don't benefit, and I don't benefit, and our relationship doesn't benefit
00:46:31from you lying about your family, who does?
00:46:35Say my parents.
00:46:36Right.
00:46:37Right.
00:46:38So how do they benefit from you lying to me about your family?
00:46:43Because through me lying, it stops people from coming in to see what's going on.
00:46:52Right.
00:46:53So it will drive me away, and then your parents' morality and hold over you remain unexamined,
00:46:58and you end up without an ally, right?
00:47:00Yeah.
00:47:01So you end up being still controlled and bullied and manipulated by them,
00:47:07because I wouldn't stick around for a lot of lying, right?
00:47:10Yeah.
00:47:11Right.
00:47:12So you're in the fork in the road, right?
00:47:14I mean, you're not a kid anymore, and you're in the fork in the road,
00:47:18which is you choose mommy or wifey, right?
00:47:20Who you're loyal to, mommy or wifey.
00:47:23To your past, to that which was not chosen, to that which was negative for you,
00:47:27or to that which you can choose, which is the future, which is positive for you.
00:47:31Now my concern is that you immediately slipped into loyalty to mommy,
00:47:35which means you're not able to make a commitment to me.
00:47:39Right.
00:47:40Because if you make a commitment to me, then the commitment is to tell the truth, right?
00:47:44Or if you lie, to at least notice it and say,
00:47:47oh, you know, hang on, I think I'm going off in the wrong direction here.
00:47:50Like to have that level of self-knowledge.
00:47:52But if you immediately cleave to your mother, you cannot cleave to your wife.
00:47:56Does that make sense?
00:47:57Makes sense.
00:47:58If you have foundational automatic loyalty to your mother,
00:48:03then you cannot have a pair bond with your wife.
00:48:09Right.
00:48:11Because in a conflict between me and your mother, you choose who.
00:48:18I'll go with my mother.
00:48:19That's right.
00:48:20That's right.
00:48:21And you don't even seem to be aware of it.
00:48:23My interests as a good woman get sacrificed for the narcissistic needs of your mother,
00:48:29if we can use that term.
00:48:33So the good is sacrificed to the bad, the healthy is sacrificed to the sick,
00:48:38the voluntary is sacrificed to the control, the future is sacrificed for the past,
00:48:43which means that you'll be okay with me unless mommy has a problem with me,
00:48:49and then you'll run over to mommy and leave me alone, right?
00:48:54Right.
00:48:57So that's your fork in the road.
00:49:00Wow.
00:49:02Now, so I think that's what a good, honest, direct woman would say, right?
00:49:06Mm-hmm, yeah.
00:49:08So when you say, I have low self-esteem, what are you actually saying?
00:49:12You're saying that you clearly signal to a woman that you'll choose
00:49:16a dysfunctional mother over a healthy wife.
00:49:20Oh, gosh, yeah.
00:49:21No, but so how are you wrong in saying I have low sexual market value?
00:49:25What honest, decent, moral woman would want that?
00:49:29And I'm not trying to be harsh or negative or say that you're a bad guy,
00:49:32I'm just saying, well, you talk about having low self-esteem like it's some made-up thing.
00:49:39But if you cleave to your dysfunctional mother at the expense of your functional girlfriend,
00:49:44you do have low sexual market value.
00:49:46It's not a myth.
00:49:47It's not an, oh, my, I just have to think better of myself.
00:49:50It's like, no, you have to act better.
00:49:53Yeah.
00:49:58That's coming from a different angle, because I'd always, when I would say low self-esteem,
00:50:03it was always from when I did try to go out and date, my mom would make comments about how I looked.
00:50:10It would be, you know, you're so skinny, you're scrawny, what sort of girl would want you,
00:50:15or your face, have you seen it?
00:50:17You know, who's going to want that?
00:50:19It was those comments, and that would play on my mind whenever I would try to approach her.
00:50:24Okay, so that is having loyalty to your mother.
00:50:29Right.
00:50:30Because that's so clearly dysfunctional and screwed up.
00:50:34Mm-hmm.
00:50:35Right?
00:50:36Yeah.
00:50:37That's so clear, like to insult your son's appearance.
00:50:40And it's not like, you know, whether you're thin or like, I don't know, she says you have bad hair,
00:50:46or you're too short, or, you know, you're too skinny or whatever.
00:50:49Okay, maybe you can exercise a bit to gain some weight or whatever.
00:50:51But, you know, a lot of that stuff is outside your control.
00:50:53If you were overweight, that would be one thing, although mockery wouldn't be the way to achieve it,
00:50:57but you could lose some weight, and maybe you could.
00:50:59But I think you said you exercise, you take care of yourself, right?
00:51:02Yeah.
00:51:03Okay.
00:51:04So if you exercise and take care of yourself, you look how you look, right?
00:51:08Mm-hmm.
00:51:09Right?
00:51:10I mean, I exercise and take care of myself, but, you know, I'm still a bit jowly because I'm in my late 50s,
00:51:15and I'm a bit thick-waisted because that's the way I've always been.
00:51:19And what else?
00:51:20I'm bald, right?
00:51:21I'm still bald, right?
00:51:22Right.
00:51:23So that's not – I can't – I mean, I guess I could lose a little bit of weight,
00:51:25although I'm still continuing to lose weight in my 50s, but –
00:51:29So that is so clearly dysfunctional that for you to cleave to your mother and say,
00:51:38oh, maybe she's right, and that does mess with my head, that's having loyalty to your mother.
00:51:42Mm-hmm.
00:51:43True.
00:51:44And that's what's been modeled by your whole family is to have loyalty to your mother.
00:51:49Yeah.
00:51:50So when you say, well, I have trouble getting a quality woman because I have low self-esteem,
00:51:56that's saying that, well, it's just this mysterious being negative on yourself that's the problem.
00:52:01But the problem is not that you think badly of your appearance.
00:52:05The problem is you think badly of your appearance because your mother said so,
00:52:08and she's screwed up beyond words.
00:52:11So the fact that you give your mother credibility is the low self-esteem,
00:52:16not what your mother says, but that you give a shit about what this crazy woman says.
00:52:24Right.
00:52:30That signals to a woman, if you're a reasonably attractive guy, where would you put yourself on one to ten?
00:52:40A six.
00:52:41A six.
00:52:42A six.
00:52:43Okay, so if you're relatively slender and you work out, what is dragging down your number?
00:52:49I don't believe I could be any higher.
00:52:51No, no, come on.
00:52:52I'm talking about your physical appearance.
00:52:53I'm not talking about your selective internal blah, blah, blah.
00:52:56Sure, sure.
00:52:58I'd say about an eight.
00:52:59An eight, okay.
00:53:00About an eight, yeah.
00:53:01Okay.
00:53:02So you're in the top 20% of men.
00:53:04Mm-hmm.
00:53:05And so a woman, if you are physically insecure despite being attractive, right, 80% is like an A, right, or an A-minus or whatever.
00:53:15It's pretty high up there, right?
00:53:17Yeah.
00:53:18So a woman, if you have insecurity regarding your appearance when you are, in fact, an attractive, if not very attractive man,
00:53:3180% is a good grade, and eight is somewhere between eight and nine, so even if we put you at eight and a half or whatever, 80%, 85%.
00:53:39So if a woman looks at you and you are an attractive guy, but you think you're an unattractive guy,
00:53:46she knows immediately that you have loyalty to someone who's hostile to your interests and happiness.
00:53:53Right.
00:53:56And so that is a signal that you will cleave to that which is destructive to you rather than assess it rationally,
00:54:03which means that she will always play second or third fiddle to whoever has attacked you.
00:54:09And a woman cannot trust you if you cleave to people who are harmful to you.
00:54:17She needs you to cleave to her to protect her, which means also to protect yourself,
00:54:22because you can't be a protector and a provider if you are a puppet on the string of people who wish you harm.
00:54:32Right.
00:54:36A woman cannot fall in love with slave boy.
00:54:41Oh gosh, yeah.
00:54:43Right?
00:54:44Yeah.
00:54:47A moral woman, whoever finds the fuck out that you're still hanging around people who are half pimping out your half-sister,
00:54:55she will run for the fucking hills, I'm not kidding you, in any way, shape or form.
00:55:00Yeah.
00:55:02So that's your choice.
00:55:09Well, it's true that my mother is dating a guy who creeped on my 18-year-old sister,
00:55:13and my whole family says, yeah, give her what she wants, that's totally fine.
00:55:18Want to go get some kebabs?
00:55:22No, seriously.
00:55:24Wouldn't work.
00:55:25Well, it's not low self-esteem, it's an accurate assessment of where your loyalties are.
00:55:29And I say this with sympathy, I really do, I'm not trying to put you down or make you feel bad,
00:55:34I'm just saying it's not some magical Jedi mind trick that's going to raise your self-esteem,
00:55:39it's not having really fucked up people in your life that's going to raise your dating market value to a healthy woman.
00:55:46I mean, unhealthy women, right, like your ex-girlfriend, how long ago did you break up?
00:55:52A couple of months ago.
00:55:54Okay.
00:55:55So, how did your ex-girlfriend know that you were going to sit for this bullshit Maoist struggle session of 15 points that are shitty about you?
00:56:02How did she know you weren't just going to laugh at her and go take a long walk off a short pier and get the hell out?
00:56:08How did she know you were going to sit there and take it?
00:56:11I think she sniffed it out.
00:56:13Of course she did.
00:56:14Yeah.
00:56:15Yeah, because you take your mom's attack on your appearance, you take your mom's control,
00:56:22you're still hanging around with the mom who stole your dad from you!
00:56:27She stole your father from you!
00:56:31The guy who might have cared about you more, the guy who might have taken custody,
00:56:35the guy who probably was more functional than the raging alcoholic.
00:56:40She stole from you your patrilineage, your father, your protector,
00:56:49for the sake of money and sick companionship.
00:56:55You never had a father because of your mother.
00:57:02100%.
00:57:07It's so strange that I wouldn't let myself get angry at her.
00:57:11No, it's not strange because if you don't have a choice in a relationship,
00:57:16you don't have a choice about what you feel in that relationship.
00:57:20Right.
00:57:21Right?
00:57:22So feelings, anger is about choice.
00:57:24Anger is, can it help?
00:57:29Does anger help, right?
00:57:31Mm-hmm.
00:57:38Now, if you say, well, you know, I've got to have a relationship with my mother,
00:57:43I have to, it's an absolute, it's like gravity.
00:57:46Well, getting angry about the inevitable is a sign of immaturity, right?
00:57:50Am I angry that I'm aging?
00:57:52I am not.
00:57:53I'm thrilled that I'm aging because I had cancer ten years ago
00:57:56and it's all a bonus from here, right?
00:57:59Right.
00:58:00So I'm not angry that I'm aging because the alternative is infinitely worse.
00:58:05So would I get angry about aging?
00:58:07Well, no.
00:58:08I mean, it doesn't mean I won't act about it.
00:58:10It doesn't mean I won't exercise and eat well and maintain a healthy weight.
00:58:13I'll do all of that stuff for sure, but I'm not going to get angry about aging.
00:58:19And so if you view your relationship with your mother as an absolute,
00:58:25then anger is pointless.
00:58:31It would be like me waking up every morning and punching the mirror
00:58:34because I was a little grayer, a little saggier, and a little more wrinkled, right?
00:58:39Yeah.
00:58:40Enraged.
00:58:41That would be the actions of a crazy person, right?
00:58:43Yeah.
00:58:45So if you view your relationship with your mother as a foundational absolute
00:58:49within which you have no choice, then anger would be completely pointless.
00:58:57Do I get angry at gravity?
00:58:59No.
00:59:01It's a fact.
00:59:02It's a factor.
00:59:03It's a reality.
00:59:09That's true.
00:59:10It's that old phrase, it is what it is.
00:59:13Yeah, yeah.
00:59:14It is what it is.
00:59:15So yeah.
00:59:16I mean, it is a fact.
00:59:17It's like an epistemological emotional statement.
00:59:19Aging is what it is.
00:59:21There's no alternative to aging other than dying.
00:59:24Yeah.
00:59:26And I prefer aging to dying, and aging is, you know, it's funny,
00:59:29you look at people who are like bent over, they're 90 or whatever,
00:59:32these are the most successful human beings around.
00:59:37Would have lived to that age.
00:59:39Yeah, yeah.
00:59:40I mean, they've succeeded.
00:59:41They've lived, that's the most, you say, in terms of physicality, yeah, they've.
00:59:45Yeah.
00:59:46Right, so how could you get angry at something that isn't absolute?
00:59:53It's futile.
00:59:54Can you imagine a woman being enraged that she gets a period?
00:59:59Yeah, no.
01:00:01Just wouldn't work.
01:00:02Well, I mean, it would just be a sign of like crazy immaturity, right?
01:00:06Yeah.
01:00:11So if you don't have a choice with regards to your mother,
01:00:14then you won't have any genuine emotions regarding your mother,
01:00:17because you will always view those emotions as irrational, and foolish,
01:00:21and immature.
01:00:26So then a woman who wants to pair bond with you and you have a dysfunctional
01:00:30mother needs to know that you can get angry at your mother,
01:00:33because that's the only way your relationship with your girlfriend or wife
01:00:36is going to be protected from your mother's intrusion.
01:00:42Right.
01:00:44But getting angry at my mother or trying to get her to change in any way...
01:00:47No, no, hang on, no, no.
01:00:49Getting angry at your mother does not mean trying to get her to change.
01:00:54Right.
01:00:58I guess I can't save her, then.
01:01:00If I'm at some cabin, right, with my family, and a bear breaks in through the
01:01:08window, right?
01:01:11And like when I worked up north, we had shotguns, because there were bears
01:01:15and wolves, right?
01:01:18Well, yeah.
01:01:19So if a bear, and I had this happen, right?
01:01:22We had a camp dog, and the camp dog was attacked by a bear.
01:01:25It broke the dog's spine, and it was creeping up on the tent.
01:01:29I had to load up the shotgun, go out with a flashlight,
01:01:33holler in my underpants, and point a gun.
01:01:36Am I doing that to change the bear?
01:01:39No.
01:01:40No, just to protect myself.
01:01:41I'm not going to try and talk the bear into becoming a vegetarian.
01:01:45No.
01:01:46Right?
01:01:47Yeah.
01:01:53So getting angry, having the fight-or-flight mechanism,
01:01:57is about getting to safety, about establishing a situation of safety.
01:02:02It does not mean changing others, necessarily.
01:02:06It could.
01:02:07It could, right?
01:02:10You know, if my friend is working, and I see a bear creeping up behind him
01:02:15in the bush, I will say, hey, bear, right?
01:02:18And then we'll get to the shotgun, and we'll, you know, try to protect
01:02:21ourselves as much as possible, and so on.
01:02:23So I want him to change his behavior, but I'm still not,
01:02:27the bear's not going to change.
01:02:29And, in fact, if I try to reason with the bear,
01:02:31I'm putting myself in more danger, right?
01:02:34Yeah.
01:02:36If I try to pet the bear, oh, easy, easy, big boy, easy,
01:02:39heel, sit, roll over, right?
01:02:42I'm just going to get my scalp chewed off.
01:02:44Yeah.
01:02:45So knowing when you can change someone, and knowing when the only security
01:02:49is distance, is pretty essential, right?
01:02:51It is.
01:02:54I mean, the ancestors who tamed dogs and cats, sorry,
01:02:58who tamed wild cats and wolves into dogs and cats,
01:03:01did us an enormous benefit, right?
01:03:04Mm-hmm.
01:03:05Kept the grain safe, kept the sheep herded and all kinds of goods,
01:03:07kept the predators away, all kinds of good stuff, right?
01:03:10Yeah.
01:03:11And so they tamed, which was good, but if you're out in the woods,
01:03:16and a pack of wolves comes around, you get the hell out of there,
01:03:19or you climb a tree, but you sure as hell don't try to tame them
01:03:22and turn them into chihuahuas, right?
01:03:26No.
01:03:27No, it would never work.
01:03:29Right.
01:03:30So anger is about establishing boundaries and securing safety.
01:03:38Mm-hmm.
01:03:39So if the bear is chasing me, and I get into the cabin,
01:03:41which is a strong cabin, and I lock the doors and windows, I'm safe.
01:03:50Because I have boundaries called the walls of the house, right,
01:03:52the walls of the cabin.
01:03:53Does that make sense?
01:03:54Yeah.
01:03:55If I'm in a tent, I'm not safe because the bear can just rip through the tent, right?
01:03:59Yeah.
01:04:02I've sat in tents with a shotgun across my lap as a bear is prowling around,
01:04:06hoping I won't have to shoot it.
01:04:10So the fight or flight there, the anger, that may be about changing the person,
01:04:16but you've already been trying that for five years.
01:04:18That's why I asked you that earlier, right?
01:04:20Right.
01:04:22So you've been trying to talk the bear into becoming a vegetarian for five years,
01:04:26and it's more flesh-hungry now than before, right?
01:04:32Right, yeah.
01:04:37So that's not working.
01:04:41So fight ain't working because you can't win against your mother,
01:04:44and you tried to go for allies, right?
01:04:46You're like that guy in High Noon, the Gary Cooper character, right?
01:04:49Bad guys are coming to town.
01:04:50Who wants to help?
01:04:52So you're saying, okay, well, I want to fight to have better behavior from my mother,
01:04:56so I'll go to the family for allies, and they're all like, nope, not helping.
01:05:00She's fine.
01:05:01So if the fight doesn't work, what is left?
01:05:05Flight.
01:05:06That's right.
01:05:09If there's some beast in the wilderness, or we all had this as kids, you know,
01:05:13like sometimes you were told if there's an aggressive dog,
01:05:15you just run at it screaming, and hopefully it'll run away.
01:05:18Okay, so you run at it screaming, and the dog growls and runs at you.
01:05:21What do you do?
01:05:22You turn around.
01:05:23You run the other way.
01:05:24You climb a tree.
01:05:25You climb a fence.
01:05:26You run, right?
01:05:28So you have tried to fight.
01:05:32It's not working.
01:05:34What is left?
01:05:35Well, if you don't feel any anger, you're just going to sit there like a piece of
01:05:39pudding and take it.
01:05:43Like you had to as a kid.
01:05:45Like you had to as a kid, but you don't have to as an adult.
01:05:49Is any decent, moral, intelligent, perceptive woman going to want to marry into
01:05:54your family?
01:05:56No.
01:05:57No.
01:05:59So that's the price.
01:06:07The price is solitude or shitty, naggy girlfriends who take the reins
01:06:14installed by your mother and whip you further.
01:06:21Forever and ever, amen.
01:06:25And God forbid you get one of these women pregnant, and then you're lashed to
01:06:30some unholy witch for 20-plus years as your kids look at you as a ball-less,
01:06:36spineless cuck and have no respect at all.
01:06:40And that's the prison you're heading towards.
01:06:42I'm telling you, that's the prison you're heading towards.
01:06:44Some woman is going to break your balls and then drain them and become a mom,
01:06:48and then you're trapped.
01:06:50There's the dice you're rolling with.
01:06:52Oh, no, I'm on the pill.
01:06:53Don't worry.
01:06:54I can't get pregnant.
01:06:55I'm on the pill.
01:06:56I've got an IUD, and everything's fine.
01:06:59Oh, wow, I got pregnant.
01:07:05Yeah, happened actually to a family member who's in that situation right now.
01:07:11Right.
01:07:12Yeah, so I think I can fall into that very easily if I'm not careful.
01:07:17Well, no, you're not careful.
01:07:19Yeah.
01:07:20Right?
01:07:21Yeah.
01:07:23You're not careful.
01:07:29Or you get an STD, which, you know, some of them stick around for the rest of
01:07:34your life, right?
01:07:36Yeah.
01:07:38Or you get a stalker.
01:07:40Or you get a woman who's got a dangerous ex-boyfriend, I guess, like your
01:07:44stepdad, right?
01:07:46Yeah.
01:07:47And then you're in serious shit.
01:07:53Or you get depressed again, right?
01:07:56Yep.
01:07:57So.
01:08:01I see.
01:08:02You've been given this great gift.
01:08:07You've been given this great gift.
01:08:09Nobody's lying to you, right?
01:08:11Mm-hmm.
01:08:12They're all telling you exactly who they are, which your mother's boyfriend
01:08:17identified, and you refuse to believe.
01:08:22He's saying, I own them, not you.
01:08:25They'll do what I want, not you.
01:08:28They serve evil, not virtue.
01:08:38They serve my master, not your morals.
01:08:44I can't think of anything more liberating myself.
01:08:50Well, there's a freedom in that.
01:08:52Freedom.
01:08:53Did anyone ever tell you that your girlfriend was kind of a bitch?
01:08:58Not at first, no.
01:09:00Until they saw her behavior.
01:09:02Okay.
01:09:03And then they did say, she's bad for you, you should break up.
01:09:06Yes, yeah.
01:09:07Okay.
01:09:08And did you listen?
01:09:10I didn't.
01:09:11I thought, again, like with my mother.
01:09:13Okay, so even when they give you good advice, the relationship is so
01:09:16dysfunctional that you don't listen.
01:09:18Yes, yeah.
01:09:20Well, choose your companions, choose your future.
01:09:25There's no escape from that.
01:09:26That is a law of physics.
01:09:28Choose your companions, you choose your future.
01:09:34It's funny, you know, you think you know all these ideas, but I guess it's
01:09:37until it sort of visits you, and you have to wrestle with that.
01:09:41You have to have that strength to actually make that step or change.
01:09:47But I think that's what I'm faced with.
01:09:50I have to make that step and think about me rather than, you know,
01:09:54serving my mother or my wider family.
01:09:57It's me at the end of the day.
01:09:58Well, and, you know, I mean, your half-sister is someone who probably
01:10:03would benefit enormously from some protection and compassion.
01:10:07Yeah.
01:10:09But I wouldn't sacrifice my future even for her.
01:10:15Because she is not a chosen relationship.
01:10:18Now, again, do whatever good you can, but if she's going to drag you down,
01:10:26I mean, sorry, you have a responsibility to virtue, integrity,
01:10:29and your future, and in particular your children.
01:10:32And I'm not saying she is, but let's say she's just a messed-up person,
01:10:36does a whole bunch of drugs, and, like, she's an adult now, right?
01:10:39And it's like, okay, well, is that going to interfere with me
01:10:41getting a quality woman?
01:10:42And if so, like, sorry, honey, but I got to think of my future.
01:10:51But it sounds like she's worth putting the effort in.
01:10:55She is.
01:10:57She is.
01:10:58I wouldn't want to condemn her to my faith.
01:11:00No, no, I would strongly suggest putting the effort in,
01:11:03but not from a slave standpoint, but from a judgment standpoint.
01:11:06Yeah, right.
01:11:10All right.
01:11:11Is that a good approach?
01:11:13No, that's a good approach.
01:11:15Thank you so much for this.
01:11:16It's really opened my eyes to just, yeah, know what I need to do
01:11:20to get my life moving.
01:11:22Beautiful.
01:11:23Will you keep me posted about how it's going?
01:11:26I will do, definitely.
01:11:27All right, thanks, brother.
01:11:28I appreciate that.
01:11:29And, again, massive sympathies for your childhood,
01:11:31but a better future is there.
01:11:33All you have to do is choose it.
01:11:35Yeah.
01:11:36All right, thanks, man.
01:11:37All the best.
01:11:38Bye-bye.
01:11:39Bye-bye.