On this episode of the Bob Ryan and Jeff Goodman NBA Podcast, Bob, Jeff, and Gary Tanguay cover all the biggest stories around the NBA. What is going on with Jaylen Brown brown and Jrue Holiday? Should Steph ask to get out of Golden State? Plus, Cade Cunningham, Calipari, and Cooper Flagg. All that, and much more!
0:00 - Celtics article discussion
2:10 - Championship maturity issues
4:19 - Atlanta game mismanagement
6:37 - Tatum's strong performance
10:12 - Holiday
12:58 - Golden State's struggles
16:07 - Team's current reality
18:30 - Potential trade scenarios
20:57 - Greatest shooting family
24:45 - Cade Cunningham's impact
28:34 - Work ethic discussion
30:10 - Media attention concerns
33:20 - Player performance analysis
35:03 - Coaching challenges discussed
37:20 - NIL impact on recruiting
39:09 - Concerns about player contracts
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0:00 - Celtics article discussion
2:10 - Championship maturity issues
4:19 - Atlanta game mismanagement
6:37 - Tatum's strong performance
10:12 - Holiday
12:58 - Golden State's struggles
16:07 - Team's current reality
18:30 - Potential trade scenarios
20:57 - Greatest shooting family
24:45 - Cade Cunningham's impact
28:34 - Work ethic discussion
30:10 - Media attention concerns
33:20 - Player performance analysis
35:03 - Coaching challenges discussed
37:20 - NIL impact on recruiting
39:09 - Concerns about player contracts
CLNS Media is Powered by:
💰 Prize Picks - https://prizepicks.onelink.me/LME0/CLNS
Download the app today and use Code CLNS when you sign up & Get $50 instantly when you play $5!
🎫 Gametime - https://gametime.co
Take the guesswork out of buying NBA tickets with Gametime. Download the Gametime app, create an account, and use code CLNS for $20 off your first purchase. Download Gametime today. Terms apply. What time is it? Gametime!
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SportsTranscript
00:00Hey folks, the big three are here, or at least the big two and a half.
00:23Bob Ryan, Jeff Goodman, Gary Tank, we're brought to you by PrizePix, the exclusive daily fantasy
00:27partner of the CLNS Media Network. Pick more, pick less with PrizePix. All right guys, let's
00:33get to it. There was an article in the Boston Globe, Bob Ryan, regarding the Celtics and
00:39we'll get to their blowout win over Golden State, but Jalen Brown seems to be a little
00:45disoriented or disinterested and Holiday is really in a funk. What do you make of all
00:49of it?
00:51Well, you know, people look at looking at them up close and personal, as opposed to
00:57the rest of us watching them on TV, you can't read the body language, you can't, you don't
01:01know the vibes. Apparently something has been going on, it is going on with Jalen Brown.
01:08He wasn't speaking to the media, which is unusual for a while, but he did go out and
01:13do it yesterday after that win in Golden State. But, you know, I mean, I don't know,
01:20I have to take it at face value. We know he's a complicated guy, we know he is an introspective
01:26guy, we know he fancies himself as an intellectual and he's got a right to do so. And, you know,
01:33his life is not just basketball. I mean, I've said repeatedly since he came around, when
01:39his career is over, his future is going to be somewhere else more than likely, you know,
01:44whether it's politics or business or what, lecturing, I don't know, something. He's a
01:49complicated guy. We just said that's, you know, so that's the case. Now, he did speak
01:55yesterday and talked, addressed the topic of, you know, what's been going on with their
02:00state of affairs and saying all the things you want to hear about, you know, about how
02:05to rectify everything. And so that's that. So that's, you know, that's Jalen Brown. We've
02:11known from the beginning that he's a different breed of cat.
02:15Yes, he is. And, you know, listen, I haven't been around there enough lately to know what's
02:22going on with him or in that locker room. But as I told you guys, I'm not overly concerned
02:29here. I think there's plenty of time to kind of, you know, get the ship right in the right
02:35direction. You know, the loss to Atlanta wasn't great, but, you know, listen, they
02:40beat the crap out of Orlando with Paulo back in the lineup, and they beat the crap out
02:45of Golden State. Does it matter? I mean, does it really matter if they're the number one
02:51seed at the end of the day? Like, okay, let me give you, it's probably a bad comparison,
02:56but let me give you one anyway of Ryan Day and Ohio State football, and they lose to
03:02Michigan, and they're ready to fire the guy. They are legitimately ready to fire him after
03:07another loss to the Michigan Wolverines. And does that matter? No, it doesn't, because
03:12he just won the national title. And the same thing could be true with this Boston Celtics
03:17team where, yeah, they're going to stumble. They're going to stumble. They're not as focused
03:21as they were a year ago, because again, they're not hearing it every day. They're actually
03:25hearing it the other way. Now, how good you are, how you're champion, all that. And that's
03:31a different level of maturity that you've got to handle. And yeah, it's a lot harder
03:37to deal with that now than it was, again, 10, 20, 30 years ago, because everywhere you
03:42look, you see it. Even when you try to hide from it, you know, you go on social media,
03:47you see it. The good and the bad, and mostly good coming out of last year, especially for
03:52Dylan Brown, right? I mean, he was MVP. He was MVP. So everybody's been kissing his ass.
03:58So I think there's an adjustment period to this. They'll figure it out. I think they'll
04:04turn it on at the right time, as long as they're healthy and have a chance to compete for another
04:09title.
04:10You mentioned, well, in this little period, the game that scratched your head was Atlanta.
04:20That was a colossal case study in game mismanagement, period. That game, that was a game, you know,
04:29we speak in hyperbolic terms often about giveaways and this and that. That was a giveaway. That
04:36was a mismanaged end of the game that was certainly not the coming of a championship
04:41team. And the idea that a player as smart and savvy as we've lauded countless times
04:46as Drew Holliday would, you know, commit a dumb foul and do things, lose the ball, that's
04:52not going to happen too often. I mean, I'm going to put that one on the side. I don't
04:55think that has to do with the general topic that we're discussing here at all. So, but
05:02that was a strange game, strange game, and even the blowout loss in Toronto was weird.
05:08But my theory went out the window. That's why I'm so disturbed, gentlemen. It's all
05:12about me. Where, Jeff, I'll start with you in response, that I thought because Jalen
05:20didn't make the Olympic team, I thought because of that snub and I thought because of Tatum
05:24not playing a lot and getting some DNPs that they would come out loaded for bear and just,
05:31you know, torch earth. And I guess I was wrong. Yeah. I mean, I think that's a different deal
05:37than people saying you're not a winner, right? Which is what they were saying a year ago
05:41at this time. Right. You're not a winner. You guys have never won anything. Well, now
05:46they've won. They've won something. They've won the most important thing. Yeah. The Olympic
05:50team was a snub for, for Jalen, but yeah, I think he can justify it in his own mind
05:56certainly by, by not being a Nike guy. And I still go back to guys. And again, I hate
06:04to beat a dead horse here, but I'll keep going back to it. Like Jason Tatum is clearly the
06:10best player on this team. Like I'm tired of the, I'm tired of the Jalen Brown cause he
06:15won MVP. Like again, Jalen Brown does not have to deal with the same things defensively
06:20that Jason Tatum does. Jason Tatum consistently makes people better around him. He deals
06:26with double teams all the time. Jalen Brown does not. I don't know. Again, I just, I don't
06:33know what's going on. I don't think I understand your feeling of redundancy, but I think it
06:37needs to be said because Tatum is playing very well. I mean, he's not the issue. And
06:43this is a guy, in my opinion, because of his defensive rebounding, they want a championship.
06:48So agreed. And I don't know, maybe that's in Jalen Brown's head. Who knows? Bob, what
06:54do you make of Holiday? I'm a little perplexed. I wonder if he's healthy. I wonder if there's
07:00an injury there.
07:03I think that's a very good supposition because he didn't, it's not like he got stupid overnight.
07:08The other night was just crazy. I don't know. I'll just throw that one out. That's never
07:12going to happen again. I don't know what was going through his head at that moment, but
07:15I think that he's not quite the same, although he was very good last night. I'm not panicking
07:23or worried, but yeah, he could be dealing with something.
07:26I think he is.
07:27All right. And he's just stoic in that regard. And by the way, you know, he's been around
07:32a lot longer than you realize, you know. And so we have to think about that as well. I'm
07:37not panicking, but just to back up what you were saying earlier about the start, they
07:42were 16 and three. I think we were all saying, oh, everything's fine. So, you know, it's
07:46a point is that they're, what are they, nine and eight, eight and eight, whatever they
07:49are.
07:50Nine and eight now.
07:51Yeah, nine and eight. Okay. That's the stretch we're talking about. We're not talking about
07:55the first 19 games. We're talking about this phase of the season. You know, I'm not, and
08:00once again, I'm not worried about anything. And I said, I kidded in the next, that I'm
08:06not going to worry until they're down three to one in a playoff series. So when they're
08:10down three to one in a playoff series, we lost them.
08:13Right. And maybe these bad habits continue, right? Maybe they don't make shots consistently.
08:18Maybe last year was a little bit of an outlier. I don't think it was. I mean, again, you look
08:24at these guys and you still say to yourself, who's got in their starting five, the balance
08:31and the fit and the chemistry. And again, you know, the one thing I will go back to
08:36is like, if you look at them individually, they're not great, great shooters. Like we
08:44don't have, and I'm not saying they're Steph Curry's like there's only one Steph, but like
08:48they're not elite elite shooters over the course of their career. Jalen Brown, I actually
08:54thought he'd be shooting 33% for his career from three, which is I think what he's doing
08:59this year.
09:00Um, he's actually been better than that most of his career in the, in the mid to high thirties,
09:04which surprised me. So this is a little bit of a, of a downtick for him this year. You
09:09know, Tatum's streaky. Um, you know, obviously, you know, Derek White has shot the hell out
09:17of it at times. Uh, I just, you know, you wonder sometimes when you're shooting that
09:21many threes, it's gonna, it's gonna run in, in kind of cycles a little bit.
09:25Yeah. I mean, there's no question they became too dependent upon the three. And then when
09:29they tried to go get away from it, um, you know, they've had some struggles, but I think
09:35we all agree that they will be there in the end. But I do want to Jeff, I do want to get
09:39your point about, um, holiday because I appreciate what, you know, something's up and I think
09:47it, of course, we're speculating, but the fact that he may not be a hundred percent
09:53underscores what we talked about last year during the playoffs, how vital he was like
10:00a hundred percent. It's for the casual observer. It's easy to just not consider it, but that
10:08could be a big root for this slope. Yeah. I mean, I think it, it could be helped.
10:13And again, your holidays probably, I mean, he is the most underrated guy on that team,
10:18you know, because again, he does all the right things. Right. So it's almost like,
10:22again, when you brought Derek White and drew holiday to the team and it was first,
10:27it was white and he struggled. And then it was your holiday. It was almost like
10:30all these bad habits that maybe Tatum and Jalen Brown had accumulated over the years.
10:36You couldn't keep doing those things when you're watching Derek White and drew holiday,
10:40like drew holiday had a ring, right? So you had to respect them. He doesn't talk a lot.
10:46So, you know, it's one of those things where if he says something, you, you listen, you listen,
10:52because there's a respect level for drew holiday because of ultimately winning. Like it's always
10:59been about winning and, and, and honestly not being about himself. Those two things are paramount.
11:06And you wonder, right. You just wonder if he's going to start to fall off too, because of age.
11:13We got more coming up. We're going to talk about Golden State, their situation. And Bob has some
11:17numbers on the Brothers Curry. But first I have to tell you, ladies and gentlemen,
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12:57All right, let's get back to it. All right, Golden State, can they fix it? Jeff, can they fix it?
13:07I don't think so. I just don't see it at this point. I mean, you look at it and they're trying
13:11to patchwork this thing together a little bit. You look at their team and
13:19listen, Dennis Schroeder is not going to make the difference here. He's not. He was fine
13:24bringing him in. Andrew Wiggins is a nice fourth option. I like Tracy Jackson Davis,
13:31but I like him when you had Old Clay and Steph together. I don't think they have enough.
13:38I don't think they have enough. I think too much is on Steph Curry at this point, and I think
13:44they're going to be in the big question now becomes like, all right, if you're if you're
13:49Golden State number one and Bob Myers is gone as a GM, so now you got Dunleavy running things.
13:57Do you go to Steph and say at this point, listen, we can trade you and you can finish your career
14:03somewhere else and have a chance to win another championship? Or do you want to finish your career
14:06here? And yeah, we're probably fighting to get into the playoffs every year for the next few
14:12years. I think that's a conversation that maybe has already been had. I don't know, but should be
14:18had. If not, it should be had. You know, that's the respect that you owe a guy like Steph Curry.
14:23Let him make the decision. Let him make it. He's earned it. Look at what you've done in this
14:27organization. And yeah, they're going to take a further step back. But if you if you trade Steph,
14:33maybe you can get something for him to and start to rebuild because I don't think the young guys
14:38are good enough. I really don't. I mean, I think they're OK, but I don't I don't think these guys
14:44are Jonathan Kamenga, for instance. He's fine, but I wouldn't build around him. What do you think,
14:52Bob? Well, I think that to me, the story's been ended. Period. They're not going anywhere. But
15:02the problem is, is that they're in a very weird division in which the number one, the number five
15:08are only separated by the three or four losses. And they may be delusionary enough to think that
15:14they can accomplish something by winning the Pacific Division, which you could. It's not
15:20inconceivable that they could emerge at the top of this. It is very mediocre division. And that's
15:27not really a good thing, frankly. So for them and in terms of what Jeff was just saying,
15:33you know, but that's the reality of it. Many times I rail about the Bill Parcells line about
15:41your record or what your record says you are, because so often it's totally not true. But boy,
15:46if there's a team that for whom it is true, it's Golden State Warriors. That's what they are right
15:51now. They're five on a team. The Celtic win yesterday was aberrational in that they were
15:58missing four of their rotation players. Four. All right. You know, so they weren't even close
16:03to being competitive in that regard. But in general terms, I think Jeff's assessed it right.
16:08And I'd love to know if they've had that conversation. I wouldn't be surprised if they
16:12had. But what would you do if you if you're Steph Curry? What what would you do? Would you go to try
16:19to win another one or would you say, you know what, this point in my career, I want to finish
16:23my career here? You know, he's I don't know. He's got four rings. He's he's he's he has the
16:29acclaim, the the the universal acclaim of the goat of shooters who have ever drawn a breath
16:35on this planet Earth. He's got that title. He's the greatest shooter we've ever known.
16:40And and he knows that he has that title. He has to be proud of that. Does he need another ring to
16:48verify his status? No, that's not the case. Does he want one because it's a lot of fun to be in the
16:54mix? I and I think I don't know where else his loyalty would lie, you know, to car, to the
17:04disownership. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know him well enough to know that. Now,
17:11most people, I think, would opt out in that regard and go for it.
17:17Steph isn't most people. Steph is not most people.
17:20You just said it. Yeah.
17:23I can't say it anywhere else. And I'm accustomed. But I think Bob's right. It's like,
17:28who knows? But I can't imagine him. And you know him better than anybody, Jeff.
17:34But I can't imagine him going to the boss and saying, I want out.
17:38I don't see it. I could see maybe the ownership saying, look, you've been great to us. Do you
17:42want to go anywhere? I was not. It did not surprise me to see LeBron go to Miami or to
17:48the Lakers. That doesn't or Durant go to Brooklyn. That didn't surprise me.
17:53It would be jarring to see Steph Curry in another uniform for me.
18:00It wouldn't look right. He's a different dude. And, you know,
18:04obviously, he his career, he's grown up there. His family's grown up there. Right.
18:11So I hear you. But in this day and age, listen, if they went to him and said,
18:16hey, we got this trade on the table and we can send you to whatever contender,
18:22right, whatever contender that has a chance to win the whole thing.
18:26Would you go? I think it would have to be one of those where it's it's legitimately a
18:30hey, here's where you're going, not you want to be traded, but here's what we have on the table
18:35for you. Do you want it? And you got a day to kind of figure this thing out. And I wonder if,
18:41you know, again, it's got to be the right fit to it's got to be the right fit. Cleveland.
18:50I mean, Cleveland would be pretty, pretty ridiculous right now if they could add some,
18:54you know, again, they've got some good. You know, that that would be that would be a place
19:00that could take them over the hump, that's for sure. You know, you look at it and I'm trying
19:06to think where else you get it wouldn't have to rob you to pay Paul. I mean, what I don't know.
19:14I don't know what their draft situation is, but in terms of personnel to trade up, I mean, to get
19:20I don't know how Cleveland doesn't make sense to me. I don't know somebody else.
19:26Bob, you have some Curry brother numbers.
19:30Well, this is, you know, it's the point here is that Seth Curry has had a very odd career,
19:37and then he's now in his ninth team. And but in terms of what he does to keep, you know,
19:45to keep moving around, as of last night, the 20th of January 2025.
19:56Steph, big brother is a career shooter at point 472. As of last night,
20:05Seth, the little brother is a career shooter of point 471. In three point percentage, however,
20:14Seth has a career percentage of point 431. And Steph, big brother has a career percentage
20:22three point of 425. That's how close they are in their careers in terms of their actual shooting
20:28percentages. And I don't think too many people realize what a great shooter Seth,
20:34the younger brother is. He's got the same numbers as his brother, exact same numbers. And they
20:41actually go back and forth on a nightly basis sometimes, who's the big who's the leader and
20:45the brother among the you know, between the two brothers. It's a phenomenal thing of these two
20:50brothers. So I just it's a it obviously has never been anything like it. And, and, but think about
20:57that. I'll repeat once again, Steph is 472. And Seth is 471 in field goal percentage, but in three
21:05point, Seth is 431. And Steph is 425. That's remarkable. And what was Dell? What was Dell?
21:15I got Dell here somewhere. Dell was a four. Oh, the Dell was 40. He did. He did crack 40.
21:20That's career. Daddy. They're both chips off the old block in the sense they just improved.
21:24Although this is a no question who's the greatest shooting family of all time.
21:28We got that one. Well, I mean, if they came out with the big ball of brand,
21:38maybe the Curry should have their own line of everything. You know?
21:43I know Bob was listening to Leangelo's rap song the other day, Gary.
21:50I gotta check it out because I'm aware of this phenomenon. I have not heard it.
21:53Got some language in it though, Bob. I don't know. I wouldn't, I wouldn't,
21:57I wouldn't leave a lane while you're playing that. I think she,
22:02she might not like the language in that. I have no clue. What is it?
22:07I don't know. It's some rap song with a lot of, a lot of profanities, Gary, a lot of profanities
22:12about the Currys or about no, no, no, no. I don't even know. I don't even know what it's about. I
22:17heard one of his songs. Now I'm with you. Yeah. I'll have to, I'll, I'll text my son. I'm sure
22:22he could fill me in. Okay. We got more coming up. Uh, Jeff's going to talk about Cooper flag,
22:28uh, and also Kate Cunningham. But first I have to tell you, if you're looking for tickets,
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23:31you're looking for comedy shows, you're looking for theater. Also download the game time app
23:36and get your seats. Okay. Uh, Bob and Bob brought this up in Cape Cummingham in Detroit. Jeff,
23:44give us a lowdown on him. I mean, he's special. Like I knew this from watching him in a U ball,
23:50he big, strong point guard who can do everything, but he wins, he wins. And what he didn't do is
23:57win in Detroit, but it wasn't on him. It wasn't on him at all. You know, they put the wrong guys
24:02around him. Uh, it was former GM Troy Weaver. Um, and they just put a lot of two young guys,
24:09not a lot of skill, not veterans that could really help Kate out. And they made a change both in,
24:17um, with Trajan Langdon coming in, uh, and being the GM and also obviously hiring JB
24:23Bicker staff. And it's worked because Trajan is surrounded him with the right players.
24:28You know, you look at Tobias Harris, perfect fit. They're perfect fit. Tim Hardaway Jr. Can
24:33shoot the ball. Uh, Malik Beasley can shoot the ball. They put the right guys around him. Some
24:39vets that provide shooting because Kate's not the best shooter, but he's a good enough shooter.
24:45And look at what he's averaging right now, pop. I mean, the numbers are astounding. And again,
24:50they're 500 right now as a team. And this Detroit team has been the laughingstock of the league
24:56for what the last, I mean, at least five years. Yes. No, I wanted, uh, they're under the radar
25:03still people, but they're not an easy team to play. Now. They're not, they're, they're
25:08respectable. They're, they've achieved respectability. And that's, that's the first
25:11step on, you know, on the way up back to where they'd like to be. But, uh, I know, you know, he,
25:18he's not getting, you know, he's, he's, he's under the radar, you know, I don't know if he has a
25:22chance of making the all-star game with the talent, you know, with the competition, but
25:26he certainly would be worthy of it. That's for sure. And I know that you go way back with him
25:31and that's, uh, love him, love him. And there's still a piece or two away, Bob, there's still a
25:37piece or two away, but you know, but you hear about this guy and that guy, and you're not hearing
25:42enough about a guy who's, you know, this guy and, and, and he's living up to his billing, by the
25:47way, his, his, his placement and that, that, that's all. I just thought we wanted to point
25:51that out. Go ahead. Uh, yes, go ahead, Bob. Well, give me your thoughts, Bob. I'm dying to know,
26:00dying to know what you think of Cooper Flash here after seeing him. It was electric in the building.
26:07Uh, the tickets were, were twice as were astronomical. And, and, uh, I mean, really,
26:13I've never seen anything like, heard anything like this in all my years of going to BC and
26:17going to games. That building, the game was at 8 p.m. Saturday night. And I, I walked in there at
26:23seven and I'm telling you, it was two thirds full. And I've never seen anything like this before.
26:28I mean, it was two thirds full at seven o'clock for the eight o'clock game. Um, that there was,
26:34there was a buzz about it, the whole thing, which was unusual. It was, it was fun. Um,
26:39the, here's the game. My summation, the Duke, first of all, BC, by the way, uh, Jeff,
26:45BC probably played its best six minutes of the year to start the game, you know, and they were,
26:52they actually led like three or four or five points for a while. And, uh, and then reality
26:57set in at the seven minute mark, but they did, they always have those first seven minutes against
27:01Duke. Okay. So, and eventually they, they lose, they're down to nine at that time. They lose by
27:0625. Okay. Cooper flag when it's all over. He had 28 casual points. He had, uh, he started off one
27:15for five, which means he went and he wound up nine for 14. You can do the math on that. Um,
27:20he goes to the basket at will. He had one quick, he had, uh, one beautiful, great pass. He had
27:28one thunderous dunk and he had one, oh my God, rebound that he got up so high. I couldn't
27:36believe it. And, and, uh, and otherwise, oh, and he had a tech and I don't know, it was bizarre.
27:43He got a tech and, and he must've said something because we could, it was the other end of the
27:48court from where we were at the time. And, and that was bizarre. Um, and that was, it's a, but
27:56he, he, you know, he, he just makes the, the game came to him. One of those things that Jeff
28:00game came to him. He doesn't force a thing. He plays the game, right? That's my impression.
28:08You know what he does, Bob, my biggest takeaway. And I wonder if you got this from watching him
28:13is not only does he play the game, right? He plays the game hard all the time. He does not
28:20take plays off at all. And that's when you're making as much money as he's making an NIL.
28:27Trust me. There's a lot of kids right now around the country that feel like they've already
28:31arrived. And this kid is going to be the number one pick. And I wonder too, here's my question to
28:38you before the game and the buildup and everything like that. How much more do you think it played
28:43in that? This was a kid from new England, from Maine. And that's why everybody kind of wanted
28:47to see him at Boston college. Oh, but I have a question. I'd love to know how many people
28:52were there for me. And I can tell you there was a healthy Duke contingent. I can tell you that
28:55that's for sure. But oh, I'd love to know about the Maine. No question. It was part of the allure.
29:03But it was interesting. Well, that's the young man's work ethic. That's the young man's work
29:07ethic. Bob Ryan knows. Bob is a part-time resident of the state of Maine. If you come
29:11from this great pine tree state of Maine, your work ethic is uncontested. I'm joking, but I'm not.
29:23I'm serious. But I mean, if you come, look, I know where that kid comes from, you know,
29:28just outside of Bangor, Southern Bangor. There's definitely a Maine work ethic. There's no doubt
29:33about it. Oh, his mother's tough on him. His mother was his AU coach, Kelly Flagg. She played.
29:40She's super tough on him. She doesn't accept it. If he's not, you show up. So while I do think
29:49there were some New England people there, I do think his background,
29:53he's never going to dog it. No, no. I've never seen him dog it. He's never going to dog it.
29:59It's just, it's not in his makeup. And I'll give credit to the pine tree state.
30:07Yeah. I mean, the other thing that's interesting about him is this year, I actually thought he
30:12would have a little bit more juice. Like I thought ESPN would try to sell him even more.
30:18And build them up even more. But I think because the college football playoff went later and got
30:24more attention. I've been college basketball is taking an even further back seat right now,
30:29because in ordinary years, I mean, think of Zion and all the attention. Now Zion was different.
30:35Obviously he could jump through the gym and all that, but you know, Cooper Flagg is a white Duke
30:41player, right? Like you would think you're going to build him up as either, you know,
30:46Christian Leitner or JJ Redick or one of those type of guys. Now he's not dislikable.
30:54In my opinion, like Leitner was, he's not, he's not a truck. I mean, you said he got a technical,
31:00which surprises me. He's not a big time trash talker. He doesn't show a lot of emotion on his
31:05face during the game. So it's hard to like hate him. But I wonder if that'll change now that
31:10college basketball, especially after the super bowl will come to the forefront for a month or two.
31:17Yeah. Once or twice, there was a look on his face that I identified as, you know,
31:22there's a, there's a grit in the air. There's a, there's a little take that, you know,
31:26you guys kind of thing. And, and you mentioned the intensity and them playing hard all the time. And
31:31I was going to say, I got, it radiates. You can feel it. You can, you can feel it with him. There's
31:37no question. Yeah. There's no way to go later. It's never going to be an attorney.
31:44What's up? Have either of you guys been to the state of Maine basketball tournament at the
31:49Bangor? No, I haven't heard a lot about it. You're right. I gotta get, I gotta get Ryan up there.
31:58No, I'd love to. I gotta get, I mean, good. Goodman's wherever he's like, he's everywhere
32:03else, but I gotta try to get, there is nothing. Look, people, I mean, Maine, the fact that Cooper
32:11Flagg comes from Maine still blows my mind. You know, I don't know how it happened. You know,
32:17I mean, I don't think, I don't know of one person from Maine. Mike, I mean, Rick Carlisle went to
32:24Orono for two years, but he's not from Maine. I can't think of one person from Maine that was
32:31born in Maine in the NBA. My question, I can't either. My question to you is going to be,
32:38has it reached a point where he's as famous in Maine as Cindy Blodgett? That's all I want to
32:43know today. I don't think so. I don't think he'll get there. You don't think he'll get there? No,
32:49here's the thing. Here's the deal with Blodgett. Blodgett played for UMaine. That's true. Right.
32:55When she played for UMaine, that was the difference. And you know, plus, did he prep a
33:00year? He prepped a couple at Montverde Academy. Yeah. So, you know, Blodgett stayed.
33:09Well, I'll give him credit. He did stay. He did stay for his Maine AU team. He did stay with
33:15those guys all the way through. His brother, twin brother, ace flag on that team. But no,
33:23it's an amazing story and it's cool. I'm glad you got to see him in person, Bob, because
33:28I've seen him a ton over the last couple of years. And he's just, again, he's just different.
33:34He's very different. And because, like you said, he gets his points quietly. He does everything
33:41well. There's really no hole in his game. The hole in his game has been his three-point shooting over
33:46the course of his career, but he's still okay there. He's a very good passer. I don't know
33:51if he blocked any shots in that game, Bob. Yeah, I think he did. I mean, that's the part of his
33:58game that I'm just like, wow, like the way he can get out and contest and close out and block shots.
34:05I hate to use that code word, buzzword, but he's more, quote unquote, athletic than people
34:13understand or would have expected. This rebound, I'm telling you, it was head above the
34:21backboard kind of rebound. It just got my attention. It was an ooh and ah rebound.
34:27You don't see it too often, I'm telling you. It was really something.
34:30Bob, where do you think, how does he fit in the NBA?
34:34Well, I mean, he's such a well-rounded and efficient player. I mean, there's
34:39everybody. I mean, he'd fit anywhere. I mean, I don't know. I don't see any problem there.
34:44There's no, yeah, but I mean, his three-point shooting is, there's a work in progress.
34:48And that's such the currency in the league these days. But given the scope of his game, I just
34:55think he's, the reason why he's already been conceded, he's going to be the number one pick.
35:01Jeff, before we go, your thoughts on the rough start, excuse me, or stop for Mr. Calipari.
35:10Well, I mean, first year at Arkansas, he kind of gets run out of Kentucky
35:15after a tough last four or five years where he didn't do anything in the tournament.
35:20And he's got a huge NIL payroll, maybe the most in the country, somewhere in that seven,
35:25$8 million range. And I just wrote a story for Seth Davis's new website HQ yesterday.
35:32He is, I mean, how about this stack guys? First of all, there's only four high major coaches without
35:37a conference win. South Carolina, Miami, Colorado, and Arkansas right now. There's also only,
35:47uh, there were 16 high major coaches hired this past off season. Only one does not have a
35:53conference win. That is John Calipari. And again, he's got the most money of all of them.
35:58But the one thing talking to people in the sec coaches, they kept saying to me was like,
36:04the pieces don't fit the games passed him by his staff. Isn't very good. You know, his biggest
36:12advantage was obviously recruiting over the years, getting high, high, high level pros.
36:17Well, those guys now, you know, think about it. Okay. Cooper flag went to Duke.
36:23That's fine. I mean, Cal would lose guys to Duke before, but you know, uh, Dylan Harper and Ace
36:29Bailey, the second and third most talented players in this class went to Rutgers is the old Cal
36:36losing that battle. No, he is not. So NIL changes things number one, and you have to be a general
36:45manager. Now you have to be a general manager and make sure those pieces fit. And you know,
36:50again, you just, the other part is guys, I've been told this by people who've worked with him
36:55is he's kind of lost that edge a little bit, right? Like coming out of COVID. I mean, he worked
37:02so hard, especially in the recruiting trail. And I've been coming out of COVID, a lot of coaches
37:06figured like, all right, it's a lot easier now. I don't have to fly across the country to wave to
37:11some 16 year old kid that I want to come, you know, to it's different now with, with money and
37:17with the portal and everything like that. And youth is not nearly as impactful unless you have Cooper
37:23flag, right? Like there's a couple freshmen, but if you don't get them that next year, freshmen
37:29right now, when you're playing against kids that are 23, 24, 25 years old in college, I'll take the
37:3623 year old over the 18 year old almost every time. There you go. Interesting. Well, you know,
37:46we saw it with Belichick where it just happens where, you know, you talk about the work ethic
37:54and it slows down, you know, you just, you know, I mean, how old is Cal now?
38:00Is he what? Yeah. Almost 65. I think. Yeah. I mean, it just, you know, he's not the same dude
38:05that, um, I don't blame him. Of course not. And you're in Fayetteville. You're not in Kentucky.
38:11You know, now again, on one hand, you think you got something to prove. You want to prove
38:16within the league too, to those Kentucky fans that wanted you out of there. I'm going to show them.
38:20And again, he had the money Tyson chicken, plenty, plenty of money in Fayetteville,
38:25believe it or not. God's Walmart. I believe it ton of money, but you know, three, three teams
38:32in college basketball right now who've spent somewhere in the top five ish in NIL are Arkansas,
38:39Kansas state, and Indiana. If the season ended today, none of which would be in the NCAA tournament.
38:44So it just goes to show you that you got, you know, you gotta be smart. Ohio state football,
38:49they had 20 million. Well, they spend it the right way for the most part. You could see, I mean,
38:55the pieces fit, they had unbelievable skill position players, wide receivers,
38:59you know, you got to spend it the right way. It's so for, I'm sure Bob feels the same way.
39:04When you start talking money for college players, it's just so foreign to me. Yeah. I mean, it's
39:09foreign for me and I've been dealing with it now for a couple of years. I don't love aspects of it.
39:15I mean, certain parts of it that I feel like, Hey, Cooper, if I should be getting money, look at the
39:19money he's bringing in this year to Duke, all those Jersey sales, Jason Tatum should have made
39:24money off his Jersey sales at Duke. Right. But we're a little carried away here too, because
39:30these kids can just jump every single year. They need contracts. They need contracts so that if
39:36they leave, they got to pay a buyout or something like that. If you're going to make 2 million
39:40and then you bounce or you sit in the middle of the year or something like that, there's got to
39:44be repercussions too. You can't have it all favorable to the player, which is kind of what
39:48it is right now. All right, guys. Great talk as always. Brought to you by PricePix, the exclusive
39:56daily fantasy partner of the CLNS Media Network. Pick more, pick less with PricePix. We'll talk to
40:01you next week.