Frank The Tank
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00:00Frank Walsh. Frank Walsh. It's time for Frank Walsh.
00:10Alright, we got another episode here of Frank Walsh.
00:14And today I'm joined by Rico Bosco and one of the hottest names in college basketball, Brian Hodgson.
00:21You know, he's leading Arkansas State to the top of the Sunbelt Conference.
00:27And as March Madness approaches, he's got the Red Wolves poised to make a run in March.
00:35Let's go for a little walk.
00:37Let's do it. I appreciate that introduction.
00:40Hopefully we can hold true to that tonight.
00:47We don't want to get too specific, do we?
00:50Yeah, that's right.
00:52But, I mean, your second season here in Jonesboro, Arkansas,
00:59and you've turned things around in just two years.
01:04From arrival, last year you had them competitive, and this year you had them battling at the top of the conference.
01:11What has been some of the keys to your turnaround?
01:13Yeah, I think, you know, getting the right guys in here.
01:18I got a good group inherited, and then we went out and recruited, you know, a group to complement what was here.
01:27The year before I got here, they finished 13th out of 14th.
01:31Last year, obviously, you know, we finished fourth and finished lost in the conference championship.
01:36We won 20 Division I games.
01:38And this year we were picked to win the Sunbelt and fighting to do that.
01:42So, just getting the right guys in here, building the culture, and then our fan base has been electric.
01:47We're second in the Sunbelt in attendance.
01:51Average only, I think we're nine people short of being the leader of average attendance in all Sunbelt basketball.
01:58So, this community loves basketball, Northeast Arkansas loves basketball, and they've really embraced it.
02:04So, we've really got a lot of good energy going.
02:08I mean, in the NIL world that we live in today, you're a mid-major.
02:13What are some of the challenges you face?
02:15You know, up until NIL, you know, I really felt like you could win recruiting battles by outworking people,
02:24having better relationships with people, you know, being a better talent evaluator.
02:29Now, unfortunately, too often it comes down to, you know, what's the dollar amount?
02:35And it's became way more transactional, and, you know, I really don't enjoy that piece of it.
02:42I'll tell you what, we've got a good group of guys that didn't make the decision to come here just based on a dollar amount,
02:48and I think that's helped us with our culture, you know, but I do think the student-athletes should make money.
02:55Oh, I agree.
02:56You know, it's the old axiom, you know, the pendulum always swings too far.
03:02Yes.
03:03I think the pendulum has swung too far.
03:05I mean, it was ridiculous that you could sell a jersey with someone's name on the back,
03:10and if you gave him a tattoo, he could lose his scholarship and not be allowed to play again.
03:17It's unbelievable, and now it's gone all the way from that to starting in April,
03:23the payments will come directly from the universities, revenue sharing.
03:27So student-athletes will now get a check from the university,
03:32so St. John's University will cut a check to their point guard from the university,
03:38and that is his revenue-sharing payment.
03:40You literally never thought you'd see that.
03:42Never. If you would have said that 10 years ago.
03:44Well, Ed O'Bannon, the Ed O'Bannon decision, and they were right.
03:49They were right. I mean, their names and likenesses are being used.
03:53It's just now being abused, and that's what the issue is.
03:57What I don't like is, personally, I don't like that players could change every year.
04:03Yeah, the transfer portal. That's one thing that I think is a problem.
04:08Obviously, you know, I don't know that we're teaching young men how to fight adversity,
04:17at the first sign that they may have to work or that they may have to battle for playing time.
04:23The easy answer is that they can transfer.
04:25Now they can transfer. They can go to four different schools in four years.
04:28Well, shoot, if they're even limited to four years.
04:31They may get a fifth year.
04:33Now they've got kids that play junior college that have sued the NCAA,
04:38and now there's a kid at Vanderbilt who's going to play another year of college football
04:44because he sued the NCAA, and they said his junior college playing experience doesn't count against his eligibility.
04:52So you have veterans now.
04:55So what happens here if he breaks a passing record at Vanderbilt?
04:59Is that a valid record?
05:00No.
05:01If he got an extra year?
05:02I think those are just a big giant asterisk on you now.
05:05It's just too much up in the air.
05:08The transfer portal, there's positives, I think, to it.
05:11I think I liked it before.
05:13You've got to sit. You've got to sit.
05:15I'm not sure I like that you sit, but I think maybe if you're limited,
05:18maybe you have to stay in the place two years and that you can't move more than twice.
05:24What's the negative to having to sit?
05:29Well, I think that maybe if you have a coaching change or something like that.
05:34Yeah, that's what I always felt bad about. Coach leaves.
05:36Coach, you don't have to sit. Coaching change, you don't have to sit.
05:39Right.
05:40If there's a coaching change, you don't have to sit.
05:42If you choose to leave for any other reason outside of a coaching change
05:46or a real personal or family issue or dilemma.
05:49Okay, I can go with that.
05:51Then you sit.
05:52I don't think back when that was the rule, the guys that I coached that had to sit,
05:59I felt like they gained valuable experience.
06:01They got an extra year of practice.
06:03Under their belt, they were able to learn the system, get a little stronger.
06:07I don't think there's many negatives to it, to be honest with you.
06:10But you're right, it's unfortunate.
06:12You'll see the largest number of transfers ever this year, I would imagine,
06:17and that number's only going to grow.
06:19I look what happened with Deceiton Hall last year.
06:22They won the NIT, had a couple good players, and then they lost everybody.
06:28I mean, Richmond ends up at St. John's.
06:31I mean, Dawes goes out to Mississippi.
06:33What did Patino say about that? Did you hear what he said?
06:36No, I didn't hear what he said.
06:37He said if it didn't have to do with NIO, directly from Patino's mouth,
06:43he said Qadari would still be at Seaton Hall playing for Shaheen.
06:46Yeah, Seaton Hall has no money.
06:49And I give credit to Coach Patino, one of the best to ever do it, to actually admit that.
06:54I mean, he knows.
06:55I mean, it's a financial piece.
06:57But on the same token, how do you get mad at a young man for saying,
07:03hey, no, I've got to go get this money?
07:05Especially someone who's probably a fringe prospecting to pros.
07:10Yeah, lack of shooting.
07:12I mean, if he plays in the G League, he's lucky.
07:16So he's getting this money now, and it puts him on the right track,
07:21that financial viability.
07:24I don't blame the players.
07:26It's just there's got to be a way to find a happy medium
07:32where it's not out of control, but the players have the power.
07:36It's hard for a mid-major guy, too.
07:38Like you bring a kid in, diamond in the rough, or an under-recruited player,
07:41you bring him to your program, he lights it up.
07:44You know the other programs are looking at that almost like here we go.
07:47They're going to poach him as soon as possible.
07:49So it's difficult.
07:50Here's the reality.
07:51On the other side of the transfer portal, coaches are able to move kids, right?
07:56So if you did a poor job of evaluating somebody
08:00and you offered that young man a scholarship and he came
08:02and he just wasn't good enough, at the end of the year you can say goodbye.
08:06And so I just feel like the evaluation process isn't as authentic as it was.
08:12People are like, you know what, I'll take a chance for a year.
08:14If I don't like him, I'll get rid of him.
08:16You know, how many times would Dave got rid of Rico by now?
08:20That transfer portal was in effect at Barstow.
08:22I mean, there has to be a balance.
08:26He negotiated his NIL.
08:28There has to be a balance, I think.
08:30That's what I'm hoping for today.
08:32You find a way to balance it.
08:34Me too.
08:36I'm afraid that it might be too far gone.
08:41Maybe I shouldn't say that.
08:42I don't know.
08:43They open the door with no guardrails.
08:48You're a guy that doesn't like highways.
08:50They put you on the highways with no brakes.
08:52Yeah, well, that's why I avoid highways.
08:54That's why I only drive on local roads.
08:56Understood.
08:57I don't blame you.
08:58Speaking of, yeah, I mean, it's…
09:02It'll come back, I think.
09:03It'll eventually come back.
09:04It has to.
09:05You guys got linked up through me, basically, on your AFC East rivalry, so to speak.
09:09Yes.
09:10Big Bill's guy, Miami Dolphins guy, as we know.
09:13It's not a rivalry anymore.
09:15No, it's not.
09:16It's not a rivalry anymore.
09:17These Dolphins are pathetic.
09:18Have we won seven out of the last eight?
09:20No, it feels like you've received more than that.
09:23It's the only game the Dolphins won is because Big Bill's almost died of heat stroke.
09:28Yeah, I've done that.
09:29I've gone down there as a Bill's fan.
09:31Too hard rock.
09:32They make us sit in the dead baking sun.
09:35Oh, I love it.
09:36It's absolutely awful.
09:38I love it.
09:39I went to a season opener a couple years ago where the Dolphins played the Patriots.
09:44Yeah.
09:45And the Patriots are, like, on the bench.
09:47They're, like, dying.
09:49They actually had to grab a table and, like, shield the players on the sideline.
09:53I mean, I couldn't even get a proper pause.
09:56I was just sweating.
09:57Just sweating.
09:58I mean, it just beats down on the visiting sideline.
10:01It just beats down on them.
10:03So, here, I've got a question for you.
10:05And, you know, people might complain about it, but it's the same thing of going up to Buffalo in December.
10:11It is.
10:12That's what it is.
10:13Yeah.
10:14And everybody, oh, why didn't we put a roof?
10:17No, that's our advantage.
10:18That's our advantage.
10:19No, there's too many roofs.
10:21Yeah, we do have the cool technology.
10:24I think, like, 40% of the stadium is covered maybe.
10:27And when the snow hits the roof that is there, it immediately melts.
10:32It's all wired and heated.
10:34I heard that they're going to install the same type of field that they have at Lambeau Field.
10:39Okay.
10:40Which is, like, a natural grass that's considered to be, like, one of the best in the NFL.
10:45Yep.
10:46Specifically, there's, like, heating pipes underneath to keep the grass warm and nutrient-rich so it doesn't go bad.
10:53Okay.
10:54And it stays green.
10:55Whatever Josh Allen wants, Josh Allen gets.
10:58Best quarterback in the NFL, MVP.
11:00Should have been the MVP.
11:01Well, where are you at with Mahomes?
11:03Because you beat him in the regular season.
11:05Where are you at with that?
11:06Like, do you think he just might have your number?
11:09No, I mean, right now it looks like he has our number.
11:12But I'll tell you this.
11:14We got a first down on third and fourth down.
11:18The fact that we're relying on a 6-foot, 280-pound sideline judge to come in and spot the ball
11:2510 seconds after the runner went down with a pile of 350-pound linemen
11:30and he just randomly gets to the side where the ball goes, that's how the MVP season ended?
11:35It's horrific.
11:36It's horrific.
11:37Put a chip in the ball.
11:39If it's a first down, it's going to tell you it's a first down.
11:42We would have went to the Super Bowl.
11:43We could have faced the Eagles.
11:46Coach Sirianni's from my hometown, Jamestown, New York.
11:49That would have been a great storyline.
11:52Instead, America had to watch a horrible Kendrick Lamar concert in an absolutely awful Super Bowl.
11:58How about the graphics on Fox?
12:00The scoreboard, that was like the cherry on top of the terribleness of it.
12:06And I got another hot take.
12:09I don't care if I ever listen to Tom Brady again.
12:12He needs to just realize his future is in the front office.
12:16Yeah, great quarterback, bad on television.
12:19Tony Romo, subpar quarterback, great on TV.
12:22Oh, no, he's terrible.
12:23He is horrible.
12:24Yeah, Romo's got a little...
12:26He was hot early.
12:27You don't like Romo?
12:28Oh, he's terrible.
12:29The high voice a little bit is too much sometimes.
12:33I think he's turned the corner.
12:35Troy Aikman, great quarterback, great analyst.
12:40Aikman's the goalie.
12:42Rob Gronkowski, great football player, horrible on television.
12:47Rob Gronkowski, he's almost like a mascot.
12:52He's affable, he's goofy, he's perfect for a pregame show.
12:56Also from Buffalo, New York.
12:58Williamsville North High School.
13:00You mentioned Jamestown.
13:02What famous sitcom starts with Jamestown?
13:05I Love Lucy.
13:07Yep.
13:08Lucille Ball, my friend.
13:09Celeron, New York.
13:11You know who else is...
13:12Oh, you're going to like this.
13:14You're going to love this.
13:16Who that is a leader of a professional sports organization
13:23is from Jamestown, New York?
13:25Rob Manfred.
13:28Roger Goodell.
13:29Really?
13:30Rob Manfred's from up here too, I think.
13:33I don't think he's from Jamestown.
13:35He's from upstate New York.
13:36Roger Goodell is from Jamestown, New York.
13:38Really? I did not know that.
13:39Jamestown, New York, my friend.
13:40I know his father was briefly a senator in New York
13:44for maybe half a term.
13:47He's from...
13:49The guy is from Jamestown, New York,
13:51and yet the bills still get screwed
13:54in every possible scenario.
13:57I was there. I saw it with my own eyes.
13:59I could have jumped out of my seat
14:01and correctly spotted the ball.
14:03Being a Dolphin fan with a long history of hating the bills,
14:07I mean, the bills got screwed.
14:10That was Montreal, the WWF screw job.
14:14Yeah.
14:15So, we got on the quarterback thing for a while.
14:18Coin flip, I mean, Lamar Jackson's obviously elite.
14:21So, I mean, you could have gone either way, right?
14:23But Lamar...
14:25I'll tell you why.
14:26I'll tell you why John Allen deserved it more.
14:29Derek Henry doesn't play for the Buffalo Bills.
14:32Yeah, Derek Henry's a specimen.
14:34Derek Henry doesn't play for the Buffalo Bills.
14:36He's a specimen.
14:37And not that I want to take it away from Lamar Jackson
14:39because of Derek Henry,
14:41but the stats are the same,
14:43and the bills...
14:46That means John Allen had to do it more himself.
14:50He did.
14:51Lamar Jackson had to do
14:53because he had that extra help.
14:55There's a better roster around Lamar Jackson.
14:59And if you're doing a coin toss,
15:02that's the deciding factor.
15:04Yeah, I can go with that.
15:06I do think Lamar's a great quarterback.
15:09But yeah, Derek Henry's...
15:11When we went down there in whatever, week four,
15:13whatever it was,
15:14and they just ran all over us,
15:16I was like, who's going to beat this team?
15:19I mean, how do you tackle Lamar and Derek Henry
15:23just on back-to-back plays?
15:25But what's your...
15:28Obviously, I was at Alabama before I came here.
15:31So I got a lot of Roll Tide in me.
15:34Man, I got to be there
15:36for the last several years of the GOAT with Nick Saban.
15:41I know he probably didn't enjoy his time in Miami.
15:45But we're not going to talk poorly about Nick Saban on this walk.
15:49So...
15:51Mr. Dante Culpepper.
15:54Yeah.
15:56Tua.
15:58Is it...
15:59Where do you stand?
16:01I just did bad luck.
16:03I...
16:06I think he's fragile.
16:08I don't think he is a...
16:10I don't think he's long for the league,
16:12especially when you have a gentleman who says,
16:15offensive line is overrated.
16:17You don't really need a good offensive line.
16:22Are you a good offensive line?
16:24I'm not.
16:26I'll tell you this.
16:27The last concussion that he got,
16:30I watched that game.
16:31But who was the first one to give him a concussion?
16:34And he wasn't called a concussion,
16:36but he was concussed and he came back and won the game.
16:38Matt Milano, remember?
16:40Oh, yeah, that's right, that's right.
16:41And the Bills gave him the last one, too, correct?
16:44The last one, technically.
16:46Although, I think he probably got one afterwards.
16:48So, that was the one.
16:50He got hit.
16:52He tried to run in the red zone, if I'm not mistaken.
16:54Yeah, dove.
16:55Yeah, dove, and he got hit by DeMar Hamlin.
16:58And he got up and walked back to the sideline
17:03after laying there for a while and was doing the posturing.
17:05And I'm telling you, I read his lips.
17:08I swear he looked at somebody and said,
17:10did I get hit?
17:12Yeah.
17:13I forgot about that until this moment.
17:16But, like, he walked back, went to the sideline,
17:18and I was like, come on, man.
17:19He probably...
17:21I mean, you want to talk about a good human being.
17:23I don't know him on a personal level,
17:25but everybody at Alabama spoke about him like he was phenomenal.
17:28But here's the issue.
17:30They don't bring in a backup quarterback.
17:31They don't have an offensive line.
17:33It's malpractice from Chris Greer,
17:36and that's what frustrates me about being a golfing fan.
17:38Yeah, yeah.
17:40It's just the incompetence.
17:42And, of course, Buffalo, maybe next year.
17:45Maybe next year it finally happens for them.
17:47I hope so.
17:48I'm just...
17:50We've got a great GM and a great head coach.
17:52I love Bean.
17:53I love McDermott.
17:54I think the culture's great.
17:57We're...
17:58As much as I hate to say it, Buffalo deserves it.
18:01They have a good, loyal fan base.
18:03I'm tired of the Chiefs.
18:05I can never really fully embrace it.
18:07I like to say Guam Barclay,
18:09but it's just Philadelphia fans, you know.
18:11I can't.
18:12I can't.
18:13So the Chiefs, if I'm not mistaken,
18:15obviously I've been preoccupied here for the last couple months,
18:19but the Chiefs have to...
18:21The roster's got to go, right?
18:23Yeah, they're going to...
18:24Can't salary capitalize.
18:25They're in trouble.
18:26I think they're going...
18:27I think Travis Kelsey's going to retire.
18:30I think Travis Kelsey's going to retire.
18:32Because I was there at the game,
18:35and their fans were actually very respectful.
18:38The Chiefs fans were.
18:39I wanted to hate them, but I couldn't.
18:41And on the way out, one guy said,
18:44don't worry about it.
18:45Let us get our 3P, which they did not.
18:47But let us get our 3P,
18:49because we lose this entire team next year.
18:51Yeah, they're going to...
18:52The salary cap, they're going to have to pay the piper.
18:55Yeah.
18:56All right, well, good luck on this season.
18:59Hopefully we're able to get you into March Madness.
19:02You know, I think Arkansas State is an exciting team.
19:06They've got a good roster.
19:07You've done a great job here,
19:09and I want to thank you for joining.
19:11And wolves up.
19:13Wolves up.
19:14Thanks, Frank.
19:18Woo!
19:22Woo!