Unlocker Room: Cristian Brocchi - ENG - video Dailymotion

A.C. MILAN OFFICIAL

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Transcript

00:00:00 At a certain point, one of us, with a slightly stronger tone,

00:00:05 said, "Roni, you're broke now.

00:00:07 Come on, wake up, give us a hand, at least do a run, something."

00:00:11 He said, "Now I score.

00:00:13 Then we won't talk anymore."

00:00:15 Once we stole Gattuso's phone

00:00:18 and started sending messages to everyone.

00:00:22 To journalists, to Braila, to managers, to people.

00:00:27 We sent them a message.

00:00:29 THE UNLOCKER

00:00:33 A new episode of Unlock the Room with Mr. Brocchi, Christian Brocchi.

00:00:40 What's the name of a coach who doesn't train at the moment?

00:00:44 Is he called "Mr."? Do they call you by name?

00:00:46 Some do, some don't.

00:00:48 But it's not a problem. The important thing is what they think of you.

00:00:52 What do they think of you?

00:00:53 How does a coach who's not training live?

00:00:57 Does he completely detach himself from the world?

00:01:00 How many games do you watch in a week?

00:01:02 As soon as I finished my last experience, I detached myself.

00:01:06 I needed to clean up, because a coach's role is very stressful.

00:01:11 On the outside, you understand, but you understand it relatively.

00:01:15 It's normal that now, not training,

00:01:20 because I had some opportunities,

00:01:23 but it wasn't what I liked,

00:01:28 what gave me the right emotion or the fire

00:01:31 that you need to do such a beautiful, but stressful job.

00:01:35 Now I do watch games, I like watching games,

00:01:39 I like meeting the players,

00:01:42 because the most important thing is to know the players,

00:01:46 from different categories, nationalities, leagues.

00:01:50 So, having a general knowledge for a coach is very important.

00:01:53 Cristian, we like to call you that, because you're a strange person.

00:01:59 I wanted to ask you, looking at this historical period,

00:02:03 without going into detail,

00:02:05 there's always this thing about players, results, how do you see it?

00:02:09 For me, first of all, it's fundamental to have an aspect.

00:02:14 Everyone plays to win.

00:02:17 So, it's not just about the player or...

00:02:22 - The result. - The result.

00:02:24 It's normal that each of us has a thought and a desire to achieve the result.

00:02:31 And the result has to be the victory.

00:02:33 Everyone has their own mentality, their own belief.

00:02:38 I, personally, am one of those who wants to achieve victory

00:02:42 through a game,

00:02:44 and not through a defensive phase alone and exclusively.

00:02:49 But because I consider football a spectacle,

00:02:54 and I like to see teams that play it face to face,

00:02:57 I like to see teams that control the game,

00:02:59 I like to see teams that have a mentality

00:03:04 that, when we speak in Italy, we call it the European mentality.

00:03:08 And I can't really understand why,

00:03:10 because now we're seeing that the new generation of coaches

00:03:14 have the desire to put something different on the pitch.

00:03:19 It's normal that this confrontation comes, more than anything,

00:03:24 from those who speak from the outside,

00:03:27 from those who express their own opinion.

00:03:30 It's right that those who go to the UTAI and watch from the outside

00:03:32 can express an idea.

00:03:35 I don't accept offences.

00:03:38 Offences from those who comment on your work,

00:03:43 I think there's a limit to everything.

00:03:44 Criticism is right, negative thinking about a job is right.

00:03:48 Offending is something different,

00:03:50 exasperating someone is something different.

00:03:53 Let's get to this, to start to go back in time.

00:03:57 What was your relationship with the media, the newspapers?

00:04:00 We were saying before, in the off-the-shelf,

00:04:02 your football was a bit like that,

00:04:04 between two great eras.

00:04:07 The start of social media,

00:04:09 the first TV stations that decide the time of the games,

00:04:12 so you started playing a lot in the evenings.

00:04:15 What was your relationship with interviews,

00:04:17 with the journalists, with the critics?

00:04:20 I've always had a great deal of respect.

00:04:23 A great deal of respect, and I've always said

00:04:27 that if I had made some friends in my career,

00:04:30 journalists and more, it would have been better.

00:04:32 Because there's no point in hiding.

00:04:35 Many players have used and still use, in their careers,

00:04:40 maybe a different way, a journalist friend.

00:04:45 But I've always had the idea

00:04:48 that I preferred to open a newspaper

00:04:50 and find an article that spoke of me,

00:04:53 in a positive way, because I've conquered it on the pitch,

00:04:57 rather than opening a newspaper and finding an article that spoke of me,

00:05:01 of a journalist friend,

00:05:02 whose objective was to do it for me.

00:05:06 Why? Because I thought more about myself,

00:05:08 my personal gratification, rather than showing

00:05:11 something different on the outside.

00:05:14 The time of the games has been determined

00:05:17 at a certain point in our careers,

00:05:21 but it has never disturbed me, honestly.

00:05:27 Most players prefer to play in the evening

00:05:30 rather than in the middle of the day.

00:05:31 This is out of the question,

00:05:33 but also for a biological reason,

00:05:35 a habit, a series of things.

00:05:38 Even if you often train in the morning.

00:05:41 But I don't know, the evening atmosphere

00:05:44 is always a particular charm.

00:05:47 I've touched up on social media.

00:05:50 I've touched them up and I tell you,

00:05:52 from a certain point of view, luckily,

00:05:55 from another point of view, you have to know how to live with it.

00:05:59 I've taken them full-on as a coach.

00:06:02 Maybe it was better to get used to it as a player first,

00:06:04 so as a coach I would have accused something less.

00:06:10 Because before, when social media wasn't there,

00:06:12 I think journalists were raised

00:06:17 in different ways, because they saw

00:06:22 and thought about what was positive and negative.

00:06:24 Now, I think, some articles,

00:06:31 websites, newspapers, and everything,

00:06:34 are conditioned more by the negative things

00:06:37 that social media brings you than by the positive ones.

00:06:39 Because I always say that out of the 10 messages

00:06:41 you receive on social media, if you receive 6 positive ones,

00:06:45 2 neutral ones and 2 negative ones that are really strong,

00:06:49 most people at this moment

00:06:52 take those two negative ones,

00:06:53 because it seems they make more news.

00:06:55 Cristian, I wanted to ask you, when you played

00:06:58 and you played thick matches,

00:07:00 and you were a smart player, tactically,

00:07:05 football-wise, maybe you didn't really look at it,

00:07:07 I mean, journalists, now we don't want to discredit our area,

00:07:12 but maybe you didn't see yourself and you didn't care

00:07:16 if you were getting negative comments,

00:07:20 when you say, "I ran 12.5 km,

00:07:23 I got 75 balls back and I got 5.5".

00:07:26 Look, between me and Fabio, if I was on a plane,

00:07:29 I would never say the name of a player

00:07:31 that we would laugh at and look at the votes,

00:07:33 and say, "Damn, he got 6 today".

00:07:34 You know that football fans publish the votes on the same day.

00:07:37 His answer was, "I think he stole 14 balls".

00:07:40 I think it's a situation where you probably found yourself too.

00:07:44 All those statistics that don't end up on the table,

00:07:46 all those situations that superficial criticism doesn't see.

00:07:50 Because, now, it's not the case of that Milan,

00:07:52 because he had great coaches who knew how to read the matches.

00:07:56 But the media, the football influencers,

00:08:00 especially today, when we look at the matches,

00:08:03 they see "6 balls", "5.5 balls".

00:08:07 And maybe they influence,

00:08:09 I'm not saying in the dressing room, because you were champions,

00:08:11 smart people, but outside,

00:08:13 they say, "Brocchi always gets 6".

00:08:15 No, I ran like crazy, I deserved at least 7.

00:08:18 Look, in my time,

00:08:21 the votes were also conditioned by the result of the match.

00:08:24 So, if you won, you had votes that were definitely higher.

00:08:26 If you lost, the votes were almost always negative,

00:08:31 because they were conditioned by that.

00:08:35 Personally, yes, sometimes,

00:08:38 if I noticed that a journalist

00:08:41 had something personal with me,

00:08:46 then, yes, it bothered me a lot.

00:08:48 So, maybe I'd take that journalist and say,

00:08:50 "Sorry, but why?"

00:08:53 But not for the 5 or 6,

00:08:55 maybe also for the comment.

00:08:58 I remember there was one

00:09:00 that I did in a particular year.

00:09:06 Even when I was, I'm not saying the best on the pitch,

00:09:09 the maximum vote I got was 6,

00:09:11 and the comment was never nice.

00:09:12 At some point, I had taken it,

00:09:14 but I had also answered in a slightly presumptuous way.

00:09:17 I put it on a piece of paper,

00:09:19 I never said a word about him again,

00:09:23 and then, at some point, he became a team manager.

00:09:28 At the end, I scored against this team,

00:09:30 he passed me by, I said hello,

00:09:33 I said good evening, and I left.

00:09:35 Because you want to win back.

00:09:38 But the thing that bothered me the most,

00:09:43 but also accompanied my career,

00:09:45 is that sometimes, despite the affection I feel

00:09:49 from those fans who have lived our years,

00:09:52 who have seen that,

00:09:54 even though I wasn't a starting player in Amovire del Milano,

00:09:57 because I had three sacred monsters in front of me,

00:09:59 Pirlo, Gattuso, Seedorf,

00:10:01 I took up an important space.

00:10:04 I played important matches,

00:10:06 Champions League semi-finals, Champions League quarter-finals,

00:10:09 important matches,

00:10:10 that if I hadn't been up to the task,

00:10:12 your team might have lost a qualification,

00:10:16 and then not be able to win the game.

00:10:20 And that was what led me to leave Milan at the end.

00:10:25 I wanted to leave Milan

00:10:27 because I wanted to win a cup with a different shirt.

00:10:29 Why?

00:10:30 Because it seemed that some players

00:10:32 who were a little more popular at times,

00:10:35 or had a name that was a little more important,

00:10:39 had won the Champions League.

00:10:41 Maybe they had played half of my games,

00:10:45 and I, who had played twice as much as someone else,

00:10:48 Emma Brocchi is not a starter, Emma Brocchi is not a player.

00:10:50 This was the thing that,

00:10:52 in my career, sometimes,

00:10:55 bothered me a little more.

00:10:56 In fact, I had decided to go to Lazio for this reason,

00:10:59 and then I won three more cups in Lazio.

00:11:01 So, Luca,

00:11:04 we would like to go back in time,

00:11:06 but we also want to follow your assists.

00:11:09 So, I would take a step back before the assist,

00:11:11 that is, when you go to the pinnacle

00:11:16 and you see that your teammate is no longer there.

00:11:17 I read.

00:11:18 Yes, yes.

00:11:19 But that was an episode...

00:11:21 Look, I'll tell you the truth,

00:11:22 I'm a person who respects others.

00:11:25 And even if, logically,

00:11:28 there's a derby in the middle,

00:11:29 there's something that Milan, Inter, the fans,

00:11:33 we know, right?

00:11:34 So, let's take this aspect away.

00:11:37 I did an interview

00:11:41 where my word,

00:11:45 which is the word "I hate",

00:11:46 was taken up again,

00:11:47 "Bro, I hate Inter", they said.

00:11:49 Because I had said that

00:11:51 I hated a person who had done something

00:11:55 at that moment,

00:11:56 and so the title was "Bro, I hate Inter".

00:11:57 From then on, throughout my career,

00:11:59 every time I played against Inter,

00:12:01 I would hear cheers, whistles,

00:12:03 and at a certain point I would say,

00:12:04 "Damn, how important they are to me".

00:12:06 Because it's not always said,

00:12:07 when there's a whole stadium whistling at you,

00:12:10 when there's a whole stadium

00:12:11 coming at you, insulting you,

00:12:14 it's not always said that if you're an opponent

00:12:17 this thing destabilises you or scares you.

00:12:20 Sometimes it even cheers you up.

00:12:22 We have an example.

00:12:23 Now he works here,

00:12:24 and he repeats it several times.

00:12:26 Exactly.

00:12:27 He invents this mantra of Ibra.

00:12:29 The problem is when your fans insult you,

00:12:33 then you do feel bad.

00:12:34 But when they're your opponents,

00:12:36 it's not a problem.

00:12:37 That thing, unfortunately,

00:12:38 did bother me, because...

00:12:40 In the end, Inter was the team

00:12:43 that had invested in me the year before,

00:12:45 buying me from Verona,

00:12:46 spending big amounts of money.

00:12:47 I arrived that morning,

00:12:49 and without having...

00:12:50 I find myself in this situation,

00:12:52 and it's normal to have a reaction.

00:12:54 It could have been Inter,

00:12:56 it could have been any other team.

00:12:57 It wasn't Inter,

00:12:58 it was the gesture of this person

00:12:59 that bothered me.

00:13:01 And this thing should be taken into account.

00:13:02 But then I've always said

00:13:04 that from every negative thing

00:13:06 comes a positive.

00:13:08 Thanks to that episode,

00:13:10 I went back home,

00:13:12 to my family.

00:13:13 I was the captain of various teams

00:13:16 throughout my career,

00:13:17 from the age of 9 to 19,

00:13:19 at Milan Aestettore Giovanile.

00:13:22 So, when I came back to Milan,

00:13:26 I still remember,

00:13:27 wearing a summer outfit,

00:13:30 a proper summer outfit,

00:13:31 I said, "I didn't even know

00:13:33 where I was going to be,

00:13:34 because it was really fast."

00:13:36 I went to Milan,

00:13:37 I felt the sensation,

00:13:38 I said, "I'm back home."

00:13:39 I got emotional again,

00:13:41 like when I was a kid,

00:13:42 I relived when I took the bus

00:13:44 to the Lotto square

00:13:45 to go and train in Milan.

00:13:47 A series of things

00:13:48 that were really wonderful.

00:13:50 And the fact that I scored

00:13:52 at Milan,

00:13:53 scoring the first goal,

00:13:55 I'm not a bomber,

00:13:56 was the crowning glory

00:13:57 of a dream of a kid

00:13:58 who started at Buccinasco,

00:14:01 made a major career

00:14:04 and scored with the shirt

00:14:05 where he grew up.

00:14:06 We'll talk about that later.

00:14:06 I'll just add something here.

00:14:08 This morning,

00:14:09 we watched the highlights

00:14:10 of that Brescia-Milan.

00:14:13 It's incredible, in my opinion.

00:14:14 I mean, apart from the fact

00:14:15 that Milan is also emotional for us,

00:14:17 even when you come back today,

00:14:19 it seems like

00:14:21 almost a paradise on earth.

00:14:22 It's a magical place,

00:14:24 you understand why it unites history,

00:14:27 it's a modern place,

00:14:28 but you still see

00:14:29 that it keeps some pictures

00:14:30 from certain times,

00:14:31 certain rooms that have not been touched,

00:14:33 it really sucks up

00:14:35 all that has been.

00:14:36 Do you know what we used to say

00:14:37 in those years

00:14:38 when we were in Milan?

00:14:39 Before 2003.

00:14:41 We were there,

00:14:42 we looked at the photos

00:14:43 and we said,

00:14:43 "Look, we'll put some of our photos there."

00:14:45 So that's a stimulus

00:14:47 for the kids who are there now.

00:14:48 Seeing the pictures

00:14:50 of the years when you won,

00:14:52 of the cups you won,

00:14:54 it's a stimulus,

00:14:54 because at least for us personally,

00:14:56 it stimulated us.

00:14:58 And when we started

00:14:59 to see some of our photos

00:15:00 attached to Milanello,

00:15:02 we started to become aware

00:15:03 that we had done something important

00:15:04 for an impressive club.

00:15:07 You said it,

00:15:09 every player is born

00:15:10 with a sympathy, etc.

00:15:12 But Milan was your family,

00:15:13 because you spent

00:15:14 over 10 years

00:15:16 in the youth sector.

00:15:17 I'm asking you,

00:15:18 what did the youth sector

00:15:19 in Milan leave you with?

00:15:20 How did you get there?

00:15:22 And then you went to play

00:15:24 in the other part of Milan.

00:15:25 Milan is a respectable city,

00:15:26 it's a very sporty derby,

00:15:29 but when you wear this label

00:15:31 of a man who grew up in Milan,

00:15:33 how do you switch

00:15:34 as a professional?

00:15:35 Because it's clear that

00:15:36 you play for Inter

00:15:37 and you're at the total disposal

00:15:39 of Inter.

00:15:40 I was brought there

00:15:41 to make a mistake,

00:15:43 in terms of my youth and everything.

00:15:45 I come from a family,

00:15:46 I've always said,

00:15:47 an Inter family.

00:15:49 But at nine years old,

00:15:51 I arrive in Milan

00:15:52 and I start seeing an incredible Milan.

00:15:54 I had the ticket to go and see

00:15:56 Inter and Milan

00:15:57 and I went to see Milan.

00:15:58 What year was it exactly?

00:15:59 Well, I'm from 1976,

00:16:02 so it was in 1986.

00:16:04 So it was the year

00:16:06 of Silvio Berlusconi.

00:16:07 '85, '86, exactly,

00:16:09 those years.

00:16:10 So I always go to see Milan.

00:16:12 In the year of the Inter's

00:16:14 Scudetto, the one with Trapattoni,

00:16:15 my dad worked on the road,

00:16:17 my parents were separated.

00:16:18 When my dad came back to Milan,

00:16:20 logically, where he took

00:16:21 his son, we went to see him

00:16:23 and he took me to see Inter.

00:16:24 I liked football,

00:16:25 I played and all that.

00:16:26 I went to see Milan,

00:16:27 but when my dad came back,

00:16:29 we had seen that year.

00:16:31 So when I arrived at Inter,

00:16:33 a manager told me,

00:16:34 'Please,

00:16:36 you've been at Milan for 10 years,

00:16:37 you have to see this.'

00:16:38 So I said,

00:16:39 'I'm from an Inter family,

00:16:40 I saw the Scudetto and Trapattoni,

00:16:42 so, Brocchi Interista,

00:16:43 Brocchi Interista, Brocchi Interista.'

00:16:45 Those mistakes are

00:16:47 divine,

00:16:48 because you should never

00:16:49 talk to the lads,

00:16:50 you should never ask them

00:16:52 which team they are,

00:16:53 which team they are,

00:16:53 because then,

00:16:55 you get into a situation

00:16:56 where you're too young

00:16:58 and you don't know how to manage,

00:16:59 or maybe a word is too much

00:17:02 and a word is less than enough.

00:17:03 But I must say,

00:17:07 I was very happy,

00:17:08 because from a certain point of view,

00:17:11 the happiness that a great team

00:17:13 like Inter had spent

00:17:14 so much money on me

00:17:15 was something special.

00:17:17 And objectively,

00:17:18 Milan didn't do that

00:17:19 that year.

00:17:21 So I have a lot of respect

00:17:22 for those who

00:17:24 had their eyes on me.

00:17:25 But the emotion I had

00:17:26 on my return to Milan

00:17:28 is indescribable,

00:17:29 because when you're 14

00:17:31 and you go to Milan for the first time,

00:17:33 you get in there

00:17:34 and you're excited,

00:17:35 you've spent 4 or 5 years there,

00:17:37 the first training sessions

00:17:38 with the first team,

00:17:39 when they call you tomorrow,

00:17:40 you have to train with the first team,

00:17:42 the excitement of the first evening,

00:17:44 the first training session

00:17:45 I had with the first team

00:17:46 of Milan,

00:17:49 where we had gathered

00:17:51 5 or 6 guys from Primavera,

00:17:52 I was in the small rooms,

00:17:53 the ones in the back,

00:17:54 on the other side,

00:17:55 and now I'm back there with you.

00:17:57 It's something really beautiful

00:17:59 and wonderful.

00:18:00 Cristian, who called you

00:18:02 to say "Milan wants you,

00:18:04 I've been talking to you since you were a kid"?

00:18:07 Look, since I was a kid

00:18:08 it was strange,

00:18:10 because an observer at Milan,

00:18:12 but I don't know who,

00:18:14 that day,

00:18:15 in that match,

00:18:16 came to see the opposing team.

00:18:18 What match was it?

00:18:19 It was Buccinasco against,

00:18:20 I don't even remember the name

00:18:22 of the other team.

00:18:23 I was 8 years old.

00:18:24 Instead of taking the guys

00:18:29 from the team I was going to see,

00:18:31 they called me to do the draw

00:18:33 for my team's number 3.

00:18:36 At the time,

00:18:37 there were draw-in draws.

00:18:39 If you went to the draw,

00:18:40 they would take many players,

00:18:42 they would play 11 against 11,

00:18:45 there were the observers on the bench

00:18:46 watching,

00:18:47 and then the best ones

00:18:49 would select them and maybe

00:18:51 call you for the second draw

00:18:53 to play another match.

00:18:54 So, that's how it started.

00:18:56 My first fans,

00:18:58 there was Zagatti,

00:19:02 the legendary Faustino Braga,

00:19:04 people who knew about football,

00:19:08 they understood.

00:19:10 From then on,

00:19:12 I was lucky

00:19:15 to have good coaches,

00:19:18 they took me right away.

00:19:19 They took all three of us.

00:19:22 Then we played our first season,

00:19:23 and at the end of the season,

00:19:24 my two teammates

00:19:26 didn't confirm their names,

00:19:27 and I was left.

00:19:30 But your dad told you,

00:19:32 who told you

00:19:33 "Milan wants you"?

00:19:34 No, the company, Bucinasco,

00:19:36 because they called me

00:19:37 to go to the draw.

00:19:38 Then, once the draw was over,

00:19:41 they would talk to the company

00:19:42 and to my parents.

00:19:45 I was lucky

00:19:47 to go to Milan,

00:19:48 because my grandfather

00:19:50 retired that year

00:19:51 and had to make a choice,

00:19:52 to keep working

00:19:55 to pay for the house,

00:19:57 we didn't live on the gold.

00:19:59 Or, since they took us in three,

00:20:02 Milan gave us a refund.

00:20:04 So, basically,

00:20:04 my parents and the other two kids

00:20:07 agreed to the refund of all three of us.

00:20:08 Autists.

00:20:09 My grandfather went,

00:20:10 and he practically became

00:20:11 the driver to take us.

00:20:13 Then, after the first year

00:20:14 went so well,

00:20:15 the other two kids were gone,

00:20:17 my grandfather cut their salary

00:20:19 by two thirds,

00:20:21 but he kept doing it

00:20:22 until he was 14,

00:20:24 when he couldn't go alone,

00:20:25 because even when he was born,

00:20:27 it wasn't the most comfortable

00:20:29 with the vehicles and everything,

00:20:30 at my house.

00:20:31 He was there,

00:20:32 and if it weren't for my grandparents,

00:20:33 I wouldn't have been able to continue.

00:20:36 Did your father see you play

00:20:37 in Serie A, your grandfather?

00:20:38 Yes, he saw me.

00:20:40 My grandparents were my first fans.

00:20:42 But also...

00:20:46 my father,

00:20:47 certainly with a very strong character,

00:20:50 a very strong person,

00:20:53 always lived it with a detached emotion.

00:20:58 He never wanted to show me,

00:21:01 but he had an incredible pride.

00:21:03 My father did it alone,

00:21:06 he worked all his life,

00:21:08 he was a shipyard worker.

00:21:10 Despite this,

00:21:11 he always continued to do his job,

00:21:13 he always did everything he had to do.

00:21:15 He had an incredible emotion for me,

00:21:18 and he expressed it, of course,

00:21:21 in some moments in his own way.

00:21:22 My mother, on the other hand,

00:21:23 made me study.

00:21:25 Once she didn't let me go to train

00:21:27 for a week,

00:21:28 until you don't study,

00:21:29 you don't go to train anymore,

00:21:30 the year before going to Milan.

00:21:32 That was a great lesson,

00:21:33 which I'm trying to pass on to my children.

00:21:36 And the good thing was

00:21:37 to have a family that always followed me,

00:21:40 always,

00:21:41 it never missed a game or something,

00:21:43 but it never allowed itself to tell me,

00:21:45 "Do this, do that,

00:21:47 it's better if you do this,

00:21:48 it's better if you do that".

00:21:49 That was my luck.

00:21:50 How much did your parents

00:21:52 help you grow up?

00:21:52 I mean, I remember your dad

00:21:53 was a shipyard worker,

00:21:55 and you, not to trivialise

00:21:57 the footballer Brocchi,

00:21:59 but you were someone who worked a lot, right?

00:22:01 Yes, although maybe characteristically

00:22:02 this thigh,

00:22:03 I got it from my mother,

00:22:06 because my mother is a good hammer,

00:22:10 she was always one,

00:22:11 she too,

00:22:13 my mother was between 18 and 19 years old

00:22:17 when I got pregnant,

00:22:21 and my father had two more,

00:22:23 so they were young boys,

00:22:24 who got married,

00:22:25 and at the age of six,

00:22:27 being so young, they split up,

00:22:29 and I was one of the boys

00:22:31 nowadays,

00:22:31 and it was normal, unfortunately.

00:22:33 But in my time,

00:22:35 I was the only one in the class,

00:22:36 it wasn't like that,

00:22:37 but I've always grown up

00:22:39 with a lot of love,

00:22:41 they've always been there for me.

00:22:43 My mother has certainly given

00:22:44 something important to my life,

00:22:46 from the point of view of

00:22:47 the desire to assert yourself,

00:22:49 the desire to achieve goals,

00:22:51 and seeing my father

00:22:52 doing that job,

00:22:53 and having that thing,

00:22:55 they've certainly influenced

00:22:57 my growth,

00:22:58 from the point of view of

00:22:59 wanting to achieve something.

00:23:01 Great.

00:23:01 But let's start with your career

00:23:04 as a professional,

00:23:04 because you were a sixth grader,

00:23:07 so you were close to home,

00:23:08 Lumezzane,

00:23:09 the old C2,

00:23:11 then the C1,

00:23:11 you went through a setback,

00:23:13 then Verona in Serie B,

00:23:15 the classic example of Gavetta.

00:23:17 So, I'd like you to tell us

00:23:19 about that period,

00:23:20 and then I'll get to a topic

00:23:21 I mentioned earlier,

00:23:22 when you totally forget

00:23:24 your passion as a kid,

00:23:25 and start living as a professional,

00:23:26 when you really get to

00:23:28 the first team,

00:23:29 when you understand

00:23:30 you can be a footballer,

00:23:31 when you gradually

00:23:33 forget about your passion,

00:23:35 let's call it passion,

00:23:35 let's call it commitment.

00:23:37 No, this was my...

00:23:39 how I lived those years

00:23:43 was my strength,

00:23:44 so, I went to the first two years

00:23:47 of my professional career,

00:23:49 after the Milan spring,

00:23:51 and that was my first disappointment

00:23:55 in the football world,

00:23:56 because I said, "Damn,

00:23:57 I spent ten years

00:23:58 in the youth academy in Milan,

00:23:59 captain of the spring team,

00:24:01 captain of the Beretti team,

00:24:02 captain of the...

00:24:04 I thought that Milan

00:24:06 could have a better chance

00:24:08 than me,

00:24:09 but maybe in those years

00:24:10 they had a better chance

00:24:10 than three or four other guys,

00:24:13 and they sent me to the youth academy

00:24:16 for more property,

00:24:18 but with a...

00:24:20 Rebuyment?

00:24:21 Yes, they said,

00:24:22 "Before selling it to another team,

00:24:23 you have to ask us,

00:24:24 and we at that point,

00:24:25 because there were not

00:24:26 all the things yet,

00:24:27 but the agreements were those."

00:24:29 So, a little disappointment,

00:24:30 but the luck I had,

00:24:32 I never thought about...

00:24:36 "I want to win the Champions League,

00:24:38 I want to get there,

00:24:39 I want that obsession,

00:24:42 or if that one comes,

00:24:44 I'll get there too,

00:24:45 or I'm stronger than that one,

00:24:47 or all these things.

00:24:49 Why my teammates

00:24:51 who were with me in the spring,

00:24:53 where this is not stronger than me,

00:24:55 and yet they went to play there?

00:24:56 I never said that.

00:24:58 I always prepared the game

00:24:59 on Saturday or Sunday,

00:25:02 with enthusiasm, desire and commitment.

00:25:04 So I started running,

00:25:05 working,

00:25:07 doing everything I could do

00:25:09 for...

00:25:09 In fact, I did the first two years

00:25:10 at the Pro Sesto,

00:25:11 the third year I could go to Serie B,

00:25:13 because they wanted me

00:25:14 in Serie B,

00:25:15 but I had the military service.

00:25:17 That year, there was still

00:25:18 the military service.

00:25:19 So I decided

00:25:20 not to go to Serie B,

00:25:22 I got in touch with Lumezzane,

00:25:24 because they wanted me,

00:25:25 and they were wonderful people,

00:25:26 we shook hands and I said,

00:25:27 "Ok, I'm coming to Lumezzane,

00:25:29 you pay me a tot,

00:25:31 if next year

00:25:32 a team comes to Serie B

00:25:34 that gives you the same money

00:25:35 you paid me this year,

00:25:37 from there or more,

00:25:38 but at least the ones you took out,

00:25:40 you can't say no

00:25:42 and you let me go."

00:25:43 Mister, I have a big question

00:25:44 in the middle of your speech,

00:25:46 which I really care about.

00:25:47 I imagine...

00:25:49 Let's talk about 30 years ago,

00:25:52 when you made the leap

00:25:53 to the first team, maybe.

00:25:54 Yes, '29.

00:25:54 30 years ago,

00:25:56 a young captain

00:25:58 of a Milan spring

00:26:00 went to Serie B,

00:26:02 and he approached,

00:26:03 I imagine,

00:26:04 I'm sure,

00:26:05 with great respect

00:26:06 to the veterans of Serie C,

00:26:08 which we know

00:26:09 are old-fashioned,

00:26:11 and you have to be very careful.

00:26:12 At the time it was like that.

00:26:14 And now I'm asking you,

00:26:15 and now,

00:26:16 how has the world changed in this sense?

00:26:19 I don't want to talk about respect,

00:26:21 but I'll put it in there.

00:26:23 Yes, in my opinion,

00:26:24 it's not a form of respect,

00:26:26 because even today's kids

00:26:29 when they enter a dressing room,

00:26:30 maybe outside,

00:26:31 outside not,

00:26:32 but inside a dressing room,

00:26:34 even today's kids

00:26:35 have a kind of respect.

00:26:38 Then there were the stupid kids in my time,

00:26:40 and there are still stupid kids today,

00:26:42 but that's another story.

00:26:44 But I'm telling you,

00:26:45 seeing the older players,

00:26:48 the ones who had to bring home

00:26:49 their salary at the end of the month,

00:26:50 because they had to support

00:26:52 their wives and children,

00:26:53 and in Serie C,

00:26:54 salaries aren't that high.

00:26:57 So,

00:26:58 it's a different kind of hunger,

00:27:01 a different goal,

00:27:03 because you're still living

00:27:05 what you dream of,

00:27:06 your game,

00:27:08 something you've wanted to do

00:27:09 since you were a kid.

00:27:10 But maybe there's someone who

00:27:12 has already taken a step forward

00:27:15 and is doing it

00:27:16 because he has to bring home his salary,

00:27:17 because he has to support his family,

00:27:19 because he has to create a future.

00:27:20 So, it's definitely not easy.

00:27:23 Today's kids are a bit lighter

00:27:25 on this.

00:27:27 Even if I have to be honest,

00:27:28 I can't go against

00:27:31 today's kids.

00:27:32 When you talk,

00:27:33 they're only on social media,

00:27:35 they've moved away from those things.

00:27:38 It's not the kids' fault,

00:27:40 it's our society's fault in general.

00:27:42 Because when we're done,

00:27:45 the first thing I'll do

00:27:47 when I get up to leave

00:27:49 is this.

00:27:51 I'll take my phone,

00:27:52 I'll do this and start looking

00:27:53 at the things I have to look at.

00:27:55 Imagine if the three of us

00:27:57 took this object away.

00:27:59 We'd be in great trouble too.

00:28:01 So, it's society that has evolved

00:28:05 in a way...

00:28:06 I always say there are three steps.

00:28:07 There's a step between my grandparents

00:28:12 and my parents.

00:28:14 A step between my parents and us.

00:28:18 Two steps between us and our children.

00:28:22 Because society is moving too fast now.

00:28:25 It's moving too fast.

00:28:26 So, while between us and the various generations

00:28:28 there was only one step,

00:28:30 between us and our children there are two,

00:28:32 because everything has accelerated.

00:28:34 And these kids sometimes take the blame

00:28:37 that is actually linked to the world we live in

00:28:40 and to what they have to...

00:28:43 where they were used to, where they grew up

00:28:45 and how they grew up.

00:28:46 I have this question here,

00:28:47 the first one I wanted to ask you.

00:28:49 Now we're a bit...

00:28:50 It's nice to go back to the memories,

00:28:53 so we're jumping left and right.

00:28:56 Speaking of today's youth,

00:28:57 I often hear a lot of disquisitions

00:29:01 about the strongest,

00:29:02 but I hear about your generation...

00:29:05 There's only one.

00:29:06 I have no doubt, I've always been with you.

00:29:09 Now he's making me go crazy, it's Ronaldo.

00:29:11 It's Ronaldo.

00:29:12 And I tell you this, when I hear and see,

00:29:14 forgive this personal deviation,

00:29:15 but in this podcast we'll come out of it too.

00:29:18 I say, when I hear "It's Cristiano Ronaldo",

00:29:21 let's leave Messi out of it,

00:29:22 but Cristiano Ronaldo,

00:29:24 rather than this, rather than that,

00:29:26 even from kids who have seen Ronaldo play like us,

00:29:30 one, if you hear Maldini, Costa Curta, Nesta,

00:29:34 and they say, "Ronaldo is impossible."

00:29:36 But I remember the last Ronaldo at Milan,

00:29:40 who, let's be clear,

00:29:41 with all due respect to a phenomenon,

00:29:42 was not in shape,

00:29:43 he scored two goals on the pitch, walking.

00:29:45 When you get to that level,

00:29:48 not counting Ronaldo, Inter,

00:29:50 or the year before,

00:29:51 you lived it at Inter and you lived it at Milan,

00:29:54 and that's why I'm asking you,

00:29:55 help me, this personal battle,

00:29:57 which I've never started,

00:29:57 but I want to start and end with you,

00:29:59 explain to all the young people,

00:30:00 and even less, what Ronaldo was like.

00:30:03 I'll put the young people in place in just a second.

00:30:08 Today, there are those who are pro Messi

00:30:12 and those who are pro Ronaldo.

00:30:15 The great thing about Ronaldo the phenomenon

00:30:17 is that you have to think,

00:30:19 so pro one, pro the other,

00:30:22 you have to think that you'll never agree.

00:30:26 There's only one person in the world

00:30:27 who can agree with you,

00:30:29 and that's Ronaldo the phenomenon,

00:30:30 because he had exactly the technical qualities,

00:30:33 the spirit and the things of Messi,

00:30:36 and Cristiano Ronaldo's physical strength,

00:30:42 and the sense of goal.

00:30:43 Let's put Messi and Ronaldo together,

00:30:46 and he's exactly in the middle,

00:30:48 between one and the other.

00:30:50 But there's a moment...

00:30:51 Everyone would agree.

00:30:52 There's a moment when, seeing him on the pitch,

00:30:53 it was obvious to everyone,

00:30:54 from the VHS, from the live, from the stadium,

00:30:57 but you, who had him in the dressing room...

00:30:58 I'm sure that, looking at him on the VHS,

00:31:01 I understand the guys, even today,

00:31:03 those who haven't seen him much,

00:31:05 who can't put him at Messi's level

00:31:09 or at CR7's level.

00:31:11 I understand these guys,

00:31:15 but we, who saw him with our own eyes,

00:31:18 who faced him in the game,

00:31:19 we played together,

00:31:21 or we trained together.

00:31:23 He's an alien.

00:31:26 He was something...

00:31:27 and we saw strong players,

00:31:29 because we had some strong players in Milan,

00:31:32 but he was something...

00:31:34 he was something unthinkable,

00:31:38 something out of the ordinary.

00:31:40 Can you give us two frames of your Ronaldo?

00:31:42 Ronaldo with his knees...

00:31:44 Look, at Inter, when I was there,

00:31:47 he was injured,

00:31:48 it was his first major injury.

00:31:50 The problem is that he...

00:31:51 I'll give you an example,

00:31:52 I remember the times,

00:31:54 but in February or March,

00:31:55 between the end of February and the beginning of March,

00:31:57 he could start again with the team,

00:32:00 do some training,

00:32:02 some games, not 100%.

00:32:04 We were in a very difficult moment,

00:32:07 we were doing very badly that year.

00:32:09 He came to play the game

00:32:11 and they said, "He can't play,

00:32:12 he can't play, he's always slow."

00:32:14 That's all.

00:32:15 He took the ball,

00:32:16 "Tshum, tshum, tshum, goal."

00:32:17 "Tshum, tshum, tshum, goal."

00:32:19 "Tshum, tshum, tshum, goal."

00:32:20 And we said, "Why can't he play?"

00:32:23 Because it was something,

00:32:25 it was something incredibly big.

00:32:29 It was something...

00:32:30 He would move the ball,

00:32:31 boom, he'd say, "I'll do this," and he'd do it.

00:32:33 And then he'd play some moves

00:32:36 that you didn't even think about,

00:32:37 and he'd already done them.

00:32:39 So, that was a gift.

00:32:42 That's a gift, guys.

00:32:43 You don't train that, that's a gift.

00:32:45 Messi has a gift.

00:32:47 Ronaldo had a gift,

00:32:49 because you don't train those things.

00:32:51 It's something incredibly big.

00:32:53 And in Milan, I remember in a game...

00:32:56 but I'm not going to say, "Pass it to me,"

00:33:00 don't tell me which game,

00:33:02 because it wouldn't be nice,

00:33:03 but I can say it.

00:33:05 Ronny was a bit...

00:33:08 indecent.

00:33:09 He wasn't taking a ball.

00:33:12 He wasn't doing that.

00:33:14 At a certain point, Ronny, come on,

00:33:16 come on, Ronny, he's so cool.

00:33:18 Because another quality of Ronny

00:33:20 was his sympathy.

00:33:21 You loved him.

00:33:22 You know, sometimes he was really nice,

00:33:25 you loved him so much.

00:33:27 "Come on, Ronny, that's the way."

00:33:30 He'd look at you once,

00:33:32 look at you twice.

00:33:33 At a certain point,

00:33:34 one of us, with a slightly stronger tone,

00:33:38 said, "Ronny, you're broken now.

00:33:41 Wake up, give us a hand,

00:33:43 at least run a bit."

00:33:44 He'd look and say, "Now I score a goal.

00:33:47 Then don't talk anymore, though."

00:33:49 And he'd do that.

00:33:50 He'd turn around, take the ball,

00:33:53 bam, goal.

00:33:55 He'd turn around and say, "OK?"

00:33:57 Oh, Ronny.

00:33:58 No, incredible.

00:33:59 They were players who did what they wanted.

00:34:01 How was he in the dressing room?

00:34:02 Very nice, very nice.

00:34:05 He was a wonderful boy.

00:34:07 Even today, when we see each other,

00:34:09 he comes to say hello, he laughs,

00:34:11 he always has that smile.

00:34:13 No, he was really a boy...

00:34:15 He was incredibly important to me,

00:34:18 that's why I call him "him".

00:34:19 Let's talk about Serie B,

00:34:20 Verona.

00:34:22 You met Cesare Prandelli,

00:34:23 who you always said was a teacher for you,

00:34:25 perhaps the coach who left you the most.

00:34:27 Absolutely.

00:34:28 It was one of the first games in Serie B.

00:34:30 You probably started to understand,

00:34:32 even if you hadn't the focus of reaching

00:34:34 who knows how high,

00:34:35 you thought about game after game,

00:34:36 but it was the second Serie B,

00:34:38 it was an important square like Verona,

00:34:40 and you played against Milan.

00:34:41 Yes, and then you realise I'd played in Lumezzane,

00:34:44 where there were few people to see you.

00:34:46 In the Pro Sesto,

00:34:48 where there are not many people,

00:34:51 when I arrived in Verona,

00:34:53 the first game, you turned around

00:34:55 and saw that corner, the stadium was full,

00:34:57 it was something different.

00:34:59 So, that was the first step,

00:35:00 but with excitement.

00:35:02 I mean, every time I got the ball in Verona,

00:35:06 and I'd start, maybe I'd get a ball back,

00:35:09 I'd start and I'd hear this "whoa",

00:35:11 this "bolja",

00:35:13 and these things are important for a kid,

00:35:16 they make you feel better,

00:35:17 you're in the middle of your physical strength,

00:35:19 you don't feel anything,

00:35:20 you'd go up against the walls.

00:35:22 So, that was the first important step,

00:35:26 even if I still didn't realise

00:35:29 I could get there.

00:35:32 I definitely had a goal,

00:35:34 which was to win,

00:35:36 or to repay, rather than win,

00:35:39 to repay the trust that a coach like Prandelli

00:35:42 had put in me at all costs in Verona.

00:35:44 It was his first purchase.

00:35:45 I was Prandelli's first purchase in Verona,

00:35:48 and Prandelli's first purchase in Florence,

00:35:50 30 years later.

00:35:52 So, I wanted to repay

00:35:55 the trust he had put in me.

00:35:56 It was an incredible year,

00:35:58 we won the league with a team

00:35:59 that didn't have to win the league,

00:36:00 it wasn't built to win the league,

00:36:03 it was built to amaze

00:36:05 and maybe create some young players,

00:36:07 because that was the club's mentality.

00:36:09 And so it was.

00:36:10 We won and we certainly created some players.

00:36:14 So, sorry, Fra,

00:36:16 but it was always more adrenaline than fear,

00:36:18 more exaltation than pressure.

00:36:20 I'll tell you the truth,

00:36:21 in my life,

00:36:23 in a football match or in a moment,

00:36:27 I've never been afraid.

00:36:29 Fear has never existed for me.

00:36:31 There was definitely...

00:36:33 - Tension. - Tension.

00:36:36 In some matches,

00:36:38 there was more tension than in others.

00:36:40 Maybe this tension,

00:36:42 if you can't manage it,

00:36:43 sometimes you can play bad jokes,

00:36:45 so maybe you can play a bad match,

00:36:47 and even if you trained very well,

00:36:50 if you did everything you had to do,

00:36:53 maybe you play badly one match,

00:36:54 two matches, three matches,

00:36:56 but because maybe it's the tension

00:36:58 that leads you to not being free.

00:37:01 But fear, I've never been afraid to play football.

00:37:03 Instead, we ask you,

00:37:04 is it a case that that Verona player,

00:37:06 Prandelli, a coach,

00:37:08 had in his rose the following future coaches?

00:37:12 Brocchi, Aglietti, Corini, Colucci, Italiano.

00:37:15 Is it a case, or when you're a great coach,

00:37:18 of course you need something in you, but...

00:37:22 I'll tell you, like in my Milan,

00:37:23 many of my former teammates

00:37:26 talk about Ancelotti,

00:37:29 and they become coaches,

00:37:31 in that Verona,

00:37:33 all these names you gave me

00:37:34 talk about Prandelli,

00:37:36 because in your career,

00:37:38 there's always a coach

00:37:39 who gave you something more than the others.

00:37:41 I say, for example, I was incredibly lucky,

00:37:43 because it's true that I say Prandelli,

00:37:45 because on a tactical level

00:37:48 and on a preparation level,

00:37:49 in the game, also from a mental point of view,

00:37:51 he's the one who made me make the quality leap.

00:37:53 On a tactical level, he taught me a lot.

00:37:56 Right?

00:37:57 But more than anything, because I had Lippi,

00:38:00 I had Ancelotti.

00:38:02 I mean, Ancelotti,

00:38:03 he didn't have to play with us

00:38:04 and do who knows how many tactical jobs.

00:38:08 Because the team was a formed team,

00:38:11 a team of great champions,

00:38:12 a team that had a game identity

00:38:13 that he had given us.

00:38:15 But he was a great coach

00:38:17 in many ways,

00:38:18 and even the things we did on the pitch

00:38:20 were all designed

00:38:21 to make us play in that way.

00:38:23 But there was no exasperation

00:38:25 about the tactical teaching,

00:38:27 because many of us already had the basics

00:38:30 that allowed you to do

00:38:31 what he asked you to do.

00:38:33 While Prandelli had to build,

00:38:34 and that's why we,

00:38:36 that group of former ELAS players,

00:38:41 had him in the lead,

00:38:43 because we were young

00:38:43 and he definitely left us something.

00:38:45 But how did you approach a coach

00:38:47 to make you perform?

00:38:49 Did he have to be more of a psychologist,

00:38:50 more of a friend, more of a father,

00:38:51 more of a shepherd?

00:38:53 He had to be honest.

00:38:54 He had to be honest.

00:38:56 He had to have a relationship with me.

00:38:59 For me, coaches have to have

00:39:01 relationships with players.

00:39:02 There are coaches who say

00:39:04 "I don't want to have relationships

00:39:04 with players.

00:39:05 This is how I do it.

00:39:06 I don't care.

00:39:07 If you're okay with it,

00:39:08 then go away."

00:39:09 It's a choice.

00:39:10 I'm not saying it's right or wrong,

00:39:13 it's a choice.

00:39:14 I, on the other hand,

00:39:16 in my years with coaches

00:39:17 with whom I had a relationship,

00:39:19 and they had a relationship,

00:39:20 not just with me,

00:39:21 but with the team,

00:39:23 those are the years where,

00:39:23 who knows why,

00:39:24 we got results.

00:39:26 While in a couple of seasons

00:39:28 when the coach was cold,

00:39:32 detached,

00:39:33 he never gave you...

00:39:36 Yes, he'd make a joke

00:39:37 every 20 days,

00:39:38 but you knew it was forced.

00:39:41 He didn't create that empathy

00:39:43 with the team.

00:39:44 We didn't get results.

00:39:46 So I think this is

00:39:49 a very, very important factor.

00:39:51 I'd say that,

00:39:53 you mentioned Ancelotti,

00:39:54 I'd open this whole

00:39:55 huge parenthesis.

00:39:57 We could stay here.

00:39:59 How was Carlo?

00:40:00 He was wonderful.

00:40:02 Wonderful because,

00:40:03 and I'm telling you,

00:40:04 he wasn't a non-movable star.

00:40:06 Otherwise,

00:40:07 those who have always played,

00:40:09 who have played

00:40:11 all the starting games,

00:40:12 talk about him as a wonderful person,

00:40:14 but it's easier for them to say it.

00:40:16 I had a wonderful relationship.

00:40:19 In seven years,

00:40:20 maybe only a couple of times,

00:40:23 there was a period

00:40:25 that was less beautiful

00:40:27 between me and him,

00:40:28 because maybe at that moment

00:40:30 I deserved something more

00:40:32 and he didn't give it to me,

00:40:34 but he was aware of it,

00:40:36 because it was an open book.

00:40:38 So when he was in trouble

00:40:42 with you because he knew

00:40:43 you were right,

00:40:44 he made you understand,

00:40:45 but he didn't tell you.

00:40:46 So at that point,

00:40:47 you couldn't do anything.

00:40:49 He was a wonderful man,

00:40:51 he could make everyone feel good,

00:40:52 he could make you feel important.

00:40:55 I always remember,

00:40:57 in an interview he did at IEA,

00:41:01 he asked which player

00:41:03 he'd underrated the most,

00:41:04 and he said Christian Brocchi.

00:41:05 And that's an incredible compliment

00:41:08 from a great coach like him.

00:41:10 Why?

00:41:11 Because he knew

00:41:12 he could always count on me.

00:41:14 In the end,

00:41:16 as I said before,

00:41:18 in those quarterfinals with Ajax,

00:41:20 in the first leg semi-final with Inter,

00:41:24 if Brocchi,

00:41:24 instead of being one of the best on the pitch,

00:41:27 had been the worst on the pitch,

00:41:29 maybe the games would have ended differently,

00:41:33 also because of a single player.

00:41:34 Mister, I wanted to ask you,

00:41:36 if you were a player,

00:41:38 and as you see players today,

00:41:40 when they don't play,

00:41:41 is it right to explain why,

00:41:44 or does the coach have to explain?

00:41:47 And on the contrary,

00:41:48 if the player comes,

00:41:49 with respect,

00:41:50 to ask why I don't play,

00:41:52 what I can improve,

00:41:54 how does a coach see it?

00:41:56 This is the most difficult part.

00:41:58 I think there are two different worlds.

00:42:01 Those who say they don't have to explain,

00:42:03 because if you don't play,

00:42:04 it's because it's a technical choice,

00:42:05 so it's useless to say

00:42:06 because you don't play,

00:42:07 it's a technical choice.

00:42:08 On the other hand, there are those

00:42:10 who like to talk

00:42:11 and give an explanation.

00:42:13 I always say that

00:42:15 either you do it like this,

00:42:15 you never give an explanation,

00:42:17 and it's the same for everyone,

00:42:19 or if you decide to go into it,

00:42:22 you have to tell the truth.

00:42:25 You have to be 100% honest.

00:42:28 This time it's not good, you say.

00:42:30 No, because if you go

00:42:32 and talk to a player

00:42:34 and tell him about it,

00:42:35 the players are not stupid.

00:42:37 So, you either tell the truth,

00:42:38 and you accept the dialogue,

00:42:40 or if you have to say something negative,

00:42:44 something...

00:42:46 not negative, sorry,

00:42:47 something not true,

00:42:50 to get out of that dialogue,

00:42:52 it's better not to talk,

00:42:54 because the player will leave,

00:42:55 and if he feels taken aback,

00:42:58 it also affects the relationship

00:43:00 and the esteem,

00:43:01 so the player might...

00:43:02 I don't know if you remember,

00:43:03 but we saw in the last few years

00:43:05 of your career,

00:43:05 that the debut in Serie A

00:43:07 on the Milan bench

00:43:08 by Carlo Ancelotti,

00:43:10 the starting XI, Christian Brocchi.

00:43:12 With Piacenza?

00:43:12 Yes, Piacenza.

00:43:13 I missed a goal.

00:43:15 Yes, Ancelotti's first chance...

00:43:18 Did you expect to play as a starting XI?

00:43:20 How did it go?

00:43:21 I knew there was a vacancy

00:43:23 in those days,

00:43:24 I had done well

00:43:25 in the Coppa Italia match,

00:43:27 so he put me in a role

00:43:29 that was a bit unusual,

00:43:30 because we played 4-4-2,

00:43:32 I played wide on the left,

00:43:34 and I remember that cross

00:43:35 that went down against him,

00:43:39 it seemed to me,

00:43:41 high, that went down,

00:43:43 I came running,

00:43:44 I tried to hit it...

00:43:45 You still remember it?

00:43:46 Yes, because...

00:43:47 Because you stayed in?

00:43:48 Because I stayed...

00:43:49 I had a few goals,

00:43:52 the missed ones,

00:43:55 or the ones that went out like that,

00:43:57 I have them as memories.

00:43:59 I remember that one,

00:44:00 because that's a matter of a centimetre.

00:44:03 That's a centimetre.

00:44:04 That mistake is a centimetre,

00:44:07 so it's not good or bad.

00:44:09 I think Lobont's is even less than a centimetre.

00:44:12 Lobont's is one of the greatest...

00:44:13 How do you remember it, coach?

00:44:15 I remember it because...

00:44:19 I scored in the C2,

00:44:20 I scored in the C1,

00:44:21 I scored in the B2,

00:44:22 I scored in the A2,

00:44:23 I scored in the Europa League,

00:44:25 even though I didn't score many goals in my career.

00:44:28 I don't think that's even true.

00:44:30 And he missed the Champions League goal.

00:44:34 And what a game!

00:44:35 And that was a goal.

00:44:36 That was a goal, for God's sake.

00:44:37 With the VAR...

00:44:39 It was in, but it was in so much.

00:44:41 I had two episodes in my career like that.

00:44:44 The Champions League with Ajax,

00:44:47 and the one in a Naples-Lazio,

00:44:49 decisive for the Champions League,

00:44:51 where we lost 4-3, I think.

00:44:54 And a beautiful shot from off the box,

00:44:59 he crosses, he goes in,

00:45:00 the ball comes out,

00:45:02 and they didn't score a goal for me there either.

00:45:03 So, two in my career aren't that few.

00:45:07 Listen, but that Milan-Ajax thing,

00:45:09 it's incredible.

00:45:11 It's something really beautiful,

00:45:13 something beautiful because...

00:45:15 I remember it as if it were yesterday,

00:45:19 because I remember it was always a bit of a pride of mine.

00:45:24 That game with Ajax and the derby against Inter,

00:45:27 because quarter-finals and semi-finals are two fundamental games,

00:45:31 it's not a one-time thing.

00:45:33 They're games from the inside out,

00:45:35 they're really tough games.

00:45:36 That game was really beautiful,

00:45:38 played well, with a commitment.

00:45:43 But you know what I had?

00:45:44 The luck I had in my career

00:45:47 is that when I wore the shirt,

00:45:50 I looked and said,

00:45:52 "Every single person who's sitting here looking at me

00:45:55 would like to be in my place.

00:45:57 How can I not give everything I have?"

00:45:59 That doesn't mean you played well,

00:46:01 you couldn't make a mistake,

00:46:03 but on a level of desire,

00:46:06 of energy,

00:46:07 of spirit, of dedication,

00:46:10 of what a player must have,

00:46:12 that he must respect all these people who came there,

00:46:15 who pay to look at you,

00:46:17 who travelled miles to look at you,

00:46:19 and who would like to be in your place.

00:46:21 That's the best thing ever.

00:46:23 It's always been like that for me.

00:46:24 That game, I remember it vividly,

00:46:28 when we went to win the draw,

00:46:31 and then the 3-2 came from nowhere,

00:46:33 they took the ball and left,

00:46:34 I couldn't run anymore.

00:46:37 In that area, I don't run to give a sign,

00:46:42 because sometimes it's the run of a player.

00:46:45 In my career, I've seen it happen.

00:46:48 In the difficult moments of a game,

00:46:50 when you're down to ten minutes, five minutes,

00:46:53 a player who runs to give you a sign,

00:46:58 gives a sign to his teammates,

00:47:00 to the people,

00:47:02 and to the opposing team.

00:47:04 Ah, Rino Manchester is something...

00:47:06 Rino's, he did it a few times.

00:47:09 I had a clear memory of that occasion,

00:47:14 when I see teams that are drawing,

00:47:17 losing, and have to recover.

00:47:18 And I don't see a player

00:47:20 who, five minutes from the end,

00:47:22 the ball comes out and does that stupid gesture.

00:47:26 It's not about saying, "Change the game there."

00:47:30 It's the sign you give that's important.

00:47:33 Some people believe in these things,

00:47:34 me,

00:47:35 some people say, "What are you saying?"

00:47:38 Giroud often has these back-and-forth moves,

00:47:40 trying to get a ball back,

00:47:42 which maybe isn't really his,

00:47:43 to give those signs.

00:47:44 It's a sign.

00:47:45 Guys, it's not something you do

00:47:47 because you get the ball back, dribble everything,

00:47:51 and you have to score.

00:47:52 No, you know it's a stupid run,

00:47:54 but even when you have to get the ball back,

00:47:57 you know it's a back-and-forth,

00:47:59 and three seconds before it doesn't change anything.

00:48:02 But it's what you give.

00:48:04 You're telling your teammates,

00:48:07 let's believe in ourselves,

00:48:08 you're telling your opponents,

00:48:10 "Let's score."

00:48:12 You're asking the fans for help at home.

00:48:16 You're scaring them away.

00:48:19 I want to stay on Inter,

00:48:20 and then I'll leave you with what we want to talk about.

00:48:25 It's a bit bad to talk about Inter,

00:48:26 because we're in Milan,

00:48:27 but there's a lot of respect between the fans.

00:48:30 That's the beauty of Milan,

00:48:31 there's a lot of respect between the two clubs.

00:48:34 But I have two questions for you,

00:48:35 having lived here, at Inter.

00:48:38 First, about Pirlo.

00:48:39 If you saw he was a player who could come on,

00:48:42 and everyone at the time didn't want to demonise anyone,

00:48:44 because at Milan, Juve, great players came on,

00:48:46 Henry, Vieira, with their parables.

00:48:50 But I wanted to ask you about Pirlo,

00:48:52 and how you lived in the Milan dressing room, 6-0.

00:48:57 Well...

00:49:00 Fortunately, I wasn't there.

00:49:06 So I lived outside, that 6-0,

00:49:10 and I didn't live...

00:49:11 But in the dressing room...

00:49:13 So I missed that part.

00:49:16 But honestly, regardless of everything,

00:49:19 it's true that there's a lot of respect between the fans in Milan.

00:49:23 It's true, but it's also true that you want to win.

00:49:26 Of course.

00:49:27 Because it's fair, the derby is always the derby, guys.

00:49:30 Regardless of the respect,

00:49:31 which is also a matter of intelligence,

00:49:33 but still, he took advantage of it.

00:49:36 The desire to win, the desire...

00:49:38 Some sort of quarrel between friends is also there,

00:49:42 but winning six goals in a derby is a lot.

00:49:45 It's something that hurts,

00:49:48 it's something you don't get rid of so easily,

00:49:52 because...

00:49:53 Maybe...

00:49:56 Maybe in Milan, the fans,

00:50:01 after the next derby,

00:50:05 or two derbies later, if you win the other one,

00:50:08 you start to let it slip away.

00:50:10 The player stays in the team for a while,

00:50:12 because it's something special.

00:50:14 Pirlo?

00:50:15 Pirlo, on the other hand...

00:50:18 What can I say?

00:50:19 Andrea...

00:50:20 I played against him when we were young,

00:50:23 and you could see him with his elegance, his shots.

00:50:27 But he played as a three-pointer,

00:50:30 and I'll tell you the truth,

00:50:31 as a three-pointer, Andrea was strong,

00:50:34 because he had those qualities.

00:50:36 But I think he was missing something in those years,

00:50:42 which could have been due to his youth,

00:50:45 or because he needed to go down that path.

00:50:49 But he was a very strong player,

00:50:51 a very strong three-pointer,

00:50:53 but he was still missing something.

00:50:55 And I think he earned that something

00:50:58 in his position on the pitch.

00:50:59 Because a count is when he takes the ball

00:51:02 with his shoulders turned,

00:51:04 or half-open with his body,

00:51:06 a count is when he takes the ball

00:51:08 and looks at everything.

00:51:09 When Andrea takes the ball and looks at everything,

00:51:13 we can say goodbye.

00:51:15 Good night, dreamers.

00:51:17 Speaking of winning derbies,

00:51:19 I'd like to close that incredible May 2003,

00:51:22 because it's in everything.

00:51:25 I don't want to talk about the story,

00:51:27 or the feelings,

00:51:30 but an anecdote from those six days.

00:51:32 When you're on the break,

00:51:34 and all of Italy, all of Europe,

00:51:36 but more than Europe, it's Milan.

00:51:38 Because you feel it when you turn on the TV,

00:51:40 when you turn on the radio, when you go by car,

00:51:41 when you get in the taxi, when you go to Milanello,

00:51:43 when you leave home.

00:51:45 There was an incredible tension.

00:51:48 But you told me before, the desire you had.

00:51:50 I also think of that room, Turino,

00:51:52 and Cristiano Milanello.

00:51:54 I'm telling you, someone is diminishing my thing,

00:51:57 because they say, "Of course, because in the final

00:52:00 you knew you wouldn't start as a starter.

00:52:02 So you had something less."

00:52:06 No, no, it's not like that.

00:52:09 In that first match of the Euroderby,

00:52:13 there was an adrenaline rush,

00:52:15 there was something in the air.

00:52:16 Milanello was magical.

00:52:18 When we were walking, even the corridors,

00:52:23 even the corridors of Milanello

00:52:24 seemed to be telling you something.

00:52:27 If I think about it, it's a real shock,

00:52:30 because it was a really beautiful week.

00:52:36 Beautiful, beautiful.

00:52:37 For me, it was even more beautiful

00:52:41 than the night before the final,

00:52:44 where you met Juve in the final,

00:52:46 and you could still lift the Champions League.

00:52:48 So it was another confirmation of that.

00:52:53 But that time, in the Euroderby,

00:52:55 it was the first Euroderby,

00:52:58 you played a Champions League final,

00:53:00 for many, the first one.

00:53:01 Moreover, you weren't at the top,

00:53:06 like Rosa, at that moment.

00:53:08 There were so many things,

00:53:10 and we needed what we were.

00:53:13 Group, strength, personality, fear,

00:53:17 which shouldn't be there, and it was beautiful.

00:53:19 There was no room in the hotel.

00:53:21 We were, me, Abbiati and Gattuso, always.

00:53:23 We had made a triple in Milanello.

00:53:25 We were the only triple.

00:53:26 Usually there are single rooms,

00:53:27 or maybe a couple of doubles.

00:53:29 We had made a double or a triple,

00:53:31 and for years, the three of us stayed in the same room.

00:53:34 And I can assure you it was a beautiful night,

00:53:36 because we didn't sleep much,

00:53:37 but not because of that,

00:53:40 but because we couldn't wait for the next day.

00:53:43 That trip from Milanello,

00:53:45 when we left to get to the stadium,

00:53:48 are memories that I still have vividly in my head,

00:53:51 really, really beautiful.

00:53:53 There was tension, but there were smiles between us,

00:53:56 there were some forced jokes

00:53:59 that you used to make to calm the tension.

00:54:01 Who was the one who was the most tense?

00:54:03 A bit of everyone, a bit of everyone.

00:54:05 We were a really nice group,

00:54:06 we had fun.

00:54:07 In the first days of Ancelotti,

00:54:09 the evening before the game,

00:54:10 and I was used to it,

00:54:11 I was used to the evening before the game with Prandelli,

00:54:14 he would sit there and watch everyone,

00:54:16 who laughed more, who laughed less.

00:54:17 He was someone who kept us in check.

00:54:20 He said, "Oh, if he comes to our Milan now

00:54:23 and sees us the evening before the game,

00:54:25 he'll send us home."

00:54:26 We laughed, we joked, we made fun of each other.

00:54:30 Then, the training started,

00:54:32 boom,

00:54:33 seriousness, commitment,

00:54:35 it was all like that.

00:54:36 There was a big joke,

00:54:38 there were millions of them,

00:54:40 maybe half a million.

00:54:41 We can only tell one story,

00:54:46 always,

00:54:47 and at a certain point,

00:54:48 without saying what we wrote,

00:54:50 but once we stole Gattuso's phone number

00:54:53 and started sending messages to everyone,

00:54:57 to journalists, to Braida,

00:54:59 to managers, to people,

00:55:02 and we sent...

00:55:04 Tell us one, come on.

00:55:05 At a certain point,

00:55:07 he got the answers,

00:55:08 he said, "You can't understand,

00:55:10 it's a video, it's a video."

00:55:11 Didn't he always get it?

00:55:12 With Andrea, he got some good slaps.

00:55:16 In the last years, when Odo arrived,

00:55:18 he got some good slaps too,

00:55:19 from Rino,

00:55:21 but they were all funny,

00:55:24 you know?

00:55:25 Funny things.

00:55:26 In fact, even Andrea,

00:55:28 when he made jokes,

00:55:29 he'd take them around,

00:55:29 he'd take them by the hair,

00:55:31 he'd pull them,

00:55:31 it became a bit of a...

00:55:34 a bit of a nice joke.

00:55:37 But it was...

00:55:38 What did you talk about?

00:55:39 You also talked about,

00:55:41 I imagine, like three roommates,

00:55:43 I imagine, PlayStation,

00:55:44 and I imagine also brotherly talks,

00:55:46 you know?

00:55:47 The PlayStation was Pierlo and Nesta,

00:55:50 who had PlayStation fixed in their room.

00:55:54 We didn't have PlayStation,

00:55:55 but we did talk about our stuff,

00:55:58 we had a relationship.

00:55:59 When you're a real group,

00:56:01 good and bad things,

00:56:02 good and bad moments,

00:56:04 your teammates are also useful,

00:56:07 and we were very close

00:56:09 and helped each other a lot.

00:56:11 What do you three have in common?

00:56:12 I mean, you can see it from the outside,

00:56:14 because Abbiati, you and Gattuso,

00:56:17 you're three people...

00:56:18 The first thing that comes to mind

00:56:19 not knowing you in depth,

00:56:21 obviously, is "true".

00:56:22 I think of Gattuso,

00:56:23 he's been here for years.

00:56:24 It's the only thing that unites us.

00:56:26 Ah, ok. I got it.

00:56:27 Exactly. Why?

00:56:29 Because we're true people,

00:56:31 in fact, we met.

00:56:33 Then, Abbiati in one way,

00:56:35 Rino in another,

00:56:37 and I'm in another one again.

00:56:38 Each of us is different.

00:56:41 Now, then...

00:56:43 I saw Abbiati last week,

00:56:45 I hadn't seen him for a few months.

00:56:47 As soon as we see each other again,

00:56:48 my eyes shine, his eyes shine.

00:56:50 What's your name?

00:56:51 No.

00:56:51 No, no, no, no, no, no.

00:56:53 But it's just...

00:56:54 sometimes the eyes speak, right?

00:56:56 And that's it, there's no need to say more.

00:56:58 I saw him last week,

00:57:00 we hadn't seen each other for a few months.

00:57:02 The nice thing I always say,

00:57:03 not just about the three of us,

00:57:04 but about our whole Milan,

00:57:06 is that life leads you to not being able to hang out.

00:57:08 Maybe you don't feel like it,

00:57:09 maybe you don't see yourself.

00:57:11 But if we were to call each other here,

00:57:13 right now,

00:57:13 we're all in this room,

00:57:15 all of us, from that group of mine,

00:57:17 from that Milan,

00:57:19 we'd start talking, laughing, joking,

00:57:22 as if we'd seen each other yesterday in Milan.

00:57:24 Because there was something,

00:57:26 a really important alchemy.

00:57:27 There were no WhatsApp groups,

00:57:28 you created them later?

00:57:30 No, they weren't a priority, for sure.

00:57:32 Maybe they weren't.

00:57:33 The priority wasn't that one, at that moment.

00:57:36 Listen, the eyes speak.

00:57:39 The eyes of Sheva Manchester are a frame that I think...

00:57:42 You don't, because you haven't seen it on TV.

00:57:45 I imagine you saw it later,

00:57:46 but for a fan of Milan, it's almost an icon.

00:57:49 I'm not asking you about that game,

00:57:51 I'm asking you about the aftermath.

00:57:52 Because, no, Fran, we're used to coming back

00:57:55 often right after the game,

00:57:56 so we'd arrive in Milan at night.

00:57:57 If I'm not mistaken, you stayed in Manchester.

00:57:59 Yes, we always did,

00:58:00 but all the Champions League games,

00:58:01 we'd stay up late,

00:58:02 and then the evening after the game,

00:58:04 we'd come back in the morning.

00:58:06 Because that's something that changes.

00:58:07 It depends on the airport.

00:58:08 Lately, if the airport is open a bit more,

00:58:11 if not, it closes.

00:58:13 Yes, it depends.

00:58:14 We had a partnership,

00:58:16 we preferred to sleep there,

00:58:18 because you had the opportunity,

00:58:19 you'd wake up in the morning,

00:58:20 go straight to Milan,

00:58:21 do the training session,

00:58:23 you'd play, and then go home.

00:58:25 It was a practice that we had in our days.

00:58:28 But I'll tell you,

00:58:30 the good thing is that,

00:58:33 I think we were...

00:58:35 At that moment, we won the Champions League,

00:58:38 and for many of us, as I said,

00:58:40 it was the first time.

00:58:42 So, you wanted to win this Champions League,

00:58:44 and make a small dedication.

00:58:47 Each of us would have had

00:58:48 I don't know how many people

00:58:51 to whom we could make a gesture,

00:58:53 a look, a word, something.

00:58:56 I remember my wife and family...

00:58:59 Who were your family?

00:59:00 We had in the stands,

00:59:01 I had my girlfriend,

00:59:03 then there was the wife and girlfriend part.

00:59:07 There were some parents,

00:59:09 there were friends.

00:59:12 Each of us wanted to give

00:59:14 to someone in their life,

00:59:16 who had been with them until then,

00:59:18 something to say "thank you".

00:59:21 Nice.

00:59:21 That gesture,

00:59:23 of the Champions League,

00:59:24 that you show,

00:59:25 is like saying "thank you",

00:59:26 because you win a trophy,

00:59:29 which is the dream of every player,

00:59:32 to win the Champions League,

00:59:33 and you won it

00:59:35 also thanks to the help of other people,

00:59:36 who shared your life with you.

00:59:39 If I think about my grandparents,

00:59:42 if I think about my dad, my mom,

00:59:44 if I think about the people

00:59:45 who were close to me

00:59:46 since I was a kid,

00:59:48 seeing their son

00:59:49 lifting the Champions League...

00:59:50 What do your sons say

00:59:51 when they see you lifting the Champions League?

00:59:53 It's different.

00:59:54 Because there was no clear eye.

00:59:56 I have the eldest son who is Milanese,

00:59:57 really Milanese, Milanese, Milanese.

01:00:00 He likes it.

01:00:01 The youngest, on the other hand,

01:00:02 since his wife is Milanese,

01:00:03 his son is a great Milanese,

01:00:05 I am Milanese,

01:00:05 you know that very well,

01:00:06 that sometimes in all families

01:00:08 the youngest arrives and says

01:00:09 "oh yes, you are all Milanese",

01:00:11 and I am Juventus.

01:00:13 So, unfortunately,

01:00:14 I was able to bring him back

01:00:15 from our side,

01:00:16 then Cristiano Ronaldo arrived,

01:00:18 he was a kid at school

01:00:20 and he screwed us.

01:00:21 But they certainly realize it,

01:00:25 my youngest son,

01:00:26 we have a picture at home,

01:00:28 him inside the Champions League.

01:00:30 We have this picture here,

01:00:31 he is...

01:00:32 Can you imagine him entering the Champions League?

01:00:34 And we have this picture here.

01:00:35 And he is the Milanese one, in fact.

01:00:37 And they certainly give importance,

01:00:41 and they know it,

01:00:42 but when you don't see them in person

01:00:44 you don't have the same perception.

01:00:47 But when Rino says

01:00:48 in that interview after Manchester,

01:00:49 "there were days when he told me

01:00:50 'let me win, let me win'",

01:00:52 it's also for this reason.

01:00:53 I mean, in the evening before Manchester,

01:00:56 do you think about Buccinasco

01:00:57 or do you think about it later?

01:01:00 I'll tell you,

01:01:01 when he said "let me win, let me win",

01:01:03 I think about two things.

01:01:04 One, I knew I wasn't going to play that game.

01:01:08 So I said to Rino, "let me win",

01:01:10 because I told him,

01:01:12 "I've played the semi-final,

01:01:13 I've played the quarter-finals,

01:01:15 everything fades away".

01:01:18 No, Rino was on the pitch,

01:01:19 Rino for me was...

01:01:21 I didn't play because Rino was playing,

01:01:23 but I was on your side.

01:01:24 You were on Rino's side?

01:01:26 I was on Rino's side.

01:01:26 We warm up on the pitch before the games,

01:01:29 I would go out and help Rino warm up.

01:01:32 That was the strength of our group,

01:01:34 that was also the strength of some players in our group.

01:01:37 I was one of them,

01:01:39 because it was fair,

01:01:40 because Rino was stronger than me.

01:01:43 Rino was stronger than me.

01:01:44 It's the truth.

01:01:46 I was strong too,

01:01:48 some say yes, some say no.

01:01:50 From Milan to Florence,

01:01:51 I've always been a moving star,

01:01:53 from Lazio I've always been a moving star,

01:01:55 from Verona I've always been a moving star.

01:01:57 At Milan I had these sacred monsters in front of me,

01:02:00 so I played less because they were there.

01:02:03 Rino was stronger, he played fair,

01:02:05 I was on his side.

01:02:07 He knew that when I was on the pitch,

01:02:10 he didn't have to have problems,

01:02:11 so that was a great strength.

01:02:13 I've heard, perhaps in a story,

01:02:15 three teams that I lived...

01:02:18 The thing I read,

01:02:19 maybe in something that the players

01:02:21 in the dressing rooms argued about,

01:02:23 they didn't have a relationship,

01:02:25 so they managed to win.

01:02:26 All the teams that won,

01:02:28 at the base there was a group of friends,

01:02:30 a group that was fine,

01:02:31 an alchemy that was being created.

01:02:33 You can't buy that one with money,

01:02:37 with technical choices,

01:02:38 but the managers must be lucky

01:02:41 to buy players who, without knowing it,

01:02:44 manage to create that alchemy

01:02:47 that leads you to win.

01:02:49 And when you lose?

01:02:50 Because you were in Manchester,

01:02:52 I was in Athens,

01:02:54 I was in the Merida stand,

01:02:55 also in Istanbul.

01:02:57 How do you deal with that?

01:02:58 In your career, how do you react to those days?

01:03:00 Rino has often told the story

01:03:02 of Dr. Gagnani, who closes him and says,

01:03:04 "You're not moving from here."

01:03:05 Because Rino wanted to quit,

01:03:06 he wanted to leave anyway.

01:03:07 Of course, because if you do something

01:03:10 with a real passion,

01:03:11 if you do something because you want to,

01:03:13 as I said before,

01:03:15 sometimes if there's a Milan fan

01:03:18 who says something negative about me,

01:03:22 I feel bad about it.

01:03:24 Not because you said something negative,

01:03:28 but because you don't know

01:03:29 how important that shirt is to me,

01:03:32 how much I gave my life for that shirt.

01:03:35 Right?

01:03:36 And we were all very close at that moment,

01:03:39 we all had something really strong.

01:03:41 So, when we lost that final in that way,

01:03:45 because you have to know how to lose,

01:03:47 but when you lose a final and you say,

01:03:49 "OK, I lost, they were better than us,"

01:03:52 or "We lost in a deserved way,"

01:03:56 you get nervous, but you played a game

01:03:59 and you lost it.

01:04:00 Guys, you can't always win football.

01:04:02 OK, a goal is to lose it the way we lost it.

01:04:05 By dominating.

01:04:06 That thing hurts.

01:04:07 We won 2-0 against Liverpool in 2007,

01:04:11 playing badly,

01:04:13 and we lost in 2005,

01:04:16 playing a really good game.

01:04:20 So, you understand?

01:04:22 I mean, you...

01:04:23 Unfortunately, that's football.

01:04:24 We want to emphasize the fact

01:04:27 that you said it several times,

01:04:28 but maybe someone still doesn't get it,

01:04:30 there's the legend of the end of the first half.

01:04:31 But, let's face it,

01:04:34 that's absolutely...

01:04:37 A way to emphasize it.

01:04:39 But you imagine Paolo,

01:04:41 or you imagine Billy,

01:04:42 or you imagine someone else.

01:04:44 I can tell you,

01:04:46 I say Paolo and Billy, so it's credible.

01:04:49 But I could tell you,

01:04:50 you imagine me, you imagine others,

01:04:53 I assure you, no.

01:04:54 Absolutely not.

01:04:55 No.

01:04:56 But when Dirk Kooij signed you for Athens...

01:05:00 When?

01:05:01 When Kooij signed you for Athens,

01:05:02 2-1, 87th, 88th,

01:05:04 what did you think?

01:05:07 I have to tell you the truth.

01:05:09 I never doubted

01:05:13 that we couldn't win that cup in 2007.

01:05:16 Even before it was 2-0?

01:05:18 Yes.

01:05:19 If you asked me, before the final,

01:05:21 I'd say, "We'll win."

01:05:23 It can't be, we'll win.

01:05:25 Because it was too much,

01:05:27 not to have the win we deserved.

01:05:30 And above all, for the team we were.

01:05:32 Fate and destiny,

01:05:34 what did you see?

01:05:35 I saw it in us,

01:05:36 but we were a group...

01:05:39 We had incredible personalities,

01:05:42 an incredible attachment to the shirt,

01:05:44 a strong group,

01:05:46 we couldn't not win it.

01:05:48 It was too much...

01:05:52 We were too focused,

01:05:56 we were too much everyone.

01:05:59 I think we were performing at 110%,

01:06:03 each of us.

01:06:04 That game reminds me of Inzaghi,

01:06:08 who was he before these games?

01:06:11 The dressing room,

01:06:12 always the same, because...

01:06:14 They always say,

01:06:15 "Inzaghi didn't have to play,

01:06:18 because he was at Pezzi,

01:06:19 he had to play Gilardino."

01:06:22 Then Ancelotti says,

01:06:23 "No, Pippo is always..."

01:06:25 Pippo you never have to listen to him

01:06:27 before the game.

01:06:29 Because otherwise

01:06:30 he always has some problems.

01:06:32 I laugh because Pippo is my brother,

01:06:34 so I can make some jokes about this.

01:06:38 Once he has a fever,

01:06:40 once he has a sore throat,

01:06:41 once he has a little thing,

01:06:43 he has to put the shirt,

01:06:44 the wool out, the cotton on the skin.

01:06:46 Now when he hears me he calls me.

01:06:49 But the truth is that Pippo

01:06:52 was very reliable in these games,

01:06:55 because he knew that if there was

01:06:57 a rebound, a ball,

01:06:58 a right move to make, he was there.

01:07:01 How do you explain it to Inzaghi?

01:07:03 As a footballer,

01:07:04 because he was a great player.

01:07:05 I explain it to him in one word,

01:07:07 passion.

01:07:09 Inzaghi is passion.

01:07:10 Pippo lived, and still lives,

01:07:14 fortunately now he has become a father

01:07:16 and instead of thinking 24 hours a day

01:07:19 about football,

01:07:20 he might think about his children

01:07:22 for a few hours, I say.

01:07:23 Because he was an impressive thing.

01:07:26 Even as a boy,

01:07:27 if he went out with a woman,

01:07:28 he talked about football.

01:07:29 Sure.

01:07:31 Some of my friends knew him

01:07:33 and told me,

01:07:34 "Can you tell him if he can't talk to us tonight?"

01:07:38 And now, fortunately,

01:07:40 a beautiful wife,

01:07:42 a father,

01:07:44 and he has a bit of everything,

01:07:46 and maybe he can get away from that.

01:07:49 But he really had passion,

01:07:51 passion, passion.

01:07:52 He asked you,

01:07:53 he knew how to tie the opponent's defenders' shoes,

01:07:56 what kind of heels they used,

01:07:57 what the sponsor was,

01:07:58 if one was stronger,

01:08:01 or the other was stronger,

01:08:02 the slower one, the faster one.

01:08:03 Yes, we all knew those things,

01:08:05 but he really got into details

01:08:07 that we didn't even think about.

01:08:08 So it was real passion.

01:08:09 We're not even halfway through your life,

01:08:12 but we want to speed up a bit,

01:08:13 because we'll be here for hours and we'll repeat it.

01:08:15 There was the 3-0 in Manchester,

01:08:16 which was the perfect game to get to that one.

01:08:18 Is there anything you particularly remember?

01:08:21 I only remember that

01:08:23 I have to thank everyone a bit,

01:08:25 because in a first-leg game,

01:08:26 I make a wrong control in midfield.

01:08:29 It's true that after me,

01:08:30 we could have recovered and not scored.

01:08:33 But when those things happen to you,

01:08:35 unfortunately, in life,

01:08:36 there are those who have made a wrong decisive penalty,

01:08:38 who have scored a wrong goal,

01:08:39 who have done something wrong,

01:08:40 it can happen to everyone.

01:08:41 But we got to that game,

01:08:43 which was in the same condition

01:08:47 I said before, of the final.

01:08:49 In that game,

01:08:52 you knew it, you knew it.

01:08:55 There was too much...

01:08:56 We knew by now,

01:08:57 when you have a group

01:08:58 that has been playing together for many years

01:09:00 and every year they change

01:09:03 in two or three,

01:09:05 but the game is tough.

01:09:07 You can feel these things.

01:09:09 You understand them when you say

01:09:11 "Today this team can't make a mistake in the game"

01:09:13 and you couldn't make a mistake in that game.

01:09:16 Lazio, you've been playing for five years,

01:09:18 you get into a discussion

01:09:20 and you cry when you leave Milan.

01:09:22 How was that moment?

01:09:23 There's the chance to go to Lazio,

01:09:25 I say "I want to go and win a cup

01:09:28 with a different shirt than Milan's,

01:09:29 otherwise I'll end my career"

01:09:30 and they say "Of course you won all the cups,

01:09:32 you played in that Milan".

01:09:34 "Ah, but you didn't play much,

01:09:36 we saw that actually..."

01:09:38 I'm just underlining it,

01:09:40 because we looked at the numbers.

01:09:42 You were 6, 4, 8 in the career

01:09:44 every year of goal,

01:09:45 so it's not true that you didn't play much.

01:09:47 Don't get too upset.

01:09:48 Anyway, that's my choice.

01:09:50 I call Dr. Gagliani and tell him this,

01:09:52 he says "Christian, you here,

01:09:54 you don't know how I am,

01:09:56 you want to leave, go away,

01:09:58 but if it were up to me,

01:10:01 you'd end your career here".

01:10:02 I was 32,

01:10:03 so ending my career

01:10:04 would mean I'd stay in Milan for life,

01:10:06 no problem,

01:10:07 and being in the youth sector,

01:10:08 in the UEFA list,

01:10:09 there's room for the youth of the youth sector,

01:10:11 so I would never have left.

01:10:13 But that summer, Milan took Flaminì,

01:10:15 so one more player,

01:10:17 paid a lot,

01:10:18 and I said "I want to go and win

01:10:19 with a different shirt".

01:10:20 I leave Lazio and I choose to go.

01:10:23 So I go to Ancelotti, I tell him

01:10:25 and I have to say goodbye to the guys.

01:10:27 Realize that at home

01:10:28 no one knew,

01:10:29 neither my wife nor I had spoken to anyone.

01:10:33 So I'm in Milanello,

01:10:34 I speak to Ancelotti,

01:10:35 I go there in the middle of the pitch

01:10:37 and logically my teammates

01:10:39 show affection,

01:10:41 someone started crying,

01:10:42 someone held back their tears,

01:10:44 a big hug and everything,

01:10:46 and it was a really...

01:10:48 I think that,

01:10:50 together with the greeting

01:10:54 I had after Lazio,

01:10:55 were two really emotional moments for me.

01:10:58 So much so that I did from there,

01:11:00 I did a bit of the hard work,

01:11:01 I said goodbye and everything,

01:11:03 then I walk, I take the viaduct,

01:11:04 I go up to get my car,

01:11:06 I get in the car,

01:11:07 I get out of Milanello,

01:11:08 I didn't have time to leave Milanello

01:11:10 where no one was there,

01:11:11 I started crying

01:11:13 and I basically stopped crying

01:11:15 once I got into my house,

01:11:18 where I enter the house crying,

01:11:19 they ask me what's wrong,

01:11:20 I say "I have a flight at 5,

01:11:22 I have to go to Rome,

01:11:23 I went to Lazio".

01:11:24 And what did they tell you at home?

01:11:26 I've always done this,

01:11:28 since I grew up with parents

01:11:29 who never told me what to do,

01:11:31 they always respected my choices.

01:11:33 Even at home,

01:11:34 at work,

01:11:36 I never liked the wives

01:11:38 who intervened in the husband's choices,

01:11:40 I don't judge them,

01:11:43 everyone is free to do what they want,

01:11:45 but I decide my own work.

01:11:47 And so, because only we,

01:11:48 in the first person,

01:11:49 know what you really need,

01:11:51 what you need or what you don't need.

01:11:53 Even if you try to explain it to your wife,

01:11:55 your children, your parents,

01:11:56 they never understand it

01:11:58 until they experience it.

01:11:59 And so I go to Lazio.

01:12:01 In the first year,

01:12:02 I win the Italian Cup.

01:12:04 With the goal?

01:12:05 No, the first year against Sampdoria.

01:12:07 Then, the following summer,

01:12:09 we play the Italian Super Cup

01:12:11 with Inter in the treble

01:12:13 and we win the Italian Super Cup.

01:12:15 So, in the span of a year,

01:12:17 since I left Milan…

01:12:18 You had already reached the goal you had set for yourself.

01:12:20 Very good.

01:12:21 Always aiming,

01:12:23 always aiming,

01:12:24 so it was something really great.

01:12:25 Listen, have you ever thought

01:12:27 or when did the will,

01:12:29 the idea, the ambition

01:12:31 to become a coach come to you?

01:12:33 Actually, this is a fault,

01:12:36 I use the term "fault"

01:12:38 with the smile of Dr. Gagliani,

01:12:39 that when I stop playing

01:12:41 because of an injury,

01:12:43 I stopped playing because of an injury,

01:12:45 which is not that Matuselen's fault

01:12:47 that everyone says.

01:12:48 I had already gotten injured a year before.

01:12:50 I did everything

01:12:52 to be able to continue playing

01:12:54 because it was my passion,

01:12:55 I still felt good.

01:12:56 I was still a Lazio star

01:12:58 when I got injured at that time,

01:13:00 so I was fine,

01:13:01 I wanted to continue playing.

01:13:02 Unfortunately, after that injury,

01:13:04 I couldn't do it anymore.

01:13:06 My foot didn't hold,

01:13:07 I tried to do my best

01:13:09 in the world,

01:13:10 I couldn't aim.

01:13:12 That Matuselen's fault

01:13:13 was just the final word

01:13:15 to a nightmare

01:13:16 that had started a year earlier.

01:13:18 Gagliani calls me right away

01:13:20 and says,

01:13:21 "When you left Milan,

01:13:22 I told you you had to come back.

01:13:24 I'd like you to be the coach

01:13:26 of a team

01:13:27 in the Milan youth team next year."

01:13:29 What does this make you understand?

01:13:33 What club is Milan?

01:13:35 Why did Milan win so much

01:13:37 in the Berlusconi-Gagliani era?

01:13:39 Why do I say that Milan is my family?

01:13:43 As many people who have spent years

01:13:45 in our family say.

01:13:48 And why when you behave well,

01:13:50 when you are a person

01:13:51 who has given everything for that shirt,

01:13:53 who has always respected people,

01:13:57 who has never behaved badly,

01:13:59 they always give you back.

01:14:01 So he called me and said this.

01:14:03 At a certain point I said,

01:14:05 "I didn't know I wanted to be a coach,

01:14:07 I didn't have this thing

01:14:08 of saying I want to be a coach."

01:14:10 I said, "I'll see when I quit,

01:14:11 I'll understand,

01:14:12 because I want to keep playing."

01:14:13 So I started this new adventure

01:14:15 and from there it was

01:14:16 a succession of good things.

01:14:18 First year in the academy,

01:14:20 we won the championship,

01:14:21 we did a couple of tournaments,

01:14:22 very nice ones,

01:14:23 with Real Madrid, Valencia,

01:14:25 other teams, we won tournaments.

01:14:27 It was a great feeling.

01:14:29 The following year,

01:14:30 I was sent to the Primavera.

01:14:32 I did a very nice spring BNU.

01:14:36 We were a team that gave me satisfaction,

01:14:39 we were getting the guys out,

01:14:40 we were making the guys grow.

01:14:41 At that moment,

01:14:42 we were working with a goal

01:14:44 which was to train the young

01:14:46 for the first team.

01:14:47 We played underage,

01:14:48 so you couldn't win the championship

01:14:49 in the spring,

01:14:50 because you were playing against teams

01:14:52 that were 10 years old,

01:14:54 almost,

01:14:55 with all the different components

01:14:56 of the team,

01:14:57 and those levels are too much.

01:14:59 But, in short,

01:15:00 we were getting some young players out.

01:15:03 I was taught because it struck me,

01:15:05 because I turned the page,

01:15:06 I did +7, +8 at the age level,

01:15:09 Rizzari, Felicioli, Locatelli,

01:15:11 Mastalli, Crociata, Zanellato,

01:15:12 Vido, Cutrone,

01:15:13 they are all players who played in Serie A

01:15:15 or who play in Serie B,

01:15:16 who were...

01:15:17 San Ruma, Calabria, Messi?

01:15:18 Messi, even if...

01:15:20 I think it's a separate matter.

01:15:22 I think it's a separate matter.

01:15:23 Calabria, yes.

01:15:24 Calabria, maybe a separate matter,

01:15:26 because he was already an important player

01:15:28 in Pippo's spring.

01:15:30 Donnarumma would have become a goalkeeper

01:15:33 as he is,

01:15:36 even without us.

01:15:38 But I assure you that

01:15:40 his arrival earlier

01:15:43 is also thanks to Cristian Brocchi,

01:15:46 even if he was a coach

01:15:48 who forced you and forced you

01:15:50 to play with your feet

01:15:52 right from when you were a kid,

01:15:55 and who still had a hard time

01:15:57 in the youth team

01:15:58 in those first years,

01:16:00 which was the difference

01:16:01 that made the big left-back

01:16:04 decide to give him this opportunity.

01:16:08 So, he too,

01:16:09 that path he took with me

01:16:12 in those years,

01:16:13 with all the methodological area he had,

01:16:15 was certainly important

01:16:16 to bring him to the first team early,

01:16:18 not to make him a goalkeeper

01:16:19 that he would have become anyway.

01:16:22 The last question I ask you,

01:16:24 then I'll leave you to it,

01:16:25 is who was your relationship,

01:16:27 human and professional,

01:16:29 with Sinisa Mialovic?

01:16:30 Because you worked with us

01:16:31 a step below,

01:16:33 because you trained in the first team

01:16:34 and Sinisa trained in the first team.

01:16:36 Then you formally replaced him,

01:16:37 but that's a speech

01:16:39 that deviates from what I want to do.

01:16:41 What approach did you have?

01:16:43 Because I imagine that with Milanello

01:16:44 the relationship was daily.

01:16:46 No, instead,

01:16:47 that's always a bit...

01:16:49 I had a wonderful relationship with Sinisa,

01:16:51 beautiful.

01:16:52 When we met, we talked.

01:16:55 He didn't need many guys

01:16:56 in that year,

01:16:58 because he had a squad

01:16:59 with the right number.

01:17:00 So, usually,

01:17:01 these continuous relationships

01:17:04 happen when the first team

01:17:06 needs players from the first season.

01:17:09 In that year,

01:17:10 there wasn't much need for that.

01:17:13 So, when we decided,

01:17:15 we talked,

01:17:16 we had a good relationship,

01:17:17 and we had known each other since before.

01:17:19 And you know what?

01:17:21 It's too easy

01:17:23 to say nice things about Sinisa now,

01:17:28 but Sinisa was a man of substance,

01:17:30 Sinisa was a man of importance.

01:17:32 One evening,

01:17:34 I remember that one of the first times

01:17:36 an article had to come out

01:17:38 saying that I had to go there,

01:17:40 that I had been to dinner with the president,

01:17:42 and I said "Yes, I'm going to Sinisa",

01:17:43 and Sinisa said "No, that's not true".

01:17:45 I said "I assure you that I am".

01:17:47 And it wasn't true,

01:17:48 because we had written something that wasn't true.

01:17:50 He said "What do you mean,

01:17:52 tonight there's dinner with the team,

01:17:55 I'll bring the guys to have dinner,

01:17:56 come to dinner with us".

01:17:57 That evening, I went to dinner with him,

01:18:00 his staff and the whole first team,

01:18:02 to say...

01:18:03 Why? Because there was loyalty,

01:18:04 he knew that I was a real person too,

01:18:06 we had a very tight and sincere relationship,

01:18:08 and we didn't tell each other lies.

01:18:11 When there were moments

01:18:12 where we had to tell each other

01:18:13 what had happened,

01:18:15 we talked about it and it happened.

01:18:17 On the topic of Milan Spring,

01:18:19 many players,

01:18:20 for the sake of the Milan youth sector,

01:18:22 many coaches didn't make it,

01:18:24 because to make it to Serie B and Serie A

01:18:25 means to make it,

01:18:26 others didn't, for various reasons.

01:18:28 I gave two names,

01:18:29 Mastur, who didn't make it,

01:18:31 and maybe I remember

01:18:32 in that spring,

01:18:33 when I was commenting on it,

01:18:34 there was Torrasi, who was very strong,

01:18:35 he had a couple of injuries,

01:18:37 and he didn't make it.

01:18:38 So, he didn't make it,

01:18:39 he made it to Serie B,

01:18:40 he'll make it back,

01:18:41 because he's a top player,

01:18:42 but the path of young players,

01:18:45 given the bad luck,

01:18:47 and given the fact that

01:18:48 they don't really use their qualities to the best of their ability.

01:18:51 There aren't many places.

01:18:54 The qualities you need

01:18:56 are not only technical,

01:18:58 the qualities you need

01:18:59 are not only physical,

01:19:00 the qualities you need

01:19:02 are also,

01:19:03 and in good part,

01:19:05 at the level of personality

01:19:07 and mentality.

01:19:09 Not all the players are ready

01:19:11 to make a leap

01:19:13 in the big football.

01:19:15 Not all the players

01:19:18 are able to

01:19:20 take that step forward

01:19:22 from a point of view

01:19:23 of consistency,

01:19:28 of life,

01:19:31 of priorities.

01:19:32 I've seen many players

01:19:33 who, in the early years,

01:19:35 as professionals,

01:19:38 lived the pre-match life

01:19:39 like they did in Milan.

01:19:41 Unfortunately, things change,

01:19:44 because, as I said before,

01:19:46 when you face people

01:19:47 who do it for work,

01:19:49 when you face...

01:19:51 you go and play in stadiums

01:19:53 where people,

01:19:56 if you make a mistake,

01:19:57 criticise you.

01:19:58 It's not like when you play in the spring,

01:20:00 even if there's a crowd,

01:20:01 there are 2000 people,

01:20:03 they don't criticise you.

01:20:04 Because it's not like you have the hearts against you in the spring,

01:20:06 even if there's a crowd in the spring.

01:20:08 You start to live

01:20:09 situations from a big perspective.

01:20:10 Not all players have the skill,

01:20:12 the strength and the consistency

01:20:13 to come out of these situations.

01:20:15 And above all,

01:20:16 I always say,

01:20:17 and I'm saying this to young people,

01:20:19 I'm going to talk to young people

01:20:21 and I like it a lot,

01:20:23 that you always need to build

01:20:25 a plan A and a plan B in life.

01:20:27 And plan A is not football.

01:20:29 Plan A is the study.

01:20:31 Plan B is life.

01:20:32 Why?

01:20:33 Because if you have a plan A,

01:20:34 which is important,

01:20:35 which is the study,

01:20:36 you need it for two reasons.

01:20:37 One,

01:20:38 because if you're not good at football,

01:20:40 you can still have a life of a certain kind

01:20:42 or try to do certain things

01:20:44 and take certain important paths.

01:20:46 Two,

01:20:47 because nowadays,

01:20:49 the thinking players

01:20:51 are the ones

01:20:53 who manage to have

01:20:55 more ease of getting involved,

01:20:57 not only at the technical level,

01:20:59 but also at the management level,

01:21:02 from a point of view of mental openness,

01:21:04 from a point of view of being ready

01:21:06 to go into a world

01:21:08 that is completely different

01:21:10 from what you've experienced.

01:21:11 And so,

01:21:12 the biggest difficulty for our young people

01:21:14 is that.

01:21:15 While you say these things,

01:21:16 I just thought of Pobega and Gabbia.

01:21:18 But let's go a little further,

01:21:19 in the sense of people who are

01:21:21 thinking,

01:21:22 from this point of view.

01:21:23 I'm sure they weren't the strongest

01:21:26 in their team.

01:21:27 Indeed.

01:21:28 You didn't think they were the strongest.

01:21:30 You thought they were good players,

01:21:32 but then the difference,

01:21:34 what did it do?

01:21:35 Something else.

01:21:36 To finish,

01:21:37 Monza in general,

01:21:38 you did well,

01:21:39 you got great results,

01:21:42 anything to add on that experience?

01:21:44 I think that Monza

01:21:46 didn't go well,

01:21:49 but logically,

01:21:51 when you,

01:21:52 in the second year,

01:21:53 after winning the C,

01:21:55 you can't go straight to the B,

01:21:57 it seems that things...

01:21:59 Actually,

01:22:00 winning the C Series,

01:22:01 there are teams that spent the same money

01:22:03 as Monza in the C Series,

01:22:04 and didn't go for 4 or 5 years.

01:22:06 We went for the first real attempt,

01:22:08 making an incredible journey.

01:22:10 In the B Series,

01:22:11 we got close,

01:22:13 unfortunately,

01:22:14 the Salernitana,

01:22:15 with a penalty at the 96th minute.

01:22:16 A game...

01:22:17 A big one.

01:22:18 Exactly,

01:22:19 a non-played game

01:22:20 and won on the board.

01:22:21 And a game

01:22:23 where we faced a team

01:22:25 that had nothing to say,

01:22:27 so in terms of energy,

01:22:28 in terms of things,

01:22:29 we were definitely

01:22:30 two different worlds.

01:22:31 Unfortunately,

01:22:32 we came in third

01:22:33 and we didn't manage

01:22:34 to do that step

01:22:35 that could have been worth

01:22:36 something really big.

01:22:37 But for the construction

01:22:38 of what was

01:22:39 the Monza Society,

01:22:40 I think we did

01:22:41 a wonderful job,

01:22:42 because we started

01:22:43 from having nothing,

01:22:44 or little,

01:22:45 and we built

01:22:46 something important.

01:22:48 So much so,

01:22:49 that when I arrived,

01:22:50 Stroppa also complimented me

01:22:52 for everything we had created

01:22:53 there in Monza,

01:22:54 and it was needed

01:22:55 to become

01:22:56 an important Society,

01:22:58 because Milan had built

01:22:59 its success on that,

01:23:00 and in Monza,

01:23:01 Verrussoni and Gagliani

01:23:02 did the same thing.

01:23:03 I'm happy

01:23:04 to have been part of it.

01:23:05 And Palladino?

01:23:06 Did you imagine it?

01:23:07 Palladino,

01:23:08 I'll tell you the truth,

01:23:09 I trained him,

01:23:10 so to speak,

01:23:11 because he arrived

01:23:12 and was unlucky,

01:23:14 then he recovered

01:23:16 and had to play a game

01:23:18 two days before

01:23:19 the first game

01:23:20 he had to play,

01:23:21 he had a little problem again

01:23:23 and so he never played

01:23:24 with me.

01:23:26 The thing you noticed

01:23:27 was that you noticed

01:23:28 in your team

01:23:30 the players

01:23:31 who, when you explain,

01:23:32 when you speak,

01:23:33 are attentive

01:23:35 and want to understand

01:23:36 what you're asking them

01:23:37 and why.

01:23:38 I have exercises

01:23:40 that I propose

01:23:41 as a coach,

01:23:42 maybe a little more advanced,

01:23:44 maybe a little more studied

01:23:45 in detail,

01:23:46 to change a little something,

01:23:47 but that I stole

01:23:48 from the coaches I had.

01:23:49 And you see the players

01:23:51 who want to be coaches

01:23:52 from that,

01:23:53 from how they listen to you,

01:23:54 from how they look at you

01:23:55 and from the questions

01:23:56 they ask you.

01:23:57 And he was definitely

01:23:58 one of those who looked,

01:23:59 observed and understood.

01:24:00 Christian,

01:24:02 I'll give you the beer, Luca,

01:24:03 let's play the pyramid game

01:24:04 that is now so popular

01:24:05 on social media.

01:24:06 I'll tell you,

01:24:07 chosen with Luca Fazzini,

01:24:08 we put together

01:24:10 some average players

01:24:11 in a word that doesn't exist,

01:24:12 because you weren't

01:24:13 average players,

01:24:14 middle-aged players,

01:24:15 who was more defensive,

01:24:16 who was more offensive,

01:24:17 so we discussed

01:24:18 per minute who to put.

01:24:20 10 of the history of Milan,

01:24:22 not the present,

01:24:23 but let's go in order

01:24:25 and when you write,

01:24:26 you'll tell us

01:24:27 first row, second row,

01:24:28 third row, fourth row.

01:24:29 Let's start with Ambrosini,

01:24:31 where do we put him?

01:24:32 In this pyramid

01:24:33 of 10 central midfielders

01:24:35 who were defensive

01:24:36 in the history of Milan.

01:24:37 But now,

01:24:38 not knowing the others,

01:24:39 I'll put him in third row,

01:24:40 Ambro,

01:24:41 he's my friend,

01:24:42 don't be offended.

01:24:43 Ok, I think it's ok.

01:24:44 Can I write it?

01:24:45 Go.

01:24:46 Then we have Gattuso.

01:24:47 Gattuso I'll put...

01:24:49 I can tell you,

01:24:51 I'm sorry for the others,

01:24:53 because I know

01:24:54 that some of them are good,

01:24:55 but I'll put him here.

01:24:56 First place.

01:24:58 First place Gattuso,

01:24:59 and I think you're never wrong.

01:25:01 You're never wrong.

01:25:02 Desailly.

01:25:03 Desailly in second place,

01:25:05 then we put you in the middle,

01:25:08 so we see Brocchi.

01:25:10 I would put myself here,

01:25:13 for what I've been through,

01:25:16 for what I've given,

01:25:17 and for all the love

01:25:19 I've had for these guys.

01:25:21 But with respect to

01:25:22 the great players

01:25:23 that will be here too,

01:25:24 I'll put myself here.

01:25:25 So, let's say it

01:25:27 for Spotify friends,

01:25:29 you would have put

01:25:30 Braccetto with Gattuso,

01:25:31 Braccetto with Gattuso.

01:25:32 I would have continued in my...

01:25:33 A single room.

01:25:34 I would have continued in my story.

01:25:37 So fourth row.

01:25:38 So fourth row for Brocchi.

01:25:39 Lodetti,

01:25:40 that young people

01:25:41 maybe don't remember.

01:25:42 Young people,

01:25:43 that's why I'll put him here.

01:25:44 Look.

01:25:45 In third place Lodetti.

01:25:47 You remember,

01:25:48 Tonali instead.

01:25:49 Yes, Tonali yes,

01:25:50 but he did too little.

01:25:52 We'll put him in fourth.

01:25:53 Then we have great players,

01:25:55 because we thought

01:25:56 many players,

01:25:57 but who was so great

01:25:58 but played little,

01:25:59 who...

01:26:00 So,

01:26:01 we'll put you there,

01:26:02 De Jong.

01:26:03 De Jong, yes,

01:26:05 but the same thing.

01:26:07 Because they had

01:26:09 a great career,

01:26:10 but at least they were

01:26:11 a little bit few.

01:26:12 I understand your reasoning.

01:26:13 Fourth, exactly.

01:26:14 Van Bommel.

01:26:15 Van Bommel

01:26:19 played at a certain point

01:26:21 in the world

01:26:22 in the position of one,

01:26:23 if not the strongest,

01:26:24 one of the three strongest

01:26:25 in the world,

01:26:26 who was going to be a pier.

01:26:27 So for this one

01:26:28 I'll keep him too.

01:26:29 Almost like it was a fault.

01:26:31 Fourth place.

01:26:32 Fourth place.

01:26:33 And then the last two

01:26:35 are Rijkaard,

01:26:37 let's put him,

01:26:38 and then I'll tell you the last one.

01:26:40 No, but Rijkaard, guys.

01:26:42 I was a kid,

01:26:43 I didn't see him,

01:26:44 he was too strong.

01:26:45 Yes, I'll put him here.

01:26:46 Second place.

01:26:47 Second place.

01:26:48 The last one is

01:26:49 Frank See.

01:26:50 See, at the end,

01:26:51 even not knowing the names.

01:26:54 Gattuso, one,

01:26:55 Desai, Rijkaard, two,

01:26:57 Ambrosini, Chessino, Dessi,

01:26:59 three, Brocchi,

01:27:01 between one and four,

01:27:02 and then of course De Jong.

01:27:04 We left out Flamini,

01:27:05 Mutari,

01:27:06 it's not bad,

01:27:07 it's not bad, it's good.

01:27:08 It's good.

01:27:09 Even knowing the names,

01:27:11 he wouldn't have gone so far.

01:27:13 Cristian, we're almost at the end,

01:27:14 but our format,

01:27:15 our podcast,

01:27:16 has two more moments.

01:27:17 So, we'll keep this one

01:27:19 because we have some more,

01:27:20 so we'll keep them with love.

01:27:22 We have this little game here,

01:27:24 I'd say one,

01:27:25 paper,

01:27:26 random questions,

01:27:27 taken from the deck.

01:27:28 Let's pick one and answer it.

01:27:29 You read it out loud.

01:27:31 Damn,

01:27:34 which historical figure

01:27:36 would you like to chat with?

01:27:37 I'll tell you, Paolo Coelho.

01:27:39 Can you explain it a bit?

01:27:42 Because since I was a kid,

01:27:44 I've read all his books,

01:27:46 he always gave me,

01:27:48 in my moments of greatest confusion,

01:27:54 of greatest nervousness,

01:27:56 he always gave me that serenity

01:27:58 I needed and I always liked it.

01:28:00 So, I'd say him.

01:28:02 Thank you very much, Cristian.

01:28:03 We're not done yet,

01:28:04 because we,

01:28:05 those who watched the first podcast,

01:28:07 those who didn't,

01:28:08 if I go and watch it,

01:28:09 we have a magic lamp.

01:28:10 We can give a spoiler,

01:28:11 who will come out of the magic lamp?

01:28:13 Obviously,

01:28:14 the genius comes out of the lamp,

01:28:16 Savicevic.

01:28:18 Can you express three wishes?

01:28:20 Professionally,

01:28:23 we hope to be able to find

01:28:26 a project that's right for me,

01:28:29 for the person I am,

01:28:30 and for what I've already done,

01:28:31 which has perhaps been recognized

01:28:33 only partially.

01:28:34 As far as my private life is concerned,

01:28:36 only and exclusively

01:28:38 the health of my children,

01:28:39 which is something wonderful for me,

01:28:41 for my children,

01:28:42 as I think everyone does,

01:28:44 I would do any kind of thing,

01:28:46 I wish them all the best,

01:28:47 I hope they can play football too,

01:28:49 they care about us.

01:28:50 As far as my private life is concerned,

01:28:54 I hope to have that serenity

01:28:59 that has distinguished

01:29:01 the best years of my life,

01:29:02 thanks to which I was able to get

01:29:06 to do what I did best,

01:29:09 and I think that if I had to find

01:29:11 that serenity in my life right now,

01:29:13 I would probably still be able

01:29:15 to enjoy life for many years to come.

01:29:17 [Music]

01:29:22 (static)

01:29:24 (whooshing)

Unlocker Room: Cristian Brocchi - ENG

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