On this episode of Poke the Bear, Conor Ryan and Evan Marinofsky react to the Bruins' loss to the Toronto Maple Leafs. After appearing to be back on track after back-to-back shutout wins, the Bruins return to the same form and look lifeless in Toronto. Is this just who this team is? At some point 'early-season struggles' just become 'struggles' and the Bruins may be reaching that threshold already. Plus, some rumors about a fan-favorite leaving Boston. All that, and much more!
Topics:
- Bruins fall into familiar flaws against Toronto
- Special teams woes continue
- Are the Bruins slumping … or just mediocre?
- What to make of a new Trent Frederic trade rumor
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Topics:
- Bruins fall into familiar flaws against Toronto
- Special teams woes continue
- Are the Bruins slumping … or just mediocre?
- What to make of a new Trent Frederic trade rumor
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SportsTranscript
00:00PokeTheBear is brought to you by PrizePix and the GameTime app.
00:07And welcome into PokeTheBear episode 275 presented by PrizePix.
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00:17And we're presented by GameTime.
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00:21Terms apply.
00:22I am Evan Marinovsky.
00:23That is Connor Ryan.
00:24Connor, what is up?
00:26Evan, I'm doing well.
00:28How are you doing?
00:29Doing great.
00:30Doing great.
00:31Tough night, Tuesday night.
00:32Bruins got absolutely crushed in a game that really could have been used as a bounce back.
00:40I said this to you on Bruins Beat on Monday that, you know, the two wins from the weekend,
00:48then you'd play the Leafs, maybe get a win there.
00:50You got Calgary and Ottawa later this week, a good chance to sort of build some momentum.
00:55Not at all.
00:56A big old step back.
00:57Four nothing loss.
00:59The fourth goal was an empty netter, which so and I don't fault Judd Strauss for this.
01:03Judd Strauss was like, oh, there's a delayed penalty.
01:06Then the Leafs pick up the puck.
01:07And I'm like, that's what?
01:08Wait, wait.
01:09They're not blowing the whistle.
01:10And then you see a sixth Bruin come into the fray and they shoot in the open net.
01:14And it's like, oh, wait, they were pulling the goalie with with four minutes left.
01:18Just another step back where you feel like the Bruins take one step back or step forward,
01:24two steps back at just not a good night on Tuesday.
01:28Yeah.
01:29Frustrating.
01:30Right.
01:31As you said, a lot, you know, to be encouraged by with those wins over the Flyers and the
01:34Kraken, two teams that aren't really gangbusters.
01:37Right.
01:38But, you know, a win's a win in the NHL, especially when you're kind of been treading water like
01:42the Bruins have to start the year.
01:45And yeah, like that game on Tuesday felt like the same kind of script we've been reading
01:50over time and time again this year.
01:52Right.
01:53Whether it's way too many penalties, I think, what, seven total power play opportunities
01:57for Toronto.
01:58The PK, once again, really labored in this one, gave up three power play goals to a Toronto
02:04team that entered 31st in the NHL in power play without Austin Matthews, by the way,
02:11like playing this one.
02:14And then you look at, yeah, the Bruins own power play can't get anything rolling over
02:18six there.
02:19And then at five on five play and after the game, Jim Montgomery mentions like that he
02:23felt encouraged.
02:24They were building their game and five on five.
02:26They were stronger, which, you know, I think they controlled the overall puck possession.
02:30I think Bruins had a thirty six, thirty three edge and shot attempts at five on five play.
02:36But they also only had two high danger chances the entire game, which is not great.
02:42It's a season low.
02:44I even looked at like kind of the numbers on natural stat trick and the second line
02:48of thing.
02:49It's Zaka, Coyle and Brezo.
02:51They were only out there for like five minutes at five and five, and they had a ten nothing
02:54edge and shot attempts.
02:56Pretty good.
02:57Good to see, especially the second line that really hasn't generated a lot this year.
03:01Good to see some, you know, sustained puck possession, all that zero high danger chances
03:06during that time.
03:07So it doesn't mean a whole lot if you're possessing the puck, if you're in the offensive zone
03:11and you're not really testing the goalie at all.
03:14So yeah, it's again, it wasn't like it's anything new from what we've seen this year.
03:19It's just unfortunate that, as you said, it feels like the team's building something.
03:23They're on the right track.
03:24You can start last week, right?
03:26They have that overtime win over Toronto.
03:28You're feeling good.
03:29And then you have two steps back against Philly and Carolina.
03:34Same thing here.
03:35I feel like you're on the right track.
03:36You're building something.
03:37You're it's not perfect.
03:38It's not a 60 minute effort, anything like that.
03:39But it wins a win.
03:41And then this game, again, not a whole lot to write home about other than the stuff that
03:45we've already discussed time and time again already this year.
03:48Yeah.
03:49No, it is.
03:50This is not fun.
03:51This is not shaping out to be a fun season.
03:53I mean, it's November six and we're recording, but like, it's sort of the same stuff where,
03:59you know, they, as I said, they take a step forward.
04:01They take two steps back, you know, stole ours, made some good saves, like some good
04:06saves in tight, and that's all well and good.
04:08And the Bruins had some good cycle sequences, but you're right.
04:12It's a lot of perimeter stuff.
04:13It's a lot of, you know, stuff up top where, and I think teams are picking up on this,
04:17just pack it in, like pack it in against the Bruins.
04:20They can't get to the front of the net.
04:21They can't find ways to get there.
04:24They're not going to take a lot of shots from the outside.
04:26They're going to have a lot of shots blocked, which we continuously see.
04:29So like, I, you know, when does that shift?
04:32I mean, we talk a lot about this team needs a spark again, I think it was a Ty Anderson
04:38who tweeted.
04:40their last eight games.
04:41Prior to that, it was three times in their last 175 games like that.
04:46That's egregious.
04:47So you just continue to see these problems and then you get into the penalties, which
04:54can, which was continuous.
04:56And yeah, sure.
04:58Some of these you can debate, but a lot of them, you can't.
05:00A lot of these are just straight up bad penalties, a lot of offensive zone penalties.
05:05And you know, again, whether or not they score on them, which they did, they scored their
05:10three goals on them.
05:11The fourth was an empty netter.
05:13But they also completely shift momentum.
05:15And we've seen this over and over and over again with this team this year, where it's
05:21stupid stick infractions from not moving your feet or undisciplined play or just that stuff.
05:28And you know, again, like it's just an undisciplined team right now.
05:33And are they not focused?
05:35That's what I just, I keep going back to with this group.
05:38And you saw it again on Tuesday night.
05:39Yeah.
05:40And a lot of just, as you said, like, you can look at some of those plays and maybe
05:43they were ticky tack.
05:44I think, like, was it the tripping call?
05:46Is that what they whistled coiled for?
05:47Like that one?
05:48Yeah.
05:49Tough break there.
05:50And that came after a brutal turnover from Nikita Zdorov.
05:52Exactly.
05:53That's the thing is like, all these things also are, you know, the byproduct of just
05:57not being focused.
05:58Like you look at, you know, the Zdorov, I think it was the interference call where it
06:01was like, Swingman just let the puck go and it's like, what are you doing there?
06:06And then Zdorov gets interference on Pacioretty.
06:08They score a goal there.
06:09And then, you know, you look at Pacioretty was taking everybody out.
06:12Yeah, exactly.
06:13They got every defensive by the end of the first period.
06:16It doesn't help that.
06:17Yeah.
06:18You lose a guy like Andrew Peake coming out of this game as well.
06:20But yeah, you look at just the lapses there and the lack of response, like the Swingman
06:25not taking care of the puck there, leads to the Zdorov interference, leads to a power
06:29play goal.
06:30And then we get David Pasternak.
06:31We all looked at, you know, how is he going to respond after the benching?
06:35Like two minutes later, it takes a high stick.
06:38What are you doing there, man?
06:39And again, when David Pasternak is taking bad penalties like that and the Bruins are
06:43over six on the power play, that sure as hell is not the response you need from your best
06:47player.
06:48Right.
06:49And that's again, it goes to like the how tough it is to get any sort of groove with
06:53this team or feel good about what you're seeing in terms of steps forward, because you see
06:58these positive gains of the team buying in at five on five play and tighten things up
07:03on defense over the weekend.
07:06And then it's still undercut by the fact you're still taking penalties, you're still making
07:10things harder on yourself.
07:11You're still overtaxing your PK, which already isn't playing well, but it sure shit doesn't
07:16help them when they're they're out there seven times in a game, right?
07:20And then you add on like David Pasternak and you got nothing from him in that game.
07:26It's concerning, right?
07:27Like you need some breaks to go your way.
07:30But I say breaks not in terms of like, it's all just puck luck or it's all shooting percentage.
07:35But you need like your guys to step up and carry you through the stretch.
07:38And we saw that time and time again over the last couple of years.
07:41I keep on going back to with a guy like Pasternak, but the Bruins have had stretches early on
07:47in seasons where their overall supporting cast isn't carrying the weight offensively.
07:52They've been reliant on their power play.
07:54And a lot of it's been David Pasternak kind of keeping them afloat as they kind of sort
07:58things out.
07:59You're not getting that to the same degree this year.
08:02The results are kind of what they are as a result.
08:05That's the thing.
08:06And I think with, you know, Pasternak, I'll give him credit.
08:09He did draw those two penalties at the end of the second.
08:11And of course, the Bruins really didn't do anything on those power plays.
08:14But it's just been a struggle to generate offense.
08:18And I think it's a similar thing like when it comes to shots on net and high danger chances.
08:22And I say this every time we talk about this.
08:24We like high danger chances.
08:26We are a pro high danger chances podcast.
08:28But the reality is this roster is not skilled enough and talented and high end enough.
08:34And I don't mean that in a disrespectful way, but they're not high enough to just dangle
08:38through defensemen and make these, you know, globetrotter like passes to set up high danger
08:43chances.
08:44And that's why you see these turnovers because they're making that extra pass when you don't
08:49have to.
08:50Just get the puck to the net.
08:51And some of those high danger chances are going to be rebounds.
08:54And you have a big team.
08:56So you should be able to out muscle guys in front of the other net and get to those
09:00loose pucks and jam those in.
09:03And I know it's easier said than done.
09:05It's more stylistic than that.
09:07But like that should be the basis of it.
09:09And we saw that last year in the playoffs.
09:11And we continuously pointed it out.
09:12And we're seeing it now where they just are not getting these chances that they need to.
09:18And again, you saw that on Tuesday night, as you've seen to start the season.
09:23I want to get into a couple of questions, like one big picture Bruins question.
09:28There was also a report about Trent Frederick that I thought was really interesting, kind
09:32of came out of nowhere.
09:33Kevin Weeks, a little bit of a Kevin Weeks bomb.
09:36I was kind of disappointed Kevin Weeks didn't do like the whole, you know, like breaking
09:39news, breaking news.
09:40I guess it isn't breaking news, but was hoping he'd be in like a cool spot for it just turned
09:44out to be like the M&M store, the M&M store at Times Square or something like that covered
09:49in M&M's, you know, like something flowing over him as he's giving Trent Frederick news.
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11:33So Tuesday was a big old disappointment for the Bruins.
11:38And you know, we've had a lot of these games so far, the Philly game, obviously Carolina,
11:43the Florida games, where it's just been sort of a miss and they haven't come out the way
11:47that we think they can and that they should be able to.
11:51And you know, we're getting to about a month into the season, full month in, and I keep
11:57going back to, is this just sort of a mirage?
12:01Or are they really a middle of the road team?
12:04Is the drafting, is the lack of high-end talent coming through the system, is that finally
12:11catching up to them?
12:12Is this the year?
12:13I think Jones also went on waivers on Tuesday, we forgot to mention that, like that's another
12:17off-season signing.
12:19So my big question to you is, are the Bruins just an average team?
12:25I'm not ready to lean that way yet, Evan.
12:28And that's not to say that I'm just like looking at, you know, I think the problem now is people
12:32look at that like 19 blues team as being like, oh, anyone can catch fire.
12:36Like you're not that far from being, I think, very concerned about this team is what it
12:41is.
12:42But I also think you look at just how bad they've been on the power play, how disjointed
12:45they've been, the penalties.
12:49There are things that can be cleaned up, I think, that should at least get you back into,
12:54you know, maybe you're not a S-tier or an A-tier team, but a team that should make the
12:59playoffs when you look at just the amount of talent that you have here.
13:04So yeah, I view it as more of a fact that they're still really out of sorts.
13:09They need to get their act together, but I'm not ready to buy into like, this is what we
13:16should expect.
13:17Like, I'm not expecting you've got seven or eight guys shooting 4%.
13:21Like I think there is going to be an uptick, right, in terms of what they can provide.
13:26But you need a lot more guys pulling on the rope.
13:28And again, that's not to say like, oh, this team's going to go 41, 5, and 2, the rest
13:34of the, you know, down the stretch or something like that.
13:37They're going to win the president.
13:38They're going to find a way to win the president's trophy.
13:39But they should be much better than they are right now.
13:42And what they're sealing is maybe it's not a legit contender, but again, maybe your team
13:48that just gets hot at the right time before the playoffs.
13:51And that's how you have to kind of view this as more of a third place in the Atlantic wild
13:55card kind of team.
13:56And maybe to shift the expectations there.
13:58But I still think this team is what it is right now, if that's the best way to put it.
14:04I agree with you.
14:05And this is like, I do see the sentiment on Twitter and I understand where people are
14:09coming from with like, nope, this team is mediocre.
14:12They're not going to be good.
14:13They're going to be near the middle of the bottom of the league.
14:16I don't see it.
14:18I don't see that.
14:19This roster is better.
14:20This roster should be better.
14:21And the circumstances surrounding this roster make me believe they should be better.
14:26I continue to go back to like Trent Frederick and Morgan Geeky.
14:29You know, Morgan Geeky sat on Tuesday night in favor of Tyler Johnson.
14:34He's in a contract year.
14:35Trent Frederick's in a contract year.
14:37We'll get to in a second.
14:39You know, I mean, Elias Lindholm is playing with better line mates than he played last
14:43year.
14:43And David Pasternak is doing the same.
14:46And like, the defense should be better.
14:49And I still think there's that potential there.
14:52I give them a little bit of wiggle room because it takes time to acclimate to new
14:57settings and new lines and all that stuff.
15:01But yeah, I mean, every time I see a game like we saw Tuesday night, I go, you know,
15:05should we brace for more of these throughout the year?
15:07And it's hard not to.
15:09It's hard not to think that.
15:10I just I'm not giving up on this roster yet.
15:13I'm not.
15:14And, you know, again, if we're sitting here on December 6th and January 6th, whoops.
15:25I am sorry.
15:26I am I am sorry.
15:28When we're sitting here on those days and they're still in this position, then
15:33obviously it's a different case.
15:35And we have a much different situation on our hands.
15:37But it's been a month.
15:38It has been one month.
15:41So, yeah, that's right.
15:44Damn it.
15:45That's where I stand on that.
15:47Sorry, everybody.
15:49We're trying to avoid the election as much as humanly possible on this episode.
15:52So we are we're going to get.
15:53So we're going to lean into the yeah, the bro just playing like crap instead.
15:58We're going to channel the anger into that.
16:00That'll be it.
16:01That's what we're doing.
16:02Um, but yeah, I, you know, I see it.
16:06And like, look, you know, is Justin Brezow a true top six winger?
16:12Probably not.
16:13You know, like I think we are in agreement that guys like him, Frederick
16:17Geeky are better, you know, as third line guys.
16:20But at the same time, you know, I think the Bruins acknowledge that
16:24they still need a top six forward.
16:26It just comes down to whether they'll be in the situation to get one.
16:29I mean, I think I think also you look at it, right?
16:32Like even if Brezow is not maybe a top six guy, you had a Bruins team that like,
16:36you know, the Bruins miss Jake DeBrusque and what he brings speed
16:40and, you know, his scoring ability.
16:41Jake DeBrusque even does not should not dismantle your entire office, right?
16:47Like that.
16:47That is the thing.
16:48Like the Bruins were a very effective team last year with a lot of.
16:54You know, middle six type of players like Deaton Heinen
16:58and Brezow and Frederick and Geeky and all these guys.
17:01And they all maybe had career years and maybe that's what
17:06maybe that was the risk
17:07as to maybe a lot of guys were just due for regressions
17:09and you're kind of feeling the the sting of that.
17:12But this wasn't a team that was, again, stacked all across the board
17:16up front last year.
17:17They should be better, especially when you have all these again,
17:20like a Brezow, a capable middle six guy that that can and should chip in.
17:26You know, a lot of guys like that, that you should be in a spot
17:28where you have enough guys pulling on the rope
17:30and you're just getting none of that right now.
17:32So is that an indictment on the roster or is it, you know,
17:36the fact that you've got a lot of guys just misfiring right now?
17:38Maybe it's maybe it's both. Right.
17:40Maybe that's the way you kind of have to look at it.
17:42Maybe it is. Maybe it is.
17:44Before we get into Trent Frederick stuff.
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19:03Now back to the show.
19:05So on Tuesday afternoon, Kevin Weeks tweeted in speaking to sources,
19:10several teams are interested in pending UFA.
19:13And then he put in parentheses after this season, Trent Frederick
19:17with his size, speed, toughness, character and skill.
19:20He's drawing attention in the marketplace.
19:23Now, you pointed this out to me and you're right in doing so.
19:26Is Kevin Weeks talking about,
19:29you know, teams being interested in him after the season?
19:32Or is he saying that he will be a UFA after the season?
19:35Because the second part is true.
19:36He will be UFA after the season.
19:39But are teams interested in him now?
19:42And again, Frederick has been a slow starter start this year.
19:45I talked about this.
19:47Diver brought this up to me with on Pucks with Hags,
19:51an idea of if you really wanted to shake things up
19:54and you either didn't fire the coach or you already had
19:57and you still weren't getting what you wanted,
20:01trade a roster piece.
20:02And for all the things Kevin Weeks said, I mean, obviously,
20:06to start the year, Frederick has not been has not lived up to it.
20:09But he does have side.
20:10He does size.
20:11He does have speed.
20:13He's a character.
20:13He's got a lot of skill.
20:15He's a character.
20:15He's got some skill and he's got some toughness.
20:17And the NHL is headed in that direction.
20:20You know, you would think that a team would want that.
20:23Maybe you use him as a trade piece and you either do a player
20:27for player swap or you do like a Tanner Jeneau trade
20:30where you get a ton of picks in return.
20:33But again, I don't know.
20:34It's not the deadline.
20:35I don't know.
20:36You know, I think Jeneau's numbers
20:38were maybe a little bit better than Frederick's
20:39at the time, if memory serves.
20:41What do you make of all this?
20:43Yeah, I mean, obviously, if if weeks is tweet
20:48revolves around like his UFA status, that makes plenty of sense.
20:51I think he's going to be a pretty coveted guy in the market
20:53because of just how unique his skill set is.
20:56And, you know, whether he is a 20, 25 goal score
21:01or more of just a, you know, 15 goal, but can add some physicality.
21:04Those kinds of things.
21:05Teams will covet that.
21:07Be very curious to see what his actual next contract is going to be.
21:10But yeah, I think for the Bruins, it all comes down to this assessing one.
21:14What's going to be the price for him in terms of how committed
21:18are you to re-upping him moving forward?
21:19You think they want to keep him as a key piece of the scene
21:23because of that skill set, because of, you know, barring this year,
21:26he's improved every year in terms of his scoring output.
21:30Again, before this year, he was regarded as a very, you know,
21:33maybe underrated defensive forward to like a lot of D zone stats,
21:38D zone stats, a lot of taxing minutes.
21:40And the Bruins have been on the right side of a pretty
21:44lopsided goal differential when he's been out there.
21:47So he's been a really useful piece for them.
21:48So if they're committed to re-signing him, like I don't think you're,
21:53you know, realistically looking at moving him.
21:55If there's going to be like a sacrificial lamb,
21:58if the Bruins need to wake things up and shake things up on their roster,
22:02you imagine maybe it's someone who, you know, is like a geeky
22:05or someone else like that, that's moved as opposed to a guy like Frederick.
22:08But again, one, I think it's going to come down to where the Bruins are,
22:12because if they are what they're playing like right now
22:15and it is middle of December and we're looking at this team
22:18and they're still treading water, then maybe you have to make
22:21some tough decisions as to whether you want to cut bait
22:23with a guy like Frederick or re-sign him.
22:26And then also just what his value is on the market, because as you said,
22:29and I I've seen a couple of people mention the Genoa trade, which again,
22:33I don't have his numbers from the year before he was traded.
22:36He had 14 points in 56 games.
22:39So like. I thought he had so much more.
22:43Yeah, that's so old.
22:45And Nashville got Cal foot conditional first round pick
22:49second round pick in a third, fourth and fifth round pick like, oh, yes.
22:54Every time I remember, I remember that was to Washington, right?
22:59To Nashville, right?
23:01Nash, Nashville.
23:03He was traded to the lightning from the Predators.
23:05Oh, yeah, not Washington.
23:07Yeah. Yes. Yes.
23:08Has done anything really since then?
23:10You know, it's a pretty bad trade.
23:12So Nashville, I'm sure, is happy they made that deal.
23:14But yeah, I think comes down to three things.
23:19One, what the Bruins value in Frederick as to how committed
23:22they are to keeping him because they are in the driver's seat there.
23:25They can work on a deal during the season
23:28where they are in the standings in a couple of months.
23:30And then just what the value is, because even if maybe you're on the fence
23:33of like, all right, like maybe this isn't our year, but, you know,
23:36we think Frederick, he's he's going to be 27.
23:38He's still a key piece of this team.
23:40Some teams offering that much draft picks and you're looking for a way to,
23:44you know, retool on the fly and you're able to get a first round pick
23:48or something like that.
23:49Then maybe you assess the thing.
23:51There's a lot, I think, up in the air when it comes to Frederick.
23:53I think the Bruins want to keep him,
23:56but a lot can change in terms of just the value
23:59and especially where they are in just a couple of months.
24:01Yeah. And I also think with like Frederick,
24:04sort of what I mentioned before is like those those traits he has are ones
24:07you want, especially come the playoffs.
24:09You want a guy like that.
24:11I think the issue has just been consistency.
24:13That consistency hasn't been there.
24:15You know, we had a really good season last year.
24:17Same thing the year before.
24:20We're not quite getting that this year.
24:22But as you said, like if you can, if you can recoup
24:25a bunch of draft picks
24:28just out of Trent Frederick, like it's hard to say no to that.
24:32And obviously a lot of our listeners are going to say, you know,
24:34why do you trust the Bruins with picks?
24:37And I get that.
24:38But they have hit on some.
24:40And I also think they just haven't had many high ones.
24:43Like you just you know, it's not like the Bruins have consistently had,
24:47you know, top ten picks and whiffed like that hasn't been the case.
24:52You give them more picks,
24:53the higher the likelihood that you get some actual legit players.
24:57And again, we don't know what the market would be like.
25:00We don't know yet.
25:01The Jino trade was two years ago, I think.
25:05So again, like I, I don't want to trade Frederick.
25:09But as you said, team comes along with a bunch of draft picks
25:12and says you can have them, you know, and I think like I like Frederick
25:15has more trade value than Morgan Geeky by a lot.
25:17Like I think that that's also like, what are you getting from Morgan Geeky?
25:22I think that's the other part of it, too.
25:24So, yeah, I don't want to trade Frederick.
25:25I like what he brings.
25:27But, you know, we'll see what ends up happening with that.
25:29Maybe more Kevin Weeks cryptic tweets will come through
25:33and we'll see what he's what he's talking about.
25:36So, yeah, that's this episode.
25:39A very negative Bruins one.
25:41It was we had a very positive one on Monday with the two wins.
25:44And now we've got a bunch of negative Nellies.
25:48Yeah, it's this Bruins team.
25:50So hopefully better days ahead.
25:53Conor, what can the people look forward to from you
25:54over at the Globe and Boston dot com?
25:56Yeah, you can follow me over the Globe and Boston dot com.
25:59We'll have covered every step of the way, whether it's recaps, features,
26:02columns, breakdowns, all that good stuff you can read over at BDC
26:07and the Boston Globe.
26:08And if you want to follow me on Twitter, you can at Conor Ryan underscore 93.
26:12Go do all that.
26:14That's Conor Ryan.
26:15I'm Evan Marinovsky.
26:16You poke the bear.
26:17Listeners have a great rest of your week.