LIVE: Patriots vs Rams Postgame Show

CLNS Media Sports Network

The Patriots fell just short against the Los Angeles Rams on Sunday, with a final score of 28-22. Drake Maye posted his best career game with 282 yards and two touchdowns, but threw an interception on the final drive to end their hopes of victory. Matthew Stafford, Cooper Kupp, and Puka Nacua proved to be too much of a problem for the Patriots defense.  Join Taylor Kyles, Mike Kadlick, and John Zannis as they provide instant postgame analysis.  ************************************************ Patriots Content Brought to you by.... 💰 Prize Picks - https://prizepicks.onelink.me/LME0/CLNS Download the app today and use Code CLNS at PrizePicks.com/CLNS & Get $50 instantly when you play $5!  🎫 Gametime - https://gametime.co Take the guesswork out of buying NFL tickets with Gametime. Download the Gametime app, create an account, and use code CLNS for $20 off your first purchase. Download Gametime today. What time is it? Gametime! Merch Store - https://shop.clnsmedia.com

Transcript

00:00:00Alright guys, here we are, we take one step forward, one step back when we're the Patriots

00:00:18and that's what's going on right now.

00:00:20A game that's interesting just because there's a lot of good, but then there's still just

00:00:27way too much bad and some of it seems preventable and we'll break it all down with Mike Kadlik

00:00:32and Taylor Kyles who are just getting out of the Patriots locker room and are obviously

00:00:37as you can see down at Gillette Stadium where the Patriots fell 28-22 in a very winnable

00:00:42game against the Rams, one in which Gerard Mayo curiously said they felt like they were

00:00:47always in control of.

00:00:48That was an interesting comment I thought.

00:00:50We'll hear from Mayo, we'll hear from some of the players, we'll talk about Drake Mays

00:00:55But guys, like I said, I think there's two obvious takeaways.

00:01:00Drake May continues to, and I'm being told I've got a mic issue so I'll double check

00:01:04it again.

00:01:05It's on.

00:01:06You guys not hearing me?

00:01:07I hear you fine.

00:01:08We're good.

00:01:09Okay, if the chat has an issue let me know, we'll adjust as we go.

00:01:13Drake May was as good as you could imagine he could be, not only for now, a year from

00:01:20now.

00:01:21Really, really high-level stuff in terms of what he was able to see in the throws he was

00:01:25going to make and how he handled pressures and how he moved it in and around the pocket

00:01:30and obviously there's a couple of turnovers but we can discuss those as the game goes

00:01:34on.

00:01:35And then the other was, after a masterful game plan where we gave the coaches a lot

00:01:38of praise for their performance, this was a really shaky day at the office for the Patriots

00:01:46coaching staff today.

00:01:47So again, guys, you're coming out of there right now, what kind of pops for you as your

00:01:52primary takeaways for this game?

00:01:54Go for it.

00:01:57I'll say for one, it was just so many self-inflicted errors and I feel like it was the coaching

00:02:00staff down to the players as well, obviously it always starts with the coaches.

00:02:03But when you look at all the questionable calls for the coaches' staff, now I think

00:02:08not having Christian Gonzalez shadow Puka Nakua was maybe the most egregious.

00:02:12Like even leading into the game we were talking about, are they going to put Gonzo on the

00:02:15boundary again?

00:02:17Or are they going to stick him on Puka?

00:02:19Like Demarcus Robinson obviously is not the same caliber of number three receivers as

00:02:22we saw against the Niners and the Bears when we also saw Christian Gonzalez stick to the

00:02:26boundary instead of shadowing someone.

00:02:29But then it became very obvious, and the Rams do make it tough on you, but I mean, Puka's

00:02:33production just doesn't feel like he would have had nearly as much success if he did

00:02:36have Christian Gonzalez against him consistently.

00:02:38Now Gonzalez also made plays against Cooper Cup and part of that was his boundary alignment

00:02:42against certain formations, so it'll be interesting to at least look at the film and see if there

00:02:46was more to it.

00:02:48Second half, Puka doesn't really do much of anything, again, another thing I'll be curious

00:02:51to see.

00:02:52But it felt like the questionable or flat-out bad decisions from the coaching staff were

00:02:56always exacerbated by poor execution.

00:02:59Like Demarcus Covington calling the all-out blitz.

00:03:02Jonathan Jones is a veteran who should know, if you are the only person who can make the

00:03:06tackle, you cannot try to make a play on the ball because if you do, no one's going to

00:03:10be behind you.

00:03:11I was shocked when I saw him sprawl out.

00:03:13And then obviously I just assumed because of Jon Jones, oh he must have, you know, broken

00:03:16it up.

00:03:17Nope.

00:03:18Turns into a long touchdown.

00:03:19Then you talk about the Patriots not going for it on the fourth and two, where Drodd

00:03:22Mayo said if it was fourth and one, they probably would have gone for it, but it was just a

00:03:26range that they didn't feel comfortable with.

00:03:27Then they decided to kick the field goal, gets blocked because it looked like Trey Jacobs

00:03:31and Lasita Smith didn't execute their assignments.

00:03:34Then you have not kicking the field goal because it was just out of Joey Sly's range from pregame.

00:03:38Win was a factor.

00:03:39Mayo acknowledged it.

00:03:40Sly acknowledged it.

00:03:41And then you go for the punt, you take a delay of game to give yourself more room and try

00:03:44to get a touchback, or I'm sorry, try to pin them deep.

00:03:47Then you end up with a touchback.

00:03:49It just felt like, no, the coaches didn't always put them in position to be as successful

00:03:52as possible, but you can't as a player, make it even worse by making all these mental errors

00:03:57and egregious mistakes.

00:03:58And then penalties were another thing that kept shooting the offense in the foot when

00:04:01they seemed to have promising drives.

00:04:02So I know everyone automatically goes to the coaching staff and everyone thinks I don't

00:04:06critique the coaching staff for whatever reason, you know, maybe pay a little more attention.

00:04:10But again, I do think that the coaches made some mistakes and definitely had some calls

00:04:13they probably want back, but you can't make it worse as the players with your own self

00:04:16inflicted errors.

00:04:17Yeah.

00:04:18I'm with you.

00:04:19Nope.

00:04:20Sorry, John.

00:04:21Can you guys, can you guys see it?

00:04:22I've got it on the screen here.

00:04:23I honestly think like with Taylor and I did not, did not collaborate on this.

00:04:28I know.

00:04:29Here we go.

00:04:30Great minds think alike.

00:04:32We hit, no, I mean, but you guys are right.

00:04:34We hit literally almost every single one of them here.

00:04:37You know, including I thought at the end, not having the Rams re-kick there and putting

00:04:41you on the 10 yard line.

00:04:43It's like, how much worse could it be?

00:04:44The five, the three?

00:04:45I mean like, and you need a, so there was just a bunch of different things here.

00:04:49And then I thought I'm adding this one to the list as well.

00:04:52Attempting that point after the point after they got blocked, which again, I don't think

00:04:56is wrong, but it's inconsistent because against the Jaguars in London in the same exact scenario,

00:05:03they opted to go for two and didn't get it, which left them down nine.

00:05:06And in this case they did the other.

00:05:08So I felt like in so many cases, maybe you can justify it after the fact, which I know

00:05:13Gerard Mayo did, but it almost felt like flipping a coin in terms of what they chose to do and

00:05:18when they chose to do it, whether to go for it deep in the, you know, deep in, deep in

00:05:22Rams territory or to kick the 54 yarder.

00:05:25I don't feel like they were well thought out.

00:05:27I felt like they were just impulsive in the moment decisions.

00:05:30And again, I feel like they could have just as easily gone in the other direction, which

00:05:34is what is confusing and confounding.

00:05:37The other ones you mentioned, Taylor, are strategic leaving Gonzo.

00:05:41This is what the Patriots used to do to, to the Jets and Darrell Revis.

00:05:45They're like, I'm going to throw an absolute Jag out on the boundary and I'm just going

00:05:48to waste Revis.

00:05:50You know, he's just going to sit there and chase somebody who's running nines all day

00:05:54long and just clearing things out and take them out of the game.

00:05:58And I'm just going to run a bunch of crossers and everything like that and just eat you

00:06:01up on your nickel guys.

00:06:03And whoever is trying to stay with my better receivers who are not, who I'm not going to

00:06:07put out there that I thought was weird.

00:06:09The treat treating Stafford like he's a rookie quarterback instead of a 16 year veteran and

00:06:14zero blitzing him and being too aggressive.

00:06:17These were choices that they made.

00:06:18And so there was quite a bit there and Mike, I'll go back to you on that.

00:06:22But there was so much both in terms of planning strategy and then in game decision making

00:06:28that I think leads you scratching your head.

00:06:30And I totally agree with Taylor on the, it's not all on the coaches at the end of the day

00:06:34the players have to do stuff too.

00:06:35And it was exacerbated by what followed in almost every case.

00:06:39They don't go for it late or you know, whatever.

00:06:41They don't kick the field goal.

00:06:42They get the touchback 80 yard touchdown drive going the other way.

00:06:46Not a single play, but a series of plays that led to, you know, the decision looking like

00:06:50even more of a head scratcher in hindsight.

00:06:53No, a hundred percent.

00:06:54A couple of things just on, you know, the coaching decisions and the things they did

00:06:56and didn't do right.

00:06:57Where two weeks ago, the offensive line with Leighton Robinson in there, they, they, they

00:07:02put that out there.

00:07:03They realized, you know what?

00:07:04Through a quarter and a half or whatever it was, maybe not even that long.

00:07:07We stink.

00:07:08We need to change this up.

00:07:09And they do it.

00:07:10And they make the in-game adjustment.

00:07:11Today, when they do the Gonzo on the boundary thing and Puka and Cooper Kopp are going,

00:07:15you know, yard after yard, catch after catch all day, you would think, okay, this coaching

00:07:18staff has the ability to make these changes.

00:07:20Why don't they do it?

00:07:21And then they didn't do it.

00:07:22And they kind of just kept sort of, you know, running and running into the wall and trying

00:07:25to try to make something work that just didn't.

00:07:27Sorry.

00:07:28You had something on that before.

00:07:29No, I know.

00:07:30You're fine.

00:07:31I think part of it was because the way the Rams formation, like it's just a scheme you

00:07:33don't see very often.

00:07:34I know preparing for it.

00:07:35One of the reasons I was wondering if they were going to shadow Puka or not is because

00:07:38the way they use them in motion, the way that they'll have every receiver to one side and

00:07:42none on the other.

00:07:43And Mayo also mentioned the difference.

00:07:44Like it's not just man.

00:07:45It's also zone.

00:07:46I think part of it was that when you prep for a team like the Rams, maybe there's just

00:07:50so much that goes into it.

00:07:52Formation identification and all of that.

00:07:54They were worried if they decided to flip the strategy during the game, that might've

00:07:57led to confusion where it's like, okay, it's zone.

00:07:59Where am I supposed to be?

00:08:01That's my only thing on that.

00:08:02I can't lie.

00:08:03I want to check the film and see if that was part of it, but that's the only thing I can

00:08:05think to that.

00:08:06No, no, you're right.

00:08:07That's a good answer.

00:08:08The other one on the, on the offensive execution and what you said on how the coach put them

00:08:12in a bad position and then the players don't execute right.

00:08:15They go down, they go for it.

00:08:16They're down at the six.

00:08:18They get stuffed on third down and then they don't go for it.

00:08:20This place goes up in booze.

00:08:22They kick the field goal.

00:08:23It's still a two possession game.

00:08:25Then the Patriots stopped the Rams on the next, the next possession.

00:08:28It's like, oh, maybe they did make the right decision here.

00:08:30They go down, score a touchdown and then slide misses it and it's still a two possession

00:08:34game.

00:08:35So it's like they make the decisions.

00:08:36People are mad.

00:08:37It ends up working out for them.

00:08:38They can make it a one possession game and then slide gets blocked and then it's back

00:08:41to a two possession game.

00:08:42So it's like kicking themselves when they're down type of thing.

00:08:45That's just, you know, they're getting there.

00:08:46They only lose by six today.

00:08:48Things are looking promising, but there's little things on the margins that if they

00:08:50fix them, they probably could have won this game today.

00:08:52John, real quick.

00:08:53One other thing.

00:08:54We were saying it in the booth, like, okay, if they win this game, it's going to be like

00:08:58the Jets win where the narrative is completely flipped on its head.

00:09:01Where if they lose, then it's like the boo birds and it's the coaching sucks and all

00:09:04this stuff versus like today, if they had won the game, I think a lot of the things

00:09:08that we're going to critique them for throughout the week would have been like, okay, they

00:09:11need to grow and they need to get better, which still should be the case because the

00:09:14Patriots had the ball with a chance to win with a field goal, not tie to win, or I'm

00:09:19sorry to win with a touchdown, not to tie, but to win.

00:09:22I think that needs to not get lost in this.

00:09:23Like obviously the coaches are young.

00:09:26The players are young.

00:09:27This team needs to learn how to win.

00:09:28We keep saying that every week, but it's not like this was something where the coaches

00:09:31got them in such a bad position.

00:09:33They had no chance in the game.

00:09:34They could have won on the last possession and obviously the miscommunication where if

00:09:37DeMario Douglas and Drake Mayer on the same page, pop has the ball in open space past

00:09:42midfield with room to run.

00:09:44So I just think that needs to be remembered.

00:09:45Obviously a lot of improvement needs to be made, but this isn't like they got run up.

00:09:49That was a good coaching staff team.

00:09:50I like that Jets game on Thursday night.

00:09:51Yes.

00:09:52Yes.

00:09:53Yes.

00:09:54Yeah.

00:09:55Hey guys, I can't reach Ahmed in the field.

00:09:56So if you're coming in a tad hot, can you, if you could tell him that, do you see him?

00:10:02Nope.

00:10:03Nope.

00:10:04He's, he's with Rich.

00:10:05Yeah.

00:10:06Yeah.

00:10:07No problem.

00:10:08Yeah.

00:10:09So you're coming in a tad hot.

00:10:10Maybe, maybe just hold them lower until we can get an audio adjustment.

00:10:11Sorry.

00:10:12I do be loud.

00:10:13Yeah.

00:10:14No, it's all good.

00:10:15It's, I mean, I'm talking a hair here, but the other one I did want to mention, I think

00:10:18we went against the kicking the field goal when you're deep into Rams territory.

00:10:23I thought you said Taylor, it was a fourth and two versus fourth and one.

00:10:28They might've gone for it on one, but two, they felt like maybe whatever.

00:10:31To me, that's less about the yardage and that's really more about where you are in the field.

00:10:34You get that deep.

00:10:35You're, you gotta go for it.

00:10:37You're talking about doing that from the 30 yard line or 25 yard line and giving up three.

00:10:41You never know.

00:10:42You're going to string together a series of plays after that you're, you could legitimately

00:10:45be leaving points on the field, but you're that deep.

00:10:47I do think that that's something you have to do, but what's interesting is to run two

00:10:50running plays thereafter.

00:10:51May is cooking.

00:10:52He is seeing the field really well.

00:10:55And I thought that was a miss on like one person could say, well, they dropped him back

00:10:58to pass 40 times, you know, or 41 times.

00:11:02And that's a lot to put on a rookie, but he was handling it like he could see it.

00:11:06He was making the right reads.

00:11:08He was handling pressure.

00:11:09Well, I don't understand not putting the ball in his hands there and running it twice.

00:11:14If you're not certain you're going forward on four, what are you running on third down?

00:11:17You're not certain you're going on fourth.

00:11:19That doesn't make sense to me.

00:11:20So I thought it was curious as well, but you mentioned like, yeah, it's the players

00:11:25and they did.

00:11:26They didn't sound like the coach just completely took them out of it.

00:11:28But you have players who you're holding to a certain standard that you're acknowledged

00:11:33have not, you haven't learned how to win yet.

00:11:37If you're going to talk like that, which Mayo did after the game, it's fine.

00:11:42But you also have to be like impeccable in terms of your decision making and your preparation

00:11:49with these guys.

00:11:51So you can't also be learning and a Mayo said that earlier in the year, and it's a comment

00:11:55that bothered me a lot.

00:11:56Like I know I'll learn, I'll be better in my second year.

00:12:00That's fine.

00:12:01But I think the coaches and the players are held to the different standard.

00:12:03The coaches have to be the adults in the room.

00:12:05They can't be kind of making gaffes along the way to Christian Gonzalez after the game.

00:12:10They asked him, Hey, what about, why aren't you following one of these guys?

00:12:13He's like, well, I go where they tell me, you know, he doesn't love that idea.

00:12:16And you know, a lot of people that are questioning it.

00:12:18So you can't have that going on with a young team that you've had a tough time focusing

00:12:24on the task at hand and have these missteps and have them start to doubt you because that's

00:12:30where things break apart and you've seen it happen in other places.

00:12:33I don't think the Patriots are close to that, but you do have people who are probably frustrated

00:12:37that they feel that they're either not doing enough or being scapegoated as the people

00:12:42who aren't doing enough.

00:12:43And when you start to think it's maybe these guys aren't putting me in the position to

00:12:46do what I'm supposed to do.

00:12:47That's where things can get funky.

00:12:49So I do think the coaches have to be better in both their game plan and their in-game

00:12:55decision making.

00:12:56I do agree with you that the coaches have to be better.

00:12:58I think everybody does.

00:12:59I will say that, you know, we talked about a divide and the mutiny comment from way earlier

00:13:05on in this season.

00:13:06The two wins in the last three games before today really changed that narrative.

00:13:10In speaking with some players this week in the locker room, they were behind Mayo a lot

00:13:13more than they had been.

00:13:15There was a little bit of a rift when things were going on and things were going south.

00:13:19He brought them back.

00:13:20They were able to get it back.

00:13:21And now they might not be on the complete same page, John, like you mentioned.

00:13:24Gonzo probably did want to shout to their best wide receiver.

00:13:26He wants the best task.

00:13:27He wants the challenge, and he didn't get it.

00:13:29But I think they do trust their coaches, and I think they are behind the vision that these

00:13:33guys have for them.

00:13:34Even Christian Barmore at the podium today asked why he comes back from his blood clots,

00:13:38why he comes in every day and wants to continue working hard.

00:13:41He mentions his teammates.

00:13:42He mentions the coaches.

00:13:43He goes, my guy Mayo and DC.

00:13:45Guys who put their defense in bad positions today.

00:13:48And so I think they trust them.

00:13:49I think it's growing.

00:13:50I think they need to learn.

00:13:52John, I agree with you a tad, I will say, on the comment from earlier this week or maybe

00:13:59it was last week where Mayo was like, look, I'm looking to be even better next season

00:14:02because all right, dude, well, we're in this season right now.

00:14:04There's guys on this team who are only here on one-year deals.

00:14:06We need to try and win games now, dude.

00:14:09Stop making this a learning-growing process.

00:14:10But realistically, that's what this is.

00:14:14Nobody wants to hear that.

00:14:16Also, he was asked about that.

00:14:18Like, he didn't just pull that out of anywhere.

00:14:19I know.

00:14:20He specifically asked about that.

00:14:21And I thought it was a good answer.

00:14:23It's the kind of answer you would be, I'm just focused on this week.

00:14:26And he's like, I'm not saying he should be.

00:14:29I'm just saying that that's the difference.

00:14:30And also, I can't stand this thing of like, yes, like the mistakes you need to learn from

00:14:34them.

00:14:35And one, like you said, they didn't do the same thing they did against, you know, against

00:14:38the Jaguars in the situation near the end zone.

00:14:41Like it was a different decision.

00:14:42There have been times where they make the repeat decisions and we get on them.

00:14:44I was going to say, it also, it didn't work.

00:14:46So then they made a different decision.

00:14:47Then that also didn't work.

00:14:48Like that stuff where you're like, oh, it's like a coin flip.

00:14:50It literally is a coin flip.

00:14:51You can do one of two things.

00:14:52It is now statistically, obviously, if you want to get into it, the metric said like

00:14:56a strong go for it.

00:14:57I agreed wholeheartedly there.

00:14:59Yes, we can critique that.

00:15:01But it's not like they're always doing the same thing.

00:15:02And when they are doing the same thing, we keep going back to, well, yeah, but they're

00:15:05not executing well enough.

00:15:07No, what am I asking them to?

00:15:08All I'm saying is, you know, if you went to your doctor and he was like, you know,

00:15:12I'm going to be it's my first year.

00:15:14I promise I'll be a better doctor next year.

00:15:16And you're like, no, I'm going to a first year doctor.

00:15:18We're also talking about saving lives here, guys.

00:15:20We're talking about a good doctor.

00:15:24I need you to be a good doctor today, not tomorrow, today, right?

00:15:32So they're going to catch heat for sure.

00:15:35I like the analogy, John, but I also hate the analogy.

00:15:38I was like the one I tried to pull out a few weeks ago where I was like, what about

00:15:41on my streams?

00:15:42You guys came after me.

00:15:43One of the things that I've said about this whole thing, when everybody's in your mentions

00:15:46and fighting back and forth and it's like fire mayo and they stink and we need Bill

00:15:50back.

00:15:51And it's like the one thing I've always said, and I heard it the first time from the great

00:15:55Tom Curran from NBC, like, let's all take a step back.

00:15:58It's not like we're covering the Pentagon here.

00:16:00This isn't like this isn't government.

00:16:02This isn't what happened in Washington two weeks ago.

00:16:04Like this is football.

00:16:05So, yes, you don't want a doctor to be your first year head coach, but you don't want

00:16:13a doctor to be your first year doctor.

00:16:14But it's like, OK, we're not talking about saying I don't mind if he's my doctor.

00:16:18I just don't want him to be like, I'm still kind of figuring it out.

00:16:21No, he is.

00:16:22But that's another thing.

00:16:23Like, I know it's a frustrating thing to hear.

00:16:25We know every time Mayo's does something wrong, he's like, oh, I don't know any better.

00:16:29Like, it's not like he's doing this all the time.

00:16:31I just think it's unfair for us to be like when people are saying, oh, my God, he isn't

00:16:35ready as a head coach.

00:16:36And you have Bill Belichick like a week or two later being like, yeah, a first year head

00:16:40coach is an impossible job.

00:16:41And if you don't have the right supporting cast, it's really hard.

00:16:44And I think he is learning on the fly.

00:16:46You've got a first year offensive coordinator, first year defensive coordinator.

00:16:49And these aren't excuses.

00:16:50These are things we've been saying since all the way going back to the spring.

00:16:53Like, you know, I don't think it should be this whole mentality shift.

00:16:56It just sucks when you have these close games and to get close games.

00:16:59The Patriots have only really been blown out once.

00:17:01And I think that's something that we need to acknowledge with all this youth on the

00:17:05coaching staff and with the players.

00:17:06But it does need to be better.

00:17:07I'm not making excuses.

00:17:08I'm just.

00:17:09It's less about whether he's absolutely right in the fact that they are new and it is hard.

00:17:16Yes.

00:17:17But is this the right environment for a team that is trying to figure stuff out, is incredibly

00:17:23inexperienced, young with a rookie quarterback and you need to be on point?

00:17:29That's kind of the decision is, is this was was bringing like that's where people are

00:17:33going to look at it.

00:17:34It's like was bringing in a rookie coach with a pretty green staff, what this team needed.

00:17:40We've talked about problems in the wide receiver room and problems, you know, you know, in

00:17:44other positional groupings where you've got people that haven't got they might all end

00:17:49up being tremendous coaches down the line.

00:17:51It's just it's a challenge.

00:17:52And when it rears its head in games, it guys are guys get on hot seats.

00:17:58You don't have you don't have the benefit of multiple years of doing this as a coach.

00:18:05You're you're you're that you're that way of coaching shorter.

00:18:08Yeah, there's the leases as short as it is in coaching.

00:18:11And I was listening.

00:18:12We've seen John Gruden all of a sudden back on back in the media game.

00:18:15He was talking the other day in a video where he was at like the nineteen ninety nine annual

00:18:20the league meetings, the coaches meetings where they have the owners and they do that.

00:18:23The head coach, the head coach photo that everyone sees and he's looking around and

00:18:27it's Marty Schottenheimer from the Chargers and Dan Reeves with I don't even know where

00:18:32Dan Reeves goes.

00:18:33Joe Gibbs with with Washington.

00:18:34And he's like, I'm looking around and I'm thirty three and all of these coaches have

00:18:37been here and been able to develop a system for 10, 15 years.

00:18:41And that's not what the NFL is anymore.

00:18:43And that's that's the that's the reality of the situation.

00:18:46But let's also put it into context.

00:18:48So this year, the Bears and the Raiders are the teams that you look at where, you know,

00:18:51they had to pull the plug pretty quickly.

00:18:53Now, first of all, you have to look at ownership.

00:18:55The crafts are not hasty, where it's like you have one bad year.

00:18:58I'm sorry.

00:18:59The crafts are not the kind of ownership where they're just going to pull the plug fast.

00:19:02You know, pulls a plug fast, bad ownership, like what the Bears have, like what the Raiders

00:19:06have like.

00:19:07First of all, that's one part of this.

00:19:08I don't think the crafts are going to seriously consider pulling the plug until one like you

00:19:12get two years of just like, oh, this is terrible.

00:19:15And also they lose buy in from the locker room.

00:19:18Mayo's not close.

00:19:19Alex Van Pelt's not close to Marcus Covington's been here for years.

00:19:22And I know we want to talk about, oh, we throw all these new young guys in all these

00:19:27inexperienced guys.

00:19:28All right.

00:19:29Well, Gerard Mayo, we all thought like, obviously, maybe they should have had the coaching search

00:19:32and you can debate that for sure.

00:19:34But when you look at like the offensive coordinators, almost every single option on the market wound

00:19:38up going somewhere that was familiar.

00:19:40And Nick Haley didn't want to come to the Patriots because he didn't know what they

00:19:43had.

00:19:44They didn't know the quarterback.

00:19:45The talent wasn't very good.

00:19:46So one, they didn't have a whole lot of options.

00:19:48And the two young guys they did bring up are guys who had experience in the system and

00:19:52who Kraft was like, you know what, it might be rough at first, but we're going to give

00:19:55them a chance.

00:19:56So I just feel like we need to always remember the context when we say, oh, this coaching

00:19:59staff is so young.

00:20:00The team sucked last year.

00:20:02People didn't want to, free agents didn't want to come here.

00:20:03They already had the same amount of wins they did last year.

00:20:04Right.

00:20:05Like free agents didn't want to come here.

00:20:06Coaches didn't want to come here.

00:20:07Van Pelt came because he knew Elliott Wolfe or, you know, and that was a big part of that.

00:20:10So again, I'm not trying to make excuses for these people.

00:20:13I'm just trying to add the context when we're frustrated that they're so green.

00:20:16Yeah.

00:20:17Well, you tell me the experienced coach that wanted to come here and still would have had

00:20:20success.

00:20:21Like what?

00:20:23You know, the guys that we were so interested in this summer who got fired, like, you know,

00:20:27you're talking to OC, right?

00:20:28Not head coach.

00:20:29OC.

00:20:30Yes.

00:20:31Okay.

00:20:32The one name I would put over that is Mike Vrabel.

00:20:33Yeah.

00:20:34Of course.

00:20:35If this fails, Vrabel is not a head coach anywhere, by the way, didn't get a job when

00:20:37they were plenty of openings.

00:20:38I don't think that's and Taylor's done on a tangent, which I want to reel it back in

00:20:46after that.

00:20:47Yeah, we have to get back to this stuff that we'll get back to the game because there's

00:20:51a lot to talk about.

00:20:52Yeah.

00:20:53Mike Vrabel.

00:20:54Best career game.

00:20:55I thought was ridiculous.

00:20:56I think Mike Vrabel is a terrific leader of men.

00:20:57But I also think Mike Vrabel is already a dinosaur at the age of 50 in this NFL in terms

00:21:02of his refusal to like buy into the whole analytics thing and running the ball and the

00:21:08way he looks.

00:21:09And I don't think that's what you wanted here.

00:21:10So I think he wanted personal control.

00:21:12The teams didn't want to give him.

00:21:13I think on the opposite side of these guys, I would have loved Mike Vrabel.

00:21:16I was excited about the possibility.

00:21:17I was like, that would have been the one that made a ton of sense.

00:21:21Again, it's not worth the tangent right now.

00:21:23We got to break down the loss of the Rams, but I was high on Mike Vrabel.

00:21:26And that is the one coach out there in this whole search and whole thing where I still

00:21:31think about like, man, would it be any different?

00:21:33How would it look at Mike Vrabel's here?

00:21:35But regardless, still not a good team.

00:21:37Still probably would be three and seven right now.

00:21:39OK.

00:21:40Yeah.

00:21:41Drake May.

00:21:42Career game.

00:21:43282 yards.

00:21:4475% completion.

00:21:45Let's talk about the kid.

00:21:46We will.

00:21:47We will.

00:21:48I'm done driving the dagger into Mayo's back here.

00:21:53I'm going to play a Mayo bite here because we're talking about that one thing is the

00:21:58learning and the other is this.

00:22:00I never really felt like they had control of the game.

00:22:05I felt like we had control of the game.

00:22:07Look at the first half.

00:22:08I think we only had one three and out offensively.

00:22:10I thought they did a great job on first and second down, which was one of the targets

00:22:14that we talked about defensively.

00:22:16Not so much defensively.

00:22:19They only had what?

00:22:20Eight third downs in the game.

00:22:22And you just can't win that way.

00:22:23When you look at the time of possession, you look at the movement we were able to get offensively

00:22:27in the run game and in the pass game.

00:22:30You look at the time of possession.

00:22:31I mean, that's that's part of the formula.

00:22:33We just got to continue to build on it.

00:22:35We'll say the guys, you know, came out with energy.

00:22:37And even when our backs were against the wall, they still continued to play hard, which I

00:22:41definitely appreciate.

00:22:42I know the rest of the coaches and hopefully the fans appreciate it as well are playing

00:22:46hard.

00:22:47Now, do we need to get better?

00:22:48Absolutely.

00:22:49And that's my job as the head coach of this football team.

00:22:50I have to.

00:22:51It starts with me.

00:22:52I have to do better, demand more from our assistant coaches, demand more from our players.

00:22:57We have enough talent.

00:22:58We have no talent in our locker room to be a very good football team.

00:23:01We just got to be able to put it together.

00:23:02You know, the fourth and two elected to kick a field goal for his fourth and one probably

00:23:07probably would have went for it, but it made it a one score game.

00:23:11And then the Seattle situation showed up again.

00:23:14And I would say this, every game is unique.

00:23:16It's a it's one of one.

00:23:18And I just felt like when I made those choices, it was the best thing to do for our football

00:23:21team today.

00:23:22You didn't want to go 54 yard and ended up punting.

00:23:24There are a lot of different factors that we take into account.

00:23:28Talk about when we talk about, you know, the pregame warmup, you can kind of see how the

00:23:31kicks are going on both sides during the pregame warmups.

00:23:34And I just felt like that was the right decision to make.

00:23:38So that kind of covers a lot of the stuff that we talked about here.

00:23:40And I don't have I mean, I thought the first answer was odd.

00:23:44I don't know whether it felt like the Patriots controlled the game.

00:23:45I think the Patriots controlled the game at the start.

00:23:48They were in possession was insane.

00:23:49They did.

00:23:50They did.

00:23:51Thirty seven to twenty two Patriots.

00:23:53So they clearly had the time of possession, you know, and again, the Rams scored quick

00:23:57a couple of times.

00:23:58That one didn't help.

00:23:59It was like a 15 second drive and the cup doesn't help.

00:24:03And yeah, the Patriots were kind of conservatively, you know, they were they were doing they were

00:24:07doing what they could offensively.

00:24:09But it was considerably more plays than it normally takes to get, you know, get yourself

00:24:13down the field.

00:24:15Not a lot of big chunk plays for sure.

00:24:18And that's what it is.

00:24:19That's what the Patriots used to do to other teams, like, go ahead and see if you could

00:24:22string together a 15 play touchdown drive and then do it again and then do it again.

00:24:26And it's harder, but they ended up with the ball.

00:24:28No doubt about it.

00:24:29That was him talking about the the different game, you know, the different situations in

00:24:33the game, which, again, Taylor, you said are unique.

00:24:35And I don't necessarily doubt that.

00:24:37I will just say my final thought on it.

00:24:39We'll put a bow on it after you guys comment.

00:24:41We'll move on to Drake May.

00:24:42But I don't think the coaches lost the game any more than the players lost the game.

00:24:48But I think if the coaches coach better, even with the poor execution, they win.

00:24:52And I think if the players execute better and don't make dumb mistakes, even the way

00:24:55that the coaching went, they win.

00:24:57It was a winnable game.

00:24:59Both sides didn't do their part for what they needed to do.

00:25:03And that's the dumb penalties, you know, that the Patriots had and the ways they shot

00:25:08themselves in the foot and some execution, again, another three or four drops, which

00:25:12is never great.

00:25:14Whatever went on at the end of the game with the turnover, for sure.

00:25:17And then all of the stuff we mentioned with the coaching.

00:25:20The big thing for me is the lack of big plays on both sides of the ball.

00:25:23Patriots couldn't force a turnover.

00:25:24Kyron Williams had fumbled, I think, six games straight.

00:25:27I think no, I was.

00:25:28Romandre Stevenson was the only player who had more fumbles among running backs than

00:25:31Kyron Williams.

00:25:32Couldn't get a turnover there.

00:25:33Matthew Stafford had a pick in, like, six straight games.

00:25:36No interceptions.

00:25:37I thought that really hurt.

00:25:38And then the offense.

00:25:39Like you mentioned, the lack of chunk plays.

00:25:41We talk about the time of possession.

00:25:42I think part of it is that the Patriots really have trouble generating stuff downfield.

00:25:47We've seen Kayshawn Booty and Drake May look like they had something going early on when

00:25:51it came to their downfield connection.

00:25:52They have not been able to connect downfield for, I think, three straight weeks, at least

00:25:55out on deep throws.

00:25:57The deep passing game was one of Drake May's biggest strengths.

00:25:59And it feels like they just don't have the personnel to be able to go to that consistently.

00:26:03And that's one thing that really has bothered me today.

00:26:06Romandre Stevenson, he had his moments.

00:26:09He doesn't look the same to me as he did before the foot injury.

00:26:11I don't think he's breaking tackles as much.

00:26:13You're not seeing very many explosive runs there.

00:26:15So it feels like they need to keep going with these long, like, eight, 10, 12, 13 play drives.

00:26:21And it's tough to win that way.

00:26:22Obviously, you know, you want to control time of possession.

00:26:24And if you can just run and, you know, marry running pass and all that, and just drive

00:26:28the ball, that's awesome.

00:26:29But it also is concerning, especially in the moments where you really need to, like at

00:26:33the end of the game, when you can't generate those chunk plays to give yourself more of

00:26:36a chance, or at least flip field position and give yourself more field goal opportunities.

00:26:40So that's one thing that I'm pretty discouraged by, is that they just are not able to generate

00:26:45those big chunk plays outside of yards after the catch, which, to be fair, DeMario Douglas

00:26:49and Kendrick Bourne, two of the guys who historically, for this offense the past two years, have

00:26:52been the only ones who really could get you that.

00:26:54They both flash in that vein today.

00:26:56So I do want to give them credit.

00:26:58It is disappointing, the downfield passing game and the lack of turnovers for the defense.

00:27:01A couple more thoughts on that before we move on, John.

00:27:03Just his answer on the, hey, if it was fourth and one, we would have went for it.

00:27:06Instead, it's fourth and two, we don't.

00:27:08While I get that you kind of have to play by the margins and be like, well, we might

00:27:12be able to get one, we might not be able to get two here.

00:27:15Part of me, that kind of makes me upset, because it's just like, just go for it.

00:27:18Like, sometimes it's just a vibes thing.

00:27:20Sometimes it's just a, hey, we need this.

00:27:22I think we can get it.

00:27:23It's not like it's fourth and six, fourth and seven.

00:27:25It's short yardage.

00:27:26Run your best short yardage play.

00:27:27And go and get it.

00:27:28You're not expecting to only get one yard.

00:27:30You're expecting to probably call a play for two or three in that situation anyway.

00:27:33So go get it.

00:27:34On the deep downfield passing, we saw Kehshaun Booty.

00:27:37Drake May, you mentioned that that's his bread and butter, hitting those guys in

00:27:41stride and making those types of throws downfield.

00:27:43He hit Kehshaun Booty basically in stride.

00:27:45It was a great ball with the defender on him.

00:27:46He just wasn't able to go up and get it.

00:27:48And then Taekwon Thornton, who was released yesterday, a few weeks ago,

00:27:51when they were playing here.

00:27:52And he breaks pocket, and Taekwon's along the sideline.

00:27:54And he puts it right in the bread basket.

00:27:56Taekwon can't go get it.

00:27:58It's a personnel thing in that department.

00:28:00And I think that's something we're going to have to look forward

00:28:03to going into next season.

00:28:04And lasting on that third down, where they had to end up when they didn't get it.

00:28:07What I was upset with, and I don't understand

00:28:09why they keep doing this, is in these critical short yardage situations,

00:28:13why are you ever lining up under center?

00:28:15Like, I'm sorry.

00:28:16You have Drake May.

00:28:17I know.

00:28:18You at least have the threat of a run or a pass option.

00:28:21Like, we have the first downfield RPO that we've seen, I think,

00:28:23like two or three years with Mario Douglas.

00:28:25Why, in these situations, when you have-

00:28:28Andy almost got killed.

00:28:29We got that ball out quick.

00:28:30Right, like, why are you taking away the threat of your young quarterback

00:28:34as a runner and as a passer?

00:28:35That is a decision where I'm like, why are you doing this?

00:28:37And you weren't planning on going for it.

00:28:38I know they got stuffed.

00:28:39And they said, I think he thought it was going to go for negative yards.

00:28:43But I hated, hated that call.

00:28:44It's the same time when the two-minute drill a few weeks ago

00:28:47that they couldn't get.

00:28:48I said the same thing.

00:28:49I'm like, why, on fourth down, are you going under center heavy

00:28:52and putting all the defenders in the exact same place you're trying to run?

00:28:55That pisses me off.

00:28:56So that's it.

00:28:57And that's when you were saying the first thing about you're not

00:29:00using Drake Mays, one of his best abilities,

00:29:04which is that downfield ball.

00:29:05And you can't, if the guys are blanketed, and they are, the ball to Thornton,

00:29:10he was covered, but the ball hit him in the hands.

00:29:12Same thing to Booty.

00:29:14Pulled that one just like that, too, a few weeks back.

00:29:16Yeah, Booty went up for it weird and, like, just stuck one hand out.

00:29:19That was a good receiver.

00:29:20Plants, goes up with two hands.

00:29:22And that ball's right there, beautiful.

00:29:23Tet McMillan catches that.

00:29:25Yeah, so that was good.

00:29:26So this is number one of what you mentioned they're not using.

00:29:30And number two, you just said it again.

00:29:32What are you doing under center?

00:29:33Why aren't you that?

00:29:35They did not, this, we're not going to run our quarterback on designed runs

00:29:40or give him the option to run.

00:29:42And just, you know, and I feel like today they even said,

00:29:46don't scramble much, make what you can out of it.

00:29:49Because there was a couple of times where, even a week ago,

00:29:51I felt Drake Mays would have run.

00:29:53And he kind of stayed back and he waited to see it.

00:29:55You're trying to make Drake Mays, Tom Brady, quick reads,

00:29:58get the ball out fast, and dig and dunk your way down the field

00:30:02with precision and accuracy.

00:30:04And it's amazing he's doing as well as he's doing.

00:30:07Amazing, given, you know, how little experience he has

00:30:11and what you thought would be the area he would struggle the most in.

00:30:15And then you're not unleashing him to do the things that

00:30:19make him dynamic and electric.

00:30:21His off-platform stuff was great.

00:30:22Going right, throwing it across his body with a lot of off-platform.

00:30:26Dropping down the sidearm throw that he made, he was ridiculous.

00:30:31Ridiculous.

00:30:32And that's what we're going to transition to.

00:30:33But you question, like, who are they designing these plays for?

00:30:38You know, and that's what's weird when we talk about a coaching decision is,

00:30:41I thought Van Pelt schemed up some things fairly well.

00:30:44Because you have to with this team.

00:30:46Because you don't have guys who can beat man coverage, for the most part.

00:30:50So you have to run some stuff to get them into space against zone

00:30:53and whatever that is.

00:30:54And I thought they did it.

00:30:55A lot of it, you're just putting on Drake May to throw guys open

00:30:57or to throw it into tight windows when a guy's not looking.

00:31:00So I don't know that this game plan suits the personnel, necessarily.

00:31:06So that's what's a little bit confusing to me as well.

00:31:08And Taylor, you're much better to speak on that than I am.

00:31:11But you just alluded to a couple of things

00:31:13that Drake May is excellent at that they're not doing, which is crazy to me.

00:31:18If it's 4th and 1, and you are heavy package, under center,

00:31:22Drake May, Romandre behind you, my guys against your guys,

00:31:25I'm OK with that in a 4th and 1 scenario.

00:31:27If you trust them and you want to go get your yard, fine.

00:31:30But I like how you mentioned there's a difference between that

00:31:33and having an under center play on 3rd and 6, or 3rd and 5,

00:31:36rather, even a shorter yardage, right?

00:31:38Where you know you're not going for 2.

00:31:40It's not 2-down territory.

00:31:41Like, give that guy a chance on this play,

00:31:43and then run the under center thing on 4th and 1

00:31:45once you get your 2 or 3 yards the next play.

00:31:47So you've got to give yourself a chance.

00:31:49You've got to make him, you know, there

00:31:51are times where it's 4th and 1, and a quarterback's in shotgun.

00:31:54And it's like, why the hell are you spread out?

00:31:56You need one yard, and your guy's already five yards back.

00:31:58And I get those situations.

00:31:59But in this situation, you're totally right.

00:32:01Let him have that ability to run if the throw's not there,

00:32:04and make the play.

00:32:05And when it comes to Drake May not really running around as much,

00:32:07that's something he's talked about for a couple of weeks.

00:32:09He wants to be a passer, not a scrambler.

00:32:11Honestly, I would say he wants to scramble a throw, too.

00:32:14That's the thing he's been working on the last couple of weeks.

00:32:15And we've even said last week, there were a couple of times

00:32:17where it looked like he had opportunities

00:32:19to convert third downs, and instead tried to run and got tackled short.

00:32:22So I'm not going to really judge that part before I look at the film.

00:32:25I do like a young quarterback.

00:32:27Not too much like a Caleb Williams, where it's like, all right, no.

00:32:29You are actually imprisoning yourself in the pocket.

00:32:32Don't do that.

00:32:33But then we did see there were a couple of times

00:32:34where Drake May did break the pocket and was able to scramble.

00:32:37But the game plan, this Rams defensive front is terrifying.

00:32:40I was really worried about them coming in.

00:32:42They're so explosive.

00:32:43They're young.

00:32:44But they're super, super talented and tough to match up against.

00:32:47I liked getting the ball out of Drake May's hands quickly,

00:32:49especially because he's been excellent as an underneath passer.

00:32:53That was the biggest area.

00:32:54In his first start, I'm saying, all right, quick game.

00:32:56A lot of his struggles have consistently been in, all right,

00:32:59I need to put that foot back right at the top of my drop and get it out.

00:33:01He's looked so much better.

00:33:03A couple throws behind Hunter Henry, we did allude to that.

00:33:06Those are a little shaky.

00:33:07But for the most part, I'm like, this looks like a different dude,

00:33:09especially when he's throwing across his body

00:33:11while he's about to get a hit.

00:33:13I didn't mind the game plan, I will say that.

00:33:14But it did look like when they tried to drop back,

00:33:17he's just looking for somebody to get open.

00:33:18Pass protection held up a few times.

00:33:20Like, I don't think they were as egregious as in other weeks.

00:33:22I saw like four or five pockets where I was like,

00:33:24I think it's a coverage sacker.

00:33:26I think they're just McNuffin really on the back end.

00:33:28For sure.

00:33:29Yeah, they're clearly still struggling on stunts here.

00:33:34And they're having some tough time picking certain things up.

00:33:37And there's a couple times guys just got flat out beaten.

00:33:39That's going to happen.

00:33:40But it's not the same.

00:33:41I think both sacks came on line games.

00:33:43You're right, yeah.

00:33:43Exactly.

00:33:44And it's not that leaky breakdown,

00:33:46just getting beat by multiple guys

00:33:49and the complete pocket collapse that we

00:33:51were seeing in the early weeks.

00:33:52But we do want to talk about May.

00:33:54We kind of alluded to a bunch of stuff

00:33:55here because it was so impressively good in ways

00:33:58that, again, I don't think, without hyperbole,

00:34:01I'm floored by some of the things

00:34:04he's able to do at this point in his development.

00:34:07First off, though, we do want to tell you

00:34:09about a couple of our terrific sponsors

00:34:10here on the Garden Report.

00:34:11And we will begin, of course, with PrizePix, the number one

00:34:15DFS app out there, and the exclusive DFS partner

00:34:20of the CLNS Media Network.

00:34:22Oh, am I looking on?

00:34:24We're playing game time.

00:34:25We're playing a game time video.

00:34:27And this is Patriots postgame, not the Garden Report.

00:34:29But we love you, John.

00:34:32That's the video I've got.

00:34:34No, you called it the Garden Report.

00:34:35We're on Patriots postgame.

00:34:38Oh, yeah, that too.

00:34:40Did you think we were talking about the Celtics?

00:34:42No.

00:34:43Pick more, pick less.

00:34:45It's that easy.

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00:35:34Let's get back to game time, because we

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00:35:41Anticipation, guys, you could probably speak to it.

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00:35:45There was some traffic on the way down to the stadium today.

00:35:48You could smell the burgers at 9 AM when we walked in.

00:35:51It's a real vibe.

00:35:52It's different, right?

00:35:53The last home game, I literally was looking around just like,

00:35:55where is everybody?

00:35:57Are they coming late?

00:35:58Different vibe today.

00:35:59It was good stuff.

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00:36:41So guys, getting back to it.

00:36:43Again, you know, it's this game time.

00:36:48Game time.

00:36:49Hell yeah.

00:36:50Let's go.

00:36:51It's too bad that this can't just

00:36:56be the Drake May victory party celebration show.

00:36:59Because what do people care about most?

00:37:04And what's funny is I think we've actually

00:37:06undersold some of his successes relative to expectation

00:37:09on what could be done, given the personnel, and the situation,

00:37:12or the opponents, or whatever it is.

00:37:13And I still believe that, like, I think

00:37:15Drake May is being sometimes judged as a veteran in terms

00:37:19of, well, he threw that behind, and he threw the whatever.

00:37:2210-year veterans are doing that on a weekly basis.

00:37:24No one's playing perfect games.

00:37:26I think we're so used to Tom Brady

00:37:28here that it's like, you are used to some perfect games.

00:37:31And I think, you know, Drake May has,

00:37:36and you're waiting for that moment.

00:37:37And it was close today, right?

00:37:39Because if he doesn't throw that pick to end the game

00:37:42and marches him down the field when they were given

00:37:44that opportunity, this would have been his statement

00:37:46and his arrival.

00:37:47And Drake May would have probably

00:37:48been the number one storyline in the entire NFL

00:37:51tomorrow if he'd led them down the field.

00:37:53Because you've got Caleb Williams

00:37:55in his kind of whatever, and they beat him last week.

00:37:58And Jaden Daniels and the Kingsbury offense

00:38:00have strength exposed.

00:38:01Yeah, they lose on Thursday, right?

00:38:04Has come back down to earth.

00:38:05And all of a sudden, people are like,

00:38:08did we get the best guy in this draft?

00:38:10And I don't think that that's a ridiculous point to make.

00:38:13And I think every time you see Drake May,

00:38:15you're seeing a little more and a little more.

00:38:17And while progress isn't linear, he

00:38:19is getting better each week to the point

00:38:22that the announcers today were absolutely,

00:38:25I know you guys are at the game, gushing.

00:38:28Like, I can't believe this is the guy we saw five weeks ago.

00:38:30Mark Sanchez, yeah.

00:38:32Gushing.

00:38:32I thought he was puking a cool pregame.

00:38:34Just fun story.

00:38:35I saw Mark Sanchez with the bun and everything.

00:38:37And I was like, why is Puka wearing a jacket?

00:38:39Why isn't he out in uniform?

00:38:40And Mike's like, nope, that is Mark Sanchez.

00:38:44Gushing over, like, who is this guy?

00:38:48He's doing elite veteran things.

00:38:51And they were gushing over his footwork and his ability

00:38:54to get through his reads and handle pressure and make

00:38:57everything.

00:38:58And again, it's hard to not watch.

00:39:00And you never know what's going to happen in the long term.

00:39:04It's not that difficult to watch this right now and be like,

00:39:08they got him.

00:39:09They got the guy.

00:39:10I think that's why.

00:39:11And you could have felt it a couple of weeks ago.

00:39:13But you still see more and more each week.

00:39:15And it's like, I don't know where it's going to end.

00:39:17I keep seeing more from this guy.

00:39:19And I don't want the bubble to burst.

00:39:21But you have to be over the moon if you're a Patriots fan.

00:39:24If you wanted one thing this year,

00:39:25it was, please tell me we drafted the right guy.

00:39:29And honestly, I don't mind if we lose a few games,

00:39:31as long as they see some improvement

00:39:32and get some draft picks next year too.

00:39:34So you're kind of getting it.

00:39:35But now it's like, shit, they could win with this guy.

00:39:38And just this guy alone, they could put it on his shoulders

00:39:40and win a few games here.

00:39:42And now you kind of want to see more and more.

00:39:44I think that's why I come out of every week

00:39:46that Drake May plays with the, yeah, OK, it wasn't great.

00:39:49But, well, yeah, but there's this.

00:39:51And yeah, and it's because, yeah,

00:39:52but it looks like you have your freaking quarterback.

00:39:55It is the most important position in football.

00:39:57And I like how you mentioned, John,

00:39:58that we're kind of already treating him

00:39:59like a veteran, where he does have some of these erratic

00:40:02throws and things like that.

00:40:03It's not like Tom Brady didn't miss throws when he was playing.

00:40:05It's not like Stafford today didn't miss throws.

00:40:07When you're a gunslinger like that,

00:40:09you're going to make your mistakes.

00:40:10You're going to have your turnovers.

00:40:11And obviously, the interception at the end of the game

00:40:13wasn't great.

00:40:14Obviously, the strip sack wasn't great.

00:40:16But at the end of the day, the guy threw for 282 yards.

00:40:19He completed 75% of his throws.

00:40:21And he had you in the game with two minutes left.

00:40:24So a miscommunication.

00:40:25Exactly.

00:40:26And so that's why everyone wants to fire Mayo.

00:40:29And everybody wants to reset this whole thing.

00:40:32It's like, let's just let them build around this guy,

00:40:34because he is so good and he is so talented.

00:40:37Yeah, but you finally, I think, have

00:40:39your quarterback of the future.

00:40:40After Tom Brady's gone, you tried Cam Newton.

00:40:43You tried Matt Jones.

00:40:44Those didn't work.

00:40:45Drake May is here, and it's pretty exciting.

00:40:46And the only reason I personally hold

00:40:48Drake May to a high standard is because I

00:40:49know he's capable of a lot.

00:40:51This is a guy where, when we've been asking him questions,

00:40:54you know, sometimes we'll ask and try to give him out,

00:40:56just so the question, we don't sound like assholes, honestly.

00:40:58We're just like, yeah, but did you see?

00:40:59No, no, no.

00:41:00He will not make excuses.

00:41:02Like, he's a lot harder on himself than we are.

00:41:04And that's the only reason I say, OK,

00:41:05like, I know he can be better.

00:41:06I know he's going to work on this.

00:41:08Because if we critique it and he improves,

00:41:10then we can celebrate him.

00:41:11You know, like what I talked about,

00:41:12the underneath accuracy.

00:41:13I was really worried about it earlier when he started.

00:41:16Now I can say, look at this.

00:41:17He's hitting his guys in stride, even when he's off platform,

00:41:20staying in the pocket, not putting himself in harm's way.

00:41:23Like, obviously, all the little things

00:41:25that he's not doing well still need to be acknowledged.

00:41:27Because one, it's like, OK, we know

00:41:28where he still needs to grow.

00:41:30And when we see every single week,

00:41:32like, you talk about the footwork.

00:41:33I was looking at last week, and I'm thinking,

00:41:35really, because we didn't do our kind of the same Drake May

00:41:38breakdown we usually do, where I kind of lasered in on, yeah,

00:41:40he's drifting into pressure.

00:41:41Sometimes he's kind of putting himself

00:41:43in the middle of the pocket and then trying to throw it.

00:41:45And it's like, dude, you're going to get clobbered.

00:41:47You've got to stop doing that.

00:41:48And you can see, he understands, and he's trying to be better.

00:41:51So I agree.

00:41:52The mistakes, especially when it's a miscommunication,

00:41:54the strip sack, yeah, that's tough.

00:41:56He probably should get it out of his hands.

00:41:57But also, that's a big, they've almost all

00:41:59come from the blind side, which is, you know.

00:42:01He got murdered, yeah.

00:42:01Right.

00:42:02Exactly.

00:42:02And he got really rocked there.

00:42:03That's a tough play.

00:42:04But for most of the game, I'm saying he's excellent.

00:42:07Like, you really have the feeling now

00:42:09that you haven't had since Brady, where

00:42:11when the Patriots have the ball last,

00:42:13you know there's a legitimate shot

00:42:15they have to actually move the ball down the field because

00:42:17of Drake's legs, because of his decision making,

00:42:19because of his accuracy.

00:42:20So any time they went on that field,

00:42:22it wasn't like the other games where I'm just like,

00:42:23oh my god, just get a strip sack or something.

00:42:25Just end it, please.

00:42:26I know that Mack, or whomever, or Bailey

00:42:29isn't about to lead this game winning drive.

00:42:31But with Drake, it's like, no, they got a good chance

00:42:33because he's got the arm.

00:42:34He's got everything you need.

00:42:35Just going to take some time to get that talent around him

00:42:38where he doesn't have to carry the entire team on his back.

00:42:42Yeah.

00:42:43At least the offense, right.

00:42:44Yeah, so that's a positive.

00:42:47So to speak to that, what you just said there is like,

00:42:52and I'm seeing it in the chat as well.

00:42:54People are having a hard time enjoying

00:42:56having gotten the guy because I do

00:42:58think that you look at what's going on with the team

00:43:01and think like, well, what else?

00:43:04And there's definitely some pieces on defense.

00:43:06And fine, you've got some OK performances out

00:43:11of number three type receivers like a Douglas or a Bourne.

00:43:14But you know what you don't have.

00:43:16And then you recognize how difficult

00:43:18it is going to be to get those things

00:43:20and start thinking like, oh, crap.

00:43:22Are we going to waste this?

00:43:23We got this guy, but you'd love to see more around it.

00:43:26And I'm not getting into the Jalen Polk stuff

00:43:29yet because it's not important enough to talk about now.

00:43:33But boy, would you feel a lot better

00:43:35if you hit with one of your receivers

00:43:37right now instead of two guys that

00:43:39not only can't see the field, shouldn't see the field.

00:43:42And I'm sorry.

00:43:43I'm always for playing the kids.

00:43:44I think Polk's got to be healthy and active for a little while.

00:43:49And I'd put Osborne back in.

00:43:51And I'd put professionals around Drake May who are going to,

00:43:54even if they're unspectacular, are

00:43:56going to do what they're supposed to do and make

00:43:58the simple plays.

00:43:59Because I think it's not benefiting anybody to do that.

00:44:04So I think that's where some of the frustration comes in.

00:44:06It's nice.

00:44:07You do have Bourne and Douglas who are good yak guys.

00:44:12And a good rebound from Bourne this week, too,

00:44:15where he doesn't play a snap last week.

00:44:17He's their leading receiver today.

00:44:19First touchdown of the season?

00:44:20And I love everything he said after the game, too.

00:44:22But yeah, go ahead, Mike.

00:44:23And his suit.

00:44:24No, I just, yeah, he did look down probably.

00:44:26But no, quickly, just on Baker, too,

00:44:28he's a guy who can't see the field on offense.

00:44:30They put him out there as a return man.

00:44:32He returns the first kick out to the 45 or something like that.

00:44:36And then his following return, he

00:44:37takes it out jogging nonchalantly, kind of strange.

00:44:40And then he tries to hurdle someone.

00:44:41And then he doesn't see time.

00:44:43Oh, he fumbled on it.

00:44:44Oh, yeah, he fumbled it.

00:44:45He fumbled it.

00:44:45Kept trying to get it.

00:44:46Oh, that's what it was.

00:44:46He messed up trying to get it like a couple times.

00:44:48And then he didn't see the field as a returner again.

00:44:50It was Hasty and Gibson for the rest of the game there.

00:44:53And that's a week after.

00:44:54I didn't even notice this on my initial film review,

00:44:56because I wasn't really looking at him specifically.

00:44:58But when I did want to see all four of his snaps last week,

00:45:00he ran a route on a running play,

00:45:02where I think his assignment wound up

00:45:03tackling Romandre Stevenson on what

00:45:05should have been an even bigger carrier that could

00:45:06have gotten them in the end zone.

00:45:08So I know we talked about this last year with Keyshawn Booty,

00:45:10where towards the end of the year, everyone's like, oh,

00:45:12why does it matter if they're making mistakes?

00:45:13I'm like, what do you mean, why does it matter

00:45:15if they're making mistakes?

00:45:16If you go out there and you get false starts,

00:45:18you get the guy killed, you don't run the right route.

00:45:19A wrong route can lead to an interception.

00:45:21Again, a missed assignment leads to what could have been

00:45:24a bigger play not being that.

00:45:25So I'm with you, John.

00:45:27I want to see these guys get their confidence back.

00:45:30And I understand the only way to get better at football

00:45:31is by playing football.

00:45:33But you need to prioritize Drake May right now.

00:45:36Jalen Polk and Javon Baker are going

00:45:37to have all summer next year.

00:45:38If they get better in practice, awesome.

00:45:40It's not like KJ Osborne's lighting the world on fire.

00:45:42But he blocks.

00:45:43He doesn't make a whole lot of MEs or mental errors.

00:45:45And no, he's not giving you a whole lot in the passing game.

00:45:47But what the hell is Jalen Polk getting you?

00:45:49Jalen Polk got the same touchdown

00:45:51that Vidarian Lowe did today.

00:45:52I think KJ Osborne can do that.

00:45:54And you know, I'm very forgiving.

00:45:55I try to be understanding with these young guys.

00:45:57But at the same time, it is frustrating when you're barely

00:45:59even really contributing when you're on the field.

00:46:02And the only impact that's tangible

00:46:04is usually you not being able to finish plays

00:46:06and making mental errors.

00:46:07So that's that.

00:46:08What is it?

00:46:09Vidarian Lowe is tied for second on the Patriots

00:46:11in touchdowns.

00:46:12Target so far today, Lowe, one.

00:46:14Jalen Polk, Baker.

00:46:15Oh, boy.

00:46:17Not great.

00:46:18Did Baker play on offense?

00:46:19No, he didn't.

00:46:20Yeah, he did.

00:46:21He did.

00:46:21Oh, did he?

00:46:22He did.

00:46:22He had a couple of snaps.

00:46:24I know he was mentioned at one point

00:46:26or somebody tweeted about when he was out there.

00:46:30But I can't remember exactly.

00:46:32So very little, very little.

00:46:34He ran the wrong direction.

00:46:36Very little.

00:46:36So look, and that's the thing is like,

00:46:38this is where the conversation becomes difficult.

00:46:40It's like you're watching it from a standpoint

00:46:42where you're used to watching this team

00:46:43and thinking, what do they need to do to win?

00:46:45And some of the stuff we mentioned regarding Drake May,

00:46:47hey, maybe they use him differently.

00:46:49But like in the grand scheme of things,

00:46:52not getting him killed and letting

00:46:54him continue to develop as a quarterback,

00:46:56doing the things that good quarterbacks need to do,

00:46:59might be more important than just like grip it and rip it

00:47:02and heave it downfield into double coverage

00:47:04and turn the ball over just because you got a big arm

00:47:07or just go out there, run, and break a rib

00:47:09like Jaden Daniels did in a Kingsbury offense that's

00:47:11very centered around getting the quarterback out there

00:47:14and using their legs and doesn't really hold up

00:47:17in the long term.

00:47:18I just don't want to remove it as an option.

00:47:20That's all.

00:47:21But right now, you can't be upset about anything

00:47:24that's happening in terms of the trajectory of Drake May.

00:47:27Because again, even the comments after the game,

00:47:29and as I said, the announcers during the game,

00:47:33I almost, you can't believe.

00:47:35It's like AI.

00:47:36You know, like it's learning at a rapid rate.

00:47:38You know, like you can't believe how much different

00:47:42before he takes over the world.

00:47:43Exactly.

00:47:44Like world domination is like by week 17.

00:47:47It's going to go into other sports.

00:47:49When does it stop?

00:47:51Exactly.

00:47:52So that's the thing is like and Kendrick

00:47:53Bourne, one of his comments after the game

00:47:56was he's striving for perfection and like he's

00:48:01improving at a rapid rate.

00:48:03And I think everybody sees it.

00:48:05And that's what pre-draft, why I liked him

00:48:07more than the other guys.

00:48:08It's just like the Vought, you keep

00:48:10using that word, but what you get from him,

00:48:12one, the attitude.

00:48:13Like when he talks about keeping the main thing, the main thing,

00:48:17sometimes you talk about like family and things like that.

00:48:19You know, it can get a little choppy

00:48:20when we're in these draft processes.

00:48:22But a lot of the time, especially

00:48:23with these quarterbacks, you thrive

00:48:25when you do have a family around you, especially with athletes

00:48:28where there is that level of perspective

00:48:30and that kind of almost sick kind of work ethic

00:48:32where it's like I'm going to be better and when I'm not,

00:48:34like I'm going to take it very personally.

00:48:36You saw that with him in the pre-draft process.

00:48:38And obviously, as soon as the Patriots drafted him,

00:48:40you could really see that come to the forefront.

00:48:43And that desire to constantly be better

00:48:45because you know if he's not good enough,

00:48:47it's going to nag at him.

00:48:48And not just that, but then the physical talent

00:48:50to really take advantage of it.

00:48:51I think you're starting to see it.

00:48:52That's why I'm not really surprised.

00:48:53Obviously, there's a certain level

00:48:55that you expect to see a quarterback grow.

00:48:57But we talked about it like during the process

00:48:59where it's like, yeah, he's going to grow.

00:49:01I don't think the flaws that he has

00:49:02are going to persist because he has

00:49:04the physical talent and the work ethic

00:49:06where he's going to work to improve those things.

00:49:08Also, just one quick other thing on the receiver situation.

00:49:12With Jalen Polk, he's really taken over

00:49:14Kendrick Bourne's role in those two receiver packages.

00:49:16He doesn't play in three.

00:49:17When it's three, Kendrick Bourne would go on.

00:49:19In the two, it's Jalen Polk.

00:49:20I think after Kendrick's performance today,

00:49:22again, another performance where Polk

00:49:24doesn't do a whole lot for you.

00:49:25I do think we're probably just going to see

00:49:26Kendrick Bourne slide in and be the true wide receiver, too.

00:49:29And obviously, you know, Demario Douglas as the three

00:49:31when they go into those types of groupings.

00:49:33Very quickly, thank you, D.

00:49:34Any super chats here go directly to the host.

00:49:37We always do appreciate it.

00:49:38We don't ask for it, but we do appreciate it.

00:49:40It helps us continue to bring this content to you

00:49:43free and frequently, which, again, is one of the keys here.

00:49:48And I know you're going to get a lot more.

00:49:49That's why it's called Pat's Daily, baby.

00:49:50Yeah, Pat's Daily.

00:49:51You're going to get more from Mike and Taylor

00:49:54on this tomorrow when they kind of get a chance

00:49:55to break things down and continue to look at it.

00:49:58So talking about Drake May, obviously, you

00:50:02had the strip sack fumble, which, again, it was tough.

00:50:07And that's that he did get smoked on that play.

00:50:10I don't know if as much ball possession

00:50:12and just simply straight force of impact

00:50:15where he just got rocked from behind.

00:50:17Ball comes out. It is what it is.

00:50:19But for the second time with Drake May

00:50:20is an opportunity to lead the team down the field

00:50:22as a as a starter of the Patriots

00:50:25and a chance to do something you had over time.

00:50:28Overtime of the sorry, which game?

00:50:31The Tennessee game where he throws a really ill-advised pick,

00:50:34which, again, I think was actually deep all over the middle

00:50:36that ends up turning into an interception.

00:50:37I think it was a I think that was strictly a wind induced

00:50:41or just under throw.

00:50:43I actually think that throw might have been there

00:50:44if he'd let it.

00:50:45So I don't think it was as bad a decision

00:50:47as we thought the first time.

00:50:47But that's neither here nor there.

00:50:49Then you have the last play today,

00:50:51which is what looks like, you know,

00:50:55just a bad read by one or the other or both.

00:50:58Again, it's hard to say.

00:50:59And I know, Taylor, you talked about it.

00:51:00I want to hear the players give their take on it.

00:51:03And then you can tell me what you thought,

00:51:05because I think people have been a bit back and forth

00:51:07on this with what happened and everybody saw the game.

00:51:10Ball sailed and Douglas didn't turn around.

00:51:17But it still might have been overthrown regardless.

00:51:19And Douglas might have done the right thing there.

00:51:22It's hard to quite be able to tell.

00:51:24But here's them talking about it after the game.

00:51:27That did just kind of what went wrong there?

00:51:30Just miscommunication, which going back

00:51:32to the question earlier, you know,

00:51:34you go back and look at the Rams versus the Seahawks

00:51:36and those guys making those plays down the stretch,

00:51:38you know, it was very impressive.

00:51:39And look, we'll grow into being able to finish out

00:51:42and finish and close out these games.

00:51:44Just got to go back to work, get on the practice field.

00:51:47Tomorrow, we'll clean up a lot of this stuff.

00:51:50And then Wednesday is change the page onto the next game.

00:51:52You guys play through what happened on that play?

00:51:54Yeah, it's too high look and it pops up the middle

00:51:57and they're pretty good up front rushing five.

00:51:59So I tried to kind of put it on them

00:52:01and kind of hit them over the linebacker

00:52:04and pop was thinking probably deep,

00:52:06but at the end of the day, just got to be on the same page.

00:52:09And I think pop, you know, did the right thing.

00:52:11I guess got to just talk through more conversations

00:52:15and it just goes back to me during the week,

00:52:16doing more, you know, talking to different situations.

00:52:19Hey, I may put this one on you versus let it rip.

00:52:21So that's about it.

00:52:22What were you thinking at that point?

00:52:24I was running my route.

00:52:29Did he not throw where he was supposed to go?

00:52:31I just miscommunication.

00:52:33Both of us, we'll take it.

00:52:35I didn't really get to see it because I was still running,

00:52:38but I just heard, you know, just heard a crowd

00:52:40and I turned around and it was an interception.

00:52:43And I think Gerard, Coach Mayo mentioned

00:52:45maybe miscommunication, something where you and Drake

00:52:48were sort of maybe seeing something differently.

00:52:51Right, I'll say miscommunication.

00:52:53Yeah, just leave it at that.

00:52:54Yeah, I don't want nobody to turn anything, yep.

00:52:57Pop is smart.

00:52:59Yeah, so Pop, very quickly, my take,

00:53:02that's two guys there who think it was the other guy's fault,

00:53:06but that's okay.

00:53:08Pop.

00:53:09I think I disagree with that.

00:53:10Yeah, I disagree.

00:53:11Leave it there.

00:53:11And May was like, yeah, I'll lead it.

00:53:15I'm the quarterback, I'll lead it here.

00:53:17You know, he did what he's supposed to do.

00:53:19So again, your interpretation of it.

00:53:21They both handled it well.

00:53:22No one's throwing anybody under the bus,

00:53:25but my vibe off of that is each one thinks it's like,

00:53:28yeah, he should have done the thing I wanted,

00:53:30and Pop's thinking, yeah, I did the right thing.

00:53:32He should have thrown it where I was.

00:53:34But anyway, how did you guys read the whole thing?

00:53:36So this reminded me of the Seahawks game

00:53:38where Gonzo and Kyle Duggar had that bone coverage.

00:53:41I asked both guys.

00:53:42Gonzo wouldn't say anything about it.

00:53:44Duggar was the one who acknowledged what it was.

00:53:46Usually the guy who was like, yeah, you know,

00:53:48miscommunication, that's all I'm saying,

00:53:50that's usually the guy who wasn't at fault in my,

00:53:52you know, in my brief experience.

00:53:54That's what I mean, they both said it.

00:53:55And that's right.

00:53:56But I think that Drake gave a little more information

00:53:59about it and was like, yeah, it was too high.

00:54:00I was trying to put it over the linebacker.

00:54:01He said that, then Debar was like, ah, ah, nah, nah.

00:54:03I think Drake understands that he,

00:54:06whether it was miscommunication or not,

00:54:07I think he was the one.

00:54:08One, like you said, it was a high ball.

00:54:09I also think that whatever reason was,

00:54:12you know, the veteran usually I'll defer to as well.

00:54:14The quarterback, when it's a quarterback,

00:54:15it is kind of tricky, but, you know,

00:54:17whoever's fault it was,

00:54:19I just feel like it probably wasn't on Pop

00:54:20because his complete non-answer felt like kind of telling.

00:54:23To me, it's both of their faults.

00:54:25And I think it's that simple,

00:54:27where they just need to get more reps

00:54:29and they need to understand what's gonna happen

00:54:31in those situations.

00:54:32And it brings me back to the game in London

00:54:35against the Jaguars,

00:54:36where there was the play where Drake threw it really high

00:54:38over Austin Hooper's head.

00:54:40He was turning one way, Drake was throwing another way.

00:54:42And that brought me back to a conversation

00:54:45I saw with Kyle Rudolph.

00:54:46He was on part of my Take podcast a couple of weeks ago,

00:54:48talking about playing with Tom Brady

00:54:50and how there are some quarterbacks

00:54:51who are so regimented in it.

00:54:53You need to run 12 yards here,

00:54:54break at 16 here and get to this spot here.

00:54:57And I'm gonna put the ball right here on this time,

00:54:58where sometimes Tom Brady was like,

00:55:00if you're open, just turn the hell around

00:55:02and I'm gonna put it right on your chest.

00:55:03And I think that's what Drake May was doing

00:55:05with Hooper in Jacksonville.

00:55:06And I think that's what Drake May was doing

00:55:08with Douglas here,

00:55:09where there was that void in the middle of the defense.

00:55:11Drake just tried to basically whip it right

00:55:14on Douglas's chest.

00:55:15Douglas sees there's a void here,

00:55:16but there's also all of this space in the back quarter

00:55:19or the back half of the field.

00:55:20I can run under this and score a touchdown.

00:55:22And I think that's just where the miscommunication

00:55:24came from between those two guys.

00:55:26So they just need to rep those things out

00:55:27and these wide receivers need to get on the same page

00:55:29with May and realize, if I'm open, turn around

00:55:31and this guy's just gonna try and make a play

00:55:33and put it on me.

00:55:33And that's the value of like Drake May being able

00:55:35to grow with some of these receivers.

00:55:37It's like Matthew Stafford and Cooper Cup,

00:55:38one big reason they're so successful

00:55:40is they have a mind meld,

00:55:42where they really are on the same page

00:55:43and Cup knows, I feel like I'm open right now,

00:55:45I need to give Stafford my eyes so I can be available.

00:55:48And that's why Kukunuku is so damn impressive already

00:55:50through his first two seasons.

00:55:51Him and Stafford are already on the same page

00:55:52and that guy's been playing about 18 games.

00:55:54It is unreal.

00:55:55Let me ask you a quick question, Taylor.

00:55:57Just to people at home watching this,

00:55:59just walk through how this works, right?

00:56:02Douglas is saying he ran his route.

00:56:03So he did what he was supposed to do.

00:56:05There's pressure there.

00:56:07So I don't know if, I don't think he's supposed

00:56:08to come hot there or whatever or turn around

00:56:11or whatever that is, but there's some pressure coming.

00:56:13So May wants to get that ball out there

00:56:15and he sees an opportunity.

00:56:17At that point, is Douglas supposed to read the defense?

00:56:20Because it looks like he broke between the safeties

00:56:23into space where he thought he should be.

00:56:26Is he doing what he was predetermined to do

00:56:28or did he make a read in that situation to go there?

00:56:31Because based on his answer, it sounds like he had said,

00:56:35I ran my route.

00:56:36That's, I did what I was supposed to do.

00:56:39And for May to throw it and think he's supposed to look,

00:56:42is that supposed to be in Douglas's head of like,

00:56:45make sure you're looking back because that ball

00:56:48could come at any point in time.

00:56:49Where are the responsibilities there?

00:56:52It's tough because honestly that happened

00:56:53when we pretty much were getting ready to go.

00:56:55We had to get ready to start going down for interviews.

00:56:57So I haven't gotten to see if there was like a replay

00:56:59of the all 22 or anything, but usually on those seam routes,

00:57:02you do have an option to either keep going straight up

00:57:04or kind of bend it inside based on

00:57:06what the safeties give you.

00:57:08If there is a safety right dead in the middle of the field,

00:57:11then you usually kind of want to make sure

00:57:13that you're bending it kind of inside or I'm sorry,

00:57:15you want to make sure you're staying up field in a way.

00:57:17So maybe you put it back shoulder.

00:57:18If it's split safety and there's an open area in the middle,

00:57:21then you curve it inside so that you're not just

00:57:24running right at the safeties.

00:57:25You're running into where the void is.

00:57:26So that's what I initially thought happened with Drake,

00:57:28where he saw there was that opening and thought that Pop

00:57:31was going to look for it once he got to that middle part

00:57:33of the field.

00:57:34But I think Pop thought, no,

00:57:35I'm literally just running off coverage and maybe thought

00:57:37something was going to come out from behind him.

00:57:39That was my initial interpretation.

00:57:40I do need to look back and confirm what the coverage was

00:57:42though.

00:57:43Okay. Yeah.

00:57:44It's just interesting.

00:57:45Cause you say miscommunication there again,

00:57:47there's so much that goes on that we don't fully know in

00:57:50terms of, you know, if they're, if they're playing inside,

00:57:54you know, you do this and if you do that,

00:57:55and I don't know if like just looking at that play,

00:57:56it's now based on that coverage, Pop did the right thing.

00:57:59And Drake took a gamble or vice versa.

00:58:01So again, the, the table show,

00:58:03and it felt like there were differing opinions from the

00:58:04Twitter community,

00:58:05from people who all are respected and know what they see

00:58:10and know what they're doing,

00:58:11but the guys handled it the right way.

00:58:13Shoulder shrug, miscommunication and move on there.

00:58:18The, you know, we did mention it briefly.

00:58:23And again, just a quick shout out.

00:58:25I love that born did what he did.

00:58:26And I actually love his answer after the game.

00:58:29It's very, very easy for someone like born who was a veteran

00:58:33and supposed to be the veteran leader of this receiver core

00:58:37to get benched outright last a week ago and not come back

00:58:42bitter or chip on his shoulder or annoyed.

00:58:45And how dare they like it was an affront.

00:58:48In fact, his answer after the game was I'm just,

00:58:51I'm happy.

00:58:52People still believe in me,

00:58:53which is really a refreshing thing to hear because you need

00:58:55more of that,

00:58:56particularly in that room where everybody's just,

00:58:59what are you talking about?

00:58:59I did what I'm supposed to do.

00:59:00I'm awesome.

00:59:01I catch everything.

00:59:02I'm the best player in the world.

00:59:03Like I got the best hands in the world.

00:59:06I love that the guy who's actually the only one who has,

00:59:09you know,

00:59:10who has any track record of NFL success among this group

00:59:14will flat out say like, I'm happy.

00:59:16They still trust me, which is great.

00:59:18And he was rewarded today with the five reception, 70,

00:59:21you know, yards, you know,

00:59:22on five targets are receiving TDE breath of fresh air.

00:59:25And then Douglas, again,

00:59:26have to find a way to work him in because just gotta,

00:59:29when you lack downfield playmakers,

00:59:32you have to get the ball in the hands of people who can make

00:59:34people miss in space.

00:59:35And that's something that Demario Douglas absolutely can do.

00:59:38So again, I still don't think it's enough.

00:59:40I still think you have to find ways to feed him more and to

00:59:42create more opportunities to get him involved,

00:59:45but hats off to both of those guys.

00:59:47You definitely needed it.

00:59:50And then we moved to this guy, Jalen Polk again.

00:59:53Thought we weren't doing Jalen Polk today.

00:59:55I said, I said,

00:59:58I wasn't doing it early because it's not important enough,

01:00:02but I do think it's it matters to show.

01:00:04I thought you meant early in his career. Okay.

01:00:07Oh no, I'm doing it in his career.

01:00:09I was like, oh, that's a rare restraint from John.

01:00:13No, we're coming for you.

01:00:15We're coming.

01:00:16Love it.

01:00:17Zero reception, zero yards, zero targets.

01:00:20And he was out there.

01:00:21It's not like he didn't play false start too.

01:00:23Yep.

01:00:23That was the one false start.

01:00:25And then he's coming to the sideline.

01:00:26Like, like, like frustrated that it happened instead of like,

01:00:31I it's just, I don't understand what's happening here.

01:00:35I don't understand how everything that's going on

01:00:38surrounding this guy is the complete opposite of everything

01:00:42you thought was supposed to be.

01:00:44This guy was supposed to be about a pro contested catches,

01:00:48tough, tough guy, accountable, this and that.

01:00:52And like, I'm sorry.

01:00:53Like, you don't want to die.

01:00:55That's that's a big purple arm.

01:00:58You don't want to.

01:01:00It was Barney.

01:01:04You don't want to give up on somebody.

01:01:05You're kind of cutting it out here.

01:01:08Oh no, I think we got you back now.

01:01:10You don't want to give up on somebody

01:01:12that's early in the career.

01:01:13But like, I cannot find a single thing

01:01:17that not only is redeemable,

01:01:19but makes you think that like,

01:01:21there's a possibility that this turns into

01:01:24a positive down the road.

01:01:26I don't know what I, I mean,

01:01:29I think receiver maybe more so than some other positions,

01:01:32you should still see some of the talent,

01:01:34even if you're not seeing the finished product, you know,

01:01:37oh, we got open, but he's clumsy with his hands or, oh,

01:01:40you know, he can only make catches,

01:01:41but he's having a difficult time doing this.

01:01:42He's not doing anything.

01:01:45And I don't know what you do next.

01:01:48I just think he's,

01:01:50I really don't want to talk about this much longer.

01:01:51I can barely feel my fingers.

01:01:52I'm so sick of talking about Jalen Polk.

01:01:54He's a young receiver.

01:01:55He's clearly in his head.

01:01:57Like, I think it's as simple as that.

01:01:58Yeah, we could say, oh, he's not showing the talent.

01:02:00Neither did Keishon Booney last year.

01:02:01Like, it's literally the exact same conversation.

01:02:03Jalen Polk is just getting exposed more.

01:02:05And I do think it's like,

01:02:07Mike Nwenu isn't playing very well this year.

01:02:09And I think he kind of acknowledged a part of it

01:02:10as he's moving around so much that he's kind of in his head.

01:02:13We can't just act like these aren't human beings

01:02:15who get down on themselves

01:02:16or probably make these mistakes and get frustrated,

01:02:18especially with receivers.

01:02:19Like, how often do we hear receivers play their best

01:02:22when they're not thinking and they're playing fast?

01:02:25I have not seen Jalen Polk play fast,

01:02:27maybe since the San Francisco game.

01:02:29I really think that's the bottom line.

01:02:30Like, we keep talking about this every week.

01:02:32He's a rookie who has not shown us anything yet.

01:02:34I understand that's frustrating.

01:02:35I'm not burying the kid

01:02:37until we at least get into next summer and see,

01:02:39okay, has he learned?

01:02:40Does he have more confidence?

01:02:41Has he grown?

01:02:42Did he put the work into the off season with Drake May?

01:02:44Those are gonna be more important

01:02:46than the guy having a bad rookie year.

01:02:47It's not insignificant,

01:02:48but it's like we're having the same conversation.

01:02:50And it gets to the point where I'm just like,

01:02:51yeah, bench him.

01:02:52I think that's what you probably should do.

01:02:53Stop putting him in these positions

01:02:55to make all these mistakes

01:02:56because I don't think the run blocking is good enough.

01:02:58And he's not really getting the ball either.

01:02:59So I don't see what he's contributing

01:03:00that you're not getting from K.J. Osborne.

01:03:02I'm with you on the mindset of there is a way to do this

01:03:06where, okay, put him on the field,

01:03:08let him work out the kinks.

01:03:09And instead of just benching him,

01:03:11go out there and figure it out.

01:03:13It's come to a point where he does have to go to the bench.

01:03:15I think you're right, John.

01:03:16You said earlier, Taylor, you just bended it too.

01:03:18He needs to be sat down.

01:03:20And I don't wanna say punished,

01:03:21but it's like a, we can't trust you.

01:03:23We can't put you out there

01:03:24and think that we're gonna have the best chance to win.

01:03:26Right now, K.J. Osborne gives them a better chance to win

01:03:28at that position right now for the Patriots.

01:03:31And so sit him down.

01:03:31It's not a end all, be all of JLo Polk, right?

01:03:35He's not a bust yet.

01:03:36You mentioned it.

01:03:37He's young.

01:03:38He can work through this.

01:03:39I forgot if it was on post game last week

01:03:40or if it was on Pat's daily at some point

01:03:42within the last few weeks,

01:03:43but like Nico Collins has turned into

01:03:46one of the best wide receivers in football.

01:03:48And I'm not saying JLo Polk could do that.

01:03:50He may, we don't know,

01:03:52but I'm not trying to say that that's his ceiling.

01:03:53What I'm saying is Nico Collins,

01:03:55for the first couple of years in Houston,

01:03:56was not a good receiver.

01:03:58He was a no-show.

01:03:59He did nothing on the football field.

01:04:01Nobody really even talked about him

01:04:02until he was able to get on the same page

01:04:04with CJ Stroud last year.

01:04:06And now he's the most productive wide receiver in football,

01:04:09or at least he was until he had the hamstring injury.

01:04:12Give this guy a chance at least,

01:04:13and I'm not saying give him a chance next week,

01:04:15but things can happen over the summer.

01:04:17He may be able to change it.

01:04:18His rookie year, not good enough, point blank.

01:04:21Right now it looks like they've whiffed on the pick.

01:04:23It's not over yet.

01:04:24It's not like this is Taekwon Thornton

01:04:25where they're gonna have to go release him next week.

01:04:27Taekwon Thornton was a bust.

01:04:28That project was over.

01:04:30Jalen Polk's project basically has just begun.

01:04:32I understand, but let me ask you this.

01:04:35Let's change Jalen Polk's name

01:04:37from second round draft pick Jalen Polk

01:04:40to undrafted free agent Jalen Polk.

01:04:42If that's who he was, is he employed today?

01:04:46He wouldn't be on the field.

01:04:48No, he wouldn't be in the field.

01:04:49He's not on the field like he is.

01:04:50Right now the only thing saving his ass

01:04:52is a second round draft pedigree.

01:04:54Yeah, the value of it is correct.

01:04:56Yeah, but why was he a second round pick?

01:04:58There was Taekwon there.

01:04:59Because of what he did, yeah.

01:04:59Why was Thornton a second round pick?

01:05:03Why was Chad Jackson a second round pick?

01:05:06Well, that's not the same thing.

01:05:06Taekwon Thornton was unanimously hated

01:05:09as a second round pick.

01:05:10Most people had him as, I think it was 150

01:05:12or like 180 or something like that.

01:05:14I'm not gonna lie, I was excited about the pick,

01:05:16but that was also, in my defense,

01:05:17that was the year before I started

01:05:19actually watching College Prospects.

01:05:20I just looked at the plays that he made

01:05:22and I was like, ooh, this is exciting.

01:05:23This guy's got some talent.

01:05:24But Jalen Polk is someone who,

01:05:26there was some debate over exactly where he was picked,

01:05:28but it's not like people thought he was a day three guy.

01:05:30It was like, no, he's a day two pick.

01:05:32It depends on how much you like him.

01:05:33And then he comes to a team with a guy who coached him.

01:05:35Everybody loved his mentality coming out of college.

01:05:38I understand he's struggling and it makes sense

01:05:40to question, all right, what even went into the pick.

01:05:43But there's some revisionist history, too,

01:05:44because no one was saying it was a bad pick.

01:05:46They were like, ah, they probably could've picked him later.

01:05:49Maybe you could debate, they could've gone for

01:05:51Karen Emegagi or Kingsley Suomata'i.

01:05:54Those guys, for sure.

01:05:55Kingsley Suomata'i, by the way,

01:05:56who got benched by the Chiefs as well.

01:05:58That's not insignificant.

01:05:59So I just think it's important to say,

01:06:01Jalen Polk was never gonna be a UDFA

01:06:03because he showed more talent than that in college.

01:06:06We just gotta get this kid to stop thinking

01:06:07and play to his strengths.

01:06:09That's when I think all of that's gonna come to forth.

01:06:11It felt a little reactionary,

01:06:13maybe not be the right word,

01:06:14but they wanted to get in the back end of the first round

01:06:16when they did it, they couldn't.

01:06:17And then they needed to make it happen with this guy.

01:06:20And so they took Jalen Polk because they missed out

01:06:22on those guys at the end of the first round.

01:06:23And now, from what he's done when he got here to now

01:06:26and he was a UDFA, he probably wouldn't be employed.

01:06:29What he's done, it's been a nothing burger.

01:06:32But the fact that he was a second round pick,

01:06:35he has value for you in this franchise.

01:06:38And what he did in college,

01:06:38he has the connection with Hughes.

01:06:40Like you said, he is a leader.

01:06:41He does at least deserve a chance

01:06:43with what his track record was

01:06:44before he got to the Patriots.

01:06:45If Taekwon Thornton can make it for three years

01:06:47as a second round pick, I think we can ease up on Jalen Polk.

01:06:49Look, we've done it with Nikhil Harry as well.

01:06:52I mean, this is not new ground here.

01:06:54It's just, it's frustrating.

01:06:55No, we're well-versed in this stuff around here.

01:06:58We know the story.

01:07:00We know the story.

01:07:01It was Leggett and Coleman as the targets

01:07:03at the bottom of the first or early second,

01:07:04missed them both, traded out.

01:07:06And that pick ended up being Ladd McCoggey,

01:07:08who looks like he's been outstanding as well too.

01:07:10So again, it's frustrating.

01:07:11Can't have two slot receivers on the field.

01:07:12He could not play with the Mario Douglas.

01:07:14I'm just going to say that.

01:07:15Wait, I do not like the, oh, they should have taken Ladd.

01:07:18No team wants two slot receivers.

01:07:20At least Jalen Polk and Goss signed him.

01:07:21So take the better one.

01:07:23It's like where would, it's like the old Lou Gorman.

01:07:26I'm going to date myself here, but that's fine.

01:07:28Where would we play Willie McGee for the boomers out there?

01:07:32Like good players are good players.

01:07:33Draft good players.

01:07:35It was, it was exactly that.

01:07:37It was a Red Sox GM back in the day

01:07:40who had a journeyman center fielder playing there.

01:07:43And there was a possibility

01:07:45of them signing a perennial all-star.

01:07:46And he was like, where would I even play the guy?

01:07:48It's like center field over your journeyman center.

01:07:51Anyway, it doesn't matter.

01:07:53Lastly, like I said, we're going to let Taylor go.

01:07:56But we did want to end on the positive note, which is again,

01:08:00which is again to Drake May.

01:08:01Yeah, Mike says how good Drake May was.

01:08:03And again, just listening to everybody talking about him.

01:08:05I thought it was worthwhile.

01:08:06We did have this sound I wanted to play

01:08:07for everybody before we wrapped up.

01:08:08Great.

01:08:10It's awesome playing with Drake.

01:08:12He just, he knows what he's doing.

01:08:14He knows what he's seeing.

01:08:15Obviously, you know, he wants that playback.

01:08:18He wants to be better,

01:08:19but I think it's just a process for everybody.

01:08:22Everybody has the same approach.

01:08:23You want to be better.

01:08:24I want to be better.

01:08:25So what I went through, what I go through,

01:08:26I want to play better every week.

01:08:28You know, you try to put the perfect game together

01:08:30but you never can, you just, you strive for it.

01:08:32So I think that's, what's awesome about him.

01:08:34He's striving for perfection.

01:08:35And, you know, he's just, he's growing at a rapid rate.

01:08:41You know, I'm, I'm, I'm behind Drake.

01:08:43Everybody's behind Drake, you know.

01:08:46Mistakes are going to be made,

01:08:47but he, he still made a lot of plays today.

01:08:49He, the offense, you know, they came out and they,

01:08:51you know, they really did what they had to do.

01:08:54You know, they were, they were making plays, scoring points.

01:08:58So, I mean, it's, it's good rattling behind Drake.

01:09:01He, he's a leader

01:09:04and it'll be fun to continue to play with him.

01:09:06Obviously he has a lot of talent and,

01:09:09I mean, we, we see that day in, day out.

01:09:11But I think just the growth in the offense,

01:09:13growth in seeing things, growth in,

01:09:16I mean, just even simple things of just how he,

01:09:19how he, you know, do the run game.

01:09:21You know, there's, there's so many little things

01:09:23in offense that go a long way.

01:09:24And I think each week he's continuing to grow

01:09:27and it's fun to kind of continue that growth with him.

01:09:31So there it is.

01:09:32They like him.

01:09:33Taylor's cold.

01:09:34We're going to let you go, but Drake may again,

01:09:37should be more of the story

01:09:38because it's the most important thing.

01:09:40But it is again, once again,

01:09:41a frustrating loss for the Patriots

01:09:43who had a winnable game.

01:09:44And it's amazing if you stack them all together right now,

01:09:47this team's three and eight,

01:09:48they could be six and five,

01:09:50probably not doing that much different,

01:09:54which forget moral victories.

01:09:57If normally I don't care about them,

01:09:59but it shows you they are.

01:10:02I did catch a little bit.

01:10:03You guys mentioned Tom Curran earlier.

01:10:05He had a really good line on the NBC post game.

01:10:07He said, don't look now,

01:10:09but this team is kind of working its way towards mediocrity.

01:10:13And it sounds like an insult, but it's not.

01:10:16What he's saying is they're actually not a bot.

01:10:19They're not as they're, they're closer to us.

01:10:22Like we thought they were.

01:10:22Yes.

01:10:23They're closer to a middle of the pack team at present

01:10:26given may and some of the things that are going well,

01:10:29then they are to a laughing stock disgrace of the league.

01:10:32Even a team like Jacksonville who beat them at present.

01:10:35So they are trending towards mediocre

01:10:38with very little around them.

01:10:39And a lot of that has to do with Drake May, which is great.

01:10:42Once again, Mike Catholic, Taylor cows,

01:10:44braving the seasonably warm,

01:10:46New England temperatures out there.

01:10:49Just you're just,

01:10:49I was in LA for two years.

01:10:52My guy, like I'm not used to this yet.

01:10:55East coast kid, your blood didn't change.

01:10:58You have no, you have no idea what LA does to a person.

01:11:01It made me soft.

01:11:02I'm very aware.

01:11:04Like I couldn't go out on this field

01:11:05and play football for Gerard Mayo.

01:11:06He'd be like, sorry, guy, you're soft as puppy shit.

01:11:08Football weather, baby.

01:11:10You're not the first person.

01:11:11I'm not kidding.

01:11:12Who's to said exactly that, but it is what it is.

01:11:14So once again, I don't know.

01:11:16No, a lot of people are like, it changes you fast.

01:11:18Quick shout out.

01:11:19Once again, to our sponsors, prize picks,

01:11:20get in on the action.

01:11:21New users.

01:11:22Sign up today on prize pick.

01:11:23Oh, Drake May.

01:11:24That's right.

01:11:25He hit it?

01:11:26We have, yep.

01:11:27I have a, I hit mine today.

01:11:28It was Drake May's overpass or more passing yards.

01:11:31Oh no, yours is Kyron Williams.

01:11:32No, the other one I do not have a Pats Daly one.

01:11:35We did not hit Pats Daly

01:11:36because I did have Kyron Williams as a touchdown.

01:11:38Unfortunately, Drake May passing yards hit.

01:11:40I had DeMarcus Robinson's under less than my God.

01:11:43That hit as well.

01:11:45Go to prize picks.

01:11:46See you at Coach CLNS.

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01:11:48New users, five Coach CLNS, $5, get 50.

01:11:51I'm so glad I did this.

01:11:52Last shout out and then download the game time app.

01:11:55Make sure you get in on game time.

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01:12:00Do apply.

01:12:01Thank you guys again for watching as the Patriots go down

01:12:05to the Rams to fall to three and eight on the season.

01:12:08Are we bi-week?

01:12:10Nope.

01:12:11No, not for like three more weeks.

01:12:12They're heading to-

01:12:13It's way, it's ways away.

01:12:14That's right, it's Miami.

01:12:15Miami next week and then Indy's gonna be here.

01:12:17Miami.

01:12:18Taylor and Ahmed will be in Miami.

01:12:20Ahmed's face lit up when we just heard

01:12:22he's going to Miami next weekend.

01:12:24But we do have a great coverage throughout the week.

01:12:26So check out those guys tomorrow,

01:12:28Patriots Daily and all that good stuff.

01:12:30We will see you later.

01:12:31Thank you for joining the Patriots Postgame Show

01:12:33on CLNS Media.

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01:12:47Thanks a lot for joining us.

01:12:49We'll see you later.

01:12:50See you guys.

01:12:51Bye.

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