98.5 The Sports Hub's Alex Barth and Pats Pulpit's Brian Hines break down Super Bowl LIX from a Patriots perspective.
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SportsTranscript
00:00All right, everyone, welcome back into another live edition of the Patriots Beat Podcast
00:28here on the CLNS Media Network, presented by our wonderful friend over at Price Picks.
00:33It's Brian Hines, back as always with Alex Barth.
00:36And Barth, welcome to the, I guess, official start of the NFL offseason, even though we've
00:41been talking about it since, what, Thanksgiving, Halloween, two weeks after Drake May took
00:47over.
00:48We've been talking about the offseason for a while, but it is officially here.
00:51Super Bowl is in the rearview mirror.
00:54The page turns to 2025 officially, but we are going to talk about the Super Bowl a little
01:00bit and, you know, maybe what it means from a Patriots perspective, maybe some players
01:06that were in the game that who could be on the Patriots radar.
01:09And I think tampering is a month from today, I believe.
01:12Right.
01:13So we'll be.
01:14Sounds right.
01:15Yeah.
01:16Getting into the tampering window and free agency soon and finally some player acquisition.
01:19But I guess just first we will start with the actual game because there were some Patriots
01:24storylines in the game as well, and it just was Super Bowl and it was an ass kicking by
01:28the Philadelphia Eagles.
01:30So what were your kind of big takeaways just from from watching that game yesterday?
01:36Belt to ass.
01:39That was awesome.
01:40That was that.
01:41That was great.
01:43And it not just the fact that it was a blowout and it was a blowout.
01:46That was no 18 point game.
01:50The way in which it happened, Patrick Mahomes, it felt a lot like that Super Bowl against
01:53Tampa, Patrick Mahomes having a run for his life, taking the hits that he took, no flags,
02:01the Eagles being able to kind of methodically move the football.
02:04That was a good old school smash mouth kind of win.
02:08And it started up front for Philly.
02:10And I kept going back to Brian.
02:11Do you remember when the Eagles came here for that joint practice back in all I remember
02:18and how dumb I remember the way we were talking about it and the way we were writing about
02:23it.
02:24There were a lot of people who were like, it wasn't that bad.
02:26You're exaggerating.
02:27You just want to knock the team, blah, blah, blah.
02:30That's what we saw.
02:32And that's not to excuse the Patriots offensive line.
02:36The Patriots offensive line was not good, but like that front.
02:42We said it that like this is this is as good as you're going to get.
02:45This is a group that has a chance to take over a game.
02:48They did that in the Super Bowl and credit to them for winning a game that way.
02:55I remember that practice.
02:57I mean, first of all, the Eagles offensive line walks out and you're like, Oh my gosh,
03:01these guys are gigantic.
03:02And they showed that the graphic on the screen, like the average size, like six, six, 350,
03:0860 pounds, which is the biggest offensive line in the league.
03:11You're like, these guys are monsters.
03:13And then I think it was towards the end of that practice.
03:17Remember they were doing the hurry up the two minute, the one minute drill and the Patriots
03:20literally couldn't move the Paul like it's like the place kept getting blown dead.
03:26And then poor Drake gets in there, we're all excited, but he's with, and it was even backups
03:29on backups.
03:30And you saw some of their backups even make plays last night just because they're so deep
03:34with that front four.
03:35And he was literally, Drake would drop back and there would be a guy in his face and they'd
03:39have to blow the play dead.
03:42You literally saw that just come to life in a Superbowl and it was, it was pretty remarkable.
03:46Definitely early on, had some fields to that box game that, that you mentioned where, you
03:52know, Todd Bowles just kind of sent four and made Patrick Mahomes run around and then baited
03:57them into some bad decisions.
03:58I think he was, my homes was probably worse in that game.
04:01He gifted them kind of 14 points, obviously the, the pick six to my guy, Cooper Dejean.
04:06And then Zach Bond got another one down there by, by the goal line.
04:09So definitely the front four took over that game.
04:12They capitalized on my homes is mistaken the back end and then Jalen hurts to give him
04:17some flowers.
04:18Cause if you went into that game and said Saquon Barkley would run for, what was it
04:23like 25 carries for 56, 57 yards, he was under two and a half yards per carry.
04:29You would have been like, that is not good news for the Eagles and Jalen hurts had a
04:32hell of a game.
04:33He did have that one interception, but he played really, really good as well.
04:38Two straight Superbowls against Patrick Mahomes.
04:40He probably outdo them.
04:41So you do tip your cap to Jalen hurts for that one.
04:44But yeah, I think the story definitely was the defense and the front for getting home
04:48with four and it just, they just completely took over that game.
04:52Yeah,
04:53they, they really did.
04:54I hurts was good.
04:55Like you said, I, I think sweat should have been the MVP, but I don't necessarily have
04:59a big problem with them giving it to Hertz credit to him and, and look, the chiefs defense
05:05game plan was clear.
05:08It was, we are not going to let Saquon Barkley beat us.
05:10We are not going to let you beat us that way.
05:13Barkley didn't have a massive game statistically beat a massive impact because once the Eagles
05:17kind of got the idea of, all right, Barkley's not an option.
05:22They started doing other things and it worked and it's, it's in stark contrast to what the
05:26chiefs did.
05:27They, they couldn't get a block.
05:29They couldn't get a block with four guys, which like that's going to happen.
05:33If Andy Reed is this offensive coach, like he's talked about, shouldn't even had an adjustment
05:37for that.
05:38So I was a little surprised and I don't know, I know their left tackle situation was a mess
05:43all year.
05:44And I don't know who they actually had like active, but don't you think at some point
05:48maybe like kick Joe Tooney back in the left guard and just try with a tackle back out
05:52there at left tackle.
05:53Like that was the adjustment I was waiting for because that poor left guard that was
05:59in there was getting destroyed and Joe Tooney was getting destroyed at left tackle, but
06:03like he's a guard.
06:04So I thought I would have tried kick Joe Tooney back in and at least try to secure your interior
06:10and then send help to your left tackle chip, put your running back over there, do whatever.
06:16But Andy Reed just didn't do that at all, which kind of surprised me.
06:20Yeah, that's a, I was really surprised that chiefs didn't have anything more innovative
06:26offensively.
06:27And then what happened with the Eagles is once they were able to start moving the ball
06:30without Barkley, they had these long sustained drives.
06:32And at one point in that game, the Eagles had run 52 offensive plays to the chiefs 25.
06:39And there was, there was not going to be a comeback at that point.
06:43Like I know everybody had the 28 three kind of pop in their heads.
06:47The reason 28 three was able to happen was that even though the Patriots were getting
06:52blown out, they were dominating the time of possession.
06:56They were, I think, out snapping the Falcons at one point in that game, I think it was
06:59like 60, something to 40, something 60, something to 30, something like that.
07:03So by the time you got later in that game, even though the Patriots were down, that Falcons
07:10defense was gassed and the Patriots were able to slowly chip away.
07:15The Eagles basically did that with a 17 point lead.
07:19It's not like the, the, the cheese were forcing the Eagles defense to do it.
07:23They weren't.
07:2438 yards at halftime, they had 38 yards at some point, I remember they kept putting that
07:28graphic up.
07:29That might've been, I know like the two minute drill at the end, it wasn't much.
07:32They had their first play from scrimmage was an 11 yarder to Juju.
07:35And that was like their first, their only first down until that, that last drive.
07:39I think they got like two more first downs at one chunk play.
07:42So yeah, it wasn't more than 40 yards.
07:45Their ability to find ways to sustain offense without their best offensive player was, I,
07:50it was, I feel really good today if I'm a saints fan, I'll tell you that.
07:53I feel really good today if I'm a saints fan about Kellen Moore, because did you, someone
07:58said he might hire Brandon Staley as his defensive coordinator, maybe not feel great now yet.
08:03Now I'm petrified.
08:04But prior to learning that information, I mean, to be able to not just have a big offensive
08:10game, but when you think about sustained offense in any setting, it usually starts with the
08:14running back to be able to sustain offense the way they did without Saquon Barkley being
08:19a massive part of it.
08:21That's that's great.
08:22That's a tremendous job by Philadelphia.
08:24Yeah.
08:25I thought Kellen Moore did a really good job with, with Jalen Hurts cause like Jalen Hurts
08:30played really well.
08:31I don't think he's a top five quarterback in the, in the league.
08:34Like he's not Patrick Mahomes especially, but you know, you see what he's able to do
08:38and Kellen Moore really got the best out of him.
08:42You said Josh Sweat would have been your MVP pick there.
08:46I think so.
08:47Yeah.
08:48I like kind of representing the entire defensive front.
08:51A lot of people were comparing it to the Seahawks, Broncos, Superbowl, where they gave it to
08:58who was the linebacker that got it?
08:59Oh yeah.
09:00Malcolm Smith.
09:01Was that it?
09:02Malcolm Smith.
09:03Yeah.
09:04Like give it to someone on the defense.
09:05Like I would have been fine with Dejean just cause the, the pick six really just felt like,
09:09okay, this is it.
09:10And that was like the real kind of dagger it seemed like, even though it was early in
09:15the game.
09:16So Dejean or Josh Sweat there would have been good choices, but Hurts did play really well.
09:20You look at what the defense did to that.
09:23And I know that they only scored more than 30 once this year, which by the way, do you
09:27know the only game they scored more than 30?
09:28I was against the Buffalo Bills in the AFC championship.
09:31What a time for that to happen.
09:33But it is still Patrick Holmes and to have that kind of effort in that, although Patrick
09:38Holmes might be a Superbowl choker.
09:41I mean, are we ready to talk about that?
09:43Played in five games, score differential of minus 28.
09:47His inner or his, his touchdown of turnovers is like eight to seven too, right?
09:52He's got more interceptions than Brady has eight to seven with those two absolute garbage
09:57ass time, whatever Superbowl, uh, oh yeah, well, no, he had those two touchdowns late
10:06that were completely irrelevant.
10:07Oh yeah.
10:08That'd be good.
10:09The garbage is like Superbowl game log here.
10:11Yeah.
10:12It was two in the last three minutes.
10:14Yeah.
10:15Yeah.
10:16So yeah, he wouldn't have a negative touchdown to interception ratio without that, but yeah,
10:22they don't have yesterday in here yet.
10:24I mean the, the first one against Philly, he threw for three touchdowns and no picks,
10:31but he only had 182 yards.
10:34He's thrown multiple interceptions now in three of five, his best games, probably the
10:42Superbowl, the second nine or Superbowl last year when he went 34, 46 for three 33 with
10:48two touchdowns and a pick besides that, I mean, yeah, he hasn't been great.
10:56It's not very impressive.
10:58And I think they said in their three wins too, they start very slow.
11:02Like they were down 10, nothing and all their three wins, which, yeah.
11:05You know, which Nick, right.
11:06Like, you know, before he stopped tweeting for the night, I was, that was his last tweet,
11:11right?
11:12Yeah.
11:13Nick.
11:14Right.
11:15Yeah.
11:16He was like, all right.
11:17Now there are down 10.
11:18Oh, the game, the game officially starts, which, you know, Tom Brady wasn't prone to
11:19his deficits in the, in the Superbowl every now and then he came back.
11:23He came back.
11:24Not like us.
11:25Yeah.
11:26True.
11:27So what do you think is that debate?
11:28I don't want to say it's over because I mean their first five Superbowls, they're both
11:32three and two here.
11:33So in Patrick homes has a long way to go, but where are you kind of, I know a lot of
11:37people were ready to crown Patrick homes to go in the three P is something obviously
11:43so hard to do.
11:44And that Brady never did, but we needed to settle down going into this.
11:48And I think now I think a lot of people are settling down and kind of taking that step
11:52back.
11:53Yeah.
11:54I'm not going to say it's over because there's more football to be played, but I think it's
11:57a great reminder of what people around here were saying for a long time, which was you're
12:01asinine for having this conversation.
12:04We're talking about a guy who, who won seven rings over the span of 20 years, 20 plus years,
12:1025 years, close to 25 years.
12:13And we're, we're okay comparing that to a guy who has less than half the rings in less
12:20than half the time.
12:22How do those two line up?
12:25And this is what I I've been saying for a long time.
12:28The longevity element of it is so crucial to the debate and you can't start that yet.
12:35You're not remotely close to starting that because you are going to have more games like
12:38this.
12:39And guess what?
12:40He's going to lose Travis Kelsey for all intents and purposes.
12:41He didn't have Travis Kelsey last night, but he's going to lose Travis Kelsey.
12:45He's going to lose Andy Reed.
12:46He's going to lose this defense.
12:48Like he's going to have to reinvent himself.
12:50Tom Brady did that four times.
12:53Tom Brady reinvented himself essentially four times in his NFL career.
12:57He did it, or there were four iterations.
13:00There's like, Oh one to Oh six Brady.
13:03Then there's long hair, no Superbowl Brady.
13:05Then there's locked in freak Brady.
13:08And then there, he, I mean, he went to a new franchise, so he had to kind of learn it all
13:11again in Tampa.
13:13There's essentially four iterations.
13:15You want to say this is the second iteration of my homes.
13:18You want to draw a line at like losing Tyree kill.
13:20I'm okay with that.
13:21Yeah, that's probably fair because they kind of reinvented their offense after they lost
13:26it.
13:27And look, Brady obviously did most of it with Belichick, but it was, you know, he went
13:33through different offense coordinators, even under McDaniel's like, well, no, he won three
13:38with Charlie Weiss.
13:39He won three with Josh McDaniels and even under, under Josh McDaniels, the 2014 offense
13:43and the 2018 offense are so different.
13:47Everything my homes has done.
13:49They lost Tyree kill, but the general offense is the same idea.
13:54Losing Kelsey is going to be a big one.
13:56And then ultimately losing Reed.
13:58So there's a whole lot my home still has to prove and people just wanted to rush and knock
14:05Tom Brady down because it's Tom Brady, right?
14:08And because it's the Patriots and he was just the right guy at the right time, but there
14:13was no way that conversation ever should have been started.
14:17Are we going to get there eventually?
14:19Maybe I doubt it, but it's the NFL.
14:23Anything can happen.
14:24And when it's time to have that conversation and all good faith, I'll have it.
14:29We were not, we are not there.
14:30We were not remotely close.
14:31We have not been remotely close.
14:33We were not close before that game last night, but we are further away now.
14:39So that that's what that game meant to me.
14:42I don't know that the debate's over.
14:44I would phrase it more as a reminder that the debate should have never started when
14:48it did.
14:49Yeah.
14:50I mean, it took Brady, what, five for people to finally kind of say, okay, maybe this guy
14:55is better than Joe Montana and L my homes had less than half and people were going there.
15:01So the debate was stupid, but definitely not over because I was talking about this.
15:06Sorry.
15:07Yeah.
15:08I was talking about this with somebody last night.
15:10We're like for Brady, you're right.
15:13There were a lot of people after they lost the AFC championship to the Ravens in 13 that
15:20were saying, well, you know, at home had the better team, like the greatest quarterback
15:25of all time.
15:26Doesn't lose that game.
15:27There were people writing them off that even when he beat Seattle in played the greatest
15:32quarter, a quarterback has ever played in the history of the league.
15:36And he had now won 10 years apart and he had his fourth defense in the league too, right?
15:41Like three years straight.
15:43That is when I started feeling comfortable calling him undisputed, the greatest of all
15:47time.
15:49It didn't become the consensus, Brian, not only did he have to get his fifth, but remember
15:53what he had to do to get it.
15:55He had to come back from down 28, three in order to do that.
16:00So if we weren't ready to call Brady the greatest until he, in Montana is four, right?
16:06So that was the other thing when Brady won four, then people said, well, Joe Montana
16:12was undefeated and super right.
16:15No, Brady was four and three, four, two, four, and two at that point.
16:21Right.
16:22And, and he had to win the fifth and he had to do it in such convincing fashion and get
16:25another MVP in there as well for people to really say he was the greatest.
16:30So my homes gets to do it with less rings and more losses.
16:34And without the, the longevity card, like it's nonsense, but that will, you know, going
16:40back a little bit, like how the chiefs move forward now will be one of the most fascinating
16:45things because Kelsey, I thought he was going to retire last year.
16:49He came back, seemed like the three P had a lot to do with that.
16:52So if he's done now, there's my home's his best weapon.
16:56And then, you know, Brady did have the benefit of working with Belichick the whole time.
17:00My home's isn't going to have that with Andy Reed.
17:02And even if you go beyond those two, their offensive line, they're going to need a new
17:06left tackle.
17:07They're going to need a new right tackle.
17:08Sounds familiar.
17:09They might need a new right guard.
17:10If Trey Smith's leaving, they're going to need, they'll get Rashid rice back, but if
17:14they lose, they'll probably need a pass catcher.
17:17Even if Travis Kelsey comes back, they'll need another pass catcher.
17:20And then you go on the defense.
17:22Like Nick Bolton might leave.
17:24Who's been one of their best defensive players throughout these playoffs.
17:27Chris Jones is getting older.
17:29It's really just Trent McDuffie and in the secondary, right?
17:32Like, uh, they lost legerius Sneed last year.
17:35They struggled to replace him.
17:37Uh, they have a read at safety who's, you know, getting a little older.
17:40He might not be back.
17:41So they have a lot to do on that roster.
17:45Not much cap space that can be finagled in or, and worked around, but they got a lot
17:50even just beyond Andy Reed, who is going to come back, but beyond Andy Reed and Travis
17:55Kelsey, who will, who will see with Kelsey to really kind of shake this thing up.
18:00And we said, there's multiple iterations of Brady.
18:03Like that was what made him so great.
18:04The longevity doing it different ways with different teams.
18:07Like that's the next big thing for the chiefs is how are they going to kind of build this
18:10thing back up and, and, you know, try to keep extending this window with Patrick Mahomes
18:15here.
18:16I'll say this.
18:17Somebody brings up, uh, Montana and my homes being the argument, like I, so I said last
18:23year, my homes had passed Manning.
18:28And I, I still believe that even after last night, my homes has passed Manning.
18:33This is the conversation here, my homes, Montana, who has the edge there.
18:40You could sway me either way on that one.
18:42I probably go Montana at this point, but I, you know, going to what they went to five
18:49or six, right?
18:50Um, five or six, three wins in five.
18:55You look at some of the individual records he's put up.
18:58I think that's pretty close.
19:00I think that's your clear top three.
19:02I don't think Manning's in the top three anymore.
19:04I'll give him a homes that, but I think he's in, you know, when we, when we're talking
19:09about, we do this all the time with these goat conversations, right?
19:12Well, if there's one debate, that's Brady versus my homes.
19:16And there's another debate that's Brady versus Montana.
19:18And there's another debate that's Brady versus Manning.
19:21And there's another debate that's Brady versus Rogers.
19:23Maybe it's just the guy who's in all the debates.
19:25Nobody's debating.
19:26Well, as my homes or Manning or Montana, the greatest quarterback of all time, like if
19:32one guy is in all those conversations, that's the guy.
19:37So it's, it's still clear to me at this point, I don't think we're close to having that conversation
19:43yet.
19:44Like you said, I think it's going to get worse for the cheese before it gets better.
19:47Yup.
19:48That'll definitely be interesting, but, um, let's take a quick break.
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21:12All right.
21:13Um, with that game, chiefs Eagles, a lot of free agents.
21:18We just talked about some on the chiefs, a lot of free agents too, on the Eagles, especially
21:24in those trenches, which is something we all want the Patriots to kind of build up.
21:28You saw how they can dominate for the Eagles, uh, in that super bowl.
21:32So on both sides, anyone that's really at the top of maybe your free agency wish list
21:39for the Patriots that did play in that super bowl last night, uh, does Adrian Brown count
21:44as a trade target?
21:45Um, I think that's off the table now, unfortunately.
21:49Yeah.
21:50So I'll go, uh, I'll go with Josh sweat.
21:54I think to get a guy that can come off the edge like that can wreak havoc.
21:59Yes.
22:00He's a little undersized, but you look at what Mike Vrabel was able to do with Harold
22:03Landry in Tennessee.
22:05He he's smaller, but I wouldn't say his size is a, is a hindrance in his game.
22:11It's just the way he plays, especially if you put them with a guy like a key on white
22:15on his size, on his side.
22:17Um, I would say Josh sweat would be at the top of that wishlist for me.
22:21Then Milton Williams, Zach bond would be third.
22:24I just think the Eagles had such a great role for him in the context of that defense.
22:29That's going to be tougher to replicate new England compared to what, what Williams and
22:33sweat we're doing.
22:34So I Josh, uh, Josh, what's the guy, Josh sweat is the guy to me that, that they should
22:39be looking at.
22:41Yeah.
22:42And, and they obviously need a pass rush.
22:43I was pulling up a PFFs free agent list.
22:45He is the, he's the number two pass rusher, I think.
22:49Yeah.
22:50Behind Cleo Mack.
22:51Yeah.
22:52And Cleo Mack is not a fit for the Patriots.
22:54Yeah.
22:55On the older side.
22:56Sweat is still sweat kind of similar to Jude on cause he he's he'll be 28 by next season,
23:01which is right around when Jude on signed, uh, back in 2021 with the Patriots been a
23:05productive pass rusher.
23:07Like this wasn't a one year thing for him or one game thing in the Superbowl, maybe
23:11earned himself a little bit more money in that Superbowl, but he's been one of the more
23:15productive pass rushers in the league, really the past few years.
23:18So you need a pass rusher.
23:20It would be great to get him.
23:21I'm, I am a big fan of Zach bond.
23:24He was badger.
23:25So that might have something to do with it, but like he seems like he would be a perfect
23:28fit kind of next to Juwan Bentley.
23:30You saw the coverage skills and he's a little smaller and athletic, but he's still a really
23:35good, uh, against the run too.
23:37So I would be all for those two guys just take the spine of this Philly defense and
23:42brain over here.
23:43Milton Williams too, if you want to add him, uh, into the mix, any of those Eagles defenders
23:48really seems like they would kind of be home run picks, but I'll say this on the other
23:52side too.
23:53I know we had a bad penalty last night, but Nick Bolton would be another fit.
23:58He's impressive.
23:59Uh, are you a Trey Smith guy where you're at, where you're at with Trey Smith?
24:03I mean, look, he's a good player.
24:06I wouldn't say no, but he can't be your big splash for agency signing.
24:12He just can't like you have too many other needs of premium positions that if they're
24:16only going to allocate X amount of dollars need an edge rusher, you need a corner, need
24:22a safety, need a wide receiver.
24:26I just think it becomes a little tougher to justify now you can get those guys and Trey
24:31Smith.
24:32They have the money to do it.
24:34But I wouldn't throw a ton of assets at him while leaving other positions unaddressed.
24:41Yeah.
24:42Especially with all the guards they have still to like, ideally one of those guys, uh, you
24:49feel confident about you, you can go into the next season with whether it's Cole stranger
24:53or Laden Robinson, this new coaching staff feels good about, but, uh, you don't want
24:58to say no to a talent like Trey Smith cause he is one of the best guards in the league.
25:01So, um, and they have the money to pay him, even though his market will probably get pretty
25:06insane as the top offensive lineman available, but, um, who else would, who else was available
25:13in that game?
25:14Uh, receivers.
25:15It was really like Deandre Hopkins, uh, Hollywood Brown from the chief side.
25:20I mean, Brown, like if you want a speedy kind of deep field stretcher, like that could be
25:25a potential good fit with Drake may Hopkins, the connection with Rabel.
25:31So if we're talking veteran wide receivers, we talked a little bit about Cooper cup, Deebo
25:35Samuels now in, in that same mix, he'll be looking for a trade, any interest in either
25:41that trade market.
25:42I know, again, we talked about cup a little bit, or, you know, maybe the hunt Deandre
25:46Hopkins, like one of those veteran routes and free agency, they, they need a guy who's
25:51going to be definitively at the top of the depth chart.
25:53They need a guy who's going to dictate coverage and cops not going to do that is this point
25:56in his career.
25:57Debo Samuel has been hurt a lot in Josh McDaniels has struggled with scheme touch players.
26:02Hopkins is he still that guy?
26:03I don't think so.
26:04I'll throw Devante Adams in there too.
26:06Like they need a guy that we're not going to sit here and hem and haw over whether or
26:11not he's the answer.
26:12Even if we think he might be right, we need a guy that comes in and we go, yup.
26:16Top of the depth chart right away.
26:17Like they need a clear answer.
26:20I don't know that any of those guys are clear answers.
26:22It's kind of like we were talking about before with the goat, with the goat debate.
26:25If we have to ask whether or not he's going to be that guy, he's not the guy, right?
26:31It's got to be a guy that comes in and we know is the guy.
26:34What if that guy is not available?
26:36Like what if you make them available, you have a ton of, you have a ton of draft assets.
26:42You you'd let it be known.
26:44And I know like tampering, blah, blah, blah, but we know these teams have a way to get
26:47information out.
26:48You let it be known.
26:49There's a fat contract waiting in new England.
26:51You have the draft capital.
26:53You make somebody available.
26:56Zach said, Oh, Zach said DK.
26:58I think that's where you're probably going.
27:00Yup.
27:01Let it be.
27:02I don't know who else is that?
27:05Who else is in that pre?
27:06I know we've talked about it a lot, but that pre-agent it's really DK.
27:10Crystal law Bay, who Drake man was playing ping pong with.
27:15That could be, I don't know if they want to trade down to nine, but I do wonder if there's
27:18maybe a package and the concussion history is kind of scary with crystal lava.
27:23But I wonder if there is a package, you know, kind of like the bears did where they got
27:26DJ more, like you moved down to nine and you get crystal lava if the saints are interested
27:31in doing that.
27:32Yeah.
27:33Um, well, Terry McLaurin, that's a tough one.
27:35Yeah.
27:36He's, I would be surprised if he leaves Drake.
27:40London's a pre-agent.
27:41Already.
27:42Jeez.
27:43Oh, that's no, that's, that's, they're going to pick up a 50 year option.
27:47That's without the 50 year option.
27:49Um, Garrett Wilson, it'd be tough to swing a trade with the jets, but Garrett Wilson,
27:55uh, Jamison Williams is a pre-agent with the, with the fifth year option.
28:00I mean, if the team knows they're not going to resign the guy that may be willing to trade
28:03him on the option because it makes them more valuable.
28:06Um, Falcons can do the, uh, Titans and trade Drake London and then just find a way to draft
28:13Tet McMillan.
28:14Yeah, seriously.
28:17Pull the AJ Brown move there.
28:19I think that's pretty much it, but like you, you figure out a way you let it be known.
28:24All right.
28:25I just, I don't know if you can't do it.
28:28Like if T Higgins resigns and there's no way DK Metcalf is getting available.
28:33Like if you can't do it, I don't think the answer is giving like Hollywood Brown or a
28:38Mari Cooper, a big contract that we saw how that worked for the Titans with, with Calvin
28:45Ridley.
28:46I'm not giving them like a huge contract, but if you get like old man here said Darius
28:50Slayton, like a two-year deal for Darius Slayton, who I think is a good fit, like a good veteran
28:55in the room.
28:56Like, how much is Deandre Hopkins going to cost you?
28:58Like one year, 10, 15 million, like to get a veteran in the room and like a guy who can
29:05actually play on the outside.
29:06Like you just hope to kind of, if you miss on the big fish, I think you just kind of
29:10want to raise the floor of the room a little bit.
29:13And maybe a Darius Slayton does that.
29:16Chris Godwin is probably like the, probably in the middle of those two tiers, like the
29:21tier below DK, but a tier above like a Darius Slayton and free agency.
29:25And you don't have to give up anything for, for Chris Godwin.
29:28So I would be, I would be down for Chris Godwin.
29:31Godwin is probably the basement where I'd say like, cause I think assuming he's healthy
29:34and you'd have to go through the medical, like I feel comfortable.
29:37He can dictate coverage would be a number one.
29:39So like, he's probably the lowest level I would say that, but like to your point about,
29:45when you get Slayton for a year, well, if he's one of the best wide receivers available
29:50and there's a team, maybe a little closer, that's kind of all in, maybe they throw on
29:54a third or fourth year knowing, yeah, we're going to be rebuilding that anyway.
29:57It doesn't matter.
29:59It's what happened with, with Ridley last year.
30:03So I just, if I'm the Patriots, like, yeah, you get the best receiver you can on a short-term
30:08deal and you try to go back to it next year, but they they've got to get creative.
30:12We know they've been chasing this guy.
30:14They went after Ridley, right?
30:16They went after, um, like they've been trying to pursue this guy.
30:21They try to trade back up into the first round for receiver last year.
30:26They've been aggressive in trying to get this player.
30:28So I don't, I don't doubt that will change, but you have to make it happen.
30:33How would you feel?
30:35Hypothetical time.
30:36Yeah.
30:37They nailed it.
30:38They nailed the trenches out of the park.
30:39Like you feel really good about the trenches going into next year and their wide receiver
30:43additions are Darius Slayton and Chris Godwin.
30:46So you get those two kind of like a second and third tier wide receiver.
30:51So your wide receiver room, you have Chris Godwin on the outside.
30:54You have, I mean, no, you have Darius Slayton on the outside.
30:57You have Chris Godwin, pop Douglas, and then you see what happens with like Jalen, Paul
31:01Caishon, booty, Kendrick Bourne.
31:02You have those guys to round out your depth chart.
31:05Um, I mean, it would obviously depend what kind of contracts you got those guys on, right?
31:11But you're going to hear me talking a lot about, you know, the 20, 26 draft wide receivers.
31:19Cause I still don't think you have a coverage dictator in there and you still need that
31:22guy and you need somebody.
31:24The other thing about like, um, sorry, my computer's being really glitchy.
31:29Um, the other, like you need, somebody who's going to grow with Drake may.
31:33And I don't know that Chris Godwin is going to be that guy with his age, with his injury
31:36history.
31:37I know he's the same age as some other wide receivers I've talked about, but he's, he's
31:40gotten hurt a lot the last couple of years.
31:43So it's a, it's a, it's a holdover and that, you know what?
31:46It might be.
31:47Okay.
31:48If they really nailed the trenches, I said this, you're not going to be able to get this
31:51whole thing fixed in one off season.
31:54You're not going to be able to do it.
31:55So fine.
31:56But you're going to hear me talking a lot about Carnell Tate, a lot about Kendrick law,
32:00a lot about Nicky Anderson.
32:02Like we're going to do that next year.
32:04It's going to be just like, and if, if it's the situation you described, there's not going
32:08to be a ton of debate.
32:11With the wide receivers we did with the quarterbacks two years ago, because if they have their
32:14address or if they have their tackle, now it's like, you should leave the draft with
32:18the best wide receiver.
32:19You should be able to move up, you should be able to, you know, pay whatever, or whoever's
32:25in free agency.
32:26Like you should be able to get that guy.
32:28Yup.
32:29I think I'm just where I'm kind of at is like, ideally you have the money in the draft capital
32:35to invest it wide receiver, like get a top wide receiver and significantly improve the
32:39offensive and defensive lines.
32:41But I I'm just like, if you're, if there is a situation where T Higgins resigns and the
32:46trade market isn't what you expect, like I would rather really nail the trenches and
32:51just kind of raise the floor a little bit in that wide receiver room.
32:55Because I do think most of the time that wide receiver is the cherry on top to some of these
32:59teams like AJ Brown going to the Eagles, like that was kind of the last move to put them
33:04over.
33:05So I think that's just, again, ideally you get both of these cause you have everything
33:09you need to get both of these if you, if you can, but I think where I'm at, it's just really
33:14take care of the offensive and defensive line.
33:16And then if you can raise the floor a little bit in that wide receiver room with like a
33:20Darius Lee and then a Chris Gahl, and that seems like it would be a really good duo or
33:24you get a guy on day two with those three, you know, draft picks.
33:28I think that would kind of be a good way to go about that.
33:31Yeah.
33:32I'm with you.
33:33I think if they have to prioritize one, it's the trenches over receivers.
33:36Yep.
33:37Is that what you did in your, uh, I saw you released a mock draft over there on 98, five,
33:42the sports hub.com trenches, trenches, trenches, trenches, trenches.
33:47I didn't.
33:48So some of it too, was like assuming certain things about free agency in the off season.
33:52And I did have them making a notable addition in the veteran market, but I don't know how
33:57people read mock drafts.
33:58Like do you read, do people just scroll through, see the names and go from there?
34:04Do they read the player descriptions?
34:05Do they read the lead?
34:06That's exactly what they do.
34:07They scroll through and they say, okay, this guy first, this guy, second, this guy third.
34:11Right.
34:12So I didn't take a wide receiver until the fifth round.
34:14And I tried to put as many disclaimers in as I could like, and I have them adding a
34:19veteran.
34:20Don't forget.
34:21They're adding a veteran.
34:22This is on top of a veteran, like on and on and on.
34:25But I, I, nobody's been too mad at me about it.
34:27So I think people did read shout out to the readers who I, I haven't had one person where
34:31I've been like, you didn't read the description.
34:33Like everybody read it.
34:34So shout out to you guys for making that work.
34:36This was honestly, I would say we'll do our mock draft either Wednesday or Thursday this
34:42week.
34:43We'll do our first one, this one specifically, I think.
34:47So this is, I started doing Patriots mocks, like actually doing them for work and not
34:52just goofing around in 2018.
34:57So 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, so eight years, three or four a year.
35:02Like that's not, you know, 20 something.
35:04This is the hardest one I've done.
35:06And that's because this off season can go in so many different directions.
35:12Like last year, you knew, depending on what happens in free agency with their own free
35:17agents, external freight, like it's a quarterback.
35:20We knew that.
35:21You go back a couple of years ago, you kind of had an idea of what the roster looked like.
35:25And you also kind of what the class was helped.
35:28This is a wide open class for a team with a wide open roster, not to mention too, like
35:34there's the Christian Barmer of it all with his medical situation.
35:37It's a new coaching staff.
35:39Like it, there's so many unknowns you have to fill in.
35:43So it was hard to do.
35:46There's a reason we're going to do one and then come back after free agency, because
35:52I, I love mock drafts for the exercise that they are doing them on the show, which is
35:58basically introducing fans to prospects they should know about.
36:03It's really hard to do that right now when they need to know about everybody, right?
36:10So there's, there's so many scenarios to get to, it makes it tough in a lot of context
36:16is needed for some of these decisions that it's going to be a lot easier once we know
36:20the background.
36:21Yeah.
36:22I mean, last year it was every draft started with whether Drake may or Jaden Daniels was
36:27there.
36:28Right.
36:29Maybe he got frisky and did a trade down.
36:31I don't even think we, I don't think we did one.
36:35I think we did one.
36:37We must've done one.
36:38It was getting so repetitive.
36:40It got repetitive.
36:41We did the wheel.
36:42Remember?
36:43Oh, the wheel was great.
36:44We opened back the wheel this year and the wheel still landed on Drake May 3rd.
36:49Cause we got like ACC on our first, our first spin or something.
36:53So we still ended up with a quarterback on the wheel, but yeah, this year, I mean, you
36:58could, there's so many different options and they're a pick farther down and we'll see
37:03what the quarterbacks go.
37:05With any quarterbacks go before them, which will shake things up all over the place.
37:09So a lot of different options with these mock drafts, which again, we will do our first
37:14one on our second show this week.
37:16So stay tuned for that.
37:17But anything else here, any more Superbowl reactions or no, no real Patriots news.
37:25Although Chooks, a core for surface today, I guess is coming, coming back into the league.
37:31Probably not here, but, uh, Chooks core for back, uh, Mike Pellegrino going to the bills
37:36that broke in the game last night.
37:37So I think that was really the only, uh, Patriots news.
37:41So anything else to wrap this one up or, uh, I'll just say if the, the bills went all next
37:47year, I'm giving a hundred percent of the credit to Mike Pellegrino, any, uh, any comment
37:53on Josh Allen when an MVP, yeah, here you have a guy that, you know, there was voter
37:59fatigue for the clear favorite, which we, we know the voters think Lamar Jackson was
38:03the best quarterback in the league because the exact same voters voted him first team
38:07all pro.
38:08So you had voter fatigue for the favorite.
38:10You had bizarre favoritism from the voters.
38:12Like, um, I think Orlovsky said outright that he was like, I'm voting for Allen because
38:17he deserves to have a MVP.
38:20Didn't care about him earning it.
38:21Just said he should have one.
38:22I saw you just, I saw you said like, or maybe that was Romo.
38:26Maybe that was Roma.
38:27One of them said it.
38:28Orlovsky.
38:29I saw a couple of Orlovsky on, on TV and he did it like the award is most valuable.
38:34Okay.
38:35So I'll get it.
38:36Never.
38:37It never goes to the most valuable player, but that was his breakdown.
38:39Like the cast around Josh Allen, he was more valuable to his team than Lamar Jackson.
38:45However they want to justify it so they can sleep at night, but you had voter fatigue
38:48for the favorite.
38:49You had favoritism for the underdog.
38:52You had a player that whose team came up short of expectations.
38:58It's the 2023 Joe Ellen beat MVP all over again.
39:02They were done with Yoke itch.
39:03They were, they didn't want to give him three in a row because of what that would mean.
39:06And everybody felt bad and beat didn't have one, even though we really didn't earn it.
39:11And so they just gave it to him because when, when my guy has to like, I need to feed, it
39:17shouldn't be talking heads, voting on this writer's fine.
39:20It should not be talking heads because the talking heads want something to prop up their
39:25agenda.
39:26So all the Josh Allen people who were sick of getting told the truth about how Josh Allen
39:30isn't as good as they think he is voted for him.
39:33So now they can point and say, Josh Allen's the MVP, even though they're the ones that
39:37gave him the MVP, it's the guy in the hot dog costume.
39:40We're all trying to find the guy who did this and they justified it by saying, well, he
39:44was the most valuable player.
39:45I've said for years, if the MVP is the most valuable player, you should give it to the
39:49player for the most value.
39:51I made the case.
39:52Granted, I was like some dumb kid in high school.
39:55Was it 2011, 2012, the year that Peyton Manning missed with the neck injury in the Colts with
40:00nearly the exact same roster went from being like a Superbowl contender to winning one
40:04game.
40:05I was going around making the case that Peyton Manning should win the MVP that year because
40:08it was clear that he was the most valuable player in the league.
40:11So if we're going to award the MVP based on value by all means, have at it.
40:17I just, if, if this is what we're going to do, this is what we're going to do.
40:21You can't go back next year because suddenly it doesn't help Joshy Poo to make that argument.
40:26Like if this is how we're doing it, then this is how we need to do it.
40:29Hell of a time to start.
40:31And also where's the MVP votes for Pena Sewell?
40:35Where's the MVP?
40:36He got a, he got a, he got like a fourth place offensive player of the year, Joe Tooney.
40:42You're telling me Pena Sewell isn't one of the five most valuable players to his team
40:46in the NFL.
40:48Joe Tooney is another great one.
40:49Why didn't we hear about Joe Tooney?
40:50Why didn't we hear about Patrick Sertan?
40:52If it's truly the most valuable player, then it is most certainly not a quarterback award
40:56anymore.
40:57That doesn't mean quarterbacks can't win it, but it needs to stop going to quarterbacks
41:01every year if it's most valuable and not best.
41:03So we'll see.
41:05Like I said, if we want to really make the most valuable player award for the most valuable
41:10player in the league, not the best player, the player is the most value to his team.
41:14I have no problem doing that.
41:17Let's see some consistency next year then though.
41:19That's all I'm asking for or, or, or maybe everybody was just being babies about Josh
41:24Allen, not being able to win a super bowl and wanted to make sure that their favorite
41:27little boy felt good, but I'll give them the benefit of the doubt.
41:31I see a lot of people in the chat said like CMC should have won it last year.
41:36He probably was the most valuable player to his team last year.
41:39We didn't do it this way last year, carried that Niners team.
41:42But I mean, Josh Allen had an amazing year.
41:45I like him and Lamar had amazing years and I think they both deserved it.
41:50I really didn't care who got it because I think they both absolutely deserved it.
41:53So was there maybe some fatigue and they gave it to Josh or, but I, I think they both had
41:59really awesome years and they were both deserving of the MVP.
42:03So I don't feel too strongly about it one way or the other, but when you have voters
42:06saying that they voted for Allen because of fatigue, there's something that's tough.
42:11They shouldn't.
42:12Well, that's Romo though.
42:13What do you expect from him?
42:14These days?
42:15Well, then he should have a vote.
42:16You're right.
42:17What do you expect?
42:18I think they should absolutely look over the, uh, who has access to voting and, and things
42:22like that.
42:23But there were some, there were some interesting votes going over those ballots.
42:28Also while we're on this, cause we've been on since that wasn't even the most egregious
42:31thing that happened Thursday night.
42:34Apparently being the best at your position in the history of the sport is not worth getting
42:39into the hall of fame, which is asinine.
42:42Like what the hell are we doing?
42:44And I knew they were going to get it wrong.
42:46And I said it on the last show and I was still pissed because not only did they not put them
42:51in, they can select the modern era committee can select up to five common, uh, inductees
42:59up to five.
43:00They pick three sharp, got in off the seniors committee.
43:03So that's separate.
43:05They left two spots blank.
43:07They left Vinita Terry on the bench.
43:09They left Luke Keighley on the bench.
43:11They left Tori hold on the bench to rail Suggs, Steve Smith, apparently not putting somebody
43:17in is more deserving than putting any of those guys in, which is ridiculous.
43:23Will Vinita Terry get in eventually?
43:25Yes.
43:26But there's something about being a first ballot hall of famer, even within the hall
43:29of fame, you can separate.
43:31It's the same as the jackass that didn't vote each row.
43:34So he wasn't in unanimously, right?
43:37Vinita Terry out of Vinita Terry should have been a first ballot hall of famer.
43:42He is the greatest player in the history of the sport in his position.
43:46He is part of multiple of the greatest moments in the history of the sport.
43:51He is the league's all time leading scorer.
43:55He should have been in on the first ballot.
43:57It is shameful that he did not get in.
43:59I had hoped that Rodney Harrison no longer being the biggest snub in hall of fame history
44:05would be something I could celebrate.
44:07Instead, they somehow lapped him.
44:10And it's really, really a bad look for that committee.
44:14Yeah, it was the fact that they leave two spots open just makes zero.
44:19There were six.
44:20There were six worthy candidates.
44:22It was Gates, Gates, Suggs, Keekly, Smith, Holt, Vinita Terry, and then there were seven.
44:32Who's the other one that got in with Gates and Jared Allen?
44:35So seven, you could have picked any of the five of those seven and had a good class.
44:43And they, they, they decided we're going to leave two spots open.
44:46Ridiculous.
44:47Yep.
44:48All the upside is crazy.
44:50Next year.
44:51Let's get, let's get Vinita Terry, Harrison, and Bill all in together and Edelman will
44:56be eligible for the first time too, but I'm gonna hold my breath on that one.
44:59I know how that's going to go, but it's Harry Bill and Harrison all getting in together
45:03and maybe Vince will fork too.
45:05That would be pretty cool.
45:06Yep.
45:07Benitary.
45:08He's an automatic finalist too now, right?
45:09Cause he like finished top seven or something like that.
45:12So he'll be a, I'll be a finalist again next year.
45:16Hopefully they wake up and put Rodney Harrison in that bill should be automatic if he doesn't
45:20come back to the league and if he's eligible, he should be an automatic for that.
45:24So hopefully we get some, get some, I'll say this.
45:27They didn't put Eli in, which was good.
45:29Yeah.
45:30I begrudgingly have to give them credit for that one.
45:32They got that one, right?
45:33All right.
45:34We'll see if they keep it that way, but they got that one, right?
45:36He'll, he'll, he'll get it at some point I imagine, but that's unfortunate.
45:40Yep.
45:41All right.
45:43We will wrap it up there again.
45:47First off season mock draft coming up later this week, Wednesday or Thursday, we will
45:51let you know Patriots CLNS on Twitter, Patriots press pass on YouTube, subscribe, turn your
45:57notifications on there and wherever else you get your podcasts.
46:01In the meantime, you can follow Barth on Twitter at real Alex Barth, head over to 95
46:05the sports of.com.
46:06He's got a fresh Patriots mock draft up there.
46:10You can also follow me on Twitter at I am Brian Heinz and head over to Pat's pulpit.com
46:14for our Patriots coverage over there as well.
46:17Thank you everyone for tuning in with us tonight and we will see you guys later this week.
46:22Right.