• last year
Jimmy Toscano returns to host the show in Bob Ryan and Jeff Goodman's absence, alongside Gary Tanguay. Jimmy and Gary take a look back at the In-Season Tournament and its results as Lebron James and the Los Angeles Lakers emerge victorious. As Lebron adds more accolades to his career, and what point does the GOAT discussion have its definitive winner? The guys also break down Jaylen brown's ejection from the Celtics game, and debate if that kind of passion is what the Celtics need right now. That, and much more!


01:10 - Lebron & Anthony Davis
15:50 - IST Thoughts
20:35 - Jaylen Brown Ejection
28:40 - KC Chiefs Offsides Call
34:20 - Patriots Officially Eliminated
36:15 - Favorite Holiday Movies


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Transcript
00:00 (upbeat music)
00:02 (crowd cheering)
00:06 - Two legends in basketball analysis
00:09 with over 70 years combined experience.
00:13 This is the Bob Ryan and Jeff Goodman Podcast.
00:17 - NBA, some college, a little bit of everything.
00:20 - You know what can I say?
00:21 But it wasn't gonna happen here with him.
00:22 - Hey everybody, welcome to the Bob Ryan,
00:24 Gary Tangler, Zubin Podcast on CLNS Media Networks.
00:28 Jimmy Toscano in for the video.
00:30 Bob Ryan again, great reviews.
00:33 - He got Wally pipped.
00:34 We might never see Bob again after this.
00:37 - No, we'll always hear him.
00:39 He will always be heard.
00:41 - Yeah, that's true.
00:42 - Anyways, we are brought to you by FanDuel,
00:47 the exclusive wagering partner of the CLNS Media Network.
00:51 Score this NFL season with FanDuel,
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01:03 Okay, Jimmy, let's get to it here.
01:05 We start off talking about just the things
01:09 that we saw with the in-season tournament
01:11 and LeBron James, it was obvious
01:14 that the Lakers really wanted this.
01:16 They won the in-season tournament.
01:18 My feeling is, okay guys, stay healthy
01:20 and show up for the real one.
01:21 'Cause I really wanna see Anthony Davis
01:23 and LeBron James in the finals.
01:25 Doesn't everybody?
01:26 I mean, in the real finals.
01:28 I mean, we want those guys to be healthy.
01:31 But anyways, you brought up the question,
01:34 is LeBron James now the GOAT?
01:38 - So I wouldn't say this makes him the GOAT,
01:41 but this is, when his story is told
01:43 at the end of his career,
01:44 whenever that does come to a close in 10 years,
01:48 it feels like, I mean, he's gonna stick around now
01:50 for his kid to enter the league.
01:51 And I wanna touch on that at some point.
01:54 But this is just another accolade.
01:57 And they keep adding up.
01:58 This guy has prolonged his career.
02:01 It's Tom Brady-esque.
02:02 For me, it's Tom Brady and LeBron James
02:05 when you talk about athletes
02:06 that are able to elevate their game
02:08 as they grow older in this league, right?
02:13 Defy father time is what both of those guys did.
02:16 And LeBron's what, 20 something years now in the league.
02:20 And he's still bullying guys out there in the court.
02:24 He's bullying these young kids who grew up watching him
02:28 in diapers practically.
02:30 So I love it.
02:32 I do think, and I know that there's a lot of people
02:36 younger than me who are trending
02:37 in the LeBron James direction
02:39 when we're talking about the GOAT here.
02:43 There's still a lot of people who want Michael Jordan
02:46 and who say, "Michael Jordan, I just had a debate
02:48 with my three buddies about it
02:49 right before we got on this show."
02:51 Who they're still adamant that it's MJ.
02:53 Like, how can you be so sure?
02:54 You were five years old when MJ was
02:58 in the prime of his career,
02:59 but it's neither here nor there.
03:01 There's a case to be made for both guys,
03:02 but I think you're gonna see a lot
03:04 of the younger generation now say,
03:05 "It's LeBron, it's LeBron, it's LeBron."
03:09 Because he's been able to play at this high, high, high level
03:12 for such a long period of time.
03:13 No, he does not have the championships,
03:15 but he does have championships.
03:16 He's got multiple championships now,
03:18 three on three different teams.
03:21 And now it's the end season tournament.
03:23 - Four times.
03:24 - Sorry, he's got four, three different teams.
03:26 - Yeah.
03:27 - He's got the end season tournament, which whatever,
03:29 you might think that's not a big deal.
03:30 And it really, is it?
03:32 Not really, but it's just another thing
03:34 that he was able to do.
03:35 He was able to rally his team around.
03:37 Anthony Davis is playing unbelievable basketball.
03:39 We all saw what he did in that championship game,
03:41 40 some odd points and whatnot.
03:43 But LeBron is the heartbeat of that team.
03:47 LeBron is making it all work.
03:48 He's doing everything.
03:49 And again, at this stage of his career,
03:51 to be able to play at the level he is,
03:54 is he a top five player today in the NBA?
03:59 Probably not, but is he a top 10?
04:01 Yeah, you could probably make that case.
04:02 And that's crazy.
04:03 You know, and it really depends on what you value.
04:06 What do you really value when you're talking about
04:08 who's the best player in the NBA?
04:09 He's not scoring at the top five level or whatever,
04:12 but he's playing awesome basketball right now.
04:16 And you know, when there's adversity,
04:19 it seems like he's able to answer the bell.
04:20 They want it in the bubble.
04:21 People are gonna shit on the bubble, part of my language.
04:24 People are gonna criticize the bubble
04:26 and say, "Oh, it's not a real championship."
04:28 I would say it's the other direction.
04:30 I would say it was an even harder championship.
04:33 I mean, the regular season games were right up there.
04:36 I think they played 72.
04:38 It wasn't like that much of a shortened season.
04:41 And to be able to play under those circumstances
04:46 in an unfamiliar, you know, without the home team,
04:50 without the home fans behind you.
04:52 - Oh, absolutely.
04:53 It was weird.
04:53 It was pickup basketball.
04:55 - It was weird, but they did it.
04:56 - Yeah, it was weird.
04:57 There was nobody in the stands.
04:58 Are you kidding me?
04:59 Yeah.
05:00 - And you know what?
05:01 If the Celtics had won it,
05:01 nobody around here would discredit that championship.
05:03 - Oh, no, of course.
05:04 Well, Jimmy, let me tell you, it comes out of this for me.
05:07 And the reason I love this discussion
05:10 is because it will go on forever.
05:13 - Forever.
05:14 (Jimmy laughs)
05:16 - But this is what I always come down to.
05:19 Because I like LeBron as a person better
05:23 in my limited dealings with both of them.
05:26 Michael Jordan was, he cut your eyes out.
05:31 I mean, even when he was elected
05:34 into the NBA Hall of Fame,
05:35 I mean, basketball Hall of Fame in Springfield,
05:38 he invited some of his former enemies there
05:41 and he was even giving them jabs then.
05:43 I mean, Michael Jordan disliked people.
05:47 I mean, this was not an overly friendly guy.
05:49 He wasn't like Magic Johnson or LeBron James
05:55 were very popular with other NBA players.
05:57 And Michael Jordan wanted to cut your eyes out.
06:01 And I think that's really the difference.
06:03 And that's why he won six.
06:05 - That's what worked for him, right?
06:06 I mean.
06:07 - That worked for him because I think
06:08 everybody remembers the game, was it against Utah,
06:11 where you had the temperature of 104 degrees
06:14 and he just went, still went off.
06:16 - Muggy.
06:17 - LeBron didn't, I remember,
06:21 this is the one thing why I give it to Michael slightly.
06:24 I remember LeBron had the leg cramps
06:27 and he was on the bench and Miami lost that series,
06:30 I believe to Dallas.
06:31 And I really thought Miami was good enough
06:34 to at least win three out of the four.
06:36 I mean, he went two for four down there.
06:38 I thought they'd two, but three out of four.
06:40 And then maybe I'd be thinking differently.
06:42 I think the difference between the two was just,
06:45 and I'd rather go to dinner with LeBron.
06:47 Like some people have like tried to make LeBron
06:50 into this, well, he's a good guy.
06:53 He's not, I mean, okay.
06:54 You had the thing in Miami, you know, you had the,
06:59 oh God, I forgot it with Jim Gray.
07:01 - Decision, right?
07:02 - The decision.
07:03 So what?
07:05 I mean, it bombed.
07:06 - And I think he regrets it.
07:08 I think he's made that pretty clear.
07:09 - It's like, who cares?
07:10 It was a marketing thing gone bad.
07:12 - Sure, yeah.
07:13 - You know, that's it.
07:14 - But LeBron to me just lacked that little bit
07:18 of a killer instinct that Michael had.
07:21 - I think he's actually gotten it later on.
07:23 Again, that's something that I think he's acquired
07:25 later on in his career, that killer instinct.
07:28 - He was pass first, shoot later.
07:30 Michael was shoot first and pass later, but you're right.
07:33 You're right.
07:34 - But I'll never forget that series when they came back
07:36 down three to one against the Cavs.
07:38 And I know Kyrie was a big part of that as well,
07:40 but LeBron was the reason they really, I mean,
07:44 down three to one to the Cavs in the NBA finals
07:46 to come back and win that series.
07:48 That's one of the greatest comebacks
07:49 in the history of the NBA, as far as I'm concerned.
07:51 And then to win two more after that.
07:53 So I think that killer mentality is there, but yeah.
07:55 Is he Michael Jordan in that sense?
07:57 No, but also Gary, and I want to piggyback on what you said.
08:01 LeBron does seem to be like a pretty good guy.
08:04 And I mean, I'm not going to sit here
08:06 and act like me and LeBron are friends,
08:07 but I've had a lot of dealings with him
08:09 just at covering games and not just me,
08:11 but it's rare to find somebody who has anything negative
08:15 to say, unless you're a hater,
08:16 unless you think that he's selfish
08:18 or you think he's egotistical and you think he's lame
08:21 and he makes up stuff.
08:23 Fine, you can think those things,
08:24 but think about it like this.
08:27 This guy has been in the limelight for over 20 years.
08:31 He was in the limelight when he was in high school.
08:33 Yeah.
08:34 And there really isn't any dirt on him.
08:36 You really can't find anything.
08:38 - You know what somebody said to me once
08:40 that he was cheap at dinner and I go,
08:42 "Larry Bird, man, was known to be the worst tipper ever."
08:45 - Really?
08:46 - Oh yeah.
08:47 I mean, ask Sean about that.
08:48 I mean, oh, oh Larry, he's got every dollar he ever made.
08:52 But I mean, somebody said to me that,
08:53 I go, "Is that all you got?"
08:55 You know, really?
08:56 And you know, the reality is,
08:57 is maybe LeBron was going to dinner with Maverick Carter
09:00 and they have a corporate credit card
09:02 and Maverick Carter always picks it up and they put it,
09:04 you know, I just think, I'm a, personally,
09:07 I'm a fan of LeBron, but that killer instinct, I wonder.
09:10 But now, but here's the old, here's the question, Jimmy.
09:13 I mean, he's a more complete player than Michael.
09:18 - Yeah.
09:19 - Right?
09:20 - Offensive.
09:20 I mean, Michael obviously was a great defensive player too.
09:22 - He could rebound.
09:23 Michael was a great defensive player.
09:25 LeBron could get better defensively.
09:27 But LeBron's like six, nine, two, one.
09:29 - LeBron can play five positions.
09:31 - He can play five positions.
09:32 You know, Michael can't play five positions.
09:35 So, you know, if you say basketball player
09:37 to basketball player, I can see why you would pick LeBron.
09:41 - Yeah.
09:43 I mean, that's kind of where I'm at with it.
09:43 And I grew up watching LeBron.
09:45 I mean, don't get me wrong.
09:47 I saw the, I saw Michael Jordan's career
09:50 at a much younger age.
09:51 And, you know, the last couple of championships,
09:53 I was, you know, obviously in love with basketball,
09:56 but I was, I was young, you know,
09:58 but having watched LeBron for his entire career,
10:01 I don't know, I had a front,
10:04 we have a front row seat to this guy's greatness.
10:05 I just find it hard.
10:07 To me, it's just hard to believe that people can't,
10:08 some people can't have the discussion.
10:10 They're just so steadfast that it's MJ.
10:13 And I just feel like that's just not the right,
10:15 that's not the right way.
10:16 - It's definitely a discussion.
10:17 - You have to, you have to.
10:19 It is, but some people are just like, you know,
10:21 they have their biases
10:22 and they just don't want to entertain it.
10:23 But every single season that LeBron plays,
10:27 each one becomes more and more leaning towards,
10:32 LeBron might be the goal.
10:33 - Longevity, man.
10:34 And people, I will take so much grief for this,
10:37 but I have no problem saying it.
10:38 If the Celtics don't win it,
10:42 and I want the Celtics to win the NBA championship,
10:45 I always want the Celtics to win the NBA championship.
10:49 If they don't win it- - Easy, Gary.
10:51 Easy, Gary.
10:52 - If they're not in the finals,
10:54 I would love to see LeBron and Anthony Davis win a title.
10:59 - Wow.
11:00 Yeah, you're on an island.
11:01 You're on an island with that take around to you.
11:03 - I'm on an island 'cause I like the players.
11:05 - Yeah.
11:05 - I do like the players.
11:07 - I get it.
11:08 - You know. - I get it.
11:09 - I like the players.
11:10 I mean, I, so, and I think it would be great for the game,
11:14 but I want the Celtics to win, of course.
11:16 - But then you're gonna get the Lakers,
11:17 are gonna have the edge on banners now.
11:19 - Oh, yeah. - The Lakers
11:20 have the edge on you.
11:22 - They're gonna win again, the Celtics-
11:23 - You know what, I'm gonna,
11:25 or I'm gonna disagree,
11:27 'cause I don't really like Anthony Davis.
11:29 - Okay. - Not a fan, not,
11:30 well, he's never done it for me.
11:32 - He's just injury prone.
11:34 Oh, I mean, that's the thing is we have it.
11:36 I mean, look what he did against Indywood,
11:37 like 40 points, 20 rebounds, you know, five blocks.
11:41 I mean, he's just hurt. - I don't know.
11:43 Yeah, I just feel like he, the injuries,
11:46 I just feel like attitude,
11:47 but I didn't like how it ended for him,
11:48 with him in New Orleans.
11:50 I thought that was really ugly.
11:51 - That's just ugly.
11:53 - Yeah. - Remember though,
11:54 Gary Tangway said he was gonna come to Boston.
11:58 - Was that a Tangway report?
12:00 - Oh, dude, I took-
12:02 - Reveal your sources right now.
12:04 - No, no, no, no, no, no.
12:04 I'm gonna tell you what happened.
12:06 I don't know if you were there yet,
12:09 but it was, God bless the great Art Martone.
12:14 - Oh yeah. - The best.
12:17 - Absolutely.
12:18 - Was running the- - He was the best.
12:19 - And did a great job with it, such a sweet guy.
12:22 But he'd always come over to me, he goes,
12:23 "You got anything?
12:24 We gotta stir up some stuff, you know,
12:25 we need to get some flicks."
12:27 So, and I was great at that.
12:29 I picked one theme.
12:31 - By the way, that wasn't how Art wanted to be.
12:34 He was getting it from the national NBC guys.
12:38 - Oh, he had to, of course.
12:38 - They were making us, they had our,
12:41 man, they had a gun to our head to make sure we got,
12:44 you know, 15 articles per sport out a day.
12:47 We were scrambling. - Oh, get out, man.
12:48 Oh, it's not about journalism anymore.
12:51 And that was the beginning of the end.
12:52 But, G-Tang came through here.
12:55 So I said, I wrote, okay, I wrote an article.
13:00 And all I said was, all I said,
13:04 was the only player the Celtics could possibly trade for
13:07 at the time was Anthony Davis.
13:11 I never said they were gonna get Anthony Davis.
13:13 I just said, if you're looking to make a deal,
13:17 you wanna trade Jason Tatum for Anthony Davis,
13:19 you could do it.
13:20 Everyone else is unavailable.
13:22 You know, my whole thing was,
13:23 "LeBron's not coming here."
13:25 Right?
13:26 You know, these guys, we're not getting this guy.
13:28 We're not getting that guy.
13:29 But Anthony Davis was playing in a small market.
13:32 Maybe he could make a deal.
13:33 And I wrote that and it picked up so much steam
13:37 that it turned into, Tanguy said,
13:40 "The Celtics are trading for Anthony Davis."
13:43 - You had to go on Sports Tonight and talk about it.
13:45 - Oh, it was great.
13:46 Oh, it blew up, dude.
13:47 And so, Anthony, so somebody that night in New Orleans
13:50 asked Anthony Davis, "There's a report out of Boston.
13:53 "The Celtics are gonna trade for you."
13:54 He's like, "What?
13:55 "I don't know anything about it."
13:58 Oh yeah.
13:58 And then Bill Simmons.
13:59 - Yeah, and it ruined our chances.
14:01 Thanks a lot, Gary.
14:02 - And Bill Simmons, he tweeted,
14:04 "Tanguy's a moron," or something.
14:06 - Oh, well.
14:07 - Oh, it was great.
14:08 It was phenomenal. - Bill Simmons.
14:10 - But yeah, it was great.
14:11 It was great.
14:12 But then--
14:13 - That's the power--
14:14 - I do know this, but I do know--
14:15 - The power of the pen right there.
14:17 - Oh, hang on a minute.
14:19 Sorry.
14:20 I do know this.
14:23 That Danny Ainge was in on Anthony Davis
14:27 to the final bell when the Lakers got him.
14:30 But New Orleans wanted Tatum, and Ainge said no way.
14:33 - Smart, very smart.
14:35 - He made the right move, obviously.
14:37 - He offered Brown?
14:40 - Yeah, they didn't want, they went Tatum or nothing.
14:43 - Yeah.
14:44 - It's gotta be Tatum.
14:45 And then, but then the whole thing was then they had to,
14:47 you know, they had to resign him.
14:49 'Cause Rich was, Rich, I forgot his age.
14:52 Rich, where he has all the big names.
14:54 - The bronze guy, Rich Paul?
14:56 - Yeah, Rich Paul.
14:57 I think, yeah.
14:58 I think he has Davis too.
14:59 And then--
15:00 - I don't even know.
15:01 - They moved him to the Lakers.
15:02 And I don't think, another thing is I don't think
15:05 Davis would have resigned here.
15:08 - Yeah, that was the big concern too.
15:09 - That was a big thing too.
15:10 So.
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15:50 - Okay, Jimmy, what about the in-season tournament?
15:53 Your thoughts.
15:54 - I feel like I'm blurry, Gary.
15:57 I hope that my connection doesn't suck.
15:59 Okay.
16:01 My thoughts.
16:02 Overall, great.
16:06 Honestly.
16:07 And this is coming from a guy who trashed it.
16:10 And I will say this.
16:12 I still don't care at all
16:15 about the winning team's prize.
16:20 Like, it doesn't really do it for me.
16:22 So, yeah.
16:23 Well, like, oh, all the players get $500,000.
16:26 Oh, that's great for them.
16:28 But like, I think the in-season tournament,
16:31 if it was tied into the playoffs in some capacity
16:34 or seeding in some capacity,
16:36 or if there was some additional benefit to winning it
16:39 other than just monetary for the players,
16:42 I would like it a lot more.
16:43 But I will say this.
16:44 It elevated the play from a lot of these players.
16:47 You could tell that these games mattered
16:49 a little bit more to them
16:50 compared to just a normal regular season game.
16:53 And it put some players on a national spotlight
16:56 that might not get on the spotlight as much,
16:57 talking about Halliburton and Indiana.
17:00 And that was a great thing for him.
17:03 On the contrary, Gary,
17:05 it put other players in the national spotlight
17:07 that maybe didn't want that spotlight.
17:10 And I'm talking about Zion Williamson.
17:12 Because not a lot of people
17:14 are watching New Orleans Pelicans games.
17:16 And when they see a guy looking like a tractor trailer,
17:19 sludging up the court,
17:22 that's the type of like spotlight that you don't want
17:28 if you're Zion Williamson.
17:29 And he's been getting dogged left and right
17:31 because let's face it, he's out of weight.
17:35 I mean, sorry, he's out of shape, he's overweight.
17:37 And it doesn't look like he's giving it his all out there.
17:42 It has been a problem over there.
17:45 Not putting in the work, not taking it seriously.
17:47 He relied on obviously being a much bigger
17:52 and talented player all through high school
17:53 and into college, but now you're in the NBA.
17:55 - Oh yeah, man.
17:56 - Yeah.
17:57 - Oh yeah.
17:58 - You're not gonna get by.
18:00 Totally.
18:00 And everyone else is gonna outwork you and it's showing.
18:02 So I loved what the in-season tournament
18:05 did for the spotlight.
18:08 I liked that it was in Vegas.
18:09 I think it's gonna get bigger
18:11 and it'll probably end up being more like an all-star game
18:14 type weekend vibe, I think at some point.
18:16 You're gonna get people flying in for it.
18:18 You might even get players showing up to watch it
18:20 and it's gonna mean something.
18:22 So good on the Lakers for trying and winning that.
18:27 And I think a lot of teams that didn't make it to Vegas
18:31 or didn't make the, out of the first round,
18:35 now they can see it.
18:36 Now they can see what it was.
18:37 They saw the celebration by the Lakers in the locker room
18:40 and it kind of resembled sort of like
18:44 baseball, right?
18:45 Wild card.
18:46 You advance to the next round in baseball.
18:48 They like to celebrate you, right?
18:49 It's not like they won the World Series, but why not?
18:51 Mix it into the regular season, keep it interesting.
18:54 So overall, I thought it was a good thing.
18:56 I think they'll make some tweaks.
18:57 I hope that they don't change the tiebreaker
19:00 from point differential,
19:03 'cause I like that ruthlessness.
19:05 I like running up the score.
19:07 I think that's just a different-
19:08 - Billy Donovan can get over it.
19:10 - Exactly.
19:11 I just think it's a different-
19:12 - It was fun.
19:13 - Yeah, it's fun.
19:14 It's fun.
19:15 - It's for the tournament.
19:16 And what I like about it is if you don't like it,
19:19 then maybe you'll see them later on down
19:20 the regular season and maybe that game will mean more to you
19:23 'cause you have it in their head or in the playoffs, right?
19:25 So I like that.
19:26 We don't need to play kumbaya and sing kumbaya
19:29 after every game with these players, do we?
19:31 It's gotta be a love fest 24/7.
19:33 It doesn't have to be.
19:35 - I'll tell you this.
19:36 And Bob Ryan disagrees with me
19:37 and Jeff Goodman disagrees with me.
19:39 Indiana's dangerous.
19:43 - Yeah, we mentioned this last week.
19:45 I think they're dangerous too.
19:47 I definitely do.
19:47 - They're dangerous.
19:49 - They believe now.
19:50 - Even though they lost, even though,
19:52 I mean, it wasn't, you know,
19:53 Lakers put it to them, they're still dangerous.
19:57 I'm not saying that they're going to get to the finals,
20:00 but they're gonna cause problems.
20:01 - They can score, Gary.
20:02 They have one of the best offenses in the league.
20:04 Now they need to learn how to play defense,
20:06 but in the NBA, what do they always say?
20:09 Good offense beats good defense.
20:12 - That's right.
20:12 - That doesn't mean don't play defense,
20:14 but if you can score,
20:15 you've got a puncher's chance
20:16 in every single game you play in.
20:17 And in the playoffs, who the hell knows?
20:19 I mean, so much can change between now and then.
20:22 - Oh my God, of course.
20:24 - If they can stay healthy, absolutely.
20:26 They have, you cannot take it.
20:28 That's the type of team where if you take them lightly
20:30 in the first round,
20:31 you're the team that just got upset in the first round.
20:33 - Yeah, you gotta be careful.
20:34 You gotta be careful.
20:36 Jalen Brown, we saw him get ejected.
20:39 I was very surprised.
20:41 First of all, I was surprised he got ejected.
20:43 Everybody understands that that second tech was a joke.
20:46 I mean, it was ridiculous.
20:47 - Complete joke, it's a farce.
20:49 - It was a joke.
20:49 Let the guy go to the bench, just let him cool off.
20:52 And even the other officials were like, what?
20:54 But he was pretty fired up.
20:59 I don't, I like it though.
21:01 I like it.
21:02 - I like it.
21:03 I like it too.
21:04 I'll never get upset at guys showing fire
21:09 and showing passion.
21:11 - Right.
21:11 - That's like the thing that I look for
21:13 when I wanna get behind a player.
21:15 Show me emotion.
21:16 It drives me freaking crazy
21:19 when a guy is just out there without a pulse.
21:22 Just get off the court, get off the field.
21:24 I don't wanna see you.
21:25 I don't wanna know you.
21:26 Be fired up to be out there.
21:27 Love the game, play hard, play with some intensity.
21:31 Now, that doesn't mean I wanna see a guy
21:33 get ejected every game,
21:34 but that's not what Jalen Brown does.
21:35 It's his first career ejection,
21:36 which I was surprised to actually hear that.
21:39 - I thought somebody said something to him.
21:43 I thought it was more egregious.
21:45 I mean, something set him off.
21:47 - Something set him, I mean, he didn't like the calls.
21:49 And then, and the-
21:49 - He didn't like the call,
21:50 but something had to be building.
21:52 Maybe I missed it, but something had to be building.
21:55 - He was, definitely.
21:57 I mean, maybe he was having a bad day,
21:59 but sure as hell,
22:00 it seemed like the referee was having a bad day.
22:02 And that's the problem I have right now
22:03 with these referees, man.
22:06 It's too personal.
22:08 - Well, the guy's on the sideline, let it go.
22:10 It's not about-
22:12 - Exactly.
22:12 These guys are trying to make it about them.
22:15 And they're taking the rule book too literal now.
22:20 And they gotta understand the situation.
22:23 Your goal should not be to eject players from the game,
22:26 especially for something like that.
22:27 - God, no.
22:28 - Control the game.
22:29 - Control the game.
22:30 - Control the game.
22:32 Let them vent off on the bench for a minute.
22:33 He's not up in your face.
22:35 He's not flipping you off.
22:36 He's not touching you or anything like that.
22:39 So let him, he's off the court.
22:42 He's away from the game.
22:43 Let him cool off.
22:44 And that's the end of it.
22:45 You did your job.
22:46 He's doing his, move on.
22:48 But to make it about,
22:49 this whole song and dance and eject the guy.
22:54 And just, you're making it worse is what you're doing.
22:57 So I disagree with that.
22:59 They get a problem in the NBA.
23:00 They got a bad problem in the NBA right now
23:01 with these refs having personal vendettas
23:05 or personal issues with these players.
23:08 And making it about them,
23:09 some of these refs, I don't know if,
23:11 I don't know what they're looking at out there
23:12 half the time either with the texts that we're getting,
23:15 the quick texts, some of these calls that we're seeing.
23:18 Don't get me started too much on the refs, Gary,
23:19 but I'm down on the refs.
23:21 Same with the NFL.
23:22 The NFL officiating is obviously going down as well,
23:25 but NBA, it seems too personal.
23:28 - Well, it does get personal because these guys see,
23:32 oh, of course it's personal.
23:34 You know?
23:35 It's the Chris Paul situation right now.
23:37 - Oh no, Eddie F. Rush is here.
23:39 - Yeah.
23:40 - And then Eddie F. Rush said to Tommy-
23:43 - These NBA refs, they think they're celebrities.
23:46 Yeah.
23:47 The NBA refs, they think they're celebrities, it seems.
23:49 You know, they're out there in the court.
23:50 You know, everyone knows the most popular ones, right?
23:55 And it gets to their head
23:57 and they think it's about them and it's not.
23:59 - No, it's not.
24:00 And I've always maintained you only need two.
24:03 I gotta look up, I gotta look up the,
24:05 what's the name of the ref
24:06 that has the issue with Chris Paul right now?
24:09 - I don't know.
24:10 But I'll pontificate while you-
24:12 - Scott Foster.
24:14 - Oh, that guy.
24:15 - Scott Foster.
24:16 We all know Scott Foster.
24:17 - Yeah, Foster.
24:18 I mean, that's a joke.
24:20 You only need two referees.
24:23 You don't need three.
24:25 Will calls be missed?
24:26 Yes.
24:27 And that's a good thing.
24:29 Let the game go.
24:31 I mean, that's one thing I like.
24:32 The games have been good.
24:33 They've been up and down with a lot of action.
24:35 - Yeah, the refs slow it down.
24:37 - You don't need, I don't care if things get missed.
24:41 So what?
24:42 Play.
24:42 I've hated the three refs since they put it in.
24:45 Hated.
24:46 - I like the play on mentality too.
24:47 I mean, you don't want them to miss something egregious,
24:49 but that's why you have replay too sometimes, right?
24:51 So there are other-
24:53 - Right, come on.
24:53 - There's other capabilities, but yeah, I thought Jalen did.
24:57 Jalen didn't earn that one.
24:58 So, you know, it's too bad.
25:00 Maybe he'll get it that second.
25:01 - Is he having his best year, you think?
25:04 - Jalen Brown?
25:05 - Yeah.
25:06 - No.
25:08 We kind of-
25:09 - I don't think so either.
25:10 You look at his numbers and his numbers ago,
25:13 every time I look at his scoring average,
25:14 I go, "Oh, it's higher than I thought."
25:17 You know?
25:18 - We were critical on last week's show.
25:20 - Yeah.
25:21 - And listen-
25:24 - 'Cause he's averaging like 21 a game,
25:25 and I go, "Really?"
25:26 And then, yeah.
25:28 Sometimes I think I have to stop expecting so much.
25:31 We talked that.
25:32 I'm being-
25:33 - No, no, not at all.
25:34 I'm there with you.
25:37 It's, for me, my expectations on Jalen
25:41 are changing a little bit where I just want him to score.
25:45 And that way I'm not getting disappointed
25:46 with him not passing or not being the elite defender
25:50 that maybe some people think he can be.
25:52 The problem is he's making 300 million now.
25:54 So it's like, okay, well,
25:55 he's expected to do more than just score.
25:58 And he needs to.
26:00 But he is a great scorer.
26:01 He can finish at the rim.
26:04 When he gets going, it's hard to stop the guy.
26:07 He's like a microwave to start the game sometimes.
26:11 He just gets hot so fast.
26:13 - He gets hot quick.
26:14 - I just don't know how the pendulum swings
26:17 so far in the opposite direction sometimes
26:19 where you don't know if you can rely on him, I guess.
26:21 And I think the difference I have with Brown and Tatum now,
26:25 and I think Tatum has taken that step to the elite
26:30 of the elites where not only is he scoring 30 points
26:34 a game pretty easily, he's getting to the line a lot more.
26:38 He's making really nice passes.
26:40 Yeah, exactly.
26:44 And he stepped into that leadership role
26:45 a little bit more.
26:46 He's saying the right thing.
26:47 So I do think that there's a bigger gap
26:49 between the two now.
26:51 And I think Jalen Brown is trying to figure out
26:53 where he fits in sometimes.
26:55 And that's because there's Porzingis, there's Holliday,
27:00 there's White.
27:01 These guys are serious contributors now
27:03 where it's not clear cut that Jalen Brown
27:06 is your number two guy every single time he's out
27:08 in the court. - Yeah, no, it's not.
27:09 No, no.
27:10 - And that might be difficult for him to adjust to.
27:13 - It's Tatum and the fearsome foursome.
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28:39 - What did you think of the Kansas?
28:43 - Yeah.
28:44 - I wanna change gears to football.
28:45 What did you think of Kansas City
28:48 and at the end of the game, we saw the call.
28:53 The receiver was definitely offsides,
28:56 but I was really surprised
28:57 and the officials had to call it in my opinion.
29:00 It was a great play.
29:02 Oh my God, what a great, it would have been phenomenal.
29:05 - Great, well, classic type of hook and liner type idea.
29:09 - I mean, Kelsey flips it back.
29:11 The guy scores, the same kid that was offline,
29:14 same guy that was, what's his name again?
29:15 I forgot his name.
29:16 - Tony.
29:17 - Tony.
29:18 - Tony.
29:19 - Thank you, Jimmy.
29:20 And he's a good player, but-
29:23 - He actually sucks, Gary.
29:24 He's not even a good player.
29:25 - All right, I'm being kind.
29:26 - Tony sucks.
29:27 - He drops the ball a lot.
29:29 - He's a bum.
29:31 Yeah, he was a bum in New York
29:32 and now he's a bum in Kansas City
29:33 and he's got Mahomes doing it to him.
29:34 Sorry, continue though.
29:36 - But anyways, Mahomes was,
29:39 I mean, even after the game, he was blaming the refs.
29:41 The refs had no choice but to call it.
29:44 - I have to say this.
29:46 It was one of the most embarrassing things
29:49 I've ever seen a professional athlete do
29:51 is what Patrick Mahomes did after that game.
29:54 Your guy lined up offsides.
29:58 It's not even a judgment call.
29:59 It's not even like, if it was like a bad pass
30:01 and interference call,
30:04 or if they called offensive pass interference or something,
30:06 fine, I understand you'd be upset if maybe it wasn't.
30:11 This guy lined up offsides.
30:13 They threw the flag before.
30:15 It wasn't like he threw the flag
30:18 after Tony scored a touchdown.
30:21 They threw the flag and then the play happened.
30:22 What's he supposed to do?
30:24 No in advance.
30:24 Oh, this really good play is about to happen.
30:26 Let me let this one slide here.
30:29 - Oh, Jimmy, yeah, it was so bad.
30:30 - I can't figure out what, I mean, listen,
30:32 Mahomes must be, he was extremely emotional in the moment.
30:36 He let it get the best of him,
30:37 but the only word that comes to mind is embarrassing.
30:40 I mean, acting like the Chiefs don't get,
30:43 don't get away with calls or don't get calls.
30:45 Didn't the Super Bowl,
30:46 didn't the Super Bowl end on a penalty last year, Gary?
30:50 So, and the Chiefs won because of it.
30:52 So I think Patrick Mahomes needs to take a step back,
30:54 take a deep breath,
30:56 maybe not cry to the opposing team's quarterback
31:00 at the 50 yard line after the game,
31:02 like he did with to Josh Allen.
31:04 And it was just embarrassing.
31:06 The player lined up offsides.
31:07 It's against the rules.
31:09 If you're the referee there,
31:12 if you didn't call it, then what?
31:14 Do you get flack from the bills
31:15 because they specifically didn't call
31:18 and lining up offsides?
31:21 So it was unbelievable that, it was embarrassing.
31:25 And I will leave with this.
31:27 There were people years, a couple of years back
31:29 saying that Tom Brady better watch out.
31:31 Patrick Mahomes is gonna be hot on his trail.
31:34 To me, not even close, not even close.
31:38 I don't think I'll ever have to have that debate.
31:40 I don't think Mahomes is gonna finish
31:42 in front of me or Brady.
31:42 - I don't think so either.
31:43 - Brady would never, Brady would never,
31:45 you can say all you want about Brady
31:47 and yeah, he complains here and there,
31:48 but never would have done something like that after.
31:52 - No, he never would have done something like that after.
31:54 And you wonder if Brady would have done more
31:57 with this Kansas City team
31:59 because what you're seeing now with Mahomes is-
32:01 - Yeah, they-
32:03 - Their receivers aren't as good as they once were, right?
32:05 They let some guys go.
32:06 People are feeling they hung them out to dry.
32:08 Tom Brady had, I would say,
32:13 two seasons with Pro Bowl receivers,
32:17 two seasons, right?
32:18 That was Randy Moss.
32:20 - Yeah, they didn't even win.
32:21 - Walker, like '07, '08, '09 type thing.
32:24 And then Gronk came in, but they won three Super Bowls.
32:27 - Gronk and Edelman.
32:28 - They won three Super Bowls in '01, '03, and '04
32:32 with a bunch of, Troy Brown's the only guy, right?
32:34 I mean, David Patten, God love him.
32:36 - Yeah, Patten, Brown, Gibbons.
32:39 - They were, I mean, and you know, great guys.
32:41 - Caldwell, yeah.
32:44 Rashe Caldwell.
32:45 - Oh yeah, I mean, oh geez.
32:47 They were, I mean, you know, those, you know, like-
32:50 - Well, they had the third down back that they used.
32:53 So they had Falk, then they had, you know,
32:54 they would use that third down back.
32:56 And Brady was able to just,
32:58 Brady was able to utilize what he was given, right?
33:01 I mean, he was-
33:01 - Absolutely.
33:02 - Nobody's better in the game.
33:04 And we always said, as long as Manning was on the Colts
33:07 and Brady was on the Patriots, we always said,
33:09 oh, if only Brady had those weapons.
33:10 We said that every single year.
33:11 - Oh yeah.
33:12 - That Manning had, you know,
33:13 10 times the weapons that Brady had.
33:15 And then finally, Brady got his weapons
33:16 later on in his career.
33:17 And he won four more Super Bowls
33:20 because of it, three in the Pats,
33:21 and another one in Tampa Bay
33:23 because he had guys who threw the ball too.
33:25 But yeah, the Chiefs,
33:26 I mean, Holmes has not had a good year at all.
33:28 And really the NFL, it's been a dismal season
33:31 of quarterback play across the NFL.
33:34 Injuries or not, it's been one of the worst,
33:38 in the history of me watching this game,
33:40 I can't think of a worse season of quarterback play,
33:44 of just football play, Gary.
33:47 - In the era of Jimmy Toscano.
33:49 - Yeah, yeah.
33:50 When they break up the NFL.
33:53 - In the history of me watching this game,
33:56 no one is more important than me, Jimmy Toscano.
34:01 - You know how they do like AD and BC,
34:03 it'll be like BJT, so like before Jimmy Toscano.
34:07 - Oh, you're killing me.
34:09 - No, it's just been bad.
34:10 And Mahomes should be,
34:11 I think he's probably ashamed of himself today.
34:13 - It's embarrassing.
34:14 It really was embarrassing
34:15 because the penalty was egregious, they had to call it.
34:18 - Yeah, they had to call it, sour grapes.
34:20 - Okay.
34:21 Oh, so the Patriots are officially eliminated.
34:24 - Officially?
34:26 Unofficially eliminated.
34:29 - I mean, he's gone.
34:29 I mean, Bill's not gonna be-
34:30 - You think he's gone?
34:32 - Oh, I think he's gone.
34:33 And I think, well, we said this last week,
34:34 but I think his play is,
34:36 well, Robert, you let me pick the quarterback now
34:40 and I'll fix it.
34:41 We went with your guy and we sucked.
34:44 - Yeah.
34:45 - So we're gonna go, I'm gonna pick the quarterback
34:47 and then we'll see how we do.
34:49 And if I'm wrong, I'm like, nope, see you later.
34:52 It's time.
34:54 - It's such a tough, yeah, it's such a tough situation.
34:57 - Top to bottom.
34:59 - I think it's Ben time.
35:01 I only said he doesn't deserve to get canned mid-season.
35:05 - Oh God.
35:06 - But he should not, but there are some people I,
35:08 I mean, I think Giardi said he thinks he should be
35:10 or he thinks he will be.
35:11 I just disagreed with that, but I love Giardi,
35:13 but I just disagreed with that.
35:14 But I think that when the season ends, they'll meet.
35:19 And I just don't know.
35:24 What direction are they trying to go in?
35:25 You know, they've got to blow the whole thing up.
35:28 I don't even know why he would want to continue coaching
35:31 'cause they're not gonna be good.
35:33 I know they have some money to spend
35:35 and maybe something will change
35:37 and they'll actually spend it on the right players.
35:38 I don't know, but I feel like it is time.
35:42 I do feel that.
35:43 And I've felt that way for a couple of years now.
35:44 I've actually been anti-Bill ever since
35:48 they forced Brady out of town, him and Kraft, essentially.
35:51 I've been anti-Bill.
35:52 I just thought that he was losing at that moment
35:55 because again, not to go too far down the rabbit hole here,
35:58 but there was no plan B for life after Tom Brady.
36:01 So why are you kicking him out the door?
36:03 Right?
36:04 And they still don't have a plan B.
36:05 And now we've gotten to rock bottom.
36:08 Every week it seems like it might be rock bottom,
36:10 but I feel like we're actually there.
36:12 And it's time.
36:15 It's definitely time.
36:16 That's where I'm at with it.
36:18 - Here's the holiday season.
36:19 Give me your favorite holiday movie.
36:24 - It's easy for me.
36:25 It's "Home Alone 2."
36:26 - Two?
36:27 - It's "Home Alone 2 Lost in New York."
36:30 Two to me is more Christmasy than one.
36:33 I love New York at Christmas time.
36:37 I think it really embodies the spirit of Christmas in two.
36:40 I also think like the mischief
36:42 that Kevin McAllister gets into
36:45 is a lot crazier than it is in one.
36:47 And I think the sticky bandits,
36:51 as they're known in the second one,
36:54 I think that the hits that they take are a lot more brutal.
36:59 I like the message with the homeless pigeon lady.
37:03 I like that.
37:04 And I just think "Home Alone 2,"
37:06 you can't go wrong with one or two.
37:07 I mean, if they're on TV, I'm watching either one of them,
37:10 but for me, it's "Home Alone 2" always has been,
37:12 probably always will be.
37:13 There's been a few that's come along that have been good,
37:15 but to me, it's the nostalgia of it all.
37:19 It'll always be "Home Alone 2" for me.
37:23 - Elf, Elf is up there.
37:24 So Elf is up there.
37:25 Elf is your number one, huh?
37:26 - Elf is my number one.
37:27 - So what was it before Elf?
37:28 'Cause that's a somewhat newer,
37:30 we're talking like the last decade or so.
37:32 - You know, that's a good question.
37:34 Before Elf, was the Santa Claus with Tim Allen before Elf?
37:39 - Oh yeah, that was way before, yeah.
37:40 - That was on the other night,
37:42 and I had to watch it, the Santa Claus.
37:44 - Santa Claus is a good one.
37:45 - Yeah, that was pretty good.
37:47 And that was pretty good.
37:47 - I didn't know if you were like a,
37:49 it's a wonderful life type of guy or something.
37:51 - It was okay.
37:52 - You know, I mean, but then it was always the peanuts,
37:54 you know, the 30 minute special.
37:56 - Yeah, yeah.
37:57 Are you a Christmas, what's the one,
38:00 a Christmas story?
38:01 Are you pro Christmas story movie?
38:03 - It's okay.
38:04 - I think that's, I think it's fine.
38:07 - It's just blown out of proportion.
38:09 We didn't like about it.
38:10 - It doesn't need to be,
38:11 one of the stations plays it all day on Christmas,
38:15 all day on repeat.
38:17 I just feel like the program coordinator is just like,
38:20 "Yeah, I'm gonna take the day off every Christmas."
38:22 Yeah, I feel like there's a couple other Christmas movies
38:25 you could mix in there.
38:26 And I like Christmas Vacation too.
38:28 - Do you like, yeah, I'm not as,
38:30 my wife loves Chevy Chase.
38:32 She thinks that he's, I'm not as, he's okay to me.
38:36 I'm, yeah, he's all right.
38:37 - He's fine.
38:37 Yeah, but back in the day, I mean, that's a good one,
38:40 but I watch it, I can watch it once.
38:42 It's not something that I'm,
38:44 like Home Alone 2, I could watch like five times
38:46 every Christmas.
38:47 - What about, you know, David Harbour of Stranger Things?
38:51 - Not really.
38:53 - You don't watch Stranger Things?
38:54 - I've seen it.
38:56 - He plays the sheriff on Stranger Things.
38:58 - Oh, okay, I know, I know, I can envision it, yeah.
39:01 - He's in this crazy Christmas movie
39:04 that I think is still streaming.
39:05 It's called A Violent Night.
39:07 - Oh, is it like a horror movie?
39:09 - No, it's over the top, shoot 'em up, bad guy stuff.
39:14 - Okay.
39:16 - It's over, I mean, it's like, okay.
39:20 - Is it Christmassy?
39:22 Is it, it's like a, are we gonna have a diehard situation
39:25 here?
39:26 - Diehard, but Santa Claus is Bruce Willis.
39:29 - Okay.
39:31 - The real Santa Claus.
39:33 - Okay.
39:34 - Harbour plays the real Santa Claus, right?
39:36 - Okay.
39:37 - So this wealthy family, right, lives in this mansion.
39:40 They have security guards all over the place
39:43 and they've got whatever, $20 million in gold bars
39:46 in the safe, right, under the house, you know.
39:49 - Typical, yeah, that's about what I've got.
39:51 - My neighbors got the same thing.
39:52 - Yeah.
39:53 - John Leguizamo, who I love.
39:55 - Oh, I love him, I do know him.
39:56 - John Leguizamo's great.
39:58 He plays the villain, where he and his boys come in,
40:03 they take the family hostage and they want the money.
40:08 While they're doing this, as David Harbour's Santa Claus
40:12 comes down the chimney, right?
40:15 - Mm-hmm.
40:16 - Through a cell phone, he talks to the little girl
40:20 who's being held hostage and she's like,
40:22 "Santa, will you help me?"
40:23 - Spoilers.
40:24 - And all of a sudden, Harbour starts kicking butt.
40:29 I mean, there's one scene where Santa craps on Uzi
40:37 and starts blowing away the bad guys
40:39 and he gets one of the bad guys out in the front yard
40:44 and as Santa Claus wraps the dude up in lights
40:49 and sticks dynamite in the court.
40:54 - What?
40:55 So this is not a kid's movie?
40:57 We're not watching this for the kids.
40:58 - No, no, no, no, this is not a kid's movie.
41:00 - Let's make it clear for anyone.
41:01 - No, no, this is not a kid's movie.
41:03 - I'm listening or watching.
41:04 - And as he walks away, he's like,
41:06 "Ho, ho, ho, you've been naughty.
41:07 "Merry Christmas."
41:08 And the guy goes, "I mean, it's so over the top though."
41:11 You know what I mean?
41:12 It's just, it's crazy.
41:15 - I'm always looking for a new Christmas movie.
41:17 So I might defy that one.
41:18 - Yeah, I would call it my favorite,
41:19 but I was like, "Oh my God."
41:20 - It's unique.
41:21 - This is out of control.
41:24 - Yeah, then you've got a...
41:26 - Like, do you ever see "Gross Point Blank"?
41:28 - No.
41:30 - Another great movie with John Cusack.
41:32 - You're gonna find that a lot of movies,
41:34 I play this game with my friends a lot.
41:36 You're gonna find that I've not seen a lot of movies.
41:38 - "Gross Point Blank" is a great movie,
41:40 but again, it's over the top.
41:41 The violence is so over the top.
41:43 It's almost, it's like an over the top.
41:45 - Comical.
41:46 - Yeah, yeah.
41:47 - You know, it's like so over the top.
41:48 - You don't have to take it so seriously.
41:50 - It's not, yeah.
41:51 You know, 'cause that's the thing when I...
41:52 - It's not like "What Lies Beneath" or something,
41:54 where you're like...
41:55 - Santa Claus, you know, with an Uzi.
41:57 I'm like, "What's going on here?"
41:59 (laughing)
42:01 All right, Jimmy.
42:02 Well, thank you for filling in for the great Bob Ryan.
42:05 - This was fun.
42:06 I mean, I'll try my best.
42:07 I'm no Bob Ryan, but would love to fill in again.
42:11 - Yeah, I'd love to.
42:12 - If I get the call.
42:14 - Jimmy has been brought to you by FanDuel.
42:16 Bob Ryan, Gary Tangler Show with Jimmy Discanto.
42:18 Sponsored by Jimmy.
42:19 - Yeah.
42:19 - The exclusive partner of the CLNS Media Networks.
42:23 Scored the centerfield season with FanDuel,
42:25 America's number one sports book.
42:27 Right now, new customers get $150 in bonus bets
42:29 with any winning $5 Moneyline bet.
42:32 Jimmy, have a nice holiday.
42:33 It's been great, dude.
42:34 - It's been awesome, Gary.
42:36 Happy holidays to you as well.
42:37 And I hope to do this again with you sometime.
42:40 (upbeat music)
42:42 (upbeat music)
42:45 (upbeat music)
42:47 (upbeat music)
42:50 (upbeat music)
42:53 (upbeat music)

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