Anomaly or Reality Check? | Celtics Finally Lose a Game | First to the Floor
Everything was looking great for the Boston Celtics with 9 minutes remaining in the Cavs game until they decided to mentally board the plane to Denver and allow Dean Wade to end their massive win-streak. Is this the fatal flaw we've been nit-picking for, or is this an understandable blip for a team with loftier priorities? Come and hang out while we break down the loss to the Cavs, and look ahead to one of the most important games in the regular season against the Denver Nuggets.
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Check out this week's underrated plays vid: https://youtu.be/lpHwfG_7AtM
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Transcript
00:00 [Music]
00:19 Wayne Spooney here for First to the Floor with my guy, I believe last time I was hosting,
00:24 I just said my Jake Eisenberg.
00:26 Yeah.
00:27 He's my guy, Jake Eisenberg.
00:28 What up, Jake?
00:29 How are you?
00:30 I'm very happy to be whatever you want, you know?
00:33 I'm a versatile podcast host.
00:36 That's right.
00:37 You're taken by one man, though.
00:39 We all know who that is.
00:40 This is true.
00:41 This is true.
00:42 One mistress is enough for me, I think.
00:43 But yeah, man, I'm good.
00:44 I'm good.
00:45 How are you doing?
00:46 You're recovering from now 13th loss of the season as we're more than 60 games in at this
00:51 point, I think.
00:52 It's stupid, but it pissed me off more than it probably should have.
00:56 Of course.
00:57 But yeah, they're not allowed to lose.
00:59 It's absurd.
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02:01 Yeah, to give Jake and Ben.
02:03 And hopefully bring to Vegas.
02:05 I know.
02:06 Yeah, you guys seriously will need to text me.
02:08 I'll have to tell my wife so she reminds me.
02:10 And everybody else that's listening.
02:12 Please remind Spoonie.
02:14 Yeah.
02:15 Our last show before we leave.
02:16 Please drop it in the chat.
02:17 I beg you.
02:18 And if you like our show, check out Celtics lab.
02:22 Jake was just on there.
02:23 I think last week he did a great job.
02:25 Talked about how the mid range game is like trench warfare.
02:28 So it was the highlight of the show for me, maybe of the year.
02:32 So check them out.
02:33 But OK, Jake, one oh five one oh four stupid loss up 22 in the fourth quarter.
02:38 You guys talked about it on the on the postgame show on late night.
02:42 So we're going to try and take a little different angle and then we're going to get to a Denver
02:46 Nuggets preview as well about halfway through.
02:48 But does the sting of the loss feel any different today?
02:52 Yeah, feel feeling better.
02:54 It is like, you know, Eric Weiss right here to postgame shows.
02:58 Question mark, exclamation point, question mark.
03:00 You're damn right, dude.
03:02 And that's and that's what you're getting on this channel is content for days.
03:06 And but like there is there is value, I think, in doing the immediate reaction, which is
03:10 obviously going to be raw and emotional, especially post a game like that post the Warriors game
03:16 that we were all on for late night.
03:18 Very different vibes between the two.
03:21 But you have have a time, have time to go back, rewatch the fourth quarter for you guys,
03:26 because that's what we do, even though it was a painful experience to watch Dean White
03:31 eviscerating my soul once again.
03:34 But it is good to get a little bit different perspective.
03:37 Spooner, I think I have a theory on why everybody freaks out, including including us.
03:43 Like I try to temper it a little bit, you know, to try and be calm, objective, reasonable
03:49 after losses, definitely not wins.
03:51 That's not something I do very, very well.
03:53 But after losses, but there are very few teams in NBA history that have been as good and
04:00 have won as much as this like Jays era Boston Celtics without winning a title.
04:05 It's like if we had won the 2022 finals and we have this team right now, like I just think
04:11 that the consternation, the concern trolling, the PTSD would be far less every time if we
04:20 had just had the title in hand.
04:22 Like what is what is we've just been beaten down by the success that ends in heartbreak
04:27 year in year out, I think at this point.
04:30 Dude, you know what proves that theory 100% right is Giannis and the Bucks.
04:34 Look at the Bucks playoff performances other than the title year.
04:38 Have they even made an Eastern Conference finals with Giannis?
04:41 I don't think they have.
04:42 I don't think so.
04:43 It was second round in the Raptors.
04:45 They beat us in the second round with Kyrie.
04:49 That's right.
04:50 And then they lost in the Eastern Conference finals to the Raptors.
04:52 So that's right.
04:53 Okay.
04:54 So one Eastern Conference finals in a title and then every other year it's like, well,
04:57 they'll be fine.
04:58 It's the Bucks.
04:59 The Bucks are going to be fine.
05:00 They've lost in the first round is the one seed twice in the past four years.
05:04 Like, can you imagine if that was the Celtics dude?
05:07 Like that would we would be slander for days because they got that one title.
05:11 Yeah, it's like it's the Bucks man.
05:13 They're going to be fine in the playoffs.
05:15 So I yeah, I think you're spot on with that.
05:17 And I think it's also like Boston fans.
05:21 Listen to local Boston Sports Radio.
05:24 You are insulated from this Jake, but one of my best friends listens to our show
05:29 and local Boston Sports and he literally texted me.
05:32 He was like, it is like two different things happen after everything to them and listen
05:38 to you guys like their takeaway about the Warriors game was it means nothing because
05:42 the Warriors were checked out in who cares.
05:45 But if they had lost I guarantee that would have been the biggest thing ever.
05:49 So like there is this sort of there's like this Diaspora in Boston that is just like
05:56 fed by these radio shows.
05:57 That's just so negative about everything Celtics and it Brady wasn't.
06:01 Insulated like Brady had four rings and they're like he's done like fuck this guy.
06:06 He's you know, they're five and two like this team sucks, you know, so like this is
06:10 part of like culturally for some reason.
06:12 It's cold in the winter dude, like people just get what else we're going to do.
06:15 Dude. Yeah, they just want to yell at shit.
06:17 But no, I think you're spot on like well, at least for me personally once they get the
06:22 title is gravy dude.
06:24 I'm not going to call no question like I'm going to follow but like these losses are
06:28 going to roll off my back.
06:29 But last night I was like this shouldn't matter but I was steward internally.
06:34 Of course, we need one so bad did we need it?
06:37 We need one.
06:38 All I want is one in the Tatum era.
06:40 Look at Pierce like immortalized that's and that's how it works.
06:44 Unfortunately, the reality of sports is like you need the one and every every TNT show.
06:52 I think Shaq squeezes in four to five digs at Charles and just says any any minor disagreement.
06:59 He goes I got I got I got three rigs big dog.
07:02 So it's just like and it's terrible but we just need the one and all of this all this
07:10 will be over Colin cowherd.
07:12 Oh, I commit so every every loss every loss is a referendum on not not really the Celtics
07:18 but it's really a referendum on Tatum's career.
07:20 It's just like every single loss is referendum on who he is as a player and what he can and
07:26 can't be for the rest of his life.
07:28 And it's just we got it.
07:29 We got to go through it.
07:30 We got to defend their honor.
07:31 That's why we're here and let's get to it.
07:34 I guess that's basically what this show is exists for to defend the honor, but I just
07:40 the double standards piss me off because Embiid's never had a playoff run like Tatum has had
07:45 multiple of and you like he can lose a game and suck and everyone's like, well, he's going
07:50 to be the MVP or doesn't anyway, but I don't want to get down that rabbit hole because
07:54 we can all day.
07:55 Yeah, it's all day.
07:57 So let's I want to take kind of let's take a long term view of what we saw in that game
08:02 because I think the biggest thing that I didn't put in the run sheet.
08:05 So I'm just shooting from the hip here.
08:08 I thought the way the Cavs played defense was really interesting.
08:13 Although I will say Zach Zarba every fucking game he refs.
08:17 It looks the same.
08:18 They call these ticky tacky bullshit fouls on screens and stuff like that or on the perimeter
08:24 and then you get hammered going to the paint and nothing gets called.
08:27 It just doesn't make any sense to me.
08:29 Every time he refs.
08:30 It's like these ugly mucked up games, but they were in this like weird zone matchup
08:36 style defense where they were sending like super help from the corners, but they were
08:41 doing it in a way where it was like lifted up kind of so it cuts off that passing angle
08:47 from like the top of the key and they were like the help was crazy on some of these but
08:53 it's almost like Tatum and the ball handlers couldn't really see the past because of where
08:57 the corner help was like located in it and it worked really really well.
09:02 Some of that was the refereeing I think but did you notice anything like how they defended
09:08 because like they don't have a ton of great defenders and we like kind of had trouble
09:12 picking on Garland at times.
09:14 Yeah, it felt like we were we weren't able to get to the matchups we wanted consistently
09:18 and when we did it was late in the shot clock and then you're absolutely right like they
09:23 when when Tatum was getting downhill.
09:25 He wasn't able to get a call and he just wasn't able to finish and then like Nyang.
09:30 I mean the one possession that Pauls Ingus finished like they able to get to it.
09:35 Weirdly he's like built to kind of defend Pauls Ingus in a way because like of how thick
09:40 he is but he failed Pauls Ingus like five times and he still finished it.
09:45 Yeah, I thought that something did have trouble with that but then at the same time like you
09:51 go back to really the first three and a half quarters, which I didn't think they played
09:54 well all game but there were possessions at a time like every second or third possession
10:00 they'd be like they would they would lock in and the process would be really good.
10:03 They would solve it and then find a wide open guy or find a cutter and it's like, okay when
10:08 when they're like really focused and then it would be like they'd build up a 12-point
10:12 lead and then they'd go back to like lazy focus and like and like the play that sticks
10:18 out.
10:19 I'm sorry to do this to Drew.
10:20 I feel like he's he's just always so memorable though.
10:23 Like he was in he saw the like the cross-court pass a bit late.
10:28 He also like missed through it but it hit a Coro in the back.
10:31 It's just like like that's that's more of a like a focus execution thing as opposed
10:36 to like not being able to solve the defense type problem because the pass was there if
10:40 it was accurate, but it was like and the defense didn't even read it properly.
10:44 He just hit him in the back, which is hilarious.
10:46 It's like seemingly impossible.
10:48 I don't know if I've ever seen that before an NBA game, but yeah, it wasn't just Drew.
10:52 I think I remember Derek had a cross-court pass that got picked off Tatum had one or
10:56 two and I think Jalen had one as well.
10:58 So I wonder if the way to attack that is to attack it more like it's a zone and less like
11:04 it's man-to-man even though it kind of looks like man and just put Tatum in the high post
11:08 or have Tatum set in the screen.
11:10 He was on ball like a ton kind of maybe too much for my taste and and we didn't get go
11:17 ahead.
11:18 Go ahead.
11:19 Please.
11:20 Oh, I feel like Derek struggled on the ball to that and like I know he's been like the
11:23 KP Derek White like I do think the KP Derek White pick and roll action or pick and pop
11:29 what it basically Derek White posing is anything should be like the crunch time thing and Derek
11:35 White like late.
11:36 He he had gone on the switch and he attacked him and he just all he like was going to his
11:41 wonky floater thing, but he just like lost his balance and bricked it and that and so
11:45 like he also struggled on the ball to and I don't know my my broader thing is like they
11:52 they checked out up 22 with 9 minutes and then they couldn't quite regain the rope again.
11:58 Yeah, and they they got that 22 point lead by defending really well and turning the Cavs
12:05 over and getting out in transition.
12:06 And I thought the pace was really good offensively from like the second half of the third quarter
12:13 until they got to 22.
12:14 Yeah, and then they just like let the shooting like take them out of the game.
12:18 Let the refs take them out of the game and all of a sudden it's walking it up the floor
12:22 again.
12:23 And we know that doesn't work.
12:24 It never works and we talked about pace all season last year.
12:28 It's not been a problem this year.
12:30 I think we talked recently about how good we think the pace has been recently and it
12:35 just was like I guess the frustrating thing is like all the stuff, you know, people hammer
12:40 the Celtics for exactly came to fruition right and that's that's what makes this one so
12:45 frustrating.
12:46 Yeah, and what's extra frustrating is like it had that hasn't been the case all year
12:51 really like writing like even in some of the close losses like the Nuggets game the Thunder
12:55 game the Warriors game.
12:56 I like you didn't think it was as bad.
12:59 Maybe that's just recency bias in my brain, but I definitely don't think it was the case
13:02 in the Nuggets game.
13:03 I don't know where we will just jump around.
13:06 This is classic Ben's not here.
13:08 We're just let us fly in a little bit of the place but like so last possession, right?
13:12 We're down one.
13:14 I'll actually I'll answer your question about the defense the transition defense was abominable
13:20 in the fourth quarter like Dean Wade got hot obviously, but and it was like insane like
13:26 he hit six reason the game he had hit six made threes over like his last five games
13:30 or something like that and the transition defense they just kept losing him.
13:36 They were there was no there was no defense there like once he got hot like there was
13:40 like a hand coming late he like pausing his last Yang in the corner like like no one had
13:46 me in the corner because pausing this was taking Jared Allen, but kneeing was wide open
13:50 in the corner because I didn't get matched up on the other end posing his late close
13:54 out and me and hits it like there was a combination of like they couldn't miss like they were
13:58 they shot 72% from three in the fourth quarter while the sub is for over eight.
14:03 We'd like yeah, it's like you don't lose games like this when you're up 22 with nine minutes
14:07 to go unless like you get a perfect storm and that's and that's what happened.
14:11 But like the transition defense I thought going back and watching the fourth quarter
14:14 today was easily the number one issue like the offense actually there was it was not
14:19 perfect at all.
14:20 But like what the process was was mostly fine like they're going to go better than actually
14:26 what was the final box score there yet in the fourth quarter over eight from three,
14:32 but there we are eight for 26 30% from the field in the fourth quarter and worse.
14:36 From obviously nine minutes on there.
14:39 Yeah, but yet the offense wasn't that bad.
14:42 No, I yeah, I think the offense felt slow.
14:47 Maybe is that that was kind of my concern with it was like but the result or not the
14:52 result, but the shots they actually ended up generating weren't that bad like KP got
14:57 a pretty deep right wide open three that he usually hits, you know, he got into the post
15:02 a couple times and that seemed to work and probably should have got fouled Tatum missed
15:06 like a little 10 foot little fall away bunny that like what's that missed?
15:11 I know.
15:12 Yeah, because he does think like I like the Tatum one I went back and I watched it.
15:16 It's like Tatum.
15:17 He missed a layup over like Nyang and I forget who the other thing we maybe was a Coro and
15:22 Nyang.
15:23 There's no room protector.
15:24 He's been so good at the rim.
15:25 This is that 10 foot shot.
15:26 It was just a catch and shoot three off Derek white penetration over Garland in and out
15:32 and he also has a great drive and kick to Al in the corner who like drops it and then
15:38 has to shoot it and that and he misses it's like it wasn't as bad as it felt but you're
15:44 right about the pace like all those shots came like under 10 seconds on the shot clock.
15:50 Right?
15:51 Yeah, and that's the problem.
15:52 But also that's like the nature of basketball, right?
15:54 The other teams absurdly hot.
15:56 So you're taking the ball out of the net.
15:57 So that slows you down when you don't get stopped so you don't turn them over.
16:00 So I mean it all just built on themselves and yeah, you're right 22 point fourth quarter
16:04 lead with eight and a half minutes left and you lose like shits gonna go really wrong
16:09 really quickly.
16:10 So one thing so I want to know I've seen some people blaming Joe.
16:14 I think the biggest thing I didn't love about Joe's game plan was Cornette being in while
16:21 we were getting shredded in transition and semi transition in that fourth quarter.
16:25 He had a lot of those like half.
16:27 Okay contests that Dean Wade hit.
16:30 I think he had contested three of Dean Wade's threes that went in.
16:33 So like clearly it wasn't working and they're clearly pushing the pace big time like that
16:38 is just not Luke's time.
16:39 Like you got to take him out real quick there, even though he was solid.
16:44 Otherwise, I thought and he's been great recently.
16:47 He was awesome in the in the Golden State game too.
16:50 But like once a game gets like that hectic in a team is attacking.
16:54 They were really small.
16:55 I don't even think Jared Allen was out there then so I just didn't feel like the place
17:00 for Luke in my opinion.
17:01 I know till I think Tillman I guess was out or apparently it feels like it must he must
17:06 have been out.
17:07 It was very unclear, but I don't think he was active.
17:09 Yeah, so I wonder if that's like you pull something crazy out of bag like look, hey,
17:14 we're on you know, a 14-0 run.
17:16 I think it was at one point, but we still had a 10-point lead.
17:19 It's like let's go Tatum at the five.
17:21 Let's match their side.
17:22 O'Shea.
17:23 Yeah, or yeah, or O'Shea at the five like we're way more skilled one through five positions.
17:28 Let's just do what they're doing and beat him with our talent and that didn't happen.
17:33 But otherwise like people are killing Joe for not taking timeouts.
17:36 He did take a timeout when it got to six.
17:38 It didn't fucking matter.
17:39 I'm so I'm so that timeouts don't do anything.
17:44 This is what happened like the corner like you're right and I think like yeah, we're
17:49 talking about this game, but like we're trying to find things like like does this matter?
17:54 What can we do big picture?
17:56 It's not something I think we have to worry about really in a game that matters like Joe
18:02 tried to buy rest.
18:04 He was like I get the things are maybe we're not guarding right now, but we're going to
18:08 score twice.
18:09 We need to score twice in the next six minutes and we're going to win the game.
18:13 We kind of kind of we actually only scored.
18:15 I mean we've more than there is three times but like there was a 34 to 6 run right like
18:20 he was like we can survive like a pretty cataclysmic to like bad offensive performance, but we like
18:28 whatever the 99.9 percentile bad performance.
18:31 We can't survive that and that's what happened.
18:33 So that's why I Cornett stayed out there and that's why the starters didn't come back in
18:37 until five minutes when they usually come back two minutes beforehand.
18:40 So it's like I don't think that's something we have to worry about really in big games
18:45 in the playoffs.
18:46 And so from that perspective, I agree, but I think everybody was on the same page Joe
18:51 Cavs.
18:52 I saw a lot of I saw some doomer.
18:54 I thought so the Cavs like reporters being like mama this sucks.
18:59 We lost again.
19:00 We're going to we're going to wait.
19:02 Are we going to fall to the fourth seed?
19:04 No, you're not.
19:06 You're welcome.
19:07 Yeah, it's a Josh Cronin in the chat.
19:10 Do you think anyone in the locker room is telling Tatum?
19:12 That's a bad final shot.
19:14 I actually don't think it was a bad final shot.
19:17 Honestly, it wasn't a great shot.
19:19 No, he missed.
19:20 I think it was Derek set like a ghost screen to get the switch to Garland on to him and
19:24 Derek was wide open for like a heartbeat and he's got to hit that pass.
19:29 But I thought the problem was he just went to slow.
19:32 Yes, Craig had we had he got that matchup and then immediately went there's enough time
19:37 for KP to get the rebound because he was there to get the rebound.
19:40 So I truly like on a last possession.
19:43 The big thing you don't want to do is turn the ball over and that's why you see all these
19:48 like shitty isolation possessions because that's the most low turnover possession in
19:52 the game and he gets like a mid-range jumper that almost went it like kicked up and hung
19:57 on the front of the rim a little bit.
19:59 So it I don't think it was a great shot, but I also like it's a decent look for your best
20:04 player in the mid-range.
20:05 It's not like a heave three RJ Barrett style to win the game that he actually made.
20:11 If they had it what I didn't hate it.
20:14 I like I guess like if he had if they had inbounded the ball with seven seconds left
20:20 and that's the shot they got then whatever but they inbounded the ball that as you said
20:24 it was just too slow dude and this is this might be 10 as big as weakness as far as like
20:29 the crunch time thing goes and specifically like the last possession stuff.
20:34 It's like you're down one and I like when I went back and watched it.
20:39 I had the the scale and Drew Carter broadcast when I watched it live.
20:43 I had the TNT broadcast and scales screaming you're going to slow you want to extend the
20:48 game as much as you can when you're down one because chances are you're probably not going
20:52 to score like you're if it's good to call your you're shooting 39% from three on the
20:58 season or 38.
20:59 That's a 38% chance of getting a shot or whatever 48% from the field.
21:05 So chances are you're probably going to miss you want to give yourself time to get an offensive
21:08 rebound or foul and then hope that they miss one or they make both of you still have another
21:13 chance to go to overtime.
21:14 You didn't leave yourself any chance to have another possession and that's the biggest
21:19 issue and that's happened game for against Philly.
21:24 That was like the fame like Marcus Smart made the shot, but it was like point four seconds
21:28 too late because they went too slow again.
21:30 I do think at this point the default for Joe.
21:35 Like I know he tried to call a timeout with five seconds left, which I'm happy that he
21:38 tried but you get just once he starts walking the ball up and it's obvious and like Joe
21:44 is like Joe's trying to like direct traffic and call the play and shows Tatum to if you
21:50 have to do that and organize just call a timeout then like if you're trying to draw up the
21:55 play just call a timeout.
21:56 You've got two left.
21:57 I just think that should be the default at this point like unless unless there's a matchup
22:02 you've been unless you've been scoring consistently over the last like four or five minutes then
22:06 fine.
22:07 You know what to go to that's been working but you haven't and so in that context and
22:11 I think Joe will learn from that and pray to God because I just think draw something
22:14 up.
22:15 He's like leading the league in 80 points per possessions.
22:17 Just fucking to call timeout draw it up.
22:20 Yeah, and I think people have got mad at him for not calling a timeout in the Minnesota
22:25 game where Jalen got that like bad three off which but when there's four seconds or five
22:30 seconds left and you're pulling the pulling a rebound down.
22:34 I'm okay with not calling the timeout because you take away the randomness of getting the
22:39 ball inbounds and not knowing where you're going to be in like if you got to inbound
22:44 it in the backcourt.
22:45 Well, you just wasted two seconds that you would have had and you're in the exact same
22:49 position except now the defense is set where they weren't set when you were getting the
22:53 rebound.
22:54 But yeah, I think it was like 18 seconds left or something like that when we had the ball
22:58 that you should probably be calling a timeout and I'm sure he had to so if we couldn't inbound
23:03 it probably could have blown another one and then tried to inbound it again and you can
23:07 just throw that back into the backcourt and that's fine.
23:09 You got plenty of time to get into your set there.
23:12 So yeah, that was I this was not Joe's finest moment.
23:16 I'll say that but certainly not his fault.
23:18 This was a trap game.
23:20 It was a trap game and they fell and then they went up big and Bill I don't know maybe
23:25 we can I don't know we need to stay on this too much longer but like do you do my whole
23:30 thing starting the pod yesterday was like what was more valuable winning that game by
23:35 17 and playing like shit for most of the game or losing it like this like what's more what's
23:40 going to be more like he's actually helped them in their quest to win the title.
23:45 Yeah, no, I totally agreed with your take that like this it's better to lose this game
23:50 and like not feel invincible anymore than it is to win it by 22 without Donovan Mitchell
23:56 and it's like what are you really learning from kind of and I think going back like they
24:02 did not play well offensively in the first two quarters either.
24:05 They were just making shots like I think four of their five first shots were like pull up
24:09 threes which is just like yeah, they were just going in but that's terrible process
24:15 and I think it kind of bit them that they just were relying on that early.
24:18 So I think losing that game.
24:21 It's like they know they weren't focused Jalen said it at the end of the game.
24:25 He said it was a mindset loss and it absolutely was so I think they'll learn from it.
24:29 I think they'll take but you know, we've said that before and we see these things but
24:33 they haven't been happening.
24:34 They've been awesome in the clutch this season.
24:36 They're plus 20 net rating in the clutch this year and I looked at the last three years
24:42 combined when the Jays are on the court their clutch net rating was minus seven and a half
24:48 for the last three years combined and they're plus five together this year.
24:51 So like things have changed.
24:53 They're really good in the clutch.
24:55 This was just a pretty painful loss in that way.
24:58 So, all right, we got to jump into our word from our sponsor here.
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26:20 Do you have anything else on the Cavs you want to talk Nuggies?
26:23 I would like to get the KP the ball more and Derek White the ball more in the clutch.
26:31 That's really that's really it.
26:32 But at the same time part of like the Paul Zengas thing is like you obviously you want
26:37 to get in the ball more in the clutch because he's been insane.
26:41 But like you do have to work.
26:42 Like actions and stuff to get him the right match up like you don't want him necessarily
26:47 posting up Jared Allen just like just chuck it to him see what he can do right like and
26:51 so that's always going to take time off the clock and if like teams are locked in they're
26:55 probably going to have pre switching like they're going to have a plan for like to that
26:59 that's like they're like that's their best play.
27:01 They're probably going to try and get to that and they probably try to but it's like
27:05 you know, and then the clock click ticking ticking ticking.
27:09 And so I think it's slightly more complicated being like obviously KP should be taking the
27:14 shots or we should get Derek White open catching shoot three like it's it's once you get down
27:19 to a one-point game just flip the coin dude.
27:22 I saw the nuggets are like one and six in one-point games as well.
27:25 So it's like I'm writing about that exact thing for three-leaf clover this week is basically
27:31 like randomness and luck plays a way bigger factor in the clutch than I think we all sort
27:36 of give credit for like shit just happens shots go in they don't and they're these tiny
27:41 little sample sizes.
27:42 So we like overreact to them, but it really is like it's just Dean Wade went like six
27:48 for six from three like come on like that's an anomaly out.
27:52 So we're aware of what we were 13 and two in our last 15 and we lost to a Dean Wade
27:59 six three-pointers game and Austin Reaves six three-pointers game.
28:03 So that's sensing a trend here, but on KP dude, let's do some weird shit with him in
28:10 the clutch throw him off like pin downs and stuff like that.
28:13 Like get him on the move like, you know centers don't like doing that.
28:16 They're going to have to switch it get him on a pin down then have them like face up
28:20 in the high post like do some creative stuff in these last 30 games or so just to see what
28:25 we got.
28:26 Yeah.
28:26 So, all right, the Nuggets they are coming off a fairly similar loss to what we just
28:31 had not quite as bad, but they fought back tied it in the fourth then got blown off
28:36 the floor and overtime.
28:38 They're 42 and 26 and four in their last 10.
28:41 So they've this is very Nugget see of just like coasting into the playoffs when they've
28:46 got a decent seed locked up.
28:48 They attack similarly to us most post ups in the league were second or fifth and efficiency
28:53 were first 29th and spot up possessions, but sixth and efficiency were like right around
28:58 those numbers to so look man.
29:02 It's yo kitch.
29:03 It's everybody else like he's better than anyone art on our team and that you know,
29:07 that's not difficult to say like, what are you looking for in the Nugs game?
29:12 Well, I'd like look looking back to the last game against the Celtics in the Nuggets right
29:17 two point loss heartbreaker.
29:20 I think that they nailed the game plan and I think that like you go back and look at
29:25 the last last game.
29:27 They shot 25.8 percent from three and they only gave up 31 attempts and like the attempts,
29:34 you know, they only gave up three attempts to KCP and only four attempts to MPJ and like
29:42 if you watch MPJ and the Nuggets against the Lakers a couple days ago when the Nuggets
29:47 right there best it's it's yo kitch like flying around with the passes and KCP and MPJ in
29:55 particular just like going scorched earth from three and that's when the Nuggets are
30:00 most dangerous like it they are truly a pick your poison team right like it there's so
30:07 hard to stop like yo kitch can can go one-on-one the two-man game with Murray and yo kitch is
30:14 insane.
30:15 Like I said it last night on late night like Jamal Murray has had four games where he goes
30:19 71 percent or better from the field and one of them was against the Celtics.
30:24 The other three were against the Hawks the Grizzlies and forgetting the last one but
30:29 it was like there's something Stephen's saying.
30:32 Yeah, slightly better than those other three like for Jamal Murray to go that nuclear on
30:37 those types of shots was insane.
30:39 And if he does that again, we're probably going to lose again, but the Jays right they
30:43 were bad last game.
30:45 So they were Tatum was 9 for 24 22 8 5 assists 0 turnovers like relative right but the Jalen
30:54 Brown 13 points 6 for 19 there are combined 2 for 17 from 3 and they were 31.8 percent
31:01 from 3 as a team is can't you probably not going to be the Nuggets if the Jays play like
31:06 that.
31:07 Yeah.
31:08 Yeah.
31:09 And like some of the shots actually taking a step back the defense did work like you
31:13 I think it was one also 100 like that you hold Denver to a hundred and two points you
31:18 expect to win and it was like Herculean efforts from Jamal Murray some of those shots.
31:22 He hit down the down in crunch time dude, like he had like a fall away 20 footer where
31:28 he like landed behind the three-point line and he buried it and like if that shot doesn't
31:32 go in we're going to overtime.
31:34 So I think that game like people point back to like, oh Denver's just in a different class
31:39 than the Celtics, but it's like we make one more three and we shot one of our worst percentages
31:44 of the year and we win that game.
31:46 So I think you play defense like that again.
31:49 We're probably going to be fine.
31:52 I don't like playing in Denver because they have the high altitude but Denver's got spots
31:57 the Celtics can pick at but like their best defensive lineup on cleaning the glass is
32:03 Jamal Murray holiday order Aaron Gordon and yo kitsch and it's like even that lineup like
32:10 you can go at Jamal Murray like holiday doesn't scare me as a defender.
32:14 Obviously mpj kind of an okay help defender, but he's not like an on-ball lockdown guy
32:19 yo kitsch.
32:20 I have not caught a ton of Nuggets games, but he's been pretty solid defensively this
32:25 year.
32:26 Yeah, and then Aaron Gordon obviously a great defensive player.
32:29 So like even their best defensive lineup has multiple pressure points that you can attack
32:34 but you need you need your threes to go down and it reminds me of like that first loss.
32:39 We had to Philly this year where we shot like 25% and it's like man some of these shots
32:44 were just wide open and it just makes it look so bad when they're not going in and you know
32:50 two for 17 from three from the Jays like this is not going to you're not going to win like
32:55 any games when they do that because they're basically shooting you out of the game at
32:58 that point.
32:59 Yeah, I I'll ask you a question on defensively, right?
33:04 So yo kitsch you just got to try your try your darndest.
33:09 Yeah, like I I think no matter who's on him.
33:13 I'm hoping that Tillman is playing tomorrow because I want to at least see him get reps
33:18 against yo kitsch like in theory.
33:19 He's a guy that can give you give you stuff there like they played it relatively straight
33:24 up last time from memory like they had KP on him and Horford you had a crack and I think
33:31 that I think that's fine.
33:32 Maybe you just did KP on on Gordon at times and you go like hate him or Jalen, but it's
33:39 like it's you can't you probably can't it's not tenable right like for that to be the
33:44 matchup.
33:45 So I think really it's about can you shut down Jamal Murray because I think they they
33:51 can do they can do a really good job on KCP and an MPJ like they have guys like holiday
33:56 and and Derek that can just really navigate screens really well and shut down there and
34:02 run them off three-point line and recover and go from there.
34:05 But Jamal Murray, I mean, I think part of it was just like he was hot like scorching
34:10 hot and just hit some crazy shots, but I would maybe like to see Jalen start on Murray or
34:16 even Tatum start tomorrow.
34:17 Just throw more size and length at him to kind of maybe keep him a little bit off balance
34:21 or really like really just try and shut that down early.
34:24 I think if you can do that then that's going to give you a chance to slow them down offensively
34:28 and then you could she I think you just you live with him like talking like putting up
34:32 a big points total.
34:33 Yeah, he doesn't want to take 30 shots or 26 shots right?
34:37 You could want to take 16 and have 11 assists.
34:40 So I'm totally fine with like if he's shooting threes if he's shooting like these kind of
34:44 deeper mid-range jumpers, that's a win even though he could make them at an elite level
34:48 but like you just can't let the rest of the team get going.
34:51 I love the Jalen Brown on Jamal Murray idea because I think to defend Murray you got to
34:56 do your work early like you almost like how we defended KD in that first round series
35:02 in 2022 where it's like anytime he cuts you just got to have a body on him anytime.
35:06 He's going for the dribble handoff with Jokic like you just got to try to get between Murray
35:11 and Jokic to blow that dribble hand up off like you just can't lazily go under and the
35:16 way you get between them is you beat him early you see it's coming and you get on top of
35:22 Murray and just get there and then he's going to try to back cut you.
35:25 That's a much more difficult pass.
35:27 There's help low.
35:28 So I think Jalen is like designed in a lab to play that type of defense because he's
35:35 a pure chaser like you know what I mean?
35:37 Like you can say to Jalen like that's your guy.
35:39 Don't let him out of your sights.
35:41 It's when he's like, okay, you're the corner help and sometimes you got to get high and
35:45 sometimes you got to get back and he's going to back cut you sometimes so like but on Murray
35:50 and he was on Garland.
35:51 I thought he did the best job on Garland last night too.
35:55 And I think we went away from it in crunch time and Garland started to get downhill a
35:59 little bit.
36:00 So I think that's the perfect matchup for JB.
36:02 Yeah, Antonio.
36:03 I'm sorry still pissed about last game.
36:05 Yes.
36:06 No need to apologize.
36:07 Yeah, we get it dude.
36:08 We get it.
36:09 So I like JB on Murray and like Gordon even KCP like is he going to take 14 kills?
36:14 Is he going to take 14 threes if you kind of give him some space in the corner?
36:18 Maybe but probably not.
36:19 I know I know he's like that.
36:21 I don't know.
36:22 He's a guy at home too.
36:23 I love the man.
36:26 This is this reminds me of like the Steph Warriors matchup like I love I loved I loved past tense
36:32 watching Steph Curry in the Warriors like it just isn't the same experience watching Steph
36:37 do like awesome stuff anymore because I'm just like that son of a bitch and like the
36:42 yoke is like I love watching the Nuggets because it's just so unique and super fun to watch.
36:50 Yeah, but but the and it reminds me of the Celtics like everyone on the team is so empowered
36:56 like they want KCP to be super aggressive.
36:58 They want MPJ to be super aggressive like anytime you catch a yoke it's pass essentially
37:02 on a catch if it's any sliver of daylight just let it let it fire.
37:07 And so I I like the idea of just like trying to shut those guys down because once they
37:13 get going at home that does actually scare me a fair bit.
37:19 Oh, yeah, dude, like it's I man we really should have had that one in Boston because
37:25 I just I hate playing Denver and Denver and we've actually been pretty sick.
37:30 Really?
37:31 Yeah, by it's a half a point if I like it's a pick him but like we're slightly favorite
37:35 which is kind of surprising to me though.
37:38 Yeah, so that's like neutral court.
37:40 You're probably thinking like three and a half, you know, we'd be favored by so yeah,
37:45 I just man you're right though.
37:48 Like I think it really just comes down to not letting those guys feel empowered not
37:52 letting them get going but also like you got to help off them to you know, so like Gordon's
37:58 the guy you help off because he's not going to yes hit 10 threes, but he'll back.
38:04 He'll post up dude.
38:06 He's good passer to like off of cuts and stuff like that.
38:09 He'll keep the ball moving.
38:10 So I'm and like there's a reason they're 42 and 20 and they don't like totally try every
38:16 game and they're still that good.
38:18 They're just impossible to defend all Ben.
38:21 Yeah, I hope you're right Ben Dallas.
38:24 Yeah, yeah, yeah hot take wonder why go ahead.
38:27 Sorry hot take we're going to fucking destroy them jail and we'll post rise your kitchen.
38:31 I hope so.
38:32 That'd be awesome.
38:33 I think that's possible.
38:34 It's weird like my idea of playing the Nuggets in like the finals or just generally it's
38:38 like the offense has to be really good for them to win.
38:41 But like then you go back and look at the matchup in Boston.
38:44 It's like a 100 102 game.
38:45 So it's like maybe it doesn't have to be necessarily incredible for them to win a game.
38:51 But like I the way I think about this matchup.
38:54 I'm like they should be able to like I know the Nugget Nuggets defense is like better
38:59 than people like think of when like anecdotally I think what are they what are they on the
39:04 year their ninth on the year, which is obviously good but like it's not elite elite and then
39:10 like Aaron Gordon has been a guy that Tatum has been very comfortable attacking on the
39:14 perimeter.
39:15 You can post up KCP you can attack MPJ like they've got a good team defense and that's
39:22 sometimes more important than anything else and your kids has definitely become a better
39:26 room protector.
39:27 Like he's good at getting his hands into passing lanes and and that's like something that can
39:32 can disrupt the Jays, you know at times is like guys that are just like good with anticipation
39:38 and as opposed to like the Jays can sometimes be pretty calculating with the way they like
39:42 to attack.
39:43 And so that's where I can see that the Denver defense having success.
39:47 I would just love to see the Celtics offense play.
39:49 Well, like even if they lose the game like that's like defensively.
39:54 I'm pretty confident.
39:55 They're going to play well.
39:56 Like I think they're going to be locked in the game plans going to be pretty sound and
39:59 they're not get the Nuggets, you know score on you.
40:01 That's just going to be kind of like what happens.
40:04 I just like to see them play.
40:06 Well offensively specifically the Jays.
40:09 Yeah, and like I that the offense in that Cavs game was just so lazy sometimes dude
40:15 and it's like you can get at these dudes with KP and Al out there because you could just
40:21 going to have to come up and defend high right and then like but you can't like you can't
40:25 but you can't let them off the hook by just like just attacking with that one action.
40:30 Like there's got to be multiple swings.
40:32 There's got to be multiple driving kicks and the key to being able to do that is attacking
40:37 early in the shot clock.
40:39 So you should be able to get an advantage every time yokage is out there by putting
40:43 him in pick and roll or pick and pop stuff.
40:46 And then it's just a matter of like making the right read off of that and Denver's like
40:51 all of their guys like yeah, yokage is great in the passing lanes too.
40:54 But so is Gordon.
40:56 So is KCP even like Murray's really he's not a good defender, but he's like smart and can
41:01 read the game and any strong for like a guard to so they they'll mucky up.
41:07 They have a little bit of that like heat devil magic style defense in them.
41:12 So I just I just want to see us go dude.
41:15 Like you can run yokage off the floor like he doesn't want to play a fast-paced game
41:20 and we don't either we play slow as hell too.
41:23 At least on a per possession basis.
41:26 So like run them around screens like get KP moving use him in different types of actions
41:31 and like off ball stuff will be really helpful.
41:34 Like there's some teams we can just attack high screen and roll with the floor spread.
41:38 I don't think Denver's one of those teams though.
41:41 Yeah, I think that even you just talking about KP like I want to see the Jays play well against
41:46 a really good team against a contender because like obviously that's important but like KP
41:52 might be the key to this matchup just generally right like even in the first game.
41:57 He's 6 for 11 3 for 5 from 3 if I remember correctly.
42:01 He was like super hot early in that in that Nuggets game.
42:04 Maybe he had like 15 or 16 in the first half and then Denver adjusted and they weren't
42:09 quite able to get back to that.
42:11 I think you know and that and when that's that's the secret ingredient to this Celtics
42:16 team in general not just for this matchup.
42:18 It's like KP's the cheat code.
42:20 He's this the ceiling blaster Latvian Moses like can we can we can he just have a monster
42:26 game and like show everybody like yeah, this is why this team is different.
42:31 It's because of this giant Latvian dude.
42:34 Yeah, dude and Tim Preston looking at getting my water bottle.
42:37 It's awesome.
42:38 My sister got it for me.
42:39 Yeah, I strongly suggest it.
42:41 But yeah, and you know what?
42:43 I want to see more KP short roll KP.
42:46 Yeah, he'll be raised jumper gone.
42:48 Yeah, or like get him going downhill with the ball in his hands because his handles
42:52 like legitimately incredible for a 7 foot 3 guy and it seems like the way teams are
42:57 defending the pick and pop with him as they know it's coming.
43:00 So they like show two on the ball and then immediately before the pass can get there.
43:04 They're sprinting back to KP, but if he's rolling downhill, you can dump that pass over
43:09 the top and all the sudden you're playing four on three.
43:12 So I wonder and yo could just slow a shit like KP can get in behind him and do a
43:15 some damage.
43:16 So I want to see a little more KP pick and roll and like in that short roll, especially
43:21 because then corner helps going to have to come.
43:23 He can dump that pass to the corner.
43:25 Then they're in rotation and that's when you can get your multiple drives and kicks
43:28 going, you know, absolutely man.
43:30 And like even yesterday it was it was a transition play, but you know KP has almost
43:35 one of the sequences of the season where he breaks up that play on one end and then
43:39 how many times this year have had people hit him on a variety of passes going down
43:43 the lane.
43:44 He's just like throwing down thunderous dunks.
43:46 Yeah, his touch around the rim is nuts.
43:49 And so I I'm with you dude, like more KP is a good thing.
43:55 And I think in this matchup in particular, I think you can you can definitely have
43:59 some success.
44:00 Yeah, for sure.
44:02 All right.
44:03 So I've got to get out of here and like about five to ten minutes here.
44:07 So okay.
44:09 What are you thinking, man?
44:10 We win in this game, Jake.
44:12 Man, I don't know.
44:14 I don't know.
44:15 This is like the one team that like I have so much respect for compared to every other
44:20 team in the league.
44:21 Yeah, it's purely because of how good I think that you think Jokic is.
44:24 So I'm not sure I can pick the Celtics.
44:26 Yeah, unfortunately, I hope I'm wrong.
44:29 But yeah, I can't do it.
44:32 It feels like we're due to just like light them up from three though, doesn't it Jake?
44:37 I mean, we've been insane from three even yesterday.
44:40 That's true.
44:41 We were.
44:42 But that's good though.
44:43 I think that's like and then you could be right.
44:44 And it's like if we had just played seriously yesterday, we would have won that game by
44:47 30 because like we are shooting.
44:49 So I am a coward.
44:50 I agree.
44:51 And so like Ben called me a coward for not picking.
44:55 How dare you be objective here?
44:59 I don't know.
45:00 We've been insane from three.
45:01 So like if we can just go into Denver, I remember was it two years ago?
45:04 We went into Denver and we just like destroyed them.
45:07 I remember Peyton Pritchard cooking in the second quarter and the game was pretty much
45:10 over by halftime.
45:11 And so like it's obviously possible and I think that like in a series against Denver,
45:17 how you're going to beat them is going to be like four double-digit wins.
45:21 Maybe three double-digit wins and one close one.
45:23 Like that's probably how you end up beating Denver in a series.
45:27 And like honestly, I was thinking about this like in all the clutch conversation like thinking
45:33 about that 08 series against the Lakers.
45:35 A lot of those games weren't that close.
45:37 Yeah.
45:38 And so you don't really need to be necessarily awesome in the clutch to win a title.
45:42 Like the Phoenix Suns were the best clutch team in the NBA that made the finals and they
45:46 got destroyed by the Bucks in the finals.
45:50 Like you just, if you can blow teams off the court, that is often a better indicator.
45:55 Even like ironically, the Warriors, like the Steph Curry Warriors, I kind of have low-keeping
46:00 bad in the clutch.
46:01 Like Steph Curry's turnover issues, except for when they have historically played the Celtics.
46:05 We didn't give them a chance to do that on Sunday, thankfully.
46:09 But like they have a game seven against the Cavs in that 3-1 blown lead series.
46:14 Like Steph Curry just turned the ball over and terrible in the clutch.
46:17 Like you don't have to be incredible in the clutch in order to win a title or win a game,
46:23 obviously.
46:24 So let's just win by 20.
46:27 That'd be nice.
46:28 Yeah.
46:29 For the love of God, please win by 20.
46:30 Yeah.
46:31 Yeah.
46:32 Kevin Love, like locking up Curry in the clutch.
46:34 I remember very vividly once or twice.
46:37 Yeah.
46:38 That '08 team, that Atlanta series went seven.
46:41 And I think every win they had was by 20 or more or something ridiculous like that in
46:46 that '08 first round.
46:47 So yeah, I mean, we almost did it by getting to six in the finals when we were way worse
46:54 in the clutch in 2022 under Utica.
46:56 We were minus 4.6 net rating in the clutch in that season and we're plus 20 now.
47:01 So things have changed.
47:03 We're a hell of a lot better in the clutch.
47:05 Please don't make it go to the clutch ever again, Celtics.
47:08 I can't handle it, dude.
47:10 It's too painful.
47:11 I think we can all agree that like it's neither nearly as bad as like Colin Calhoun, which
47:19 you know, not a serious voice, but like some of the ridiculous takes about the Celtics
47:25 in the clutch are like not nearly as bad as that.
47:29 But I also don't think we have to lie and be like it's a strength.
47:34 Like one of the best things about the Celtics is like they're incredible in the clutch.
47:37 Like they're just they're not I know the numbers are good.
47:40 They're good in the clutch.
47:42 Good in the clutch.
47:43 I think it's fine.
47:44 But there it's not a strength.
47:46 Right?
47:47 That's I think that's totally fair.
47:49 There may be slightly above average in the clutch.
47:52 But it's just so stark because they are fucking incredible and every other time.
47:56 So I think that's why it's so nerve-wracking.
47:59 But after the Nuggets, oh, I think we got a three more games on the road, Phoenix, Portland,
48:04 Utah, and then back home to play Phoenix.
48:07 So what game of that you looking most forward to and then we'll wrap it up here.
48:11 Yeah, I guess the two Phoenix ones.
48:13 I think I think that first Phoenix one.
48:16 It's gives me tuckers me the end of the road trip be a little tired.
48:20 So my guess is that I hope I got I want to pick against the Celtics again against the
48:27 against Phoenix in that spot too.
48:28 But I've fallen late lately.
48:30 I'm just I'm a smooth brained, you know, I've got recency bias.
48:35 I watched the Celtics lose yesterday and I watched Phoenix beat the Suns.
48:40 I mean Phoenix, they are the Suns Phoenix Denver yesterday.
48:43 So I'm like, yeah, the Phoenix are good now without booker as well.
48:47 So I don't know.
48:50 I I'm a mess at this point.
48:52 I just everything's blurring together.
48:54 I don't know man.
48:56 I hear you dude.
48:57 It's that point in the season.
48:59 I think anytime Katie comes to the garden, there's just a little extra juice to it.
49:03 Actually, I saw Katie in the garden his second or third year and he had 37 and it was fucking
49:10 incredible.
49:11 I mean, he was he should so goddamn good dude, even at 36 years old and I was watching.
49:16 I was watching some highlights of his like passing with Nurkic and that's friggin terrifying
49:22 dude.
49:23 Like Nurkic is catching in the short roll and like Diamond up corner shooters like shit.
49:29 They've definitely found something there that is not ideal.
49:32 So I know it's got to be the Phoenix games.
49:34 Of course.
49:35 Yeah, the the jazz and blazes games are hopefully just be like fun Celtics vibes games.
49:41 But then it's kind of yeah, then you were really like there's like two big games left
49:45 after that.
49:46 If we win tomorrow, I will definitely be happy again jazz in the chat here.
49:50 Absolutely.
49:51 Absolutely.
49:52 No question.
49:53 Yeah, if we win tomorrow, I mean you thought vibes were high after the Warriors game.
49:56 I think like if we win the Nuggets game that that'll just be it.
50:00 I think like like no one's going to care about I don't know actually, it's probably not true
50:06 if we lose the box game and the Thunder game everybody will freak out again.
50:09 So yes, a hundred percent dude, especially the box game.
50:12 I can tell you one man who will be extremely happy if we win tomorrow and that's Ben Vallis
50:17 is the Denver Cup for him is one of his good friends is a Nuggets fan and apparently a
50:21 very ruthless shit talker.
50:23 So hopefully the C's win for Ben, but unless you got anything else Jake, I think we can
50:28 wrap it up man.
50:29 You've just put in two hours of podcasting in back-to-back days about that Cleveland
50:33 loss.
50:34 So it's probably it's time for you to get some rest recuperate and watch us beat the
50:38 shit out of Denver.
50:39 So anyway, Jake love your work man.
50:43 First to the floor.
50:44 We are out.
50:45 I love the Celtics!
50:46 Celtics!
50:47 Celtics!
50:48 [Music]