• 7 hours ago
The Boston Sports Journal's Mike Giardi returns to the show to share his best offensive and defensive fits among all the prospects he saw at the Senior Bowl. The guys also cover the latest they've heard on Mike Vrabel's impact, the Patriots' changing coaching staff and finish with an early Super Bowl thought.


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Transcript
00:00:00back from Mobile, Alabama, not fresh, a little stale, a lot tired.
00:00:18Here's Mike Giardi, Boston Sports Journal, back on a happy Friday with Pats Interference.
00:00:23I am very fresh.
00:00:24I will tell you, I have not gone anywhere.
00:00:26I have not boarded a plane or five or seven or however many it took you to get down there
00:00:29and then come back watching Mike Frabel, Rod Cowden, and Elliot Wolfe.
00:00:33Did I put them in that order for a reason?
00:00:34I don't know.
00:00:35We'll get into it.
00:00:36But anyway, we have Mike's takes, his scouting reports, his complaints, everything from this
00:00:40week down on Mobile, which is obviously where most of the football world was watching this
00:00:44week.
00:00:45And then we're going to get into some coaching staff and moves and a little bit of intel
00:00:47for the folks who've been following along.
00:00:49Because while you were gone, I was working here.
00:00:51I was keeping tabs, making some calls, sending some texts, and writing up a lot of different
00:00:55moves that have happened.
00:00:56Of all that, I guess we'll just start here.
00:00:58The question I've really never asked on this podcast, because I think it's the most boring
00:01:01way to start.
00:01:02But we're going to do it anyway, because you're a friend.
00:01:04How are you?
00:01:06We got in at 2.30 last night, a lot of plane strains, automobiles, cancellations, reschedulings.
00:01:13And I was hoping to wake up at like 11 this morning.
00:01:17That was like my please.
00:01:19But I woke up at 8, 8.30, because I'm old.
00:01:21And that's what old people do.
00:01:22I had to get up, have my Geritol, my Wheaties, you know, but here we are.
00:01:29I was committed to you, you know, like Andrew's my guy, so I'm going to be here for Andrew.
00:01:33And you know, when I'm tired, I think we did one during the season at one point where I'm
00:01:38going to be like, hard time focusing.
00:01:41So let's just get to it and see what happens.
00:01:43Well, speaking of focusing, what is Geritol?
00:01:46Yeah, that's like an old man vitamin, you know, like you probably still eat Flintstones,
00:01:51right?
00:01:52They're gummies.
00:01:53They're not for children, but they're, they're, they're not the hard pill.
00:01:57Yeah.
00:01:58No, actually, I'm not a Geritol yet, but I do have the Centrum Over 50.
00:02:03Yeah.
00:02:04Because, well, I'm over 50, which is so sad.
00:02:08It's pretty much over.
00:02:10Okay, you're doing pretty well.
00:02:12This is where we're going to end that flowery conversation here.
00:02:16Okay, yeah, let's go talk football.
00:02:17You're doing just fine.
00:02:18Yes, we are here for football.
00:02:19I want to know a lot about the Senior Bowl.
00:02:22I've done a little bit of reading because I think at this time of year and everyone
00:02:24dives back into the draft, there are very few people, especially those of us who cover
00:02:28an NFL team who has spent real time assessing film with these college prospects.
00:02:33Granted, I'm not going to totally withhold from what you write and draft experts, Daniel
00:02:39Jeremiah or Mel Kiper, Dan Brugler, certainly entirely, because I need a framework of guys
00:02:43that I look at and positions names, but I don't like to dive in just yet because I don't
00:02:47want their evaluations to kind of pollute or shape or influence what I eventually see
00:02:52when I start to pick up the tape, which is right now.
00:02:55When you think about your biggest takeaway from the Senior Bowl, though, zooming as far
00:02:58out as possible, and this could be about Mike Vrabel or Ryan Cowden, Elliot Wolfe, and did
00:03:03I put them in that order?
00:03:04Yes, I might have put them in that order for a reason, or the prospects, whatever it was.
00:03:07Give us your biggest takeaway before we get into the nitty gritty of the players that
00:03:10are on the field.
00:03:12You know, so I really, when we went down there, my boss was focused on one thing and I was
00:03:17focused more on the on-field stuff and like, so I guess what I came away from is, like
00:03:23everybody said, it's an awesome D-line class, like there's a bunch of dudes.
00:03:28So, you know, like, and I'm talking dudes from the first round to someone you might
00:03:32get in the seventh round who could help you this year.
00:03:34I think that's how deep that class is.
00:03:37But then from the skill position standpoint, and I'm talking quarterback, which is obviously
00:03:40impacts the Patriots where they stand in the draft, and then wide receivers, it's just
00:03:46not, I mean, there are some guys, there are some good players at wide receiver, but like
00:03:50last year, Ladd McConkie, Roman Wilson, there were a bunch of dudes that just like went
00:03:55to Mobile and you were like, I knew who this guy was before and I had high expectations
00:04:00for him.
00:04:01And then when I saw him in person, I'm like, no, that dude's even better than I thought
00:04:03he was.
00:04:04This wasn't, this wasn't that.
00:04:06This was like, okay, I kind of like him.
00:04:08He's, you know, he's got some things he can do, but never, no one was like, oh my goodness,
00:04:12this dude just jumped off the page.
00:04:14So that to me was something that it's like the talent level is, I think it's a deep group
00:04:20and you hear that a lot.
00:04:21Now it feels like everybody says, you know, between 15 and 55 or 20 and 65, it's like
00:04:26the same kind of player.
00:04:27It's just how teams will stack them based on their needs and how they, you know, how
00:04:31they play.
00:04:32But I definitely see that there's a, there's a, there's some good players, but I don't
00:04:36know how many, like, oh wow, these guys are going to be dominant forces in the league
00:04:40for 10, 12 years.
00:04:41Right.
00:04:42And that's a function of the year to year difference in just talent.
00:04:44Like some years you've got a quarterback class that's loaded and the networks are happy and
00:04:49you see all the commercials and it provides us hype in the first round to right now everyone's
00:04:52going to anyone really want to trade up with the Titans to number one overall, or are they
00:04:56just going to have to sit tight?
00:04:58And I think it also speaks to the fact that the senior bowl, as you're speaking now kind
00:05:02of speak to me is like scouting speed dating.
00:05:06Yeah.
00:05:07Like two, three days.
00:05:08These guys, very limited reps, but sometimes when you know it, you see it and you feel
00:05:12it and you're like, okay, let me talk to you, put them down.
00:05:14And that's how I felt at least watching him granted again, wasn't immobile, had never
00:05:16actually been to the senior bowl.
00:05:19Was there anything else outside of that?
00:05:20Because you also wrote about the coaching staff this week and that's really where I
00:05:23want to start because we're kind of backwards here, impressions of the Patriots hires, which
00:05:28I'll just go down now in case people forgot, because look, there has been a lot of shuffling
00:05:34How are we going for different assistants?
00:05:36And so right now, basically the easiest way to understand this is everyone who was on
00:05:39the staff last year, wave goodbye, except for Jeremy Springer, your special teams coordinator,
00:05:45Quinn, his special teams assistant, who's a long time coaching veteran, multiple decades
00:05:49in the business.
00:05:50And as of this morning, courtesy of our fellow short Mike, Mike Reese, Ben McAdoo, the mustachioed
00:05:57cockroach who has survived an event that took out all other coaches under Josh McDaniels.
00:06:03He's around and I don't know what his role is that hasn't been reported yet.
00:06:07Last year, we know he helped with Drake May and Joe Milton, some of the scout team defense,
00:06:10but he will be a part of an offensive staff that right now we have Ashton Grant Brown's
00:06:14assistant is going to coach quarterbacks.
00:06:16Tony Dews coming over from the Jets before that in Tennessee, like a lot of these coaches
00:06:19coaching running backs, TBD and the receivers coach, we'll get to that in a minute.
00:06:22Thomas Brown, tight ends, coach and passing and coordinators are reported this week.
00:06:26Doug Marone, presumably going to help with the offensive line.
00:06:29Jason Hotaling spoke on this podcast a couple weeks ago to watch out for him.
00:06:33He's coming aboard.
00:06:34And then they got a bunch of lower levels assistance defensively trail Williams.
00:06:37We know defensive coordinator from the Lions.
00:06:39And basically, let's just put a bone, a bunch of young assistants here who have crossed
00:06:43path with Mike Grable at some point in time.
00:06:45So either the scuttlebutt around that staff, things you picked up, learned, or just your
00:06:49assessment.
00:06:50Take this wherever you want with the coaching staff.
00:06:52So the big thing when I got down there was, you know, so the day we flew down is the day
00:06:55that the Marone news came out.
00:06:57And like the initial response was like, Hey, you know, he's good coach.
00:07:02He's been around for a long time, got the head coaching experience.
00:07:07Most of the people that I talked to very quickly, because we were literally just getting on
00:07:10a plane.
00:07:11We're like, yeah, you know, he's a, he's a good offensive line coach.
00:07:13And then I just started to do some digging.
00:07:16And I just had some questions about sort of his, his approach.
00:07:22He's old school, which again, like I, and I wrote it in Boston sports journal, like
00:07:27it's fine.
00:07:28Like I, I want my offensive lineman to be the toughest, baddest dudes on the planet.
00:07:32Like I want them to be able to whatever, handle anything, but he's, he can be really critical
00:07:37and it can be biting.
00:07:38And I think we have clearly seen a shift, whatever the last five years, the last 10
00:07:42or wherever you want to put it, where that doesn't always play anymore.
00:07:48And I wonder how that will work for an offensive line.
00:07:51That's going to be completely retooled.
00:07:53You know, I mean, it's possible that you could be looking at four new starters next year,
00:07:58at least three guys that aren't here in the building.
00:08:01Like there's, there could be some massive changes there.
00:08:04And I wonder too, about like, how does that play with some of the young guys?
00:08:07Like, you know, the Kayden Wallace's Layden Robinson types who again, are part of this
00:08:11newer generation or someone that they might draft.
00:08:14It's possible that they, those guys be able to handle sort of that approach.
00:08:19I also found it interesting.
00:08:20I went back and I was, you know, just like looking through some old Marone interviews
00:08:25and I covered him when he was the head coach in Jacksonville.
00:08:28And I found a quote from him about how he doesn't, when he takes a new job, he doesn't
00:08:33want to watch the film of the guys that he's inheriting.
00:08:36He wants to see them on the field, see how they move, see how they respond to coaching
00:08:41before he starts to make an impression.
00:08:43And my thought on that is if you just got hired in January and you're not going to be
00:08:48doing field work until May, and that's not even real field work.
00:08:52Let's be honest, you're not doing real field work until August or late July, whenever they
00:08:57finally put on the pads, like that's a lot of wasted time.
00:09:01Like, and maybe he just was whatever.
00:09:04Maybe he wasn't being not truthful, but you know what I mean?
00:09:07Like maybe he was just sort of whatever, this is, this is what I'm going to say, but that's
00:09:10not how he views it.
00:09:11But I don't love that at all.
00:09:13Like you should know these guys inside and out before you hit free agency, before you,
00:09:19you know, get them on the field in May, like that just, I don't, I don't love that.
00:09:23And I'll just say on top of that, just as a group, I think this coaching staff on the
00:09:27offensive side doesn't make much sense to me.
00:09:32And I'm not saying there aren't good coaches and plenty of experience.
00:09:34Like I like having all these guys with head coaching experience, but like we just lived
00:09:39this two years ago.
00:09:41Bill Belichick had Bill O'Brien sort of foisted upon him, right?
00:09:45I mean, I think we can all agree that ownership said you're getting a real offensive coordinator.
00:09:50We like this guy, you have experience.
00:09:53Let's do this.
00:09:54Well, it was more, Hey, you, you can pick from this menu, but it's not a full menu.
00:09:58It's a specifically tailored happy hour menu of things that make me happy.
00:10:02Maybe not necessarily.
00:10:03And then what did they do for Bill?
00:10:05They gave him a menu that had, you're allowed one item.
00:10:09I mean, we got Will Lawling on the staff and everybody else was inherited.
00:10:12O'Brien did.
00:10:13Yeah.
00:10:14Yeah.
00:10:15And I, that, that offense didn't work for a lot of reasons that whole season didn't
00:10:18work.
00:10:19Right.
00:10:20We've, we've gone into that very well.
00:10:21But like when you're hiring an offensive coordinator, he should have some of his guys.
00:10:26And right now, I mean, maybe the assistant quarterbacks coach who comes from John Carroll,
00:10:32right?
00:10:33Like maybe he's the guy and he's what, 26, 28, whatever he is.
00:10:38Like, that's not to me what I'm looking for.
00:10:43And maybe this is, this is too far, but all I can think of is putting together this staff.
00:10:49It feels a little bit like the Carolina super staff in 2023 with Frank Reich, where David
00:10:54Tepper's like, no, no, no.
00:10:55We're bringing in all these different voices and all these guys that have coached elsewhere.
00:10:59And the paths hadn't really crossed.
00:11:02And it was like, Oh no, go run an offense together.
00:11:04Well, I don't know this guy and I don't know that guy.
00:11:06I don't know what he expects from me and like that season predictably went terrible
00:11:10and guys got fired before the end of year one, this team that shouldn't happen to this
00:11:15team, but I just don't like the construction of, of it.
00:11:17And I, I, I'd like someone to explain it to me because I haven't got a good answer yet.
00:11:22So I understand and appreciate the concerns about the coaching staff, but I think some
00:11:28of them are very legitimate for the reasons you laid out.
00:11:30Okay.
00:11:31You want to throw a bunch of pieces together.
00:11:33They might not fit.
00:11:34If you're not united by a philosophy or experience or any kind of overlapping beliefs about football,
00:11:38that's generally an issue.
00:11:40The comparison to 2023, however, something that, you know, I learned in reporting deep
00:11:44on that season of just like, again, you're only united by the fact that you have built
00:11:48Belichick's contact in your cell phone.
00:11:51Like that, that's it.
00:11:52You have his number.
00:11:53That's the reason that you're here.
00:11:54There are no Ross Douglas is on the staff.
00:11:56There are no Vinnie since there is on this staff, guys who played defense in college
00:12:00were younger than 30 and running position groups and rooms pretty much by themselves.
00:12:06Okay.
00:12:07Running backs and receivers respectively, or receivers running backs respectively.
00:12:10Instead aside from Ashton Grant, who we know, okay, he's a quarterback coach.
00:12:14Josh is running that room.
00:12:15Josh is laying out every single step of the development practice meetings.
00:12:19That's going to be his job.
00:12:20Tony dues has been around.
00:12:22Thomas Brown has been around.
00:12:23Doug Morone has been around.
00:12:24This feels much more to me like set it and forget it.
00:12:27This is what I want you to do.
00:12:28Just get the job done.
00:12:30Now, if they are United and understanding that like Josh is the boss, he'll collaborate
00:12:35some on game plan, but that really is going to start with variable, right?
00:12:38He's going to say, I want these three things done.
00:12:40Now you make it happen.
00:12:41I think this can work.
00:12:42It doesn't mean there won't be any strife.
00:12:44It doesn't mean strife.
00:12:45Is it also just a normal part of day-to-day coaching life, a bunch of sometimes alpha
00:12:49males in that group.
00:12:51But it is interesting to me that a lot of these, or if not most or all of them were
00:12:57variable hires more than Josh hires.
00:13:00And I know there were some assistants, I mean, spoken to people and people close to them
00:13:05that would have come back to New England and just never got a phone call.
00:13:08So why was that?
00:13:09I don't know.
00:13:10I don't buy the theory that this was a shotgun marriage from ownership between Josh and Ray.
00:13:14Well, maybe you disagree because Josh was linked with Mike dating back to December before
00:13:19the season ended before the hiring process started.
00:13:22And Josh doesn't have a whole lot of leverage.
00:13:23So he just might be on board with like, look, as long as I get my job, I get to stay local.
00:13:27I get paid pretty well.
00:13:29I'll be here.
00:13:30You hire who you want, but then I'll run the offense and make it work.
00:13:34Who says?
00:13:35Yeah, I don't know that I'm fully at the place where I think it's a shotgun marriage.
00:13:40I just think that when you have such an important task, and that is the task of elevating Drake
00:13:47May after year one, where he showed plenty of promise, right?
00:13:50And now it's the most important player on your football team and could be the cornerstone
00:13:56for a dozen years or whatever.
00:13:59Like I'm trying to get this right, and I'm trying to get it right in a short time.
00:14:03Because again, you're on that rookie contract, so you have the ability to push some things
00:14:08money-wise and make some things happen earlier that you might not when he finally gets paid.
00:14:12Assuming he delivers on his potential, he finally gets paid with probably three years
00:14:16from now will be a $70 million a year contract.
00:14:22To that point though, shouldn't that give you reason to be confident and happy about
00:14:25this stuff?
00:14:26Because the number one most important thing, just like a draft class, right?
00:14:29You need to nail that top pick.
00:14:31If you get the first round pick right, it matters just as much as basically every other
00:14:34pick.
00:14:35The offensive coordinator and quarterbacks coach, you and I both agree, Josh was a great
00:14:39hire.
00:14:40If there's someone to be in charge of Drake May, just get this position right.
00:14:43And we all know it takes protection and better receivers and yadda yadda, and that'll come.
00:14:47If they got that right with Josh, isn't this mostly a good job?
00:14:53Well done?
00:14:54No, because I want to, I mean, look, that's a good place to start, obviously.
00:14:59And I'm not even saying like, look, last year, they threw that staff together.
00:15:03Nobody knew it.
00:15:04It's just like, those are Elliott hires, and they're different pieces.
00:15:07And it just, there was no freaking cohesion.
00:15:09And I want some damn cohesion.
00:15:11And Mike talked about like, sort of, we want to share the sort of the same vision and see
00:15:15it through the same set of eyes and like, okay, well, if you're plucking this guy from
00:15:19over here, and this guy from over here, and this guy from over here, but he's overseeing
00:15:23all this stuff.
00:15:24And he sees it.
00:15:25He comes from a different tree and sees it differently.
00:15:26Like, I mean, I have time to get it together.
00:15:30And it could work because there's a lot of experience in the room that they didn't have
00:15:33last year, a lot more experience.
00:15:36But I don't know.
00:15:37I just would like a little bit more of these guys have worked together for a while, like
00:15:42Josh knows this guy.
00:15:43This guy knows what he wants.
00:15:44And this guy will be able to, you know, if Josh says it one way, and it doesn't seem
00:15:49like it's getting through, this guy will be able to translate the message and get it through.
00:15:52And like, okay, here we are, we're all going in the same direction, where, man, it's a
00:15:56lot of cooks in the kitchen right now.
00:15:59You know, a lot of guys, as you mentioned, alpha males with big egos on the offensive
00:16:03side of the ball.
00:16:05And I just don't know.
00:16:06I mean, we'll see.
00:16:07We'll see how it plays out.
00:16:08There's obviously, we got a long way to go before they're all actually on the football
00:16:10field and we get to see these guys coach together.
00:16:12And to argue against my own point, you know, if there was anything we, yes, often again,
00:16:17this is not, this is not good.
00:16:19You tired me at the end of a week, the tension is going to be bouncing around the place.
00:16:23But to the idea of, you know, Josh is the most important piece, offensive quarter and
00:16:28quarterbacks coach.
00:16:29That's great.
00:16:30That is maximum important.
00:16:31But if the last two years have taught us anything, it matters as much who you surround the offensive
00:16:37coordinator with as much as it does, who that offensive coordinator is just like the quarterback.
00:16:42Okay.
00:16:43There's only so much, even the best quarterbacks in the world can overcome if they're not afforded
00:16:47protection and proper pass catchers.
00:16:49The same way that Bill O'Brien, we're saying a lot of the same things now about Josh that
00:16:54we did back then.
00:16:55He's going to professionalize the operation.
00:16:56He knows the system.
00:16:57He's flexible.
00:16:58He's been here.
00:16:59He's developed quarterbacks, yada, yada, yada.
00:17:00He'll fix it.
00:17:01Well, when you hand him again, all due respect to professional coaches who have since gone
00:17:05on to do great things in the college ranks, Ross Douglas and Vinnie Sonseri and Troy Brown.
00:17:08I'm like, that's half of your staff because Bill kept it very, very tight in its circle.
00:17:12There's only so much Bill O'Brien can do.
00:17:14And so what I do think will benefit this team is if they're on the same page, and that's
00:17:20the biggest obstacle, the question mark, the reason for concern is if they are aligned
00:17:25in vision, but also they can put this diversity of experience and thought, which you have
00:17:30not seen in new England, basically since 2000, right?
00:17:34It was all Bill, came from Bill, people who coached under Bill, et cetera, et cetera.
00:17:38That will help them.
00:17:39That will help with problem solving.
00:17:40Okay.
00:17:41Doug Marone says, oh, we faced this blitz when I was with the Jaguars in 2017, it affected
00:17:44this protection.
00:17:45We can do this.
00:17:46You know, the same way Josh has spoken about, I was a much better coordinator in new England
00:17:49the second time around.
00:17:50Whereas in 2007, I have the greatest offense ever, but we're flummoxed by the Steve Spagnuolo
00:17:55game plan with the Giants.
00:17:56And it just took us so long to get the right answer.
00:18:00The more experienced coaches you have, the smarter coaches you have, the better you will
00:18:03be on game day, provided again, they're speaking the same language and that's their first obstacle
00:18:08here to kind of come together.
00:18:10And then you obviously have to grow from there.
00:18:11So I, I get the reasons for concern.
00:18:13I just look at this as kind of the roster as well.
00:18:16The Patriots can't be picky, like get good coaches in the building, then figure it out,
00:18:21get good players, get real talent in the building, then figure it out.
00:18:25But if you're going to argue someone who we know fits with Josh might be a little bit
00:18:28less of a coach than Thomas Brown is coaching tight end.
00:18:31Say Nick Kelly came back some weird way.
00:18:33Okay.
00:18:34And that'll be better.
00:18:35If not the same production, it's hard to argue against it.
00:18:39You make all fair points.
00:18:40Like, look, I'm not, like I said, I haven't, I'm not pressing the panic button.
00:18:43I just, I have questions about how they went about doing this.
00:18:47And I would have thought that Josh would have a little bit more influence again.
00:18:49It's my staff.
00:18:50It's his job.
00:18:51Like he's the, he's the head coach.
00:18:52It runs through him and I get it, but okay.
00:18:56There's just a lot of, there are some, at least on the coaching staff, not necessarily
00:19:00again, between Josh and Mike, some arranged marriages on the offensive coaching staff.
00:19:04Like you're going to take my guy and that's my guy.
00:19:08So make it work in more ways than one.
00:19:11This speaks to, okay.
00:19:14Everyone knows in that building, whose team this is.
00:19:16This is not Mike sharing with an Elliott Wolf.
00:19:19This is not Mike sharing with anybody.
00:19:20You report to him.
00:19:21He hired you, Thomas Brown.
00:19:23He hired you.
00:19:24Jason, Jason hotel, like Doug Moran, et cetera, et cetera.
00:19:26Not Josh.
00:19:27You're not reporting to Josh.
00:19:28This is Mike's team.
00:19:30He's the guy that knows that or certainly will in the coming days and weeks.
00:19:32And especially on defense where, you know, I talk about, I don't totally align with the
00:19:36concerns about the offensive staff, but I get them.
00:19:39These concerns are ones that I personally feel and believe in, because I just think
00:19:44in speaking with players who played safety under Brian Belichick and who played corner
00:19:48for Mike Pellegrino, forget the 15 minute snapshots and snippets that we got with them
00:19:52once every two weeks in the season, which really isn't all that telling anyway.
00:19:56These two guys were good coaches.
00:19:58These two guys are coaches who worked in a system similar to what Mike Fable will be
00:20:01bringing to new England from Tennessee and wherever else he's been.
00:20:05Okay.
00:20:06They're gone.
00:20:07See it.
00:20:08And they would have come back.
00:20:09I know that for a fact contractually, at least one of them, their contract was up.
00:20:12So this was not a, Hey, you're fired.
00:20:13We got to pay you out and you're going to go away.
00:20:15This was a situation where Mike had the option, but in both cases, he chose to turn down in
00:20:21my Pellegrino's case, a coach who just made a second team all pro and Christian Gonzalez's
00:20:25first round talent.
00:20:26I get that presided over Stefan Gilmore's defensive player of the year campaign in 2019.
00:20:31And at that point I told this guys, Hey, I don't know what I don't know.
00:20:35I'm learning too, but we're going to make this work.
00:20:37And a guy who Jonathan Jones said on this podcast two weeks ago, watch more film than
00:20:40anyone else in a facility famous for bragging about how much film they watch and how hard
00:20:45they work.
00:20:46And that's not just to players and coaches.
00:20:47That's to other coaches and players around the league.
00:20:50Okay.
00:20:51Patriots tell prospects.
00:20:52We work harder than anybody else.
00:20:53Are you with me?
00:20:54Are you a little softer on that?
00:20:56What do you make of what we know about the defensive staff so far?
00:20:58No, I'm 100% with you on those two guys.
00:21:00They're really good coaches.
00:21:04You talk to the guys that had run through that safety room and look, there were some
00:21:06really good players that ran through that safety room and guys that actually helped
00:21:10Brian Belichick become a better coach.
00:21:12Guys like Devin McCourty, guys like Duran Harmon, but they talked to you about like
00:21:16we learned so much from him and the give and take with him was great.
00:21:20And when I look at this year and you and I had this conversation at some point during
00:21:24the season, maybe later in the season when I was like, go look at position groups and
00:21:27say who's gotten, what position groups have gotten better, what young players have developed.
00:21:32And one of the guys that did a nice job was Brian Belichick.
00:21:35Del Pettis obviously came out of nowhere and he did some good things for this football
00:21:39team and developed.
00:21:40I think Marte Mapu, you know, whether he fits going forward or not, I don't know, but he
00:21:45had moments where he looked like a good NFL football player.
00:21:50And again, some of that goes to the coaching that he got.
00:21:53And Pellegrino just, he does an awesome job and like he's what he's like a nut.
00:22:01Like if you ever go and you watch, you watch the 22s and like you're watching the, and
00:22:05like there's this guy on the sidelines when one of his dudes makes a play, you're like,
00:22:09oh, what was that lunatic running up and down the sidelines?
00:22:12It's Pellegrino.
00:22:13He was so invested in those guys and took so much pride in some of the unknown guys
00:22:18that, you know, for instance, played in week 18 and did well, it's like, that's a huge
00:22:24moment for them.
00:22:25I like did it, poured everything I could into them so that they could have that and have
00:22:29that be able to be put on tape and like they'll miss those guys.
00:22:33Like those are, if you told me those two guys are coming back, I said, good, the staff is
00:22:37better for it.
00:22:38We'll see about the new guys, but they're, they're going to be missed.
00:22:42And I want to say this to the folks who, I don't think this makes up a large audience
00:22:45of the podcast, but I know there is some overlap.
00:22:47There's a Venn diagram of listeners to this show and people who listen to, let's just
00:22:51call them toxic radio shows in the market that just immediately assume any praise from
00:22:57a journalist like myself, like you, a beat reporter who deals with players and coaches
00:23:01on a regular basis comes from a place of quid pro quo.
00:23:04And that, oh, this is a favor to them.
00:23:06And this is that as if we have, we do not have any objectivity or integrity left on
00:23:09our jobs.
00:23:10And again, I don't think it's as large part of people, but I want to draw an important
00:23:12point here because I've said this to this person's face, there was no one who is a bigger
00:23:18pain in the ass with the media, 2019, 2020, 2021, mostly like 2022 on bill Belichick staff.
00:23:25Then Mike Pellegrino like borderline jerk.
00:23:28And that's his prerogative.
00:23:30You deal with this, whoever you want, you're a grown person.
00:23:32So am I.
00:23:33So the idea that this is some sort of shilling from you or from me, which is garbage anyway,
00:23:39because there's just no good way to go about your business as some people who are in this
00:23:42job or have been in this job or whatever, have admitted to this, not how I go about
00:23:46my business.
00:23:47Does it cost me scoops?
00:23:48Probably sure.
00:23:49Okay.
00:23:50But I get to sleep well at night.
00:23:51The point is I know they're good coaches from what I've seen with my eyes, what I've heard
00:23:54with my ears and really nothing to do with interacting with either of these guys personally.
00:23:58So I just want that out there because I've even joked with Mike.
00:24:01He was, he was much better with the media this year and that doesn't mean anything.
00:24:05Okay.
00:24:06It doesn't put any points on the board.
00:24:07It doesn't mean anything.
00:24:08He didn't make the defense any better, but when we say he's a good coach, you got to
00:24:11trust us.
00:24:12And if not, I don't know what you're doing.
00:24:14Listen.
00:24:15Yeah.
00:24:16I mean, no, quickly there, there are people that have gone through that building that
00:24:17I have had terrible relations.
00:24:19I did not like this person when not, and I'm not saying that about Mike, but like in general,
00:24:22but like if I talk to players and they say, dude is a great coach, like he's helped me
00:24:27so much.
00:24:28My, all right, well I can separate the person who I may or may not like versus the coach.
00:24:33And when players tell me he's a good coach and there are players that I respect that
00:24:37are telling me this, then I have to listen to that.
00:24:40Like, and on Brian Belichick's case, just quickly, I mean, I hammered his dad the last
00:24:45two years, like hammered him.
00:24:49Brian's a good coach.
00:24:50That is like, and Bill, obviously Bill's one of the greatest coaches of all time, if not
00:24:53the greatest, but like, like that you can separate all those things.
00:24:57He's a good coach.
00:24:58He's going to, you know, wherever he goes next, they're going to be lucky to have him.
00:25:01Yeah.
00:25:02To this point, I still have you on this podcast.
00:25:05Okay.
00:25:06That's excellent.
00:25:07Excellent point.
00:25:08Jerk.
00:25:09I don't like you at all.
00:25:10We just, you bring, bring good content.
00:25:12Anything else?
00:25:13I'm going to send you another Soprano meme at this point.
00:25:15Yeah.
00:25:16Yeah.
00:25:17It's the only way we're really just conversing these days.
00:25:18A lot of birds flying as well.
00:25:21Terrell Williams, I haven't spent a ton of time with him.
00:25:23This is another case, just like the draft prospects.
00:25:25I, I'm going to ask around, got some Intel, Doug Kite had a great piece earlier this week
00:25:30on Monday.
00:25:31You should read it in the Herald.
00:25:32Yeah.
00:25:33Yeah.
00:25:34Yeah.
00:25:35Yeah.
00:25:36Yeah.
00:25:37Yeah.
00:25:38Yeah.
00:25:39Yeah.
00:25:40Yeah.
00:25:41Yeah.
00:25:42Yeah.
00:25:43Yeah.
00:25:44Yeah.
00:25:45Yeah.
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00:28:00Yeah.
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00:29:59Yeah.
00:30:00Yeah.
00:30:01Yeah.
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00:30:11Yeah.
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00:30:13Yeah.
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00:30:15Yeah.
00:30:16Yeah.
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00:30:18Yeah.
00:30:19Yeah.
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00:30:38Yeah.
00:30:39Yeah.
00:30:40Yeah.
00:30:41Yeah.
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00:30:48Yeah.
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00:30:50Yeah.
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00:30:52Yeah.
00:30:53Yeah.
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00:30:55Yeah.
00:30:56Yeah.
00:30:57Yeah.
00:30:58Yeah.
00:30:59Yeah.
00:31:00Yeah.
00:31:01Yeah.
00:31:02Yeah.
00:31:03Yeah.
00:31:04Yeah.
00:31:05Yeah.
00:31:06Yeah.
00:31:07Yeah.
00:31:08Yeah.
00:31:09Yeah.
00:31:10Yeah.
00:31:11Yeah.
00:31:12Yeah.
00:31:13Yeah.
00:31:14Yeah.
00:31:15Yeah.
00:31:16Yeah.
00:31:17Yeah.
00:31:18Yeah.
00:31:19Yeah.
00:31:20Yeah.
00:31:21Yeah.
00:31:22Yeah.
00:31:23Yeah.
00:31:24Yeah.
00:31:25Yeah.
00:31:26Yeah.
00:31:27Yeah.
00:31:28Yeah.
00:31:29Yeah.
00:31:30Yeah.
00:31:31Yeah.
00:31:32Yeah.
00:31:33Yeah.
00:31:34Yeah.
00:31:35Yeah.
00:31:36Yeah.
00:31:37Yeah.
00:31:38Yeah.
00:31:39Yeah.
00:31:40Yeah.
00:31:41Yeah.
00:31:42Yeah.
00:31:43Yeah.
00:31:44Yeah.
00:31:45Yeah.
00:31:46Yeah.
00:31:47Yeah.
00:31:48Yeah.
00:31:49Yeah.
00:31:50Yeah.
00:31:51Yeah.
00:31:52Yeah.
00:31:53Yeah.
00:31:54Yeah.
00:31:55Yeah.
00:31:56Yeah.
00:31:57Yeah.
00:31:58Yeah.
00:31:59Yeah.
00:32:00Yeah.
00:32:01Yeah.
00:32:02Yeah.
00:32:03Yeah.
00:32:04Yeah.
00:32:05Yeah.
00:32:06Yeah.
00:32:07Yeah.
00:32:08Yeah.
00:32:09Yeah.
00:32:10Yeah.
00:32:11Yeah.
00:32:12Yeah.
00:32:13Yeah.
00:32:14Yeah.
00:32:15Yeah.
00:32:16Yeah.
00:32:17Yeah.
00:32:19I think we're...
00:32:23I think Verable has quickly put his stamp on this thing, just the entire organization.
00:32:29And as I was talking to someone who knows him quite well, and he was like, he's going
00:32:34to test everybody, us in the media, but people in the building, constantly.
00:32:39Then there's a push and a prod and like, okay, how do these people react to certain situations,
00:32:47and demands and what have you and I think it's a far cry from what last year looked
00:32:54like and it might have even been a far cry from what it looked like in the last couple
00:33:00years of Bill and I'm just interested to see how quickly he weeds out some people because
00:33:07I think that's invariably going to happen and also like when you get to the roster,
00:33:13I think there's going to be some significant changes on the roster that go beyond adding
00:33:18people in free agency. I'm talking about guys that are currently on the roster that I don't
00:33:22think are going to be variable guys and I don't think they're going to get a leash.
00:33:27I think they're going to find their way out of town pretty quickly. So are you going to
00:33:32stay here going to survive? I have ordered my new hard at for the press conferences.
00:33:38I'm going to have some safety goggles. It's going to you know, he's I died dealt with
00:33:43him in those times in Tennessee and like he he wants good questions. Sometimes you give
00:33:49him a good question and he's still going to slap you around and that's just the way it
00:33:53is and like, okay, let's go, you know, we as we always say, I think a lot of people
00:33:57think we try to make it about ourselves and there are some people that do that. I always
00:34:02feel like my job is to get the guy on the record. And if I ask the question, whatever
00:34:06you do with it after I ask the question is up to you. If you want to answer the question
00:34:10honestly or as honest as you can without whatever, go for it. And if you want to snort at me
00:34:15like the old guy used to or what have you, that's your, your choice. As you said earlier,
00:34:22grown men, grown men can make grown men decisions, whatever you want to do.
00:34:27Shades of Bill, the coming back. And of course, no one cares about the press conference. So
00:34:30long as you're winning.
00:34:33You're not stepping in at every three days and you shouldn't, that's it. It's such a
00:34:38small, tiny part of the job. Like we're discussing it because that's the muck that we're in,
00:34:43that we're working with the moments that we share. But in the grand scheme of football
00:34:47and the NFL, like it, it matters. But for the exposure fans will get, yeah, you're going
00:34:53to notice some things that felt very familiar over the course of 24 years here in New England.
00:34:57All right. We are going to pivot to the future. I'm going to ask Mike for two to three offensive
00:35:01prospects, two to three defensive prospects that he think the Patriots could draft from
00:35:05the senior bowl. And if you think that this is just a nice tease before we get into a
00:35:08break, a it is, but B, if you look back at the Titans draft history and Mike Vrabel was
00:35:13there with John Robinson, certainly not back now in New England, but came from a similar
00:35:17background, they drafted a ton of senior bowl players.
00:35:21So I don't guarantee it, but one of the players Mike is going to mention offensive or defense,
00:35:26maybe both is going to be on the Patriots board right after this. Okay. So I know most
00:35:30of you still remember, it's only been about five years, the Patriots playing playoff football,
00:35:35the best of the best going head to head. That's what January and February is all about. I
00:35:39don't know when the Patriots will be back, but I know if you want to make lifetime memories,
00:35:43whether it's the NFL playoffs or later on this year, the NBA playoffs or the NHL playoffs,
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00:37:03offensive standouts. Everyone wants to hear about the receivers. Do you have a receiver
00:37:07or two that could be on the Patriots board? We'll be on the Patriots board that you think
00:37:10they could draft come April Jack Beck from, uh, TCU, uh, who is, um, almost six to he's
00:37:19about two 15. He's sort of the power slot. There was a lot of comparison this week to
00:37:26Pooka Nakua, which like Pooka Nakua, what he's done the first couple of years, bananas.
00:37:31And maybe this is an over correction because a lot of people missed on him and he didn't
00:37:35get picked into the fifth round, but there are some shades like with his physicality
00:37:39and his power and he runs better than I thought and had seen, uh, and watching film before
00:37:45I went down there cause he was a name that had sort of popped up on my radar. Um, but
00:37:51he had a really good week and I was surprised at times with his ability to get down the
00:37:56field and then go high point the football. Like I didn't necessarily know that he had
00:38:00that in his game, but when you look at the body type, it makes sense. He was, he was
00:38:06impressive. I'll give you another one and this is a totally different version of a slot
00:38:10guy. This is the old school Patriots slot. That's Jalen Noel from Iowa state. Jaden Higgins
00:38:16is the bigger outside receiver for Iowa state who got a lot of buzz and is probably considered
00:38:20or at least coming into this was considered a better prospect. This kid had been excellent
00:38:27route running, um, physical for his size and he's five nine and change. Right. Um, and
00:38:34one of the things that stood out to me on tape and then I saw it this week at the senior
00:38:37bowl is like run after catch stuff. Like the ability to quickly turn into a runner
00:38:43and there's some power in that frame. Like he, he did remind me a little bit, just a
00:38:49little bit of an old school patch receiver. So I'm saying, you know, look, when Josh was
00:38:53here the last time they went with a bigger slot and Jacoby Myers, right? Like that sort
00:38:57of, and it was more about, Oh, we want to run the ball a little bit more out of this
00:39:00personnel. But I'm just saying in terms of types, I thought he had a really good week.
00:39:06He tracks the ball well to like footwork on the sidelines. Like there's a lot of good
00:39:10stuff there from that player. So I, I liked those two guys and I'll give you, I mean,
00:39:14there were no, there were a few offensive linemen. It was a better group than I thought
00:39:17to not nearly as good as the D line group, but a pretty good group. And you've probably
00:39:22seen the name. If you, if you're into this stuff, Anthony Belton from NC state had an
00:39:26awesome week and he was a right tackle at NC state. He played right and left here. He
00:39:31had some guard, you know, some pitches he could actually go inside. But I thought his
00:39:38tape in college showed, he was like, yeah, it seemed like the right tackle, like a powerful
00:39:42guy. Pass protection was okay, but he was more of a physical mauler type and right tackle.
00:39:48What I saw this week in one-on-ones, which are designed for the pass rusher, that's like
00:39:52a pass rushers have the edge there. Um, his feet, the way he moved his punch, like maybe
00:40:02he could play the left side and maybe he could be a much better path protector than he was
00:40:07or he should be a much better path protector than he was at NC state. Not that he was bad
00:40:11at NC state. I'm just saying he was more of a run guy to me at least. And I saw a lot
00:40:15of good things from him. And I think a lot of people were like, he's made himself some
00:40:19money this week and it's going to go maybe higher than the initial projections were.
00:40:22So I liked what I saw out of him. So you and Greg talked about Anthony Belton when you
00:40:28were down there. And I don't remember who said it, or if this was like a sentiment that
00:40:32you guys had gathered from scouts, Anthony Belton projects right now get it's late January.
00:40:37Someone who has not studied the tape yet. That is coming up very, very soon. Day two.
00:40:41Is this a case where a guy goes from possibly second round late first, because either the
00:40:47Patriots will be there at the high port of the second round, or they'll have the ammo
00:40:52to move up into the first round if they believe enough in him and secure a fifth year option.
00:40:57I didn't see as much as I liked him. I didn't, I, he didn't look like a, that guy. Okay.
00:41:04And that's look, there's plenty of great players second around and on. I just, I didn't see
00:41:08that, but I definitely could see him working his way up. Especially again, when you look
00:41:11at the tackle class and some of the questions about the tackle class and whether it's, you
00:41:16know, we'll Campbell in the short arms or all these different things, right?
00:41:19Just Kelvin banks. A lot of people I still have heard from, including down there when
00:41:23he wasn't there, I think he's a guard, you know? So I don't know how that plays, but
00:41:28when you, we saw it last year and I think it was a considered a better tackle group,
00:41:33the run on the tackles. And what happened to the Patriots is that kind of got left,
00:41:37or at least the feeling around the league was they got kind of caught with the pants
00:41:40around their ankles a little bit and, and ended up like, oh, this is the last of the
00:41:44good tackles. So we'll take Caden Wallace and see what we can do here. Uh, I think Belton
00:41:49goes higher than that. And I think I could see him in the top of the second round.
00:41:55Okay. There's a name you didn't mention that I also saw in Daniel Jeremiah, who's going
00:42:00to be my go-to guy for a lot of the same Brooklyn or two. And there are plenty of good draft
00:42:03analysts out there. It's not for searching anybody else, but the guys work for three
00:42:07different teams. I've spoken with him before for stories, interviews on the side, Daniel
00:42:10Jeremiah has great Zabel down there, offensive tackle out of North Dakota state. He played
00:42:15some guard, even played some center and even pulled that off. Yeah. Daniel calls him. I'm
00:42:20going to call him DJ. I've got his number. I call him DJ DJ calls. Gray's able a day
00:42:25one start. Okay. Yeah. What did you see from him? Yes. No, he was awesome. Like I'm not,
00:42:31I he day one, he was the first guy I put on my studs and duds. Like he just was,
00:42:37holy crap. Um, I think he's the center, but he can definitely play guard and he also played
00:42:42tackle at North Dakota state and not to go to state, like obviously not, you know, they're
00:42:47not LSU or whatnot, but that's a real good program. They win national champ there. That's
00:42:51a legit program. Uh, and they've had plenty of guys come out of there. Yeah. I, I, the only
00:42:57reason I didn't mention him is because I think tackles a bigger need for the Patriots, but
00:43:02yeah, I think he plays, I think he plays right away. He, uh, as someone told me, uh, and I wrote
00:43:08this for Boston sports journal, uh, that'll it's actually my notebook this week, uh, this weekend,
00:43:13uh, he won the week was the quote. He won the week. So, and I, yeah, absolutely. Like I
00:43:21was drawn to him. Like the first day, the dynamics were like, Greg's watching the big guys and I was
00:43:27watching more of the little guys, but I, you know, one-on-ones are going, you can sometimes time it
00:43:31so that you're watching back and forth. And like first rep I saw, I was like, Oh, okay. And then
00:43:39like, kept looking out of the corner of my eye. Like, I want to see him do it again. Oh, there he
00:43:42is again. Oh, Hey, how about that? And then you start watching him and it was like, Oh, I put him
00:43:46a guard. He put him at center. Like, and he's just, he was a standout. He was, he was really,
00:43:50really good technically sound. He's strong. Like, and he's got a little edge to him, stood over a
00:43:56guy when he knocked them down. Like, you know, just little things that happened during the course
00:43:59of talking about alpha males. There's a bunch of alpha males on that field. And he's like,
00:44:02no, I'm a badass. Don't mess with me. I was like, yeah, I think we could be friends.
00:44:08Not really, but you know what I mean? It came so natural out of your mouth. No, I'm a badass.
00:44:13Yeah, no, I, I, I, that's what I say to myself in the mirror every morning. Yeah. Yeah. And then
00:44:18I proceeded to get my, you know, slapped around all day. Yeah. Yeah. Well, you mentioned North
00:44:24Dakota state, like it's a, you know, FCS program that people are familiar with, won a bunch of
00:44:27national championships. Like Cody mock came out of there. Not too long ago. Another experienced
00:44:32versatile lineman goes to Tampa. I think he was a day to pick. Um, it was really crossing my
00:44:37fingers that this guy who plays offensive line, missing his two front teeth would end up in my
00:44:41life. And I get to cover him and ask questions about those teeth until he's sick of me.
00:44:45Didn't happen. Point is the versatility, something I know they're going to value
00:44:49as a team that just doesn't have the depth and was trying to put square pegs and round holes.
00:44:54They got bigger and bigger and bigger because you just couldn't fill them all year. And those
00:44:57holes were left tackle and right tackle, uh, Zabel's and I, you know, a name to keep an eye on
00:45:02the second round, maybe third, wherever he ends up, uh, one other position and two other names.
00:45:07I want to ask you about, because as we always do here in New England, it seems like this is
00:45:11just our fate has been since at least 2018, 2019, we're going to talk about receivers.
00:45:16We're going to talk about offense tackles. It's just very readily. So, but tight end
00:45:19is a position that I think for the offense that Josh wants to install and that rebel wants to
00:45:24bring in terms of this attitude tight end is going to be an important position to tie all
00:45:28this together. The run concepts, being able to run from light personnel and obviously have a
00:45:32receiving threat and Mason Taylor and Elijah Arroyo are two guys that stood out according to
00:45:38some like a DJ, my friend, DJ, my pal DJ, uh, down to the senior bowl. I've seen Arroyo one person.
00:45:44He's a little bit more of an F and a move tight end. I was, I was impressed with him. Granted,
00:45:47they played wake forest. You and I could probably score at least six points against wake forest.
00:45:50Did you see anything from either two of them? I love the tight end class,
00:45:54and I'm glad you brought the group up because I think it's more of a need than maybe other people
00:46:00do because I think you're sort of, I think you're in a transitional period. Like how much more good
00:46:05football can you get from Hunter? He was terrific last year. I'm not sure Hooper's back. We'll see,
00:46:10uh, Jean bell, you know, they played him some, but I didn't see anything that really jumped
00:46:15off the tape. Well, let me just quickly, Elijah Roy is out of Miami. That's for folks who want
00:46:19to look these guys up. Mason Taylor, son of Jason Taylor, uh, is, is from LSU and both bigger,
00:46:24you know, can play in line, but traditional kind of later. Mason's only 20 years old too,
00:46:29which I didn't realize until I got down there, which is crazy. He is of the group that was in
00:46:34mobile. He's the most well-rounded guy, like can do the inline stuff, can move a little bit,
00:46:40uh, sure hands, like just a complete sort of player. He's definitely in the conversation.
00:46:46I think to be the third tight end picked. And of course we're talking about your boy from
00:46:50Penn state, whose name is Warren and then Loveland Colson Loveland from, uh, from Michigan. He might
00:46:55be the third right now. Yeah. He might be the third tight end, which could mean first round.
00:47:01And I think, uh, by the way, I've heard a row hole and I'm not positive. Oh, no.
00:47:08You know what I meant to nine times, I'd meant to look it up. And then my, my scattershot brain,
00:47:13I haven't looked up the pronunciation of it regardless the Miami tight end.
00:47:17Um, he's big enough where he wasn't much of a blocker at Miami or they didn't use him much in
00:47:24that regard, but I saw some good things in him blocking this week. And I think his size, his
00:47:29frame, his athleticism, he should be better at it. So while I don't think he makes his living
00:47:34being an inline tight end, I think he can do it. So he was something, um, Ferguson,
00:47:39the tight end from Oregon, just a good player. Like, I don't know that he's going to test off
00:47:44the charts, but like he gets open. He just, he gets open. Doesn't safety linebacker. And he
00:47:50catches the football natural catcher with the ball of the ball with his hands, like just very smooth.
00:47:55And I like this kid Fedon from, uh, from Nebraska who I knew nothing about. I think I saw one
00:48:00Nebraska game in the last two years. Um, he's twice had ACL surgery once as a freshman. And
00:48:07then once as a red shirt freshman, uh, he was a four star coming out of Iowa. And like, I think I
00:48:13described him as, he looks like he's getting electrical shocks in each leg at a different
00:48:17time while he's running. It's just a weird looking. Someone said baby deer, but I didn't
00:48:21think that was fair. Cause it was weirder than that, but like six, five, two 55 and like what
00:48:30hands on the dude? Like he's good football player. Like he could be another one that's in the
00:48:35conversation. And like Gunner Helm was supposed to be there from Texas. He didn't show. Cause
00:48:39obviously they had a long season. Like that position group is stacked this year and I would
00:48:46be intrigued if they plucked one of those dudes. All right. Give me your favorite offensive
00:48:50prospect. You're going down with the ship with this guy. He's going to make it. He could be a
00:48:54fit New England, but even if not, he's going to crush it elsewhere. That player is blank on offense.
00:48:59Zable. I just think he fits. No, I do. I just think he fits. Like, I think I don't like, I
00:49:06think whatever, what are you? West coast airport, whatever you're running. I think he fits. I think
00:49:12he brings that kind of attitude and edge that we've seen. And we've seen a lot of guys in
00:49:15recent years. Quinn minors is another guy like, you know, cause they're like step right in and
00:49:19be this guy from a small school. Like I think he's got that in him. Cool. All right. We're
00:49:26going to move on to defense here in a second. And there are plenty of, you know, we, again,
00:49:30we talk about receivers, offensive tackles, Patriots are going to take an edge player in
00:49:33this draft. They need one, any defensive tackles, even if Christian Barmer comes back and is better
00:49:38than ever, which we don't know yet. They need linebackers. There were a ton of players that
00:49:42all of those positions post corner at the senior bowl who could be on the Patriots board and
00:49:46certainly we'll make it in the NFL. But at first I got to tell you, I know coming up super bowl
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00:49:57about how you can make more money when you integrate it with sports and they'll have offers
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00:50:47Okay. Then you pick another player, uh, more or less a hundred yards. Take one Barkley. Okay. Boom.
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00:51:48Defense. Did you do that all off the top of your head?
00:51:52I plead a little bit. Okay. So defense, uh, this is for my money. By the end of the year,
00:51:59the Patriots had the worst passers in the league. If you have sacks bottom 10 and pressure rate,
00:52:04they're the safest place in football basically was across from their defensive line. Get them
00:52:10some help. Mike Giardi, who are the Patriots looking at who will be on their board? What
00:52:14are the guys that stood out to you down to the senior bowl? Well, I think this, this first guy
00:52:18that I'm going to mention is not going to be there, but, uh, what a wow. Two days at, at, uh,
00:52:24and mobile and that's Shamar Stewart from Texas A and M. And he is an interesting case study
00:52:28because in three years, I think he had four and a half sacks total. And you look at the package
00:52:33of the athlete that he is six, five, 281 pounds. Someone told me that he's going to run a four or
00:52:38five, which at 281 pounds is absurd. Um, and, but he was awesome in the first two days at mobile.
00:52:45And then he tapped out because as it happens a lot with these all-star games, uh, you start
00:52:50getting that buzz of first round or like, Oh, you're moving up on the boards. Some of these guys
00:52:57choose that option and leave. Uh, he was one of them. Uh, he, he is, there was a, there was a
00:53:04moment. He had a, he had a strip sack. He basically, he beat the right tackle. The kid,
00:53:09one of the kids from LSU, whose name is I'm drawing a blank on right now,
00:53:12swiped the ball off the quarterback's hand. And then the way he was facing
00:53:18was towards where all the scouts and the front office people are. So there's one side of media.
00:53:24And then there's the other side. And that was a side he was facing and he proceeded to let them
00:53:29know that he was him in colorful language, shall we say? Uh, and it was just a moment. It was one
00:53:38of those things, but like, he was really, he was, I thought he was fantastic for the two days.
00:53:42Of course, I'd love to see him stay and like work his way through like some other guys did. He did
00:53:46not, but he was something, um, Mike green from Marshall who had, uh, one of the plays of, of the
00:53:55entirety of the senior bowl when he ran through Josh Connelly's chest in one-on-one and Connelly
00:54:01is one of those tackle prospects that he could end up being a first round guy. Some people,
00:54:06again, could think he might be a guard. I think he's still kind of growing into his frame and
00:54:10he's a tackle to me, but, uh, yeah, he was finally was expecting something else.
00:54:16He was not expecting power and you can Google it. Uh, I think I had it on my timeline on Twitter.
00:54:22Uh, he just went right through his chest and put them on his ass and the place went bananas and
00:54:27they had a rep later where Connelly won the rep, but it was, um, it was a definitely a wow moment
00:54:34and he was already rising. I think, and I I'm sure he's already up there. I think he's a first round
00:54:39pick, but now he might be to me the way he, he played the first two days in mobile. And he,
00:54:45by the way, also tapped out after two days for the same reason he's getting that buzz.
00:54:49I think people thought him as a late first round guy, high second. I think he is in the low
00:54:54twenties and maybe could crack the high teens. Uh, cause I think he's that kind of bendy
00:55:00explosive athlete coming off the edge. So he's, he's someone that stood out to me.
00:55:04I'll give you a couple of, um, sticking with that position. Um,
00:55:10Femi Oladejo, I think I got it right from UCLA. Nice job. Yeah. So doesn't have crazy measurable
00:55:18six to two 61. Doesn't have the go-go gadget arms like enough, but like, he's not like this
00:55:25freaky guy. He played Mike linebacker for UCLA. And this year he switched to edge and you can see
00:55:34the footwork that he had to be a Mike linebacker come into play on the edge.
00:55:39And if you give him just a little hint of daylight, he takes it. He's a really nice player.
00:55:44He kind of, I didn't know much about him. He opened some eyes. I talked to some people who
00:55:48were like, yeah, he, you know, like there's a, there's a lot there. Cause he hasn't,
00:55:51he hasn't played over there on the edge very long. So he's someone that was, I found very interesting.
00:55:56And, um, I'm drawing a blank on his first name, Alexander from Toledo.
00:56:02He's more of a defensive tackle, but you could see him in some situations play on the edge,
00:56:07but he definitely, when it comes time to pass rush, I think he's going to have to be inside
00:56:11because I think his length and his quickness will give guards problems. But he had, he had
00:56:15a really, really good week. And again, people with Toledo, he went to Toledo. Well, Quinion Mitchell,
00:56:21who got my vote for PFWA rookie of the year, didn't get it. Cause he doesn't have the counting
00:56:25stats like Jared versted, uh, Toledo guy, like really good football player. I think this guy's
00:56:31a really good football player. He's not going to go as high as Mitchell did in the draft. I
00:56:34wish we got picked maybe 16th or 17th, but I think he's a day to pick. And I think he
00:56:39showed a lot, like he's, he's got some good length and a good motor. And, uh, I did notice
00:56:45too, both he and, um, uh, Ladejo were guys that other guys gravitated towards. So when we're
00:56:52talking about the alpha male thing again, when these two guys who again, aren't the biggest names
00:56:57or the biggest stars, there's plenty of first rounders in that group. Walter Nolan from Ole
00:57:01Miss is the first rounder. I mentioned Stewart. He's going to be a first rounder. Most of the
00:57:05guys were feeding off these two dudes and listening to those two dudes. And they were going around the
00:57:09huddle and patting guys up. And, you know, someone makes a play when they weren't on the field and
00:57:12they were running out on the field to give them a high five. Like I like those guys. Like I like
00:57:16that kind of energy. And, uh, those two guys definitely presented it. Darius has yes. Thank
00:57:23you. I, I scribbled, I scribbled and it looks like Davis and I'm like, it's not Davis is not his first
00:57:29name. No, uh, long arms too, which this will be interesting, right? You're we're trying to
00:57:34recalibrate to use the senior role word, uh, you know, our expectations are prototypes for what
00:57:39the front office is going to be looking for. So long it was, you know, for so long, it was what
00:57:43Belichick wanted. And we always knew receivers look at the three cone time, you know,
00:57:48quarterbacks better have ball skills. And I don't think those things are going to be flipped on
00:57:52their head, but it will take a little bit for us to learn what the Patriots like. I think when you
00:57:57look at players like Darius Alexander, you check a lot of boxes in terms of that positional
00:58:01versatility, whether you like on length or not, it's there. And if someone that you feel like
00:58:06can grow, uh, based on, again, the little that I saw here, one name you didn't mention,
00:58:10who's gotten some love and another D tackle who, again, I just think that position,
00:58:15you could draft a kid and he might give you just as much, if not a little bit more than
00:58:18Daniel Eko, while I did for more than 60% of the staff. So it should just never happened.
00:58:23I'll do respect to Daniel. It was been very good to me, but you understand what he's probably going
00:58:27to get paid heading into for agency. It's going to be less than these guys, Joshua farmer,
00:58:31who's a little bit bigger. And you know, if he was not as good as, as people have said down at the
00:58:37senior bowl might be on my list of darts. I throw in the sixth round being like, they're going to
00:58:40take a big guy. It's going to be an early down run suffer. He's got a little bit more than that.
00:58:44Okay. It's not just the two gapping. Did you see anything from him? Yeah, it was funny. I, I,
00:58:48so I finished my notebook and I was sort of doing like my overall, like impressions of certain
00:58:53players in the thing and at the senior bowl. And, um, he was just past the cutoff point.
00:58:58Like I did put, I was like, all right, you put listed too many names of guys that were impressing
00:59:02you, like just stop. But he was like right there on the list. Um, good energy from him all week.
00:59:07Uh, there is more to his game than just being sort of a, a run stuffer. Uh, yeah, I think he's
00:59:15again, I, I don't know how many, I didn't check the actual number of guys, uh, that were on the D
00:59:22line that were at the senior bowl, but it feels like all of them are getting drafted. Like that's
00:59:26how deep, you know, there's always guys that slipped through and end up with undrafted free
00:59:30agents. Uh, I felt like all these guys are going to find themselves having their names called at
00:59:36some point during the draft, which is, you know, pretty impressive and a credit to the,
00:59:40to the guys that scouted these players to get them down to the senior bowl.
00:59:44All right. You gotta go down with the ship, pick one guy, be good in new England, a fit,
00:59:48but he's going to be great wherever he goes. I think it's green. I just think there's like,
00:59:56and again, it's another Marshall kid, right? So it's not, it doesn't, I'm not playing the
01:00:00greatest competition or a highest level, just a real explosive athlete got an edge to him.
01:00:06I think he's a good football player. Who's going to get better. So I can see him, you know,
01:00:11wherever he goes in some ways for, and I don't, I haven't even looked at the size comparison,
01:00:17but I thought Bryce Huff, like that's, he gave me Bryce Huff vibes. And again, I don't know
01:00:23if the measurables are the same or whatnot, but just in terms of some of the explosion,
01:00:26I saw off the edge and the skills as a pass rusher. I'm like at the very least, he's going
01:00:30to be a good situational pass rusher. And as we know in this league, you can play for a long time
01:00:35and make a lot of money doing that. Yes. Right now, according to my guy, DJ pal, DJ top 20 pick
01:00:42for Malik green at a Marshall. So probably out of the Patriots range there, but certainly a name
01:00:46that I saw as much as anybody following along again from a distance, not, not that I call him,
01:00:51Mike. See, I'm, I'm at the point where fatigue has set in. There's a lot of scribblings and yeah.
01:01:02Oh,
01:01:05no, you didn't call Mike because that's his actual name.
01:01:10Whatever. No, look again, you know, see, this is when my fatigue ends up transferring, you know,
01:01:16thanks for, thanks for taking the bullet. Everyone totally bought that. All right. So
01:01:20Mike green at a Marshall, everything else stands about, I'm supposed to pass rusher off of the
01:01:25edge. That's much as clear. Anyone who just flipped on the senior role for a little bit,
01:01:28as I did this week, but deferring to the people that were there like yourself and appreciate all
01:01:31that insight. Let's talk about a different bowl that now I can say, because it's not during an
01:01:35ad read the super bowl. And I felt apparently quite the opposite of everyone immediately after
01:01:44the game and the matchup was determined and I was rooting for the bills. I made this clear on TV.
01:01:48This is not something I do very often. I just want to see a little, a little bit of spice,
01:01:51a little bit of variety in my football life when the Patriots are not playing.
01:01:54And here it is. Cheat signals part two. I think this game is going to be awesome.
01:01:59I think the teams are too talented. I think they're too well coached. I think this is a
01:02:02better Eagles team than you saw two years ago. And certainly one better equipped to handle the
01:02:05chiefs. We're not as good offensively, but better defensively. I think it will be close. I have no
01:02:10idea who wins. I don't want to do that, but just your thoughts about a matchup that no one seems
01:02:14to want, but everyone's going to watch. And I think we'll ultimately enjoy in a way that most
01:02:18are not expecting right now. I like you want a Buffalo to win. And I, you know, obviously I
01:02:22covered Buffalo for a while there. And I have some warm feelings about some of the people there.
01:02:27So I was kind of hoping that they would break through. Well, it's, you know, they, they,
01:02:31they treated me well. So I'm just talking like from a fan base perspective in particular,
01:02:37the fans are all like, they're crazy, but they're awesome. So I was, I was kind of hoping that they
01:02:42would get their opportunity to break through. I know a lot of people around here don't want that
01:02:45because you know, nobody else can win the Superbowl from the AFC East, screw the bills,
01:02:49jets and dolphins, but whatever. That's kind of what I was rooting for. It didn't happen.
01:02:54But I'm like you, I think, I think Philadelphia is the best team. I actually thought Philadelphia
01:03:00and Baltimore were the two best teams. So Philadelphia is here. That roster is loaded.
01:03:06The quarterback finally played a good game for the first time in like two months.
01:03:10And so if he can deliver a similar type performance, I think Philadelphia is going to be
01:03:14hard to beat, but I just think it's a great matchup. I think the coaching edge is on Andy side.
01:03:20They've got Patrick who's, you know, unbelievable player and yeah. So it just, that's all. I think
01:03:30I love the idea that we have a team that somehow we kept thinking like this year,
01:03:34they're just not, they're not the same and it's like, but they keep finding ways to win 12,
01:03:38one score wins this year, which is just absurd. And, and then some of the ways that they've done
01:03:44it or, or, you know, blocking kicks at the end of the games or whatever, it's like, they just
01:03:49have that gene, that winning gene. So I, you know, this is going to be to me a fourth quarter game.
01:03:53And I'm, I'm, I'm excited to watch it. You know, I thought my son texts me, he's like,
01:03:57this is going to be, this is going to be boring. I was like, shut up.
01:04:02Come on, man. I was like, one team's going for a three beat. That's pretty awesome. The other team,
01:04:07like the coach was like borderline on the, the hot seat was on the hot seat last year.
01:04:12They talked about maybe bringing in bill Belichick. And at the beginning of the year,
01:04:15it's like, Oh, they're not like, what are they doing? And is he in trouble? And you know,
01:04:18next thing you know, they rip off whatever it's been 14 to 15 games. Like that's,
01:04:23this is two really good football teams and it should be a really good football game.
01:04:28I don't want to spend really any time doing the chief's dynasty Patriots comparisons,
01:04:31my home Brady, which is why I said careful earlier. And people are saying what they will.
01:04:35I just want to call us out as a collective in the media, because I said this on TV,
01:04:40when this came up the other day, always my home's in the conversation now with Brady.
01:04:46And before I get to my real point, I go, yes, because we put him there. If we want to talk
01:04:50about fans being aggravated over the chief's place and chasing the Patriots and gaining ground and
01:04:54this and that that's on us, we are putting in front of them what we choose to put in front of
01:04:58them. And granted Patrick, my homes has a big say over his plate and how excellent he is.
01:05:02And he is tracking, tracking, not there yet, not remotely close to be the best quarterback
01:05:07ever by almost any metric that you want to measure. But we got a long way to go folks.
01:05:10And it starts with a potential number four ring on Sunday, obviously unprecedented three P I'll
01:05:16do respect to the Packers who won the title right before we started calling this the super bowl,
01:05:19super bowl, super bowl. Now that I can say it, but it's just, if people are aggravated,
01:05:24we are aggravating them in the process. I don't think that's a story unto itself.
01:05:28If it is, it's self-sustaining, which we also tend to do here in the media,
01:05:31semi rant over unless you want to object. Cause I do think the chief's excellence should be honored
01:05:37more than complained about the people who are bitter. I understand it. And what they're doing
01:05:41is spectacular. And that's really just by my ice cold take on this.
01:05:45No, I heard there was a good debate going the other day about Kelsey versus Gronk. And it's like,
01:05:49they're both awesome players. And you're like, I, I mean, whatever, like they're both awesome
01:05:56players. Yeah. Would one team be better with it? They had this guy, the other one, like the
01:06:00coaches would have figured it out. If Travis Kelsey was a new England, they would have figured
01:06:04out the, how to maximize Travis Kelsey. Just like, I think Andy Reed would have figured out
01:06:08how to maximize Rob Gronkowski for the time that he played. Like, so yeah, whatever.
01:06:12Yeah. I'm also happy for Sigmund Barkley. That's a kid covered in college and just a good dude.
01:06:19And I tell you this, not because of, again, any real interactions they had in college. Like you,
01:06:23you rarely get one-on-one opportunities to speak players, coaches. And I had a few of those,
01:06:27but it was in a group setting. I'm not talking about the media group setting though. They
01:06:31convinced me this guy had high character and I will tell the full version of the story sometime
01:06:35later, perhaps on radio coming up. There was a night, December, 2017. I was a part of a Santa
01:06:41crawl. It was me, other Penn state writers, friends get dressed up as Santa at eight to 10
01:06:46different bars. All the money or part of the money at each bar goes to a certain charity.
01:06:50That's what you're raising this for. Okay. Last bar we went to is the athlete bar as it was known
01:06:54then at Penn state, probably still is lion's den. And fast forward, we're there in the middle,
01:07:00just a bunch of awkward, mid twenties, sometime in their thirties folks in Santa costumes in the
01:07:06middle of a dance floor, like 2.00 AM. I looked to my right, of course, Saquon is behind the bar.
01:07:11He's serving whatever bottle he wants and taking it into a back corner. And he often did sit as I
01:07:18read in the story this week, just by himself. Thank you very much. Appreciate everyone coming
01:07:21by offering me this shot that the man was as calm and as cool as collected and unselfish as any
01:07:27celebrity I've ever heard or seen behind a bar. Granted it's not a long list, but the man just,
01:07:31just went about his business, helped a couple of people out, took what he wanted, nothing more,
01:07:35nothing excessive. And that's just kind of how it went, which I don't know how Saquon was. I don't
01:07:39care, but good on the man for just being a gentleman, even at 2.00 AM. While some of us
01:07:43were not at a bar when he could have done, he could have gotten away with murder and no one
01:07:47would have ever heard about it. Yeah. I just, you know, as I was just saying about some of the guys
01:07:52that were sort of, you know, leading the charge at the senior bowl in terms of the energy and the
01:07:56enthusiasm and sort of assisting teammates. You see it, if you've ever watched Saquon, you've
01:08:01seen this energy from him since the day he walked in the league, but certainly was on display at the
01:08:06NFC title game when Will Shipley comes in and bust this long run and like who's, and then scores his
01:08:12first ever touchdown a couple of plays later. And who's like, first of all, smart enough to put his
01:08:17helmet back on because he ran on the field and that's a penalty. If you have your, you know,
01:08:20supposed to be a penalty. And then like, he just was elated for the dude. And it was just like,
01:08:24he could have, you know, his calf was bothering him a little bit. He could have been like wrapped
01:08:28up in a, in a jacket and just like, wait until he came back and dapped him up. No, no. He was
01:08:33like the first guy down there. I just think that speaks volumes to the kind of teammates that he
01:08:37is. So yeah, that's pretty cool. And he's going to do something awesome. Forget the character stuff
01:08:41or, you know, matchups, history, chiefs, this and that, like that is top five, however you want to
01:08:46rank them. Most exciting players in the league. That guy being in the Superbowl is good for all
01:08:50of us. It's good for business. It's good for whatever you're going to be doing in a Santa
01:08:53costume or not. Come Sunday night. All right. He is Mike Giardi. He needs a nap. Thank you
01:08:58very much, sir. For all your Intel insight, everything from Mobile. We're glad you were back
01:09:03and we'll have you on sometime soon. Are you going to the combine?
01:09:07I don't know yet. Probably. Okay. All right. Well beers. I'm going to need it. I'm going to
01:09:13need to recover. You're going to need a break. There's about a month left. I think we all need
01:09:18mind and body preparation for what the combine is, which is I'll talk about as we get closer.
01:09:22Anyway, thank you. This was awesome. And we'll see you soon. Either way, right? You got it.

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